Push Pull Health

Protein: What's On The Menu?

• Ben Davis • Season 1 • Episode 28

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What does your rotten health attitude struggle with most?

Chapters 

  • 00:00 Introducing Protein: The Essential Macronutrient
  • 06:21 Debunking Common Protein Myths
  • 10:34 Why People Avoid High-Protein Foods
  • 16:30 Don't You Dare Aldi & Lidi!t
  • 19:09 Protein Timing and Distribution for Optimal Benefits
  • 24:25 A Midget's Protein Requirements
  • 28:11 Protein and Ageing: Fighting Muscle Loss
  • 37:35 Losing Muscle as your Gentials Get Saggier
  • 43:22 CHATGPT's Wankiness
  • 45:30 Foods You Love
  • 54:04 Practical Protein Sources and Low-Cost Options
  • 01:11:07 Film Review: "The Menu" and Its Metaphors

Robot Ben Episode Summary 

Imagine walking the supermarket aisles, passing by countless high-protein options without a second glance. Why? Because somewhere along the way, protein became "that thing bodybuilders eat" instead of what it truly is: the essential macronutrient your body desperately needs.

This episode blows the lid off protein myths that have been holding you back from feeling your best. You'll discover why protein isn't just about bulking up—it's the cornerstone of hormone production, immune function, and that elusive feeling of fullness after meals. We tackle why most people barely hit their protein needs (hint: "carbs are fun, fat is luxury, protein is responsibility") and how this deficiency might be sabotaging your energy, recovery, and body composition goals.

From the startling truth about muscle loss that begins in your 30s to practical, budget-friendly protein sources that don't require cooking skills, we've created a roadmap for achieving protein success. You'll learn exactly how much protein you really need (spoiler: it's more than you're getting), how to distribute it throughout the day for maximum benefit, and why spacing matters more than you think.

The conversation takes fascinating turns, exploring ageing considerations, plant-based options, and how protein intake becomes increasingly crucial as we age. Perhaps most compelling is our discussion about appetite control—your "discipline problem" might be a protein problem all along.

Whether you're confused by conflicting nutrition advice or simply seeking sustainable ways to enhance your diet, this episode offers actionable insights without the usual gym-bro intensi

With a temper as short as her legs, Fiona joins Ben every week to forcefully 'Push Your Health From The Pulls Of Life.'

Expect Foul-mouthed narcissistic ramblings on fitness, nutrition, film, and life's daily rot.

This weekly audio & video expansion on the world-famous 'The Daily (ish) Rot' email and video ramblings also includes:

Usefully Useless Fitness and Diet Advice.
Half-arsed film reviews.
The exploitation of children.
True Crime recommendations.
Nutritious leprechaun-inspired recipes (short and to the point)
Narcissistic wisdom.

WHO THE FU*K ARE YOU?

Howdy,

I'm Ben, the only 'health' coach (not a life coach) who allows you to embrace your Rotten attitude towards exercise and nutrition!

Empowering You to give the middle finger to your yo-yo diet and half-arsed exercise routine in JUST 30 Days!

Are you sick of yo-yo-ing from one restrictive diet and hideous exercise plan to the next, begging for it to end so you can slip back into old habits, only to start the same rotten cycle again?

And again.

Your Complimentary Rotten Health Guide
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Ben:

oh man, push for health. This is push for health. Push for health. Yep, what do we do?

Fiona:

pushing our health, our health, from the pulse of life.

Ben:

Yeah, that's what we do.

Fiona:

That's what we do this podcast is a bit of a pull ben we'll be getting an intro sorted, so we don't have to do this yeah, third, third time, looking, this is the third time we're trying to record this episode.

Ben:

Won't tell you why, doesn't matter, doesn't matter feedback not recording.

Fiona:

Well, I just said, doesn't matter.

Ben:

Tension doesn't matter doesn't matter. So yeah, sorry about the feedback. If there is, it's coming from fiona's laptop and she thinks it's funny. I've got to press record on the box a couple of times. I think the camera's been okay camera is red light, yeah, red camera's been fine red light action, yeah that jazz lights other issues, other issues.

Ben:

So let's just get straight into it. Let's just get this one done. Unfortunately, it's just getting one done. It's, for most people, quite a boring subject, I imagine. So that's fine. Maybe all these technical difficulties was all part of the plan. Maybe Was all part of the menu.

Fiona:

Why are we doing this, Ben? Tell us why we're doing these podcast-y things.

Ben:

Oh yeah, that's right. Mnu, mnu. I am an MNU nutritionist, an evidence-based practitioner, but anyway, we've done that 15 times, so let's just get on with it. Let's just get this one done, get it through. Let's get through it, let's go.

Fiona:

I would, if you just get quiet.

Ben:

Minimal discussion points. Let's just rattle off the facts.

Fiona:

Whenever you're ready.

Ben:

This is the third and last time I've been sick as well, that's on cue.

