From Systems Change To Sweet Relief: Joy Marsh On Liberation, Baking, And Belonging

Healing doesn’t have to shout to be powerful. Sometimes it looks like a steady whisk, a kitchen scale, and the quiet joy of a macaron rising just right. We sit down with Joy Marsh—social scientist, strategist, and the heart behind Minneapolis’s Blissful Cakery—to talk about the craft of staying whole while doing hard things. Joy has led transformational change inside city government, healthcare, and nonprofits, and she opens up about what liberation means in practice: precise language, shared accountability, and centering Black and Indigenous women, trans and non-binary people so everyone can experience safety, peace, and joy.

We trace the arc from burnout and news fatigue to boundaries and ritual. Joy explains how baking became her counterbalance to systems work—not as escape, but as a mindful practice where inputs and outcomes finally align. Measure, fold, rest, pipe. That embodied focus calms her ADHD brain and creates room for pattern-finding and creative strategy. You’ll hear candid reflections on entrepreneurship as an introvert, the courage to narrow your lane, and the humility it takes to learn from younger generations who refuse to make peace with harm.

Along the way, we celebrate macarons as both art and metaphor: playful color, surprising flavors, and the discipline to try again when the shells crack. Joy shares what’s next for Blissful Cakery, from monthly pop-ups to holiday gifting and a vision to teach baking as a regulation tool for organizers and caregivers carrying heavy stories. We close with a mindful moment that grounds the conversation in something simple and true—cooking connects us to ourselves, and the care we practice in the kitchen is the care we can carry back into community.

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Transcript

Welcome & Grounding Breath

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome to the Cake Therapy Podcast, a slice of joy and healing with your host, Dr. Altricia Foster. This is a heartwarming and uplifting space that celebrates the transformative power of baking therapy. The conversations will be a delightful blend of inspirational stories, expert insights, and practical baking tips. Each episode will take listeners on a journey of self-discovery, emotional healing, and connection to the therapeutic art of baking. There's something here for everyone. So lock in and let's get into it.

Introducing Joy Marsh

SPEAKER_03 0:53

With me, your host, Dr. Trisha Foster. And this is the conversational space of the Cake Therapy Foundation, where we mix healing with the sweetness of human connection. Our mission is clear, and it is to create spaces for women and girls to heal through creativity, connection, and of course, cake. Before we dive into today's conversation, though, I'd love to invite you to take a mindful breath. I'm asking you to pause for a moment, inhale deeply, and then exhale slowly. Feel your feet on the ground and remind yourself that you belong here just as you are. And if you haven't yet followed the Cake Therapy Foundation and Sugarspoon Desserts on all socials, do it now. The links are in the description. Now let's get into it. So today's guest truly lives her name. Joy Marsh joins us. Joy Marsh is a powerhouse of clarity, purpose, and compassion. She's a social scientist, anti-racism activist, she's a business strategist, an executive leader who has led transformational systems change initiatives across educational nonprofits, financial governments, and healthcare spaces. She also happens to be a creative at heart, and she is the face, the owner behind Blissful Cakery, which is also a Minneapolis-based bakery known for known for stunning French macarons and soulful cakes. A venture, which was recently featured in the Minneapolis Monthly Magazine. So hi Joy, welcome to the Cake Therapy Podcast. We're happy to have you today. Thank you so much. I'm really excited to be here. Yeah, we're excited to have you too. I've I've had you on my wish list for a very long time. I did. We've had you on the wish list, I think maybe since season two. So I'm happy to have, you know, gotten you here today. Um, so we're both in Minnesota, so we know it's nippy outside. So just want to do like a check-in. How are you today, though?

Pop-Ups, Introversion, And Entrepreneurship

SPEAKER_00 3:03

How am I today? Um, you know, overall, I feel like I'm in a pretty good spot today. I'm uh sort of in some life transitions around work and around my business. And as you can imagine, that means that there's some ebbs and flows, some ups and downs. And today is has been a day that's gone really well. I set an intention to get some things done. I was able to get those things done, so I feel pretty good. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:28

You recently had uh a pop-up though. How did that go? That was last weekend, right?

