The Real Deal Podcast
Unlock the door to success in the dynamic world of real estate with your hosts, William Gomez & Alfredo Madrid. Join us as we dive into the inspiring journeys of loan officers and real estate agents, sharing their triumphs, challenges, and invaluable insights. Your key to navigating the ever-evolving landscape of real estate starts here.
The Real Deal Podcast
#12 Transforming Communities and Creating Generational Wealth with Ashley Dailey
From her small-town upbringing in Osage County, to walking the red carpet at the Oscars, Ashley Dailey provides a bit of entertainment as well as insight. We're talking everything from meeting Leonardo DiCaprio to becoming an advocate for your community.
Ashley reveals her how early years inspired her to help others achieve financial security through homeownership. In discussing the pressures and rewards of assisting families in difficult circumstances, she highlights the transformation from seeking financial success to finding true fulfillment in making a positive community impact.
Wrapping up, we tackle some of the pressing issues in today's real estate market, from the influence of interest rates on buyer behavior to the necessity of regulating short-term rentals. Our guest provides expert insights on recent changes in real estate commission rules and how they might reshape the industry.
What keeps me going is just trying to prepare everyone. I feel like we're living in a time where, now more than ever, you need to have the security of owning your home and being able to access your home equity, and those two things can literally save someone's life in the community that I live in. I don't mean to sound cheesy or anything, but it's just my love for my community.
Speaker 2:That's it.
Speaker 1:It's my love for my community and I want people to look at me and not think, oh well, that girl's just making all this money, but that girl's helping a lot of people. But it's just crazy because the people that come to me they do genuinely need help.
Speaker 3:Well, welcome to the Real Deal Podcast. I know that you've been on the Willpower a couple of times and it's been amazing every time, but we were just talking that you just got back from LA.
Speaker 1:Tell us a little about that story of how you got to go out there and everything and the singers. They were nominated for Best Original Song. They wanted to add some movement to the song, so they asked some of the tail dancers and the drum keepers to come out and they were able to bring a plus one. So I was like, yes, sign me up and let's see. They flew us out there Wednesday and we were there until Monday and he got to go to the Oscars walk the red carpet.
Speaker 3:Wow. And you got to meet Leonardo DiCaprio.
Speaker 1:He took all the pictures. Yes, so he was at the after party. Everyone that was in the movie was at the after party.
Speaker 3:That's amazing.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, so the family, the plus ones, they had like a special watch party for us. The Apple Films put on it was at the Sunset. Hotel and then after the Oscars, everybody came there and we celebrated and it was awesome.
Speaker 2:How did the movie do?
Speaker 1:Honestly, it was just surreal. It didn't win any awards but honestly, having the singers there and the dancers and having them perform on stage, that was it Like to us.
Speaker 2:Like on the main stage.
Speaker 1:On the main stage of the Oscars like the world saw that, and so in my heart and mind that's winning, you know just having that representation there. You know that Osage language being sung in front of the whole entire world, to me that's, that's an award.
Speaker 2:Has this always been real, near and dear to your heart, or is that something that has built up over time?
Speaker 1:Right, I mean it always has been, because I spent my life in Osage County.
Speaker 3:So I think all of us People think you're Osage.
Speaker 1:Yes, all of us brown kids we just kind of gravitated towards each other right. So a lot of my friends were Osage and just kind of been involved in that community my entire life, growing up in Skytrip in the 80s and 90s. I was the only Hispanic kid so I didn't have like my little Latino group there.
Speaker 2:Right, I didn't have your cholo gang.
Speaker 1:Latina girl gang. It was not that. So it was definitely like everyone just kind of took me under their wing and they're like you're our family. And it's been that way my entire life. So, as William knows, because I feel like every time someone gets qualified, I'm like I've known them my entire life, they're very important.
Speaker 3:Yes, every single one, and that's actually what I want to mainly talk about today.
Speaker 3:So anybody interested in kind of getting to know your story a little bit more I know that we've gone through in the last couple episodes that you came on the podcast, the last couple of agents that we've had this is this podcast is mainly for top producing realtors, top producing loan officers that we bring on to try to really have any agents and loan officers that are listening really kind of get motivated, especially with the market that we've had in the last year or so, and then and then learn from like, how is it that you're doing what you're doing?
Speaker 3:And with one that came on, we mainly talked about social media last week. We talked about the importance of the relationship with a lender and a realtor. What I really want to talk about with you is you're big on your why and you're right. Like you just sent us a lead the other day and then I'm like actually this is going to be tough and you were like you said they have low income and they're about to have a baby or they just had a baby, like what we have. Like she told me we have to help them and I'm over here like A lot of pressure.
Speaker 2:Figure it out. I'm going to help this family and then I'm over here like no pressure.
Speaker 1:You know, what. We're doing this.
Speaker 3:I was actually just like saying we couldn't help them because I didn't want to help them Like now.
Speaker 3:But I don't get that, and I'm sure you probably have your agents that you work with, that you know. I feel I feel like a lot of people do this because that's how they make a living. But I think that you're truly doing this to help people and that's what I really want to dive into today of, like, the difference of why you're doing your job and I mean you're consistently closing 80 to 90 deals between you and Brittany, your teammate, but your majority of it as well, and you've been doing it for a long time. So I really want to dive into that so that way, maybe people can have a different perspective every time they get a lead, every time they get a loan, and it just not feel like a job but really like a calling.
