Ep. 48 - Using Food as the Gateway to Change with Kirstin Nussgruber

Are you a cancer survivor seeking to reclaim your health, find empowerment after diagnosis, or break free from patterns that no longer serve you? This transformative episode dives into the healing power of personalized nutrition, self-advocacy, and mindset shifts essential for thriving after cancer. Board-certified holistic nutrition consultant and cancer mentor Kirsten Nussgruber joins host Kathy Washburn to share her inspiring journey from HR manager to survivor and expert, revealing how she broke the karmic cycle of cancer in her family.

Gain practical insights on moving from overwhelm to empowerment, the profound connection between what you eat and how you feel, and the emotional roots behind food choices. Discover the importance of self-care, reframing limiting beliefs, and building resonant relationships to support lasting change. Plus, get actionable tips for navigating social settings, staying mindful, and cultivating self-worth through nourishment—body, mind, and spirit.

Whether you’re in survivorship, supporting a loved one, or ready for your own transformation, this episode guides you on a path toward informed, sustainable healing—so you can reclaim your life and live with greater joy and resilience. Don’t miss it!

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

• Personalized nutrition for cancer survivors
• Mindfulness practices in healthy eating
• Reclaiming life after cancer diagnosis
• Overcoming limiting beliefs around food
• The power of resonant relationships

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Transcript

Ep. 48 - Using Food as the Gateway to Change with Kirstin Nussgruber

[00:00:00] Today's guest is Kirstin Nussgruber, a compassionate coach and mentor to humans that find themselves in health transitions. Kirstin received her holistic nutritional diploma at a leading naturopathic institution in Munich, Germany, where she soaked up centuries old wisdom of understanding and recognizing the vital importance of a whole foods based approach and helping people manage.

Their health and practice, proactive disease prevention and treatment. As important is Kirstin's background in psychology and sociology. It is my hope that this podcast will allow you to witness how this triumvirate of nutrition, psychology, and sociology. Works and the unique way that Kirstin approaches helping others to overcome mental and emotional [00:01:00] barriers.

May this podcast be a catalyst for you to become the better version of you just bursting to step forward.​

Introduction and Guest Welcome

Kathy Washburn: Hello and welcome to our next guest, Kirstin Nus Gruber. She is from Texas and is a, how would you describe that? I always, I hate to just slap the label coach onto people, [00:02:00] but you're a coach.

I actually, your website, you refer to yourself as a mentor. I do. I love that idea. I might have to steal that from you. So you work with cancer survivors and the nutritional path and healing from that experience, I would love it if you would. Share more about your story and exactly how you find yourself right here in this moment.

Kirstin Nussgruber: Well, first of all, thank you very much for having me here. Kathy, it's an honor to be on your podcast. As I said to you before, I listened to many episodes in the car accompanying me everywhere I need to go. So, I gotta pinch myself that I'm honored today as well. So I'm a board certified.

Nutrition consultant. And what that basically means is that we go through a rigorous board exam as well. And the education that we receive is more of a holistic nature. Taking more than nutrition into account. And we support a lot of [00:03:00] integrative doctors, neuropathic doctors medical doctors that are also functional doctors that have, you know, studied a little bit more of an integrative approach.

So that's kind of where we fit in. Integrative pharmacies supplement companies research companies. So that's where our sweet spot lies. And I. Have pivoted or really pretty much from the get go when I decided to turn my career around and embrace a passion of mine, which was nutrition and basically a hobby all along.

And then in my late thirties, I realized I can turn this into a new career. Why not change? Why not pivot? I was in. Human resource management before went to business school, et cetera. And so when I started my nutrition studies, we were living in Munich, in Germany at the time. It was on a three year assignment through my husband's work.

And I realized I'm fluent in this language 'cause I grew up German speaking. I can study [00:04:00] here. Wow. And so that's what I did. I found a neuropathic school that offered a two year. Nutrition course. And that's when I, that's where it started for me. 

Personal Cancer Journey and Nutrition Focus

Kirstin Nussgruber: And while I was there, I got diagnosed with my first breast cancer.

So to me it then became pretty obvious, you know, what? I actually, that's the area I want to focus on because first of all, I had to, for myself this was like, you know, you get catapults into situation. You go, wow, I'm at the source of so much information here and of so many theories that I can test out.

And I don't just wanna keep that for myself. I wanna share it and I want to focus on that, become an expert in a certain area because that's really also what a lot of the. Business advisors tell you as a nutritionist find your niche and then become good at that. So that is kind of what I'm doing, what I have become and still do.

You know, this is a continuous learning experience and that's why I'm here where I [00:05:00] am right now. 

Kathy Washburn: Wow. And I know that you work with those who have experienced cancer and. I'm a cancer survivor also. You and I met through the National Cancer, national , national 

Kirstin Nussgruber: Coalition for Cancer Coalition.

