Bouncing Back After Failure: Tools for Entrepreneurs in Stressful Situations (with Gina Louise Phillips)

If you’ve ever spiralled after a mistake, ran to the bathroom to cry after a meeting, or deleted a reel because it didn’t feel “perfect,” this episode will give you both the tools and the emotional permission to come back stronger.

This one also gives you a bit of a fresh take on perfectionism and may help you reframe yours into something more positive.

I'm back with beloved guest Gina Louise Phillips (CBC, The Last Of Us, Reacher, Ghosts) who is the real-life embodiment of bounce-back energy, for a raw, hilarious, and practical conversation about navigating high-pressure moments in life and business.

You’ll hear about:

• The coughing attack heard across Canada and what it taught Gina about grace under fire
• Why perfectionism isn’t the flex entrepreneurs think it is—and what to focus on instead
• How to recover from business and content failures faster, even if you’re not yet the most perfect “enlightened” version of yourself
• The mindset shift that will make you stronger on social media and in scary sales-related situations
• A deeply relatable story about pop music class, failure, and resilience in the face of embarrassment

🔗 Links & Resources Mentioned:

• Stream Gina’s original episode: “Red Carpets, Panicking on Live TV, and Mustering the Literal Audacity” here: https://episodes.fm/1697523148/episode/QnV6enNwcm91dC0xNDcwODAyMg
• Connect with Gina on Instagram: @ginalouisephillips
• Learn how to post boldly and consistently at Magic Marketing Machine: www.magicmarketingmachine.com

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Music by Jordan Wood

Hosted by Jenna Harding (Warriner), Creator of Magic Marketing Machine

Transcript

You guys loved the last time that we had this guest on the show for the episode called mustering the literal audacity. A handful of people, like not to have the bar too high and stress you out, dear guest, but if I reveal who you are, but a few people literally told me that that episode changed their actual lives. Like I was getting messages from people, including my sister who said those words. She's like, I think that just changed my life. So I'm gonna link that appearance. 


down in the show notes, but we are back today with Gina Phillips, 2L's actor, journalist, currently on CBC radio, my personal trainer, but that's kind of, that's a private matter. We're back with her today talking about handling high stress environments and high stress experiences. 


which is one of those things where she's developed a special skill by necessity. Yeah, truly, by failing so many times, being like, I gotta figure out some tools here. So this topic actually came to mind because of an experience you had yesterday. Yes, my gosh. was, okay, so I always do hourly updates on the radio, four and a half minutes of here's the news today, basically. This is what's happening in the world. 


and you're completely live. So there's really no opportunity. If you make a mistake, it's just out there for everyone to hear forever. it's most people's worst nightmare. And yesterday I read the first story, so I was about 20 seconds in, and I just started thinking, I really need to cough. And there is a cough button for this exact thing, right? When you say button. 

Okay, so there's, when I'm in the studio, there's like a set of buttons and the audio person who's across the glass from me, who's watching my every move and he's playing my clips and music and everything and adjusting my volume and I can talk to him so I can press down a button to be like, hey Mark, are we heavy? And he goes, yeah, you need to fill 12 seconds. So he's timing out the show and we're discussing. 


when there's a clip playing or music playing, we're talking about how the show's doing, do I need to read faster, do we need to drop a story altogether. So it's kind of this collaborative back and forth with the audio person. And for this particular day, I was halfway through that first story and I couldn't even stop to think what I could do because I had to finish reading the story and I thought, okay, I could... 


I know once I get to the end of this story, I can take a beat. Like maybe it's okay just to kind of take a minute. I'll just clear my throat. I'll press that cough button. So I pressed down the cough button. I finished the last sentence, pressed down the cough button and I went, in Alberta. And my voice just broke and I started the second story. And I was like, somehow something happened. It was like someone had taken a vice to my vocal cords. 


and my eyes started streaming. It truly felt like maybe I was having an allergic reaction or something. So I continued, so I pressed the cough button back down again and I just coughed the hardest I've ever coughed for probably 30 seconds straight. And Mark is just looking at me through the glass, panicked. Yeah, but somewhere the inventor of the cough button is like tipping his hat. Right? The fact that it literally says cough. 