Ben:

We'll get to that later. Oh and also sorry, I mentioned Dan Mackles. This will be the fourth time I've mentioned Dan Mackles. Okay, just before we start, this will be the fourth time I mention his name. Mr Dan Mackles, he is a bald Canadian man. I think he's what like 74 or something. The relevance of that is he's going to be doing an intro. He doesn't know it yet, but I'm going to get in touch and make him do an intro to the podcast so we don't ever have to do this.

Ben:

We can just get straight into the meat.

Fiona:

Meat's on the menu meat's ready to be served Ben so let's go that's, that wasn't bad for you.

Ben:

That was actually pretty good, yeah, nice shall I dish up? That's pushing your luck, isn't it? That's pushing your life. Just keep your mic away from that laptop. We just got to avoid that feedback all right, shall I serve oh, let's just get on with this. Okay, I actually don't want to speak that much, I'm just gonna, right, shall I serve? Let's just get on with this.

Fiona:

I actually don't want to speak that much. I'm just going to let you rattle this stuff off. So today we're talking about the macronutrient everyone pretends to care about, but nobody eats enough of. What is it, ben?

Ben:

Carbs, fats, I think people eat a lot of those already Not everyone Protein.

Fiona:

We're not talking about it because it's exciting. We're talking about it because it actually works. And no, licking the side of a Greek yogurt pot doesn't mean you're high protein now?

Ben:

Oh, that's right. We talked about this, didn't?

Fiona:

we already, or the peanut butter jar.

Ben:

Yeah, we talked about licking. I'm not a licker, I don't lick I liquor, I don't lick, I don't lick the lids. Yeah, don't know why, just not a bit of thing.

Fiona:

I get the spoon and do it that way.

Ben:

No, I don't. Yeah, I don't really. I just take the lid off and throw it in the bin. What a waste, eh that is a waste.

Fiona:

Definitely getting a spoonful out of that.

Ben:

Yeah, the problem is we've discussed this. This will be the fourth time we've discussed this, so I'm uh, comes natural now.

Fiona:

I don't want to talk about it anymore, okay oh well, hang on.

Ben:

Sorry, fiona, just before we move on. What is dan mackles? What was he? That word that you said he was charismatic, charismatic, okay, dan mackles is very, very charismatic no, he's got a charismatic voice he's got a very he's got a very charismatic voice is that the word? Oh, he loved this bless him, bless his heart. He hasn't got much of a life. He loved this. We used to talk about him all the time, didn't we? He loved this.

Fiona:

Can I get back to the menu Instead of Maccles?

Ben:

Yeah, okay, yeah, I was just thinking about the older.

Fiona:

So what the heck is protein? So it comes from the Greek word proteus, meaning primary or of first importance.

Ben:

That's relevant.

Fiona:

That makes sense. It's made up of amino acids 20, in total nine of which are essential.

Ben:

Oh God, it sounds so lovely.

Fiona:

It's needed for muscle maintenance, hormones, enzymes, your skin, hair, nails, immune function and satiety. Satiety, satiety, satiety. Yeah, which stops you from reading the fridge at 10pm. Maybe You're not just eating chicken to get lean, you're reading it to stop falling apart.

Ben:

Oh, that's right, if this is the first episode that you've watched of the MNU side series. I have introduced ChatGPT. It's all my notes, it's all my words. But chat gbt does get a little bit fruity and drop stuff like that. So there'll be certain things that would just be awful and some which are really good some that are better. Yeah, again based on my notes yes, and the slides from mnu don't worry.

Ben:

Well, and mnu, no, just you. Well, these are my notes, but these are based on the lectures from mnu because I am an evidence-based nutritionist. Yes, you are, yes okay.

Fiona:

So myths broccoli has more protein than steak. How, how is that even a myth? So per calorie maybe, but proportion absolutely not. Oh, he said absolutely not. 100 grams of protein gives you 2.8 grams of protein. 100 grams of broccoli gives you 2.8 grams of protein.

Fiona:

That sounds, yeah, sounds good 100 grams of steak gives you 20 to 30 grams, so you'd need to eat over one kilogram of broccoli to get even close. That sounds, yeah, that sounds good. 100 grams of steak gives you 20 to 30 grams, so you'd need to eat over one kilogram of broccoli to get even close to 20 to 35 grams. Protein damages your kidneys. Yes, it does, but only in people with pre-existing kidney diseases.

Ben:

Sorry, sorry, yes it.

Fiona:

So, yes, protein, yes, it does, but only, oh right, okay, yes, going off script there and so, yes, protein, yes, it does but only, oh right, okay, yes, yes, going off only people with pre-existing kidney disease. The rest of us are fine more than likely.

Ben:

Yeah, yeah, that's a bit of a myth, isn't it? The whole, the whole kidney thing? Yeah, yeah, I know you've got the, the protein farts, what, what can be quite nasty oh yes yeah okay maybe their kidneys aren't on up to the on up to the job, and that could potentially make the protein farts even worse good, good what that feedback is you can only concerning you can only absorb 30 grams at 30 grams of protein at a time.