Kathy Washburn: Thank 

Kirstin Nussgruber: you. 

Kathy Washburn: I always 

Kirstin Nussgruber: get 

Kathy Washburn: that wrong. And I and I work with a lot of people who have experienced cancer, but nutrition is, it's a basic need and a power for everybody. And I think we often get lost in this idea of like, okay, I am just gonna eat for the sake of eating versus eating as a way of nourishing ourselves.

I mean, I remember years embarrassingly, I spent so many years on the Mass Pike commuting and just like shoving food in my face while I was driving. Just mindless. You know, [00:06:00] totally detached from what was happening. It was just kind of a means to an end. And gosh, if I could rewind all the way back, I know that my cancer wasn't caused by that, but I'm sure that was part of the cocktail of not nourishing myself in a way that was empowering.

I love 

Kirstin Nussgruber: those words that you just selected. You know, the nourishment, the empowerment here, and the mindlessly doing something. Because I think that holds true for all of us living a modern lifestyle. And, you know, some of us get rattled up by such a disease diagnosis like cancer or maybe autoimmune disease, which is.

More chronic cancer can be chronic too. But it doesn't have to be. it's such an opportunity really to understand the interrelationship between mindfulness, conscious awareness, self-awareness, [00:07:00] what nourishment really means. And yes, I focus on nutrition. But when I work with my clients, we focus on so much more than nutrition because what do we nourish ourselves with?

From a mindset point of view, from an emotional point of view, from a spiritual point of view, from a physical point of view. So a lot of that feeds into this. Let's nourish yourself. It's focus on self-awareness, focus on your self-care, get back to core again, which is very hard in, in this day and age of modern living.

You know, so many pressures are on us mainly work related, financially related that. We can lose sight a little bit, number one, but number two also, there's so much information out there. So it is so overwhelming and often, and especially also in the nutrition field, full of contradictions. Do this, no, do this, do that.

And you know, we just get scared, I think because we also just don't [00:08:00] have the bandwidth to delve into every area of information that could help us become more educated. And that's kind of where we fit in, you know, where I can help out with that too. Often we do a lot of reframing to just take away some of that overwhelm.

That's really how I phrase it. If someone says to me again, going back to this whole marketing thing, you know, I, I would did a course once and we were taught. When somebody says to, you know, what do you do? Don't answer, straight out, answer in a way where people want to ask more of you. And my line is, was I help people with cancer get out of overwhelm by teaching them how to reclaim their lives.

Kathy Washburn: And that's 

Kirstin Nussgruber: really what I focus on, is getting you, helping you, or at least offering some steps for you to get out of overwhelm. And start to focus again, so that you can reclaim what you feel is lost. 'cause very often when we come, when we are diagnosed with cancer and we [00:09:00] get to that crossroads, we feel lost, we feel we've lost something, and we have, we've lost our, you know, pre-cancer self and we know we are never ever gonna get back there.

Even sometimes we kind of try and we in denial and we kick and scream like a toddler sometimes. But we are, you know. When we get down to it, we realize this is our new norm. We are never gonna get back there. So this is an opportunity to just sit with that for a little bit. Sit with this overwhelm for a little bit.

We all will feel it, but how do we get out of it? How do we reclaim it? And we can take small steps. And when it comes to the nutrition field, yes, there are certain guidelines. I follow, you know, evidence-based, research-based, but in the end it's very personalized because nutrition is something, you know, that empowers us because we do this every single day.

We have to eat and put things in our [00:10:00] mouth every single day. What a wonderful way to consistently improve and help us, but at the same time. That is also very scary. Because of the fear of I have to commit to this, I have to be responsible for myself. I have to now show up in an area that I didn't really wanna go or took for granted, or I didn't want to make that an action list as well.

So we have a lot of these kinds of conversations around mindset. When I work with my clients and it, in the end, it needs to work. So the plan that we come up for you needs to work for you. It needs to be sustainable. It's not a diet. We are not doing this for a short period of time. We are teaching you really how to make informed decisions moving forward and being in the various situations that we find ourselves in.

Kathy Washburn: I love that personalization because the one size fits all is [00:11:00] just not a, it's not a really an option for a myriad of reasons. But I wanna go back to something you said this reframing or getting out of the overwhelm. I know from a conversation that we've had prior to this, and you just alluded when you were diagnosed, you found yourself.

Informed Fighter: Taking Control of Health

Kathy Washburn: In this program of nutrition, and I know that you've had familial history of cancer and your choice to go about your personal cancer Journey in a different, more empowered way than. You witnessed. Will you talk a little bit more about I think you used the fra the phrase informed fighter, which has stuck with me since our conversation.

Can you talk a little bit more about your experience of being informed [00:12:00] and and how it. kind of changed that trajectory or maybe even healed the karmic passing along of cancer in your family. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: Yeah, I like that. The karmic passing along. Which is so true. Let me start there then it let's take that point.

