MEDIASCAPE: Insights From Digital Changemakers

From Rhymes to Podcasts: Corey Gumbs’ Vision for Inclusivity and Empowerment in Digital Media

• Hosted by Joseph Itaya & Anika Jackson • Episode 39

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Ever wondered how a rapper's dream could shape an entire podcasting community? Join us as we uncover Corey Gumbs’ unique journey from aspiring musician to influential podcast development strategist and community builder. Corey shares intimate stories from his early music industry days and how those experiences led him to pioneering efforts in educating artists about the digital music business. His passion for creating spaces where aspiring podcasters can thrive without traditional constraints is inspiring, especially as he recounts his 2013 reintroduction to podcasting and the formation of the Black Podcasters Association.

As the conversation progresses, we explore Corey's mission to build a supportive environment for Black podcasters. He candidly discusses the challenges he faced in establishing himself in the industry and the importance of creating spaces where individuals can express their true selves without fear of judgment. Corey highlights the issues of elitism and microaggressions within the podcasting community and emphasizes the need for authentic representation. His dedication to fostering a thriving network has been crucial in creating a space where diversity is celebrated, enabling a new generation of podcasters to share their voices.

The episode wraps up with an insightful discussion on empowering marginalized communities within the podcasting realm. Corey sheds light on initiatives like the Black Podcasters Association and their efforts to connect podcasters with national brands through high engagement rates. His collaboration with figures like Chris Colbert, and parallels with Rita Batista’s work for the Latino community, underscore the power of collective action. Corey’s story is a testament to the power of passion, collaboration, and resourcefulness in forging a path for success and inclusivity in the podcasting world.

This podcast is proudly sponsored by USC Annenberg’s Master of Science in Digital Media Management (MSDMM) program. An online master’s designed to prepare practitioners to understand the evolving media landscape, make data-driven and ethical decisions, and build a more equitable future by leading diverse teams with the technical, artistic, analytical, and production skills needed to create engaging content and technologies for the global marketplace. Learn more or apply today at https://dmm.usc.edu.

Speaker 1:

Welcome to Mediascape insights from digital changemakers, a speaker series and podcast brought to you by USC Annenberg's Digital Media Management Program. Join us as we unlock the secrets to success in an increasingly digital world.

Speaker 2:

Hello, I am Annika Jackson, one of your DMM instructors and the co-host of Mediascape Insights from Digital Changemakers. I maybe kind of met Corey, but I definitely DMed him at the Podcast Movement Conference because Corey is a podcast development strategist. Community builder, corey, you started the Black Podcasters Association. You do a lot to pour back into the community, and the conversation around people of color in the community I think is not one that we have, particularly with Black podcasters. You did a lot of great presentations at the conference, so I'm just really blessed to have you here today, thank you.

Speaker 3:

Thank you for having me. I'm honored to be here.

Speaker 2:

Of course, now I know you got your start with, like web design, other aspects of digital. Can you talk a little bit about what engaged you in that industry and then how you found your way into this crazy world that is podcasting, which keeps growing?

Speaker 3:

So my background was in audio. So when I was younger I wanted to be a rapper. I was, you know, I played music, was going to school to be a recording engineer. I was also trying my hand in the music industry. It went from music to podcasting, to the web stuff, back to podcasting. So that's kind of my path.

Speaker 3:

But in the early 2000s I was watching the whole Napster, the whole you know music on the internet thing, and I came at the time you't, you know, my friends and I we had signed a bad management deal for our rap group, so it was a lot of learning curves that we had learned, you know, in the music industry I decided to see, I saw where music was going, where the internet was going, and I started a website called don't get jerkedcom to teach people about the music business and wound up being with, like facebook, twitter, all that stuff. We had like a lot of stuff that. You know, when I was talking to my developer at the time, we were thinking about bringing stuff like that to it, so kind of like predicted the future a little bit. But I stumbled onto podcasting, what would become podcasting, and I saw that as a way for artists to connect to their audience. You know, because the whole goal of the website was to show artists that you don't need the record label model, the traditional radio music model to what the internet was going to do. You didn't need it. So I was trying to say like trying to create a space where people can free themselves right and learn about the industry, and I was trying to create like what I used to call the Kinko's your class probably doesn't know what the Kinko's is, if those are still around Of the music industry where you came to one place and you got everything you needed to get done in one place.

