Dopamine, Silence, And Starting Over

A casual start about movies turns into a surprisingly intense ride through identity, recovery, and the way our brains chase relief. We take a live call from a friend who just used Ancestry DNA to uncover a biological father he never knew, only to learn his dad has passed and he has a whole lineup of siblings he’s never met. It’s funny, awkward, and deeply real all at once, the kind of story that makes you rethink how fragile your “known life” can be.

From there we get honest about addiction recovery, methadone, heroin history, and the day-to-day reality of avoiding triggers. That opens the door to a bigger theme we keep circling: dopamine. We talk about “cheap dopamine” habits, why you can’t always trade one addiction for another, and how the real problem is often the stress pattern underneath the behavior, not just the substance or the app.

We also debate AI and ChatGPT from two angles: the privacy and security anxiety of feeding your thoughts into a system, and the more personal fear that dependence can make creativity go dormant. As teachers, friends, and regular people trying to stay awake, we’re not anti-AI, we’re pro-human. Mindfulness becomes the anchor, with reflections on Eckhart Tolle’s The Power of Now, meditation, surrender, and what a Vipassana retreat reveals when you remove stimulation, speech, and comfort.

If you’ve been feeling burned out, stuck in loops, or just moving too fast, listen through the end where we land on a deceptively hard idea: play matters. Subscribe for more conversations like this, share this with a friend who needs a reset, and leave a review with the one habit you’re trying to change.

Transcript

Movie Banter And Theater Nostalgia

SPEAKER_01 0:10

I know you're a big Trump supporter. I don't want that kind of shit on my podcast, all right? Man, I saw this is a free place, huh? No. Oh man. No, this is prison. Alright, you ready to start? Yeah. Okay, let's go.

SPEAKER_05 0:25

What's up? What should I jump in that? What's up? What's up? Alright. Isn't that how we used to talk? What's up? Do you think you're gonna watch the new one? What? Scary movie. There's a new scary movie.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Number six? Seven, I think. Six, seven. I think I'd have to watch the last three first.

SPEAKER_02 0:47

No, don't do that. It's not worth it. They're not good, huh? Even the director will say, Don't do it, dude. Just watching you one. He admits they're terrible. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Hmm. Probably not. I don't know. I've been wanting to go see a movie, but every time I ask my lady friend, she's like, watch a movie? At the theater? I'm like, yeah. She's like, uh, come on.

SPEAKER_05 1:07

Because she likes leaving, she used to leaving a Shima.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

Yeah. I don't know. I think she's just like a hippie. So she's just not like makes me feel like lazy for asking to go watch a movie. Can you not blow into the fucking microphone?

SPEAKER_05 1:20

Oh, my bad.

SPEAKER_01 1:21

You're fine. Sorry. You can blow into your asshole. Alright. I should edit that out. She ain't down. She ain't a hippie, you know? They're more like tuned into like being grounded in earth and mountains, but yo, man, sometimes it's fun to go see a movie. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:36

What's wrong with that? Maybe you just like don't go to the one that Shimon just show her as the PlayStation Taipei. She she shh, I know. Too cloudy as she mentioned.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

You wanna know the funnest movie I ever saw in a theater?

SPEAKER_05 1:51

The recently one?

SPEAKER_01 1:52

No.

SPEAKER_05 1:53

You can probably guess.

SPEAKER_01 1:55

What do you think is the funnest movie I've ever seen in a theater?

SPEAKER_05 1:59

In Taiwan? In your life? Yeah. Dude, I don't think I can. I don't know, man.

SPEAKER_01 2:04

If there's anybody that could guess this right, it's you. Oh Joker? Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 2:11

Oh, I see.

SPEAKER_01 2:12

Yeah. I said the right thing tonight. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 2:14

It was so good I had to go back the second time. I never watched the second, second one, man. I did. Do you like it?

SPEAKER_01 2:21

It hurt my heart. Oh wow. I didn't I didn't watch it.

SPEAKER_05 2:24

Maybe I shouldn't.

SPEAKER_01 2:24

Yeah. It's great, but it's like it does hurt. Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 2:29

Because she like. You just like I I I this is a lot of movies she catch up like the the other one is like the new version of Batman, right? You say you say he's really good.

SPEAKER_01 2:42

I think you know, society was really obsessed with Joker. Or maybe it was just me and you.

SPEAKER_05 2:49

I mean, we we we do see a lot of Harley Queen and Harley, what was that? Hollow. What was that? Holiday. Halloween. Halloween, yeah. Sorry, man.

SPEAKER_01 3:00

A lot of Harley on Halloween. Yeah. Yeah. So I don't think it just says. Right. Everybody got in got in on that train. I think there's a reason. A reasonable one.

Ancestry DNA And A New Family

SPEAKER_01 3:18

I'm recording a podcast.

SPEAKER_06 3:24

I don't know who my dad was, right?

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 3:28

So I did ancestry.com. I found him. He passed away.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

He passed away.

SPEAKER_06 3:35

I think they passed away. What's up, dude? But yes, I found him. He's dead. He died last year. I've got eight brothers and sisters.

SPEAKER_01 3:44

Damn. Eight brothers and sisters you don't know about.

SPEAKER_06 3:49

Yeah, starting from 59 to 32.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

Damn.

SPEAKER_06 3:54

That's not including my brother Daniel. So nine, really. I'm one of ten.

SPEAKER_01 4:00

I'm happy for you, David.

SPEAKER_06 4:02

Yeah, I don't know how to tell about it yet.

SPEAKER_01 4:06

Well, yeah, well, do you want to? I mean, I'm live recording a podcast with my friend Mango right now.

