Success Secrets and Stories
To share management leadership concepts that actually work.
You are responsible for your development as a leader. Don't expect the boss to invest the training budget in your career. Consider this podcast as an investment of time in your career, with a bit of management humor added at the same time.
Success Secrets and Stories
Ownership Builds People, Control Breaks Culture
Feeling like the bottleneck at work? We break down a simple, human framework that helps supervisors stop rescuing and start leading, so teams think, anticipate, and own results. Drawing on Management by Responsibility (MBR), we share practical shifts that move you from control to genuine ownership without losing standards or speed.
Greg and John start with the supervisor trap—why well-intentioned fixes lead to late nights, frustrated teams, and stalled growth. Then we reframe leadership around voluntary responsibility, showing how better questions spark better thinking: “What outcomes are you aiming for?” and “What do you need from me to complete this?” You’ll hear how clear agreements—outcomes, timelines, resources, and ownership—eliminate confusion and micromanagement. We revisit classic lessons popularized by Ken Blanchard and bring them to life with an office case study where a team turned chronic late reports into on-time, high-quality delivery in six weeks.
We also unpack accountability without blame. Instead of conflict, you’ll get a calm script for reviewing agreements: what worked, what didn’t, what changes next time, and what support was missing. For technical leaders promoted for their expertise, we show how to resist the urge to “take the wrench” and use a lightweight SBAR approach to give context and earn buy-in. The result is a culture that replaces waiting with initiative, and fear with trust: people speak up early, solve problems faster, and take pride in their work. That’s the moment a supervisor becomes a leader—not because of a title, but because of the impact of your leadership on people.
Presented by John Wandolowski and Greg Powell
Well, hello, and welcome to our podcast, Success, Secrets, and Stories. I'm your host, John Wondolowski, and I'm here with my co-host and friend, Greg Powell. Greg? Hey everybody. And when we put together this podcast, we wanted to put out a helping hand and help that next generation and help answer the question of what does it mean to be a leader? Today we want to talk about a subject that I think supports that concept. So today we're going to take a little inspiration from Dr. Durce's Management by Responsibility, MBR. And I want to talk about shifting the control of you see sometimes in leadership to ownership. The first real step is really having that transition from controlling it to actually owning it. And it hits every new leader right between the eyes. Shifting control is about how you give ownership to your staff. This shift is the moment a supervisor becomes a leader, it's the difference between managing tasks and developing people. It's the foundation of what Dr.
SPEAKER_00:Durst talked about in MBR. So if someone listening feels like they're carrying the whole load at work, this episode is going to speak directly to them.
SPEAKER_01:Absolutely. So let's dive in. A new supervisor is kind of in a trap, and they usually call it a supervisor meltdown trap.
SPEAKER_00:And if you're coaching a lot of new supervisors, exactly what does that look like? So, John, you coach a lot of new supervisors, and you've talked about something called the supervisor's trap. What does that look like? Okay, so let me paint a picture.
SPEAKER_01:A new supervisor, let's call her Tina, steps into a role, excited, motivated, ready to prove herself. But within a few weeks, she's drowning. She's checking everyone's work, she's fixing mistakes, she's staying late, she's working weekends, she's constantly reminding people to get their work in on time. And she's thinking, Am I the only one who cares?
SPEAKER_00:You know, I think half of our listeners just whispered, hey, that's me.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And Tina's not alone. This is the supervisor's trap that happens to a lot of people. You feel responsible for everything. So you start to take responsibility for everything.
SPEAKER_00:And the more you take on, the less your team does. And at the same time, there's more frustration within the team because the micromanagement of your supervisor is undermining the work that you're trying to help them do as a leader.
SPEAKER_01:Right. And you take away the responsibility from the people, they stop taking responsibility for anything else.
SPEAKER_00:So Tina's meltdown wasn't because she was a bad supervisor, it was because she was trying to carry the whole world on her shoulders.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. And that's where MBR comes in. It gives the supervisor a way out of the trap.
SPEAKER_00:So let's talk about that shift. What does it look like when a supervisor moves from control to ownership?
SPEAKER_01:It starts with a mindset. Responsibility isn't something that you can force. It's chosen, it's internal, it's voluntary.
SPEAKER_00:You know, that's a big shift for someone who's used to being the fixer themselves.
SPEAKER_01:It is. And a fixer is sometimes in that role like trying to be a superhero. Organizations assume that that superhero is the reason the team, the department is doing as well as they are doing. And that's usually when the superhero is overwhelmed, when the responsibility becomes so much that they start micromanaging the department until it crumbles. That's when some very good people who are in leadership positions end up being fired for not being able to develop their staff. Let me give you an example. A new supervisor, in the moment that they realize that they have a serious problem. The supervisor, let's call him Marcus. He's at a turning point. And he told me, you know, I realize that I'm answering everybody's questions, solving everybody's problem, and making everybody's decision, and I have become the bottleneck.