Speaker 3:

And I was young, then I was going to be a father, so that kind of took precedence and my partners backed out. So back then, developing a website took a lot of money and I just couldn't sustain it. So I did what most people do I started teaching myself how to code, to try to continue, to try to further my vision, and it just became a hobby, something I really enjoyed doing. So that's kind of how I led into the web development portion. And you know life was lifing and you know it wasn't until 2013 when my friend reintroduced me to podcasting, because I just never paid attention, like you know, kind of died out. So that's what got me back into the podcast as a fan, like a lot of people, and that's what got me back into the podcast as a fan, like a lot of people.

Speaker 3:

And then my partner he's an engineer and we talk a lot of politics, science and stuff, and one of the things we wanted to do was create a podcast that bridges politics, science, tech and for the black community, because we've seen a lot of misconception, misinformation, misconceptions and straight up conspiracy theories that really triggered both of us. So we like you know people hear our conversation and do the same thing start a podcast. So that's how I got started, and the cool part about podcasting is still fulfill my love of wanting to do the studio recording and everything. So I started my own mobile studio here in New York City pre COVID, and then COVID hit, so that bottle got blown up. But I also did this when I started the community. So, and then that's what I've been working on ever since, and actually we just opened a studio this year, me and my partner. Oh, fantastic.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, my hands are a little bit everything.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, a ton of things, yeah. So, okay, going from music production, all of that into learning how to code yourself and then back to podcasting. Really before a lot of people discovered it during the pandemic, right, that's when we saw it get even bigger and bigger and bigger and people really understand the power of podcasting. So I want to talk about your podcast and then how that you know what was the outgrowth then to the Black Podcasters Association a lot of the work that you do. I know that you're also doing a lot with the Afros and Audio Conference and a lot of other. You know Black Pod News. You have so many your hands in so many cookie jars.

Speaker 3:

I only got two hands, but I do it. So the podcast my friend and I were going to start never came to fruition. We had an investor and we were going to start never came to fruition. We had an investor and we were trying because he lives in another state. We were you know, this is before people were using, you know, all these different platforms that we use now.

Speaker 3:

There wasn't really a lot of options to do podcasting, you know, in a remote capacity At the time. Google Meet wasn't that great. You had Zoom. A lot of us were using Zoom for, like school, you know, classes and stuff like that but you know, it wasn't really using. Zoom wasn't even that great as far as, like, the audio and video quality at the time.

Speaker 3:

So his idea and idea was like to just like rent like a Sprinter van for like two weeks and just travel city to city and we were trying to get sponsors and investors to help fund it and we would go to different cities and meet with people and, you know, and do do our interviews. But we had a deal, we were ready to sign a contract and that fell through. So it was just like how do we get this going? And then in 2018, I had a car accident.

Speaker 3:

So that's that kind of messed me up and it was like you know. I was like, okay, do we keep talking about this or do I actually try to do something about it? And I took my last two grand out, my savings and brought my, my equipment, my mobile setup, because I wanted to be able to move with it. So, and that's where, really, I just got back into. Podcasting was like you know, and, because of the car accident, gave me a lot of time because I wasn't working anymore. I just took a lot of time to really do a deep dive into really understanding how podcasting works and working with clients and stuff like that. So, and picking people's brains and just learning as much as I could.

Speaker 2:

What was it like to get your first client? Was it hard? Did people understand the power of podcasting as much as you did?