SPEAKER_05 4:14

Sorry, man. That's a that's a wild story, I just heard. So you just find out, you just find out you have like seven siblings or something.

SPEAKER_06 4:24

What is it?

SPEAKER_05 4:27

You just find out what?

SPEAKER_06 4:30

Yeah, I don't know what's he saying. I don't know what he's saying. Speak louder.

SPEAKER_05 4:34

Okay. What did you what what happened? I'm sorry. You say you find out you have like seven siblings now? Siblings.

SPEAKER_06 4:40

Well, hey, so okay, so my mom is a lime wharf. Okay. I guess she was banging so many dudes back in the day that she didn't really know who my dad was. So she told me it was one or two guys my whole life. And then I did ancestry.com. Here you can send your DNA in, and then I'll run it with a database to see what comes back to what. So I did that. It came back like, you know, three or four weeks later. I had a pin for a half-sister. So I reached out to her on Facebook, contacted her, she said, yeah. So uh the guy that pregnant my mom that did my dad my whole life, adopted me when I was, you know, we Michael Grasshopper. And then when I was 18, they told me who my real dad was. So she's like, she's like, now there's another girl. I'm gonna give you her number and she'll fill you in on everything. So when I contacted her and told her who I was, how I fit into everything, and she's like, okay, I'm one of them too. I have nine other brothers and sisters now, or however many I fucking lose count. So but yeah, so that so that I'm in contact with who's the hottest okay, okay. So she before I see him see it, she sends me a picture of my older brother named Kyle, Kevin, Kenny, Kelly, something. I don't know what his name is.

SPEAKER_00 6:14

Oh boy.

SPEAKER_06 6:15

And I'm looking at the picture, I'm like, his wife's pretty cute. And then she sends me a picture of her. She's the fucking girl with the other girl in the picture. I was like, oh damn.

SPEAKER_01 6:24

What's that mean? I didn't get it either. What's that mean?

SPEAKER_06 6:28

My sister in the picture was hot. But I before I knew who she was. You said your sister was hot.

SPEAKER_01 6:34

Yeah. That's so American of you.

SPEAKER_06 6:41

No, that's so fucking uh my family of me, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 6:45

Wow. Well, you know, the whole world's gonna know you once thought about hanging your sister now.

SPEAKER_06 6:54

It gets better, it gets better.

SPEAKER_01 6:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 6:57

So the dude was a Vietnam vet.

SPEAKER_01 7:00

Your dad.

SPEAKER_06 7:01

So he's been so yeah. So the guy, I can't really call him dad. I don't. That kind of is unfamiliar to me. You know what I mean? But anyway, Mike was stationed in Vietnam for a couple years. On his deathbed, one of the older sisters was like, hey, you know, what's the chances of more people coming out in the future saying that you're their dad and more siblings or whatever? He's like, there's a high probability that there's gonna be some, and probably some Vietnamese also.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

What? Wait, your dad was a Vietnam War vet?

SPEAKER_06 7:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:39

And he got around, and you might have some Vietnamese brothers and sisters?

SPEAKER_06 7:44

Probably. I mean, that dude's coming back out of the fucking driveway.

SPEAKER_01 7:54

You want to come to Vietnam?

SPEAKER_06 7:57

I mean, that would be cool, but I can't make it there, bud.

SPEAKER_01 8:00

I wouldn't suggest it. That's the only country that has ever just broke me down until I was nothing fucking left.

unknown 8:08

I remember you were pretty depressed there.

SPEAKER_01 8:10

I did not have a good time in Vietnam. I remember that. Yeah. Yeah, we all remember that, don't we? I have my nom stories. Oh man, back in nom, dude. Mafia tried to kill me. Someone stole my phone.

SPEAKER_06 8:27

I'll be doing something, and I'll be like, I learned this trick in Vietnam.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Fucking blurry.

SPEAKER_06 8:35

You in the back of your podcast just popped in to say hi, I love you, bruv.

SPEAKER_01 8:39

Cool. Well, this moment will now be saved forever. See you, mango. See you, man. Why is story I ever. We love you, Dave. Can I can I share some information about you on the podcast after you hang up? You don't give a fuck about nothing, do you? How long how long have you been off Methadone?

SPEAKER_06 8:58

Uh, since January 16th. So I don't know. 60 days or so? I don't even count.

SPEAKER_01 9:04

How fucking?

SPEAKER_06 9:07

It's not even a big deal. I mean, it's a big deal, but the time that I have it is not a big deal because I'm not going back. So, hey, you know, I made it six months, hey, I made it nine months.

SPEAKER_01 9:19

How long did you shoot? How long did you shoot heroin?

SPEAKER_06 9:24

A long time.

SPEAKER_01 9:26

Ten years.

SPEAKER_06 9:28

Let's see. So probably started. I started Norton and oh, maybe. No, no, it had to be by 20. So me and Son were together when I got this dumbass tattoo on my arm.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 9:50

I remember doing a small rhyme with dude driving down the street, puking out the door, like, dude, this shit's so good, blah, blah, blah. And then it was probably maybe six months before I did it again. Maybe two years after that, that I started, you know, sleeping or whatever. And then in 2015, I got cleaned on the methadone maintenance program and didn't touch anything from 2015. Until actually, until I ate an edible like probably around January 20th because I'm having trouble sleeping. Big mistake. I shouldn't have done that. I'm afraid to smoke marijuana because I know that the first puff I take will lead me right back to cigarettes. And I don't want to do that.

SPEAKER_01 10:44

I think you're the biggest success story I know. Yeah, but most of them died. No. No.

