Cheeky Run Club

Laura Henshaw on what she's learnt from running

• Phoebe Pincus & Anna Coldham • Season 7 • Episode 8

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Hello and good morning cheeky crew!

This week, we had the absolute pleasure of hearing the five running lessons that the one and only Laura Henshaw – the CEO and co-founder of KIC - has learnt over her running journey.

We’re also in awe of everyone competing at the World Athletics in Tokyo, plus there’s been an exciting development in the Enhanced Games 👀

LINKS:

Laura has gifted the cheeky community a discount code to their new Kicrun challenge- use the code CHEEKY for one month free when you sign up to Kic on a monthly subscription at www.kicapp.com. Available for new and returning users only. Expires December 31st, 2025.

Follow us wherever you get your podcasts + Instagram, TikTok, Substack, Phoebe's Strava + Anna's Strava, and join our Strava community 🩵

Music produced by Hugh Raper & logo design by Michael Cotellessa. Podcast edited by Kiara Martin.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Cheeky Run Club recognizes that every day we live, work, and run on Aboriginal land.

anna audio (intro outro):

Welcome to Cheeky Run Club. Wait. Welcome Welcome to Cheeky Run Club, the social running podcast and community for your everyday amateur runner. Hello, Phoebe Holly and hello listeners.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Today we have the great pleasure. We've actually just wrapped up interviewing. Mm-hmm. Laura Henshaw, who we will introduce. She doesn't really need an introduction, but we will introduce her in a minute. we chatted to her about her five, lessons that she's learned from running over the years. so excited for everyone to listen. They're all incredibly relatable, I think, for everyone's running journeys

anna audio (intro outro):

and it was just a really interesting lesson, especially because things have changed a lot for her since we last started her 18 months ago. So it was really cool to just catch up with her and see what's been going on. I know. so we you enjoy that. before we get into it, there's a of things. First, we are having an event with Lululemon, on Saturday, the day before the Melbourne Marathon at the Botanical Gardens in Melbourne. We're gonna pop a link in the show notes to register. Please come along. It's gonna be a shakeout run, a four kilometer jog or walk, or you don't even have to do that. Then we'll have coffee heats of good vibe. Vibes afterwards and get in amongst it. So you don't need to be participating in any of the runs. I certainly am not, but I will definitely be there. And

phoebe audio (intro outro):

you are participating as a supporter and a

anna audio (intro outro):

cheerer, which is maybe just as important, if not more.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

more. I'm gonna say you have a bigger job on the day.

anna audio (intro outro):

but yeah, so come along to that. We're also going to, by the time this episode comes out, the world championships for athletics in Tokyo would've just finished, but we are going to give our highlights so far. and also just touch on one little thing.'cause the enhanced games has popped

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yes. In

anna audio (intro outro):

our newsfeed.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

And we'd, we like to keep you updated.

anna audio (intro outro):

We do. We are just doing God's work.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

But before we kick into all of that, we will start off as always, with our notable runs or running related activities of the week. I'm so excited for yours This week, kick us off with your best.

anna audio (intro outro):

My best is so easy. It's a run slash walk that I did on Saturday before I met you and a couple of others for coffee. And first time in a long time. I felt like Saturday morning is spent how it should be. I did a 10 by three minute jog, one minute walk was absolutely.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Gassed and I loved every minute of it. So Good. You are so back. How did your hip feel? Uh, it's okay. It's definitely like, it's not a hundred percent, but I think'cause it's a tendy kind of thing, I feel like I bang on about tend, I feel like I'm just all, I'm just a tendon kind of now. anyway. have noisy tendons.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah. it's not gonna go from like, painful to no pain overnight. but I'm doing my exercises each day and the physio sort of said, the symptom relief should sort of come two to three weeks after you've built strength. So hopefully just over time it, I like feel it less and less.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

and talk. I saw your decision to get back on Strava. I noticed she's hard launch.

anna audio (intro outro):

I'm a hard launch Strava. it's been un notable absence from Strava the last little while, last actually quite often. sorry, quite a long time. So I think initially I, I went off it when I stopped running as much, but was still running a bit just'cause I had fomo and I thought looking at other people's running isn't really gonna make me feel. Good about myself or the fact that I can't do it. So I was like outta sight outta mind. I actually deleted that and Instagram, my

phoebe audio (intro outro):

personal account? Yeah.

anna audio (intro outro):

'cause

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Full recluse, hermit mode.

anna audio (intro outro):

just'cause I was like, I just don't need

phoebe audio (intro outro):

to stuff. Um,

anna audio (intro outro):

purely just back on Strava because I am able to run and I'm enjoying it. And

phoebe audio (intro outro):

back, you uploaded a picture,

anna audio (intro outro):

I know.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

I know, yeah. A screenshot. Yeah. Yeah. What was that of?

anna audio (intro outro):

Oh, it was Ava Taylor Swift song For anyone who listen, who watches the summer item pretty, they will know.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

I just screenshotted a, the like thumbnail of a song that was, quite important. right? Okay. So now show? that makes sense. I couldn't understand why you'd made that your specific return to Strava. Yeah. But know, you know, it's dressed by Taylor Swift Okay. anyway, what was your best run? Well, this actually feels like a lifetime ago, but it was last, Friday. So it was a ago. ago And yeah, I was doing a session mm-hmm. In Sydney. Mm-hmm. And I'd been in Sydney for a few days for work. It had been bucketing rain, rain, wasn't crazy Rain? And then for whatever reason, Friday morning, Stunning. Yeah. Beautiful day. So nice. I'd been, not feeling a hundred percent, and my like run the day before I just felt pretty average. So I was like, okay, I am just gonna like see how this session goes. And I did it with a friend, grace. Yeah. which. We, the session was, a bit of a longer temporary. It was a six K effort, five minute jog, 2K effort. so quite a longer session for me at least. Um. And you know when you're just feeling a bit nervous, like this is gonna be really hard. Yeah. I've been doing all my long sessions, all my long efforts have been by myself for ages. Doing it with Grace made such a difference to the run

anna audio (intro outro):

so much more fun.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

It was so it's a just different, it feels like doing different sport than when I've been like. Pushing away in my slogging away in those long efforts. Whereas when you're running with someone, you're kind of a, you're pushing each other like you're feeling good. Like she was kind of able to carry the pace for a lot of it, and I could just like sit with her and just like, don't think about it. Just yeah, just relax. It sounds more of a team sport. Yeah, definitely. And I feel like when you're not, when you're running with someone else, you don't feel like you need to be hyperfocused on what pace is.'cause you kind No, I agree. You do. You, you just vibe it out a lot more. Yeah. so yeah, it was like beautiful morning. and I'd ran faster than I thought I was gonna go. Yeah. Which was really nice.'cause I feel like for ages it's been the opposite for, I, I was like, oh, okay. Even though I'd had like a really full on week, and you're feeling tired, it's like, oh, my body still can like, push through and like, Yeah. Felt good, So I love that. So good. What was your worst running related activity? Mine was actually from this morning, oh, actually I think I mentioned on the podcast, I started New Common, anyway, we started at seven 30 in the morning and my spin class at Cycle Collective that I like doing on a Friday, they start at six 30 and it's just, I can't. Get to work in time'cause it finishes at seven 15. So I decided to go to a different spin class that started at six 15 and a little bit closer to work. I'm not gonna name where it was, no, it was, I honestly nearly walked out. So, So so bad? okay, so it is six 15 on a Friday morning. The instructor opens up the class by asking us what the definition of tenacity is and saying how we are all tenacious people. You need that grit, you need that vibe. As she's like wearing a microphone, so it's like quite full on The room is also dark, and then the lights come on and the music that comes on and it is so loud and then she's walking around being like, we can beat this out.

