MEDIASCAPE: Insights From Digital Changemakers
Join hosts Joseph Itaya and Anika Jackson as they dive into conversations with leaders and changemakers shaping the future of digital media. Each episode explores the frontier of multimedia, artificial intelligence, marketing, branding, and communication, spotlighting how emerging digital trends and technologies are transforming industries across the globe.
MEDIASCAPE is proudly sponsored by USC Annenberg’s Master of Science in Digital Media Management (MSDMM) program. This online master’s program is designed to prepare practitioners to understand the evolving media landscape, make data-driven and ethical decisions, and build a more equitable future by leading diverse teams with the technical, artistic, analytical, and production skills needed to create engaging content and technologies for the global marketplace. Learn more or apply today at https://dmm.usc.edu.
MEDIASCAPE: Insights From Digital Changemakers
Shyam Balsé's Vision for TV's Future: Navigating Digital Disruption and Innovation
What if the TV industry as we know it is on the verge of a revolutionary shift? Join us for an eye-opening conversation with Shyam Balsé, the acclaimed producer behind ABC's "Extreme Makeover: Home Edition." With his rich background, from an internship at National Geographic to honing his skills at USC's graduate film program, Shyam offers a compelling narrative on adapting to the digital disruption fueled by the rise of streaming platforms like Disney Plus, Apple TV, and more. Listen in to glean insights from Shyam as he candidly discusses the uncertain future of television and the strategies he employs to navigate these turbulent times.
As we trace the evolution of storytelling in TV, Shyam shares his perspective on the transition from traditional broadcast to the dominance of digital media. Discover how this shift is reshaping the landscape, influencing everything from production budgets to the fierce competition for network deals. Through anecdotes and examples, we explore the dynamics between networks and production companies and the mounting pressure to meet the ever-changing expectations of both viewers and networks. This episode sheds light on the challenges and opportunities that lie ahead for those who dare to create content in a rapidly evolving industry.
Beyond the technicalities of TV production, Shyam delves into the art of storytelling and leadership, emphasizing the necessity of emotional connection and personal investment. He shares poignant insights on choosing projects and collaborators wisely, stressing the importance of passion and personal fulfillment for sustaining a vibrant career. The episode concludes with a focus on leadership through empowerment and collaboration, where Shyam articulates the value of nurturing supportive relationships and fostering creativity within teams. Whether you're a seasoned professional or an aspiring creator, this conversation promises a wealth of knowledge and inspiration.
This podcast is proudly sponsored by USC Annenberg’s Master of Science in Digital Media Management (MSDMM) program. An online master’s designed to prepare practitioners to understand the evolving media landscape, make data-driven and ethical decisions, and build a more equitable future by leading diverse teams with the technical, artistic, analytical, and production skills needed to create engaging content and technologies for the global marketplace. Learn more or apply today at https://dmm.usc.edu.
Welcome to Mediascape insights from digital changemakers, a speaker series and podcast brought to you by USC Annenberg's Digital Media Management Program. Join us as we unlock the secrets to success in an increasingly digital world. Welcome everybody. Today we are blessed to have one of my longest friends, one of my favorite people, the person that I went through film school with and then started a company with directly out of school. We are joined today by also a fellow Trojan, sean Balsey. Sean has been a producer, a director, a writer and now, most recently, a showrunner for the hit ABC show Extreme Home Makeover Extreme Makeover.
Speaker 2:Home Edition.
Speaker 1:Thank you, sean. I knew I was going to get my wording wrong. I said all right, sean, welcome. Thank you so much for being with us today.
Speaker 2:Great to be here.
Speaker 1:I'm excited to talk to you guys. All right, fantastic. Sean. Why don't you help us get to know you just a little bit before we dive into the other things that we're going to discuss today? Tell us what first got you your start in the world of producing and storytelling frankly.
Speaker 2:It's been a long time ago that it all started.
Speaker 2:You know there was seeds of it in my early childhood and growing up but I think it all came to kind of a reality of me being.
Speaker 2:You know that this was a professional career, getting into TV and film About 25 years ago when I was got into an internship for National Geographic Television, which at the time was making feature length documentaries about amazing things around the world, and I went and worked with them for a summer as an intern after college and then that led to getting into the unscripted world which back then was like a lot of documentaries, and then that led to the travel channel and discovery era where you know it was more travelogue stuff and that was right around.