Speaker 3:

So funny story. When the pandemic happened and I had, you know, when the pandemic hit here in New York City, I was kind of trying to figure out, like what do I do? Right, we still didn't have all the information. Kind of trying to figure out like what do I do? Right, we still didn't have all information. And it was like, do I, do I still try to launch my? Because I actually had put on my calendar March 2020 launch business and I was going to I was working on the goal was during the winter was to put the business plan together and work on the marketing and start actually doing it. I was doing it through 2019, but I had a couple of clients, friends that would have podcasts and you know, know, the first client in that one came with the studio double book. So my friend was like I remember you posted something on facebook, do you still do that? And I was like yeah, he was like can you come to my house? And I was like sure, that's what I do and that I started becoming their editor, slash producer, slash studio. And it was real convenient for them because they didn't have to find babysitting, they had conflicting schedules and it was like, okay, they can do it at this time I will come there. And that's when I was learning, like, about how, like I know how sound works, but it was like you've got to learn how much equipment to get and all that stuff. So because you, you know, like one time we was recording on fourth of july, which I advise people to never do unless you go into it, because no matter what you do, you're going to hear everything. So but I started that way and then my first consulting client came post COVID.

Speaker 3:

I mean during COVID, where I was really trying my best to avoid doing consulting. At first I was trying to figure out my business model, since my original one got blown up and I was. My friends kept saying you're doing all this stuff? You started your Facebook group, why don't you get into consulting and helping people since you enjoy doing it so much? And I was just like at the time all these gurus and stuff were coming in and I just didn't want to be associated with that.

Speaker 3:

I got my first consulting client through a recommendation of a friend who told me to take a personality test so that I know what kind of people I work well with. I'm not a big fan of those things. But I said, all right, I'll try it. She said it worked for her and the conversation shifted to me. The person who did it was like, oh, I saw you do podcasting. She was like you know, can I ask you some questions? I was like you know, whatever, what do you have? You know, cause I give away I don't say giveaway, I help people freely and we just wound up being like a two hour conversation. At the end of the conversation she was like Cor, I wish I met you two weeks ago. I spent $1 you that for the past two hours of information you gave me.

Speaker 3:

And that's when she started becoming a more consistent client for me. And the funny part is personality tests. Our personalities were like the ideal personalities to work together. So it was kind of like like I don't know, like destiny or something, but that she became my first client and, truthfully, she kept me afloat during the first two years of my life, my company's life, because you you know, kobe, it was a struggle to get consistent clients, you know, as the podcast industry was trying to figure itself out. Yeah, so I know it's a long-winded way, but no, that it's.

Speaker 2:

I know it's still a struggle, particularly for the indie podcasters, because we don't have the big celebrity name, we don't have the big studio that's backing us, we're not necessarily attached to a TV show, so we really have to find our way and figuring things out. But now you're at a point where you have started. You know you have Black Pod News, you have the association, you're also on the board of the Association of Independence and Radio, so you've been able to elevate to all these things that look and sound very glamorous to somebody from the outside but I know are a lot of work for you as the founder.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I'm just a little old, me. It was like you know, sometimes, like even at podcast movies, people were talking to me like oh, I wanted to meet you and I've heard some and I'm just like I've had people walk up to me and be like it's you, and I'm like it's you, like what do you mean? It's me, you mean it's me, I don't know. Like, that's the part that I because I always wanted to work behind the scenes I've never been in the front person, so doing panel discussions and doing all those things was a shout out to my community because they forced me to do that stuff.

Speaker 3:

They, you know, I'm a very competitive person and one time a couple of my members were like joking on me like cory, we need you know. They were telling me they need me to do this to help promote what we're doing with the community and they were just cracking jokes on me and I was just like, all right, let me show them, prove you guys wrong, and you know. But that's the part I'm still trying to get used to is the I don't want to say celebrity, but the recognition as far as people say, you know, putting you on a pedestal to a degree, because all I'm trying to do is just solve problems.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, well, talk to me about the problems that you're trying to solve, because I know that. You know there is a huge landscape of podcasts. There is some who can get sponsors, some who can't, but people you know. You're obviously helping solve the how to get started and helping shepherd people through that process and then do production for them. But why did you find it important to create safe spaces?

