Shampoo Lies, Wallet Cries + Resilliency with Kate Assaraf (part 2)

Feeling burned out by beauty hype and buried in empty bottles? We sat down with Kate, the founder behind DIP, to unpack how a tiny conditioner bar can outlast liquid bottles, simplify your routine, and actually reduce waste without sacrificing how your hair looks and feels. Kate breaks down the rinse‑off reality of hair care, why most “active‑packed” claims wash down the drain, and how she designed a bar that delivers soft, shiny results through months of daily use.

The journey wasn’t quick—about 40 iterations across four years—but the principles never wavered: performance you can see after one wash, formulas that respect scalp health, and radical longevity that undercuts hyper‑consumption. We also get candid about what didn’t work. Paid SEO and ad packages under‑delivered, while real customers and stylists fueled growth through genuine enthusiasm. You’ll hear how eco‑minded salons stock DIP because it isn’t discounted on Amazon, why minis make plastic‑free services easy to offer, and the surprise win that the conditioner bar helps remove foils painlessly during highlights.

Beyond the shower, this conversation is a manifesto for buying locally and rebuilding human connection. Store owners act as curators in a noisy, algorithmic world, helping people choose sustainable swaps that fit their habits and hair. Kate draws a vivid line from where we spend money to how our towns thrive, reminding us that a refill shop can feel like an old‑school record store—personal, knowledgeable, and fun. We close with a look ahead at a music industry partnership and a creative residency with the Savannah College of Art and Design’s atelier in Lacoste, where the next DIP product will be developed in public view.

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Transcript

Framing The Mission Of Reigniting

SPEAKER_03 0:06

All of us reach a point in time where we are depleted and need to somehow find a way to reignite the fire within. But how do we spark that flame? Welcome to Reignite Resilience, where we will venture into the heart of the human spirit. We'll discuss the art of reigniting our passion and strategies to stoke our enthusiasm. And now here are your hosts, Natalie Davis and Pamela Kat.

From Plastic Bottles To Bars

SPEAKER_00 0:41

Outside of the plastic bottles, right? Like that's the big piece. Like, and so that is a huge, I mean, when you look at like just the average person, the number of bottles of conditioner that they're using throughout the year, that being alleviated, and Pam hit the nail on the head. Now we have your customer that is making an impact, right? Like a positive impact for the planet. Tell us like conceptually about the bar itself, because we didn't get to work with a scientist. And so we don't know all of the magic that goes in on the back end. Give us a better understanding of the benefits, the pros, why you went that direction and how the end user truly does benefit from it as well. Sure.

Rinse‑Off Reality And Honest Claims

Designing Bars To Last A Year

SPEAKER_01 1:18

Yeah. So with one of the most important things to realize with any hair care is that it's rinse off, right? So it's not like skincare where you put it on and like it stays there a long time and it kind of like really matters and accumulates over time. So shampoo and conditioner, you'll know like within one wash whether it's for you or not for you. And I don't want to piss off other brands, but a lot of brands for shampoo and conditioner make all these claims and marketing claims on there because they use an ingredient at a certain percentage or whatever that does XYZ to hair. But the reality is it's on your head for a very little time and then rinses off. And some, you know, things make it softer, some things make it shinier, glossier, whatever. So, like with dip, you're using so little product per wash. Like, imagine like this small disc, really, this conditioner bar will last someone a year. So you're using so little, and that was intentional. That was like my favorite part of it because my conditioner bar is like a middle finger to the hyper consumption of the beauty industry. So even if the whole thing was like so condensed with what they call actives, like it wouldn't matter because you're really using very little. I just I seriously focused on making sure it just left hair soft and shiny. Like I don't, I wish I could say more about all of those things, but I was like, okay, I'm gonna use the best of the best ingredients. I'm gonna make sure that they do what they say. And with the shampoo, especially, like I really wanted to solve that daily shower problem. It needed to be gentle. But if someone uses like a lot of mousse and gels or like the slick back hair wax stick, dip is too gentle to take that out. It's not for that person, but it but it is for all these other people. So so yeah, I mean, my main priority was that when someone blue dry their hair or air-dried their hair, that it looked how they wanted it to look. Beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 3:02

I love it. And concept to consumer, how long are we talking?