Speaker 2:Then is when reality TV that we know today started and then everything became about reality TV, started working in reality TV as a producer and in the field and post and you know that fast forward I took a stint out to go to film school in the graduate program at USC and met Joseph yourself, my very good friend and colleague, and some other great people and really got seeped in, I think, the techniques of storytelling that I had been doing professionally but didn't really dive into as an art form, and that's where we learned a lot more about storytelling and script writing and narrative work, which at that point I hadn't really done. So I got into narrative and then you know, like Joseph you said, we started company, we did commercials, we got into films and then now I'm pretty exclusively back in the TV broadcast reality TV world.
Speaker 1:Fantastic. Thanks so much, Sean, for taking us back on that awesome trip down memory lane, so to speak. But it's great because where you are contextually really helps our students understand how to frame this conversation that we're going to have. We have a whole bunch of students in our program across lots of different industries, but some people are very focused on entertainment and they're focused on TV, and we talk a lot about how important it is to specialize and to really find your niche both. That's just what's going to lead to a lot of happiness in life, but then also success in your career.
Speaker 1:So, as we talk now about TV, the question I want to ask you is about digital. You've been in and around networks and network programming for a long time and you're doing it now, but we've all seen this incredible rise and disruption because of digital. We see the rise of streamers, all of these different platforms. We see Peacock, we see Apple TV, we see Disney Plus and Paramount, and I mean I could keep going and going and going right. So can you talk a little bit about how you've seen that change happening and then also what you see on the horizon in the middle of all this disruption?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's, we're right in the middle of it, so the future is unknown. I think maybe a lot of people have a lot of ideas, but how this all shakes out, tbd, the disruption is real right now. I think we're. We knew the writing was on the wall that essentially digital media as a place where eyeballs go had been brewing for, you know, decades. At this point, you know we knew this was a growing place that would draw away audience and we saw it in slowly declining ratings on broadcast and across cable and traditional television. But there was no real marketplace essentially for advertisers. Like advertisers, if they wanted Big Bang for their buck, they'd go to television, television, linear television, was where most people were watching. So I think, as that slow wave of digital rose into what it is today, which is a powerhouse and a very clear place where advertising dollars can go and actually maybe even more attractive place for advertising dollars to go along with a growing number of people who want to watch it. And now there's multiple generations of consumers who only do digital and don't even really get or watch or care about linear tv. So like the tide has now shifted where you know broadcast tv and linear, it's still a massive, very lucrative business. There are still lots of people who watch it. There's still generations of people who only watch that. So it's going to have a slow fade out. You know how fast slow is, you know, depends on who you talk to, but that's where we're at right now. Slow is, you know, depends on who you talk to, but that's where we're at right now.
Speaker 2:You know, and what that really means for me in the broadcast TV world and linear TV is that we are trying to make shows, like we did, which are big, you know, spectacle shows that appeal to mainstream America. You want to hit all the demographics. When you're on broadcast TV you have to hit everybody. It's not niche, but there are, you know, a fifth, maybe a sixth of the audience watching now and that means there's a lot less advertising dollars now, which trickles down to a lot less budgets and a lot less resources to make these shows. So we're still trying to make these mega shows that get, you know, great viewership and still appease the advertisers. But it's having to be done a lot tighter, tighter budgets and all the way through is harder to get these shows off the ground because, you know, there's also less airtime that's being dedicated to primetime network television. Like you know, there's sports now that do better. There's all these legacy shows that just never go away. They occupy, you know, entire day, nights of the week, and so like you're really competing for these few open slots every week and trying to break through.
Speaker 2:So you know the future is clear. Like the linear TV is going to go away. You know it will disappear at some point. But you know, my big question is does that happen during my career, after my career, or is like, should I be already, you know, sending my resume out to the digital media companies? Nobody knows that. I think ai's sped everything up a lot because and also the whole shift to streaming sped everything up because you know we're just finding it's easiered everything up because you know we're just finding it's easier to make content. You know anybody can do it and they're pulling numbers that back in the day you know are rivaling TV show numbers and Nielsen ratings. So that shift is there. But there's a lot of people, me included, that still make a living and broadcast TV and linear TV. It's just a little bit harder.