Speaker 3:

for Black podcasters specifically, all right. So for me, like I said, when I started to do my deep dive into podcasting, you know, like many people, I joined all the Facebook groups that I could find. I joined a lot of different. You know I would go to different events and stuff and you know you notice diversity is an issue, especially when you go physically, go to certain places. You know the people of color in the room are just almost non-existent, which is fine. You know I won't say it's fine, but it's understandable, right. So what I started having an issue was and it could have been me reading into facebook, you know, because you don't get context or you don't hear voices, you don't hear tone, tonality and stuff when you're reading conversations on facebook threads. But it was like I was clearly seeing there was a disparity or philosophical, ideological disparity and conflicts in regards to how people saw how podcasting should be done. I would see black people asking questions in some of these groups and it would be like, well, just do this and do that and it's like this is how you do it and I'm sitting here like one. There's cultural differences. Two, there's economic differences. So, telling somebody to go and buy a $500 mic and then not I won't say criticizing or ridiculing, but making them feel small for not being able to, was kind of. You know, it's kind of like the elitism in podcasting right, especially from those people who are successful in it a lot of times. And I was just like it rubbed me the wrong way. And I was talking to a friend about it one time and she was like well, corey, just start your own. And you know, challenge accepted, you ain't got to challenge me more than once. I'm like I'm ready to do it. So it was just.

Speaker 3:

And then as we started the group, we was kind of trying to figure out what it should be about and everything. And I've started realizing from interacting with members in the community why they needed a safe space, because a lot of them felt alone. I've had so many people tell me they've hired producers, you know, from other communities. They're telling them how to do a podcast and like. But I don't want to do that, I don't want like, especially like we're code switching. I don't want to have to code switch. I do that all day in my life, I do that at work I want to talk about and there was conflicts there. So it was like you know, you start realizing like there's these little microaggressions, these little things that are going on that people just accept or aren't aware of. So I was like, well, it's creating space, plus some people I agreed with, like investing in your audio and building quality content, but it's just the delivery of it. So we had to figure out a place where you felt safe, where we could have a conversation in a way that I can explain it to you, in a way that you would be more receptive to it. So it was like a lot of mixture of different things that made me try to figure out how to make this community work.

Speaker 3:

That was four years ago, no-transcript.

Speaker 3:

I was like here we have an opportunity in a brand new industry. That's at the beginning of his infancy that we can actually play a role in producing. Because I always saw it with the music industry Once the money levels out, then they turn towards the Black community and say, hey, you guys have been doing this with bare minimum, making money. And that's when, like what happened with hip hop, you saw that in hip hop. Then, all of a sudden, now hip hop is hip hop saved the music industry for the past 30 years. So you know, I was like that was my. One of my main concerns with the podcast industry too is like once they figure out the money when it starts to dry up, or the levels out or plateaus, I wanted to make sure we were prepared for when that happened, so that we don't suffer, you know, lose our IPs and lose our ideas and stuff, and we have an opportunity now to really be in the ground floor and have a seat at the, a true seat at the table, as people say.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, oh, I just love that aspect of making sure people stick together and they feel that they have a place. When I started my other podcast I didn't realize until about three years in, like oh, I have an audience and I have this and I have that, but I was still.

Speaker 2:

I still thought of myself as very much an outsider and didn't realize that there was such a big opportunity with it, and even though I sent some of the Facebook groups and stuff right. But you have to really figure out who's for you and stick together and make sure that you're helping each other learn and it's not a competition. It is something everybody can go together and figure out how to get bigger, how to get better, how to monetize, and that's something that I think is really important. It is something I love about the podcast community. I feel like I think, for the most part, people are very welcoming, but I do think I mean, I use a Blue Yeti mic. It didn't cost me that much, right? I'm still using it 400 episodes later for that podcast and 30, 40 to 50 episodes for the USC podcast, and it does me fine. So, yeah, thinking about that like helping make sure people understand it doesn't have to be really expensive to start this and you have a voice and you should share it and we're going to help you that's really amazing.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, when I talk to my clients, when I talk to people, they see my setup or they see some setups and I tell people, when you see my setup, you have to understand this is my business. Like I, a lot of what I have, what I brought and set up was for me to be able to do mobile recording for clients. So you know you can't see everything, but you know I have racks of stuff just in case. Like I try to think of all scenarios or I've been in scenarios like, oh, I needed this. So I go out and make sure I have this, just in case. I get into that scenario again and I tell people sometimes like you don't need what I have, you don't need what you see. You know everybody wants to get the SM7B mic and I'm like I started with a mic that, an electric voice mic that I got for $50 at Guitar Center. It was really too good of a mic because it was picking up like I used to live by JFK. So we'll pick up JFK, we'll pick up the buses that come down my block and my room was in the back of the house and the route. You know I'm hearing this stuff as I'm recording and I'm like, okay, this might be a little too good, you know so, it was a hundred dollar mic, you know so. It was like you don't have to go crazy on the equipment, you don't have to go crazy with what you see everybody doing. And that's one of my main things when I talk to people is it's like one reason why I like podcasting is there are things that work right. There are foundational things that work. Everybody does it, it's just. It works right. It's just no matter what, it's not debatable. But then there's so many people doing so many different things outside of the box. Right, as far as equipment goes, you know what recording equipment, recording techniques, cameras Right, you know it's always people of their brands, but a camera is a camera. Right, you can use your iPhone. You know you can use your Android phone. Most of these phones I just saw I forgot his name. They just announced there's a director. He's filming an entire movie on iphone 15s. Wow, so you have the power. Like, you don't have to go and buy a three thousand dollar camera to do something to have a good podcast or a good video on your podcast. You have people filming movie, big budget movies with their iphone, with iphone. So it's just.

Speaker 3:

I think the biggest thing, like we used to say in music is you know you can have the fanciest studio, but if you don't know how to use the tools it doesn't mean anything, right? So I think a lot of pop people in this industry just need to realize you have a lot of tools already there. It's just a matter of figuring out how to master it and make it work for you and where you're at and I think that's the welcoming part about podcasting is a lot of people try to. We try to meet people where you're at and give you advice from where you're at and get you from point A to point B. So I think that's it is a very welcoming community.

Speaker 3:

And I just want to add that's where, like over the past four years, I started changing our rhetoric a lot of how we will do things. We're more collaborative now. So we work with different groups. We're the Black Podcast Association and one of my biggest challenges right now is we. I do events and stuff and I tell everybody all are welcome and it's like you know some white people like, oh, I didn't know if this was for me and I'm like this is for podcasting, even though, through our organization. This is for podcasting, because, at the end of the day, if we all come together and get to know each other as people, and you might find your next opportunity or collaborative effort, that will take you guys to the next level, and I really so. I now say we're ambassadors to podcasting, so I really am trying to push the community in that level of being ambassadors and representing podcasting across the board, not just as black people, but as human beings and as professionals in this space.

Speaker 2:

Wonderful. So, for instance, I could join the Black Podcasters Association, even though I'm Asian, just to show my support and also because I love meeting other podcasters who are just as passionate about this.

Speaker 3:

There are conversations that happen and I think one of the biggest problems and you, being Asian, you understand this is people think we're monoliths and we're not right. The stereotypes that make people think that, oh, all Asians or all Spanish people or Latinos or all Black people are all the same. And one thing about podcasting, you know that has helped me is learn is that we're not. We have people who have gardening podcasts. We have people who talk about Black topics right, black-related topics. We have people who have gardening podcasts. We have people who talk about black topics right, black related topics. We have people who just love what they're talking about and it is good to have people come in and hear those perspectives.

Speaker 3:

I will tell anybody who enjoys any organization that's directed to a specific group of people, you're there as an ally. You're not there to change anything and you know there might be hard conversations going on in that group that you may feel a certain way about, but that's not a conversation for you. Sometimes, you know, and you have to respect that. But at the end of the day, we're all trying to work with each other and that's why I say I'm collaborative. I work with Latino podcasters, I work with Asian podcasters. We support each other. It's been great.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that support in that community, I think, is what's going to help us stay strong in this field. I don't know if you have the statistics or the number of, because I don't even know if I could find that information on how many in the landscape of podcasters are podcasts run by Black podcasters.