anna audio (intro outro):

But I literally, it's. I was like, it sounds like you're having sex. Like she's like, faster. Faster. Yes, yes. Go. And I literally was losing my mind. I'm like looking around being like, is this just me

phoebe audio (intro outro):

is just me

anna audio (intro outro):

and everyone else? blank Everything's completely normal. This is how, and then she like says some things and then all of a sudden from the crowd, she gets this woo. And then all these people wooing. And I'm

phoebe audio (intro outro):

like, no way.

anna audio (intro outro):

is

phoebe audio (intro outro):

The crowd, the people, the people on their bikes,

anna audio (intro outro):

it's probably six 30 on a Friday morning. I'm like, this is not it.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

feeling Tenacious.

anna audio (intro outro):

Oh, I was

phoebe audio (intro outro):

feeling

anna audio (intro outro):

anything but tenacious at that point. And then she pointed me out. I got in trouble because you do it to the beat, like the cycle to the beat. And she was like left. Left. Left, and then I was doing it to the beat, but it was actually my right foot that was down. And then she, she must,'cause she must have a thing up on the screen that says your name. And she was like, other left Anna.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Oh,

anna audio (intro outro):

I was like that. It was at that point that I was like. I think I'm gonna walk out.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

my last time

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah. Anyway, so I actually called Dave, my husband after, and I was like, can you remind me never to do

phoebe audio (intro outro):

that?

anna audio (intro outro):

again?

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Your personal assistant? Write this down. Dave.

anna audio (intro outro):

Next Thursday night when I say, oh, I might do blah, blah, blah. Anyway, that was

phoebe audio (intro outro):

What are we? Vibe? He must have walked down into the world being like, whoa,

anna audio (intro outro):

I don't think I've ever left a class so quickly.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

You know how normally you kind of like put your shoes on, blah, Yeah, I would say thank you. Did you say thank you? Absolutely not.

anna audio (intro outro):

Anyway, what was your worst running related run or running related activity

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yeah, running related. Well, I, I've been sick. Shock. Shock.

anna audio (intro outro):

No,

phoebe audio (intro outro):

No, I know, but that's not actually my worst, although maybe this is where it all kicked off to be fair. So again, this was last week. We recorded on Tuesday night last week. Mm-hmm. And. I had quite a late night that night. Then writing the substack.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

and I had like a little just breakdown, mental breakdown on Tuesday night where I was like, I'd gotten up so early to do the session in that morning. Like

anna audio (intro outro):

Tuesdays are hard.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

so early, so it was like 5:00 AM and I didn't sit down till 11:00 PM or like get into bed that that was the first time all day.'cause I'd had such a big day at work as well that I'd like stopped. And I was flying to Sydney the next day. I like, hadn't packed, I wasn't ready. You know, when you just like, you have too much. It was all too much. I did write about this in the Substack, so apologies for anyone who but yeah, I had I, it's funny, I woke up the next morning. I almost felt like hungover. Yeah. When you're, actually of emotional hangover, I feel super tired and overwhelmed and then you have a cry.'cause I feel like. I actually don't know. I feel like it must dehydrate you or something. Yeah.

anna audio (intro outro):

And you have that, like, you have a bit of a like

phoebe audio (intro outro):

hangover headache. Yes. Headache, yeah. And I think there's like an emotional hangover. Like I was so, you know, it was cathartic. I had a good cry. But like, then the next morning I just felt a bit like, not numb, but just a bit like, ugh.

anna audio (intro outro):

Anyway,

phoebe audio (intro outro):

got up. I was running by myself'cause I'd tried to give myself a bit of a sleep in, which was good. put on my shoes, and I just couldn't get myself out the door. Like I literally, one point was just standing there fully ready and I was like, I can't, yeah, I just can't do this. And it's such an awful feeling'cause like running. It's something that I'm normally, I wanna be excited

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah. It's meant to make you feel good.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

But I just couldn't, add myself up for it. And so, I didn't run and That's good. That was the right decision, I think.'cause then I got sick a few days later anyway. Which I do. I do just feel like I was probably bit off, a little bit more than I could chew. Yeah. but that was just a bit of a, that was a downer.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah, yeah. No, I get that. Yeah. It's not a nice feeling, especially then when you're like gonna Sydney away from home. Yeah. Like it just that whole, your mindset. Yeah. You just would, it would've been too much.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

much. Too much. But, we do touch on some of these, some of these themes in our chat with Laura. So without further ado,

anna audio (intro outro):

welcome Laura.

laura audio:

Cheeky

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

listeners, we are so to introduce our special guest for today, Laura Henshaw. Laura is many things. She's CEO and co-founder of the Australian Health and Fitness app kick one of the biggest and most engaged fitness and wellness communities in the country. She's the co-host of Kick Pod. She's the author of two books. She was also our first. Ever guest on the cheeky pod way back in season one, nearly 18 months ago. Laura, welcome back to the pod. How are

laura audio:

you? Thank you. I am just laughing and listening. It's so awkward. We were talking before of Mike, how awkward it is to sit here during your intro,

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

you just like nodding. It's like

laura audio:

happy

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

birthday to you. Yeah, yeah. But a personal, very intimate. now the plan for today's episode is that Laura is gonna tell us about five things that running has taught her, which we're excited to talk through. we will ease into it with a couple of questions first because we wanna catch up on everything, since we last had you on the show. So, we normally kick off our episodes, and we talk through our best and worst runs of the week or running related. Activities. So let's start there. Give us your best. Okay,

laura audio:

so I, we, I am sure we'll get into this, but I'm not running much at the moment, mine's gonna be movement related, but not running. I have been, actually, I'm how, I'm 28 weeks pregnant, so the past five weeks I haven't been very active. At all. But this week I did a prenatal Pilates class at home. Nice. it was very gentle and very, very lovely, but it did make me feel much better.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Oh, that's so nice.

laura audio:

Oh, that's so, that's my best of the week. I did something. Yeah. And it made me feel good.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

what's the main difference between a prenatal Pilates class and a normal Pilates class?

laura audio:

There's as you get further, and I've literally am just, I'm just learning this. as you get further into your pregnancy, there's things you can and can't do, so you can't lie on your back

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

past a certain phase.

laura audio:

Yeah. You have to do things on your side. you have to be careful about, we were talking about it before as well, about AB separation. Mine have separated, so if you start getting this like dome of stuff coming out in the middle, you need to stop.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

if you see an elbow.

laura audio:

so, yes, there's a, there's a few things. It's more with. Prenatal Pilates, really just getting your body ready for mobility really.'cause it's moved, changing so much every day. Wow. Yes.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Very cool. That is very cool. What about your worst?

laura audio:

Uh, so my worst, it actually is running related because, yeah, that's good. and it is so, this is so funny and Phoebe, we were talking about this before we started, but my boobs have grown from a B to an e. Oh, like I went and got out when the lady was like, you are an E. I was like, what do you mean?