SPEAKER_00:And that's when he realized he wasn't leading, he was actually babysitting.
SPEAKER_01:Yep, exactly. Leadership isn't about control, it's about creating the conditions where people choose ownership. So how does a supervisor start to make that shift? Well, it's by changing questions and how they're presented. Let's take a couple examples. Instead of why did you do this? Ask in a little bit better of a format, what outcomes are you aiming for? Or instead of saying something along the lines of, here's what you need to do next, get them engaged. Ask them a question. What do you think is the next step? And the most important one for leaders that are actually in this position is let me fix this. There's the micromanager 101. No. What do you need from me in order to get the task completed?
SPEAKER_00:So, John, these are not binary questions looking for binary responses. Those questions invite thinking, they invite responsibility.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. And that and that's the shift weight back onto the person that's doing the work. And when the people think on their own and they come up with their own answers, they start to own the work.
SPEAKER_00:And I think, of course, that builds confidence.
SPEAKER_01:It does. And that really, a lot of people, that's what they're really looking for. People rise to the occasion, to the challenge when they feel trust and they think that you have given them the power to think, to decide, and to act on their own.
SPEAKER_00:So let's talk a little bit about the team transformation. Now, one of the most practical tools in MBR is the idea of clear agreements. So why are agreements so important?
SPEAKER_01:Because most workplaces, the frustration comes in with unclear expectations. People think that their job description actually answers all the questions, and it doesn't. They need to understand what is expected. And until then, they don't. And then supervisors feel like they have to micromanage. Exactly. And that's where it all comes from. It's the lack of creating an agreement that is clear. If you create an agreement, you'll eliminate 80% of the confusion that leads to micromanagement. So what is it that makes an agreement clear? Okay. There's two parts to this. The formal approach is you're trying to get an outcome, and exactly what are you trying to achieve? You're trying to develop a standard on what looks good. You're trying to define a timeline so that everybody knows when it's supposed to be done and it doesn't have a floating date on when it's going to be delivered. You always ask the questions of resources to make sure that they have what they need in order to be successful. But you also want to make sure that the last part is that there's ownership and you're telling who is responsible for what element of that project needs to be completed. Now, one of my clearest memories of this kind of problem of giving clear-cut direction was really helpful when I read a book, and it's a bestseller, by a gentleman by the name of Ken Blanchard. And he did a very good job of describing what it is to be a manager in a book called The One Minute Manager. And the core of the One Minute Manager was really those three elements that we had talked about earlier: the outcome of what you're trying to achieve, the timeline that it needs to get done, and clearly telling that individual what you need to do in order to get the project completed. There is that agreement, that clear direction. And with that clear direction, you have an accomplishment that is the essence of what people are looking for, that element of respect, that they have completed something and have taken ownership.
SPEAKER_00:So let's bring this to life. You mentioned a team transformation story.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it's it's a little bit more of the office environment rather than the technical environment. And let's call it Elaine. And her team was missing deadlines. Reports were late, incomplete, inconsistent. Elaine was frustrated. The entire team was frustrated. So she agreed to use the MBR program in terms of a model that I gave her. They defined the outcome as a group. They defined the standards as a group, as a team. They talk about a timeline that they could actually deliver, and they clarified their roles, who was going to take what responsibilities. By identifying the supports that they needed and the outside people that needed to help them to create the report, it was a very good job of identifying what they needed to do for an agreement. And what happened? Within three weeks, the reports were on time. Within six weeks, the team was performing better than ever. And it was not because she was pushing harder. It's because she owned the work and she was able to communicate the work. Now that's the power of clarity.
SPEAKER_00:And it's the power of responsibility. So let's talk a little bit about accountability without blame. A lot of new supervisors dread it. Why do they dread accountability?
SPEAKER_01:Because the association of accountability with conflict, blame, and punishment. That's the challenge. MBR is trying to basically bring accountability to a simple conversation about the agreement. So could you walk us through what that actually sounds like? Yeah, what it sounds like. Let's let's take a couple of those conversations and words that are key. Let's look at the agreement we made. What worked, what didn't work. What would you do differently next time? That's really an important and very powerful tool. What support did you need that we should be basically looking at as we go forward?
SPEAKER_00:You know, John, that's very calming, very objective. It's actually very human.