SPEAKER_00 3:33

Yes, I did. So last Saturday I was I participated in a pop-up, which is not usual for me. I mean, my business started out in my home, and that's where it existed for a really long time. And so pop-ups are kind of new. So I don't always necessarily have a lot of super clear expectation. And this was not only a pop-up, but it was in a new place that I've never done it before. So a new customer base. But overall, I was really encouraged by my long-term fans who've come out, who came out and support, supported me and the opportunity to engage with new folks. So overall, it was great. My my daughter came, my youngest daughter came and hung out with me as well. So it was it was a good day. Yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_03 4:12

Kudos to you because for me, I'm like I'm I'm an introvert of heart, and I couldn't do pop-ups. I can't do pop-ups and can't do tears. Yeah, because of what I am, and I've given up on the idea of go having pop-ups and stuff like that. So kudos to you.

SPEAKER_00 4:31

Well, what's wild is I'm also an introvert. Um, and it takes it does take a different level of energy. It really does. It takes a whole different level of energy, both to get out of the house, to agree to do it, to to to participate in it, and then as soon as it was over, I'm right back home and quiet, yeah, recovery.

SPEAKER_03 4:50

It's it's amazing what entrepreneurship does, how it pushes you out of outside of your comfort zone. Um, and I've been in business for a long time, but I just cannot get over the hurdle.

SPEAKER_00 5:01

That's real. I your your point about a pushing out of your comfort zone. Absolutely. I mean, there's nothing like it. I've worked in a lot of different fields, I've done a lot of different jobs, and there is nothing like entrepreneurship at all.

Beyond Cake: Identity And Purpose

SPEAKER_03 5:14

Yeah. So um, I want to, you know, we've been chit-chatting about your entrepreneurship journey, blissful cakri. So we've been chit-chatting about your entrepreneurship journey, blissful cakeri. But what I want, where I want to start, is where I initially met you and how, well, it's been eMeet, of course. We haven't met in person, but I want to start the conversation there because I don't want people to think that you're just cake. There's so many layers to you, and I want girls to hear from you about what you do, and I want girls to hear about your entrepreneurship journey, your journey in cake, why you started it. But I'm gonna start at a place where it's really personal to me because for me, I try very hard to let people know that I'm not just cake. There's so many layers to me, and I want you to speak to that. So I'm gonna um simply start about your background and helping institutions heal from harm. Will you allow me to go there right now? Yes, let's go there. Of course. So, what do you think about healing and and liberation joy? What do those words mean to you personally?

Defining Healing And Liberation

SPEAKER_00 6:31

Before I answer your question, I just want to name how much I appreciate you setting the context around all of the layers that you have. I mean, I've read your book, so I'm I have a pretty good understanding of who you are. Um and I share that that uh that that thought about myself and that I'm I'm more than someone who bakes. I have a lot of different elements to who it is that I am, and it's easy to for that to get lost when people know you in a single slice of your life. And as some as someone who's in a space of trying to discern what's next professionally, um, it's important that I don't lose sight of that and that the people around me don't lose sight of the fact that I do more than bake. And so thank you for that, for that context setting. That actually means a lot to me, probably more than you know. Um as it relates to liberation um and healing, for me, this is this is the lifelong work that I feel like I am deeply committed to for myself first and foremost. Um, and and then being able to show up in community as the most healed version of myself every single day. I don't think I'm ever gonna reach full healing. I mean, trauma, harm, it happens all the time, every single day, especially when you're in a body that holds a lot of identities, that um systems and structures persistently marginalize and harm, yeah, whether intentionally or unintentionally, the trauma is gonna always come. But you know, my goal is to show up as healed as I can because that's what I feel like is my responsibility to the community that I live in and to the family that I have and the people with whom I come in contact, if it's um in a in a small transactional way at the store, if it's uh a close friend, like I want to be the most healed version of myself. And um, because I recognize how important that is to me, um, and as someone who has spent the greater part of her career helping systems and structures wrestle with these sort of questions, um, I do feel like it's a responsibility that I have to be in partnership with others and thinking about the ways in which we can be a better, more benevolent society.

SPEAKER_03 8:41

Yeah. But when you when you think about like schools and um systems of government, right? Institutional healing, how does that connect to liberation for you? How do you view that?