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

like, who are you talking

laura audio:

No, it's not me. Can't be me. And I'm thinking of all of my friends who I used to that have bigger boobs. And I like, when I was in high school, I was like, oh my God, I just, I wish I had your boobs. And they were like, Laura makes it hard, harder to run. You have to have really, really supportive sports bra. Like I always have neck pain and shoulder pain. You don't want these boobs. And I am messaging all of them, or they're

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

so

laura audio:

me and I'm like, I get you. Because I like run between things. I'm not running long, but like I'll run between meetings

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah,

laura audio:

to the toilet.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Also, even that you are noticing

laura audio:

I can't eat. I have to hold them. I can't run down the stairs. So I was literally running down the stairs in our office and I was like, oh my God, I can't, I, I have to hold if I'm gonna do this now. Like brace for impact.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

gosh. Unreal. Okay, well that's running related. We'll take dashing between two dashing the boobs. I'm sure people can relate. Yeah. And maybe, we'll ask a little bit of a question about, your running journey since falling pregnant in a moment. But it'd be good to get a bit of a running update from, since you were last on the pod. I believe you might have participated in a major marathon. Tell us about that experience. It's,

laura audio:

so we caught up in, which is crazy. It Felix, it felt like it was yesterday

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah,

laura audio:

just checked before this because I was like, have we spoken about the New York marathon yet? But it was in March and then I did that in November. Yeah. So since we spoke, I have done my first marathon. Huge. Yes. And

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

not just any marathon, there was just any

laura audio:

oh, it was so, it was so special. It was the most, it was definitely very difficult, and I'm gonna speak to a little bit of it in one of my lessons as to why it was maybe a little bit more difficult, but, and it was funny, like as I finished, I was like, I will never do this again. Why do people, the first 28 K was like, oh my god, a marathons. Who? They're not hard. What are you talking about? Like why do people say this is difficult? And then it hit me at like 28 K and I was like, oh my God, this is so uncomfortable and so difficult. And why am I subjecting myself to this? And people are crazy who do this and why do people do it? Yeah. And the spiral. The spiral. And then at the end as well of New York. So you, you get to 40 2K and you are, because at the end everyone had warned me about the bridges being very hilly and elevated and I was like having high elevation.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I

laura audio:

like, okay. I was so ready for that because everyone was like, oh my God, they will kill you. And I feel like I went in with it thinking it was gonna be like the Hilliest hill of all time and it was still hilly, but it was actually fine. I feel like,'cause my expectation was like,

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

10. Yeah. Yeah.

laura audio:

But no one told me about the hill running up to Central Park, which I believe, and that's at the end. I thought Central Park was like, I'll have 2K to go. Just do a little like, no, I think you do about seven K around Central Park and it starts with a hill. I

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

was gonna say Central Park is deceivingly actually not that flat. Yeah.

laura audio:

but in Melbourne, all of our parks are pretty flat, so I was like, what do you mean this is so much elevation. And I was crawling, my husband was, right near the finish line and he filmed me. My technique was cooked. I was like, it was so, it was, I was, I was so bad. Got to the end, and then I'm like, oh my God, thank God. I just wanna sit down. And then you're not allowed to sit down, which is good because they want you to keep moving. But it was. I think it was a two mile walk and I was like, this is actually cooked too long. Yes, yes, yes, yes. It was so cooked. It was, it was longer than 2K. I was So you weren't, but you couldn't get out of it because it was all barricaded. Yeah. And every time I tried to sit down, they would tell me off. So I was like, okay. So it was even either like you had to call the emergency

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. Yeah. Or

laura audio:

had to continue walking yourself. Yeah. So yes, that was honestly the part was the walk afterwards. Oh

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Oh my goodness. That, yeah. What was your emotion crossing the finish line? were you just relieved it was done or were you Yeah. How did

laura audio:

Oh, I, I did cry. It, it was, it was just relief thinking.'cause truly from 28 K and it's not like at 28 K you're like, oh, I've got a few Ks to go. I can do it. It's like, I've still got 14 kilometers to go here. but I think the other thing was in the marathon, I, after that point, if I stopped, I wouldn't have been able to start again because I know all my muscles would've spasmed. So I thought, I was like, fuck, maybe I'm gonna have to stop. I'm not gonna finish this. And so when I finished it was just this immense pride of oh my goodness, I just did something I never, ever thought that I could do. So cool. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

And what was the crowd like in New York?

laura audio:

Oh my God. They were, I, I love Americans. And it's interesting, I've spoken to a few people that have been very lucky and done New York and Sydney. Yeah. And they were talking about the difference in the crowd. Yeah. So New York is like every person you run past and it's, it's like a festival. Everyone out

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

the front

laura audio:

their houses, there's not many, apart from on the bridges, there's not many periods during the entire run where there's not like, and it's not just one person. It's

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

like

laura audio:

10 people back crowd. Wow. and you have, I didn't have my name on my top. I wish I did, but everyone had their name. People would be like, yeah. Phoebe, like, you have got this. You are amazing. Don't you Give up on yourself, keep going. And you're like, and I'm like listening to people say that to others. I'm like, wow, that's incredible. And it sounds like they're best friends, but they're never their strangers. And so that was incredible. But what people were saying with Sydney is there was actually a huge crowd, which is, which was amazing. But I think in our culture in Australia, we are not as. yeah, it's not kindness. We're just not as

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

extroverted in that.

laura audio:

like, we don't pick out someone's name and be like, you can do such hard things. You keep going.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I feel like they're a little more like shameless over there in a sense where they'll just be like, anyone's woo girl. Whereas over here, I feel like even I get a bit, I get like

laura audio:

We like, oh yeah, Yeah. Like, am I gonna say their name wrong? Or whatever. So yeah, the, the crowd was just. It was amazing. But it was interesting at the start, people were like, you don't need headphones. The crowd's so amazing. But I was like, it was amazing. But I also was like, oh, I needed music. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

yeah, yeah. Wow. What an amazing experience that, that's such a dream draw New York. That would be so cool.

laura audio:

you guys will be there soon.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah, maybe one day. Maybe one

laura audio:

Definitely.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Also Sydney also looks really, that's major. would prefer New York

laura audio:

Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

personally. Sorry to everyone who just read Sydney. No, I just remember my older housemate, she's moved to New York and she said she signed up, she did it last year actually because her first time over there and she's like kind of into running, but like not heaps, she always sort of. Thought I was a bit odd. Fell always going for a run and she was like, it was literally the best day of the year. People are just like on the street drinking from like 10:00 AM and like not obviously

laura audio:

cultural

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

do that

laura audio:

It's a cultural event for them

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. And tell us about what about since you've fallen pregnant, how has that changed? How or how you run?

laura audio:

Mm, quite a lot. Quite a lot. So I, it's funny, so as I was finishing New York, as I was saying, I was like, oh, who the heck would ever do a marathon again? This is crazy, et cetera. But then You know, you get like a week out of it, two weeks out of it, three weeks out of it, and you forget how hard it was and then you just remember the good things.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

You're like, oh, quite enjoyed that.

laura audio:

It's almost like when you break up with a boyfriend and then like two months later you are like, oh, but he was really, you just like remember all the, then

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah,

laura audio:

your girlfriend's like, no. Yeah, exactly.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. I think people say childbirths like that as well.

laura audio:

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I'm never gonna do.

laura audio:

this again. Yeah, it's so true. So I then decided I would do the London. I was very lucky to get an opportunity with New Balance to do, and they asked me, do you wanna do the London Marathon? And I was like, oh my goodness. Well I have to, don't I, and I had told myself that with the London one. I had some, a very funny night before the New York Marathon, which we'll go into later. Yep. But I told myself that I wanted to do one marathon without. What happened to me the night before New York

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

happening.

laura audio:

and to see how I felt and if it still felt like really, really difficult, of course it's gonna feel difficult. Sorry, but really just uncomfortable in my body. Then I won't do another one. Yeah. so I was training for London and I was at, I think my, I just had a 28 k training run, but my training runs were the, my two long runs I'd kind of done weeks in a row. Felt really difficult. Yeah. And I was like, oh, I don't know why I am feeling so tired. But also with running, sometimes that happens like where you're at in your cycle. I was about to get my period and then I found out that I was pregnant. I was like, oh, goodness me. This is a big shock. And I wasn't We were not trying, and everyone says like, if you're having unprotected sex, you are trying. We weren't