Fiona:

False, you can absorb all of it. Your body just prioritises what it needs immediately and what gets broken down more slowly. You cannot store protein the way you store carbs or fat. So if you don't use it by building, repairing or maintaining tissue, you break it down and pass out the nitrogen, usually by urination. I'm trying not to swear.

Ben:

Oh right, god, you're really on one today, aren't you? I am, yeah, so we need to restart three times every week? Sorry, three times every week we need to what we need to restart the podcast episode three times every week? Yeah, because on the fourth one you're on fire oh yeah, because it's just second nature to me. Now you can say it without doing it, we didn't get this far. Oh, each time we had to restart, we'd only we hadn't even got past the intro, maybe the arguments released some tension, right.

Fiona:

That's why spacing protein across meals works better than shoving 100 grams into one. You need BCAAs. Have you heard of those? What are?

Ben:

they Branch chain chain amino acids.

Fiona:

Oh no, I didn't and no, you don't need them. If you're eating a balanced diet with complete proteins, you're getting them already Never heard of the old BCAAs. I think I have, but I don't know what they are.

Ben:

More gym bros, but if you get a few, years More what. More for gym bros.

Fiona:

Gym bros, gym bros, gym bros. People who like the gym bodybuilders, I get it. I've never heard of you to refer to somebody as a gym well, I wouldn't, it's just, it's a term, isn't it?

Ben:

gym bros you can say I'm a gym bro, okay, but bc double a's, they were a thing, not not as much now, I don't think they're a thing as much now. I mean, people still pedal them, but they're, but they're not, they're not necessary.

Ben:

Because if you're having a balanced diet, you're already getting them If you're getting, but maybe, maybe if people aren't, if people aren't consuming enough protein, maybe for people who are training, fasted in the morning, potentially, again, if your diet isn't the best, it's the whole supplementation thing, isn't it? Let's work on your diet, let's improve that before you start supplementing, before you start supplementing a shit diet, before you start supplementing a poop diet, a pooey diet. No swearing. It'd be interesting to get this out to the kids, because this is informative, it is, this is educational, it is Highly so. This must go out to the children.

Fiona:

Yes, you ready for the next? Course, love kids, love them.

Ben:

You ready for the next? Why is that funny?

Fiona:

I just think I'm on. I don't know. So why protein is people's least favourite macro?

Ben:

anything sound. The myths that was ones that you'd all heard before.

Fiona:

I'm trying not to drop my laptop, apart from the BCAAs.

Ben:

That all made sense. Yes, people had heard those myths before yes, I've heard about spacing it out and about damaging your kidneys.

Fiona:

And I never heard of broccoli, which has more protein than steak no, it was, it's the, it's the quantity isn't it?

Ben:

I suppose it's the sort of thing that people might say based on if you're not a meat eater or you can get all your protein from vegetables you can be plant-based. You can be plant-based and get all your protein in. Yes, yes, you can. But imagine sitting there eating a kg just to make you aware let's not be silly about it For the most part, if you are plant-based, if you are a vegan, it's going to be a bit harder.

Fiona:

Is it possible to eat a kg of broccoli in one go? Surely not. Maybe, when was I?

Ben:

If you really like broccoli, you might have to douse it in butter and other stuff.

Fiona:

Exactly.

Ben:

And then put a crap load of salt on it and pepper, and then you have a high sodium intake which might be fine and high fat intake because of the butter if you're putting, if you're putting butter on it, yeah, if you're plant-based, you can't have butter that's correct, yeah so why?

Fiona:

protein is people's least favorite macro? Well, let's be honest, it's not very crave wordy at it, is it? It's like, let's be honest, it's not very crave-worthy is it?

Ben:

It's like you're saying that, naturally, it's just the note.

Fiona:

But it's not.

Ben:

No, I guess no. Okay, no, it's not no a lot of people don't.

Fiona:

Oh, I fancy a chicken fillet.

Ben:

Yeah, a lot of people don't naturally just reach for high-protein food. No, you're right.

Fiona:

Oh, I'll have a boiled egg me Great snack.

Ben:

It's a pretty good snack. It is a good snack, yeah, stinks, though.

Fiona:

Yeah, it feels it doesn't. It feels like diet food. It does Sad. Chicken salads plus egg whites is boredom. Yeah. No, this is a cracker. I really like this.

Ben:

This was unfortunately chat GBT, based again on my notes.

Fiona:

Carbs are fun, fat is luxury, protein is responsibility. No wonder no one wants it Very good chat GBT Excellent. Protein is easy to come by Still doesn't mean people automatically reach for it. That's what the bodybuilders eat. Oh, that's what the bodybuilders eat.

Ben:

That was yeah, oh, that's what the bodybuilders eat. If you mention to someone oh protein, what's your protein? Like you get your protein in Protein farts.

Fiona:

That's what the gym bros. What did you call them Gym bros? Yeah, that's what the gym bros eat.

