#76: Reset Your Nervous System: Understanding Micro Stresses with Dr Tess Browne

Are you feeling constantly frazzled, even though nothing major seems to be going wrong?

In this episode of the Hello Therapy podcast, I'm joined by clinical psychologist, Dr. Tess Browne to explore the powerful impact of "micro stressors", those everyday pressures that silently drain our energy. The conversation delves into how these small stressors affect our nervous system, especially for women and mums juggling work, family, and endless demands.

Tess shares practical, evidence-based strategies for calming your nervous system, even when you’re time-poor, and highlights the importance of self-compassion and connection. Whether you’re struggling with burnout or looking for simple tools to create more calm in your day, this episode offers reassurance and actionable advice to help you feel seen, supported, and empowered.

Highlights include:
03:33 Micro stressors shape modern life
12:27 Unseen stress of motherhood
14:00 The pressure to "have it all"
19:13 Preventing burnout and prioritising self
22:37 Recognising a dysregulated nervous system
23:34 Signs of stress on the body
31:21 Stacking habits for change
34:09 Overcoming challenges of slowing down

This week's guest:
Dr. Tess Browne is a Chartered Clinical and Coaching Psychologist and the founder of The Mind Atelier, a boutique online psychology practice supporting high-achieving women - especially busy mums - to feel calm, confident, and connected. Drawing on over 25 years’ experience, Tess helps women break free from perfectionism, people-pleasing, and self-criticism, and replace them with self-compassion, confidence, and emotional ease. 

As a mum of two, she knows first-hand how easy it is to put pressure on yourself - and how hard it can be to prioritise your own well-being. She’s passionate about making mental health support practical and relatable, breaking down complex psychology into tools women can use in the middle of their real, messy, everyday lives.

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The Hello Therapy podcast and the information provided by Dr Liz White (DClinPsy, CPsychol, AFBPsS, CSci, HCPC reg.), is solely intended for informational and educational purposes and does not constitute personalised advice. Please reach out to your GP or a mental health professional if you need support. 

Transcript

Dr Liz White 0:02

If you're looking to improve your mental health and well-being, then keep listening. I'm Dr. Liz White, a consultant clinical psychologist with over 20 years of experience. Whether you're a frazzled parent, a stressed-out professional, or finding your way through the challenges of midlife, you're in the right place. Through a mix of solo episodes and insightful conversations with expert psychologists and therapists, I'm bringing you evidence-based tools and strategies to help you navigate life's ups and downs with confidence, clarity, and compassion. This is your space to feel seen, supported and empowered. Welcome to Hello Therapy. Have you ever felt like you're juggling a thousand tiny stresses every day, wondering why you feel so frazzled even though nothing big has actually happened? You're not imagining it. Those micro stresses, the small constant pressures that chip away your energy, have a real impact on your nervous system. Today I'm joined by returning guest Dr. Tess Brown, clinical and coaching psychologist and founder of the Mind Atelier. Together we're unpacking what it really feels like to juggle work, family, and the endless stream of daily demands, and why even small stresses can leave you feeling completely drained. We'll talk about the science behind micro stress, how it affects your body and your mind, and Tess shares simple, evidence-based ways to calm your nervous system, even when you've got no time to spare. So if you're ready to discover small, powerful ways to reset your nervous system and reclaim a little more calm in your day, then let's dive in. Thank you so much for joining me on the Hello Therapy Podcast. Can you tell our listeners who you are and what you do?

Dr Tess Browne 2:11

Sure. Well, thank you very much for having me. It's so lovely being here. Yes, my name is Dr. Tess Brown. I'm a clinical psychologist and coach and a founder of the Mind Atelier, which is an online psychology practice. And I specialise in supporting women mainly, particularly mums who are experiencing parental stress, occupational stress, and also traumatic stress. So my clinical specialisms are sort of around the traumatic, trauma, PTSD, and maternal mental health area. So yeah, that's what I mainly do, support them through therapy. I recently started offering retreats, workshops, that sort of thing.

Micro Stressors Shape Modern Life

Dr Liz White 2:55

So today we're going to talk about sort of nervous system functioning, stress, and also how that links in with the experience of being a mum and maybe sort of more broadly being female in today's world. And we tend to think about stress as sort of being like the big things, right? Like, you know, work deadlines or uh difficulties in your marriage or major life changes like moving. But can you talk about the sort of micro stresses that we experience on a day-to-day basis and how how those types of stresses tend to impact us and maybe sort of thinking about what I mean by micro stresses?