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah.

laura audio:

okay. Everyone on the internet anyway. Anyway, I was actually booked in to have a laparoscopy on the 15th of.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

May.

laura audio:

So I was thinking like it was gonna take us a long time. There were a few things going on with inside, et cetera, and it was, that was the laproscopy was for after the London Marathon. So the plan was do the London Marathon, get my laproscopy, and then maybe start trying after that. so it was a very big shock and. I had, it was so funny. The first thing, like, or maybe not honestly, the third thing I said to my husband when we found out,'cause he was still in the shower, I didn't even wait for him to get in the shower because I was like, actually I,

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

actually I've seen this in, yeah. It's so good. You're like, what about Olympics? Yeah.

laura audio:

honestly like, that was the third. I literally, it was like, can I still do London Marathon? And it's so funny because we're both like, oh yeah, of course you'll be able to. Yeah. Yeah. I'll be able to. Yeah. Yeah. And then after that, I. I just started feeling so tired. I was doing like a three K run and it would just felt my heart rate was so much higher. Yeah, it just felt like such a slog. And I think as well, it's like some people do marathons pregnant, but because I wasn't near the distance yet, I still had quite a bit to build up in my training. And because of how much of a strain it is on your body, I just didn't feel. Comfortable and it's kind of when you, there's so many articles online to say you can or you can't or whatever. But I felt like. Shit. Yes. And when it actually, I would've been seven and a half weeks when the marathon was on, and at that point I was feeling the worst. So I'm actually, I don't think even if I had

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

yeah, you're relieved that you put Yeah, yeah,

laura audio:

So then I felt pretty bad in the first trimester and just so demotivated exhausted. And it's, I think too, in your first trimester, because the child is literally sesame seed size, like it's so small. And you, but your hormones are literally like HCG. We've never had, you only have in your body once. I've now learned all this stuff, um, which I knew nothing of before, but when you're pregnant, that's that hormone. I think it triples almost every single day and we have not had, and our progesterone and estrogen also goes up

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

significantly. Yeah. Wow.

laura audio:

Your, that hormone increase make can make you feel. Crazy'cause it's like this hormone milkshake, so tired. It's exhausting. Plus your body is like growing the placenta and all these incredible things. But because you can't see it yet and you just, you just, it's so, it's quite confronting how tired you get.'cause you're like, I understand. I thought, oh, the longer it gets, the more tired I would be. But actually at the start is I found so far has found, has was the hardest. So I hardly ran and I, when I did do my three K run. That would mean that day I was wiped out. I was too tired to even work properly. Yeah. So I was like, I need, I don't wanna use all my ex, my energy on a run, which is so different because usually exercise makes you feel so

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

energy feel. Yeah. I was

laura audio:

didn't do that. It was the opposite. Sugar was making me feel good. Exercise was making me feel shit. Um, so I didn't run, and then we had a shoot for New Balance. It would've been like, oh, I reckon I was about 16 or 18 weeks pregnant, but I hadn't run much at all. And the biggest thing with movement in pregnancy is if you do it before you're pregnant and then you continue it, usually you, you obviously have to adjust some things, but usually you would feel comfortable. But because it had been such a long time since I'd run regularly, my body wasn't conditioned for it. So I got really bad pelvic girdle pain and then I was like, okay, that. Me done. Yeah. For the pregnancy.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I have to ask.'cause I feel like I'm, we were talking about this a bit before, I feel like you're being very pragmatic about it. Like, oh, well I just can't do it. But you're someone who's loved running for so long, like how have you dealt with that? Not being something you can do anymore.

laura audio:

Yeah, I think it's interesting. At the start I saw people running and I was like, I'm allergic to this. Like I, it was so I

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

yeah. You like not even jealous. Yeah.

laura audio:

but what I miss is with exercises, it's something that helps me, like higher intensity exercise because I've still been doing like some, you know, Pilates stuff and some strength stuff, but the high that you get from Iran. Or that type of activity, I, you can't, it's very hard to replicate that. So often I feel like days when I wake up and I just feel like this blur and like shit, I'm, my God, I wish I could go for a

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. To like get it outta your system stuff. Yeah.

laura audio:

trying to do things like meditate and journaling and,

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. Yeah.

laura audio:

Interesting. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Do you find that helpful? Yeah.

laura audio:

Yeah, it's much better than getting up and scrolling on my phone for an hour.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Shocking. Hot. Wow.

laura audio:

But it is, it's, but it's like you think, oh no, it's doing nothing. Like, it's just,

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

just, yeah.

laura audio:

makes us feel like shit. So yeah, I'm just trying to do less of that stuff.'cause otherwise in the morning, that's what I'll do and then I'm like, no, I actually feel worse.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

yeah, yeah, yeah.'cause I feel like, especially like you are someone that you know, would've been exercising so much. So all of a sudden you'd kind of almost like now that you're not as tired, you kind of would have quite a lot of time in the morning. Yeah, yeah, totally.

laura audio:

And it's just like, how do you use that in a way, but you can't do anything that's, well, what I was doing before. So yeah, it's been, it's been interesting. And I think the other thing is worth saying is that I didn't think this would be my pregnancy. Like I remember. I used to see these videos of women running that were pregnant on the treadmill 35 weeks so fast, and I'd always send it to Steph and I was like, see, you can keep running when you're pregnant. Like,'cause so many people say they feel like they're gonna weed themselves after like after

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

12 weeks.

laura audio:

was the pressure and I was like. Seth, this will be me. She loves me.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

yeah, she'd like, mm-hmm.

laura audio:

like, but she's so good about her shit. And she didn't say like, no.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

She's

laura audio:

oh yeah, it could be you could be you. Who knows? It was not me.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Let's kick into our main deep dive today, which is your running lessons, which I'm so excited to hear. We haven't heard them yet. we have been really interested in this idea of like getting someone to come on and talk about their running lessons because something we reflect on quite a bit is that we are always learning from running, whether that's lessons about running or about our bodies or ourselves or just about life generally. So let's dive into it. What's your first lesson?

laura audio:

Okay, so my first lesson is consistency over perfection, which is a lesson that is not just obviously for running, it's for life, and that is something that. To bring back to what happened the night before the New York Marathon. So I was, with my marathon prep, I was pretty good. I mean, there were weeks where I was sick or injured and just a little bit injured. Uh, I didn't have to stop for long. Niggles. Niggles. Yeah. Yeah. But I only Do you know about that? Yeah. and that mentally was difficult when I was like, oh, I can't. And when you're sick, if you keep running, it's not gonna make it better. Like you're gonna get sicker. We all learn, we all learn the hard way. We learn the hard way. But it is when you're in a training block and I was following my marathon program, I was like, oh my God, I've missed a week. What's gonna happen, I'm not gonna be able to do it, et cetera, et cetera. then I got through most of my training runs, felt comfortable. I was pretty consistent. Then I got to New York and I was, there with, with New Balance, which was amazing. And there was another kind of big group of runners there from Australia. And one of them was talking to me about their car looting plan. And I was like. What do you mean? I thought you just ate lots of carbs a day before. Yeah. Um, but he was like, oh no, like I'm gonna start five days out and I'm, this is like my ratio per body weight kilo. And I was like, I don't even know how much I weigh. Like, I know I'm gonna calculate that. But anyway, so I feel like I got in my head a little bit about like, oh my God, I should do this, I have to do this, et cetera. And obviously it's so important for your body before, but I, I just went a bit too sciencey with it and intense for like

