How Relationship Wellness Drives Organizational Success

We are taking a deep dive into the transformative power of relationship wellness with our special guest, Kristal DeSantis—a licensed marriage and family therapist renowned for her expertise in relational health and trauma work. 

You can learn how maintaining and improving relationships within organizations can drive success and productivity. Kristal introduces us to her STRONG model of relational therapy, breaking down the core elements like emotional safety and personal vs. performance-based relationships. There are many practical strategies for fostering relational safety and long-term organizational success. 

Tune in to learn how a happy, balanced life can make you a better employee and how companies can create cultures that genuinely support their teams.

00:00 Introduction to Nine to Five Wellness Podcast

01:05 Discussing Relationship Wellness

05:16 Guest Introduction: Crystal DeSantis

06:28 Defining Relational Wellbeing

07:15 The STRONG Model of Relationships

09:57 Balancing Personal and Performance Aspects

22:22 Practical Strategies for Relational Safety

36:55 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

You can learn more about Kristal at-

https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristal-desantis/
https://www.instagram.com/atxtherapist/
https://www.tiktok.com/@atx_therapist
https://www.strong.love/

🌟 🌟 🌟 If you liked this episode and would like to learn more about wellness training and workshops offered by 9 to 5 Wellness, email us at info@aeshathair.com. You can learn more about our programs at: https://toneandstrengthen.com/workshops-trainings/. 🌟 🌟 🌟

My passion is helping organizations create a culture of wellness, and I do this by setting up health programs that prioritize the most important asset they've got – their employees. Cheers to a healthier and happier journey ahead!

🌟 🌟 🌟 You can learn more about ME- the host at https://www.aeshatahir.com

Follow me on IG and LI to learn more

https://www.instagram.com/tone_and_strengthen/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/aeshatahir/

Transcript

 Welcome to the nine to five wellness podcast,  a show about corporate wellness solutions with innovators and forward thinking leaders who are at the forefront of the workplace wellness movement.  I'm your host, Aesha Tahir. 

 Hello, and welcome to the nine to five wellness podcast and LinkedIn live show. Welcome to today's episode.  I hope you guys are staying warm over here in the Northeast. It's pretty chilly today. It's like 24 degrees outside and it's afternoon. So the windchill effect is really, really, cold, but that's okay.

I feel like days like these are kind of like important and necessary to put like the beautiful summer and spring days in perspective. Otherwise I'll be like, so spoiled with nice weather. Like we. Get that in most of the parts of California, although I do miss that.   So today we are going to be talking about relationships,  relational wellbeing, relationship wellness, and how relationship wellness drives organizational success.

I think we can all relate on a personal level and professional level that relationships are hard.  They are very, very hard, right? Maybe starting a relationship, not so much, but maintaining it, and being  comfortable with conflict.  That, that is hard. That is very hard. We don't want to,  confront conflicts. That, that, that's just the truth. And I've learned that in the past year. Myself. So when I, got a message from our guest today that she wants to talk about how relational wellbeing, how relationship wellness drives success within the organization and within our personal careers. I was like, yes, I'm all for it.

I want to talk about it. And  as I was  preparing for this interview and I was researching this topic, I realized that over the past few decades, our workplaces have gone, through significant transformations. And especially because of the emerging technology,  you know, just if you think about it, like 20 years ago, we didn't work the way we are working today because now in almost every office, we have iPads and iPhones, and they didn't exist 20 years ago, like in our work settings,  the AI.  Which is very recent, but it's taking on a lot of the responsibilities of employees. So there are so many dynamics that have shifted  in the last just like couple of decades.  And with the COVID especially, the rise of remote work, that has changed the landscape all together. So these vast changes  Are happening within our workplaces and within our personal lives, right?

Because it does impact our personal , life. And, one of the things though, that remains constant is  power of human connection.  And that's what a relationship is. That is what a relationship is. A relationship is human connection. How are you connecting with the person sitting in the next cubicle?