Speaker 1:Exactly. And that's so weird that you said that, because literally today, as I was driving home from Osage County, I was thinking, you know, because the NAR settlement came in, I had a couple of people send me that article. And I'm thinking in my mind and I'm like, if I never made another dime again, I think I'd be okay with it, as long as I'm still helping my community. You know what I mean. I'm grateful I'm in a position where I'm not the only income anymore.
Speaker 1:I wouldn't be able to say that if I was still a single mom. But I just kind of reined, just kind of reined it in and I told myself I'm not here for the money, I'm here to help people, like that's what it is, and the money is a perk. Simply put, that's just what it is. But I think when you live in a community where you've been anchored your entire life and you see the struggle, you see you know the lack of generational wealth but you see how you pulled your own self out of that, that's what you want for your entire community. You know what I mean. You want that. You know girl who just became a mom at 19, and the kids you know becoming parents, young and living in poverty, and you really want to help empower them and take that same avenue that you did because, I saw it work for myself and I just want to share that with as many people as I can.
Speaker 1:So for me, that's the why is pulling people out of this thinking of I can't own a home, I'm never going to have any money?
Speaker 3:I'm stuck in this job forever.
Speaker 1:Yes, In Keller Williams they say want equals lack. And that's so true, because, man, if you're just constantly wanting that and wanting, wanting, wanting, wanting, wanting, like you know you're lacking something. And so, man, that's it. It's just my community and trying to give people that hope, that, man, we lose sight of the hope.
Speaker 2:I want to talk about a little bit. You mentioned it just slightly here. I think we even all three share this in common. You said you didn't grow up with a lot.
Speaker 2:Right three share this in common. You said you didn't grow up with a lot. Right, and I didn't either. And I've heard Will's story myself and I know he did not grow up with a lot. But there's no way I would change any of that, because there's no way I'd be who I was without that. But let's play a little game. I mean, what did that look like for you? Like, let's play a. How poor were you Let's't work.
Speaker 1:You know she stayed home. My dad, you know he's part of the Casillas family. His mom was a Casillas. So when they came here, you know in the 1950s they immigrated here and you know his mom was back and forth to Mexico and so he became a laborer at 16 for Flintco and worked his way up to like the project superintendent. But obviously when we were kids he wasn't making that much money. So a lot of it looked like a lot of hand-me-down clothes, a lot of leftovers. You know what I mean Like it just was that If we had any luxuries it was a big deal.
Speaker 1:When my parents did get to a better place, you know they opened a Mexican restaurant there in Skytube. Like that's what they wanted to do with their money was open up a Mexican restaurant. Obviously that wasn't a good choice in the 80s. I mean it only lasted about a year. So I did get to see my parents try to take some risks, you know, in that way, and some succeeded and some failures and so that was kind of weird and different.
Speaker 1:You know to see in Skytook and experience that as well. But weird and different you know to see in Sky2 can experience that as well, but you know I remember when my parents got divorced, you know we lived in a one bedroom apartment, me and my mom and my two siblings. So I mean we had, you know, three kids sharing one bedroom. And I will never forget that we had a little Honda Accord that it would barely make it out of the parking lot and it would die Like it was backfiring, like the whole time. And I was like that kid that was late for school every day my third grade year because we had this, you know, pos car. That was our only vehicle.
Speaker 1:I think, someone gave it to my mom, yeah.
Speaker 2:The dash light, all those lights on the dash light. I thought that was a normal thing. I got that.
Speaker 1:Every car had that normal thing, like every car had. That that's, that's so true, you know. And just um, you know, my parents did not graduate from high school. You know what I mean? They didn't, and so for me and my brother and sister to all graduate from college big deal, you know, we really have turned things around, and just one generation for our family, and so to me that it just makes you feel even more proud, and you know. And then our kids, all of our kids, are doing really well and, you know, are either business owners or have really good jobs, and so me and my siblings recognize that we take time to talk about it, to be like, wow, we're really making every generation better and that's the goal.
Speaker 2:Do you feel that you have changed the trajectory of your family moving forward?
Speaker 1:Definitely.
Speaker 3:Thousand percent.
Speaker 2:How does that feel?
Speaker 1:Well, I you have changed the trajectory of your family, moving forward Definitely.
Speaker 2:Thousand percent. How does?
Speaker 1:that feel. Well, I mean, it's all the feels you know, like sometimes if I'm driving down the road and I think about it, like I'll get teared up and like get emotional about it. It's insane. But you know, I told my daughter I said you know, you're the first woman in our family on both sides on my side and her dad's side who is not a mom yet.
Speaker 1:She's 22 years old, not a mom. She's not married, she's a business owner. She bought her first home, financed her first car, you know, and she's a successful business owner. She's making good money and she chose to be an entrepreneur Even though she graduated third in her class, never made a B in high school. She went that way because I think she saw me like doing my own thing. She went that way because I think she saw me like doing my own thing and she's like I want to do my own thing and so that's huge. You know, changing that. As far as the female side, you know, not being a young mom, not having that struggle, building wealth at this young age it just blows my mind Like I can't even wrap my mind around that life. But I'm so happy that my daughter has it.