Institutional Harm And Collective Accountability

SPEAKER_00 8:54

Oh, um, schools, systems, um, structures, institutions, everybody has a part to play. Like there's like uh liberation requires everybody understanding the part that they're playing in their harm and taking action to do something about it. Um, it's not just about people having self-care days or mental health breaks or going to the spa or taking care of themselves. I mean, that's important, but um, but ultimately there's an accountability, I believe, in everyone doing what their part is and showing up in a way that helps to make sure that we're creating a much more um supportive ecosystem that recognizes everyone's humanity. So, yes, education systems, government systems, philanthropy, the private sector, nonprofit sector, everybody has a part to play. Everybody is complicit in the harm that happens. And so everybody has a responsibility to recognize and to do their part. Not everybody knows that, not everybody does that or accepts that truth, but I believe that that's fundamentally true.

SPEAKER_03 9:55

Yeah, you know, like I I've been in systems, you know, I've done this kind of work and it's often so demanding. And I would love to hear from you, or I want our listeners to hear from you how demanding this work is, and like what has healing asked of you lately?

SPEAKER_00 10:17

The work is it's a lot. Um, and particularly when you're someone who pays attention to what's happening in the world and you feel a draw towards care for your neighbor, for yourself, it's a lot. I think we're over inundated with information, um, locally, nationally, internationally, about what's happening in the world and just the extent to which harm is taking place. Some of it's real information, some of it's fake information, but a lot of it is just a lot of it.

SPEAKER_01 10:49

Yeah.

Overwhelm, News Fatigue, And Boundaries

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Um, and so it can become exceptionally overwhelming, um, especially when you attempt to hold all of it and try to wrap your arms around and fully embrace the complexity of the harm, particularly understanding just how long it's been happening, like since the formation of this nation, if we just keep it localized to the United States, the harm has always been present for hundreds and hundreds of years. And even knowing that um and seeing how it continues to play out, how it morphs um in its very nature, is it's a lot and it can become exceptionally difficult on your body to be able to stay healed yourself or you know, work towards healing yourself in the midst of that. Um it and and honestly, it's it's because of that complexity, which is how I got into baking in the first place.

SPEAKER_03 11:37

Yeah, yeah. I'm happy you went there because I was about to say that that I respond to that kind of demand in my kitchen. And I wanted to know from you what how you respond to that particular demand because I know how entrenched you are in this work. You know, don't take her lightly. She is a beast in it um in responding to these causes. So tell me how you respond to this kind of harm or this demand on you.

Baking As Counterbalance And Mindfulness

SPEAKER_00 12:06

Um I have had to learn, I started off in this work attempting to hold it all, or attempting to hold a lot of that um when it relates to the harm, attempting to have my hand in a lot of different issue areas and um responding to a lot of different pain that I saw in community. And uh and reached the point where it was, it was too much for me. It was, it was too much for my nervous system, it was too much for my mental health, it was too much for the relationships that I'm in, it was too, it was too much for my life to try to hold all of that. And um, I turned to baking as a counterbalance um to help me have a process that I knew that if I follow the steps, right? If I follow the recipe and I use my scale and I measure precisely and I do all the things and I preheat in my oven and I prepare my pants, if I do all the things that I'm going to get the sweet reward. Yeah. I did not find that to be the case in the rest of the work that I was doing. So today, steps that I might take to organize people or steps that I might take to advocate for policy change, one day it might work, the next day it might, even though I haven't changed my behavior necessarily. And so baking was that mindful counterbalance to that. Um, but what I will say as far as like my expansive sort of focus on on attempting to boil the ocean of oppression and and harm, is I've had to learn to get clearer about what's my, what is my contribution? Like what are the areas that are my areas to actually do something about? What is my specific path towards liberation for myself? And how does that um open me up to be in partnership with others who are also seeking their liberation, but narrowing my focus and trusting that other people are probably out there doing the same thing. And while I might see that harm is happening around me, it may not necessarily be my fire to go help put out, yeah, but to stay focused on what my thing is. And what's interesting, even as I'm saying this, I think the same thing about my baking. Like I can bake a lot of different things, but not everything that I bake brings me the same level of joy. Okay. And I'm not as good at everything that I could bake. And so I've just as I've had to be much more refined and disciplined in how I show up in community and how I address social harm, I've had to do the same thing in my baking. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:35

So you you you spoke a little bit about the intention about measuring and being meticulous for that sweet res this that sweet result, like you mentioned, use the word sweet. Was there an actual moment when you realized that being in the kitchen was doing something deeper than just making something sweet, that it was actually restoring something inside of you?