How are  you connecting with your teammate on that Zoom meeting? What's going on? Like, what are you doing?  Is there a connection at all? Actually, does there, you know, does a connection exist? If it, if it doesn't exist, well, there's, there are going to be issues. And definitely that's not going to lead to organizational success.

That's not going to lead to productivity for you as an employee. As a person who's  working to thrive in your career.  So a lot of it comes down to when I talk to leaders  is that, we have a roadmap,  we have a certain formula we follow  for our teams, and I think that's going to lead to healthy relationships within the organization, but. 

To me, I'm like, no, because every team is different. The people on the team are unique. I am not sure if that's, what's going to lead you there. So we are going to learn today about.  What is relational well being,  how to understand it better, how to strengthen the interpersonal bonds, to foster growth, well being, and innovation within the organization.

And for ourselves. And for that, I have a very, very special guest with me today.  Kristal DeSantis. She is, a licensed marriage and family therapist based in Austin, Texas,  known for her expertise in relationships and trauma work. She's passionate about how improving Relational health among employees, especially around emotional resilience and mental well being can dramatically enhance workplace productivity and overall job satisfaction.

 She is also the founder and developer of the strong model of relational therapy, which blends trauma informed and attachment based methods. So I. Really want to dig deeper into those two aspects of her model. And she has earned her reputation as a leading authority in the domain. Welcome to the podcast, Kristal. 

Yeah. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.  

Oh, thank you for joining us. Thanks for taking the time out of your busy schedule and sharing this goodness with us. I want to dive right into the topic.  My first question is, how do you define relational well being? How do you define relationships? 

Yeah, so that's really,  why I developed the STRONG model because STRONG is an acronym  and, you know, as I was getting my training and becoming a marriage and family therapist, and as I was developing kind of my own practice, that's really what that was the question I wanted to answer, right? Because everybody comes in and they want healthier relationships.

They want better relationships. And I wanted to understand, of course, everybody's definition is slightly different, but is there a blueprint? Is there research based, evidence based ways that we can define what a healthy relationship is? Right? So what is relationship wellness? And so that's really what I've compiled into this acronym STRONG.

So, you know, on a shortcut, STRONG is healthy.  That's kind of my model of relationships.  And I can break that down right now if you want, but. I'm that's kind of my little shortcut. Strong is healthy. 

What makes a relationship strong?  

 So the different elements, so these are the six different elements that make a relationship strong, which makes it healthy.

The first thing is safety. Emotional safety. Um, and I break it down into four different aspects of safety, which again, you know, as we're talking relationships, you know what you were saying in the intro about how relationships are difficult. They are, but they're even more difficult when you don't have a blueprint when you don't know what you're doing.

Right? Which is so many of us, right? We kind of get into relationships and try to figure it out as we go. And we're like, why is this so hard? It's sometimes because we don't know what the rules are or what The plan is or what the strategies are with the skills and tools we need to actually be successful in creating the kinds of relationships that we want.

And so, you know, ultimately, for me, again, coming from a trauma informed attachment based  perspective is at the end of the day, healthy relationships feel safe,  right? And when we break down what that means, the first thing is. I talk about the difference between types of relationships. So the first thing is kind of the self awareness of what kind of relationship am I in?

And what kind of relationship do I want to be in? Or, you know, for coming to a corporation, what kind of relationship, what kind of experience am I offering to my employees, right? Is there a connection here? Or is this simply a transactional like,  at the end of the day, all we care about is the bottom line.

We don't really care about you as the individuals. Right. Um, and this is really what I noticed in, like, again, the micro of personal relationships to the macro of organizational relationships, you know, people feeling like.  They understand. Am I in this because of my personhood or am I in this because of my performance?

And again, any high functioning relationship needs a balance of both, but really being aware, especially if you are the leader of your organization, and I keeping that balance in check between, of course, we need people to be, you know, high performing and product oriented, but we can't do that at the expense of them as people. 

And really making sure that balance so that people feel safe within that context, right? Their personhood is being honored. Um, and that's the same for inter like romantic relationships, interpersonal relationships as well.  