Ben:

I thought if you go into the shop, I'm used to it, this is my life you don't go into a shop if I go into a shop, I will head straight for the high protein stuff you do the yogurts, you go along the dairy and the cheese and all the yogurts high protein, straight in the basket.

Fiona:

When you go to Aldi, it's literally you cut across the flowers and up that aisle straight straight in the basket yeah so it's very easy for me just to scratch my hand and think well, what's, what are people doing?

Ben:

it's all there, high protein. But if you're not looking for it, if you associate protein with bodybuilders and people that train and go to the gym, and I've got big muscles, you're just not going anywhere near it. You're ignoring it, like I ignore a lot of the other foods that people buy yes, you do right.

Ben:

So you always have to remember that, just because it says high protein on it, if you associate that with people who train and people who lift weights and have got big muscles or it's just not part of your diet, you're not just going to all of a sudden go oh, do you know what? Yeah, I will try some of these high protein yogurts. Oh, there's a high protein strawberry one there. No, I'll just get the regular strawberry yoghurt. See that I'm just picking up the yoghurt.

Fiona:

Very good, very good. You see what I mean, fiona. I do see what you mean, so say before.

Ben:

Maybe you met me before you started. To well, you don't train anymore, but you wouldn't have cared about protein.

Fiona:

I do like the protein milkshakes, the protein shakes.

Ben:

Okay that you get in the shops, but maybe if you weren't part of Pushball Health, you might go into the shop and not care that much about protein If there's a chocolate milkshake there which is just a regular chocolate milkshake and then a high protein version.

Fiona:

No, I would have got the high protein version, because it just says high protein and it sounds healthier, or no?

Ben:

I would have got the high protein version because it just says high protein and it sounds healthier or it sounds better for you, and also because it might be lowering calories. So if you are maybe being conscious, it'll be sugar as well.

Fiona:

I don't like very sweet things. I find the other chocolatey drinks. That's why I only like the Aldi one, Even the little one. I find that too sugary. Right, okay, Even though there's barely any sugar in it. But even for you.

Ben:

You're not necessarily eating high protein foods because you're trying to get your protein in.

Fiona:

You might be eating them because of the calorie content If you're trying to be conscious of your calories and what you're shoving your gob Because it does keep me fuller for longer. Okay, right, since I've transitioned over from having milk in my Weetabix to having the high protein. That does me all day right, okay, that's.

Ben:

Yeah, yeah, satiety, yeah that's the word society, but you see, you see, can you summarise what I'm trying to get at?

Fiona:

no okay, so did you not take on anything that I said I did, but you put me on the spot and I don't do things like that right people, the average person, go shopping.

Ben:

They're not looking for high protein stuff, and if they see high protein, they may associate that with bodybuilders, people who work out. Oh, I'm not one of those. Oh, I know, I should probably exercise a bit more. Oh, I know, I should be a bit more conscious of all the things I shove in my but. Protein I don't know what that is. That hurts your kidneys. Bc, double a's, that, what that? No, I'll just get the regular yogurt. There's a lot of high protein options yes which are quite cost effective.

Fiona:

But then that's what I was just about to say right, yes, but then also.

Ben:

But then also there's a lot of other products that are slapped with high protein and they're not, and they are a scam. They're a rip-off. High protein wheatabix. High High protein bread no, high protein. Milk Milk's got a good amount of protein in it already. Because protein's become a big thing, it's hyped up a lot more than it used to be. Naturally, people are jumping on that and trying to. Well, people are hearing about protein and they think, oh God, yeah, protein's everywhere. I keep hearing about it on Instagram, on the, on the news. Oh, I should probably eat more protein. Yeah, high protein weetabix anyone? Oh right, okay, well, I always eat weetabix, but these are high protein. Great, I'll grab those. Double the price, but I guess that's, uh, that's protein, isn't it? And also, that means that people associate high protein foods as being really expensive. Which is also annoying.

Ben:

Oh well, I would eat more protein, I guess, because I have heard it's good for you and it keeps you fuller for longer and stuff like that, but it's just so bloody expensive, yeah. I can't afford organic chicken? No, we don't need to start there.

Fiona:

Yeah, but even the price of meat and everything is going up, very sneakily going up. Well, we'll get to this Fiona, we'll get to the low-cost protein options. But they're going to start going up as well, because other people are going to start using high-protein stuff yogurts, stuff like that to stop them buying meat, I think and then high-protein stuff is going to go through the roof. Well, it has look at your mousse sugar that used to be 99p yeah, well, there we go 39 now mercifully.

Ben:

It'll be a sad day. It'll be the sad. It's a sad day. It's sad day when the high protein ice cream in aldi and lidl just disappears. They bring it back for a bit. You think, oh my god. Oh my god, this is great, actually tastes not too bad.