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. Well, I feel like especially when you're in that environment, it becomes quite consuming and then all of a sudden you're like, oh my God, this might make break

laura audio:

and you get in your head, like even in, in New York, I was trying to walk trying to take the subway, but I was still doing like 20,000 steps a day. And then I was getting worried like, oh my God, am I ruining my legs before the marathon? Like. You just have to sometimes, like, I'm not an Olympic athlete, like, just let it go. Yeah. It's

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah.

laura audio:

Uh, and so what happened? I was doing all my carb loading and I was buying these yogurt drinks to have the night before or like at night. And one night which was the night before the marathon, I happened to buy a cashew yogurt drink accidentally, so a vegan one. I'm anaphylactic to cashews, so I had a sip of this yogurt drink at 10:00 PM. So the marathon in New York, it was so funny, the mar, well, not funny at the time, but the marathon in New York, because they shut down the whole city. So I had to be at the bus at, I think it was 5:00 AM I had to meet the New Balance team at the bus. So this is 10:00 PM so it's sort of like a lot of hours between, have my sip of my yogurt, yogurt drink. I'm like, this tastes weird. And then I was like, oh my God. I knew straight away I'm like

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah, I was gonna say, did you realize? Yeah.

laura audio:

Spatted out, ran over to, and I reckon I would've swallowed like a tiny, tiny, tiny bit, which was lucky. It was only a tiny bit. But I went over to the drink and I was like, oh, hopefully it's got like a tiny bit of nuts. But then it was first ingredient cashews,'cause it's vegan Anyway, I didn't go into anaphylaxis, which is if I, if my throat, because with my reactions, they're often only mild if I have a tiny, tiny, tiny bit and I know within about five minutes. Where my throat is and my throat wasn't swelling, so that was why I didn't,'cause obviously you need to be, take it seriously if you are, if your throat is swelling, you need to call the ambulance. Very important. but I was having a mild reaction, which just basically means I feel so nauseous, I vomit. and. It's just I get a rush and just feel like you feel exhausted for like three days after having it.'cause your body has so much adrenaline. Anyway, so I started vomiting and I was vomiting. I'm like, great. All this carb loading, all my hydration, like all of those things going down the, literally down the toilet, quite literally down the drain. And then it was. It was probably about 11:45 PM and I was lying there with my, if I move my head like an inch in bed, or not even inch, half an inch, I would feel like I have to go vomit again. And I was like, to my husband, what? And it was so funny as well. So he obviously gets quite anxious if I have a nut allergy. Fair enough. He had just taken a sleeping tablet. Oh no. Because it was funny, he took it like at 9 55 because we were still like a little bit jet lagged and like, so he took his. Sleeping tablet. So he's like got adrenaline running through his body, but also a sleeping tablet. So the poor thing, it's just like, you know when you can't sleep on a sleeping tablet, it's just, yeah, it's not good. So he was, he was on his own journey as well, and I was like, what time is it? He is like 1130. And I was like, shit, okay. And then I closed my eyes and I just. Whatever was lying there. Not asleep. But then I asked again like, what time is it? And he's like, it's one 30. And I was like, I still feel like I'm dead.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Oh my

laura audio:

And so I've

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I was like, that's it.

laura audio:

it. I'm gonna have to wait till my body's recovered. And on Wednesday, I'm, how embarrassing. I've told everyone I'm doing the marathon and I've done this stupid thing with

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. Yeah.

laura audio:

embarrassing did you balance how embarrassing to everyone on social media? So I'm gonna do the marathon around Central Park by myself on Wednesday. I bull planned. I was like, I'm not gonna

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

be able. Yeah, well you can't really race in that condition. No.

laura audio:

But then by a miracle, it was daylight savings in New York that day and we gained an

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

ounce. Oh.

laura audio:

Oh. So I then fell asleep and I woke up two or three hours later and I was, my alarm went off and I was, as soon as it went off, I moved my head to think I'm gonna vomit. Yeah. And then I felt fine, and it was a miracle. And so I was like, oh my goodness. I am fine. So then I went and I on no sleep. And so for if you had have told me I was gonna do the New York marathon and also I do not recommend this to anyone listening, like it's not the best race break, but I was gonna vomit the night before, have a reaction and be like tired from that. Have three hours sleep, have ruin my carb loading and my hydration,

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

in your body. Yeah.

laura audio:

which I then tried to have as much as I could in the

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

morning.

laura audio:

But I could still do it. I would've been like, absolutely not. Like there's no way I wouldn't do it. Why would I do it in that condition? Like I wouldn't be able to get through. Yeah. And so that was a very, very big, the only thing was my heart rate was very high for a lot of it, which I now know. Um, I actually didn't know. But you shouldn't run if your heart rate is elevated, like. Super heart rate, well above your average, normal heart rate because

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

it's like stress on the

laura audio:

Well, your body's on stress. Exactly. Exactly. Right. And now I didn't know that, but now I, I do, my physio was like, um, I had a patient who's a cardiologist and she saw your heart rate and she was like, and I was like, oh, I didn't know that. Anyway, so obviously, it's definitely not the best prep at all or very much not

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

the worst possible. Yes.

laura audio:

but it was such a good reminder of, and I did, I had a goal. and I'm gonna talk about this in a minute. It's not about pace, but I had, and I, with this goal, kind of time I had in my head, I had three 30 in my head, is my goal of what I wanted to do. But I also, it was my first marathon. I had no idea how I was gonna go. So if I wasn't gonna, it wasn't like if I didn't get to that. I have such, I have a very good relationship with PACE and things now where if I don't get it, I'm not gonna be hard on myself. I know. It's just like, exactly. It's just I wanted to have a goal to work towards I think I missed it by seven minutes or something, but I didn't, I don't honestly care if it takes me 10 hours or 12 hours to finish this because I've

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

actually amazing to miss that by seven minutes after what you've been through

laura audio:

Well, it's, that went downhill after 28 k. I said the first bit was perfect. but it was just one of those moments where while I didn't hit that goal, but I didn't care, honestly the fact that I could have, I did it. I was like, that's, that's winning. That's amazing for me. I'm so proud of myself, but. I just, it just reminded me that we put so much pressure on ourselves sometimes to do everything perfectly, like in the lead up. if we miss a run or if a run doesn't feel good or whatever, that then it's like, oh, we might as well not try or we're not good enough, or whatever. Yeah. Um, it's not about every individual. Prep or run or whatever. It's consistency over time is what makes an impact. And it's just, I think it, you can have so much, I have so much trust in myself now that if I'm consistent with not just running, but everything in life, like even if specific instances don't go my way. Yeah. Overall it will. Yeah. Yeah. It's

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

like if you are just continuing

laura audio:

show up. Exactly. You

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

No matter what that looks like, then Yeah. Oh, what a great lesson. Yeah. I love it. I also can understand now why you wanna do another marathon. Yeah. Just to see without that night before. okay. So let's get to your second lesson.

laura audio:

Okay. Second lesson is I can do hard things. And so I think that, I mean, it very much ties into the first thing, but that's, that is what I love the most about running is I feel like it is this safe. It is probably one of the only places where. Outside of injury, which I mean, most of the time it actually is within our control because we don't stretch and things. But anyway, sometimes it is out of our control or if we fall over or whatever