Gentle Shampoo And Use Cases

SPEAKER_01 3:07

We moved pretty fast. I'd say as fast as it takes to do like 40 iterations. Sometimes we do like three or four iterations at a time. So I would say overall, probably four years of research in like creating the formulas, but also once you start getting close, like really, I would say four months after we got the trademark secured, we were like in it and ready to go. So some of it is kind of you're doing a little bit every day, you know, maybe putting one or two hours in a day. And then before you know it, you're like the actual beginning is like when you're doing like 15, 18 hours a day, and you like don't know, you know, you can't think about anything else. Yeah. So I love that. Looking back on this journey, is there anything you wish you had known or any surprises that came up during it that you're like, gosh, didn't expect every single marketing thing that someone has told me to pay for has not worked as well as the genuine people who use dip. So, like, like I just got I got hosed by like an SEO company that promised all these things, and it was like, okay, but like nothing's better than the woman in a running group who uses Dip and tells all of her friends. Like, none of all the real like dip is built in real life, all the any kind of marketing thing like I've tried just doesn't land the way the enthusiasm is like person to person. So it's kind of one of the the biggest reasons we don't do any marketing or you know, but there's I mean, there's so many things like that. They're like, I think what's very surprising is how unreceptive so many people are once they hear it's bars. They're like, no, not for me. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 4:41

Yeah, they have that pre-judgment instantly, like, oh, that's not gonna work for me. It's not gonna work for my hair. Where am I gonna store the bar? Like I don't know. They probably come up with 15 different, you know, they do.

SPEAKER_01 4:51

Or I get like very long stories about how their hair is way more special than anyone else's and requires my hair.

SPEAKER_02 4:58

So special, my hair is genius, and it just doesn't do that.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

Your hair is not special, your relationship to your hair is special, but like as far as this being like matter on earth, it's like not that special.

SPEAKER_02 5:10

Not that special.

Iterations And Product Timeline

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Sorry, ladies and gentlemen, your hair is not that special. Some people really want to think that their hair is so, so special. Yeah. And I love it. I hair is one of my favorite things. I've had every kind of hair you can imagine. And I just love hair. And I also like I just appreciate like Pamela, I love your bangs and I love how they frame your face. And like your Natalie, your straight across bangs are so cute, especially with your glasses. Like, it's just I love hair. I can like, yeah, and if someone catches, like if I'm looking at my phone and it's kind of scrolling through and someone's like looking over my shoulder, more often than not, they're gonna see like me on Pinterest looking at hair. I just save cute hairstyles for no reason, not hairstyles, it just love hair. Like and I just you'll see me just going through and like looking at different hair.

SPEAKER_02 6:00

Now, do you see this product being used in hair salons?

What Marketing Actually Worked

SPEAKER_01 6:04

Yeah, and it is. So some of our like die hard customers and bring their bars to the hair salon because they're like, I trust what's in this bar and I don't need you to do anything else. And also the conditioner bar takes out foils painlessly. So it helps take out foils if you're getting your hair highlighted, which is really cool. That's something I learned. I didn't intend for that, but it made me really happy. And so also dip is sold in a a lot of eco-minded salons. So there's a lot of hairdressers that are kind of tired of products that they have to have retail and then compete with Amazon or Sephora or Ulta for all of their discounts. And since we don't offer our products there and we don't undercut stylists, hairstylists, we put it on their shelves and then they're they're able to recommend it and say, hey, if you buy this shampoo and conditioner bar, you'll save the amount of being able to come into my chair twice. That's the stylist math, right? Like I'll sell you a dip conditioner bar, and with that money, you can have like two services. And so that's a very compelling thing for someone who is like, okay, the economy's crunching, like the things I care about are, you know, it's starting to become really expensive to buy luxury products. Like, can I like dip's a no-brainer for someone who wants to go into the salon? Like that's their haven, you know.

SPEAKER_02 7:16

Now, could a hairstylist use like the same bar on multiple people, or is that that would be up to the people, the players involved in that. Yeah, surprise. Okay, so it would be more of a product that you would sell at a salon for the clientele.

Overcoming Bias Against Bars

SPEAKER_01 7:31

Yeah, and some salons, what's really cool is we have minis too. So we have smaller sizes, and then they put the price, they say, like, would you like a plastic-free service? And if someone says yes, they opt in and the cost of the bars is blended into the price of the service. So then they take it with them.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

I was gonna say they can take it with them and then try it. I'm asking these questions. My son's girlfriend just finished cosmopology school. She's gonna be starting in a hair salon, and I was like, I'd love to introduce her to this, to potentially to the salon she's gonna be working in. So yeah. And she does my hair, so I'm gonna have her do it on my hair. So I will be I will be a huge shout out about that.