Ben:

It actually tastes pretty good for me anyway personally, I'm sure if someone else ate it they'd go. This is dog shit, this is dog poo and would want to eat Ben and Jerry's. Fine. But it comes and goes and there's the. I'm assuming it's the same in Lidl, but Aldi have got the, the strawberry and the vanilla, the salted caramel they've got lots of flavours raspberry here's a nut now that's Lidl, the normal puddings, the puddings, or the, the original ones.

Fiona:

The puddings.

Ben:

Okay, so the puddings are what?

Fiona:

99p 109. Oh, they've gone up, or maybe 190.

Ben:

But the original ones, the original soft cheese versions with the raspberry, the strawberry, the vanilla.

Fiona:

So they're 75p but the pouches have gone up to 95p.

Ben:

I've noticed this week. They're more convenient, yeah, but it'd be a sad day. They're more grab and go. It'd be a sad day when those yoghurts go up they are going to go up.

Fiona:

75p is a pretty good deal because the pouches used to be cheaper than the actual pots. I don't think that's right yes, they used to be, because I used to buy the pouches but the pouches are more convenient yeah, I know, and then they increased them okay, I'm not Right.

Ben:

Oh no, this is useful, isn't it? People go to Aldi and Lidl. This is useful information. High protein stuff.

Fiona:

And just to let everyone know, Lidl as well is now doing the protein, high protein pizzas, which are nice.

Ben:

Are they high protein compared to a normal pizza?

Fiona:

Well, they're like half the size, which is perfect for me.

Ben:

Right.

Fiona:

But they're nice and they have the high protein. Meals and the microwave meals are quite handy now and again.

Ben:

They're only yes, I think the point is there is there is a lot of good options out there okay no, I was going to start going into a whole different thing, but there's a lot of good options out there and we'll get to protein and how you can still get more high protein foods into your diet which are low cost okay.

Fiona:

So protein timing and the distribution of protein. So most people would have approximately five grams of protein for breakfast, 10 grams for lunch and dinner approximately 60 grams. That's not ideal. Protein is best spread across the Muscle. Protein synthesis is a short-lived process. You can't just backload protein at dinner and expect it to cover the whole day. Hitting one big dose at dinner is like brushing your teeth once per week. That's a bit harsh, lewison. Who.

Fiona:

That word Lewiswison threshold, leucine, leucine threshold. You need around 20 to 40 grams of protein per meal to hit the leucine threshold leucine leucine threshold. That's the trigger for muscle protein.

Ben:

Sensitists do that multiple times per day I've included some foods there, because 20 to 40 grams of protein can look very different based on hitting the loosing threshold, based on the the food so you'd need chicken around two grams per 100 grams, tuna around 2.5 per 100 kg, 100 grams.

Fiona:

I can never say this one quinoa quinoa quinoa I can never say that quinoa around 0.48 grams per 100 grams right, dot, dot dot.

Ben:

So that's a lot isn't? It so you're gonna have to really shovel in the quinoa to get that to hit that leucine threshold? Yeah so what? So that's 0.4. That's gonna be whata thousand calories a bucket to get? To get that 2.5 grams of leucine, that's going to be what 1,000 calories of quinoa.

Fiona:

Christ. So one egg is 0.6 leucine, which is four eggs.

Ben:

I'm assuming that's based on a medium egg, maybe. Yeah, I don't know what's the average. What do people eat? Do they eat large eggs or medium eggs?

Fiona:

Not sure.

Ben:

I would say medium, just go for the large eggs, I think.

Fiona:

Are the large eggs, because we get them free range.

Ben:

Oh right, yeah, yeah, I've noticed. That's probably why I'm a little bit hungry.

Fiona:

Probably. Maybe you should start having five.

Ben:

Sorry, I keep looking down because there's a bloody cat in the room.

Fiona:

Yeah, he's staying out.

Ben:

He's half dead so just wary that he wakes up and starts causing mischief.

Fiona:

You would never do that so.

Ben:

Okay, no, hang on. Is that fine? Did that make sense?

Fiona:

Yes, it made sense.

Ben:

So the leucine threshold?

Fiona:

muscle protein yes, you need 20 to 40 grams Muscle protein synthesis Leucine threshold.

Ben:

Yes, and then we gave some food examples yes, right. Okay. Is it making sense, though, fiona? Yes, I'm conscious that you read all this off, which is useful for me because I can then just discuss the points, but well, would you like to explain it in layman's terms then?

Fiona:

but you need, you need dilution. Yeah, I get it okay. To trigger muscle protein synthesis yes, okay and you need 20 to 40 grams of it to do that yes, but this is a little bit heavy scienceyy, I suppose.

Ben:

Yes, but it's just, I don't know, just providing all the details you need to.

Fiona:

Without enough leucine the M4.

Ben:

Leucine.

Fiona:

Leucine, the MTR.

Ben:

Don't worry about that, Christ. No.

Fiona:

Which means there's no muscle building signal. You need the 20 to 40 grams of protein to do that.

Ben:

Based on the yes, and we've discussed the oh God, it's up. And we've discussed the different types of food. Yes. So, yeah, we'll get to whey protein in a minute, but probably get yourself some.