Kirstin Nussgruber: So my family history is such that my mom. Had breast cancer twice. Actually, when I was diagnosed the first time with my first breast cancer, she was fighting her second time breast cancer. Oof. At the same time on a different continent. So there's that connection isn't there? And her sister, so my maternal aunt, who I was very close to, was diagnosed when she was 34, and then 39, it had metastasized to her liver and she passed. Just short of her 40th birthday, leaving a 6-year-old behind I was 25 at the time, so we were very close. She was like that generation in between my mom and me.

And it was a huge loss for me, even though she was also in a different continent. So [00:13:00] when I was diagnosed, it was like, and the rhetoric coming from the medical establishment was also, 'cause of course they ask for family history. You tell them and they say, oh, I see. And I mean, you think that too, and in a way, you know, the voice comes up saying, oh, it's your turn now.

And I'm, and I remember clearly thinking, 'cause I was 39, I had just turned 39 when I was diagnosed for the first time. My aunt passed at 39. And when I, you know, when I reached 39 I was thinking, Hey, I made it. It was a thought in my head. So then I got diagnosed and I just thought, I've always been a bit rebellious.

And I've always been, you know, I was one of those little bit annoying kids that would just keep on asking questions and questions and would never be satisfied with an answer that, that she would get. So to me, this was, I like, no, I need this to stop. I have a daughter. My daughter was six.

When I was diagnosed first time, like, no, I don't want [00:14:00] this to be a threat that runs through my family. There's got to be more. I want to step out of this karmic cycle if that, you know, is what's going on here. And that made me also embrace more of an emotional, spiritual part to it because I had doubled with that.

Discovery area before I was diagnosed. I would say the last, you know, about six, seven years before I've always been drawn to a more integrative approach, even in my early twenties. But, you know, you try and and you go on living and it's only until something really happens, you know, at some point you, you yourself decide this is it.

This is the moment I have to take that step. I have to cross that threshold and do something substantial now. You know, not just try or think about it, but actually do action. And so [00:15:00] that's when, you know, for me, my diagnosis was okay. Alright. I have to do more. I mean, I watched what my aunt went through, just conventional.

I watched what my mom went through, just conventional. On different continents, right? The one was in Germany, the one was South Africa. I'm living in the United States. The approach to cancer stand standard approach is pretty much similar in each country. And I'm thinking no. No not, this is not gonna happen.

So by the way, sorry. I was actually in Germany at the time when I was diagnosed but still later on in the US and that's really what got me to the drawing board saying, you've got to do more. What is that more? Well, let me find out and let me approach conventional as well from a point of view of what can you give me what do I need to take away from this?

But I wanna be part of the decision making. And I did at the time. Have the discussions with the doctors and, you know, of the different treat. They wanted to, because of my family history, it was [00:16:00] like, all right, we are gonna do lumpectomy and then we are gonna do chemotherapy and radiation and hormone therapy.

And I wanted to know why. You know, this is how I really started is tell me why this is this informed fighter theme coming through is, I will do what I need to do. I'm embracing a conve sorry, a complimentary approach, right? In other words, conventional plus whatever else I need to do side by side, strengthening each other, not counteracting each other, but I want to know why.

And that's how this whole process of being an informed. I guess stop started. 

Kathy Washburn: It's that little five-year-old self coming, you know, coming through. Like why? Tell me more. And it's so refreshing because often, becoming a participant in one's own health is stripped away as soon as we walk into the hospital room.

You know, it's like you hand over the keys to the castle and there's some sense [00:17:00] of believing that this person knows more about your body than you do. Yes. And I see it, or I've seen it in my parents. I remember. I was a yoga teacher and my ex-mother-in-law had a 

aFib is what it's called. Yeah. Atrial fibrillation. Yes. Yes. And I was doing all of these breathing meditations at the time and I had given her a copy of them and she said, oh no. I'll need to check with my doctor first. Yes. And I thought, I think your doctor would be okay. For you to breathe.

And the same thing happened with my dad. He had COPD and I gave him this CD that I did. And I said, dad, are you listening to the breathing meditations? And he said, well, I'm gonna have to, I'm gonna talk to my doctor about that first. And. Like you, I think I enter sometimes with a little [00:18:00] more like we are equal.

The doctor or the nurse comes in and I'm an equal party to this conversation, and I'm not gonna be talked at, I'm gonna be talked with. And I think it's a powerful position to take, not to be. Rude or disrespectful. And it often takes doctors completely by surprise. You know, there's a, and part of it's probably the culture of, okay, you have 11 minutes and so if you do all the talking, we're now at like three minutes left.

But I do think it's such a powerful practice and we were taught by these parents. And this culture of completely being disconnected to what our bodies are trying to say. 

Reconnecting with Body and Nutrition

Kathy Washburn: Do you see nutrition as kind of an inroad to [00:19:00] that awakening, that conversation between what my body's saying and how I can respond differently?