Speaker 1:Got it. So Sham you, your most recent show and you've done a lot of shows with a network called ABC. Abc is close to us here at USC because ABC is owned by Disney and Disney is owned by Bob Iger, who is married to our Dean, you know. So we really have this ecosystem. We love Disney over here. We have a lot of Disney and Hulu employees in our and ABC employees in our program. But you can you explain Endemol, the production company, and then ABC, the network, so that some of our students here who are thinking about this move into entertainment and into TV can understand how that works.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so traditionally network television was just a distributor. They were a buyer, right, they didn't make anything. They just they have the purse strings and they have all the data and the information that the advertisers want and they just go through and basically pick and choose programming that they want on their air that will appeal to their advertisers. So they didn't make anything back in the day. So you would need production companies, which are basically entities that take full legal and physical responsibility for this production, and you know they're given a set amount, which is the agreed upon budget, and then it's on that production company to make the show and deliver it. Now Endemol is a production company that does that and there are. That model is still the I would maybe dominant I don't have all the metrics on this, but I would say still probably a little bit the dominant model that most TVs made by a production company that is just has sold or has been contracted out by this network, the buyer, to make the TV show that they want.
Speaker 2:Now the creative relationship between the production company and the network is different at every different network, you know. So they weigh in, they have to be happy, they, the buyer, the network has to be happy with the product If they. You know if you sold them something and that they are waiting for and you show them the show and it's not what they wanted. It's on you slash the production company to make it right. All of it is based on. You know your reputation hangs on everything you do. So like if the production company doesn't deliver and they get a bad reputation or can't do it, they're out. So, like you know, production companies go above and beyond to make the buyer happy, like anything and everything, because it's a very competitive market and even though there's a lot less production companies now because for various economic reasons, they still depend on you know ABC wanting to come to Endemol to buy something versus Fremantle or Magical Elves or Mark Burnett. You know like they have their pick of the litter, especially if the IP that they want to make belongs to them or that they are dishing out.
Speaker 2:Now, in the case of Endemol, which is owned by Banajay, which is a big, mega, global production company, that is scripted and unscripted. Now they own formats inscripted and unscripted. So if you want a format of theirs, you have to hire Banajay or their subsidiary company. So in this case, endemol shine owns the format for extreme makeover, home edition, and avc wanted it back on the air. So they came to endemol and said, hey, let's get this going again, let's reboot it, and so that's how they came in it.
Speaker 2:But like, you can't make this show without endemol. So so that's one way, endemol why it's a powerhouse today, and band of j2, it's just a huge library of formats, global formats, that if you want to make a show or remake it or reboot it, or there's some show in korea that's doing well or europe you want to bring it over, the company that owns those formats are in business. You know it's a different business model than the companies that come and just have to, don't have a library and have to pitch original shows. You know that's it's harder. These days everyone wants pre proven IP, so it's easier to get across the green light than the original idea that everybody has to take a chance on.
Speaker 1:Boy. That's a whole different subject altogether, and it's one of the things I want to ask you. So I was going to save it for the end, but we might as well start with it for just a second right now. And that's a quick question about storytelling. Storytelling is a big, huge bucket of topics and here in this program our students are learning about the power of story to communicate a message to an audience. But these aren't fictional stories. Usually these are stories about businesses and about products, but at the crux of it, it's still about storytelling and getting a message across. Now I've given these guys some of my best tidbits of wisdom that you and I have gleaned along the way and all the projects that we've worked on, but you're one of the best storytellers that I know. What do you think are the one, two or three hallmarks of what make great storytelling and that you're looking for when you develop or when you're getting involved in any show?
Speaker 2:The hallmarks of storytelling big big question. There are certain tenants of storytelling that probably all your students are learning being at USC and you know there's structure to storytelling. You know like simple things like beginning, middle and end and protagonists. That's overcoming odds with certain things. There's those elements which I won't get into but I think, for me personally, what I've seen and you know, maybe starting in film school, when you're really experimenting with like who are you as a storyteller, I think anything that I wasn't connected to personally failed. I mean anything I was connected to personally, meaning emotionally connected to that story, whatever it was, whatever structure it was or whatever did.