So I want to explore the personal and performance aspect a little more. I want to dive deeper into it because I have like a million definitions going on in my head, like, okay, what is personal?

 And what is, performance based because I can define performance in many different ways. And so can I define like, you know, personal, , achievements or personal success in many different ways, even within the work capacity, even within the career,  aspect of it. So  I want to just dig a little bit deeper and understand what exactly is personal and what exactly is performance. 

Yeah, so, you know, kind of boiling it down to the basics. I kind of talk about it as, you know, function based where it's transactional versus connection based where there's an acknowledgement that there's a person that's doing the work.  Does that make sense? Yes. Yeah. And so, you know, again, transactional relationships are valid, right?

There are a lot of the world runs on purely function based transaction based relationships, right? You're here because you provide me a function and I provide you with a paycheck or even in romantic relationships. Sometimes I've seen this where people are like, well, I married you because, you know,  I wanted children, you wanted children and we agreed that we had shared values around that.

And so we decided to have a life together. Um, but often again, because of my work, primarily, it's about couples and relationships is at the end of the day. We need to know what kind of relationship we're in. Otherwise, it leads to a lot of internal conflict, right? It's like when you have the expectation that you are valued here because of your performance, people can switch into that gear.

Like, all right, you want the project done by blank date. You don't care if I lose sleep to do it. You don't care if my family is, you know, missing me while I do it. You care about my performance and that gives people the opportunity to really acknowledge. Like, is this sustainable for me? And maybe if, you know, maybe if the transaction is balanced enough, great people choose to do that, but then there are other times where people realize that ultimately, especially if they're going to make a career out of something, or if they're going to be in a long term relationship, they really do want the acknowledgement that there is a person and there is a connection.

 You know, being acknowledged that this is costing me something as a person to be in this relationship. I'm not just, you know, able to  be a robot that can be productivity productivity all the time, you know, sometimes I have bad days. Sometimes I'm sick. Sometimes my family needs me. And if that's okay to bring into this relationship,  then I can kind of relax into the fact that that's okay for me to be personal in that way  is that clarified a little bit more.

Okay. Bye. Bye.  

Yes. I want to highlight what you just said. You said something that I think it resonated with me and it would  resonate with a lot of people who are in jobs and careers  where  it's a performance based,  formula that they work on.   I think a lot of people probably don't look at it objectively enough that, oh, okay,  can, can I do this long term? 

Can I pour into the projects I'm working on long term? To generate that performance  well, it is written in my contract or after meeting with my manager or supervisor, I can clearly understand that my job here is performance based. Okay. I do have a base salary, but what's expected of me is performance.

And if I don't hit those benchmarks, well, it's not going to go well.  That aspect of the transaction,  a lot of people miss that. Would you agree? 

Yes. And I think that's where, like, again, making that really explicit is that there's no right or wrong choice here. Objectively, right? Ultimately, what matters is, is this the right choice for you? 

And, you know, being able to really reflect on, you know, what would this cost me if I were to hit those performance  metrics consistently? What would that mean for the rest of my life? Will I be getting enough sleep? Will that give me enough time to spend with my family? Will I be able to take vacations?

How will my marriage do right? And I think this is part of, you know, the things that have changed in our society is, you know, in the past, right? Like, we weren't reachable 24 7 by our companies. We would clock out and go home. Nobody could reach us till Monday. Right? And so almost there was, um, yeah. A default balance that was in place, right?

Sure. There were always people that were workaholics, but now it's almost like it's, it's just been such a subtle shift that we don't even realize. And I've seen people where they're just constantly working. They don't even realize that. Oh, my gosh, you know, in order to meet these performance metrics that you really do want to meet on one level on the other level.

At what cost,  right? When is the last time you made it to your child's baseball game? When is the last time you were able to have a date night with your wife? When is the last time, like, and just being able to kind of objectively look at that. And maybe some people say, like, you know, all right, I'm gonna, I'm gonna grind it out for two years and then I'm gonna have a breakdown.