Speaker 3:So continuing to play that game, which I'm so happy that my daughter has it.
Speaker 2:So continuing to play that, that game, which I like it maybe it's a new segment, so when I think of my story. You need a sound effect for that A lot of sandwiches.
Speaker 2:I remember just that. It reminded me. I remember one time seeing, like my I didn't know what W2s were back then, but I just remember seeing one of my dads and he he's the sole breadwinner and we lived in this little five of us at the time and I remember seeing his W-2 and he'd made $13,000. And now back then I mean I didn't even know I was that poor, to be quite honest with you Like I just you know, I had my poor friends so it didn't really matter.
Speaker 2:But looking back I'm like dang how did? How'd he do it? How'd?
Speaker 1:they do it. Yeah, and that would be growing up in SkyJet. I mean, no one really honest.
Speaker 2:I mean I was having a good old time you know, with whatever Will's about to, one up his own A lot of hand-me-downs.
Speaker 1:Will we know your?
Speaker 3:story. No, so I don't know if you guys would agree with this, but I truly believe, whether you grew up, you know poor or rich, or middle class. There's also different faces of it. Right, like both of you guys said, you know my story. I feel that there was one face whenever I was in Mexico. There was another face whenever I moved here and we were in a better position, but we were still not even middle class. And then, and then a different like face when I started my career, when I became an adult. And that's kind of what I wanted to ask you, because you're you're telling us how you grew up, but something that you said you know, your, your sister, your daughter, I mean, she could be your right, she looks like your sister so, uh, she is 22 and is the first woman that has not gotten pregnant yet.
Speaker 3:To where you became a mom at 20 years old, and a single mom at that. And then what I wanted I want you to tell me, like a little bit of your journey from 20 year old ashley single mom to getting into real estate and then getting to where you're at today, because I think that so many people that, like you know, listen to people like yourself, that it's like oh, you're like, all of a sudden they're there.
Speaker 1:Like, where was the fast forward button? There's not one. And then some people can't.
Speaker 3:And then some people can't even relate to like this is how I grew up, because it's like okay, well, you're a baby, this and that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they have no idea.
Speaker 3:So, but let's talk about the situation where somebody might be in right now. So, so what got you out of that and how? I mean, I would assume that you would. It sounds like I would rather take your, your childhood, than go be a 20 year old single mom, exactly Like my mom had me when she was 17. And I don't. I have a 10 month old kid and, and between me and my wife, like I, I'm like how did you do it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's my kids. My kids tell me that all the time. They tell me that all the time.
Speaker 2:You felt stuck yeah.
Speaker 1:You definitely feel stuck and just to give you a glimpse and like the poverty level that we were in you know it was how poor were you? I remember like we lived in a trailer that had holes in the floor and there were stray cats living under that trailer and I would hear them fighting at night.
Speaker 3:This is like what do you?
Speaker 1:do? Do you kill the cats Like? I'm not a cat killer. So I dealt with it Right and my kids were little would wake them up in the night.
Speaker 1:And I put rugs over the holes in the floors. But but it was a free, it was a free place to live, all right. One point for ashley it was in avon, oklahoma, which, if you know avon, it's, you know, a very, very small town. The whole town's on wheels. You know I always say that. But, um, you know, that was definitely a point.
Speaker 1:But I knew I was destined for better and bigger things. I would say, um, I gotta give, you know, my dad a little bit of credit here, because his family, the Casillas family, and his cousins and his brothers and sisters, they all did really well for themselves later in life. And so I did see that Tony Casillas, my dad's first cousin, he went on to play for the Dallas Cowboys and when he would come to town, what a big deal it was. You know what I mean. And I did have people in my family to look up to, to where I felt like this and something inside of me that deserved better. And I knew it. You know, I knew it. I knew I deserve better and I knew that I would get there eventually. But I 100% was like, felt like concrete in my shoes, like what am I going to do? And growing up in rural Oklahoma and a lot of times being a female and being a young mom, being a teacher, makes sense because you have the same hours as your kids, you know you're not having to pay for daycare. So that's, of course, what I fell into, just like my sister.
Speaker 1:But what? What changed kind of my trajectory? You know I was making $1,600 a month, which wasn't a lot, guys, and you get paid once a month. So there were times I mean, after I graduated college I'm working full time. I didn't have it'd be the end of the month and I'm waiting for payday. On the first I'd have gas money to actually get to the school and my sister would pick me up, she would pick me up, take my kids to school, take me to school, drop me off. And there were just those times where you know the money, you know I had a car payment, I had a house payment and so that $1,600 a month did not go very far.
Speaker 1:But one thing I did in my community was I coached my kids' team, so soccer cheerleading, I was part of the booster club, so I was always out there doing fundraisers, events, you know, just supporting my community, right? Well, my brother who we don't have the same dad, so he's a white guy. So he's had a lot of good looking white guy. He had a lot of opportunity in his life. He has an engineering degree. He was the CEO of Capital Homes and he saw what I was doing and he said, hey, why don't you come over here and help us do some marketing? Like, you're really good at the fundraising and all that, come over here and help us do some marketing and all that. Mind you guys, this was 2010,. Right after that, first time homebuyer tax credit went away.