Speaker 3:

I think the closest thing I've seen was what Edison Research does. Every year they do their podcast report. I haven't looked at it in a while but I know on average I know the average from when I used to read it the last time I looked at it. Over the years it's been between, from the people that they polled, percent are black and latino podcasters. In comparison to the industry. Um, I don't know if they've added other ethnic groups in there or other races into that conversation yet, like I haven't seen the one they put out this year since early this year and usually I do go and reference it a lot because it helps me to understand how to talk to people and show people like this is the growth of podcasting. One of the things we did used to look forward to was the black podcast Listener Report that Edison Research used to do, but they haven't done that and you know I've been talking with them about trying to figure out how we can get that done again.

Speaker 3:

That's the one thing about the industry I think we need to work better on as an industry is making more data accessible about things like that, because it's going to be important not only for ourselves and which is part of the problem of monetization and discoverability is that these companies don't know how to deal with our communities. They don't truly understand our communities and it's hard, when the numbers are not really out there, to try, when you try to pitch them and show them that there is places where this will make sense for you, and it's hard when you don't have numbers and that data to back your pitch. So you know, that is a problem. We do need to help. We need to help figure out and I think collectively, as the you know, bipoc groups, right, or?

Speaker 3:

Or people of color groups, we do need to figure out how to come together and support each other with these, because they're not cheap to do, you know, and unless we're doing it, sometimes these companies, unless we show these companies why it's important for them to do it, so, which means sometimes you just have to do it yourself, which is why, like I, my hands are so many places, so I'm just like I'm just going to do it myself. Like you know, we'll just figure it out as we go along. But you know, some of these types of data collections cost like hundreds of thousands of dollars, so that and that's where things get a little complicated. So I always put a call out to data scientists out there, especially the kids in college and stuff. If you want a project you want to work on, put on your resume, hit me up because we can figure something out.

Speaker 2:

Love that. I'm actually going to definitely put that into the LinkedIn group for the DMM students. I wanted to ask then, because there's also the power of the collective in terms of being able having a network where you can go to an advertiser and say here's the power, here's how many podcasts we have, here's the data, the number, and so that sometimes helps to create that reach that advertisers might be looking for. Have you, are there any that you recommend? Are there some networks like that that exist that can help?

Speaker 3:

So you know the power network is the collective. You know every network has their different models. So you got to. If you're looking for a network or you're looking to get it, you know for that particular type of model you have to make sure you understand the model of the network. There's a Chris Colbert at DCP. He's doing the Black Coalition, the Black Podcast Coalition, which he's been working on with support. I've been helping him with that which he's been working on. We're a supporter. I've been helping him with that. He's been going around pulling all the different podcasts, networks and podcasters who have over 10,000 downloads together to come into one organization. He's working with Barometer on that.

Speaker 3:

I think the project's called Mosaic as well. Everybody's working together. What they're trying to do is take these numbers collectively and go to the more bigger brands and advertisers saying, hey, we have a million downloads a month. Can we start pitching to these national brands, the bigger brands, because we have a high rate of engagement. I know black podcasters have a very high rate of engagement when it comes to advertisers and sponsors that are on it, especially if it's a black owned company or black, black related or black supporting company, it has a very high rate. So there are people who are actually out here working on it. I think you know some networks work with they own the podcast, so it's more there for them and how their business model. So if you're looking for something like that, you got to really scrutinize the business model, ask questions, make sure you understand how it works. In regards to you know, sponsorships and advertisements through that.

