Success Secrets and Stories
To share management leadership concepts that actually work.
You are responsible for your development as a leader. Don't expect the boss to invest the training budget in your career. Consider this podcast as an investment of time in your career, with a bit of management humor added at the same time.
Success Secrets and Stories
Embedded Leadership In Action
Leadership gets real when learning is baked into daily work. We explore how to turn existing systems—incident command drills, compliance training, audits, and planning cycles—into a living leadership lab that strengthens communication, trust, and decision-making without a massive budget. Drawing on deep healthcare experience, we break down how OSHA and FEMA-driven requirements create a common language across nursing, facilities, biomed, and administration, and how unified command with external partners builds clarity under pressure. The result isn’t just readiness for emergencies; it’s a culture where people grow through practice, feedback, and shared wins.
We share concrete ways to spotlight emerging talent: create lead roles, hand off sub-teams during drills, and give rising contributors exposure to executives. That visibility accelerates development, balances technical skill with communication, and builds a durable bench for succession planning. You’ll hear how consistent debriefs shift teams from finger-pointing to learning, why interdepartmental drills formalize collaboration, and how frequent reps become a feedback loop that powers advancement. The same playbook applies beyond hospitals: financial audits and annual reporting mirror incident command with defined roles, documented processes, spokespersons, and cross-functional coordination.
We also map embedded leadership in customer experience programs, crisis communication protocols, and strategic planning. Each provides structured reps for empathy, risk reduction, and narrative clarity. Throughout, we keep the focus simple and practical: treat recurring processes as practice fields, set clear roles, rehearse often, and measure outcomes to prove value. Want to build leaders where you stand? Start with the systems you already run and let culture carry strategy.
Presented by John Wandolowski and Greg Powell
Well, hello, and welcome to our podcast, Success, Secrets, and Stories. I'm your host, John Wondolowski, and I'm here with my co-host and friend, Greg Powell. Greg? Hey everybody. And when we put together this podcast, we wanted to put out a helping hand and help that next generation and help answer the question of what does it mean to be a leader? Today we want to talk about a subject that I think supports that concept. So the term embedded leadership is an interesting term. And it really is saying that there's something already in your culture, in your business culture, that you could use as a tool for leadership. And more importantly, you want to encourage continuous education. So looking for ways of utilizing uh leadership and leadership development should never be a one-time event. It should be a lifelong mindset. Now, one of my interesting experiences in the healthcare industry was one of the clearest examples of that mindset. To shape an environment where leaders is really trying to look at development and going beyond what is the exception. Healthcare demands constant adaptations. And staying relevant requires continuous learning across multiple domains, multiple departments. The best example of leadership starts with the understanding of organizational legal requirements and reporting requirements. And if you don't understand those requirements that are core to your job, you're probably not going to succeed overall.
SPEAKER_00:So I know your background, John, is rooted in healthcare. Can you expand on how the environment of compliance of reporting requirements fosters a culture of learning? Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01:There are all kinds of continuous education requirements within the healthcare industry and basically any kind of organization. There's OSHA requirements for ladder safety and fire safety and slipfalls that you have to do on a regular basis. And then there's something a little bit more involved, like FEMA, that are doing things that are associated with emergency incident command. And they're both driven as requirements for your teams to be trained on to understand the requirements. But most of all, it's really to create the safest work environment. And in the hospital environment, it was the most healing environment that you can create. Those were all those generations of what the government agencies are really trying to accomplish. And the sad part is a lot of that is generated from people who have done damage or have had incidents that had to be addressed. A lot of these requirements are coming from that format of where it has failed.
SPEAKER_00:You know, that sounds like an awful lot to manage, John. So let's break it down. How does continuous education apply specifically to the idea of embedding leadership skills?
SPEAKER_01:Let me explain. Continuous education in leadership isn't just about formal education, it's about mentoring, peer learning, cultivating curiosity. Leaders must foster that cooperation. And especially in high pressure situations, they have to be able to find that common ground and that common language. Probably one of the best examples I've seen as far as incident command training is where those department silos start to dissolve into leaders from different departments like nursing and facilities and biomed and other departments start to collaborate and create and resolve problems in real time.
SPEAKER_00:So what you're suggesting is that incident command should be treated as a regular training activity?