Speaker 1:Home builders couldn't. You couldn't give a home away. You couldn't give a new home away. Back then Did anyone tell me this? No, but that was the beauty of it, because I came in with no knowledge of the market. I didn't have that negative Nancy hadn't been beat up with the foreclosure market. I didn't have any of that. I came in with excitement and drive and I turned things around for several communities there at Capital Homes. So then they were like well, let's give you your own community, like you need to be selling houses. So I went into a community all the way out in Sepulpa and I was living in Skytook and I went in there and I sold more homes in six months than they had sold in two years. And then I knew this is what I need to be doing Left education, thank God, because I'd be fired today anyways, and so-.
Speaker 2:So you graduated college with an education degree. So with an English degree and then I went on to get the certification in education.
Speaker 1:And so I realized I'm good at this, I love this. And what made it easier for me in Sepulpa was we were right across the street from a school. So I went over there and I got involved with the teachers. I did a garage sale to benefit their reading night. So I went over there and I got involved with the teachers. I did a garage sale to benefit, you know, their reading night. We took pizza over there on reading night.
Speaker 1:So, even though I knew no one in Sepulpa, I just started working in that community. What can I do to help? Because, first and foremost, if you're going to go into a community and build homes or develop or provide a service, number one, you should come in with the helper's heart. How can I help this community, first and foremost, if I expect them to come support me? What can I do to help them? So I did that, really, really enjoyed it. But I was driving all the way to Sepulpa so I wanted to be at Home Creations at that point because they had just opened a neighborhood in Collinsville. So I picked up the phone and I called their director in Oklahoma City and I said hey, I shopped your guy there in Collinsville. You need to fire him and hire me, and they did it.
Speaker 1:They did it. They sent their sales manager out to meet me a couple days later and he hired me right on the spot. But I did, I had went and shopped him and I thought why are these homes in Collinsville not moving? They're full brick, they offer granite, they started, I think at the time, 120. You know, this is this should be selling like hotcakes. Well, I went and I shopped the model home, you know, and the salesperson.
Speaker 1:I was like oh my, he's not good yeah he's way out of touch here and he's way over it over his head, and so, yeah, I just made that phone call and I went for it, they hired me, and then it was history after that I didn't know you were a new before.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So then with home creations, I helped put them on the map and we opened three additional communities while I was there. So I took over Ashbury Park, but then within a year I was salesperson of the year out of all of Oklahoma and then they promoted me to area sales manager. So that was it, you know, after that. So that was it, you know after that. And then, of course, you know, selling new homes on the weekends and being a single mom wasn't the best situation, because my kids were teenagers at this point and so I had to kind of get out of that, and that's when I shifted to marketing for title companies. I think that's how we met.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think so. I think that was it. We were doing the happy hour we were. That was a good time. You were a great networker for sure. I do remember that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so I got you know nine to five and kind of. But then you know, a year went by and I was like I miss selling homes. So I got licensed in 2015.
Speaker 2:Did you have immediate success in real estate, like when you got your license?
Speaker 1:Not immediate, because it wasn't my one thing, you know, marketing for title companies.
Speaker 2:I held on to it, you know like you didn't want to release that security.
Speaker 1:I, I, yeah, I just was like man. I have benefits, I have a salary. You know I'm a single mom. I have to consider this, so God held onto that for dear life.
Speaker 1:When, every time I would go into the office, julie Smith would be like why aren't you going full-time, like you're doing more than most agents that are full-time? I was just closing 10 to 15 a year or something like that, and so I wasn't doing a lot, but now that I know the amount of business that most agents do, I'm like I guess I was for being part-time essentially. So I did. I worked those two jobs doing the marketing and every networking event that I could go to. I went to it and enjoyed it. That was my thing, and I think that's also what helped me just in real estate. I mean, it's just hard to work in this world when you don't know anyone Right, and so it really helped me kind of get connected with the right people right out of the gate. And then in 2018, I went full time. In management history Since then, I think I sold 50 homes that year and that's been my lowest production.
Speaker 2:I think you went right past this and this is a Gary Keller concept, but you said it wasn't my one thing. Can you expand a little bit on what that means?
Speaker 1:I've actually read the book the One Thing, and it's basically just like finding your niche right and then putting all your time, your focus, your energy into that. And listen, I see a lot of real estate agents. They'll be a real estate agent, but they're also this and they're selling that and they're doing this. And I'm like you know already, life is taking so much of our focus. Don't let it take anything else away, you know, from what you're doing, from that drive for your career. And not only that, but it's also about like perfecting that craft and focusing on that one thing every day. And how can you get one percent better every day at what you're doing? Yeah, huge deal.
Speaker 3:it changed everything for me do you think that when you were you shifted over to to title that you were as fulfilled doing that, that job?
Speaker 1:it was fun. You know it was fun, but I wasn't helping anyone that's kind of what I'm getting at, and that's what I was missing.