Fiona:

Oh, whey protein 25 grams is equal to 2.25 grams of leucine. We almost missed that out yeah. It's because I can never say whey either.

Ben:

Whey.

Fiona:

Whey protein.

Ben:

Whey protein, whey, get yourself some whey protein. Yeah, it's gone up in price, like everything else, but yeah, there you go 25 grand. So a scoop, a scoop of protein. We don't have protein. A scoop of whey protein and you've hit your loosey and fresh old, bloody hell.

Fiona:

That's not bad. That's a good goal one. That's not bad. How come we don't have any protein? Remember the protein. Snickers I used to make. Yeah, that was really good.

Ben:

How's the camera looking, fiona? The light is bleeding through the oh yeah, it's very bright Ben. Okay. Yeah, I'm concerned because the light is bleeding through the shades, very, very bright. So we have a light on. We have a light on. We have a light. I'm okay, I think. How do I look?

Fiona:

you're blended into the wall right you need to move over a little bit, I think. I think you're out of shot a little bit.

Ben:

I haven't moved the whole episode, so that's really concerning, isn't?

Fiona:

it. You have because you got up to turn the camera off.

Ben:

I know since we recorded and I said how's the camera looking? Looking, I have not moved an inch. Well, I don't know so you're now telling me that I'm not in shot I don't know.

Fiona:

But right, let's continue.

Ben:

So you're starting again okay, you do know, because you can, you can see.

Fiona:

You can see if I'm in shot or not I can't even see me, ben, because it's so bright okay, wow, they seem to be getting worse as opposed to getting better.

Ben:

That's the concerning part, isn't it? That's the concerning part.

Fiona:

How much do you actually need? Well, if you're sedentary, between 1.2 to 1.6 grams per kg. If you're more active, between 1.6 and 2.2 grams per kg.

Ben:

That sounds about right. Yeah, yeah, that sounds okay.

Fiona:

Yes, I know, I did a lot of research into this Okay yeah, you can also estimate based on your height. So aim for one gram of protein per centimetre of height, or around 0.7 grams per pound of body weight.

Ben:

Yeah, I say the height for you. That can be useful for some. For a lot of people that might be too much. So even if you are sure, I'd need 150 grams exactly of protein per day exactly so, even for you sorry 151 tiny, that's still a lot. Yeah, so that might still be quite a lot. The whole centimeter of height, one gram. So for you, what are you? 120? Centimeters one meter. One meter 20 no, I'm 153 centimeters or 152 sounds tall, bloody hell.

Fiona:

I'm 100 just 150 what? 1 okay. I'm 5 foot 1 right, so 5 foot 0 tiny, yeah, just ridiculous. I think I'm 153 centimeters.

Ben:

Actually, I think that's what egoids do, but that's still a lot, isn't it?

Fiona:

yeah, I ain't getting 153 grams of protein in right lot isn't it?

Ben:

yeah, I ain't getting 153 grams of protein, right, okay, and you're someone who consciously looks for protein and and consumes protein. So you can imagine for the, for the average person who isn't and is just starting this, just starting their protein journey, that's a lot. So I would suggest use that, maybe to keep it simple and just half it, start there oh okay, so I probably would hit my protein.

Fiona:

Would I, would I be hitting 75 grams of protein?

Ben:

You tell me I don't know.

Fiona:

Well, I'll have 20 grams with my breakfast.

Ben:

Okay, I don't think anyone cares about what you're eating. To be honest, it's not about you.

Fiona:

Okay, sorry, sorry, it's about MNU.

Ben:

We can't see you anyway, yeah so you just said that so so start there.

Ben:

So take that target and half it for all targets. You may as well just start low and work your way up. Yes, but the thing is with protein. I think we're going to get to this on a later section. You're better off just finding ways to get more protein in. Get into the habit of eating more protein wherever possible, even if you aren't exercising, even if you don't care about your diet. You couldn't give a crap, you couldn't give a poop about protein, because when we get to the recommendations for the elderly, it would serve you quite well to get into the habit of trying to consume more protein, because the older you get, the harder it is.

Fiona:

Yes.

Ben:

Like everything in life.

Fiona:

Oh, I've gone too far.

Ben:

Oh, I can hear the feedback oh my God, it's killing me.

Fiona:

If you've got a lot to use, use.

Ben:

It's weird, isn't it? It is weird because I, you know, I think I talk okay, I'm quite clear when I speak to people, but when, when we're in this setting, maybe it's the stress, it's the cameras on the lighting, everything else I just jumble my words if you've got a lot to lose, use your target weight in pounds as your goal in grams.

Fiona:

The rda of 0.8 grams per kilogram is the minimum to not fall apart.

Ben:

It's not to thrive so yeah, the rda, yeah the recommended daily allowance yeah, that's what I thought yeah, it is, it's. It's not a lot.

Fiona:

Okay.

Ben:

Again, start there.

Fiona:

Fancy words Start there.