Stylists, Salons, And Foil Removal

SPEAKER_01 8:09

So amazing. Yeah, there's some salons that have put in like 20, 30 reorders because they're able to, they're able to sell it, you know. It's very hard for stylists, especially like independent business owners, like of any kind, to be able to sell anything that is also offered on Amazon. It is so hard because people are naturally inclined to sit around and add to cart. Um, so we try and make it a little bit harder to get dip, but a little bit easier for people to sell in person.

SPEAKER_02 9:32

Okay, so tell people where they can get dip because after this episode, we're gonna have a bazillion people that are like, I want that.

Salon Economics Without Amazon

SPEAKER_01 9:39

How do I get it? Exactly. So you can get it at dip allready. So dipalready.com, D-I-P-A-L-R-E-A-D-Y.com. And then if you want to ask any questions, we are on Instagram at dip allready and also on TikTok at dip already. And also if you go to our website, you'll see a tab called store locator. So if you click on there, you can see if you don't trust me and my what I have to say about it, you can go there, see if there's a dip retailer in your town and talk to someone that is not me, who's not, you know, to find out if it's as good as I say it is. And what's cool about people in stores and people that own these stores is that they've tried every version of a product before they decide what to stock. So, like, in my opinion, a store owner is like the last kind of it's like the antidote to what's happening with AI and fake UGC and like all of this stuff. A store owner will have tried all of the brands and more often than not, they're stocking dip.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

That's incredible. That is wow. What's next?

Minis And Plastic‑Free Services

SPEAKER_01 10:40

Isn't that enough? I have some cool things coming up. One is a partnership with someone in the music industry to bring dip into cool events. I can't say too much until everything's kind of inked, but that's my little teaser. It would be something that we did a collaborative bar with the band Guster. Do you know that band? Oh yeah. They're really big when I was in high school and I get they're continuing to be big. They take they're really fun band, but they're very earth-loving. And so it's so cool to see that their cut their like audience has really embraced dip also. And and so yeah, we're we're like, okay, there's a big connection here. We've had an evergreen kind of marketing thing that's called Refill is the new record store. And the idea is that you know how you used to go into a record store and you can like you knew the person working there, and they kind of knew you're weird, and you could say, like, I like this band, and they would be like, if you like that band, you'll also like this algorithm. You'll like this one algorithm. Yeah, like, but when things felt like secretive and fun, that's how sustainability is for me in refill store. So when you walk into a refill store, they kind of like can get a sense of where you are on your sustainability journey and like recommend things you think you'll like, and that and there's some things that are like, oh no, you have to be like way deep into this, you know, to get into that. You know, someone out there is selling reusable toilet paper, and it's like never gonna be me. Oh, I'm good.

SPEAKER_02 12:03

I'm actually good. I also do not want to buy used underwear at a second hand store. I'm just listening to certain things.

SPEAKER_00 12:14

Yeah, there's certain there's certain things not your target audience. That's fine. I'm not targeted.

SPEAKER_01 12:21

But what I'm saying is it's fun to be able to like get the algorithm away from you and go into one of these places and have them kind of like be able to help curate something that seems right for you and where you are. And so yeah, I love the idea of refill stores feeling like record stores. And I hope one day physical media comes back because I do miss going into a record store. Same way I miss like waiting in line for tickets to go to a concert.

SPEAKER_02 12:47

I know it's not as fun when everybody's in their own house just waiting to click a button.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

It's not that remember how many weird people we'd meet in like lawn chairs on the street on the streets in the city.

SPEAKER_02 12:59

How can our parents let us do that? I have just I know.

SPEAKER_00 13:02

I'm trying to envision how we could even go back to that. Like, I don't know how we would make our way back to that. I think people want it.

Where To Buy And Store Locator

SPEAKER_01 13:08

You know, like I think people are like, bring tickets back to the box office. Like, why do I have to pay Ticketmaster? Like, come on, you know. I think people are starting to disengage with the digital world a little bit. And I think that that's not so much of a bad thing.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

No, I think it's actually a really good thing. Yeah, people need human connection.

SPEAKER_01 13:26

I think about pre-Faco days.

SPEAKER_02 13:28

Oh my gosh. Like how about pre-cell phones where you actually had to like you had to memorize their phone number and you had to actually style it? Yes. I still do that, but I guess that's not a thing. So sad. Good old days.

SPEAKER_00 13:49

You know, there, I don't think we have any listeners that can relate to not understanding what that is. I think all of our listeners can relate to 100% that era, that those moments in time for sure. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 14:00

Yeah, yeah.