Right? It made me feel better, right? Because obviously this is something that happens. Or sneeze. Yeah, or sneeze or something. Just clearing your throat. I don't think they mean all out, like on the floor, you're almost dead, you're coughing so hard, which is what happened. kept trying, so I'd release the cough button and try to come back just to see how my voice was doing. There was no saving it. 


But after like a minute of me trying so the listeners just hearing silence at this point They're just adjusting their dials thinking that their radios broke. I'm hoping they're just like is it my connection? But I ended up clearing my throat enough and that they could tell something was wrong But I got through the stories and I got I managed to throw to like The next clip that we could at least get into some audio that plays itself, and then I could really cough 


and then kind of get out of it. It was kind of scary. You know, it almost sounds like when we're in situations like this, it's almost a blessing that for me, theater and singing on stage, for you acting, being under the pressure of having a crew around you in the news, we have to go on. And I think that's how we learned to go on. Because someone else, like a listener who might be doing social media or maybe just like speaking, I don't know, speaking to a group or something, like you almost have the opp. 


opportunity to fail, like you can be hard on yourself and you can just go, screw it and like, and not keep going if you had to. I know and you know what's weird is I've done so much live stuff in my career, I'm actually better live. If you don't give me an option, I'm better. If I'm just staring at myself in my phone and I'm creating a reel and I'm doing a little bit of an intro, I will mess that up over and over and over again. if... 


someone was like, you're live on the radio. I would probably be able to get a clear sentence out. Yeah. So maybe part of being better on social media, being stronger on social media is just really forcing yourself. And so many of us, and I give the advice all the time to avoid recording when somebody can hear you, like when your partner's in the next room. But maybe we sometimes need to in order to push yourself. 

to just keep going, because also a lot of the times when you think you look dumb, you don't, right? You stutter over word and you think that it's so obvious and it's actually not. There's this term in TV. So when I started in TV broadcasting, we do live to tape all the time. So that means, yeah, it's set up like it's live because there's no more time to redo it. Like you could redo it if something goes really wrong. But the idea is that you're taping it. 


but it's all live. It's all happening. with the late shows. Like the late shows on TV, like they film it in the afternoon as if it's live, but if somebody does accidentally drop an F-bomb, they have enough time to like clip it out. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So live to tape, maybe if I were to think of my Instagram reels or whatever as, okay, I'm giving myself one shot to do this. Maybe with a little bit of pressure. You know what I just thought of a time that... 


where I would bomb heavily and nobody bailed me out. And it's almost like you have to learn also that like quitting isn't cute, you know? So I almost failed pop class in college. Did I ever tell you this? What's pop class? it's like a- Wait, back up. So I went to school for musical theater. Yeah. And they also wanted to teach us how to like perform in kind of a club vibe or- 


pop music or in a band, that sort of thing. It's actually something that a lot of other theater schools don't teach you and then people graduate and they don't know how to hold a mic or sing on a stage in like that kind of a setting because they only know how to perform like a song and dance. So it was great that it existed but I sucked at it and also believed that I sucked at it. Look at me still saying I suck at it and I probably actually didn't but I was trained... 


like classically singing and I love musical theater. was hard for me to even find a pop song that I could sing. And so I started failing that class or almost failing it so hard. And I remember one time I was singing a song and I just got really emotional during it. And I was just like, Oh, I don't want to, I don't want to go on. I remember looking at my best friend and she was like, keep singing, keep singing, keep singing. And I kind of thought the teacher would let me try again. 

And she didn't. And it's like I failed the song. And that like really affected my grade. You know what I mean? And there was another time in college too where I just got really overwhelmed, anxious, and just gave up on the number and then failed. Because I always kind of felt like somebody was going to bail me out. I don't know if this will be relevant to a lot of what other people are listening or hearing. the thing that I ended up having to do in that case was because I knew I was bombing that class so hard and I also knew I was doing 


what I could, like I was trying as hard as I could. Right. She would, I would sing and the teacher would fill out the rubric with notes and grades and I would pass it to my best friend and she would hand me back the notes but not the grades and the rule was tell me if I fail. Tell me if I actually, because if you actually failed at my school you got, you sent home. Right. And 60 was a fail and if I was 


close to failing or failing, I was like, tell me, but other than that, the numbers are just getting in my head. They're making me upset. And I'm only going to improve by the comments and the feedback. And I can't do better than I'm freaking doing right now. So we did that forever. And one time she was like, you almost failed that one today. I was like, what was it? was like 62 or something. Okay. There's also something to like, you always have next time. 