And I, I accept that. It's like, all right, well, if that's the choice you make for yourself again, just being able to have that informed awareness. That I am actively choosing this thing because also, you know, on a psychological level, when we can actively choose something, it makes the pain that comes with it a little bit easier to swallow a little bit easier to accept, right?

It's like, if you decide to go on a, I don't know, a fitness routine, and then every morning, you know, why you're waking up at the crack of dawn, you know, why your muscles hurt, right? It's not something that's happening to you. It's something that you're actively choosing because you have a goal.  And that's the same with, you know, choosing whatever balance you want in your business versus personal.

Um, being able to say, I know why I'm doing this. I know what the cost is and I know why I'm doing it. Um, and that gives me the resilience to really. Kind of go all in or, or choose to take a step back and I, and I can also feel confident in that choice because I know what I need in my, in my life, in my work in order to be the best version of myself and it's different for everyone. 

Yeah, absolutely. I want to underscore what you just said. It's different for everyone. However, in my experience when I talk to people,  people don't know what the cost is going to be. They're, they're stepping into it. Absolutely. Naively, I would like to say, even  after they do come to  the understanding that, okay, it's performance based, they do not understand the cost  on their personal life. I think that's a connection a lot of people can't make, that they don't, or I want to say they don't make, till something goes down south. Like you said, they get burned out or  their relationship suffers. Or,  you know, worse is like if your kids start suffering because you weren't there,  right? I want to talk about how can  an individual understand what they want.

I think it comes down to  many of us, we don't know what we want. We know we want more money.  I'm not saying people don't know that. People know that everybody desires it. Because money is power and power can in this society, in this world, we have created can drive certain results. That are very attractive to us,

but how do we understand what we want out of life? What kind of success? How do we define success in life? 

Exactly, and I think that's a really important question, right? Because otherwise, you know, and Obviously, this is the work I do right as a therapist. I sit with people all day, um, and helping them realize that sometimes the script that they're following the script that they were given the script that they default into is not actually bringing them closer to the life that they want, right?

It's like, sure, they might have gotten that promotion. They might have gotten that. Pay raise, they might have gotten that big corner office and somehow they still are missing what it is that they're actually looking for. And so I think being able to define like, what does success mean to you? Is it having a certain number in the bank?

Is it having a certain number of vacations a year? Is it having a certain number of children? Is it being able to send your children to whatever kind of school or what is success? What are you working for? What? What is the goal here? Um, and again, really being able to take ownership of if that's the goal.

How can I reverse engineer that so that I know that everything I'm doing? I'm not just a hamster on a wheel here. I'm not just like checking boxes and running through the script that I was given. I'm actually. Feeling empowered that I am getting closer. Everything I do, you know, every day that I work, I'm getting closer to creating the life that I imagined for myself, which again is unique to me.

Maybe my vision of a successful life is not my cubicle neighbors vision, right? Maybe they want to have. I don't know, 45 dogs and I, you know, I want to be able to have my weekends off, whatever, right? Everybody's script is different. And so I think just really kind of parsing that out a little bit is that yes, money means power,  but sometimes that's not exactly what you personally are looking for. 

In what a fulfilled or successful life for you looks like  and again, is there another way to get what you're looking for that doesn't require just putting in more hours at the office, right? Maybe there's some other things that you could add to your life that would actually feel a little bit  more fulfilling.

Then simply, all right, got to grind it out. Got to keep going, right? Which again, if we're talking about, um, organizational wellness, I think that's also something, you know, for the leadership is recognizing that, you know, happy people make better workers, happy people, people that have had, um, that have a good home life are, are much, much better employees, right?

I think there's a little bit of a misconception that, and again, this is very, you know, grind culture that, you know, if we can, if we can squeeze the productivity out of someone that that's the goal. And it's like, but that's such a short term strategy that is not sustainable in the long term. Right? Um, and so again, even as the leadership, when you're thinking about creating your company culture, being able to think about, okay, if I want, if I'm really focused in on these short term costs, like, I'm just going to make my team, you know, pull 15 hour shifts and no sleep, well, recognizing that that's just not going to be sustainable for organizational success in the long term.