Dr Tess Browne 3:33

Yeah, yeah, because I think a lot of the things which I think of as micro stresses, I think a lot of people just brush off as, oh they're just part of life. But actually, when we really look at what life involves nowadays, you know, things like, you know, interruptions, technical glitches, sibling squabbles, notifications on your phone or iPads, exposure to social media posts, news that might kind of be perceived as threatening in some in some way. There is so much of that in modern life. We are constantly exposed to all these micro, and that's what I mean by micro stresses. Our brain is constantly detecting these things. And it, you know, our brain, its job is to detect threats and to keep safe. So it's kind of scanning our environment, taking this information in, and it's sort of sending little pings to our nervous system to say, oh, oh, you know, oh gosh, you've got to get that email replied to, got to sort out that argument, oh, forgot to pay that bill. And so all of these micro stresses get detected by our brain as little threats, which then kind of kickstart a process in our nervous system, which is then how we experience it. I I I read something recently which said that if we were to read a newspaper from front to back now, that would be more information than a human a hundred years ago would have had in their lifetime. Wow. And, you know, okay, we're not sitting there reading newspapers from start to finish, but the amount of information that we are constantly exposed to now, like our brains and our bodies weren't evolved to take in this amounts to this magnitude. So we're still figuring out, yeah, how to how to cope with it all.

Dr Liz White 5:30

Yeah. And it's not just any information, is it, that we're being bombarded with. And I because I'm just thinking about like recent news events and wars, and it it's re it's really heavy stuff, isn't it? It's not the news is never really anything positive. And there's so much to process and be worried about and be appalled by, and it's a lot, isn't it? And I think it becomes normalized that we just you know look at our phones and and that pops up and then we go about our day. I'm interested in what you said there about nervous system functioning. So that gets talked about a lot, doesn't it? But I think sometimes maybe a lot of people don't really know what that means. So can you take us through what what that means, the nervous system functioning and what that means in relation to to what you've been talking about in terms of micro stresses?

Brain-Body Communication and Nervous System

Dr Tess Browne 6:28

Sure. So essentially our nervous system is um it's got our body's communication system, essentially. It's uh a network of nerves that communicates and sends messages between our body and our brain, essentially. And one of the ways it does that is through something called the vagus nerve. So this big, big nerve that we have running all the way through our body from our from our brain all the way down to our to our gut. And it's a bit like a motorway. So there's kind of two lanes to it, and about 80% of the traffic travels from the body to the brain. So lots of messaging being sent sort of bottom up, body to brain, and 20% of the traffic is is coming from the brain down to the body. So our bodies and our brain, our body, sorry, and our brain is constantly communicating with each other. So when our brain detects a threat of some kind, and actually it doesn't matter if that threat is a real threat, like a business orders or um a perceived threat, like I don't know, me thinking I might mess up a work presentation I have coming next week, it doesn't matter if it's real or perceived. My brain detects danger and it kind of kick starts this process within our nervous system. Um, and I guess just to kind of put it in the most simplest terms, there's essentially two branches of our nervous system that it's helpful to be aware of. We have our parasympathetic nervous system, which is when we that is the part of our nervous system that's activated when we're feeling at our most calm, relaxed. Sometimes it's called our rest and digest system. It's when we're functioning at our best, essentially. Um, and then we have our sympathetic nervous system, which I guess might be termed commonly as our fight or flight or freeze system. You sometimes hear those words associated with it. It's the nervous system that will be activated when a person is feeling overwhelmed, anxious, irritated, um just frazzled, basically. And a healthy nervous system is a nervous system that can kind of move between both of these different states with relative ease, relative flexibility. You know, there are absolutely times when it's wholly appropriate and helpful to be within our have our sympathetic nervous system activated. Um, but obviously we want to kind of come back down to calm. So when we're talking about nervous system and we're talking about nervous system regulation, we're talking about using strategies and tools to nurture our nervous system so it's able to work in the best way for us, so that when we do detect these threats, which we will because they are all around us, as we've just talked about, we can respond in the healthiest way.

Dr Liz White 9:07

Do you think it's harder these days to have a sort of balanced or regulated nervous system given that given technology and everything that we have to kind of deal with day to day compared to 100 years ago?