SPEAKER_01:Yes. And it's a quarterly requirement, but I have seen applications where they practice monthly to ensure that the team can demonstrate readiness for incident command. But it's also a wonderful opportunity to respond to pressure and also see how the team unifies rather than isolate departments that are struggling. That teamwork, that groundwork of leadership, communication, adaptability starts to be demonstrated in these kinds of environments.
SPEAKER_00:So I can see, John, how management would use incident command to strengthen leadership cooperation, team building, compliance, alignment. It makes total sense.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. And with healthcare rapidly changing with technology and the regulatory landscape, leaders must constantly learn to stay compliant and to be effective. Incident command drills also reinforce interdepartmental communication and they formalize it. And that is something that is both a practice and a real skill set that's needed in an emergency.
SPEAKER_00:So how does communication evolve across different incident command scenarios?
SPEAKER_01:And we've talked about that whole thing about communication, how important it is. And the whole thing of incident command is a wonderful microcosm of communication. In some drills, external agencies like the fire department are involved. And they actually create a parallel incident command structure. And then you see the example of how the hospital handles incident command and how the fire department handles the incident command, and then how they coordinate as independent resources and create a common goal and a common approach. All those things you're looking for as far as a leader, you have a perfect teaching format right there in your hands that you need to exercise with. You need to try to bring other people into that incident command environment for them to learn.
SPEAKER_00:So let's bring it back to that topic of leadership. How does this help leaders become more adaptive and learning oriented? Right.
SPEAKER_01:I guess that's kind of my point. Incident command is more than a drill, it is really a leadership lab. It teaches that learning is a career-long requirement. It also builds relationships across departments, giving leaders a face-to-face and a name to associate it with roles that they might never otherwise engage in. This connection accelerates trust and collaboration because they have some history and they have common goals that they both share.
SPEAKER_00:So, John, thanks for explaining it the way you did. Now I see why you emphasize incident command. It's a powerful tool for both organizational cohesion and leadership development.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. And it's no accident that the frequencies of these exercises are sometimes tied directly to how well a leader can communicate and coordinate with their peers. It's that feedback loop, that practice loop of involvement and making sure that the leads are involved in deeper learning. And the secret here is that if you don't do a good job in that leadership role on incident command, you might have a limited opportunities for advancement. But if you do a great job of leadership, it's also a wonderful opportunity to prove to executive management that you're ready for more. I've always impressed upon individuals that I want them to succeed. Their opinions and their talents are what makes a lasting difference by empowering them to learn, to take ownership, not only of their assignment, but the environment in which they're working in and influence the surroundings. We're cultivating that leadership skill. And from the ground up, incident command is actually testing everyone within that environment. Those people who actually are involved in a real incident command will start to shine because they've learned this process over time.
SPEAKER_00:And by setting that example, John, I'll bet the rest of the staff began to adopt the approach as well. Is that what you saw? I did.
SPEAKER_01:And that reinforcement, that idea of personal responsibility, it often shifted the conversation towards staff development after the incident command event happened. I'd ask what they would need to take that next step, whether it be technical training or becoming better tradespeople, and being able to communicate and express what they are trying to do in that incident command role.
SPEAKER_00:So going through continuous education, you also shifted the language. It became more about what did we learn instead of who is a blame. We've talked before about finger pointing. It eliminates that. But what strikes me is how your approach models respect, especially towards the mechanic or the technician and their expertise. The secret seems to be listening and using that as a tool to foster an adult learning mindset. Exactly.
SPEAKER_01:And you put it perfectly. That really is trying to push them to understand leadership in a small level. And then they're learning as a team, and they have that shared experience and knowledge that they've crafted from those events. It's that mutual learning, that mutual trust that starts to expand and actually grow.
SPEAKER_00:So you've also shared examples of more formal ways to embed a culture of learning, like developing SAT through structured roles. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I've seen organizations actually elevate support team members and entry-level supervisors on how effective that they were able to handle these events. And what I did is I would take people who I thought had potential and I would let them take some of the lead in some of those conversations and give them a taste of leadership. Sometimes I would put them in charge of facility subgroups so that they would be able to report to me and I could respond to the executive team. That really didn't cost anything in terms of special training, but it was so significant in terms of exposure, not only internally to our team to build that trust, but also for the other department managers and supervisors to see the skill set that we had in our own department.