Retailers As Curators In An AI World

SPEAKER_01 14:01

Yeah. And so I know it's kind of antiquated a little bit to think that way, but dip does try and keep like people back a little bit in time. And it's fun, you know. It's like get your ass in a store, go check it out. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

Well, what I love is like that dip is actually all about the connection, right? Like, I mean, I know that it started with this intention about, you know, kind of our footprint and what we're doing to the planet and and the environment, but you, I mean, you have that like connection from the product itself, but then bringing it into these refill stores and bringing back the human connection piece of it, it's such an impact product that I would never have imagined. And so I think it's beautiful what you've created and love watching it grow.

Music Partnerships And Refill Culture

SPEAKER_01 14:42

Thank you. Yeah, it's wild to see it grow because when I started it and I was like, I'm only gonna sell this in small stores, I'm not gonna put it on Amazon, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna chase big box. I really want to support these people in different towns like educating their communities about going plastic free, which is like the refillary group. People kind of laughed at me because I came from uh the beauty industry, which is like big box, like huge purchase orders, like all and I still have those connections and I still like love that world. I have a special spot in my heart for that and like the hustle of getting something like in Walmart or Target or like wherever, but I don't necessarily want that for this. And I think a lot of that has to do with just I don't know, I'm very attached to these people that open these refill stores. I don't know. I want them to succeed. I want to see that movement grow. I want there to be that option in every town, and I want it to be seen as like a viable business that people can start and you know, that service a community and get like younger people excited about reducing plastic. Cause right now, if you don't have a refill store in town, it's like it's really like information overload to find out what's good and what's bad online.

SPEAKER_02 15:48

Yeah, absolutely. And so it's that marrying of the what's good for the environment, but also what's good for the customer to make it a beautiful, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:57

Accessibility is the other big piece, right?

SPEAKER_01 15:59

Yeah. Yeah, for sure. And I think people don't realize the more you spend your hard-earned money at like these very few companies, the less it works for you in where you live. So like it's hard to be so I hear a lot where I where I am, because I have two kids and they're in a school district, and people are like, the teachers should be paid more, but it all of the purchases are on like Sheehan and Amazon. Like your teachers aren't gonna be paid more if you don't shop locally because those local businesses are what pay the taxes that kind of fuel everything. And if you're not spending money where you live, you're actually contributing to the problem. And it's not a nice thing to bring to the surface, but it's the truth, it's the truth. And so I want people who like really want, you know, firefighters to be paid more like any any of these jobs, like you have to not always, but just sometimes shop where you live because some people are get so used to adding to cart that they forget. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

Just remembering to shop local, right? Just yeah, plugging in.

Refill Stores As The New Record Stores

SPEAKER_02 16:59

And it's getting harder and harder because I'm seeing more and more of these little boutique places that I used to shop at because I know I could get something that nobody else would have that have shut down because they couldn't compete. So it's too bad.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

I know, and unless you want every spot in your town to be a spirit Halloween, you like you have to start based on the visual.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

I just had like the flash of the the big spirit sign on all the vacant warehouses that are all over our town.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Yes, which basically then just makes it a ghost town because that's only the seasonal. That's three months out of the year.

SPEAKER_01 17:36

Yeah. I know, and like even and it's not just buying stuff, right? Like it's also this mom and pop restaurants, like all these other stuff things. But yeah, if you just change your behavior a little bit, like you shop in town, like as the first surface level thing, and then if you can't find it locally, then go to your, you know, your secondary shopping points is like Amazon or wherever, like then that's it's a better feeling. Like even if you I don't know, even if you don't care that much, it's just just feels good.

SPEAKER_02 18:02

Well, and it solves also the issue of the disconnection that people feel when you are out and about interacting with other humans, you're creating that connection in your own community. And I remember the day when the gal at my grocery store, she'd been there for 20 years, and I talked to her every time I was there and watched her kids grow up. And it's like, that's what we want in our communities again.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

Do you have one now? I still have my grocery person. Her name is been there.

SPEAKER_02 18:26

I since I moved to Fort Collins in '89, and she is still there. And now she's got five grandkids, and we know each other, we know everything about each other, and I love it when I see her.

SPEAKER_01 18:36

Love it. That's amazing.

SPEAKER_02 18:38

Yeah.

Craving Real‑World Connection Again

SPEAKER_01 18:38

I love that. Yeah. Even my bookstore lady, she knows exactly what I like to read. I know what she likes to read. Like we talked about there's like in my town, there's still a candy store, which is also feels magical, you know. I love taking the kids there. It's it feels good, you know.

SPEAKER_02 18:51

Yes, yeah. Well, your bar of soap is gonna bring that all back.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

I hope so. Even if someone just started the conversation and was like, yeah, you know what?