So again, what is that going to cost you in, you know, uh, yeah. Employee retention. What's that going to cost you in morale? What's that going to cost you in? Um, maybe the health issues that your company will suffer? What's that going to cost you in rehiring people or or all of that? Right? Um, so is it really worth it?

And again, just thinking a little bit differently about what does success look like and how can I actually set myself up so I can get there  without this kind of back and forth of the short term, looking at the short term while neglecting the long term.  

 I  like how you just put it and made the connection to the organizational success that a happy employee.

Is a productive employee, is an employee who actually wants your organization to succeed too. And their relationship with teammates  would be better,  because they're, I mean, they're at peace. They're, they're mostly at peace, not as stressed out as  a person who's not doing well in their personal life at home.

What are some practical strategies that can be implemented? To promote relational safety among teams and also how can the leadership communicate this message to their employees, to their teams, that  we value your  mental health. We value your role at home  and, and your wellbeing, your relational wellbeing at home with your kids and your wife and your family or your partner. 

Yeah, and that's really, again, there's a couple of pieces to this, but tangibly, right? The leadership does also have to think about what kind of culture they want to create, and then they have to hold themselves to that, right? So, if one of your valued employees, like, you have a deadline coming up, and they say, you know, my kid is sick, and I have to go home, are you going to be able to hold yourself to your own kind of company values of, yeah, go spend time with your family? 

Right, or are you going to go back on your word? And so that integrity piece is so crucial for the management, right? Is that if you say that your company values blank, do you have the integrity to stand by that? Do your act, your behaviors align with your. Stated intentions, right? Because that's often where I see where people join companies and then they get really disillusioned.

The first time they asked for something, they asked for their back to be, you know, supported and the company immediately goes back on what they said they stood for. And that's where I see a lot of people feel very betrayed. By their company cultures, right? It's like, this is what you promised, but you don't have any integrity.

So I don't feel safe here anymore. And so immediately that starts to kind of lead to the employees pulling back, right? So like, if you don't have my back, why should I give my all to you? And that's where, you know, companies start to feel, uh, like you lose that, you, you lose morality and you lose a company culture when the leadership cannot hold themselves in their integrity and make sure that their behaviors align with their stated values.

Thanks. So that's super crucial for,  you know, the management and then also the other thing that's really important in fostering a sense of safety in the company culture is having  not just an open line of discussion, but actively looking for disagreement. And this is something that, you know, like you said, Oh, people, you know, they don't like conflict, but this is where it's so important is.

You know, and I talk about this even in my couples, right? Is that we avoid difficult conversations at the expense of long term dysfunction, right? So when we avoid having that little conversation that might be uncomfortable in the moment, all we're doing is kicking the can of dysfunction down the road, right?

Like, my partner made me mad, but whatever, that's an uncomfortable conversation. I just won't say anything. And then five years later, now it's a big problem. Right. And the same thing is true for a company. And so really, again, the leadership setting up some kind of feedback mechanism where they can actively say, criticize us, tell us what we're not doing.

Well, tell us where we can improve. Tell us where you're not happy. We invite this because there's conflict that drives discord. But then there's also, um, There's this great book. It's called the power of discord. And it's basically like, how do you strengthen your muscles? It's micro tears because then it grows back stronger.

It's the repair. That makes things stronger. It's not the avoidance of hardship. It's having these micro tears. And so again, you know, talking about when you building muscle, that's what you're doing. You're doing micro tariffs, right? But again, that same balance of you can't go work out every single day.

You're not going to be just inviting criticism every single day because then that leads to a negative, you know, there's not enough time to repair. But having that safety that like we have times where we actively invite it. I guess what it would be called conflict or, or criticism, um, because then what give us the chance to improve.

And then we're going to check back in and say, did we get better? Are we stronger now? Right? If not, let's go again. Let's do it again. Bring it. Right? Um, and then also having again, these, uh, safe structured, I guess,  what's the word? Maybe curated, um, conversations between employees, um, or if there's ever any issue that they everybody knows what the process is.