SPEAKER_06 11:04

I was watching the TV the other day, and it said some dude fell in his head and froze to death outside. It was him. Which was crazy.

SPEAKER_01 11:12

Damn. Or we're gonna get back to the podcast now. Love you too, man. Alright, bye.

Recovery Talk And Quitting Methadone

SPEAKER_01 11:24

Should we leave that in the podcast? That's crazy. I think I should actually just bring him on the podcast.

SPEAKER_02 11:32

That's uh I love my question though. What was your question? Oh Who's the hottest?

SPEAKER_01 11:38

Who's the hottest? Oh Lord. So we were discussing the Joker. Joker, yeah, uh what about Joker? Sorry. What I was I had a point. I had a I had a story. I think there's a reason society was obsessed with the idea of Joker and Harley Quinn. Infatuated.

SPEAKER_00 12:04

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 12:05

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. What do you think?

SPEAKER_03 12:10

I think. Hmm. At a time, at the time I remember the movie. I remember the movie.

SPEAKER_05 12:23

I do remember that the the the the the shot, right? Uh in the tet in the TV show, then shot the the the Wuzakai.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

I forgot who's that guy. Snap. Anyway. Oh, you're talking about in the movie he shot somebody on the TV show? Yeah, yeah. Oh, it doesn't matter. But he shot somebody.

SPEAKER_05 12:46

Yeah, but I I do remember the the feelings of that that that that the week. Stick closer to the mic. You it's like it's like you get satisfied from your anger. You know? When he murdered that guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You get a satisfaction. Yeah, so so so so we all have that. It's kind of like he was brave to do brave. Yeah, yeah, we do have the the the that's why that's why in the movie it's like it's like everybody's wearing the wearing we're wearing his mask, right? Right, because everybody feels the same. So but that's just the movie, man. It's just like it's just like it's just like I learned one of the things I learned from Rick and Morty. That do you watch that show? I have. You have watched that show. That there was a time that Jerry and Beth going to the rehear rehear uh helping their marriage get back together, kind of center thing, and scan their brain and projecting a monster, and the guy come out and say something like, This is the monster in your in your head. This is not what happened. This is not happening, this is not your your partner is not your side. This is what your salt is. This is the monster, you know what I'm saying? So what I'm saying is that you yeah, yeah, a lot of the the people like feel dissatisfied and that from that from that from that movie, but also this is a soci this society is citizens' society doesn't shouldn't we we have more control than that in that in in the movie.

SPEAKER_01 14:21

Am I making sense? We have more control than like Joker and Harley had in the movie.

SPEAKER_05 14:30

No, we couldn't control crazy happen, but we could control ourselves as the audience. Do we wear the mask to join? You know, you heard uh you heard uh have you heard the news at what happened at the MRT? Yes. That sounds crazy, right? Sound crazy. But the thing is that that there was a time that me and Dan was talking about that. That that when we hang out. That the we would talk, of course, when you're a man, right? Of course, when you you when you talk about this and you're taking MRT, you can talk about me, if that kind of thing happened in front of me, I mean this is what I'm gonna do, right? But I remember the thing is that the the only ad advice I just want to tell him that whatever you're gonna do to that person in that moment, you are not alone. That person is alone, you know what I'm saying? So so this is this is the other side of the society when bad things happen, people stand up. You hope so people unite. Apparently, so I I know so it happened in in Taiwan already. People stood up together, yeah. People stood up together because that happened like 10 years ago. There was some crazy people, there's some crazy guy, Sun Chie, right? Just like taking the one step uh station to the when when like travel to Guten because that's the longest part of that in Taipei. So he started killing people in the in the in the MRT station. But there were like some guys just like stand up, just only have this umbrella, just like do not get close and like trying to pretend in the people behind.

SPEAKER_01 16:05

There's still people like that. Yeah, we need that, huh? Yeah, Batman style. Human style. I think the infatuation with Joker and Harley was like, because we we all want to be free and brave.

SPEAKER_05 16:20

Yeah, but free and brave doesn't always mean breaking everything down.

SPEAKER_01 16:26

Destruction, right? Yeah, for sure. For sure.

Joker, Anger, And Crowd Psychology

SPEAKER_01 16:31

What about AI? I don't know. I feel I feel like in some weird way AI has replaced the Joker.

SPEAKER_05 16:38

I don't mind. It's right. It's a just follow the flow. I don't mind. Yeah. I I I told you that I kind of disagree that Ash, you get your friends say. What did he say, and what about it did you disagree with? I he he's the he's standing, he's standing aside that uh I he doesn't think that asking too many questions to Chat GPT is a good idea because it's not just asking the question to getting your information for them is getting the information of who is asking this kind of question, why is he asking this kind of question. You see what I'm trying to say? No, no, okay. So what what he's saying is that you should you should have the awareness of your own security on online because because when you asking questions to Chat GPT, ChatGPT also uh see your question as a data that to recognize labelize you as a wondered person in in the data. So he's I mean I mean this is what I heard from from him.

SPEAKER_01 17:36

What do you that's very interesting because yeah, that's not what I retained from what I've done.

SPEAKER_05 17:40

Okay, what do you hear from him?