Speaker 1:That's what I was missing. Actually, it was Julia Lookout, who's an Osage lady, who she was my very first listing. That's why I got licensed, because she had some land to sell. She's a real estate agent. She knew I had been involved in real estate. We were kind of talking about it and I was like a full-time job. But I went home every day for two weeks, locked myself in the bedroom, took that test online and I was licensed within a month.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So the people that are like oh, it's going to take me six months, you don't want it, you don't want it.
Speaker 2:Just get it over with.
Speaker 1:Do it. If you want it, do it. Don't procrastinate, Just do it. You can do it in two weeks. Be licensed in a month that's awesome. What's holding you back?
Speaker 3:You and I have shared a lot of different stories of people that we have helped that for one reason or another, they've had to sell and then they've been able to cash out a good amount of money, and one of those people being your son, Alfredo, I think you've shared with me I don't know if you've said it in a podcast, but going back to whenever you were living in that 800 square foot house, you said your parents bought that house for how much and sold it for how much.
Speaker 2:They sold it for five. I mean, they bought it for five thousand dollars and they ended up selling it for twelve thousand dollars, which doesn't seem like a lot Seven thousand a month but that's double, two and a half times what they bought it for. Then they bought another one for 20 and then a few years later sold that one for 46. And then a few years later sold that one for 46. And one of the points I was making was, like you know, the people that were helping, the majority of their wealth is usually in their real estate, in their primary residence and maybe that second rental that they have.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, if you own a home, you're you're 42 times more wealthy than somebody who doesn't own a home. And it's crazy. The numbers are there in black and white.
Speaker 1:I try my best to paint a clear picture for people of what home equity can do for you, but it is really hard for people to grasp. It really is, but I'm going to keep talking about it until they do.
Speaker 3:So one of the things that I've never felt from you is I felt pressure from you of like we got to get this deal closed, but I've never if it's never one once came across on like I got to get paid for this deal.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And you, you, like I said you guys close 80 to 90. How many did you do by yourself over 50? Right?
Speaker 1:Last year did 68, 68 by yourself.
Speaker 3:So clearly I mean you're making a good living doing this, but but, but what? What is it that that makes? Is it those stories like that, that kind of keep you at it like you got to help this person? You got to help this person?
Speaker 1:to you know. Just, he was 22 years old, you know, and so, yes, that's definitely 100%. What keeps me going is just trying to prepare everyone. I feel like we're living in a time where, now more than ever, you need to have the security of owning your home and being able to access your home equity, and those two things can literally save someone's life in the community that I live in.
Speaker 3:Is there anything else that drives you like the drive that you have to be able to to do what you're doing?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean absolutely it's. I mean I don't mean to sound cheesy or anything, but it's just my love for my community.
Speaker 3:That's it.
Speaker 1:It's my love for my community and I want people to look at me and not think, oh well, that girl's just making all this money, but that girl's helping a lot of people. Like, oh well, that girl's just making all this money, but that girl's helping a lot of people. But it's just crazy because the people that come to me.
Speaker 2:They do genuinely need help. They do so. What do your milestone goals look like? What is it something you're like, man one day I'm going to achieve this. What do those look like that line up with your business? Because you can line them up, it doesn't have to be I'm going to make a million dollars one day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I'm already working towards that. So one big goal was to own a farm and own land, and so we've done that. And so two years ago we bought eight acres and it had four houses and a barn on it that needed rehab. So we've rehabbed one of the houses and a barn and built a tiny home there. And then we wanted to grow, so we bought the place next door last year. So you know, two years back to back we've grown our farm, our land ownership. That's all in the Osage reservation too. So this is all reservation lands which is very important to us.
Speaker 1:I would say to me that's the biggest thing I'm living at right now. Is that, just you know food sovereignty, learning to grow our own food, take care of our own animals, and the world's a crazy place. So I feel like being sustainable and having that gift, having that knowledge. You know it's hard. You know going out early in the morning, being out in the sun, taking care of the land, taking care of animals Not easy.
Speaker 3:No.
Speaker 1:Not easy, especially when you have a full time job and other things going on.
Speaker 2:So I saw that you, you raise chickens right and I have.
Speaker 3:You just got married to the chicken, the cookie coop cookie the cookie coop.
Speaker 2:So, um, but I have chickens, but I don't, I don't consider my. I guess I haven't conceded to the fact that I raised them. I guess I do, though, because they get, they're born there and then whatever. But do you, when you say you raise just a little side note here are you saying like there's some sort of like process, that you're doing it, or you're just have chickens and like you're starting to multiply them?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, definitely, definitely that.
Speaker 2:And we have way more eggs than you can ever eat.
Speaker 1:We do, and you know, we let them free range kitchen because our rooster, you know, he just disappeared one day and it was just terrible. And so then I was on the hunt for a new rooster. You just fed a coyote and so, yeah, I mean circle of life, I guess. But totally uh you know I'm living that dream. Yeah, for I'm living that dream.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure I'm living that dream Our first home. We're turning into an Airbnb there north of downtown Tulsa, because it's such a good place to have a short-term rental. I'm not a huge short-term rental fan when we're living in a housing crisis, but it's a situation where we've been moved out of the house for two years. We've basically just been letting family bounce in and out of the house. Which is also something that's important to me is being able to provide housing for my family members that are having a hard time that may need it. I've been able to do that. There's another house on the the land that we bought last year that I'm able. We also I mean gosh, we've had three different family members just kind of bouncing and out at times where they needed to. I mean waiting to go to rehab. You know, hey, here's a place.