Dr Tess Browne 9:22

Yeah, well, I I I imagine so. I I mean I wasn't around 100 years ago. I guess there were maybe different threats back then, um, and and even further back in history. But I think there are definitely it feels relentless at this in this time, you know. I guess, you know, back in the caveman days when the sun went down and the cavemen like retreated to their caves, you know, all was quiet until the next day. Whereas, you know, now we we leave work and work comes home with us. If we have our phones with our emails on our bedside table, work is with us all night long. But I wouldn't say there's no escape from it, because actually I think what we sometimes overlook is that we do have some agency and we can make choices which can protect us from exposure to some of those micro stresses. But I think sometimes it doesn't feel like we can. It feels relentless because there is so much noise.

Dr Liz White 10:21

Yeah, there really can be a lot of noise. I was just thinking there, even just you know, I don't know, the multitude of WhatsApp groups that you might have on your phone, especially as a mum. And that's sort of popping off at all all the time. But let's think about mums, particularly, because that's that's where you kind of you know specialise, you're working, isn't it? And if you're anything like me, you probably see a lot of women mums who are a bit like you know, that sort of swan scenario, like completely on it on the outside. They just look like they're managing really well, coping, but feel constantly sort of, you know, it inside are feeling just ri super frazzled, burnt out, and anxious sometimes. Can you talk a bit about the invisible kind of mental load that the women that you see tend to have and how that links into this concept of micro stresses and nervous system dysregulation?

Unseen Stress of Motherhood

The Pressure to "Have It All"

Dr Tess Browne 11:58

Yeah, absolutely. I guess a lot of the micro stresses I mentioned earlier are, I guess, external, the things happening outs outside of our bodies. When people talk about the term sort of the invisible mental load, what that's referring to is that constant, it's like having a load of tabs open in your brain, um, bit like a you know, an internet browser. You you've got constant things to remember to do, to action, maybe it's forms that need filling in, uh, you know, emails that need replying to, house admin, planning meals, planning holidays, just anticipating people's needs, not to mention your own needs. And it's not always, but I think often in a modern family setup, it is a mother who carries that load internally. And because it's not visible, it's not external, it's not seen, it can often kind of get overlooked and not really identified as micro stressors, which actually is exactly what it is. And I think it's not recognized by others as much, maybe partners, other family members, colleagues, etc. But I think also importantly, it's often not recognized by the mum themselves. It's it's almost just accepted that, well, this is just the way it is. And so, you know, they don't do anything to address it, or they feel there's limited things they can do to address it. But just like with external stress, that internal stress also massively takes a toll. You know, our brains will also detect things internally as a threat and therefore kickstart the same sort of stress response as it might do to some of the external stresses that come away. So that's often why, you know, you you might come across sort of high-functioning women who really appear to others as having it all together, feel seem very calm and successful and collected, but it doesn't feel that way to them inside. Inside they feel very frazzled, as you that's the swan, they're kind of kicking frantically underwater. And that is off that is usually the the exactly the type of women that I I will work with on the outside. They seem to have it all great jobs, successful careers, you know, lovely family, all the things, but they're really struggling internally, and they're not feeling like their their lived experience matches what others are perceiving on the inside.

Dr Liz White 14:36

And I I don't know what you think about this, but uh this idea of you know, like sort of women can have it all, you can have the career and you can have the kids and you know keep the the plate spinning. And I think there is that narrative out there, isn't there, that that we can do it. Uh but uh it at a cost, and I think there's that pressure to have it all almost, you know, to kind of almost like prove that we can do career and kids and house, um, you know, compared to you know, sort of like the 1950s, where it was much more, it was a different time, wasn't it, in terms of women's roles and and that kind of thing. Do you see that pressure or is it is it much more subtle in in the clients that you tend to work with?

Dr Tess Browne 15:24

Yeah, no, I I think um, you know, I think that narrative it's it's it's a help and a hindrance in that you know, I guess there was that big shift in that movement in terms of women's rights and the fact that actually we can do it all, we can have it all. Um, but as you say, it will come at a cost. And just because we could have, you know, many of those things. Do we want many of those things? And how do we want those things to look like? Um, and I think that narrative unhelpfully contributes to this almost societal expectation that you can have it all and you should have it all together at the same time. That's the unhelpful bit. Yeah. So I don't think it's that you know, we should strive for less. Um, but I think we need to, you know, with whatever we're striving for, whatever it is, there is always a cost. And so what can we do to mitigate that cost? How can we yeah, how can we care for ourselves so that maybe when we do have it all, we're actually enjoying it all, you know, because it's not just it's not just having it, is it? It's giving it and you know, enjoying it.