SPEAKER_01 17:42

What I heard him say was just that we're becoming so dependent on AI that we're not doing the work anymore. And because we're not doing the work anymore, there are literally like places in our brains that are going to sleep and we're not using them because we're using not using them, the neurons are not firing. So there are sections in our brain that are going dormant because people are becoming too dependent on AI, and we're not dependent enough on our own humanity to be creative, and that really resonated a lot with me as a teacher because I use it a lot, and I started trying to use it as a shortcut to not do my job and to not do a good job at my job, and I got so dependent on it that I stopped being creative, and then it was I don't know, it was like because I had my science teacher, right? So I was asking it for experiments, and then I was and then I was like hitting a wall with AI, and I was like, maybe Ash was right, like maybe I shouldn't be depending on AI for experiment ideas, maybe I should be trying to come up with my own experiments and not be so dependent. I think it's useful for like information for science, but I don't know. When he said that that night, I was like, Yeah, fuck yeah, like I should put some distance between me and AI and not become too dependent on it because I should be doing the work because we're in a precarious state right now where we could very well lose our humanity.

SPEAKER_05 19:12

Wait, wait, wait, I have a problem in life or when most of the people who have a problem in life, the the the one of the ways like look back what other people dealing with the same situation is like what we did uh about the the the audio track. So look back to the history of what other people have did is just part of the part of the way to expanding your idea to she seeing more possibility. I don't see the problems here. Do you know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 19:47

I think the problem I don't know. Well he's a kid. I think the only problem is like imagining a worst-case scenario.

SPEAKER_05 19:54

I it's just like alright, he's he's you're probably not gonna agree with that. I don't know, man. It's just for me, it's just like uh it's it's it's a it's a it's a uh I I the way I see it is just a it's a tool that we eventually people a lot of people are gonna gonna know how to use it and a lot of people are gonna gonna gonna gonna not gonna use it at all. And I I just I just wanna get closer to know how to use it. I think it's fine that you you you should have some experience. You should have some experience, a good experience and bad experience, and then they can have the conclusion of your own experience. You know what I'm saying? So I don't think I don't think what you're doing right now is wrong, but you should you should you you you don't see it don't see it as uh only the best side because your journey with AI just get started. Damn, what are you a fucking salesman for AI? Dude, am I wrong?

SPEAKER_01 20:47

No, I think it's a great tool. You're right, you're right, you're right.

SPEAKER_05 20:49

Yeah, man. You you you you're gonna use it for the next 30 years. You're gonna get used to it, man. You're gonna find a way to security yourself, you're gonna find a way to to to to know how to how to use it the right way, but man, it's in our life already. Is what I think.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

I'm down. I just I think I just like people that fight. Fight for what? That fight for things. Like like in the 1960s, they fought the Vietnam War, like Dave was talking about earlier. Or people that like groups that protest things. I think that's important, whether they're right or not, but just pushing back against the system, I think, is important. And I don't even know if what he was saying is right, but I think it's good that we just have people that are willing to push back.

SPEAKER_05 21:38

I see. I see. I don't see I don't see why it's your idea to AI ha and my have two against to each other.

SPEAKER_00 21:47

Hmm.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

I mean, I would become a cyborg if I could. Yeah. You'd be one robot.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

A microwave? You'll be a microwave, man.

SPEAKER_04 22:00

Make your own popcorn. That'd be awesome, dude. Just slide a bag of popcorn in my stomach and warm it up. Digital gut biome. Microwave. I like that.

SPEAKER_01 22:13

I like that. Shoot infrared light out of my eyes.

unknown 22:21

Hmm.

SPEAKER_05 22:22

That would be a good idea. That if you can like re-cyber that, like what part of that are you gonna do?

AI Dependence And Losing Creativity

SPEAKER_01 22:32

Oh, you mean did I used to light candles? Yeah. They're expensive in Taiwan, so I didn't used to buy them. But my mom came out here and we went to Costco, and she I think she brought these candles. And uh my mom's always burning candles, dude. So she got me burning candles in the house, and I just love it.

SPEAKER_05 22:50

I have to say, man, the the the uh your place is like you take care you take care of your place, which is really fine.

SPEAKER_01 22:58

Well, it's changed a lot, I think. There was this house, and then there was this house post-women. Oh like it was a bachelor pad, and then my and then what Tracy came and then my mom came, and then it kind of like really changed the vibe of the house. Like they both brought a lot of energy and paintings and decorations and really changed the whole vibe of the house. But it it is a lot of work, but I also love it. Like, no matter what, no matter where I'm coming from, every time I get home, it's just like I feel so good. That's a good feeling, man. You want to feel that's what you want to feel when you do. So you don't feel that before your your uh Tracy and your mom was like No, I always felt that at this house, but in past houses in the city, I don't know. Like, I might get home and be like, ugh, but Dude, I feel that.

SPEAKER_05 23:53

I feel that, man. I I understand that. I understand that.

SPEAKER_01 23:56

I've had houses in the past where I got home or you like get home and it's like teeny tiny rooms or compartments, or it's like it's not like a like my house is like a paradise. I get home, I'm like, yeah, yeah. You know, I get energized when I get home.

SPEAKER_05 24:10

Like this is your balcony, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

This is your view, yeah, yeah. Do whatever you want. First time in my life, you know. My home is my bliss. So I'm happy here.

SPEAKER_05 24:21

It's very nice.

SPEAKER_01 24:22

How much how much for a month? 16,000. 16,000. Pretty cheap, right? She said I can stay for three or four years. And she said I can leave anytime I want. If I find another house I like, I can break the contract and she'll give me my deposit back. No, it depends are you gonna move in with uh Tracy or not? Well, I imagine what we're gonna do is get a nice big house.

SPEAKER_05 24:49

You can get a house at Hua Ishington. Yeah, you can get a nice house over there.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

On the like on the ground, on earth, not in a building.

SPEAKER_05 24:58

Oh, yeah, yeah, that's what I know what I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You can get a whole house at the Hua Inshington if you guys uh put your rent together. Yeah, yeah, it's yeah, you have options here.