ADHD, Focus, And Kitchen Precision

SPEAKER_00 14:59

You know, what's it was when I was working at the city of Minneapolis, I will say the work that I did there was probably the most aligned with how I want to be in the world. It was looking at deep, it was looking deeply at systems instructors. It was really being inside the belly of the beast, but doing so in close partnership with people, both employees of the city, community members, wrestling with policy, thinking about opportunities to bring about greater healing, working to um equip community to be the sort of people that could care for themselves. Like that was it was amazing work. It is, you know, professionally, probably the best work that I've ever done. And it was also the hardest work I've ever done. And so I found myself doing lots and lots of baking. I didn't necessarily put those two things together at the beginning, but I was I had a reputation inside the city enterprise, like Joy brought something. It's in the break room, and I was doing a lot of it. And I was like, I need to find a way to like monetize this self-care because actually you know, like baking is not a cheap sort of hobby to have on the side. And so I began to do more of it and started the business as a result of that. And then it was in that sort of starting of the business and really leaning into it that I that I really began to recognize the role that baking played in relationship to the rest of my life.

SPEAKER_03 16:22

Do you feel like the the kitchen and and and baking was somewhat a language of liberation for you, reclaiming your actual joy and creativity in the world?

SPEAKER_00 16:33

I believe that baking was for me in service to my own commitment to my healing. Um, and what I mean by that is the practice of it allowed me to shift my brain, to shift my body in a different sort of way that helped me to heal. It gave me the space to think about what was happening outside of the kitchen while I pipe macarons or make some salted caramel. Like it helped me to think about these things in more of a detached type of way while I focused on something else.

SPEAKER_03 17:14

You say uh a detached kind of way. Can you expound for our listeners?

Transparency For Youth And Community

SPEAKER_00 17:20

Yeah, so detached in the sort of way. So, you know, full disclosure, I have ADHD, and so my brain does a lot of different things. And so learning how to operate with this neurodivergent mind, um, it's really easy for me to get like hyper-focused into a thing, um, and to just be like heads down all the way into it. And with the job, particularly working at the city or in other work that I've done in community around uh racial and social justice, it's easy to get like overly consumed into that and lose sight of yourself, whether you've gone too far, whether you've you're filleting yourself on behalf of some issue and not caring for yourself. So the stepping into the kitchen, the the sort of detachment is is that because baking is very precise, you can't like sort of like half-brain baking. I can't. I have to pay attention. I have to make sure that if I'm scooping sugar, that I'm actually scooping sugar and I'm not scooping salt. Yeah. If I'm if I'm using flour, that I'm actually using all-purpose flour and not tea flour, whatever the recipe calls for. So the focusing intently on that activity allowed the rest of my brain to settle a little bit, and then I could begin to see different patterns and think about things and find different sorts of paths forward for the work outside of the kitchen while I was in the kitchen baking.

SPEAKER_03 18:41

Yeah. You know, I actually loved your transparency around ADHD. Because we we serve the young ladies in the in our community. Some of them do, you know, have um ADHD. And I'm happy that they will hear you and hear from you and also hear that you've been successful in spite of, you know, you did not let it be a barrier to your success. You know, um, it's not a barrier to you in the kitchen, it's not a barrier to you in measuring and being precise in your cake or cake artistry. Share with us the importance of really being transparent in our communities and impact, the long-term impact on kids, not just adults. I we're focusing on young people right now. What tell us um share with us the importance of being transparent sometimes, letting our guard down.

SPEAKER_00 19:37

Um, I have found, so I found both in my spiritual practice and someone who grew up in the Christian church, um, and transparency or bearing witness is something that was always reinforced. Um, I believe that my journey towards greater liberation for myself is not just for my benefit.

SPEAKER_03 19:58

Yeah.

Collective Freedom And Centering Marginalized Lives

SPEAKER_00 19:59

Um, I have a responsibility and I also grow. I um I grow from leaning into my the truth of my own story and being willing to share it with others because I don't believe that any one person gets liberated in isolation. I believe that as a society, our liberation is bound, my liberation is bound up in your liberation. Yeah. Your liberation is bound up in your neighbor's liberation. And we don't get free unless we're willing to be honest about how we've arrived in this moment and what it's going to take for us to move to the next moment. Yeah. Um, and the fact that we need each other uh in order to do that. And so the the responsibility around transparency, especially with young people, um, especially with people who are from marginalized communities, persistently marginalized communities, to understand that yes, you can have a career with ADHD. You can start a business, you can lead an organization, you can do many, many things, even with these specific, um, even being a neurodivergent person, even being a woman, even being black, even being queer, even having a disability, all of these things. And the more we're willing to talk about that, the more we help someone else to take a step towards their own freedom. So I think it's very important to be transparent. And I don't um I don't mean that people have to share all their business with everyone, but when you have an opportunity to speak that sort of life into someone else, then take it.