Dr Liz White 16:48

Absolutely. And I think the other thing just to just to bring in is I don't know about you or your experience with mums, but I think when women reach a certain age or a certain stage in their hormone journey and perimenopause, menopause, I think what I've seen is that then and experienced to some degree is that it it then becomes really difficult to keep the plate spinning because your something changes in your ability to manage stress or or demands, and I think it's certainly in in the women that I see, it then becomes very, very difficult, and that's at the point at which they might reach out for help. Do you see women sort of across their their life span of of being a parent or particular age of clients that you see?

Preventing Burnout and Prioritising Self

Dr Tess Browne 17:41

So I typically tend to have women come into my world um around the time that they might be thinking of starting a family or they've recently started a family and then kind of work with them right through. So I'm definitely working with women who are going through significant kind of hormonal shifts, be that related to, you know, um their perinatal journey, partum, but also perimenopause as well. And I think, you know, the reality is that even if they have developed certain strategies and tools to help them manage their stress, when there are significant changes in their life, be it hormonally or physically in other ways, or be it practically in terms of you know having less time because you've got children to look after or, you know, a busier job, whatever it might be, the the strategies that worked for them before just might not work anymore. Yeah. Um, or they might not work in the same way. They might need kind of sort of just tweaking and pivoting a little bit. But sometimes we can hold on to expectations. Well, this should work. I should do this because it's worked for me before. And I think, you know, we are ever-evolving beings physically, psychologically, but also, you know, our context is ever evolving. And so it is it is something that we kind of need to come back to and review and revise to check in with ourselves or what's working with us now. And I think, yeah, I typically will meet women at some of these significant change points in their life where you know, maybe they've actually managed stress really effectively in the past, but suddenly none of the old none of the old tools are working and they feel really stuck. So a big piece of the work that I'll often do with women is kind of thinking really flexibly, really creatively. Okay, well, how can we kind of, you know, mold the mold this? You know, people will talk about some strategies for managing stress, but like actually, how can we make something like that work for you at this stage in your life? That's the really important piece because otherwise people don't do it.

Dr Liz White 19:49

So important, isn't it? And just picking up on what you said about time, because I think when you're time poor, it then becomes very difficult, doesn't it, to put yourself first or to to even think about the fact that you're struggling a bit or or the or to even notice that the stuff that you did before to manage stress isn't working now. And I think a lot of the time women get to a point where they're they're so focused on just doing all the stuff and not having the time for themselves and not realizing actually I'm struggling, that they then reach a point where it's like a crisis point where they can't they feel like they can't keep going, or it's that sort of burnout type scenario, or you know, that you know, they can't they feel like they can't manage their emotions and are wondering why. And that's why I'm interested in your retreats because I'm wondering if your the retreats that you're doing are are they about meeting people at that crisis point or trying to help people or help women prevent the sort of crisis point from occurring?

Recognising a Dysregulated Nervous System

Dr Tess Browne 20:56

So there, I guess there's two key objectives that come from them. One is about teaching them some tools and strategies that they can use to feel more in control when they are feeling stressed, when they are feeling overwhelmed. So when their sympathetic nervous system is kind of driving the car, they can employ, they can learn certain tools and strategies to bring them back into a more regulated state. And then the second objective is about improving their resilience to stress in general. Um, so that might be different types of tools and strategies. So it's it's really lovely. The retreats that I run, I do it in collaboration with um a friend of mine who's a Pilates and yoga teacher. And so we bring, I think that's what makes them quite unique. We're kind of bringing sort of the body and the mind piece together in terms of both of our specialisms. And I think, yeah, that's that you know, we've had with the feedback is that that kind of holistic approach. So you're thinking of, yeah, you're thinking of strategies that can go both ways on that Vegas nerve highway, right? Body to brain, brain to body. I think importantly as well, keeping them simple. Because I think that block of people thinking, I don't have time. You know, I I always take that belief and and kind of explore that with a client because they probably don't have a lot of time. I know I don't have a lot of time. I'm a working mum. I don't have a lot of time. But sometimes it's not about finding more time, it's just about using your time differently or making different choices so that you can use your time more efficiently, or just making different choices in in in yeah, what you choose to do for yourself. I think that's a big one as well. But I think it has to come, has to start from a place of believing that you know you're you're worthy of of of shining the spotlight on yourself and making those changes and sort of stepping back. I think that's what's good about retreats is that you know they kind of force you to take it, you know, day minimum away from normal life and just that that kind of exit gives you that pause to just see things from a slightly different angle when you're you're sort of stuck in the thick of it.