SPEAKER_01 25:08

And then there we have a warehouse or like a lab, you know? Okay, where we can grow all the mushrooms and make all the collagen extracts.

SPEAKER_05 25:16

Man, what'd you think I'm gonna grow? Babies?

SPEAKER_02 25:24

Anyway.

SPEAKER_05 25:25

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think you can find someplace at the Washington. I uh I can. You can.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

Do you like Joe Dispenza? Who? Joe Dispenza. Quantum theory, quantum fields.

SPEAKER_05 25:40

I know quantum I know the last two words you're talking about. I don't know which Joe you're talking about.

SPEAKER_01 25:45

Joe. I wonder Joe Logan. Not Joe Rogan. Joe Dispenza. You probably know who he is. Let me try to pull up a picture. He wrote a book called Breaking the Habit of Being Yourself, and he wrote another book called Becoming Supernatural. You never heard him? Really? But but alright, okay, dude. I think I think this I think Joe Dispenser would be right up your alley. Because I know you really like Eckhart Tolle and the power of now. And he kind of takes it a little bit further in terms of like visualizing, manifesting, rehearsing, and kind of like using your mind to manifest your day. I think he's really, really good. Something we talked about earlier was like worst case scenario, and he talks about like how our brains are naturally kind of wired to go to worst case scenario, but you can actually rewire them to go to best case scenario. Yeah. And then which thus like influences your life and what happens. Sorry. There wasn't a question. You keep going. You know what you did. I didn't blew that. You took the last fucking cookie. What cookie? And there's no milk.

SPEAKER_05 27:09

I have some mango shake, and you want some mango shake.

SPEAKER_01 27:13

What do you want to talk about?

SPEAKER_05 27:15

I forgot what we're gonna talk about.

SPEAKER_01 27:17

What do you want to talk about? What's on your mind?

Home As Sanctuary And Mental Rewiring

SPEAKER_01 27:24

Have you have you read The Power of Now yet? So you sent told me to download the summary audiobook, I believe. Am I right? Wait, what? Practicing of the Power of Now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Whatever you told me to do, I did it. Whatever you told me to do, I did it. Uh-huh. How do you feel? And I did and I've been doing it religiously ever since. Like it reprogrammed my mind. The only thing I'm worried about now is that like there's either there's two two scenarios. Either I really did fix parts of my brain, or I've completely forgot it. But like when now when I re-listen to the power of now, it's not as effective as it was in the beginning. Of course. But hopefully that's because it's already like stored in my mind. Huh. But I my mom just brought me the real book, you know? So now I would like to actually read the real book to store it even deeper into my mind. But thank you. The Power of Now was a very good book. Many people were trying to get me to read it for years, and I was very intimidated by it. I was intimidated. Why? I don't know. Several years ago, like seven, eight years ago, this girl, she's like, I think you'd really like it. And she and it was really big. I just remember it being really big, and I was like, Oh, it looks scary. Oh, interesting. And I was like, Maybe when I'm old. Too heavy. Maybe when I'm old, I'll read that. But like, I don't I don't want to I don't want to look inside yet. Just let me be. Huh. And so thanks to you, I finally committed to get listened to that audiobook. And it was great, man. Great. Very good. Oh, sorry. You're good. What what are your biggest takeaways from the power of now? Oh huh.

SPEAKER_05 29:30

That's like years ago. Power of Now is the the practicing the power of now was the first time I uh experienced the the it book except it said in this moment what you feel is enlightened. That's what he said. But what I feel is like I have the fully conscious of what I am right now. It's data present. That I don't have any conscious at the futures or in the past in that moment. So that's the that's the time the first time I feel like I feel the the difference just by reading.

SPEAKER_01 30:09

To erase your past and erase your future and literally just be right here, right now.

SPEAKER_05 30:15

In that moment. Yeah. Yeah, because because before that I didn't have that. I in the in a point in some some in just some of course, you know, it's just it's just uh it's just uh regular life, just you have a goal, uh, not sure why you have the goal. You know what I'm saying? That you keep chasing and and and never ask yourself that why am I chasing that?

SPEAKER_01 30:37

Yeah, like when you're driving to work, you're like thinking about like what am I gonna do when I get to work? What am I gonna do? You're like thinking in future mode, right?

SPEAKER_05 30:45

Yeah, thinking in future mode, and and you think about too much, right? So that was the first time that I feel that. And I remember even the next day when I wake up, man. Even the next day when I wake up, I can I can I can see the colours on the tree. I can I can hear I can hear the birds we sing on the on the and when I drive my scooter on the way, I just could looking, looking around. I just in the moment. I feel that. That was my biggest takeaway.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

A couple times I forgot my headphones when I went to work. Dude, I'll like I get on my scooter and all my headphones, I'm like, fuck. But then I'm like, but then it ends up being the best day because I don't have this huge input of music or podcasts or audiobook or whatever. I'm able to just be present. It's like when you just have a constant influx of information going into your ears, you are never really aware of what's going on around you. You do not notice the leaves, you do not notice what's going on around you because you're too in your head. Easy to say, really hard to describe.

SPEAKER_05 32:02

Say again. Yeah. Anyway, that was my biggest take. Uh that's I I remember there was uh there was a like few take a few few moments. I I was I was so wondering that how come nobody's talking about this? How come nobody's talking about this to me? What the fuck are we doing? You know so Yeah, then I start to meditate and then I know what I feel and then I never shame off my my experience. So I always share my experience. You always share your experience? Yes, I always share my experience of of of with like when I when I have time, when I have time to to talk to my coworker, I talk I tell them you should meditate. I should I tell them to I told them I I've been doing that. Some of them agree, some of them disagree, some of them Christian or something say this is bad or evil or something. I don't know, man. People say weird shit, but I never I never feel like even people say it's weird or something, they give you a label or something, labelize you or something, but you just I know this is right. So I still like every time I feel like you should meditate, I tell them. How do you meditate? How do I maintain? Hmm. I just uh honestly like I I found I I usually usually I just focus on my breathing and caught and caught myself that having another thought, I just give myself a little noted, thank you, and I release it and just focus on my breathing again. Hmm. So usually when I wake up, it's around 10 minutes or 15 minutes.