Speaker 2:Better, you know, and I've certainly seen that in my career, is that I, you know, being a producer, you produce. What the job is, you know A lot of time you're hiding on these shows and that wasn't your show and your baby. But you have to make it happen and you can do it. But when I was emotionally invested in those stories, it was I was all in and so like for this, for Extreme Makeover, home Edition, as a showrunner, like the first thing I look for and actually the whole process starts with finding the story like it's all based on a family and I'm you know it's me and the casting director and we talk for hours upon hours upon hours about these hundreds of possible stories and we look for these ones that shine through, because once I have the story, then all of a sudden the entire creative structure around how to tell that story starts to fall into place and that's what gets exciting for me.
Speaker 2:So, whereas if it was just like something you're doing because you have to do it or you're not that connected to it, it gets very, I don't know. A lot of TV doesn't have emotional charge and you know it's fine, it fills the airwaves. You know, tv serves a lot of different purposes for a lot of different people. Sometimes it's just to be sound in the room while they're doing the rest of their life. I, as a storyteller, have to. I am most charged when I'm invested emotionally and that's what I look for and that's hard to put a word on. What is that? I think, other than it's just my own personal thing, my own personality and that person's story and the time, and you know the kind of zeitgeist of whatever's around you in the world, like it just connects and that's what.
Speaker 1:I look for. So I think that that dovetails perfectly into the next question that I'd love to ask you, which has to do with leadership and priorities. The topic that we're exploring right now has to do with decision-making and leadership in complex situations when there are competing priorities. And so when we think about story and you were you were mentioning like the emotion and what makes you care and what moves your heart and your soul and makes you feel invested. I have a feeling that that's one of the things you know.
Speaker 1:When, when we talk about a mission statement within a company and being a mission driven leader, that when you're on a set or when you're working with all the different teams and different units, and then you've got the financial guys and you've got the network and those executives and everybody that's underneath your leadership, that in those situations, my guess is it probably comes back to that story when you have to decide do we do this or do we do that? What's going to serve the story more? But I'm maybe putting words in your mouth, but I'd love we've even talked about mission-driven leadership. So what do you think about competing priorities and how that relates back to story?
Speaker 2:You know running a big show and you know being a, whether you're the director, or on TV it's the executive producer, showrunner, or or you're just the department head. You know being a, whether you're the director, or on TV it's the executive producer, showrunner, or or you're just that department head. You know there's, in terms of the complexity of the decision-making, extremely complex. You know, I'm married to a physician. I don't think it's that complex. This isn't life or death and the decisions don't have that kind of finality. But you know, there's a lot of pressure in the moment to satisfy a lot of different people and you have to be on your toes to do all that. I think what it takes to be that level of leader and be able to, you know, get through it, I would say, is one be ready. You know, like, do all be invested in it, like know as much as you possibly can so that your instincts are right more time than not right. So, because you know the material so well, or the story and this does tie a little bit into story is one aspect of it If you know the story so well, you're going to know should we do it that way, or someone's got a crazy idea hey, let's see if we should do that in the house for this family. You're like like no, that has nothing to do with what they want. Maybe that's a great spectacle for you know the tv show big surprise moment but they themselves will probably not be happy about that. It will read on camera. Let's not do that. Instead, let's do this thing and we know that that connects to who they are and you can make that decision. So I think your instinct, when you're really steeped in your story or your project and you really have invested and done the time and thought about it all, then your instincts are kind of right. You know, like you know what's right for the show or not. So that's one thing and I think great leaders lead by instinct because it's instinct and preparation. And then there's going to be things that you haven't decided on. You don't know.
Speaker 2:You know, and I think that level of leadership is you surround yourself with all the people you trust to advise you and, as you know, a producer and director you have all these department heads and like I don't know how to build a house yet. And director, you have all these department heads and like I don't know how to build a house. Yet I'm running a show about building a house. A lot of decisions are about how that house should be built and, like, I'm also not an interior designer, but a lot of decisions are about interior design. So I have these great people who know it very well, and then what we do is collaborate. So I'm coming in as, like, looking at the show and the story, and like, all right, well, you're making that decision about the house, how does it tie back in the story? And then we collaborate and they, they see my point of view, I see theirs, and that's the great collaboration. So collaboration for me is key to leadership, because now that's my style of leadership too.