Signs of Stress on the Body

Dr Liz White 23:13

Yeah, I that's such a key point, isn't it? Because even if you're someone who goes to therapy once a week, um you know, physically goes to therapy, if if you're finding that you you're finding it really hard to get out of the house, then there's something that that's something to look at. But as you say, a retreat is you know, you book it in the diary, it's weeks in advance, you know it's there, and so there's there's sort of there's intentionality around that, isn't there? And I think that's why it can be can be a really powerful experience. And I'm I'm curious about someone listening who might not realize that their nervous system is what I call jangly, you would maybe call dysregulated, I call it jangly. How can someone recognise that actually, yeah, I'm in I'm in this place and I need to sort of start to do something about it? What what might someone notice?

Dr Tess Browne 24:10

So I guess obviously it's it's going to look different for everybody, but I think there are some kind of common sort of signs and symptoms. I always find it helpful to sort of break it down into, I guess, different domains to look at. So I guess starting with the body, like how might how might Jangli show up in the body? It might show up as kind of muscle tension, aches and pains, stiffness. It might show up as in feeling constantly like wired, like really struggling to rest. You know, maybe you have some time to yourself, but you're still thinking about the to-do list or you know, working through your emails. It might also look like um having more illnesses or having a sort of recovery time when you when you become unwell. So there's a lot of kind of changes within the body. And I think especially I find, you know, especially if women are going through set sort of hormonal change and things, a lot of the time they can um, or practical life changes like I don't know, a demanding job or a new baby, they can kind of just dismiss a lot of the physical things. Well, of course I'm tired. It's because I'm my baby's waking up in the night, or of um, you know, of course I feel a bit stiff, it's um perimenopausal, and and and it may well be, but it also may not be. I think emotionally, often experiencing feelings of anxiety, um, feeling overwhelmed, just feeling quite burnt out, uh, low mood, or sometimes feeling nothing at all, feeling numb is also a feeling, just kind of feeling a bit like frozen. Mentally, it can show up in terms of a lot of worry. So, especially kind of catastrophic thinking, thinking worst-case scenarios, overthinking of things, ruminating on things, dwelling, going over and over about things. And it can also show up in an increase in terms of self-blame, self-criticism. It's all sorts of kind of negative thinking.

unknown 26:03

Yeah.

Dr Tess Browne 26:03

And then and then behaviorally, you know, it can really show up in how we respond and react with other people. If we're more irritable, we might be more snappy at people we love, more snappy at colleagues. Maybe because our body's so wide, we have trouble switching off, which might mean that we, I don't know, a a really common one that I see is people kind of scrolling late into the night, um, procrastinating, sort of seeking reassurance more, like, you know, checking they're doing things right, they're doubting themselves more. So we can kind of show up in these four different domains. And I, you know, I always, I would always say it's always worth, you know, seeing your GP and just kind of getting a bit of a medical check over just to rule out anything of a medical origin. But if there's no kind of medical explanation for these kinds of signs and symptoms, then maybe, you know, it maybe it is more about kind of nervous system health and a, you know, an approach towards kind of soothing that and and helping to heal that is needed.

Dr Liz White 27:06

So where can someone start? So especially the person listening who who is feeling that real kind of pressure of time and and maybe it's like in their mind saying, Oh, that's just don't worry, don't worry, fit self-care in, because again, self-care is a real buzzword, isn't it? And everybody knows you know what self-care is and that it's good for you. Uh the women, especially who end who end up in a in a state of jangly nervous system and and can't relax and can't be still, are usually the people that find this this idea of you know starting to regulate the nervous system quite difficult because it feels like another demand. So what would you what would you say to that woman listening? Like, where do they start with that?

