MEDIASCAPE: Insights From Digital Changemakers
Join hosts Joseph Itaya and Anika Jackson as they dive into conversations with leaders and changemakers shaping the future of digital media. Each episode explores the frontier of multimedia, artificial intelligence, marketing, branding, and communication, spotlighting how emerging digital trends and technologies are transforming industries across the globe.
MEDIASCAPE is proudly sponsored by USC Annenberg’s Master of Science in Digital Media Management (MSDMM) program. This online master’s program is designed to prepare practitioners to understand the evolving media landscape, make data-driven and ethical decisions, and build a more equitable future by leading diverse teams with the technical, artistic, analytical, and production skills needed to create engaging content and technologies for the global marketplace. Learn more or apply today at https://dmm.usc.edu.
MEDIASCAPE: Insights From Digital Changemakers
From Concrete to Clicks: Data-Driven Growth with Build Grow Scale's Matthew Stafford
Growth doesn’t come from another hack; it comes from doing the right work in the right order. We sit down with Matthew Stafford of Build Grow Scale to explore the deceptively simple idea that changes everything: information is everywhere, but focus is scarce. Matthew takes us from his 23-year run in commercial concrete to a breakout Teespring campaign and into the data-driven system that helped brands in supplements, apparel, kitchen goods, and digital products add millions in revenue by fixing what actually blocks conversions.
We pull apart why most sites convert only 2–3% of visitors, how adding just two or three more buyers per hundred can double revenue without touching ad spend, and why the “laptop lifestyle” sells a lie: the best companies don’t hide behind email blasts—they talk to customers, publish helpful content, and keep a phone number visible. You’ll hear a practical framework for matching your messaging to real buying stages (unaware, problem aware, solution aware), the often-ignored 90-day window where 80% of buyers convert, and the small set of metrics that matter when you’re moving from $10K to $100K per month.
AI shows up as the great accelerator, not the great replacer—supercharging analysis, pattern-spotting, and testing so lean teams make better calls faster. We cover free resources and low-friction audits (“date before marriage”), why owning your audience beyond social platforms protects your funnel, and the operational difference between scaling physical versus digital products. If you’re choosing a niche, Matthew’s pick may surprise you: pets—where emotion and spend meet, and where thoughtful research beats reinvention every time.
If this helps you think clearer about your funnel, subscribe, share with a friend who’s scaling, and leave a quick review to tell us which optimization you’ll test first.
This podcast is proudly sponsored by USC Annenberg’s Master of Science in Digital Media Management (MSDMM) program. An online master’s designed to prepare practitioners to understand the evolving media landscape, make data-driven and ethical decisions, and build a more equitable future by leading diverse teams with the technical, artistic, analytical, and production skills needed to create engaging content and technologies for the global marketplace. Learn more or apply today at https://dmm.usc.edu.
We don't have information problem. We typically have a time problem. There's lots of information and it's free. We just need to know what to work on. And so we give most of our information out for free. But where the real value is, is in knowing what to work on and what to filter out so that it's not just a distraction.
SPEAKER_00:Welcome to MediaScape, Insights from Digital Changemakers, a speaker series and podcast brought to you by USC Annenberg's Digital Media Management Program. Join us as we unlock the secrets to success in an increasingly digital world.
SPEAKER_02:It's always fun to get the opportunity to reconnect with somebody I've spoken to and see how their business has gone and grown since our last conversation. Matthew Stafford, thank you for joining me on Media Escape today.