Speaker 2:There are leaders who are these, you know auteurs, or you know one man bands or one woman bands, and they have all the answers and they can do it. I think James Cameron is a great example, like he doesn't almost need anybody else to make a decision, because this guy, at least by lore, seems to know every right decision and has proven it time and time again. Right decision and has proven it time and time again. Like whether he's a machine or a robot or just that great, like, whatever it is great on him. I can't do that and for the most part I haven't seen many people succeed with that model.
Speaker 2:When they do succeed, obviously it's quite well, but for the most part, collaboration, working with other artists, you respect, and then in terms of the like you know, competing priorities, you know, you, it's a political game, like you really, as in my position I felt more like a mayor than a producer.
Speaker 2:A lot of times I would have to go around and shake hands and give rah-rah speeches and a lot of times it was the same speech to rah-rah-rah up, and you know, get crew morale, cause you've got the whole crew on this side of you. Or I'm pitching up, and you know, get crew morale because you've got the whole crew on this side of you. Or I'm pitching up to you know, the various people at ABC to sell them a vision of the show, and you've got to. You know, champion the show and all that, and you're just constantly pitching and kind of hyping and assaging everybody's interests and concerns and balancing that and that's just. You've got to know who these people are and know what actually is making them take. So you can like kind of see, read behind the lines, if you know, so you could play those politics, but that's a part of it as well.
Speaker 1:Boy, my next bullet point question that I was going to ask you was actually about collaboration. And then you went right there and talked about it. I've been on film sets with you many, many times. I was supporting you when you made a film that you were directing in India and all the chaos that was in Mumbai, india sense of collaboration, that you are not a dictator, that you ask a lot of questions, that you have a sense of the vision and you say, hey, we just need to get up there.
Speaker 1:But everybody has their own great ideas and skill sets that they're going to bring that you're always listening to. So I know I've just seen that the incredible amount of listening and empowering is the way that you lead a team and, frankly, you don't stand up here and say I'm the leader and the rest of you are followers. It's much more like you're the Pied Piper and there's a whole bunch of people and you're like, hey, let's just go and do this, let's go do this thing together. Is that something that you consciously do, sham, when you're working with people, to empower them and to be so, you know, encouraging and gracious, or is that something that you just just comes naturally? I don't know. Tell me about that.
Speaker 2:Thanks for saying that. I do feel I am aware that I do that and it is a conscious choice. I think it is a little bit my personality, you know, like I was never a believer, a practicer or a very good follower of anyone who led by fear or domination, and also I never did my best when I was never a believer, a practicer or a very good follower of anyone who led by fear or domination, and also I never did my best when I was micromanaged. So I learned a lot about the style of leadership that I wanted to be by being led by other people and in this business there's a lot of big egos and there's a lot of people who are amazing and collaborative and you quickly are able to choose your path. I think an anecdote you'd appreciate and maybe the USC folks was one of my first jobs working with Robert Zemeckis on a documentary he was doing for Showtime in between Forrest Gump and Castaway and I got to know his producer producers very well and Steve Starkey was like one of his longtime producers and I was having lunch with him at one point and he I was just like getting his like life advice and career advice and he was like early on in your career. Choose to work with people who support you and you want to be like because you can choose to work with the other people that aren't like that and that's kind of who you become or who you are affected by on a daily basis. So he's like basically, choose the people that are like you and the good people and stick with them and even if you lose opportunities because other you know opportunities come up and when you're starting and I was at the very beginning of my career at that point it's worth it. Like you will fall into basically these groups of people that then are supportive of you. And he's like I've had the amazing opportunity to do that in his whole career. He was the nicest guy Stu Starkey and, like you know, tom Hanks and Robert Zemeckis these are all good people you know and and they produce amazing stuff. And I think that stuck with me and I do that too now.
Speaker 2:Like I'm like, okay, there might be James Cameron type crews out there and they're maybe doing different things than I'm doing, but like I want to go out on my crew and go shoot something and love it and like you know when we did our rap parties or you know, our moments down there was so much like camaraderie with the crew, and that's what got me into this business in the beginning was just those feelings of being doing something amazing and doing it with a bunch of people you actually want to be around. So I intentionally lead with, you know, collaboration and and letting people be creative, and constantly, you know, like allowing people to dig in themselves creatively and bring something. That's special because and and mostly I find when I do that, not always, but a lot of times people dig in and bring something better than I would have done if I had been the dictator. It wouldn't have been as good, not even close.