SPEAKER_00 33:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 33:55

Yeah, that's when I wake up. So I will I will I know it's not sleeping because I can still hear around me, but it was uh it was sleeping in in a way, I don't know, man, it's in the zone when I in there. Am I making sense? Yeah, yeah, totally. Yeah, so so for a lot of people, like you say, like manifesting or or seeing views, like kind of spiritual guiding guys. I I sometimes I I I watch their videos, I agree, I totally agree with them, but I know I'm not kind of sent, can have that, can can can can see see the future or see my past life of some some kind of like the yoga passenger, the book that we were just talking about, that kind of people. Yeah, I don't understand that. Wait, what what book are you talking about? The journey of a yoga master or something.

SPEAKER_01 34:48

The journey of a yoga master.

SPEAKER_05 34:51

I I don't know in am I am I saying right in English? What was your question again?

SPEAKER_01 34:56

Sorry, because I don't know, I don't know my question either. I was just listening to you.

SPEAKER_05 34:59

So so after the part of now that I started meditation and and I find I find a wonderful part of the subject in my life is very interesting. It's the let me find that word. Surrender. Yes, I watched I I read that book. What? Surrender. No. Surrender experience. No. There's a book about that.

SPEAKER_01 35:20

No. No. I'm saying surrender was the final message in the power of now. Hmm. And the Eckhart Tolle book. And that was like a really it really opened up like my third eye. How do you say this? That is the only way to be free. Buddhology? Yeah. Buddhology? I've never heard of this word. Buddhology. It looks like Buddhism.

SPEAKER_05 35:48

Like Buddhism is like religion, right? Buddha?

SPEAKER_01 35:51

That's a real word? Surrender.

SPEAKER_04 35:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 35:56

Okay. Am I wrong? What were you were you just looking something up on your phone?

SPEAKER_05 36:06

Buddha?

SPEAKER_01 36:08

Oh, you wanted to tell me Buddhology.

SPEAKER_05 36:10

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What about Buddhology? Buddhism is the is a legion in Taiwan, right? Like like the people burning instance or or like mumbling the spell or something. But but uh if it really if you really read the the the the information is in there, it's very interesting. So uh this is why this is reason that uh this is the subject that I really into recently that uh talk about talk about that uh for example that the Buddha itself, the Buddha itself, this word doesn't mean a god, a figure of a person, uh anything. It's just a it's just the person who's awake. That's all the definition. The big the person who's uh that's it, awakened, an enlightened one, yeah. The one who's awake or whatever, yeah, yeah. So it's not it's not it's not saying it's a god, it can do uh crazy shit. Making sense to you?

SPEAKER_01 37:09

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 37:10

So so the the uh after that like reading the the the way to to s to to understanding the the mumbling when you were a kid, the what while your parents making you like mumbling the the spell. Yeah, you probably don't do that. No, yeah, religion thing, man. It's a religion thing, it's silly. Yeah, yeah, it's just silly.

SPEAKER_01 37:43

Until I don't know.

SPEAKER_05 37:44

It's just I I mean I mean that the we the the way we see religion is that that the there's a guru of people that's saying what they say is right, but actually the the thing is older religion is the is only is only the the finger pointing to the truth, it's not the truth itself, you know what I'm saying? So we should have our outstanding than other people just telling us what to do to do to to to do the ceremony and shit. I feel that, yeah, right. So that's why that's why you you try to start thinking about Muslim. You want understanding the the wisdom behind it. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah, like like like recently I I I told you I told you that the seven dead sing in the Bible.

SPEAKER_01 38:26

Yeah, what were you saying? I didn't I didn't follow you.

SPEAKER_05 38:28

The reason the reason I was talking about that is because Well, clarify for me and the listeners, because I didn't understand earlier either.

Meditation, Presence, And Surrender

SPEAKER_05 38:35

So in Dopamination, that in mentioning in what Indomination. I've never read that book. In mentioning that we couldn't check, we couldn't trade an addiction to another addiction because you let me make sure I stay with you for this one.

SPEAKER_01 38:54

Okay. You can't trade an addiction for another addiction.

SPEAKER_05 38:59

Yeah, you couldn't you couldn't you couldn't switch it. You couldn't you couldn't just because in your brain the reward the reward part uh is remained the same. So like for example, smoking cigarettes to nicotine gum. You can't do that. It's the same. Your your body reacting to you your your brain, your your brain, the dopamine part, uh you you rewarding, you feel the good, is the same. Okay, the problem is not the the addiction, is the problem is that how you see what is addiction to you is the pattern. Am making sense, it's not the opportunity. I would like you to elaborate.

SPEAKER_01 39:38

Oh man. What? This is why we're here. That's why we're here. Yeah, right. Yeah. Exactly. I've never read that book, man. So yeah, if you're gonna lay it out, you gotta lay it out clearly.

SPEAKER_05 39:52

Yeah, so anyway, that the the point that is that so so for me that you say you I if I couldn't trade one addiction to another addiction, so the problem is that what is addiction? What is addiction to to it because it can mean differently to other people. There's a guy in a book like he makes an orgasm machine, just keeping dick, keep giving orgasm.