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

it,

laura audio:

is. But outside of that, it is this really safe place to be able to progress and show yourself that you can do things that you didn't think. That you can do, and it doesn't matter if it's running 500 meters or a kilometer or a marathon, like it doesn't matter what that actual thing is. It's just this incredible place where you can, and you feel when you do something you didn't think you could do. I don't know if you both both felt this after your first marathon, but you just are like, wow. Like what? What are all the other stories that I've told myself in my life that I couldn't, such a mental shift. Yeah. Yeah. And so that definitely, and I think that's one of the most incredible things about running. It gives us so much more, like it's so much more than just putting your feet on the pavement and moving forward physically. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. I feel like as well, there's like the big moments, like you said, like when you do the marathon or whatever it is, but then there's also just the micro moments of like every day you get up and you probably don't feel like doing it, but you do it. And so it's like proving to yourself that. You can do all of those little things as well. And those things when they accumulate, like what a great lesson to learn is like, oh, I can push past that voice. That's like, maybe you feel too tired today, or whatever that looks like,

laura audio:

and it doesn't have to be perfect. It ties back into the first lesson in that. You not everything's gonna go perfect, but you can still work towards your goal and you can still progress. And it's something that, Hannah Ferguson speaks about it. Actually, can I get it up because I, yeah, It's not to do with writing it through with life generally, but I, it's just, it ties into it so well, and she says the things that keep women out of most rooms, most positions of power is because we expect perfection of ourselves and often other women to. And I

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

think,

laura audio:

I think so often, how many things have we not done in our lives? Because we're, and especially like you, were both very high performing individuals, so you probably do this tenfold to yourself. And we do, we do it in our mind. But I can think of so many times in my life where I haven't done something,'cause I'm like, oh, I'm not perfect at it. I can't speak about that because I'm not an expert. I can't launch whatever it is because I'm not good enough. To do it and other people are better and I'm not perfect, therefore I

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

to do it. Yeah.

laura audio:

do think that's something that as women, we think a lot more of. Yeah. Compared to like, especially with a lot of my male friends, they're like, oh, if I can get 50% of the way, like I might as well give it a goal. Yeah. But we put this pressure on ourselves that everything has to be perfect to try. Yeah. Yeah. That is super interesting. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

All right, lesson number

laura audio:

Number three, okay. Is listening to our body matters. Mm, very important. Why are you nodding like this? Tell me.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

uh, we have a tendency to accidentally not listen through our bodies. Yeah. But we agree that it matters. It's just there's the, there's the acknowledging it matters, which is the first step. And then there's like the how. Which is the journey that is ongoing

laura audio:

And what's been the hardest thing with, for you both with that?

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Well, I, I actually find acknowledging what my body's telling me. Hard. Yes. Which I know kind of sounds silly, but actually being able to listen. To it. once it's telling me something, I'm like, okay, I'll do this, or I won't do this. But I find it hard to actually make that connect and be oh, that's, yeah. Yeah. We've said before like you almost need to ask it, which sounds crazy, but like it doesn't always gets lost in translation. Good at suppressing it.

laura audio:

Suppose. Yeah, you

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

get pretty good at being like, yes. Pushing through. Pushing through, especially with something like running that it has this positive effect where like you feel better afterwards. and so, and I think it's one of those things, you do that for so many years, so then it's kind of hard to unravel. Yeah. Um, and start actually acknowledging it. I feel like I struggle with the counter narrative of am I just making excuses and being lazy or is this a, am I genuinely tired and need to rest? And that's the, the two voices in my head is not that I would use the word lazy to myself necessarily, but they'd be like, oh, but you're tough. no, you're fine. You can push through versus being like. No, you're actually sick or you're

laura audio:

sick or

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

whatever. That tired or you actually need to prioritize something else. And it's hard to know how much credence to give each of those voices.

laura audio:

I think. Oh, it's so, it is, it's so, it's so true and and I feel like I used to really struggle with this and I've got, what's helped me on the journey is actually when, interestingly, when I had my first, maybe it was my second, but it was the the biggest panic attack I've ever had in my life. And my body was, because when you have a panic attack, you'll have, have either of you, I hope you haven't had them. There's, it's not, it's not really, it's really not a nice experience. You're, you essentially think you're gonna die, so you are I couldn't, when I had, um, when did I have one? It was in s it would've been around a year ago, September last year. And first I had pin and needles through my whole body, and then I couldn't stand up and then I lay down and then I could not move any part of my body. And you feel for me, it felt like I was having a stroke and I, I couldn't open my eyes and I couldn't talk. I was slurring my, like every, your whole body almost feels like it's, it's shutting down. And I think for me. Experiencing that there was so much stuff emotionally that I was suppressing. So all of this stuff in my mind that I was suppressing and not dealing with, and then, so I, I that for me. But then the physical, then your body's literally like, no, you actually need to stop. Like you have to stop right now. And it's making you stop because it's literally shutting down and. I think for me what that taught me is if my body is, if I'm pushing, the physical is usually the second thing that presents for for us. Mm-hmm. So if I'm pushing through pain or my body telling me to stop. I'm actually like late to fixing this in my body anyway, because it's probably something I've been like suppressing mentally for a really long, whatever, however long time it is. And so that for me helped quite a bit in being able to, I don't know, just navigate it. And I think as well, it's then just the lessons of, I know when I have been injured, if I push myself, I get more injured. And when I'm sick, you can't, when you try and run sick you feel. Shocking. You feel exhausted. It's not actually gonna help you like rest isn't. I think it's also understanding the impact, the importance of rest. And even in my marathon training block, the times when I was corp have niggles and I had to stop. It didn't stop me from progressing. And that consistency element, right? Because we think, oh, if I don't do this one run like it's all over and I'm not gonna, I'm not showing up for myself. But I think it's just redefining for what's helped me with listening to my body and learning to is like redefining. What does showing up for myself mean? And sometimes a run actually is gonna make me feel shiter.'cause if you are like, feeling anxious or overwhelmed or whatever, sometimes a run will help you clear your mind. Yeah. But sometimes you'll finish a run and be like, well I shouldn't, I shouldn't have done that, done that. So going out and I, I find too, I'll go out and I might, sometimes you actually, I find, I don't know the difference between, yeah. But I'll go out and I might do 500 meters and I'm like, oh, this feels shocking. So I just stop and then I'll go for a walk. Yeah. Yeah. But it is, it's, it is a journey.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. That's how I really, I really like that though, being able to almost rewind or like strip it back a little bit and be like, wait, I've missed something here. Like what is actually going on? Or like, what's the issue? Yeah. I also love that framing of what does showing up for my body well actually mean?'cause it's easy to be quite, Blunt with that and being like, always exercise is good, but actually sometimes that's not what your body needs and it needs rest, or it needs whatever other thing you can give it.

laura audio:

or a lighter type of exercise.'cause running is quite an intense, high impact exercise, right? Yeah. And it also, I think what happens when you, we continue to push through that si where our body's telling us that we shouldn't be running. You also like lose the joy in running because it becomes. Painful and uncomfortable. Yeah, definitely. And when you continue to push yourself in that way, it doesn't bring you you don't really get endorphins, you don't get the joy.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

at all. Yeah.

laura audio:

it, it kind of comes back to like, why do we run and what other things come out of, when you think about it, like unless you are training to be an Olympic athlete or qualify like professionally for something. You probably run for your mind, for your body, you know, for, to feel good. And if you're pushing through pain, then it's like, exactly. And so it's so important to step back, we just, So today actually our kick run challenge is launching, and this whole challenge is about, it was really special. We spoke to a lot of our community members about why they run and what running means. To them that has nothing to do with pace or metrics or distance, and it was so special. Like for a lot of them it was joy or building strength in their mindset or their form of meditation or for the jaffles and coffee afterwards. Yeah, like there's so many reasons to run that aren't to do with. You know, make punishing ourselves or discipline or whatever working towards performance. Exactly. And um, I think it's been, yeah, it's been really special, like in building the campaign out just to re as a reminder.'cause I think it's something we all need. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

that would actually be really fun to like talk to different individuals and get an insight into what they think. Just to be like, oh yeah. I get that. Yeah. alright, lesson number four,

laura audio:

four. So it kind of ties in a little bit into what we were just talking about, but movement and running shouldn't be a punishment. Yeah. And so that comes back to. I think it ties in so much to listening to your body, but if it feels like a punishment, then it's not the time in our life that we should be doing. And, and we touched on this this last time, but for me, and so I won't, I won't go into it'cause maybe people could have already listened or they could go back and and listen. Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

in the show notes. Yes.