Speaker 2:So I think I know people you know, at a certain point in their career, you guys, you're good, like you really have something to offer. So, like, how do you utilize them? They're not, they're a person, they're not a tool, but like, if they're a tool in your tool belt, how do you get the maximum use of that tool? Like you know, and I, to me it's creative freedom, it's feeling like you're, you know your ideas will be accepted, and feeling like you have a voice at the table. So Awesome.
Speaker 1:All right, we're coming up on the end of our discussion here and the I could ask you 20 more questions and more, but the last question I'd like to ask is the same one that I always ask people when we do these interviews and you're gracious enough to come and spend your time with us. Hit us with your one big piece of advice, your secret sauce and this could be related to being a storyteller or a leader or an executive or just a great person in life that our students can take and marinate on what is your secret sauce and secret to success in your life and in your career.
Speaker 2:It's a little bit tied to the philosophy I just shared with Steve Starkey and you know I got that same advice from other people I respected over time. But I think what it is is that you know everyone says you got to love your project. You know like especially if you're out there trying to sell it or sell script or get a movie off the ground that you got to be the most passionate person about it. But I think it's beyond just that. It's that you should definitely do what you can in the beginning to get your experience right. You need to know the different roles depending on you, know if you're a creator or a producer or whatever, understand the different things people are doing, which means take everything, take every kind of job, get as much experience as you can for that period. But then, when you start honing in on who you are as a creator or producer, only choose that and only do things you feel good about, because you end up living with these projects for years of your life, plus years into my career. You can count all those projects Like there's a resume that just says them all. These aren't infinite number of projects you get to do in your life, you know, unless you're a Spielberg or something where you know, but like you do a finite amount of projects.
Speaker 2:So when you get to the point where you can start choosing things that you love, it's not just love the things you're doing, but it's like, choose things with love.
Speaker 2:Like, choose the people you want to work with, choose that story that moves you. Choose that because you're going to work like a dog no matter what you do, but the one where you don't come out totally depleted at the end is the one that you were full of in your heart. You know that's the one that you love doing. You know, and you and work with the people who also you feel great about doing. Like when you're like, oh, we're going to go back into battle again. Like that's the person you want next to you in the battle, find those people because there's tons of projects and some of them are probably better than maybe others. And like you're going to walk away from project because maybe it's toxic, but you're going to. You're going to get way more life and more enjoyment and more happiness out of the other project, even if it's not at that scale. Or have the, you know, whatever makes it special, where everyone's like.
Speaker 2:Oh you got to do it. You know it's. I think what matters most if you want longevity is something that's not going to burn you out is find the people you love, find the projects that you believe in and you know, get comfortable and get good at it and then just keep doing that and keep pushing at that as far as you can go, because there's a easy and I think the burnout happens when everyone does everything and then you just get beat down because you're working around people or projects that don't aren't who you are and after a while there's a toll. It takes that you can't get back and people drop out. I think that's what happens. I've been doing this 25 years because at the end of the day, I really like the relationships I have. I like I've chose the projects I believe in and that I could look back and go. Mostly I'm proud of what I've done. We've all had to do some things to survive but, like, mostly I'm very proud of it and these days I only do stuff that I really believe in. So well.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for sharing your time with us and all of that wisdom and insight. I can't tell you how many times I've been in different situations and I've thought, hey, you know, there are certain aspects of your leadership style and the way that you engage with people that I've actively tried to make a part of the way that I approach things, actively tried to make a part of the way that I approach things. So you've been a great teacher for me and a great friend for a long time and you know you're one of those people that I just pray I grow old with. So thank you for being with us and for sharing all this insight. I hope everybody who's listening here is paying close attention.
Speaker 1:We talk a lot about both tangible and intangible skills. Sham shared with us some great tangible ones, but I think even more it's the sense of the intangibles, of caring about the people that you're with, listening to them, collaborating with them, getting empowerment and giving empowerment, and that's a great takeaway for me and hopefully for all of us as well. So fight on, Mr Balse, and we will see you soon. Thank you, it was a lot of fun. All right, Thanks everybody To learn more about the Master of Science in Digital Media Management program. Visit us on the web at dmmuscedu.
.jpg)