SPEAKER_01 40:17

This doesn't make sense. He just like in the book, in the book, they talk about a guy that makes made an orgasm machine, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 40:25

He just like out check his own dick and something or something like that. You have a tiny little switch, and he can do that. So, so what's the point? That's the ultrony, that's the the the the best pleasure you can give, probably. I don't know, right? What's the point eventually, right? Because your balance, the balance of pleasure and pain eventually just like too much, man. You you have to feel the pain.

SPEAKER_01 40:49

Yeah, you know, so but too much pleasure in you eventually gives you the pain.

SPEAKER_05 40:55

Of course, yeah, yeah. In the in the book, it mentioned that uh in in in in you have you have uh you have a balance system in your in inside your body that that the the the it should be balanced, but the when you put like alcohol, like like merch the bait or porn, like if the pleasure, then eventually you will have to bounce back. You gotta bounce back. Yeah, you gotta bounce back. Like it depletes you. Yeah, so you you you you you you have to suffer in that the the when when the the the pain part get heavier, have you have to get through that the handover, right? Right, right. The the all the the the you feel the regret that you doing you doing all nine, right? You have to get through that, yeah. Right. So for me, the problem is that what is the fucking addiction, man? So like we talk about that, that that uh the the guy we're just talking about, a slave to his lust, you know slave to his lust, yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, the guy, right? So that makes me wonder that uh so that's why that's why I I mentioned that the seven deadly thing. That so is that is that the I want to find the the the the wisdom behind the Bible or something. I don't know, man. It's just like so this is how people want to get more and more. It's the same thing that that just like you you just this is the only way you can reward yourself by cheap dopamine, you know the thing same like just this this is this is all you can get, so it becomes thing. So I think it's that it's it's the the so I think it's not just the the thing that we we put in our body to cause the addiction is the the pattern that we we should looking at looking at the stress that causes to have the addiction. Yeah, making sense, yeah. Yeah, so yeah, that's uh that's the that's the interesting thing about uh dopamination. Is dopamine a problem? Dopamine a problem. It's not a problem, man. It's a it's a it's a it's a it's a it's a it's a it's a thing that your your body will make and absorb and and have in your blood when you are when you're feeling something, when you're feeling happy, it's a is a is it's something we're having you but if you have it too much, you won't feel it. It's you know, it's just a it's not a bad thing or good thing. You just you have to know that what's happening right here, then and you know, I told you man, it's just that when there's a what the fuck am I still watching porn? What's the fucking porn? What's the point? So it's delete the porn and uh delete the app. I mean, so I want to like like what if like put out I put down the just just just put down the the the old pattern that every time I feel stressed, I want to do you know they make the uh what what kind of difference they'll make, right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

Yeah.

Dopamine, Addiction Patterns, And Porn

SPEAKER_01 44:01

Vipassana. Shit. I should do this. What? Vipassana. You seemed kind of interested in that. What I did. What does that mean? Vipassana is the meditation retreat that I did.

SPEAKER_05 44:17

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Yeah. Pretty interesting. Yeah, yeah. I'm very interested in that. I'm interested in your version of story. It's very different than Chasey's version of store. So that's why the first question I asked both of you guys is what do you think is look like before you go? What do you think it's going to like? I didn't think it through at all. So you didn't know what's going to happen at all. So you're just joining that the you my my my new girlfriend is taking me some somewhere fun. Is that what happened? We're going to party. That's that did cross your mind, didn't it?

SPEAKER_01 45:01

I think I thought, I think I thought, this is just going to be so nice and relaxing and calming. I was like, oh man, no computer, no phone. I'm just going to be able to chill. I think that's what I thought. But that's not what happened.

SPEAKER_05 45:20

Okay. Okay. Yeah. So do you feel like do you feel like? Did it work?

SPEAKER_04 45:35

It was so hard. That's not what I asked.

SPEAKER_00 45:40

What you asked.

SPEAKER_04 45:42

Did it work?

SPEAKER_01 45:46

Maybe. I think when I came back, I was like on a high. I think I was on a high. Interesting. Interesting. Yeah, I was so deprived of dopamine. There. Hmm. Interesting. There were no dopamine hits, you know? And I thought about her a lot. And when I thought about her, I got dopamine. Hmm. But there was no like stimulation of any sort at all. Hmm.

SPEAKER_05 46:26

It's a challenge, man. It does it even s sounds just like a challenge I can imagine. But you have you it sounds like you have much more English story in inside of you than than than Tracy. That's what I like for example, the like uh the for example that the night that the uh the other African-American girl was here.

SPEAKER_01 46:55

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 46:56

Yeah. Good job.

SPEAKER_05 46:58

That that you guys were talking about this journey, and uh like like like you say saying something like uh you're gonna face yourself, your own trauma, something like that. And she's like, I'm not gonna do that shit. Something like that. And I was like, huh, they're really two different types of person. Two different types of person, people like like some people like like like fixing their childhood by whole their life, but some people just like fixing their whole life by their childhood, you know. It's huh.

SPEAKER_01 47:30

I think I know what you mean, but like yeah, you gotta be willing to be with yourself.

SPEAKER_05 47:37

Yeah, so I'm I'm so that's why that's why I'm like really un wondering that uh did it work.

SPEAKER_01 47:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now I've had a lot of time to reflect. The only mistake I made was not giving myself enough time to process the experience. I needed time, more time to process the experience. I didn't really have it. But now, back in the real world, I think it it was working.

SPEAKER_05 48:12

It was working and do you have uh empathy sod? Or do you have a break before your reaction? What do you feel like you have brief break before your reaction?