Speaker 1:It happens and it's a conversation in our community. It's important to recognize it and to say people do need help and sometimes they also need a roof over their head and I'm happy that you know my husband and I have put ourselves in a position where we can help our family and friends that are in that transitionary thing. That, to me, that's it.
Speaker 2:Two-part question here. You said something you're not a big proponent of short-term housing during a housing crisis One. What do you mean by that? And then I know you're very anti-Zillow. I want to hear a little bit about that, because I am too to an extent, but obviously I don't have the voice you have from a realtor's perspective. I don't know that it's my place to ever tell a realtor like hey. Zillow leads. This is why you shouldn't do those. But why don't you tell me about the short-term?
Speaker 1:Right. So I mean, here's a really good example, guys. So let's talk about Pawhuska, oklahoma. Right now we have a lot of tribal members who want to move back there, or want to live there because they're working for the tribe, or people just want to live in pasca, and you've got like 40 plus short-term rentals because of the what is that attraction out there? I hate to say the lady what's her oh man, don't hex me, but it's the pioneer woman. Yeah, don't say it three times, we'll beat a beetlejuice her, but anyways well anyways that's a whole nother podcast, okay he
Speaker 2:just had to bring it around sorry. Sorry, I just wanted to. I'm gonna forgive you I wanted to remember why it is an attraction.
Speaker 3:It's a problem, so so do you think that that's why there's that many?
Speaker 1:yeah, I yeah, I mean, that's definitely part of it. Is that attraction coming there now people just kind of genuinely maybe wanting to visit the osage? I mean it's on the map right and so when I put a home buyer up on a search for Pawhuska and there's no homes and then I'm looking at the Airbnb and there's, like all these empty homes, that's a problem. They need to regulate City. Pawhuska needs to grow a backbone and regulate their short-term rentals in that town. It's bad. So I mean, there's just nothing.
Speaker 1:There's no single family residences that are decent, that can be bought and financed and a family actually move into them. So that's that's a problem. And then here in the city of Tulsa too, there are certain areas where it's just too much. You know, I'm on a block, you know four or five. I mean they should regulate how many can be per block, right? So that's just kind of me. You know, when I'm looking for affordable housing for clients and I can't find them, but I can find you, you know, 10 to 50 Airbnbs in the same area, it's a problem.
Speaker 2:Or just limit how many licenses they give out. So you have to. There's like a waiting line, as somebody would have to relinquish theirs before you get another one. I've seen cities like that, like Colorado, does that a lot, where you have to apply for it. You got to wait till one's available, then you get it, and there's only so many, which makes it more coveted by the Airbnb owners anyways.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and it should. I mean there has to be some kind of regulations. I'm not trying to take away anybody's rights here, but you know, golly, we got to think about single family residences and how important they are to our economy and they have to be available for people to buy and live in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, corporations are buying them up and doing it Well I was going to say it's a tragedy.
Speaker 3:That's just a minor. The whole Airbnb thing is a minor thing for the big big companies that are coming in and just doing the longer term rentals, because at the end of the day both of those, if anything more, the longer rentals they're. They're taken away from people that you know will never get to see the dream of owning a home.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's true. I mean, I believe in harm reduction, harm reduction. So is it harmful and how can we reduce the harm that it's impacting our community? So, and then let's talk about Zillow and the harm that it causes.
Speaker 1:Come on, yeah, didn't really understand the concept of Zillow until my sister became a real estate agent and she took her first listing and we're on Zillow, we're looking, and I was like, oh, I'm going to click to request information, that's going to tell you. And I clicked to request information on her listing. And another agent reaches out to me and I'm like, what is this? You know? And so then I'm like researching and I'm like, oh, so they can pay to buy, like a certain zip code, and then they get all of the leads and they're going to get your buyer, versus you getting the buyer, maybe making a little bit more money, possibly, and it could be a person.
Speaker 1:Here's what irks me is when someone buys leads, let's say, in North Tulsa, but they've never been to North Tulsa. They won't go to North Tulsa, they don't frequent, they don't have friends there, they don't have kids in school there, they don't live there, they typically won't even drive there after dark, but they're buying leads there. That bothers me. Rural communities they're buying leads there. We get a buyer under contract. I get a message oh, I didn't know there wasn't a grocery store in this town. How could you not know? Why would you buy leads in a town where you don't know the simplest little facts about that? So for me, if you're going to do business in a town, have some heart in it.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean. Know about the town, know about the people. Don't just make it about the leads, the leads, the leads, the leads. So for me and you'd be surprised most of the top producing agents in a lot of the brokerages are Zillow agents who you know. They've got a big team and they have to find a way to feed the machine and buy leads for their buyers' agents. So Zillow is the path of least resistance for them to do that. So we see it a lot.