Kirstin Nussgruber: Absolutely. Such valid points that you bring. And you know, if we do look back the generation of our parents where it is very typical, you know, there are experts and trust the experts and there's, but there's also, at the same time, underlying that is the sense of. Lacking self-advocacy and lacking self-confidence.

I think, you know, growing up too with access to the internet where we. Whatever we wanna find out about, we can Google it. Whether we get a good answer or not, I'm not gonna go to that right now, but we have access which our parents didn't, you know, you had to go to libraries or microfish stuff, which, if you didn't go to university, you had no idea what a microfish was.

So none of my parents went to college, so they didn't know where to get that information. So it's understandable that they have [00:20:00] that feeling. I'm just flabbergasted at how many people. Now still feel that way and feel disempowered. But to get back to your question about nutrition as an inroad, yes, because this is the time, you know, when you are diagnosed, when you're dealing with a diagnosis to reconnect.

And one way in which we need to reconnect is what are we feeding ourselves from a a food point of view and understanding that. Has such an influence on our microenvironment, on our inner terrain, and educating my clients on that. And also, you know, corroborating it with certain lab values, basic lab values, you know, from LabCorp request or so on, saying look and then making those changes and then doing the lab work again, say, look at the change just from doing that.

And then seeing, you know, in other words, providing proof [00:21:00] of the positive effects that nutrition has on your physique. And then that sort of is, I think, sets the ball rolling for many people when they realize that does make a difference. It really does. And moving away also from trusting, , I don't wanna really, you know, dis television here, but I don't watch any kind of television with ads because that is one area that can really get my blood boiling in in, in under five seconds to see how we are being manipulated. But that. Is around us, and that is the basic kind of environment that we all grow up in, in that, again, it doesn't matter which country you are.

Similar strategies. And you believe it. You believe that because there's also, there's real manipulation going on. You see always healthy bodies and smiley faces and happy families and so on associated with certain products. You want that. That's something that you, [00:22:00] everybody, most of us at least yearn for.

So we trust in the products and then it's quite an awakening to go. Back and analyze some of the products that you are eating on a regular basis. And this is important regular basis, right? Exposing yourself to something on a very regular basis versus every now and then. There's a big difference here too.

And realizing what I'm doing, what am I contributing to, what are the little imbalances that I'm contributing to? But if you add it all up, I'm actually, it's, it actually has a very big impact on my physique. So there's a whole lot of this going on this awareness and this education this informing going on.

Kathy Washburn: Yeah, I can see that. It's this waking up almost of I once had coach that had me fill out this form every day I was having, and I still. Deal with a lot of inflammation [00:23:00] that has resulted in this cough. That's been going on for a while. And my friend she had me just print out these little gingerbread men, you know, just a outline of a human body.

Yeah. And every morning. Just start at the head and say how I was feeling. And then on the other end of the other side of the paper was my food journal. So it was quite remarkable it, because I've done food journals for a long time, but to actually put it on the body and say, wow, you know, that glass of wine last night.

Really makes me feel congested. I feel a lot of congestion, or I haven't had a glass of wine for four days and I have no congestion. I feel clear, and I thought it was one of the silliest exercises, but the most profound because it started reconnecting [00:24:00] me with, you know, these like habitual movements. This constant do eating something or drinking something that I wasn't connecting to the repercussions of it. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: What I have my clients do is when we do food journaling is go, I have reason, you know, why are you eating that? And can just be you're hungry. How does it make you feel? Thing, very similar approach because it stops you in your tracks and you go, oh, I gotta actually think about that.

I've gotta try. And is 

Kathy Washburn: there a connection? 

Kirstin Nussgruber: You know, it just stops people in their tracks and then they might realize. Something that they took for granted. And a lot often it has to do with, as you said, symptoms like congestion. You just think it's your normal until you stop something and then it you are forced to analyze.

Does that make a difference? And then you notice a difference and then you obviously gotta try it again and again. You know, because you want to see, oh, is this just a one thought? Is [00:25:00] that really.

I was working with a client once, now he wasn't a cancer client of mine. 

Personalized Nutrition and Healing

Kirstin Nussgruber: So every now and then I take non-cancer clients. It depends, but he had very severe GI issues. You know, constant. Diarrhea, et cetera, et cetera. So he came, referred, he was working with a functional medical doctor and came referred to her to me.

And you know, it was, we had to do some really strict food elimination for a very long time. Follow a very rigorous style of eating low FODMAP diet, which really reduces the amount of carbohydrates that you can take to almost nil. And avoiding a lot of other you know, flavor enhancing foods too, like onions and garlic and so on.

So it was very strict, but he was determined. And. We really got through that phase. He was, as I said, because he was working with the medical doctor as [00:26:00] well. He was also on a a medical therapeutic protocol regimen as well. And he was strict with that too. And that focused on healing the gut too.