SPEAKER_01:Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_02:Of course. What you do is so vitally interesting, engaging, and important to the students in many divisions at USC. Particularly, of course, I'm teaching in the digital media management program, which sponsors this podcast, and the digital social media program. So I'd love for you to do a little introduction. Your company is Build Grow Scale. That name I think speaks for itself. But talk about your specific area of engagement.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So essentially what we do is every business that has a website where people either have to opt in or they have a shopping cart, we use data and analytics to analyze the UX UI. And that's a bunch of fancy words to say that we want to help the business owner be more profitable. So get more leads or make more sales. And the way that we do that is using data and analytics. Most people, their websites convert around 2 or 3%. That means for every hundred people that come, about two or three people take action that they want them to. And I always felt like that was very broken because I was selling things myself. And then when I started looking into the data and realizing what people were doing, that I could fix that process and get another two or three people to buy, I doubled my business with the same amount of ad spend, which uh, you know, the longer we get into digital media and the more expensive it is. So it's it's one of the largest expenses of running the business. And so fixing the website to where it talks to the customer in a way that they understand makes the business work much better.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, that's such an understatement. You're underselling the amazing things that you do for your clients and for your own business. But when you realize this for your own business, what was it that you then said, oh, I this is actually useful for everyone who's having this experience?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So I had a kind of an interesting introduction to e-commerce. And what happened was I used to do commercial concrete for about 23 years. And I went to a Tony Robbins event, and he was selling a monthly program called Money Masters, where they would send out a DVD and a booklet every month highlighting a bunch of the points from the DVD. And it was all about people that were doing online selling. And so some of them were around marketing, some of them were around, they were all around marketing. I mean, because really everything that we do is actually marketing, but different aspects of marketing. And I really at that time I'd only used my computer to do emails and blueprints and stuff like that for the concrete business. I was like, oh wow, this is pretty interesting because I'm on the road about 200 days a year traveling and pouring these big concrete pours. I could actually do this from home and the weather wouldn't matter, and I wouldn't need 25 employees, and I could scale it. And uh here we are 12 years later with, you know, 25 employees, but it's all online and remote. And I just have fallen in love with the process of using data to inform us and being able to make educated decisions instead of having to guess on what we think's happening.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And that piece is is so vitally important. It's something that I speak to my students a lot about. We talk about ad tech and Martech and all of the changes, especially with AI now and how that can help your business. But one thing that I really imparted on them actually last week was talking about your paid media is important as is your earned, shared, and owned. So once you get somebody to jump from awareness and whatever action they've taken, that click from the advertising you've done, how do you get them to actually purchase, to leave their name and the information so then they're part of your database? And, you know, uh, because I always use the example, everybody was in an uproar when TikTok went away. And a lot of people make a lot of money selling things on TikTok, right? But they haven't converted that audience off of a social platform onto their own, into their own ecosystem.
SPEAKER_01:Sure.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So this is something that I think a lot of people still have that disconnect of not really knowing what's the secret sauce that will help me make those sales.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think you set the tone for the relationship. And we call them clients, not customers, because you deal with a client different than you deal with a customer. And I think a lot of gurus have done a poor job of promoting the laptop lifestyle of that you can hide behind your laptop and not have to get in touch with your customers. The most successful businesses that we deal with and that we partner with, they are not afraid of their customers. They have a phone number, they communicate with them, they don't just send emails and text to buy, but they actually provide value. And so they create a relationship. And I think that if you still create a relationship, even if the person hasn't bought from you, that turns into a much longer lifetime value with that customer or client when you do that. And so if you're willing to play the long game, you're going to do much better because people are in three different buying cycles. One, they're unaware, then they're problem aware, and then they're solution aware. And so until they move through that, you might get 10 people to your website. Only two of them are even in the buying cycle of where they're ready to buy. The other ones might be unaware that you even existed, and the other one might be, oh, I know I have a problem, and now I'm looking for solutions. And so by staying in touch with them and following up with them through the different modalities that are available to us now, you have like 80% of the people that buy do it after 90 days of becoming aware. So if you're only looking for the people that are going to buy right now, you literally only have 20% of the buying audience instead of the 80% that's available within the next 90 days. And most people never follow up with the people.