There's a very clear expectations on how things are handled and there are very clear resources that. Are there for the employees if they have any issues where again, they don't necessarily have to go through the difficulty of like, oh, I have to check with management or I need to have that difficult conversation.

It's like, look, it's there. It's for you. We already anticipate that something might come up. We've made it easy for you to take care of your needs when things come up. We got you. And again, that really fosters that sense of, oh, I believe when this company says they care about us because look at the evidence. 

It's not just empty speeches, there are actual systems in place that allow me to get my needs met in a way that's non confrontational, um, that I feel valued. 

Yeah, that there's a conflict 101 in place,  every employee, every team should know that. Yeah, no, I love that. I love that strategy. I think only if we could implement something like that in our personal lives and in the workplace.

 On organizational level. I should say  that would take us far. However,  I still feel like and again, maybe what we are striving for is like an ideal world, a perfect world, which doesn't exist. It's still difficult to confront because it's a difficult idea. Like it makes you uncomfortable.

That's why a lot of people don't exercise. I like the analogy you gave, but I mean, as an exercise physiologist, I'll tell you only 20 percent of the U. S. population. Regularly exercises,  okay, goes to the gym regularly. And when we say regularly, it's like three to four days a week, not even six days a week, which should be happening, right?

We are, are creatures who are built to move. And now we choose not to, because, our brain.  Is always gonna choose comfort  and with the modern life, like, you know, it's just  so easy  to get comfortable, like, not only physically, but also in relationships. Oh, you know what? I'm just not gonna say anything.

Yeah, and that's the thing again, that what sometimes what's comfortable isn't healthy,  right? And I mean, like you said, yeah, I'd rather sit on my couch and binge watch Netflix and, you know, eat a whole bag of popcorn. But, you know, is that the healthiest thing for me? And I think that's part of also what I've seen with.

With couples or with systems or with families is that's where structures really come into play, right? It's removing the mental obstacle. And I think that's where, again, with organizations where rather than having a, uh, Um, uh, employee or, you know, having to  make that mental hurdle to choose to have that conversation, the structure is already in place for the conversation to be had.

Um, and so, for example, with my, with couples, I ask them sometimes to implement what's called the state of the union meeting. It's like, just put it on the calendar. Every, every month you have a state of the union. So, again, you don't need to, uh, should we talk? Do I want to bring this up? Is it worth it? It's like, you just have it on the calendar.

You just have a state of the union meeting and that's the day that you guys check in. How are we doing as a couple? What could we be doing better? How am I doing as a partner? How can I better meet your needs?  And it's just there. It's part of the structure. Um, which again, like, you know, I don't know if you had a, yeah, if you had to think about going to the gym every day versus if you had a group that just, you know, you have a walking group and they just show up at your door and like, come on, let's go.

Right. Um, sometimes we need that, especially when we're starting something new. And so again, just. You know, sometimes it's not going to be perfect when you set it up, you know, it's not going to maybe be implemented right away. But that's the thing, right? Practice makes perfect building resilience, getting comfortable with discomfort, setting up the systems of accountability and then just continuing to build. 

Recognize that it might be a work in progress and that's okay as long as you're working in that direction.  

Absolutely. I just love what you said right now.  It's like, okay, take small steps. You're working in that direction. It's not going to happen overnight.  Like, you don't build muscle mass overnight too.

Like if you haven't been weightlifting for a while, or if you haven't been taking care of your body for a while and you go to the gym, you can't expect. Everything to just turn in a month. No, no, that's not going to happen. It's going to, the process is probably you're looking at two to three years, but are you getting closer to your goal  with every workout that you do?

Absolutely. Yes.  All the.  Uncomfortable  things  that are there in life, in our lives,  they are all long games.  They are not sprints. You're not going to get there in less than 10 seconds. No, no, no.  It's not going to happen in one workout. It's not going to happen in one team meeting.