Speaker 2:Plus, they have a master plan of taking over. Right, they do.
Speaker 1:They do. But like I told my husband we were talking about the NAR thing. I said I'm not so much worried because I take care of my community and I know they're going to always take care of me. So as far as that I'm just kind of like, eh. But I mean it really is hard for the experienced agents out there. We take our job seriously. This is a career, it's a passion. And then you get a brand new agent who just bought their first Zillow lead and they don't know what they're doing and you're having to basically handle everything in the transaction because they were able to buy a lead. And that's also a big hindrance too when you're a busy agent, I mean taking that extra time to hold another agent's hand through a transaction is a lot.
Speaker 1:So I try to be very nice and kind because I remember when I was new. But there's just so much of it right now.
Speaker 3:My two cents, too on this. On the Zillow stuff, so many people get into the mindset of like I'm not busy. That's normally when people want to buy leads, right, right. And then you buy leads and then your phone starts ringing and then you get this like feeling it's like you're busy, it's a high Right, but then let's meet again in like three months or six months. It's like hey, out of those 10 people that called you that day from Zillow, from the, the leads that you bought, how many have you closed? Right, and that's where people don't want to see, or the actual profit of it. I've introduced you to a guy that that we met, that he's paying $600 a lead right now. $600 a lead right now, wow. And the conversion rate is probably, like I would say, like 2%, 3% and it's like Well it's a, they get you, it's a gerbil wheel.
Speaker 2:They just get you into this wheel where you're like, well, in order for me to pay them now I have to get these leads, so that I and so like, it's this wheel. And then they call you and they go, hey, I got another zip code, this. And then you're like, well, if I get a little more leads, I can maybe afford the payment, and it's well.
Speaker 3:I just talked to another agent too this week and she said I'm paying a thousand dollars a month and I'm getting one to two leads a month. And then she said, but honestly, and she did go into telling me that she was like it used to be a lot better than it is now and all this stuff. But she says I'm just afraid and I truly believe that a lot of agents feel this way they're like, even though this isn't performing right now or it hasn't been performing for the last 12 months, I'm afraid to give this zip code up because if I want it back later, I'm not going to be able to get it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's so many different things that like there is, there is, and the zestimate too.
Speaker 1:The zestimate really gets people, especially in the rural areas and the payment the payment the payment, that payment scenario not realistic.
Speaker 1:You're not realistic. You're living in la la land. Okay, I try to make like little funny videos to be able to talk about zillow and all that and it's really good, easy content. But you know, we had one in cleveland, a lady of course no inventory, so she finds it for sell by owner. I'm helping her buy and the seller's. Like you know, I don't want to work with an agent. I got my value on zillow and I think the appraisal came in $10,000 over.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so they missed out on that.
Speaker 1:So, even if she would have paid a realtor and everything, she still would have made like $5,000 more. And so, believe me, I'll let her know After the deal closed. I let her know.
Speaker 2:I was like you know it's too bad. You lost some money.
Speaker 1:You left some money on the table.
Speaker 2:What are your opinions or thoughts on this NAR ruling? The payout, the future. What does the future hold? What's really going to change? Because what I have found in situations like this is loopholes get found. Everybody freaks out oh my gosh, this is going to be terrible. I can't believe it. Buyer's agents aren't going to be able to make money anymore. And then there's a loophole found and they got to add one line to the contract and it's business as usual. What are your opinions about it?
Speaker 1:Well, unpopular opinion is. You know there needed to be something needed to happen.
Speaker 2:Something needed to happen to what?
Speaker 1:Two reasons to the commission. Number one I'm tired of agents not showing certain listings because of a commission. I had an agent who refused to drive to Sperry and show my listing. This was just last year. Refused to drive to Sperry and show my listing. She's in Bixby because she couldn't make 4%. She wanted me to make 2% and her make 4%. She did not show to her buyer.
Speaker 2:So she called you and said either give me four or I won't show your home.
Speaker 1:Literally flat out said if I can't make 4% off this cause, I have to drive from Bixby. I'm like honey. I just drove to Pawhuska today like an hour. What are we talking about? Are we in the same universe?
Speaker 3:right now. I just it made me think of the one Pawhuska closing I went to.
Speaker 1:Oh, he came to one closing in Pahuska and after he's like you drive out here all the time, I'm like, yeah, it's relaxing for me. I don't know.
Speaker 2:You better not have gone to visit, you know? Oh yeah, we don't go there.
Speaker 1:So there's one. There's one reason as you know, the consumer, their needs, did kind of get put on the back burner. You know, because a lot of agents, they are working for the money, not helping the people. Okay, that was a problem, it's a problem. And then you know, the second thing is I hate to say it, I'm a socialist. Okay, you know, I'm not sitting here being a capitalist. So I think that if you sell a $500,000 house, like making 30,000 off that, it's a little steep.
Speaker 1:You know, what I mean. Do I exist in that price range? I don't, and so I can look at that commission and be like that's a little much. You know I would have reduced it to 5% to help the person out 5% to you and 3% to them, or 5% to 2.5% to 2.5%.
Speaker 3:Right 2.5%, 2.5% of course.