So this is important. You can't just stop eating certain food. You really have to also focus on healing the gut at the same time. Which I generally do with my clients too, if they come through my private practice to me and. We got through and he ended up being able to reintroduce some of the foods and then finding out what's the threshold for me?

Are there certain foods that I really cannot have at all anymore? Or can I have them, but maybe only at half the quantity or the frequency. So that's that personalized approach again. And it is a little bit trial and error sometimes is trying to find out what will work for me. I have really focused on on, on recovery and health recovery been diligent and compliant and so on.

So I'm seeing the benefits now in terms of, alright, what can I actually eat? [00:27:00] What is not making, what is not causing me diarrhea, what is not causing me gas and feeling bloated and cramping and so on. Oh, I can have that, but I can only have it maybe once a week or once every two weeks if I have it more frequently.

I kind of tend to feel that and that awareness. It's hard work, it's really disciplined, dedicated work, but. At the end of that is you feel better and you can re, I'm going back to that word, you can reclaim your life where nutrition isn't constantly in your face. And that's really a goal that I have too.

You know, when I work with my cancer clients is. Let's figure this out. Let's figure out what we need to do for you. But I want to get you to a point where you embrace life, you embrace eating, you embrace joy for living again as well. And this is not always in your face. Every time you think of, what do I need to eat?

Kathy Washburn: I could see how it, it becomes a new way [00:28:00] of Yeah. Reclaiming your life. It's just a different way. I can see mindset playing a big role in this. How do you work with mindset and helping that self-advocacy or inspiring people to kind of step into their adult shoes. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: So those, let's call them.

Addressing Limiting Beliefs and Self-Worth

Kirstin Nussgruber: Hard to crack cases. Where there is just severe limiting beliefs and low self-esteem, low self-worth, maybe even self-loathing going on. That is hindering compliance with my recommendations. Okay, let's phrase it like that. First of all, I think from the get go, I make it quite clear I'm nonjudgmental.

I'm not gonna judge you. And I hear you and I want to hear from you. If you're struggling, I want to hear from you. Don't stay away. If I have [00:29:00] a client, which very seldom happens, but you know, postponing rescheduling kind of, okay. Let's meet I don't care. If you've done nothing since we last spoke, let's meet.

Okay. And very often we just have conversations that have nothing to do with nutrition that have to do with this self worth and. Oh, you know, PE people often are then, you know, depends what's going on, obviously. I mean, I've had some cases where they were, you know, they were mentally really challenged.

There were things going on in their lives that were just taking precedence in terms of coming to the fore and having to deal with that. But I just offer a safe space. Sometimes that's all I can do is offer a safe space in which they often also just, I. Vomit regrets. And also when they are working with their integrative doctors feel under pressure by them.

And they don't wanna own up to the integrative doctor, but they feel they can own up to me because [00:30:00] I give them that space. I want them to own up, but I want it to come from them. I want them to trust that process, them having someone that they can talk to. About their own weaknesses, about their own shortcomings, and just be heard.

Often helps them reframe it and just see it, see a little bit from a different perspective and kind of really move towards that embracing themselves. And let's start with real small baby steps. And that's fine. You know, going back let's just dial it back a little bit here. And I think that's so very important is this offering this space and then asking questions.

Uncovering Childhood Food Trauma

Kirstin Nussgruber: Sometimes going back, you know, so I had one client to she was really struggling to implement and, it didn't make sense that she was struggling and she was so frustrated with herself, but almost couldn't help herself. [00:31:00] And I asked the one question and that set it all off for her. I said, what happened when you were a child with food?

And she just sat there and had this shocked look on her face, because this I this person I actually saw in person. And she goes, oh my God. It turns out that she had been, food had been used as punishment. She was always more of a tomboy as a kid and, you know, would be out in the woods and stuff and maybe miss dinner times and come in late or disheveled or it just, you know, she was a child okay.

And then being a child. But her father would use that as punishment and would she would have to go to bed hungry. And she just dissolved and just started crying. It just came up. It just bubbled up in her. And all I did was just sit and allow her to do that. And she was embarrassed. I said, no, it's just you and me because I wa and inside I was going, yay, [00:32:00] yay.

You know? And so there was this cleansing, this realization going on for her. And so that started a process for her to reclaim that and realize. My resistance to doing the right thing when it comes to food stems from that shame that she was made to feel. So she started working on that. And that opened doors for her then, and, you know, and so slowly but surely, you know, she could start embracing.

Finding herself and finding I'm actually worthy of, I wanna ditch this, I wanna cut cords to that and I wanna move on from there. But she didn't know that she had to do that before. Just that little conversation. And I dunno what made me ask that, but I just suddenly had this feeling like, oh, something happened with her and food, you know, with as a child.