SPEAKER_02:That's a huge statement right there. That's actually several huge statements right there. So people who are looking for, I just want to do a business that's going to make me money really quickly, but they're not pouring their time into getting to really know that customer and filling the pipeline. Yeah. And being intentional, right? They're just there for that quick money. And that's what we see a lot of people saying when we look at these online gurus, right?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And they treat their list that way too. They treat it as like, how much can I make from it today? And what happens is a lot of those people that need that 90 days to develop the relationship or to get to the point where they're ready to buy are burned out because you've sent them 30 emails that provide no value. It's just buy my stuff, buy my stuff, buy my stuff. And eventually they're like, I don't need to open this email anymore.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah. Or you they send a whole series of emails every day that don't really that are way too long, that don't really help solve a problem for us, or that are just trying to give us a sense of urgency to buy now.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I hate when I sign up for something and by the morning when I wake up, they've already sent me four emails. Like I literally unsubscribe immediately. I'm like, listen, you're making a business problem my problem by dumping on me like that instead of like letting me navigate or create my own path through your business.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Let's take a step back and talk about what it was like to switch from being on the road 200 days a year, having to worry about the weather, having a big team, right? Going from a home completely different industry into online sales and marketing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I actually really enjoyed it. I love learning new things. And I had the luxury of there was a platform that came out that you could, it was called Teespring, and you could come up with designs, and it was really like hot market or just catchy phrases, things like that. You could get a design made, put it on a t-shirt, run a campaign, and and test ads to it. So thankfully I was making enough in my concrete business that um I had some disposable income and I could play around and you know figure things out. And my first campaign that did really well, thankfully, it was maybe three or four weeks in. So it didn't take too long for me to figure it out. But uh, I came up with a catchy phrase. And when I launched it, it got tons and tons of shares on Facebook. And that for that first one that took off, I'm guessing, I want to say that it did like more than 10 grand the first night. And I thought, oh wow, this is actual real money. This isn't a few hundred dollars if I could figure this out. And I ended up scaling that one to do over$100,000 in sales, which meant I probably took home about$25,000 in that 10-day period. And I was like, okay, this is real. These people aren't just like selling me snake oil. I'm gonna figure this out. And over the next three years, I created a small group, but we did about$15 million worth of t-shirt sales. And I went 100% online, sold my concrete business, and I've been online ever since.
SPEAKER_02:Wow. That's what everybody who wants to sell online, that's where they want to get.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Right?
SPEAKER_01:But you Yeah, and it took a lot of work. I had to do it, you know, I did it at night when on the outside. So it's not this. I don't want people to think like, oh wow, if I go online, I'm gonna make, you know, tens of thousands or millions of dollars. Like it was hard, and I did it my first 12 months that I was trying to do stuff online. I did SEO and that didn't work and I didn't like it. And but I was doing it anyways, and I was figuring out like the path to I don't I just look at failure as feedback. I tried this, didn't work. Doesn't mean it doesn't work because I see other people doing it, it just means I haven't figured it out yet. And so I don't want I certainly did well early on, but there's been periods where we didn't do well for a long time. And you know, there is ups and downs to it, and entrepreneurship really requires a resolve that like you believe in yourself, you get up every day, expect to win, even when you know your past 30 days hasn't proven that out.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. But you spent the time, the attention, and even with the good and the bad, you figured out how to make this your full-time gig, but then also how to help other businesses implement the same strategies that you used.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. The way that that happened is, you know, I had about five or six people in a Facebook group that we all shared ideas to sell sell more shirts. And I just believe that success leaves clues. And so when they would have a successful one, we could learn from that. And same when we had successful ones, they would learn from it. And all of us did really, really well in that type of format. And so what I did when the t-shirts, you know, we moved out of that business and moved into Shopify. I contacted those people that were in that group, and they had all moved on to their own platform too, because we wanted to own the data from all of these sales so we could build a better, more solid business. And I said, Hey, I think I've figured some things out. Let me share with you. And if it works, you can pay me. And if it doesn't work, you're not out anything. And they're like, okay. And so the first two that I helped, they got extremely good results. And when they were doing about 400,000 a month, and we got them to 2.7 million a month within the first six months, and in print on demand, you know, we could have got there a lot sooner, but it just required a lot of inventory and shipping and and growth that uh they weren't ready for. So the business is there if you do the right things. And then the the next one, we took them from 2.75 million the year before to within 90 days, they were on a nine nine million dollar run rate and they ended up doing 16 million that year. I'm like, okay, so this stuff literally works. One was for a supplement, the other was for print on demand. And the store that I was that I owned and was working with was kitchen supply. So I'm like, okay, if we fix the website, it doesn't matter what they're selling. It's pretty, I didn't just get struck by lightning, but this works. And so then we literally that's how BGS was built and born was around we started helping other people do it and teaching them what we were doing.