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. And that's the point. It keeps the relationship intact. It reinforces responsibility instead of fear, and it builds trust.
SPEAKER_00:And I imagine it also reduces the emotional charge that comes with this.
SPEAKER_01:It does, because you're not attacking a person. You're reviewing the agreement, and that's the key that they understand that they're making conditions and discussing the agreement. This office application, in terms of an agreement for creating a report, is a little bit different. My experience is that someone in the facilities or maintenance applications, the guidelines and the agreement is basically the same approach. One of the challenges for an engineering application is that the most qualified technician or engineer is usually advanced to this management position. And they have the skills to manage the process and also to micromanage. Here's the real issue. They're in management and they need a set of skills and a framework in order to transfer responsibility and lead a staff. MBR is that model to help the leaders, new leaders, stop micromanaging, to understand the importance of developing their staff and to create agreements and challenging job descriptions in order to make it clear for the employee. And it's also clear for the supervisor to understand what empowerment really means and to apply that transfer of responsibility to the staff.
SPEAKER_00:So let's zoom out. What happens to a team's culture when a leader consistently uses responsibility instead of using control? People stop waiting.
SPEAKER_01:People start thinking. People start anticipating. They start solving. They start that process of owning the results. You know, John, this is when culture really shifts. Exactly. And I guess sometimes it it what does responsibility actually entail? What does that mean in a business environment? And there's some clear-cut buzzwords. It's trust, it's that psychological safety that you can talk and you can share without fear. It's the engagement, the personal engagement, the initiative. If you're doing those elements, you're going to see elements of pride, people proud of the things that they're producing. You'll see better performance. And most of all, you'll see better relationships in terms of you as a leader talking to your staff.
SPEAKER_00:So this is really important, John. This is the moment when a supervisor becomes a leader, not because of a title, but because of the impact they actually have on their people.
SPEAKER_01:Well said. And now I have seen several issues associated with engaging a staff that takes accountability for their results. Sometimes simply telling them what is the process and how is it supposed to be done and what are we going to be doing as we go forward is counterproductive and it's just another element of micromanaging. I took the approach of creating a S-Bahn report whenever I was talking to management, and I realized that if I did the same thing for my employees, I give them the benefit of understanding the background and where my request is coming from. I can't do an S-Bahn report for every project, but if I did a couple of them, they would understand that there's thought put behind it. And if you're not familiar with an S-Ba report, it's worthwhile to just go over it one more time. The S stands for situational analysis, B stands for background, A stands for your assessment, R is for your recommendation. It's pretty simple, is my point. If you help them in terms of creating this agreement and they understand and they engage and they have some pride in terms of how that is going to be actually accomplished, you're engaging with your staff, and now you're actually down the road of being a leader. Most leaders believe that the overall responsibility is based on their title, and that's not true. The moment that they realize that it's the collective team that they represent, and then at that point is when they actually transition to be a leader and they share those kind of benefits of being considered capable, competent, they all own that end result. Now, instead of carrying on the load with just your hands, you have so many more hands in your team that are carrying the load together.
SPEAKER_00:So, John, as we wrap up, what's the one question you want the listeners today to walk away with?
SPEAKER_01:Okay. Where in leadership are you trying to control? And when should you be creating that environment to encourage ownership? Think about the one person on your team, one task, one situation where you are carrying more than your share, and you have to ask yourself, what's the agreement? Does it need to be clarified? What responsibilities need to shift? What conversations need to happen? Leadership isn't about doing more, it's about empowering more.
SPEAKER_00:And when you lead to responsibility, you don't just get better results, you actually build better people. Yep.
SPEAKER_01:And just remember, leadership's other task is to teach, to develop your staff. That's the essence of being a leader. And hopefully what we've talked about gets that clarity of trying to engage your staff to take that next step and to find some element of joy of ownership. The pride and the culture kind of fits into that at the same time. So if you like what you've heard, I've written a book called Building Your Leadership Toolbox, and we talk about tools like this. And it's available on Amazon and Barnes Noble and other sites. The podcast is what you've been listening to. Thank you so much. It's also available on Apple, Google, and Spotify. A lot of what we talk about is from Dr. Durst and his MBR program. If you'd like to know more about Dr. Durst, you can find out on SuccessGrowthAcademy.com. And if you'd like to contact us, please send me a line. That's wondo75 periodjw at gmail.com. And the music has been brought to you by my grandson. So we want to hear from you. Drop me a line. Tell me what's going on, what you like, and what you would like to hear about. It has always helped us to create content. Thanks, Greg. This was fun.
SPEAKER_00:Thanks, John. As always. Next time. Yeah.