And here we go, you know, so. Yeah. You, we sometimes have that right? We so sorry. We sometimes have that, or we are forced to eat [00:33:00] certain things as a child and it, it has lasting impact on us into our adulthood. 

Kathy Washburn: Yes. I've seen that with a few of my clients. Mostly what I'm working on with clients is emotional health.

And I remember one client just very bubbly and she came to me. She's a little overweight. And she said, oh, we were talking about feelings and giving yourself permission to feel. And she said, oh, I eat my feelings. And I thought it was such an interesting way to couch that, which cut, which was a limiting belief and a mindset that to give herself comfort.

It required eating because that was something that she had control over as a child. Yeah. And her, and made her feel better. That made her feel better, that she could control. So [00:34:00] she, when we were talking about this she said, I've been saying that line. I eat my feelings as a self-deprecating kind of ha.

For so many years that I actually didn't quite get that I am eating to comfort myself. And that's not a healthy way to comfort. So it was just kind of this remarkable, just like the one you just shared this moment of meeting where. People are just like, whoa. Oh my goodness. The whole board just lit up and I can now make all these connections.

Yeah. And now how can I switch my mindset to something that is more beneficial and serving me instead of eating my feelings, I can nourish myself and find a way to [00:35:00] feel. You know, give myself permission to feel. Yeah. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: Correct. I mean, so often it's an emotional, has an emotional undertone. Yeah. 

Kathy Washburn: Yeah. And like you said our parents or the previous generation did not have the wealth of knowledge and understanding that we now have.

And I often think about how important it is to. To invoke people like you, help from people that don't really know us and all of our kind of limiting beliefs that we were born in, but can shine that light and mentor us and to new ways of being. 

The Importance of Resonant Relationships

Kathy Washburn: Can you share the i we call this a resonant relationship?

This is the work of, huh. It's just escaped me his name. It'll come back. But resident [00:36:00] relationships are really those places where you can go and really be heard in a way that maybe is not available to you. The groups of people that you normally kind of hang out with. Can you share, I think you are a resonant relationship for all of your clients but, and you've mentioned some of the criteria of that resonance like being a safe place.

Are there other elements or criteria for change to occur in those spaces?

Kirstin Nussgruber: Good question. So I think it's important that we each find souls that we can connect with. And that means getting out there. 

Stepping Out of Your Comfort Zone

Kirstin Nussgruber: Those people that have held those roles for me, I [00:37:00] have met through me going out and connecting and networking, joining associations, going to annual conferences, and in other words, expanding your sphere of influence beyond your family and your friends and your comfort zone.

So stepping out of your comfort zone, I mean, a lot of it is related professionally too, but also. In terms of terms, you yourself saying like set yourself one thing per year. I love that idea. Something new. You're going to try and it doesn't have to be big thing, can be a small thing, but do something which you wouldn't, you haven't done before and where you have to step out of your comfort zone.

And you would be amazed at who shows up in your life and suddenly you can find souls that you've just met, but you've known each other for a long time. Do you know what I mean? And you suddenly have this connection and you can talk [00:38:00] about things that are so intimate, but you feel safe. So it's this scenario where, put yourself out there.

Don't close yourself up. Because then you're just building a wall and you're shuttering everything off. Meanwhile, if you go out and you try something and you bold, you take a little bit of courage or guts and then you, it's amazing who you will find. So doesn't have to be your teacher. It could just be someone, like a peer that you meet or someone that you look up to and you think, oh, that person, wow, has so much more experience in this field.

And then it turns out they're just as human as you are and feel the same about you, maybe. You know? So it just, that those experiences, I think solidify your self worth and your self advocacy as well. And I think that [00:39:00] is such an important. And also when you go out there and you put yourself out there and you meet, join a group or something, and you realize this group is not for me.

I have that with the typical, sorry. The typical support groups, breast cancer support groups, they didn't work for me. Yeah, me neither. It was a pity party. Right. And it was just really, and I mean, again, with all due respect, they can be very helpful for some people. That's why it's always about find your thing, but.

Does that thing, that environment, that group of people, do they inspire you? Do they make you feel good? Do they want you to be a better version of yourself? Do they just cause you to feel good about yourself? So ask those questions too. And if they don't match then. Don't go back, you know, that's also out there.

There's a lot of that out there where you go, that's [00:40:00] just not where I feel good and I'm not running away from something. I'm just realizing this is not an environment that is helping me grow or become stronger. 

Kathy Washburn: You bring up a really good point, I think in any kind of change. And it's not just cancer.

Maybe it's job change or divorce or relationship ending or loss. There's such a tendency for isolation. And that isolation, nothing grows in isolation. Even trying to like change my diet on my own, it's really hard to do these changes in the vortex of ourselves without being witnessed by another human.