SPEAKER_00:So let's wait a minute here. You promoted people without a major budget hit. How did that work?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, well, our structures were pretty small, but when I made the suggestion of finding team leads rather than just supervisors, we weren't talking about a huge increase in pay. And the payoff really was the way I presented it is that we could reduce overtime, we could expand operational coverage, and most of all, we could enhance leadership influence. A lot of what we're looking for in terms of hospitals or any organization is helping those responsibilities and helping those key players understand what's required of them and kind of like setting goals for them to achieve.
SPEAKER_00:So I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I think you probably had to have those results audited just to prove the value you promised.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, because people wanted to make sure that it was worth the money. And executives would ask me later just how was that being accomplished? Um what I really wanted to make sure is that they had clear takeaways, that there was this approach to expanding leadership responsibilities from these small teams, and how that would really be a benefit to the hospital 24-7 environment. What I'm really talking about here is building a bench for future advancement. And that's something that was missing. And that whole bench conversation is actually something healthcare is dealing with now. Succession planning is critical. This approach creates leadership depth without really excessive spending. And it's inspired other departments to do the same thing because it's really rooted in continued learning and continuous teaching.
SPEAKER_00:So, John, way back in the day, I heard the quote culture eats strategy for breakfast. All right. It's not just what you teach, but it's how you live what you teach. Your team lead strategy went beyond task completion. It fostered listening, it fostered cohesion and leadership from within. And I imagine those leads had a better feel for the trades. So were they better communicators or better technicians?
SPEAKER_01:Well, that's kind of like the heart of it. Most leads excel in one of the two areas. Either they're very good at communicators or they're very good technicians, but they're usually, they don't have both of those skills, and that's what you're trying to develop. Every lead I have worked with were always talented within the business environment. But they were never given a voice in the old management structure to actually give their opinion and be part of the process. Watching their eyes and just seeing the effect on their face when they're sitting at the table with executive management getting their first chance to give their views and their insights to an executive team, it's transformative. And it's transformative for them and then for you. Because you've had an actual hand in helping them take that next step. Many people that I have helped advance also learned that this is a continual learning process and it's a leadership principle.
SPEAKER_00:So, John, you took the opportunity to provide modeling for your supervisors, delegating responsibility and giving them a voice. Exactly.
SPEAKER_01:And I wanted my managers to have the same opportunity so that they could grow and they would have the exposure to executive management. So both the hourly and the supervisory level are getting that opportunity to take my role someday. And if you don't practice what you preach, it's never going to give you that kind of return that you're looking for.
SPEAKER_00:So the incident command example and model looks fantastic. But what if your organization doesn't have something like incident command?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, well, I've worked in manufacturing and higher ed and hospital organizations. They actually all have incident command. And they have emergencies and they have defined communication roles. Different organizations take incident command, whether they practice it, whether they actually have executive management involvement. But sooner or later they understand that there's a risk involved. And if they don't have incident command, unfortunately, they really do need to have something in place. More importantly, executive management has an opportunity to test teams to see whether they can handle real life emergencies. I can't think of an application where it wouldn't benefit an organization to have incident command procedures and requirements defined.
SPEAKER_00:John, I can see the importance of that. But any places where folks can find this information, this information associated with incident command, if it's something that they've never done before?
SPEAKER_01:Yes, there are. And really my favorite is incident command. And incident uh command is actually uh governed by the National Institute Management System, which is NIMS, which is overseen by FEMA, Federal Emergency Management Agency. And good grief, if you try to get any more acronyms in in the business world, you're probably in healthcare. But if you're looking for the information, www.fema.gov is actually the best place to start. And the real key here for Incident Command is hitting the Incident Command Systems 400-level classes. And yes, there's a level 100, a level 200, and a level 300. But what they're really trying to do is teach you some very basic components of Incident Command, the command and general structure and roles, to talk about unified command or multi-jurisdictional or multi-agency incidents occur and how those are handled. Area command in terms of structure and responsibility, complex incident management strategies to try to handle some of the variables that you're going to see, and integral coordination and communication. Greg, have you ever heard communication more often than when we talk about what is involved in management? It's like the very basic of any of these projects in terms of learning. Communication is probably the most important. Now, upon completion, uh participants will understand their role in terms of a large-scale incident. How to actually apply the ICS principles in terms of complex applications. But more importantly, to understand that coordinating effectively with multiple agencies and jurisdictions really requires to plan, to lead, to cooperate, and also be part of the process. It is a great format for people to understand. It's like with my point, it's a leadership lab and it's all there. It's that soup that as soon as you start to mix it, you actually can use that as a tool of training.