laura audio:

I always don't like repeating things. I'm like, like, Laura, you already said this. but my relationship with running changed a lot. from, I had a really good one growing up and then it went. To shit. And then it got better and it became, and it was actually really interesting, especially with marathon training. With marathon training, you need to fuel, otherwise you can't, you'll get in like you literally, if you don't need fuel properly, you get in, you're exhausted, but you also get injured. And I don't think we talk about that enough, that actually fuel helps us. Yeah. Prevent injury, which is, I was like, what? I didn't know that. But what I thought was amazing with my marathon training. It was such an amazing moment for me because when you are training, like I was fueling before, fueling during, and then straight afterwards, and so my goal at the end of the run is to be have zero deprivation. Like I have refueled, every single replenished, replenished, everything that's, that's been taken from me during the run. And that for me was such a proud moment because I think if I think back to why I was running when I was 19 and kind of in the depths of my disordered eating, it was to deprive my body. And so when I finished my run, I'd have nothing left. And that was

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

the, yeah. Yeah.

laura audio:

And it was very empowering to be like, wow, I've taken like it's, that was 10 years in between, but I fully rebuilt that relationship

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

And now

laura audio:

fully like, how can I make sure I'm giving my body the

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

best chance? It ha it can Yeah. To like, feel great in this run and not get injured. Yeah. Which is great. I feel like, the running, is not a punishment thing as well. It's, it's a slippery slope because you can kind of fall into it and be enjoying it more and more and enjoying the feeling of pushing yourself and you're on that progress and you're getting better and all of a sudden you can look around and be like, oh, this isn't serving What? I want it to be anymore. So it's not even like it's an intentional punishment for a lot of people. It just sort of evolves into that.

laura audio:

Yeah, exactly.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Should we do lesson number five? Yes,

laura audio:

Sure. Okay.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I love

laura audio:

my last, my last

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

last one.

laura audio:

My last lesson is, uh, and we kind of touched on this a little bit before, but strength training, warmups and cool downs

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

are essential.

laura audio:

And if you don't do them, you can't run long distances or it's very difficult to, I strength training for me, and we, I think we spoke about this when you guys came on the kick pott, it's, I think Phoe you said it's the gate to unlocking. Injury Free running. Yeah. Or something. You said it way better than that. That was very nice. But it's true. And I found that when I stop my strength,'cause it's hard when you are, if you are training for something like a long, a bigger, longer distance event, you obviously have to do quite a lot of running. And sometimes you'll be like, oh, I'll fit my runs in but I can't do my strength training this week'cause I'm too busy or whatever it might be. And the weeks that I skipped my strengths training for longer than sometimes if I skipped it like two weeks in a row, then I would get a niggle. It was like, it was just like, here you go. You have not been doing, because

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

You've been served.

laura audio:

it's not just about the run and it's about the cool down. It's about the fueling, it's about the resting and all those elements, and the running is one part of your training. And I think we sometimes think it's a hundred percent of it, but if you don't do all of the other things. Yes. You can't, like I've, the only reason, the only reason I built was able to put up to a marathon distance and not get injured like I did every other time is because I did strength training.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

yeah. I feel like people think of that as the whole picture, whereas the running's actually really

laura audio:

like 40, 50%. Yes. And all the other stuff counts

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

just as much, if not more. I feel like with the warm up and cool down as well, It's funny because I think people think about warm ups and cool downs in relations to sessions, and of course you need to warm up and cool down probably for sessions, but also just for your everyday run. it's only in the last, probably since I turned 30, well over the last few years that I've been like, oh, the first few Ks of an easy run. I should be warming up into it and going a bit slower and not expecting that. Just straight out the door, you can be pushing yourself because there's some statistic about injuries are most likely happening in that first cave of the run. And so if you can just like ease into it, then that's gonna be better for everyone. Even better to do some pre activation. Pre That's

laura audio:

Yeah. And also cool down. Cool down because how many times, like the amount of times I've been like, I've only got 30 minutes, I'm gonna run the whole time that I'm gonna get in my car and drive for 30 minutes like to do, to do that exercise. And then it's like, no, that's actually really bad for my body. Yes. So don't do that. Take time for the cool down. The biggest

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

ever is when I can finish a run 500 meters to my house and walk it in and it's such a joy. Like you finish a run, you kind of just enjoying it, but also you feel way better.'cause as you say, you're not just like sitting down straight away and like Stepping off, getting straight onto the next thing.

laura audio:

Yeah. And your hips, your hip flexes aren't cooked because when you don't, when you don't cool down, oh my God. Your hip, do your hips get and glutes and then, yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

so I, so many times I've done exactly the same, like run for the maximum amount of time as possible and then just like sat down for hours. Also, we sit down a

laura audio:

afterwards

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

and then you get up again and I'm like, am I a plank of wood? that's a, I feel like running's just more enjoyable when you're doing those things to like supplement it and make it feel good.

laura audio:

Yeah.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Thank you so much. Thank

laura audio:

Thank you. Thank you for having me. I love those lessons

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

and thank you for sharing and just being such a good role model for everyone as well, and for coming on the pod. We really appreciate it.

laura audio:

Thank you for having me back.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

No worries. All the best of the last what?

laura audio:

12

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yeah. Oh my gosh. So exciting.

laura audio:

you.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

Yay.

laura audio:

Nice. Thanks. I hope.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

alright, so moving on to, we've got two news items, so I guess the rundown is kind of broken into two. first we are going to briefly mention our highlights of the world Champs Athletics So far. Ready? that it's currently Friday, so there is still a big weekend ahead of There's a huge weekend. So yes, there's plenty more exciting to go, but what's been your highlight so far? So

anna audio (intro outro):

So my highlight was the

phoebe audio (intro outro):

you are so excited to talk about this.

anna audio (intro outro):

I just love talking about athletics. I feel like I should,

phoebe audio (intro outro):

get job as a

anna audio (intro outro):

She's a commentator.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yeah, No, literally no one would that would be, I would definitely listen into but I just feel like I'm so passionate about learning about Yeah. The and stories. Yes. It's bizarre. Why am I commentated. Anyway, so the women's marathon was on last weekend, it actually was the finish itself for gold. It was crazy.

anna audio (intro outro):

It was a sprint finish, and it was literally, it was like the last 80 meters. That it was decided in, which is absolutely bizarre. Like they were running into the stadium and it was still neck on. Neck. Yeah. For a marathon, like you've already run 42, you've literally already run 42

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yeah.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah. anyway. Absolutely wild. so I definitely recommend, actually, yeah, I recommend going to watch the last few minutes of the women's marathon and also the last few minutes of The women's finish of the marathon was super close. The men's finish was actually

phoebe audio (intro outro):

a photo finish.

anna audio (intro outro):

Which

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Is in. When does that ever happen?

anna audio (intro outro):

I know, but what I wanna talk about today is the person who came third in the women's marathon, which was Uruguay's, Julia Patine. So she came third in a time of 2 27, 23 so she's, she's 25. And in March she ran her. First ever marathon. and while she didn't hit the World Championship Standard in that marathon, she got into the race for the world champs via her world ranking.'cause there's like two, you can either get in, you can automatically qualify by getting a time, or you can get in through the world ranking. so the thing that's pretty interesting her was. So she's called a few places home. She's got three passports and a green card. She was born in Mexico. her whole family's from Uruguay, and then she grew up in England and now lives in America. She was so stoked to be on the start line. She hadn't even considered finishing so high when interviewed after the race, she said I was just trying to run my race.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