SPEAKER_02:You answered part of my next question, which was what kind of clients do you work with? Because a lot of times we know that what when we niche down, we can get a lot more business, we can scale faster. You have niche down though into helping specific types, e-commerce businesses, even if it's not, you know, your your kind of category agnostic.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. We don't care about the product because we use data and analytics. So it's really how the person interacts with the website. And so if you have a website that makes sales or collects leads, we can look at what they're doing on the website and optimize that process in order to make it more efficient.
SPEAKER_02:And what does this look like for you today? Because we also know a lot more people are using different agentic AI and different AI tools to help with some of these work streams. And every big company, Salesforce, SubSpot are trying to figure out how to keep their customers in those platforms and roll out more things.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think AI is amazing. Obviously, in the data and analytics world that we're in, it makes us way smarter and way more efficient. And so we're getting some of the biggest wins that we've gotten ever in our company in 12 years, the last several months, by using it as an efficiency tool. And I think what that does is, you know, we're very deliberate about how we use it. It's not meant to replace people, it's meant to help them do their job better. And the other thing that I've noticed is the clients that we work with that use it, they can grow much faster and much larger without adding more team members, which makes them more profitable and less to manage. Because I really believe the more people you have, the more energy that that takes away from being able to focus on the business itself.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, that's very true. So talk to us about some of the things that you do. Because you obviously you can work fully hand in hand with clients. Do you have other things for people who are maybe not quite there? They're just thinking about a product or service that they want to sell online, or they they've, you know, at the baby steps.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, if you go to our website, buildgrowthscale.com, we have a blog. We also embed all of the podcasts that we do. And so you can see uh we literally believe that I will tell you our very best things that we're doing, and you don't need us to do it. You can go implement it yourself. And typically what we want to do is help them grow to a point where they go, Wow, this stuff really works. I want someone to do it for us so that we can focus on the business. And then we would partner with them and do that. So all of our resources are free. We have a couple of like smaller things that we do with them, just kind of to what I say is it's it's dating before you ask for marriage. And so uh really it's a way for them to get to know us and us to get to know them because we're in a place where we really only want to work with people that we like and enjoy. And I think that that's important too, because you spend enough time at work, so a lot of times more time than you get with your family on a daily basis. And so you might as well enjoy who you work with.
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely. And with the the kind of numbers that you're talking about, I imagine that there is that threshold that you want to make sure that this is a proven product and service already that you know that you can scale.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, we typically our sweet spot is the companies that do about 250,000 a month to a million and helping them scale that to much better, you know, much bigger numbers. Yeah, they've already got you know that they have a good product. They know how to sell enough that, you know, they're profitable. We go in there and just make it way more efficient and move more units.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And I see on your website Piperloo, Pink Lily, Organifi, Soho Social House, Game Day Couture. So there's a little bit of variety in there. Does somebody have to have a physical product or can it be a service-based business?