Ben:

If you can hit that for a couple of weeks, great.

Fiona:

Excellent, well done.

Ben:

Some people might have a high protein diet without even thinking about it, but I fear the quality of protein might not be high. If you're accidentally getting in a decent amount of protein, the quality of that protein might be dubious.

Fiona:

Okay.

Ben:

Yeah, let's move on.

Fiona:

Glucogenesis and the Gluconeogenesis. Gluconeogenesis, and I can never say this word ammonia maybe yeah, sounds okay so protein can be converted to glucose via gluconeogenesis, but it's not the default. Unless carbs are low or energy demand is high, it doesn't mean protein is wasted.

Ben:

Your body prioritizes needs based on context yeah, I should have had this further up, because we mentioned this, didn't we?

Ben:

yeah, yeah yeah so it can do? Yeah, you can. Your body does have the ability to process protein and to convert it to glucose for fuel, for energy. But yeah, it doesn't like doing it why not? Because it gets it from other sources well, because you you hopefully will be eating enough carbs or fats, right, and that'll be your main source of energy oh, okay, so it's only doing it and I like, if it really needs to, yes if it's got nothing else to pull from, then yeah.

Fiona:

Hmm, interesting Body's a fascination. So the ammonia smell after training so it's often linked to protein breakdown or urea production can indicate insufficient carb intake or overtraining, while relying heavily on protein for fuel. If you smell like a bottle of Domestos after hill sprints, it might be time to look at what you're eating.

Ben:

It's grim, isn't it? I'm sure that would be me. Over the years, I've gone through stages of just not eating any carbs not eating a lot of fat and just eating protein.

Fiona:

Jeez, I think the the mess still stored us.

Ben:

So the old gluconeogenesis that had been kicking in. Definitely, and, yeah, maybe that I imagine it'd be quite a sweet smell for some reason.

Fiona:

Yeah, I don't know why. Yeah, I think it is. Yeah.

Ben:

Not a bottle of bleach.

Speaker 3:

So I imagine points in my lifting career with all the gym bros.

Ben:

I reeked. I'm sure they reek as well. Well, I don't know, maybe if you're, if you're a full-on gym bro, you're, you're okay with eating carbs. I think you're okay because carbs fuel. Carbs fuel the muscles, help you lift more. So I imagine the the average gym bro is not, is not doing this, it's not approaching this. It doesn't stink. Well, I'm sure they might stink still, but they're not having to worry about this. I think it's for people who are getting into lifting weights and because of all the mixed messages over the years Carbs are the devil, fat to make you fat, oh, but this protein thing, yeah, apart from that, it can kill your kidneys, it will destroy your kidneys and all this. I've heard. It's heard it's good for muscle and it's. I've heard it's what people do who lift weights they eat protein. So I'm going to cut everything else out and just eat protein, right, yeah, yeah, I like how you're thinking, but you probably need something else to go with the protein otherwise you'll smell yeah, and just feel a bit crap.

Ben:

I imagine that's a swear word what's a swear word?

Fiona:

I didn't say a swear word. I did crap for the children. It is, isn't it, fiona?

Ben:

it's a polite swear word if your child is For the children, it is, isn't it, fiona?

Fiona:

It's a polite swear word.

Ben:

If your child is saying the C word, are you happy with that?

Fiona:

What crap. Or the other C word no.

Ben:

The word. I just said yeah, yeah.

Fiona:

No, I'm not offended by that. Oh, okay, could be saying the other C word.

Ben:

Right. So Protein and fat loss and dieting protein, so it's role and how it helps when you're trying to lose fat it's not written there, though, is it?

Fiona:

or you're on a diet so it's muscle sparing it is it's got a higher thermic effect we've talked about this. Yeah, we have it fills you up, such as my Weetabix, and helps you stick to the plan, such as your Weetabix such as your Weetabix. Such as my Weetabix with my protein.

Ben:

Oh, okay, yes.

Fiona:

Context. Yeah. Without protein weight loss? Huh, without protein weight loss equals fat. What?

Ben:

I think it means. I'm assuming it means when you lose weight, you might lose some fat, but if you're not consuming enough protein or resistance training, you may lose some muscle.

Fiona:

Oh, that hasn't been said like that it's chachapitay. Okay, so protein helps preserve lean tissue and increase satiety.

Ben:

Wow wow, satiety, it gets worse every time.

Fiona:

Oh, you say it really fast, it's fine, it's fine Satiety. Yeah, that's good While eating, making it easier to stick to Cut calories without open protein. Congrats.

Ben:

You're just eating yourself.

Fiona:

Ha ha. Glp-1s, which is Ozempic.

Ben:

Oh, this is just a brief mention. I've been reading a lot about GLP-1s. We've done an episode actually, haven't we Remember Fiona? We should quickly let's talk about that. Do you remember that episode? I think it was okay. Yes, osempic Wigovi Monjaro.

Fiona:

Yes. Yeah.