I didn't think about the medal. I just ran. Everyone else could do whatever they wanted. I didn't care. I was just gonna run my own. Own race. Wherever I finished, I finished. And I don't know if you saw, we might even put the visual in of her finishing. It was, she was so surprised. Like she, well, she didn't actually realize even know she'd finished. She was kind of like. thought she would.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah, she thought she had to keep going. So in, in the post-race interview, she said I had no clue what position I was in, and I just wanted to run smart without thinking about the place. when she did come into the stadium and cross the line, she was so confused because one, she thought she had another lap until an official actually told her she could stop running. And then two. Was also confused about where everyone else was, which I think is why she thought she had another lap. because she didn't realize how high up she'd finished. It was only actually when a cameraman revealed to her that she'd won bronze, that she knew.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Oh my gosh.'cause I, we were watching this footage at a cafe and we were like, She looked so shocked. Yeah. Yeah. She's like, what the hell do I like Go around again? Anyway, I just found a nice It's such a nice story. And it's also Uruguay's, first ever medal at a senior global athletics championship. So that is mind boggling that she only qualified not even through getting the time. And then she came third. the, yeah, I know. Well, it just goes to show the, the, conditions were so hard, it was so humid. People were so far, like off pace, even the, the winners themselves that were so far off their they were like 10 minutes but I genuinely think her. I mean, it's like a testament to running your own race.

anna audio (intro outro):

She literally just was only focusing on herself completely, like was never in the front pack originally and

phoebe audio (intro outro):

must have thought I'm overtaking some people, but I guess she just had no idea

anna audio (intro outro):

in, in the post, in one post race interview, she said she saw a big pack that had like split up in front of her and then she sort of. passed a few of those people at, in the latter stages of the race, and she thought, oh, like I'm in the, I might be in the top 10

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yeah, that is crazy. And then she came third. So

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah. Anyway, so that is my highlight so far. I love an underdog story. what is yours?

phoebe audio (intro outro):

So good. Oh, mine is, mine's a real basic bitch highlight, but it's Jess Hull coming third in the 1500. What a woman. What a woman. So, I mean, I did think, obviously it's just such an incredible achievement to come through, but I also thought the way that she ran it. Mm, Was I almost got emotional seeing it. Yeah. Because for context, faith kept y gone greatest. to ever do it for the 1500 she won and she's untouchable. Yeah. Everyone knows can't touch 1500 since 2021. Oh my God. God, you are gonna stats, you just pulled that out of nowhere. I feel like there's this mindset around faith where like. You just let her go. Yeah. She's untouchable. Yeah. And, And, and with a lot to go, she starts ramping it up, the field's getting thinned out. Everyone's letting her go. The only person who tries to go with her is Jess. Yeah. I'm like, she's so That is so cool that you did that. And then the, in the post run interview, which I wanna say my other highlight has been straight out its post-race interviews, which are unbelievable. Like a, they're so

anna audio (intro outro):

we'll link there. Actually we posted the Jess Wan and our story, but we'll link it in the show notes as well. It's really worth a watch.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

not only timely, they are. So his questions are so good and so considered. Anyway, I loved how she spoke about it in that interview that she's not just running for herself, but she's running for all the, like women at home who are like back in Australia, who, you know, we've got the Olympics coming up in Brisbane in 2032. All this to like. Show them what's possible for Aussie women. it's so cool that she's, that's her responsibility. Like that's her, her legacy is like, I'm gonna prove that. Like we can compete on a world stage. Yeah. And we can be so brave and we can achieve this. Like she's, yeah, she's incredible. She.

anna audio (intro outro):

is amazing. Yes. I love that. And I don't think, I mean, it might be a bit basic, but I reckon it's a clear highlight for anyone that is Australian.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Approved by highlight.

anna audio (intro outro):

yeah. I don't know why.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

So,

anna audio (intro outro):

okay, so a little update about our old friend enhanced

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yeah. We saw this pop up and we thought we should give, we should give the people the

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah, I just, I

phoebe audio (intro outro):

are invested in the journey.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah, I just feel like it's such an interesting, I mean, it's obviously the first of its kind. It's such an interesting concept. So I and there, when we did the episode on it, there had hadn't been like a whole heap of sort of people that are currently ranked super high and like really successful in whatever sport they do. so uS Sprinter, Fred Curley has become the first American man and the first track athlete to commit to the enhanced games. Curley, who is 30 years old, is a, he's a two time Olympic medalist in the hundred meters. He won silver in Tokyo in 2021, but he won bronze in Paris last year, so just over a year ago. Yeah. He's also, it's. Six time medalist at the track and field world champs. interestingly, he's not competing in Tokyo at the moment because he was provisionally suspended by the athletics integrity unit for whereabouts failures over the past year. So for anyone that doesn't know the elite, the athletes that are sort of on the. Roll call, I guess, of being tested. They have to, I don't actually know the frequency, but they have to sort of like say, okay, I know I'm going to. Be at Phoebe's house recording Thursday night kind of thing. So I, I'm gonna put into the, it's like an app and you put in where you're gonna be at what time, and it only has to be, it's like not all the time kind of thing, but it's like for like an hour or whatever. So he has failed to be where he said he was gonna be on and they get sort of, I think it might be, there's a few strikes. Yeah. And he, so. Failed. He's had an accumulation of those over the past year. So then was suspended from racing in Tokyo. so it's now interesting that he's decided

phoebe audio (intro outro):

wait. So did hands game. So he was suspended and then he's decided to compete?

anna audio (intro outro):

Yeah.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Interesting,

anna audio (intro outro):

interesting. Yeah. So it's sort of like, well, it's interesting.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

It's interesting, that's all. Yeah, because it's like obviously if you're doing that, it's incredibly suspicious because Yeah. And I feel like for anyone to be suspended over anything. There's a lot of,

anna audio (intro outro):

yeah, there's a lot of, yeah.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

I feel like Yeah. Where there's, where there's, yeah. Yeah. Sometimes where there's smoke that is fire up, but sometimes not. Yeah. I feel like in this situations because it's, I feel like it's so hard to suspend anyone, I mean it, I, it's funny, I reckon anyone who signs up to the internet games, even if they'd never had any sort of violation. I'll be suspicious. Suspicious about. Yeah. Yeah. But that's case that he was a bronze medalist last year. Last

anna audio (intro outro):

year in the 100, like the fastest, the third fastest man. Okay. At the Olympics. Yeah. So, um, another bit to add to his sort of profile. I guess he was actually charged in Florida, in May this year with punching a woman who. She was actually an Olympic hurdler. and that came just after a few months. He was arrested for allegedly punching a Miami Beach police officer in January. Um, an incident which the police then tasered him. So, interesting.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Background. background, I feel like that says,

anna audio (intro outro):

That's

phoebe audio (intro outro):

that says all you need to know about the people who are currently signing up to compete in the enhanced games.

anna audio (intro outro):

Yes. Well, they, this all allegedly, That is all we got time for today.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Yes, hope everyone enjoyed that chat with Laura and we can't wait to be back in your ears next

anna audio (intro outro):

Woo.

phoebe audio (intro outro):

Bye bye.

anna audio (intro outro):

Bye. Bye.

laura audio:

Yeah. Cheeky

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

listeners, we are so excited to She is many things. CEO. I always feel so weird doing this when you're

laura audio:

writing.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

I'm like, boy,

laura audio:

It's weird.

phoebe + anna audio (interview):

C.