Small Acts for Mental Health

Stacking Habits for Change

Dr Tess Browne 27:52

So I'm a big fan of thinking about things at a micro level. So kind of just thinking of kind of really, really small, low effort, low time, low demand strategies. Maybe you wouldn't even use the word strategies, that's how I think about it, but just little little kind of drops throughout your day, which just send that messaging to the brain. I'm safe, I'm okay, I've got this. So that might look like little micro moments of pausing. So just taking a minute, two minutes, great if you've got longer, but even a minute is better than nothing to take some deep breaths, breathing down into your belly. Um, we tend to breathe into our chests and shallow when we're feeling anxious, when we're feeling stressed. So just taking a minute or two to take some deep belly breaths, we can stack that onto something else. We can do that while we're walking back from the school run or we're driving in our car on the way home from work. We don't need extra time to do that. Or we might just carve in little micro moments of mindfulness throughout our day, you know. So rather than being lost in your phone on your morning commute, you put your phone away, take your AirPods out, and you, you know, you engage with your five senses as you're walking along. You see what you can see, you notice what you can smell, notice what you can hear, etc. So you're not having to add, you don't need any extra time to do this. You're just doing what you're already doing in a slightly different way. Micro um sort of social connections can be great. You know, connection is the biggest protective factor when it comes to our mental health. That's been proven again and again in the research. And so, um, yes, you might not have time for you know dinner with a friend, but even just taking a quick moment to send them a little voice note or a little message or just let them know that you're, you know, thinking of them. Um and then I guess other little things that I will commonly sort of suggest to people is I call them little movement snacks, but just taking little little snacks of movement in the day, it might just be as simple as having a stretch, you know, if you've got the time, having a short walk, even just standing up and having a little shake or doing a couple of star jumps, something like that. That can be really, you know, really powerful. I always think of um, if you think about, you know, whether you've you know had a child or not, if you think about how a parent would soothe a baby, right? They typically might give them a little rock, they might give them a little hug, they might say something. Something kind of calm and soothing to that child, they're essentially doing that to calm the baby's nervous system when the baby's upset. So we can take those exact same strategies and apply them to ourselves as well. So maybe it is about applying some soothing self-touch, just giving ourselves a hug, putting our hands on our chest, maybe adding some soothing self-compassionate talk, you know, telling ourselves, like I've got this, I can do hard things, I'm trying my best. Maybe it's about adding in some of that rhythmic movement, like, yeah, like with a baby, you might kind of like give them a little sway. So maybe it's about sort of swaying your body or taking a gentle stroll. Um, so none of these things are huge. I mean, obviously, some of the bigger stuff can make a difference as well. But actually, what's going to make more difference than occasional big stress relievers is consistent, sustainable micro stress relievers. And I think that's much more practical for people who've got busy lives. I know for me that's much more practical, the sort of things that I use, and I know that they work for me, and I know that they've worked for loads of my clients. And so that's often a good sort of stepping stone in, and then you can build up, you know, build up with the things that are most attractive for you.

Dr Liz White 31:50

Sometimes a bit of a barrier can be like a person remembering to do the things. Have you got any tips for that?

Overcoming Challenges of Slowing Down

Dr Tess Browne 31:58

Well, yeah, I think I'm I think when we're starting to form new habits, I always try and stack. So stack a new habit onto an existing one. So for example, you know, if you're boiling the kettle to make your morning cup of tea, you know, take some, take some deep belly breaths, for example. Um, or when you're brushing your teeth, I really like an exercise called the five senses exercise where you notice five things you can see, four things you can hear, three things you can feel, etc. You could do that while you're brushing your teeth. So just taking really established habits that you're already doing and just adding something new onto that, and then you build up the association with that. So, therefore, you know, because I think a lot of people don't forget to brush their teeth. It's so that habit is so instilled into them because they've been doing it for so long. And so, if we can sort of stack a new habit on top of that, that can be a really helpful way of um of of creating a new habit. Also, things like accountability, be that accountability with another or you know, some kind of accountability with yourself, keeping, you know, a bit of a sort of a spreadsheet, you know, just it doesn't have to be anything fancy, it could just be like ticking off on your calendar each day that you that you do some breath work, or you know, there's loads of apps you can use nowadays that kind of measure you know how consistently you are with with building new habits. So there's lots of technology which can kind of facilitate that as well. But I would definitely recommend kind of checking in. I really recommend to my clients to have kind of a weekly check-in. I mean, if I'm working with them, then we can do that together. But you know, for clients that I don't see as often anymore, I'll always recommend they have a bit of a almost like a self-therapy session, kind of review how's this week been? Okay, I didn't, you know, what what were the challenges of maybe maybe not doing that habit as much as I wanted to? How can I overcome that next week? But kind of keep checking in with yourself and being very, very intentional about these new habits. And I would say another thing really importantly is don't try and do everything at once. Like that list of ideas that I just shared, like just pick one, pick one, try that out, give it a good run. If it works, great, if it doesn't, try something else. Um, but don't try everything at once.