SPEAKER_00 19:00

I never thought about it that way, you know. Well, it's definitely making an impact. And I think as people realize, right, it's the small little incremental changes that we make. And that's I think that's all that we can ask for, is like to make it back to that. It's never a complete overhaul. So this is like one of those small incremental changes that we can make and collectively start to see that shift.

SPEAKER_02 19:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:18

Awesome. I love it. I love that. I love that. Kate, congratulations on the partnership. We will wait to hear, we will follow along to hear more about it. What's in store for you? What do you have on the horizon? Because the creatives never stop creating. So I'm sure there's something that's bubbling. I do.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

I have. So we also just were nominated as the brand to like we won the SCAT. Do you know Savannah College of Art and Design? Yes. So my husband and I, we met there and we're doing their atelier program in Lacoste, France. And so when we're there, we're gonna be creating a new product and we will be using social media to talk about it. And people can actually come. People who come to France will be there all summer, they can come and see what we're working, see us working in progress on building something. Oh wow. Building the next products for dip, which I think is gonna be really fun.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

Oh my gosh.

Local Shopping And Community Health

SPEAKER_01 20:11

Congratulations. That is so exciting! That's wonderful. Yeah, I mean, that's like a pinch me thing because I my dad did not want me to go to art school, so he made me drop out. Like I'd studied, I ended up studying math and economics, but like I met my Jonathan. I met Jonathan in art school, so it's like funny that the art piece of me, like you can't take the artist out now of someone. And so the idea of being able to go back to SCAD as an like Jonathan's an alum, but I'm not an alum, but I get to feel like I'm back in that community, which I love so much, it's gonna be really great.

SPEAKER_02 20:45

All right. Well, then you need to come back on our show when this new product is about to launch so we can let our listeners know about it because they're gonna want to know.

SPEAKER_00 20:53

Yeah, that'd be so fun. Yeah, thank you. Love that. Oh my gosh. All right, Kate, I'm gonna leave us with one piece of advice for our listeners from the entrepreneurship standpoint. If you could give our listeners one piece of advice, those that are either on their entrepreneurial journey or they're wanting to start it, or two, however many pieces that you want to share, what advice would you have for those individuals?

Practical Ways To Shift Habits

SPEAKER_01 21:14

Okay, so my number one piece of advice would be do not, if you have like a dream, like do not run into a partnership because a business partnership is like a marriage, like you're stuck. And so I had a partnership that didn't go well. And what happens is the business goes with it a lot of times. And so that is, you know, to dip is my own thing. It's my second rodeo, really. And so the it's really important to realize it's a lot of women choose partnerships first, right? But what you should really do, and and it's a lot of that is a confidence gap. Like they don't think they can do it by themselves. You can absolutely do things by yourself, and you can always hire someone to help. You don't have to like, I think Shark Tank is like messed everyone up. You think like equity is like a fun thing to dish around. It's it's not, it's not a good idea. Like it's really like kind of Disney fied what it means to start a business and talk about numbers, and it's not like what they show on these clips. So if you can bank on yourself, that is the that's the biggest piece of advice that I would give you. And then the just follow-up to that is like you will have shortcomings, you will not be good at everything, and you should hire people that are better than you know, like you'll figure it out. You can start small with small hourly things, and then eventually like bring on people full time. Like I started just by myself for 18 months, and now I have a team of there's now seven of us, and I have my own factory, I have my own sales executive. Like, she's amazing. So, I mean, like you just celebrate the small wins and you'll get there. Love it.

SPEAKER_00 22:50

I love that. That's amazing. Oh, great advice for entrepreneurs, and I think even just business professionals and General. Um, I think great tips for them. Kate, thank you, thank you, thank you. This has been an absolute pleasure. Yes, this is so fun. Yeah, absolutely. Dipalready.com or dip allready on Instagram on all of the socials. Um, check them out if you haven't. You're gonna just fall in love with branding, and we can't wait to dive into product and and have that discussion and share. So, Kate, thank you for sharing with our listeners. We really appreciate it. Thank you so much for having me. This is really, really, really fun. Awesome. Thank you. And if you all are looking for more from the world of Reignite Resilience, head on over to ReigniteResilience.com. Find us on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, and maybe here live soon. Keep your eyes and ears open and let you know. Until next time, y'all have a good one. Bye everyone.

SPEAKER_03 23:44

Thank you for joining us today on the Reignite Resilience Podcast. We hope you had some aha moments and learned a few new real life ideas to fuel the flames of passion. Please subscribe on your favorite streaming platform, like or download your favorite episodes, and of course, share with your friends and family. We look forward to seeing you again next time on Reignite Resilience.