SPEAKER_03 21:34

Yeah, absolutely. Um, what Joy has shared is that you can, you can, you can. I've heard like six or seven you can. And I don't think that if you have a disability, it should be a barrier to your success. You can, you can, you can, and you should go after it. I I've been like I'm super OCD, right? And I've been Stephanie and I have been going. Going over your bio, and uh she pulled out this um in our conversation. In your bio, you actually wrote that none of us are truly free, and I'm reading verbatim here, until black and indigenous women, non-binary, and trans people are free. That statement to me carries so much truth and urgency. But what does collective freedom look like to you? Because you mentioned our collective freedom are is actually tied um with to each other. Um, I don't want you to give me in terms of or respond to it, not in an abstract idea, but as something that you've actually seen, touched, or even tasted in the work that you've done in the community.

Learning From Younger Generations

SPEAKER_00 22:45

Um, I believe that collective freedom um requires precise language, and it requires us being willing to be really, really specific about where the harm is, where the harm is the greatest, um, and to speak into that. Um, collective liberation is rooted in a fundamental belief that all people are human and need to be treated with dignity. We recently had a chance to go and hear Tanahassi Coates speak. Um, and he said something that I was like, yes, that resonated with me. He made a comment that he believes, and I hope I'm not misquoting him, but that his his hope is that all people are able to experience joy, peace, and safety. Yeah. When I think about what collective liberation means, it means that we lead with love, we lead with grace, we lead with a desire that every single human being is able to experience joy, peace, and safety. And if we're able to do that fundamentally as people, then I believe that our orientation around harm, systemic harm, structural harm is going to change significantly. What we're willing to tolerate as far as the treatment of someone else, even if the person looks like us, worships differently than we do or doesn't worship at all, has a lifestyle that's different than the one that we would choose for ourselves. If we are rooted in love, we lead with grace, we fundamentally believe in everyone's humanity and their dignity, we're gonna treat these people very differently than I see us as a society treating people, especially black women, indigenous women, trans people, and non-binary people, we're gonna treat people very, very differently. And the reason I have that in my bio is because I do believe that that's true. I believe that we look at the data, when we look how communities are being impacted, if we serve the needs of these communities and we're and we're specific in our focus of how systems and structures are impacting black women, indigenous women, trans and non-binary people, and we solve for their sense of safety, peace, and joy, we will solve for everyone.

SPEAKER_03 24:53

Yeah, we will solve for everyone. But so when you think about the next generation of girls coming behind you, what do you hope they learn from watching the way you lead, create and love?

Legacy And Choosing Healing Practices

SPEAKER_00 25:07

Oh, you know, honestly, I am in a place where I strive to be real humble in the face of young people who are coming behind me. Um, the young people, uh, like I've got kids, I've got kids who have my oldest is 34, my youngest is 27. Um these kids, they are built different. And I love it. I'm here for it. The the level of questioning that exists in younger generations that are coming, the the intolerance for harm, uh, the level of acceptance that I see within younger generations, their critique, which sometimes is hard to hear if you're a millennial or if you're a Gen Xer or a boomer, it's sometimes it's hard to hear. But the truth and the pain behind their questions and their pushback, their challenges, their expectations, I feel like each of us who are in older generations ought to be in a position of deep humility and willingness to listen. Um what I hope that they might learn from me uh and in my example is I strive to be someone who is willing to interrogate what I've learned. I'm willing to question the things that I always thought were true, um, that I was always told were true, that were absolute truths. And I am learning every single day how to live with deeper curiosity, with a deeper openness to how other people live their lives in a way that is without judgment, um, but in a way that is that is uh rooted in my own belief that the path forward means everybody is able to help influence what the path forward looks like. And we start with the place of from a place of understanding of how we've arrived here, recognizing that all of us, specifically those of us who are much older, have a lot of unlearning to do. Um, that there's a lot more truth out there than what it is that we're holding fast to.