Dr Liz White 34:14

Yeah, and that's really important, isn't it? But also the there are lots of things that you can do, as you said, and some of them might not work for you. And it is finding the stuff that does work, and you kind of need to do that trial and error thing of um, I'll try this and then didn't really like that. So I'll try this thing.

Dr Tess Browne 34:34

And also things, because sometimes something that might not have worked for you in the past, it might work well for you now, or something that used to work might not work well for you now. So it's a constant experimentation, as you say. Absolutely.

Dr Liz White 34:46

And I know I've worked with lots of clients in the past who um who find like this idea of being still or slowing down actually really quite challenging, and often that's you know, there's there's sort of some belief there around if I if I stop, then I won't start, be able to start again, or when I'm still I get the anxious thoughts or the worries. Um and I I like what you said in terms of all the things that you suggested there, because a lot of them are about movement, aren't they? And and um not necessarily just sort of having to put the candles on and sit down and listen to a meditation. But for those people who who do find slowing down actually really difficult, is there anything that you might say to them?

Dr Tess Browne 35:28

I mean, firstly, I would say that that's can very, very normal, especially in a wired um, you know, uh disactivated nervous system. Um if you think about all the stress hormones that are going around your body, adrenaline, cortisol, it makes being still very, very hard. So, you know, just being mindful of your expectations for yourself, um, that yeah, it is probably it is hard to be, it's hard to be still because it's it's it's hard to be still. So I would I would recommend leaning more into yeah, more active forms of regulation, but things which are um more active in a sort of downregulating way. So things like maybe stretching, yoga, gentle forms of yoga, not more um uh I guess uh cardio forms of yoga, walking, even things like kind of mindful chores, right? Because a lot of the lot of the things that we, you know, on the to-do lists are quite active. I don't know, hanging out the washing or loading the dishwasher, whatever it might be. But what we can kind of do is we can also kind of integrate that, integrate them into ways to regulate at the same time. So maybe we really mindfully unload the dishwasher. Maybe we really appreciate like, oh, what do the plates smell like when they're they've just been clean? What do they sound like? So yeah, absolutely. I would say leaning into anything that involves kind of moving, and as I said before, that incorporating kind of rhythmic movement, you know, swaying, shaking, dancing, playing around with what works for you and what works for you now. Because yeah, I know for me there will be times when sticking some music on and having a good dance is super regulating for me, and there'll be other times where it's actually I just need to do a really gentle stretch of that. Um, so yeah, it's it's about having uh a collection of tools that you could use, um, but then being quite intentional about what do I choose today and why, where am I today, and meet yourself where you're at.

Dr Liz White 37:38

And I think that also speaks to what you were saying earlier about connection, but also connection to self. Because I think when you're you when you're in that zone of dysregulation, I think there is something that happens. You talked about the numbness and sort of feeling empty. There's something there's something that can get disconnected in terms of actually checking in with yourself and actually being able to support yourself and and give space for yourself. But when you're particularly when you're a mum, busy mum, you're giving to everyone else and you do forget about yourself, I think. Um, so have it creating that time, even if it's two minutes, of how am I doing? Like, what's today been like? Um, what do I need? I'm constantly saying to clients, ask yourself what you need. Yeah. And that's such a self-compassionate act, and it's so powerful.

Dr Tess Browne 38:32

Yeah, it's so powerful. It can be sometimes be yeah, really. People are gonna realise, wow, I I can't remember the last time I asked myself that. I'm so wrapped up in other people's needs. When did I last ask myself? It can be quite emotive.

Dr Liz White 38:46

Absolutely. Well, Tess, I really appreciate your time today. Thank you so much for joining me on the podcast. You are so welcome. I've loved chatting. Thank you for having me. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Hello Therapy. We'd love for you to join our growing community over on Substack. You can sign up for free or become a paid subscriber for access to exclusive perks, like never before seen video interviews and downloadable guides designed to support your mental health. If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe so you never miss a new release. And if you got value from this episode, it would mean the world if you left a five-star review. As always, check the show notes for my full disclaimer. Thanks again for listening.