Speaker 1:But you know, and so I do look at those things and I'm just like maybe there needs to be a cap on a commission. But I'm also not working in that $500,000 to a million, I don't know what it takes to sell that kind of house. You know what I mean it could take more money, more marketing, more time, all of that that they think that they're worth that.
Speaker 2:How would you define? What are they getting sued for? I mean honestly, because you know you hear a lot of variations of this. So what do you think?
Speaker 1:It's basically about putting the commission in the MLS and saying, hey, I'll offer you this if you bring me a buyer. So from now on, the commission's not going to be in the MLS.
Speaker 2:It's negotiable.
Speaker 1:It's going to be negotiated directly. You know, agent to agent.
Speaker 2:Well, so the total commission won't even be in there Like 6%. It won't even say 6%.
Speaker 1:It won't say it.
Speaker 2:Because now it says three and three or two and a half and two and a half. Yeah, now none of it will be in there and it's all part of the negotiation.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Are you negotiating with the seller in your listing agreement though?
Speaker 1:I am. I mean, I'm going to go ahead and handle that upfront and just explain the situation of if we don't offer a buyer's agent something you know, because this is the world we live in and people aren't going to work for free.
Speaker 3:And.
Speaker 1:I would say 80% of the people here in Northeast Oklahoma cannot afford their own buyer's agent, Unless you're just going to charge $500, maybe $1,000 or something like that which I have. I've represented people for $500. I've represented people for $250. I've done it done it.
Speaker 2:So now, when a buyer puts an offer in and a realtor prepares the offer, they're going to say $250,000 price, 5,000 seller concessions, 3% buyer agent commission. It'll be in the offer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's what's going to clearly look like. And here's another thing is you know, at Keller Williams I have to say we're on the up and up with our paperwork and so I'm guessing because I saw this verbiage was in there that people were entering into broker agreements with buyers without executing an agreement. You know, at Keller we're not supposed to go show them a house or anything until we show them the buyer broker service agreement and then we disclose to them what those brokerage broker duties are and what it means to them. Now, when I do that, I do it here's the paper copy and I'm also going to send you an email explaining to you what you're signing and you're going to sign it on dot loop. That way I know and they know we covered this. So I always double check myself and cover myself, because I want people to feel informed. I don't ever want them to feel like they don't know what's going on in their transaction. And that's something I really reiterate to people at front is I want you to feel comfortable moving forward. That is my priority. And so knowing about the money obviously is a big deal.
Speaker 1:You know, buyers, agents and I've always said this to and I guess people just aren't saying it. I guess they're not saying it, but I've always said you know, I don't make any money until closing my commissions paid out of the seller funds. And I'm assuming some people didn't know this, some sellers didn't understand this. And when I explain it to a seller, you know, I just say you know I reduce my commission a lot. There's very few listings where I'm 6%. It just I'm already negotiating my commission. It's already part of my wheelhouse.
Speaker 1:So the way I run my business isn't going to change a lot. But you know I do have those conversations with sellers is. You know we can't expect a buyer's agent to work for free and you know it is something that definitely enhances the listing whenever there's some kind of commission there. So now it's just all going to be a negotiation. I'm not too worried about it. I mean I think people here in Oklahoma they're not going to get too kicked around about it because our average sales price is still in that like 270, 260 range. You know we're not dealing with a lot of money here.
Speaker 3:But what was it a couple of years ago? Right, it's gone up quite a bit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's gone from like 160s 170s.
Speaker 3:And, like I said, I know this specific podcast is mainly for loan officers, real estate, but if anybody honestly, even within those same people that are thinking and potentially making a move, what I'm kind of scared of is, right now, where the rates are at. People are like I want the rates to come down before I start looking. That's what we're hearing from a lot of buyers and for every one whole percentage that rate goes down, five new million buyers come into the market, which all that's going to be doing. It's going to keep. It's going to keep driving prices up. For instance, 2019, we're up like 46, 48% in appreciation. So if this comes in and and, like you said, not very many buyers can afford the closing costs and the down payment, let alone a buyer's agent fee, and they try to build it into the price that's just going to keep making prices even higher and higher and higher. So anybody that's looking to buy I mean it's always better to buy sooner rather than later.
Speaker 3:Ashley, thank you so much for coming. I know that you've worked so hard to get to where you're at and the biggest thing that I got from your story today is, since day one, you've been invested in helping people and you're still doing that today, and you are a perfect reminder of somebody that I can think of that in this business, people want to stand for everything to be able to be like, to be able to get business, and one thing that I've noticed consistently about you since I've met you in 2018 is that you stand up for what you believe and, at the end of the day, that's what's kind of driven your business to where it's at today. So, anybody listening, make sure that you stay true to yourself, and I really appreciate you coming on.
Speaker 1:Thank you guys.
Speaker 3:You guys are awesome you stay true to yourself and I really appreciate you coming on. Thank you guys. You guys are awesome. This is Ashley Crawford, daly, and she's the real deal. Alfredo always goes into this space when he says that Every single time.
Speaker 1:I love that. I love that tagline it's good, you like it Good.
Speaker 3:Right. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you, guys, you.