Speaker 3:

But I know Chris, what he's doing at the Black Podcast Coalition is one of the bigger ones that I know of. There's Rita Batista who does for Latinos as well. I don't want to say the wrong name, but you can look up Rita. She's very known. She's been working on that for I remember it used to be a network. I don't know if it still is a network, but I know she's been working on that for in the Latino space, the Latinx space, it's people so unoffensive which they were, the Latino, latino, latinx space. I know she's been very spearheading that. So those are the two major people I know that are doing it in those communities. I know there's other people out there. I just can't think of it off the top of my head.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, but it is great to know that people are being proactive, that they're seeing that this is a market opportunity and we need to start it ourselves rather than let somebody else, like many other industries.

Speaker 3:

I mean, I'm working behind the scenes of building my own network for my association, because we have a community of people, all levels of podcasting, all levels of success, and for me the solving the problem monetization is. You know, you guys are here, let me figure out how to. You know, it's a little bit for self-survival too right, because we're a dues paying organization. So I look at it like well, if I can bring you guys money through our network, you can pay your dues. But if it's also I can bring you money to help you offset some of your costs and help you hire an editor or you know, it's a whole ecosystem. I'm trying to build what we're doing, but it is, like you know, I'm even trying to do it myself, trying to figure out how I can make it work for my members. You know I can make it work for me personally, but I want to make sure that it's something that's worth my members' time and that it's worth the time and investment that we put into it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely, that's really important to it. Yeah, absolutely, that's really important. What would you say is one of the biggest surprises that you've found since creating Black Pod News, deciding to have your full service business and having the podcast association as well?

Speaker 3:

My biggest surprise as far as me personally, or just in the industry.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, both. Personally, I can't believe I've gotten this my biggest surprise as far as me personally or just in the industry?

Speaker 3:

yeah, I both. Personally, I can't believe I've gotten this far. It's like it was just a wild, crazy idea and it's like you're becoming a name in it. You know, it's like, like I said, I was just trying to solve problems. So me personally was like how do we solve this problem? How do I solve these problems that I'm seeing or I'm hearing coming from other people? And it was just just like it's just turning into like these ideas, and I think for me it's been.

Speaker 3:

Sometimes you don't know your resilience and who you are until you like till your back is to the wall. And there's been plenty of times where I was like I don't know if my company is going to make it another month. You know, because you know it's just. You have your's kind of changed how I see and view things in regards to like I don't panic as much over money, and you know it's like OK, you just got to figure out how to work this out and find it Industry wise.

Speaker 3:

I shouldn't say this, but I was surprised by the immediate support that we got when we first launched and how so many people just reached out and were like I love this idea, how can I help? You know, part of the trauma of being Black in America is, you know, you're so used to getting to being judged and stereotyped and getting pushed back, simply just for, you know, having these kind of ideas. That I wasn't expecting. You know, at first I wasn't expecting the support. I just had a very isolationist idea, like you know what we're just no matter what anybody says, we're going to make this work and we'll just figure it out internally and figure it out for ourselves. But you know, from day one, just the support was just like this is amazing, thank you, you know, and a lot of those people have turned into friends now, so I love it.

Speaker 2:

Fantastic. Where do you see yourself and the various business endeavors going? Next, you talked about starting a podcast network. What else do you think is something that you want to birth into the world?

Speaker 3:

So one thing you learn about me is if I'm going to do something, you know saying go big or go home. Right, I'm not going to. Just my goal is to turn the BPA into a global organization, which I mean technically we are. We have members from all over the world, but I want it to be a household name. Like you know the whole idea because my background was in music, I looked at it like as an ASCAP or BMI type of organization originally and I want us to be on that part where we're also like part of think tanks. We're part of trying to figure out how to make podcasting move into the next level.