SPEAKER_01:No, it can certainly be digital. In fact, I think that that's something that we didn't do well for a lot of years. We kind of pigeonholed ourselves into just physical products. And about two years ago now, I had a friend that was selling a digital product and asked me to look at their website. And I did, and I implemented a few of the things that we do on the physical products, and we got a 10% lift on their checkout, which for them, they do about$60 million a year. So it was a six million dollar lift for them, and it was one test. And so I was like, oh wow, if they have a digital product and we help them, we don't create any other problems, they can scale it infinitely. Where if you sell physical products, like when we worked with Piper Loo and helped them scale up to$2.7 million a month, that's a lot more units. And so it required like scale a lot of times will break systems and requires, you know, a bigger team. So that created a new problem that they needed to learn how to solve. Where with digital products, when we help them, it doesn't really create a new issue because they can, you know, sell as many as they want.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, so true. What is the biggest mistake you see people make?
SPEAKER_01:Not wanting to talk to their customer.
unknown:Oh.
SPEAKER_01:So so many people think when they get online that that will allow them to hide behind their computer. And what I've noticed is the people that really treat their customer like their mom, they end up having a much better business that weathers the storms way better. You can certainly create a great business for a little while until, you know, the market turns. But the ones that really do well when the ups and downs and survive are the ones that have a community because they built that relationship with them and they treat them like a real person instead of just someone that's going to give them a check.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And that can be a mindset shift from people who are panicked about starting a business and starting to monetize because they've put everything into a business. Right.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, for sure. You need to plan a runway. Very few people figure it out right from the beginning. It certainly happens. But I definitely would say uh learn how to invest an hour or two every day outside of your job into figuring it out. And, you know, don't be dumb and just go, okay, I have three months of runway to figure this out. I'm gonna go quit my job and and go all in. That typically could backfire in a bad way. Or, you know, there's probably some people that have done it and and they were great at it, but that's not gonna be the norm.
SPEAKER_02:We've talked a lot about using data analytics, simple things that people need to do, which I mean, simple, but maybe not so simple depending, you know, because you have to have that shift. And and you call this your revenue optimization methodology. So is there a whole checklist people have to have, or is there a survey they do to get started to so that you take them through so that you know exactly what you need to do for each per each company?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, for sure. We have like best practices. Typically we'll do an audit for them where we just jump on a call and walk through their website and help them out and then go from there. We don't charge anything to do that. It's just a a matter of if we can provide some value, then that again, that's our way of creating a long-term relationship. And if they grow and it works and you know they want to come back and do business with us, we'd love that. But that's not required in order to start the relationship.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I think that's a really beautiful thing because that's that's how we build and trust within each other's businesses.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, but and it's worked for us. We don't advertise, like we literally have no longer advertised to get new clients. It's literally people find us through podcasts or word of mouth and referrals. And for us, you know, you could grow too fast and implode because it's so much work for each individual client. We could take on more than what we could handle and then deliver a poor service. And so for us, it's more of a being very hyper-aware of what we can do and how many that we can deliver that world-class service to and uh not let our ego get in the way.
SPEAKER_02:Mm-hmm. Definitely. And it is, it's like you're plucking all the questions right out of my head because I did want to ask about ad spend if there is, you know, a percentage that you recommend people do spend so that they can see better results along with your system.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, for sure. You need eyeballs in order for the data to be meaningful. The more data we have, the better decisions we can help you make. And so one, knowing how to track your data accurately is really important. And then from there, doing it in a way that's sustainable. Because if it's a if it feels like a whole nother job to learn your data, then you're not gonna do it or you're gonna put it off. And so, yeah, we would clarify like what metrics really matter and then get those and then start there. And eventually, you know, at scale, you're gonna have more points that you're looking at. But to get them from 10 grand a month to 100 grand a month, there's you know, three or four things that they can look at and kind of reverse engineer. And so we just go through that with in that process.
SPEAKER_02:Wonderful. Where do you see yourself going in the company going?
SPEAKER_01:That's a great question. I actually get up every day excited to go to work and do this. It really the way that I see it is by helping a business owner do better and that they get to accomplish their dreams. And so for us, I find it very fulfilling. They they end up having, you know, they show up better as a parent or as a business owner if the business is doing well and if it's profitable and they understand, you know, all the aspects of it. So for me, I really get a lot of fulfillment out of helping people build their dreams.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I'll probably keep doing it for a long time.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Amazing. Amazing. And do you think that use of AI is going to continue being an efficient helper, or do you think at some point it's going to be an industry disruptor?