Because when I fail at my hourly newscast, like that coughing attack was a horrible fail. But I was like, well, thank God I have next hour. You know, there is that element of you're only as good as your last newscast. only, you always have more chances in your life to do the next thing. So you've got to just like pull up your bootstraps and keep going, I guess. Where do you think that mentality comes from in your head? Other than the news? 


Like we've talked about that. how come you are so bold at that? Like how come you're so okay with handling not doing amazing? Because also people are like perfectionists, right? I am a perfectionist, I think. You're not. You're so good at learning. 


And you're so good at trying again. If you tried to lift something and I was like, you know, just because that's the first thing that comes to my mind, but you like tried to reach for something and did it wrong. And I was like, Jean, if you do it this way, it's better. You take that feedback and change. That's not a perfectionist. That's like interested in improving. Perfectionist is like somebody who tries to reach for it and then you kind of give them feedback and then they beat themselves up for not knowing it in the first place. Yeah, but if you, if you beat yourself up, then you're not going to be able to get perfect at it. 

That's true too. maybe I've experienced that side of things where I'm like, I'm like, I'm so bad at this. And I just like get down on myself. And I've just recognized that as like, I will not be as successful as I want to be at that low frequency, like beating myself up mindset. So I've, I've done a lot around get like clearing my brain of my mistakes. 


and going in with full confidence and just trying to redo everything over and over again. Oh wait, okay, so I really like that. So it's like, because you want to be perfect, you will not let yourself be mad at yourself or beat yourself up because that is not gonna help on that journey to perfection. If every perfectionist had that attitude, I feel like it be a lot better, a lot healthier. You got it. 


You gotta clean the slate. You gotta clean the slate. I started at one point taking stock of a lot of my failures. What do you mean? Like remembering, like I didn't get that job. I didn't get that audition. didn't... Taking stock in my brain. Like doing the math. And it was adding to my burden when I would wake up every day. Like I've experienced that. So when I started to meditate and... 


do a lot of yoga and just like sit in silence a lot. And I started just being more like, oh, I can control my thoughts, which is very important. And I recognized like, oh, I've like some, for some reason I decided to carry around my failures that year. You know, like I was like really holding onto them. And so- She's holding her hands like she's got a little clutch bag. I like a little basket. And so- 


The meditation taught me recently how to clear your brain of your emotions. Whatever you're feeling about messing that thing up last hour, you need to truly wipe the slate clean and start from a place of neutrality for the next time. 


You know? Okay. Meditation taught me that for sure. That's fascinating when you say it like that. I'm a really visual person. So like when you're saying that, I'm picturing like a face cloth, like a white glowing face cloth and just like scrubbing clean. Yeah. Start from neutrality because you know that it's actually what's going to be best for you. And then also you're kind of telling us the thing that we didn't want to hear, which is that there isn't a quick fix or a cough button to solve this. 


And we actually, it's more of like a lifestyle and a lifelong journey and finding a whole bunch of tools to keep in your tool belt. Well, and it's resilience. Like learn, teach yourself how to be resilient. So actually, every time you fail, you have the opportunity to bounce back or you have the opportunity to be like, well, there's another one I'll remember forever. Yeah. Right. And I've experienced both mindsets. That one, I was not successful in that mindset, meaning 


I was not good at my acting auditions at that time. I was not being a very good listener to other people, because I felt very burdened by my own shit. If someone gave me lines to memorize, I was kind of filled up with all this stuff already. So it's like, how do you take on a character? How do you learn something new if you're already filled up to the That's probably the place most people are living in, I would say. I know. 


I know. I really hate that feeling and I've decided to, I guess as much as I can, get myself back to that neutral place because I will be a much better, not just like person, but also truly on air it shows, I think. Wow. Yeah. I think that's really helpful. Do you want to talk about that thing that you said? Oh my gosh. I just... 


whatever, 


we're just gonna tell you one more story really quickly because and I almost feel like it's an affirmation especially if you, she'll tell you in one second, especially if you don't feel like you are at that like we'll call it enlightened place yet. Like if you don't have a lot of tools in your tool belt. Like this is a story about someone who didn't have a lot of tools in her tool belt and how she recovered very quickly in a stressful moment. 