SPEAKER_01 48:31

Do I feel like I had a break before my reaction?

SPEAKER_05 48:34

Yeah, when something happened in your life that do you just do you Oh react or do I have a second before I react?

SPEAKER_01 48:42

Yeah. After Yeah. It didn't like change me permanently, but I think it slowed me down a bit. But I kind of miss it in a strange way. It was so nice not talking, it was nice but challenging. I don't know, it was a really big punch to the to the ego. And why does it say big punch you to the ego? What does that mean? Because you I think we feel a need to express ourselves all the time and communicate and wear clothes and interact with people, and when all of that's taken away, there's not a lot there's not a lot left, but that you're stripping yourself of your ego, and then when you still have to interact with people, but you can't talk to them, that shit gets really awkward. Like I still gotta like interact with all these people around me, but not not verbally, right? Only through eyes and nods and stuff like that, and it was so awkward, and I had to face a lot of awkwardness, I guess, and that was really hard and reminded me of ayahuasca type things where I had to face a lot of insecurity, perhaps I think it was good, man. Oh, I've just been in like a snowball since I got back trying to be so busy working and just go go go go go go go. May it was paradise, but I labeled it hell because I was mad because it it sucked.

SPEAKER_04 50:50

It sucked. Yeah, we're being there. It sucked. What do you mean sucked? It sucked. Like it wasn't fun. Yeah. Yeah, it happened.

SPEAKER_01 51:03

You know, it was it was work to have to wake up at 4 30 in the morning every day and to not be able to talk and to not be able to have your phone or your computer or eat what you want when you want, to be so disciplined, it sucked. But I think discipline is the key to freedom. And I enjoyed that we only got two meals a day. And the last two days I decided to skip the second meal. I was like, fuck it, man. They're just giving me vegetarian food anyway. I'm not getting that much nutrition. I'm just gonna fast. And so the last two days I didn't even eat the I didn't eat the lunch, I just went all the way through it. I don't know, life is complicated, man.

Vipassana Lessons, Work Stress, And Play

SPEAKER_01 51:59

I just want to get out of my job. It's not good for you. It's not healthy to be stressed out and moving so fast all the time. It's not healthy to have all this pressure, and it's not healthy to have all these social obligations at work. The kids don't bother me, it's the adults that do. I don't want to interact with them. I do and have because I didn't have to.

SPEAKER_05 52:23

I do what I was talking to Alice about this. That I do realize that the one one of the things I really I really want to quit my job is because that I I like this couple years that I have a I I know I know I have a great relationship with my family, I have a great relationship with my wife, I have a great relationship with my friends. You know, I'm fine, I'm totally fine. And oh most of my anxiety was only from my work. That's it. There's all the anxiety coming from. Yeah, I just I only want to, yeah. I mean, but honestly, beside my work, beside those three things, I don't care about nothing. Have we become grumpy old men? I don't know. I mean, come on, man. I don't care. Honestly, but so yeah, that's why I I I should I should like like thinking about like my next industry.

SPEAKER_01 53:18

Yeah, um I'm done with the pressure.

SPEAKER_04 53:21

It's like I guess it gave me enough of a break to see once you start a business, actually, you're you're gonna be more happy.

SPEAKER_01 53:31

Sure. Something that really stuck out to me was that she said when I came back from America, I just looked lighter and more relaxed, and it just got me thinking about some of my coworkers and other people are the same age as me, but they look really old, and I'm like, man, this is just like stress wearing you down. I think stress is what ages you, you know? And I don't want to be stressed. I want to have fun. Isn't that why we're here? Are we here to be stressed? Are we here to play? I was laying in bed trying to sleep last night, or maybe it was this morning, and I was like, play, play, play, play, play. That is an important word, and I think we've forgot it because we're in in becoming adults, the domestication of the humans. We've forgot to play. I think to play is so important, and I want to get some really big pieces of like canvas or like paper, just so I can just like write really big letters. I think we just need to remember to play. I think it's really important. I think that's something that Tracy's brought back into my life is the importance of play. Being a kid. That's why I went and got my turtles. I want to play, man. Why we gotta be so serious and working all the time, stressed out, paying bills and shit.

SPEAKER_05 55:00

It's not pursuing to the happiness, man. It's the happiness of pursuing. Say again. You find a you find a way to enjoy your life. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_01 55:15

No. Great we can like chase wealth or we can chase joy, I think. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 55:27

I mean I mean for me, I I the way I see it, I seize, is that I'm only 36 and even even I have the money to retire right here, right now. I still have to live. You know. Well, you want to die? No. No, that's not what I'm saying. You still have to live. I still have to live. I still have to have my life. I still have to figure it out. You see, that's the point. When I take work out of my life, you think there's nothing in your life. Your your your pattern. My pattern? Yeah, man. That was your pattern, man.

SPEAKER_01 56:09

What are you talking about? If I take work out of my life, I can live, I can create.

SPEAKER_05 56:14

That's right. Yeah. So I'm saying is that it's stress will come anyway, man. Even you have a business, stress will come anyway. That's true. Money gonna get tight, and shit are gonna happen. It's not about it's not about that like how you how you like surviving from all of this, man. Just enjoy all of this. It's a part of your life. You will survive from that. You will survive from you survive from all the things. When you look back, you look back to your history, you know, you know you survived, and you thank God. So you look forward, you believe in God. Alhamdulillah. Right. So the point is to be you is not about chasing money, it's being Chris. To enjoy your life. Be a mango. You could try.

SPEAKER_01 57:20

Okay.

unknown 57:22

Let me hear your