SPEAKER_03 27:07

Yeah. What is the legacy that you'd like to be for blissful cakery?

SPEAKER_00 27:12

Um, the legacy I want to leave for blissful cakery is that for me, um, what it has represented for me is a path to my own liberation, mainly in my mind, more than anyone before it started. Um, and so the legacy I'd like to leave is that it's possible to choose a path for yourself that is focused on how you heal and how you um attend to yourself, particularly when you are inside of a body that holds a lot of identities that experience harm on a daily basis, that it is it is in your best interest. It is of value to you and to the community where you live for you to choose something. It doesn't have to be baking, it's not in your body. That's fine. But but to choose something that helps you come return to yourself, yeah. Um, and to heal so that you can show up um in these places in a way um that helps you stay aligned, stay inside your body from a somatic perspective, but stay inside your body and stay connected to yourself and not lose yourself in the midst of all of the awfulness that sometimes is happening.

SPEAKER_03 28:24

Yeah. Um, let's talk about uh that let's let's dive a little bit deeper in blissful cake and where you are with it. I follow you on Instagram, so I want our listeners to know are you doing blissful cake re full time or are you doing, you know, systems work? Like how where does it stand right now?

Marrying Systems Work With Baking

SPEAKER_00 28:43

Yeah, that is such a great question. Um, so I was working in uh a healthcare role, uh leading equity work for an organization for a few years when I left the city and separated from the organization earlier this year, not because they're not committed to DEI, not because of all of the things people are hearing. It was just the time the separate requisition was eliminated. And so in that moment, I leaned into baking because I like baking. And you know, like I've already stated it, it kind of helps me think about the rest of the world. And honestly, full disclosure, I think I leaned a little too far into it. Um, in the sense that uh I've what I'm learning over the course of the last few weeks is just how important it is that my the blissful cake remain my baking holds a very specific place in my life. It's not the lead character in my life, but it is a very strong supporting character. It might get a daytime any. I mean, it really does. It really does play a very, very important role in my life, but my heart is completely, completely belongs to systems change, to structural change, to building bridges in community, to working collectively to fix the world and make the world a more benevolent place for everybody that lives inside of it. That is the core of who I am. And as far as blissful cakery, I have been in real deep discernment lately about actually how to marry those two things together. Um, and so I've been doing a lot of talking with people and thinking about what it looks like to share with the world this baking as a counterbalance to the complexity of trying to fight for a more uh humane and just society. Yeah, I have been there.

SPEAKER_03 30:27

So, and that's why that that answer was important to me because I I struggled for a long time with these two identities, right? As a public health practitioner, and uh, I call myself a premier baker in the city who wants to really hold on to the identity of being a baker, but then following the other passion of the science, right? Um, systems change, community engagement, and just marrying those two. And that's where I founded the Cake Therapy Foundation. How am I gonna use the kitchen to change people's lives? But at the same time, I I still set fastly try to hold on to my identity around the system work that I do because it really is important, and I'm not saying that cake is not important, um, but I still wanted to hold down to do things, those two things, and I wanted to get your feedback on how you were managing and balancing those and how you're merging those as well. So that that was the question for me.

Divine Timing And Discernment

SPEAKER_00 31:36

Yeah, and you know, I feel like my vision for how it comes together is a little bit early days, but I'm really excited about what you are doing with the Cake Therapy podcast and and how you're finding that balance. Yeah. Because you have a very impressive academic and professional background, and you're doing really impressive work, and you also bake. I saw that cake for Betty Crocker. Oh, thank you. No, no, it's phenomenal. Thank you. Um, and so finding ways to marry those two things together. So, you know, when I think about like my legacy for Blissful Cake Ray, honestly, I want my own version of whatever a bake therapy uh podcast, a cake therapy podcast is. I want to be able to think about how do I expand this and make actually make this experience that I've had more accessible and translatable to other people. And I feel like that's what you're doing with the Cake Therapy podcast, and I'm looking for my own version of that.