SPEAKER_01:It's definitely already disrupting the industry. So certainly for the information people, because you know, now they can have a$20 smartest assistant in the world on their phone and and their laptop. And so the information isn't the issue. Now it's being able to have someone that can essentially share their perspective in a way that the new business owner can use it because we don't have information problem. We typically have a time problem. There's lots of information and it's free. We just need to know what to work on. And so we give most of our information out for free. But where the real value is, is in knowing what to work on and and what to filter out so that it's not just a distraction.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. That is one of the biggest things that we have to tackle right now. And because there's so much information out there, it can be really easy to go down a rabbit hole and like you said earlier, spend a lot of time working on one piece of the business that you're raising your hand. Yeah. That isn't necessarily the place that you should be. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. We we tend to gravitate towards the parts that we like or that are fun, but that's not necessarily the most important.
SPEAKER_02:For people who are listening, all of our students do capstone projects where they create a digital business or they create a website or a podcast, whatever it might be. But what are some categories that you think are going to continue performing really well? Or how should somebody approach starting a digital business in this day and age?
SPEAKER_01:I think so. I've been asked this question a lot. Like they said, hey, if you're going to start another one, what would you do? And to be honest, I think I would go into the pet industry. And I'm going to share why, because I I did a lot of thinking around this when I, you know, we've worked with some very large e-commerce businesses that were in the pet industry, and they're very profitable. I was like, what makes them different? And I thought about it. The more that we're on digital media, the less connected we are. And I believe that people's pets are the only place that they actually get unconditional love. And so because it's there's such a disparity in the amount that they'll spend on their pet compared to what they'll even spend on themselves. There had to be a reason why that was. And I really believe that that pet gives them that feeling that all of us are looking for. And so I think that that's a great industry to be in. I don't think it's going to go away. I actually think with AI, it's going to get even better. And I think success can be had in anything. Like when you look at everything around you, somebody's successfully creating that and selling it. I think probably the deeper question is is it something that you're going to enjoy working on a long time, even if the results aren't immediate? And I definitely don't believe that you have to love the industry that you're in, but you need to at least love the aspects of running a business and learning how to do things. Whether you like dogs or not, there's still a whole bunch of things you have to do that have nothing to do with dogs in order to have a dog business. And so you can enjoy the business aspect of it and not necessarily sell the widget that you're in love with. So, but I think that the idea that you're willing to do the research and AI makes that easier than ever. You don't need to reinvent the wheel. Use, I think success leaves clues. So see what someone's doing really well and figure your own spin on it or figure out an underserved area of that market. And that's where you see the people that come in and and really do very well is that they've really thought it out and done the research ahead of time.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, fantastic. And as you're saying all of this, you're just making me think about my little dog that's not so little, but who's sitting behind me waiting for a walk and all the treats, yeah, all the different things that go into pet ownership and wanting to make sure that they feel loved.
SPEAKER_01:So that's what you get from them. Like they love you unconditionally. They like they greet you every day when you come home. You know, they want the love and attention and it feels good.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I know that I'm walking away from this conversation, excited about the journey I've been embarking on and digging in a little deeper. So I'm sure that everybody else who's listening who is looking at going into something in digital has is having the same reaction. So thank you.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, thanks for having me. I really appreciate that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's been a really fun conversation. Of course, we'll link to your book, a call, and also just to your website in the show notes so that people can get all of those free resources, start developing a relationship with you and with Build Grow Scale.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you.
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely. And thank you to everybody who's watching this episode or listening to it. We'll be back again with another amazing guest very shortly.
SPEAKER_00:To learn more about the Master of Science and Digital Media Management program, visit us on the web. Web at dm.usc.edu
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