Speaker 3:

The same thing with Black Pod News. I want it to be. In my mind, it's a trade paper, so I want it to grow and I want it to be a place where you know, if you want to learn more about the black podcasting sphere and the people in it, this is where to go. Like this is we're going to be your number one resource for it, and that's how I look at things is like how can I position myself to be an industry leader or how can I position what we're doing to be industry leaders for? Not only for our own sake, but for the purpose of the whole entire industry, to make sure that it grows, because you can't ignore the voices of people of color. There's other countries that podcasting is growing in and we have to be able to stay unified and to be able to bring people together so that the industry as a whole can benefit.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely Amazing. I feel like this is a really good intro to this conversation and we'll definitely have further conversations and journalism, pr, communication, social, digital, but also to the entire you know alumni groups, like all of the different constituents we have that are part of the USC community that these are the conversations we need to be having. Access D&I are very you know. They're baked in goals and things that we talk about in class and love it when people share various experiences they've had and are able to connect with each other or learn different perspectives. And that's, corey, what you're doing today is bringing a really great perspective. I think a lot of people probably wouldn't even realize that there's a black podcasters now in association and all the things that you're putting, that you're either doing right now or that you're creating.

Speaker 2:

So I wanted to see, do you? Of course we're going to link to the Black Podcasters Association in the show notes and I know you have an offer for our students, our aspiring podcast students, that they can yeah, I'll throw in something for you guys.

Speaker 3:

So we're in the process of moving to a new platform. So I've just the process of moving to a new platform. So I've just been working on that on the community platform. But, again, part of what I'm doing is I want to connect people and we have so much great people. We just announced the Legends Award, black Podcasting Awards and Afros and Audio, and they just announced the winners. So, and our members voted for those people, and those three people who won those awards are some amazing producers in this industry that you'd never heard of, but they've been doing this for a long time and they've been around a lot of big projects and they named for themselves within the industry. So being able to allow students to connect with these people or your students would be great. I'm willing to give you guys a free year of membership in the community. We have a free tier, but I'll give you a code Allow the people that take your course to join for a year.

Speaker 2:

Amazing. Thank you.

Speaker 3:

I'll give you the link for that and everything.

Speaker 2:

OK, and for those of you listening, I will share that. You know how to reach me, either through my USC email address or on LinkedIn. Corey, do you have any final thoughts? That you just want to make sure is something you're really imparting to the audience today.

Speaker 3:

I think the biggest thing for me is everybody has a voice that you should not be afraid to share with the world. There's going to be things people say that we don't like, that we don't always agree with. But I think sometimes I've always been one person I still want to hear it, I still want to be able to see the perspective of other people. But what I will tell you is, if you're planning on coming to the podcast industry, you're going to see a lot of people doing things that work for them and a lot of times people try to copy or we try to mimic or imitate what those things work and then, when it doesn't work for us, we kind of get discouraged. I want to tell people don't get discouraged.

Speaker 3:

The beautiful thing about podcasting is you should be thinking out the box. And it's hard when you're doing everything yourself sometimes, but you should always keep reminding yourself how can I find my way to do this that works for me? And I think that's the most important part of the success of podcasting for people to be successful in podcasting and I talk to my clients about it it's like okay, I hear you, but how can we make this work for you and your audience. And the second part is even though you're creative and this is your thing, it's not about you. It's about your audience, Right.

Speaker 3:

And if it's about you, then just go in the bathroom, look in the mirror or just talk to yourself, Right? Or just talk amongst your friends. But if you're going to come into the space, people are coming to listen to your perspectives and listen to you. But you don't have a show without an audience. So always remember it's about your audience first. You're the creative, you're putting a part of you into this, but always consider your audience first and just try to figure that out. And that's where people like myself and other producers and stuff come to help you figure out how to shape that voice if you're struggling in that area.

Speaker 2:

Fantastic. Thank you so much. I'm so glad we got to have this conversation.

Speaker 3:

I've been looking forward to it I was like yay. We got to have this conversation. I've been looking forward to it.

Speaker 2:

I was like fantastic and I just thank you to everybody in the community who is listening to this episode of Mediascape Insights from Digital Changemakers. I'll be back again, or my co-host, joseph Ataya, will be back with another amazing guest to share their journey, their space, with us, and until then, I will make sure I have Corey's information up for everybody and, corey, thank you again for being here and giving us some of your time today.

Speaker 1:

To learn more about the Master of Science in Digital Media Management program, visit us on the web at dmmuscedu.

People on this episode

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Anika Jackson

Host
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Joseph Itaya

Host