SPEAKER_03 32:33

Yeah, absolutely. And it it's it's tough, and you have to be innovative, and you have your nice many you're thinking, like, man, did I walk away from that security to do this work? Is it worth it? So you're gonna be questioning yourself a trillion times, but trust me, it is worth it, and you will find that balance, um, and you're gonna find it when you least expect it. That's what I'm gonna say. But it's gonna come. I think the first step is leaning into something that you're super passionate about and then start working your way back to finding that balance. And I think that that that would be my advice.

SPEAKER_00 33:13

Yeah, that's uh that that advice is right on time. Um, I really appreciate that reminder that it that it will come in the time that it's meant to come. Uh, you know, that the tree will bear fruit in its season. And in the meantime, I need to just tend the soil, be patient, um, and and and wait for it. That's my as my therapist would say, that's my lifelong work. Yeah. Staying, staying in that place of like, I want to be in a place of readiness. I don't want to feel anxious about needing to take a step or feeling like I have to jump into something in order to fill a box or quote be productive, but to instead be like, let's just take the time. I do really feel exceptionally supported with my spouse, with my community, around being in this season, being able to take the time to discern. And so one day I'm gonna have whatever my cake therapy podcast is, whatever, whatever it won't be a podcast, but whatever my version of it is.

SPEAKER_03 34:13

Absolutely. And from what just write everything down, every random idea that comes to you, just jot it down, or even send voice notes to yourself. That's that's how I've I've done it all. Like I sent voice notes to myself and I write it down. So it will come, Joy. Trust me. Once you step out in faith and believing that this is part of your calling or your purpose, it will all fall. It's scary, but it will all fall into face.

Macarons: Craft, Play, And Preference

SPEAKER_00 34:43

You know, what is so amazing, and so I'm just gonna like speak about this and from a very spiritual perspective. Like, I don't believe in coincidence. I don't believe, um, I believe that everything happens when it's intended to happen. And I will say that I my readiness for this exact conversation and the perspective that you just shared with me, like this week, yeah, is very different than it would have been a week ago, right? We were supposed to talk last week and then Hurricane Melissa came and did whatever it is that it did. I don't know that I would have been as ready in that moment last week if you had tiered that as I was this week. And so, you know, just sort of like a high five for divine for divine timing. Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 35:25

And maybe if if we had had the this this conversation even two years ago when we made our initial intro, right? I wasn't ready to leave the public health space. Uh, I'm sure you weren't ready to leave the public health space either. So the conversation definitely would uh have been different for sure.

SPEAKER_00 35:47

It would have been so different two years ago. I would not have even imagined what it would have looked like. I would have thought, what are you talking about? That's not even a thing. I bake when I bake and I go to work, and I was so head-focused on what I was doing. So absolutely. Everything happens in the divine time. Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 36:04

So uh I love your macarons. Clearly, clearly, the community loves your macarons. Is that your favorite dessert to make? Tell me.

SPEAKER_00 36:15

Um honestly, it is. The thing about macarons is that they just offer such a wide range of creativity. And I have um, I've made a lot of different kinds of macarons, like a lot of them, a lot of different flavors, and I've like put things together and tried them. I've done savory, I've done sweet, and it's rare that something doesn't work. It's rare that something doesn't work. And the color combinations, the flavor combinations, the the uh it's not effortless, it took a long time to learn how to make them, but but um, but it's they're just magic, the way that they come together. They're they are definitely my favorite thing to make. Full disclosure, they're not my favorite thing to eat, but they're my favorite thing to make.

SPEAKER_03 37:03

Well, they're the my least favorite thing to make. Okay. Take time, they fail. Oh my goodness, they're not my favorite things to make. So, but so I love seeing your your vibrant colors. I love seeing how perfectly round and raised, and they all got these perfect little feet, and I'm like, okay. So uh so I'm happy. So, what's your favorite dessert to eat? Macarons are your favorite to make, but what's your favorite to eat?

What’s Next For Blissful Cakery

SPEAKER_00 37:36

You know, this is where um talk about like transparency. Honestly, uh I'll try I love like low-grade desserts. I love them. I love a rice crispy bar, I love um some Oreo cookies, some like just some real basic off-the-shelf. Like, if I my go-to is just some real trash desserts. However, um, if I'm going to eat something that's not just a trash dessert, not to disparage rice krispie treats because I love them. But um, I have a I I really enjoy a well-made cake. A well-made cake is just amazing. So good. I didn't grow up in a house with a lot of cake. Um, I grew up in a house with a lot of cobblers and pies and things like that. But cake was rare, especially like a homemade cake. That was very, very rare that I would have seen something like that. So like a really good piece of cake where someone has put some imagination into it with some real interesting flavor combinations. Yes. Excellent.