And whether it's witnessing on this mentoring coaching level, or being witnessed as part of a group where you can just. [00:41:00] Intimately share. Wow, this is really hard. This thing I'm doing is really hard. And somebody next to you says, ah, I totally feel you. That's exactly how I feel. And there's something about that being witnessed by another human in a safe space where you can be.

You just deepen that intimacy. I feel like intimacy is the counterbalance of isolation and those two words aren't often looked at together. 'cause intimacy. I do a lot with intimacy and I often refer to it as into me, I see or into me letting another, into me to see, which is really scary and vulnerable.

But it's way easier if the stakes are lower. If you don't know people from Adam, it's like, I'm just gonna show up in this group. Yeah. And if it doesn't work out, I can leave no, no [00:42:00] harm, no foul. If it does work out, I can practice being this other person or this other version of me, a more exposed, vulnerable person, and just see how it lands and what happens.

Kirstin Nussgruber: It's being in a nonjudgmental environment, isn't it? Which really gets you to open up. Is I think that's the key. Yes. We often, you know, we feel that people closest to us could potentially judge us, and even if they don't do so knowingly, but there is that risk. But going somewhere else and where, you know, I think that's the most important key.

Literally to get people to dig deep. And connect and uncover what is really holding me back and what's really what's the scene being played out in my act here that is causing this reaction in me? Whether it's resistance or denial or just refusal, you know? So [00:43:00] we have to go there.

We have to have those kinds of. Conversations and you know, some of, with some of my clients, we really go there and it just depends. It depends how vulnerable you are and how willing you are to release some of that too. 

Yeah. 

Kathy Washburn: So beautiful. And such a integral part of life, you know, to use that.

Little dial of nutrition to turn up all of this other more generative stuff that can happen because of, yeah. Can you share a story where that actually has happened, where you've witnessed somebody making this change in nutrition and it actually influencing their life in a very positive way because of that?

Kirstin Nussgruber: I think [00:44:00] I. Anyone realizing that it affects your, you know, different systems, organ systems in the body, your endocrine system, only different hormones, that includes your feel good hormones, your stress hormones, and realizing how you can have an impact on that. I think making these connections. If I eat that or if I drink that happens.

We've talked about it before, but you know, these little connections are so important to to realize the immediate repercussion that an action of mine can have and how I can control that. And if I struggle to control that. I have to dig deeper. I have to ask myself, now that I know that I can [00:45:00] control that and what it is doing to me.

Why am I still drawn to doing it? Why can't I break away? Why don't I have the, oh my gosh, I will change that because now I know moment because that sometimes happens too. And you can have both at the same time. That's empowerment to me is you keep on asking those questions. You know, you do something, you find something out, and then you go, well, why am I not, why am I not automatically doing that?

What's going on here? And not, again, no judgment, no blaming, no guilt. Just step aside, look down on yourself and go, what's she doing? What's he doing? You know, what's going on here? What's really going on here? That's empowerment. And you kind of, you uncover the layers about yourself, which is really transformative.

In 

Kathy Washburn: the 

Kirstin Nussgruber: end, 

Kathy Washburn: I feel like you're speaking right to me. I really have struggled for so long, I [00:46:00] think. You know, alcohol has been a familial. My grandfather was an alcoholic and then it kind of skipped my parents' generation. There was no alcohol in my house growing up ever. And then I married into a family that alcohol was very prevalent and a huge part of everything.

And I think I took the, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Approach. So. 

Navigating Social Situations Without Alcohol

Kathy Washburn: I've been trying to let go of alcohol and I'm not, I wouldn't call myself an addict. I'm not addicted to it, and I am a little, there's this like, oh, if I just have one glass. I don't even know, half of the time, I don't even like the taste of it.

It's like, very rarely do I find that glass of wine that's like, oh, this is so good. Most of the time it's like, I do you. But I [00:47:00] know that it causes so much inflammation and I have asthma, and over the last six months I've had, as soon as I drink alcohol it, I actually have to do my inhaler. And then there was a period there where I was like, I'll just take a Benadryl so that I can have a couple glasses of wine and, or it's like, oh, maybe it's wine.

Maybe I'll try vodka. You know, I'll have vodka with my, and so I've been going back and forth. Well, long story short, last week I ended up in the ICU. Because my asthma met the rhinovirus and which is a cold gone bad and I couldn't breathe. So I was in the ICU for three days and I could do nothing in there.

'cause I couldn't really think clearly. But there was a lot of pondering, like. Why would I ever wanna drink alcohol? Not that alcohol was what put me [00:48:00] there. It was a perfect storm, but sure, no, I've been trying to give up alcohol for as long as I've been trying to give up coffee. I don't think either of those things are healthy for me.

Certainly not as bookends to my day, starting with coffee, ending with wine. And so I haven't had any alcohol for a couple weeks now and. I'm about to meet some girlfriends in Florida, some old friends. We've known each other for 20 plus years, and I had to put out the, I'm not drinking alcohol. No.