SPEAKER_00:So in my world, specifically in human resources, I didn't really have an application for incident command. We participated in bigger incident command situations if there was a people issue or opportunity. But can you give an office-based example of what would be relevant here?
SPEAKER_01:Okay. Yeah. Uh probably uh more manufacturing-based would be an audit. Whether it be a financial audit or a regulatory audit, they are a structured leadership requirement that falls right back into that continuous learning uh side of the business. Take uh Sox Oxley compliance, for instance. Organizations are training administrators to understand the spreadsheets, report protocol, and handle external communication to meet the legal standards. That's all in incident command. It's the same thing. Even something as fundamental as preparing an annual report involves embedding leadership. It's not just accounting, it's coordinating across departments, understanding profit and loss, and ensuring that every contributor knows how their work fits into the bigger picture. Training audits isn't a one-time event. Teams rehearse the process, assign spokespeople, refine communication to their auditors' expectations. It's continuous learning in action, especially when leaders use it to reduce risk and improve transparency.
SPEAKER_00:So, what you're really saying, John, is that continuous learning applies in almost any institution. Exactly. It's not just about compliance, it's about competency.
SPEAKER_01:Whether you're in healthcare or finance or education or you're a technician or you're a leader, you have all these embedded systems that need and demand support, whether it's accountability, adaptability, or cooperation, those are all those skills that leadership has to demonstrate. So additional examples of embedded learning opportunities. One of them is project management from my construction days, where you have your regular reviews and you have leaders reflecting on the work and how they did it and how they need to improve. And these sessions are a culture of feedback and those interactive learning opportunities. Strategic planning cycles where you're doing an annual plan. Sometimes we did asset plans, we did capital equipment opportunities and capital building opportunities. All those things are trends in terms of market and forecasting and team alignments. And they're using tools like S-BAR and MBR concepts that we were we talked about in the past as all part of their regular routine of operations.
SPEAKER_00:So, from my experience, I've seen a few other applications of embedded leadership requirements. So they would be as follows customer experience initiatives. Leaders are often tasked with improving service delivery based on customer feedback. This requires empathy, cross-functional coordination, and continuous improvement training. Another example is crisis communications protocols. In corporate settings, leaders must be trained to respond to PR crisis, data breaches, or operational failures. These protocols often include simulations and media training, which is another form of embedded learning. And finally, succession planning. Identifying and mentoring future leaders is a strategic imperative. Organizations embed leadership development into performance reviews, stretch assignments, and coaching programs. So whether it's incident command in a hospital or audit prep in a corporate office, the principles are the same. Leadership development is most powerful when it's embedded into the fabric of daily operations. It's not a separate track, it's the track. And when leaders embrace learning as part of their role, they don't just meet expectations, they actually elevate them.
SPEAKER_01:And that's the point of today's podcast. That really is the essence of it. Have a training strategy, understand what's embedded in your organization that can help you complement that leadership training itself. So if you like what you've heard, I've written a book called Building Your Leadership Toolbox, and we talk about tools like this. And it's available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble and other sites. The podcast is what you've been listening to. Thank you so much. It's also available on Apple, Google, and Spotify. A lot of what we talk about is from Dr. Durst and his MBR program. If you'd like to know more about Dr. Durst, you can find out on SuccessGrowth Academy.com. And if you'd like to contact us, please send me a line. It's wando seventy five periodjw at gmail.com. And the music has been brought to you by my grandson. So we want to hear from you. Drop me a line. Tell me what's going on, what you like, and what you would like to hear about. It has always helped us to create content. Thanks, Greg. This was fun.
SPEAKER_00:Thanks, John. As always. Next time. Yeah.