SPEAKER_03 38:40

What's next for blissful cakeery?

Where To Find Joy & Upcoming Pop-Ups

SPEAKER_00 38:43

What's next for blissful cakery? I am um slowly building back up to where I feel like my height was, which was like early pandemic, 2020, 2021. Um, as far as operationally, how the business was flowing. Um, things have shifted a bit for me since then. Like I don't live in the same house that I lived in, then I'm not working the same job, I'm in a different relationship. So things are a little bit different. So there's mechanically I need to sort some of those things out because blissful fingering is something that I've committed, um, is going to be a part of my life in some way. Yeah. That is my hope. It took me a long time to make those macarons all round and feet and looking great and tasting great. And so I don't want to lose, I don't want to lose that. Um, however, at the same time, I the next step is also thinking about how do I marry these two worlds together, my deep commitment to bridge building and community building, social impact and baking and figuring out ways to to share the experience um with other people. Where can where can our listeners find you? Um the easiest place for folks to find me, honestly, is gonna be online. I am uh gearing back up to start uh shipping again um my product. And so folks can expect to see those updates coming up online, um, focusing pretty heavily in November and December on like holiday gatherings, packaging things for folks to take for like meals or having things together around the end of the year, thinking about gift giving and making that a bit more accessible for folks who are looking for more interesting ideas on gifts that they can give to folks at a variety of different price points. But that's the next deal. Um and pop-ups, we're thinking like maybe like once a month to do a pop-up. Last week I did the pop-up with the black market um in St. Paul.

SPEAKER_01 40:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:35

And that went really well. I'm scheduled to be there again um in December, and perhaps that'll be my once a month I'm in the world with other people, flexing my ambivalt muscles. Um, and then going home and reminding myself that I'm an introvert. Yeah.

Mindful Moment & Closing Calls To Action

SPEAKER_03 40:50

Man, this has been uh a great conversation. I've I've enjoyed it, and I'm I was happy to not just talk about blissful cake with you. Like I told you at the top of the conversation that there was there's so many facets to you, right? I'd be doing a disservice to our girls and our listeners to not have them hear the full length and breadth of who you are. And I'm truly true, I am grateful. I'm growing, grateful to have met you, to have a conversation with you right now, and especially for you to come here and share your story and not just your story, your spirit, and like we say here at the Cake Therapy Podcast, your slice of joy and healing. Thank you so much, Joy, for joining us.

SPEAKER_00 41:34

Oh my goodness, thank you so much for inviting me. Thank you for the questions that you asked. They were right on time, they're definitely speaking to the level of areas of focus that I'm trying to have for my life. So, yeah, I'm deeply, deeply grateful. Yeah, thank you. I loved having you here.

SPEAKER_03 41:50

I love talking to you. Um and then speaking of reflection, let's take a moment um to be mindful together. Um, wherever you are, settle into your own body, notice your breath, and just allow yourself to be fully present here right now. So today's mindful moment is that cooking connects us to ourselves. Each meal is an invitation to care, to nourish, and to be kind. And if today's conversation resonated with you, follow the Cake Therapy Foundation and Pleaseful Cakery on social media. Check for the links in the episode description. Also, please grab a copy of my books, Cake Therapy, How Baking Changed My Life, and Lessons I Never Learned from My Father. They both share parts of my personal story and the lessons I've learned along the way. You can find them on Amazon and other major book retailers. Just click the links in the episode description. Until next time, be gentle with yourself and keep stirring love into something every day. Thank you so much for joining the Cake Therapy Podcast.

SPEAKER_02 42:56

Thank you for tuning in to the Cake Therapy Podcast. Your support means the world to us. Let us know what you thought about today's episode in the comment section. Remember to subscribe wherever you get your podcast. And if you found the conversation helpful, please share it with a friend. Also follow Sugarspoon Desserts on all social media platforms. We invite you to support Cake Therapy and the work we do with our foundation by clicking on the Buy Me a Coffee link in the description. Or by visiting the Cake Therapy website and making a donation. All your support will go towards the Cake Therapy Foundation and the work we are doing to help women and girls. Thanks again for tuning in, and we'll catch you on the next episode.