It's not going to happen with one survey.  I know organizations where there's like  once a year survey that you have to fill out. And I also know employees who are. And I'm not scared as hell to say anything on those surveys. Absolutely. So it's not gonna happen. It's not gonna be like that. If that's what you're counting on.

If you're counting on going to the gym once a week. And seeing results.  It's just like that. Like giving out the survey, end of the year survey.  And expecting results.  Sorry. Yeah. 

Yeah. And that's again where often I see, I mean. Yeah. When you, if you work out once a week and your goal is to try to push yourself, you're going to end up hurting yourself.

Right. And so that's also the thing is that, you know, I've heard from people, like you said, and in corporations or in couples where they're like, well, I want to have an emotional conversation, or I want to be honest, but I'm afraid it's just going to lead to more conflict, or we're just going to hurt each other or hurt ourselves, right?

It's like, well, maybe you're trying to lift a little too heavy, right? It's like, you can't just run up to the gym and for the first day, try to it. You know, lift, whatever some PR, right?  It's like, you got to work up to that. And so that's again, the recognizing that, you know,  it's not going to be the big overnight change.

It's just not, but you can start implementing again, the cultural shifts, the. The, uh, more  incremental steps, because that's your goal. But again, that's where it takes consistency. It takes commitment. It takes systems. Um, and again, if you're going back to the leadership, or if this is a couple or just, you know, um.

You are in charge of deciding that this is a goal you want to work towards, and that if it takes you three years, five years, that that's still worth it for you,  right? And you're not going to get discouraged after the first survey, and you're like, well, nobody filled it out, so I give up. It's like, well, then clearly it's not very important to you.

So again, being honest with yourself of, is this important to me? If so, how can I make sure that my behaviors continue to align with the value that I,  

 Absolutely. And I think safety is at the base of it, as you said, in your strong model too.

I think the most important thing in,  Maslow's hierarchy,  right? Like safety comes first  and then there, , I actually reviewed Maslow's hierarchy like a couple of days ago, but I, I'm totally blanking out on it, but I know safety is the first one. 

And that's really where, you know, my model, it starts with safety because at the end of the day, like as humans, we don't do anything unless we have safety.

Right. Um, yeah,  it's, it's the foundation of everything. So  we're going to start there. 

Absolutely. Absolutely. Oh my gosh, this is so good. I, I learned a lot and I think  there are so many parallels to having like personal relationships and then how they translate into our professional life too.  And I've seen this in my clients, although, you know, I'm coaching them on wellbeing, but I do see this a lot that people who are not doing well in one.

Like, let's say, uh, they're not doing well in their relationships at home, they're not doing well in their relationships at work, too.  Because, again, it's the same concept, because you're trying to avoid discomfort. It doesn't matter where the relationship is.  The, the system that you're going to create and you're going to put in place for your relationship at home and  let's say somebody who is doing well in their relationship at home, if you have a system in place there,  try to bring it in to your work too, even if it's not a system wide.

System in place, our framework in place, you can always implement it yourself to and talk to your supervisor, talk to your manager. This is how I like  to  collaborate and work with my team. Is that something that's available to us over here? Are you open to it? Right. Or at least, are you open to me implementing this  for myself?

This is how I work best. And again, that takes a lot of exploration, a lot of clarity around how you work best, what you want out of life, what you want out of that workplace, what you want out of your career as a whole, and I think organizations have to recognize that this work is so important and that's going to drive success for them.

That's going to drive employee productivity in the long run. So thank you so much. I really loved this conversation. Honestly, when I scheduled the interview, I didn't know where it's going to go. So. I'm totally pleasantly surprised. Thank you for your time, Crystal. 

Thank you. This was fun. 

 One last thing.

Where can our viewers and listeners find you if they want to work with you, if they want to learn more about your work? Where should they go?  

Well, you can contact me on LinkedIn.  Or my website is just strong. love.  

I love that strong. love.  Yeah, cool. Very, very cool. Oh, thank you. Thank you so much. And thank you everyone for listening to us, for watching our interview.

I hope you guys stay warm if you are in one of the colder states and if not, enjoy your day. Bye.

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