Yes, and this came from my own experience of being an intern in television and being quite stressed out at a very young age, surrounded by people I admire, trying to do my best. I almost didn't have my own personality, if that makes sense. Like I would show up and just be like nodding and like wanting to do good. Wanting to please. Yeah, wanting to please and just like that really like shaky puppy dog. my God. Golden Retriever for sure. Which I still have. 


to some degree. But, so I was working recently in a newsroom and there was an intern there that day. The producer had given her some feedback. It was like quite, quite, quite good feedback, but clearly she hadn't kind of succeeded to the level that she thought she needed to excel at because she took this feedback in and I just, she was sitting next to me and I could hear her breathing. Like she truly was like, 


And it seemed like she was barely getting oxygen oxygen through I know that feeling She's got her hands on the keyboard and she's really tense and I could just feel that she was about to explode and I Turned to her and I said hey go to the bathroom cry Get it out. Come back come back strong. Yeah, come back strong and 


She went, okay, thank you. And she ran from her desk. Five minutes later, she comes back, a whole new person, just back to her being herself. She was level, she was calm. And she has thanked me for that moment since. And I told her, like, I have been in your shoes so many times. Like, when you're holding that much emotion and you're kicking yourself and there's nowhere for it to escape. 

and you almost feel sick because of it. I think she needed to know that it's okay to be upset. Don't do it here, but go get it out, like deal with it. If she had just continued to keep it down. It would have been a horrible day for everyone. Right, she wouldn't have been able to write. She wouldn't have been able to think clearly. No, she'd be exhausted by holding it in. 

All that. People you noticed, people are gonna start to notice, like there's a bunch of things. I know, I know. I'm like, no, I don't think she should like sit at her desk and bawl her eyes out and she clearly didn't want to, so she was holding it in for that reason. But like, I think if you just like really strongly embrace that you're upset at that moment and don't just push it down, then you can get it out, like bring it to the surface on purpose, intentionally, and then you will feel a thousand times better. You'll feel relieved and... 

I was proud in that moment that I had had the life experience to be able to pass that on to her and see it translate in a workspace. And so it's that same thing we said, you come back to that state of neutrality. Yeah. What do you have to do to come back to that state? Or what do have to do to wake up or start your day in that state? I know a lot of people have really strong morning routines that help them just prepare for their day in that way. 

or maybe like little bits throughout the day. I think we all know what it feels like to feel like shit and beat yourself up and then fail because you're not like totally present and you're not doing very well. And you know what it's like when you wake up and you're like, okay, so get yourself to that place as much as you can. And like, you're gonna truly be able to rise to those moments where you're really under pressure. 

you will be able to go, I've done this a thousand times. I have recovered so many times and been able to come back. So if you can do it right before that really scary moment, right? You've got like a big job interview and you can just, just like focus up, get yourself to that neutral place before that job interview, you will do much better. I want to anchor that one because people like, I can already hear people listening being like, I, but I haven't recovered. So it's like, 

I love this idea of I've recovered so many times already, I know I can do it right now. And you're like, okay, but I haven't. If you have, it just took a day. It just took eight hours, but you have recovered. And we're gonna shorten that and remember that you can recover and you do recover and you're good at it and you're capable of it. And then we're just gonna make a lifetime effort of getting through it faster, processing it, moving forward, all of that. 

I mean, I took, think, a whole year to figure this stuff out. I really like made it a bit of a full-time job for myself. Not a full-time job, maybe a part-time job. Because I really didn't want to continue in a high pressure industry without figuring this out for myself. You don't want to fail in moments. You want to rise in those moments. And so I think if you feel like you are failing in moments where you're like, I normally would do better than this. 

It's like, well, maybe you're filled up with stuff and you just need to figure that out and have those tools so that you can come in strong. Gina, where can everybody follow you on the internet? Oh, well, I have Instagram, Gina Louise Phillips with the little at symbol in the front. Oh, that's how they work. I know it's unusual. Yeah, I sometimes do TikTok and that stuff, but I think Instagram I'm on the most. Yeah, they'll come say hi. OK, come say hi. OK, love you. Bye. Love you. Bye.