And. I have such anxiety, I'm like, am I gonna be able to do this? Am I gonna be able to not drink alcohol in this very familiar environment? Environment? I think I just need to have a one-on-one with you on another, off the podcast. But I feel like you're talking right to me. It's like I need to have this, 

Empowerment Through Self-Reflection

Kathy Washburn: Moment with myself, which I might have this afternoon, where I'm looking down and [00:49:00] saying, why is she doing that? What does alcohol actually, what is it? What's the feeling that I'm trying to get? Or what am I after? It's 

Kirstin Nussgruber: part of the social group. That's what it a lot. We wanna belong, you wanna belong, we wanna belong and be, do we?

We ident. It's that NLP thing, right When we sit across from each other. And we invariably end up doing the same body movements, crossing our arms, folding the legs, doing this, you know, putting, you know, cupping your hand in your chin and you will find yourself doing, if you become consciously aware of it, you'll mimic mirror each other.

What is that? It's this sense of I'm belonging. If we do the same thing we say, we protect it. Against whatever, against the elements, whatever. Okay. It's that in, in inherent instinct in us, I think, you know, is part of that at least. So with the alcohol thing is a, those, they are kombucha drinks that are not sweet, [00:50:00] but you know, there's something you can take along and put in a fancy.

Kathy Washburn: Cocktail 

Kirstin Nussgruber: glass or whatever, wine, glass, whatever. So it is a different glass, not just your normal water glass. Yeah. You feel like you're drinking a special drink. That's one option. And the other option is. You know, mocktails that are not sweet, which is difficult to find because, you know, many of the mocktail Co, you know, lists will always have some syrup or something in it.

It's like, no guys no. I want like a gin and tonic type thing. Mocktail don't want anything. And so there's another option is play around with some mocktail recipes that you like and, either take the recipe along to a bar and say there could be that, oh, what a brilliant idea. Or take it along whatever to a friend's house.

But you want to have a different drink than your standard in a different container than your standard. When you're part of a social group, 

Kathy Washburn: it's normal. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: It's nothing odd. It's [00:51:00] normal. Right. Thank 

Kathy Washburn: you for that. Yes, and I have way more you just. Reiterated I have way more control than I, than my limiting belief.

Yes you do. Yeah. So thank you for that. You don't have to sit there with a water glass with my lemon, my slice of lemon. That just boring. It just screams like you're not drinking, you don't belong. You don't belong. Yeah. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: Thank you. You drink everyday thing. 

Final Thoughts and Reflections

Kathy Washburn: This has been so wonderful. I have one last question.

I'd love to ask you if I were to crush you up. Crush your essence up and put it in pill form, what effect would you have on someone taking that pill? 

Kirstin Nussgruber: I knew that question was coming because you ask everyone and I'll be listening to a podcast. Alright, so my daughter asked me earlier, 'cause I said I read that question out to her saying, 'cause that's I'm sure she's gonna ask me this.

And so she goes, what are you gonna say, mom? And so this is what I'm gonna [00:52:00] say. Maybe I'll re recreate it, but I think. So I immediately went to you take the pill. How do you want to feel after that pill is ingested? Not just swallowed, but actually ingested and takes hold of doing whatever need to needs to do inside.

You wanna feel really good. You want to feel empowered. You want to feel like I can conquer the world. You want to feel. Positive about whatever you throw at me. I can tackle this. I can, there is a way I can handle this. I want you to have a clarity of mind. 'cause we need that so that we can feel that way.

So if we've had some mental fog or some fatigue going on that gets all cleared away and I can see and think clearly. 

And then we can do. Then we can embrace what we want to embrace. We literally can find the cloud with a silver lining. We can find the sunshine breaking through the clouds, but we need to have [00:53:00] that clarity of mind and just feeling I am worthy of looking for a solution that is good for me.

Kathy Washburn: Oh, I wanna take that pill all day. And it actually kind of circles back to when we originally started this conversation because you embody that you yourself knew that you were worthy of looking for a different solution to ex with your cancer experience. And here you are sharing that solution.

With so many other people to empower them to become informed fighters in their own life. And I'm just so, kind of blown away with the work that you're doing and I am really grateful that you're here and that I got to meet you and we got to have this conversation. We'll have your contact information.

You, do you take people out of state, out of Dallas? Yes. Okay. Yes. We'll have your contact [00:54:00] information and, has just been extraordinary. I really appreciate the gift of time. 

Kirstin Nussgruber: Well, thank you for having me here and allowing me to disconnect with you and your listeners. It's been a real honor.

Thank you. 

Thank you so much for your gift of time and for tuning into the investment of self type C transformation podcast. Make sure to check out the show notes for this episode@kathywashburn.net slash podcast and give us a follow on Instagram at Kathy Washburn, D-O-T-N-E-T. If you liked this episode, make sure to follow investment of self type C transformation and if you feel so moved.

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