Ben:

I remember doing that. The film we did was Shallow.

Fiona:

How? Oh yes, Now I remember which is an absolute abomination. Yeah, that's a good film. It's got some funny things in it.

Ben:

It's terrible, it's bad.

Fiona:

Well, yeah, In this day and age you wouldn't get away with it Gwyneth Patrow, gwyneth Petroleum. Gwyneth, petral, petral. I thought it was Petroleum. Oh, she could be called anything Gwyneth.

Ben:

Petroleum, yeah. Bad film, yeah Jack.

Fiona:

Black is what wire, weaver or something sagoni weaver.

Ben:

That's the one. Jack black is terrible. This might get me famous. The most liked post I've ever done is the one about keanu reeves what about?

Fiona:

that he sucks oh, and people didn't people got very cross on tiktok oh so yeah, jack black awful. I liked him, always been awful I liked him in um yeah, he's lovely in that. I find him very irritating in School of Rock.

Ben:

Oh, people really like that film.

Fiona:

I find him quite irritating. He's very shouty and I don't like people who are shouty.

Ben:

Right, good, this is good this is going to get snipped. Yeah, school of Rock, I like.

Fiona:

School of Rock, but I just didn't like him in it.

Ben:

Okay, yeah, lots of energy in that, isn't it Lots of energy?

Fiona:

There's another film that he's in and he's when is it?

Ben:

Most films, most films that Jack Black is in.

Fiona:

I can't remember them at all.

Ben:

I struggle with Because Jack Black is not very good.

Fiona:

He's a bit whiny in Shallow. How isn't he A bit of a?

Ben:

douche. He's probably a bit more bearable in Shallow Howe, actually, really oh, his voice, I don't know. I don't think he'd hit his stride at this point.

Fiona:

I think he was still finding himself oh, okay he still hadn't reached peak annoyance maybe it was just that film, though, because his bald friend with the tail, he was very irritated oh anyway, oh god, anyways.

Ben:

okay, going down a rabbit hole here, right, but the whole point. Go listen to that episode. I think it's fine, it's okay.

Fiona:

So Ozempic, which is a drug, isn't making you lose muscle. The lack of training and protein is. You would lose muscle on any low-calorie diet if you train like a ghost and eat like a child. I'm a ghost.

Ben:

Don't need to be concerned by that Fiona that you, the camera can't see you you want to keep your strength on GPL1s or whatever?

Fiona:

live properly, eat enough protein, that's it whatever. Glp1s. Glp Zempic, monjaro Wagovi, I don't want to just say that it's a Zempic, because you know no, no, I know, so say GLP-1s. Glp-1s weight loss drugs. That sums them up. I get the numbers, the letters so yes, that's a. Thing that is a thing.

Ben:

we'll maybe do a future episode again on, and because the research is being updated and GLP-1s are very popular, very popular, so yeah, does that make sense? Yes, the so yeah, does that make sense? Yes, the drug itself isn't making you lose muscle mass. Yes, it's everything else, so it's helping you lose weight.

Fiona:

You're not eating.

Ben:

Yes. And training. You're not eating enough protein? Yes, but that can be hard because, as we've discussed, satiety keeps you fuller for longer. So, if you have no appetite, eating a high-pr, high protein diet is good, but at the same time, not so good because it might be limiting the amount of calories you can consume. And if you're not resistance training, not lifting weights, no muscle mass, and the muscle mass that you do have, you're losing it. So it's not the drug that's making you lose muscle. Every low-calorie diet will probably do a similar thing, other than the reduced appetite.

Fiona:

It's because it's the thing to do, then, isn't it? If you want to lose weight, you just do the injection. Is it like a psychological thing?

Ben:

Sorry, is it like a psychological?

Fiona:

thing, sorry, is it like a psychological? Why don't people just go on diets then?

Ben:

Well, because they're a lot harder, aren't they? And the appetite, the food, noise that remains. The more weight you lose. The hungrier you get GLP-1, not the gout.

Fiona:

Yeah.

Ben:

GLP-1s.

Fiona:

Yes, not just one.

Ben:

Protein and ageing the guys. Yeah, glp ones, yes, not just one. Protein and aging. Sarcopenia starts in your 30s. Who, jesus christ? Sarcopenia?

Fiona:

yeah, then I read it as it is okay accelerates after 40 years of age, I'm assuming. That means everyone loses three to five percent of muscle per decade past 30, really yeah, it's.

Ben:

Yeah, that's why you gotta lift those weights, you gotta eat that protein. You can slow this down. Yeah, power explosiveness, it all goes. It all goes. I think after 30 yes, you need to start being more conscious of it. I think it's after 40. The older you get, naturally, the older you get. And if you're not doing anything about it, if you're not training, if you're not lifting weights, resistance training, high protein, like most things, like we've already touched upon, the older you get, the harder it gets.

Fiona:

Anabolic resistance is harder to stimulate MPS.

Ben:

Muscle protein synthesis yes, okay.

Fiona:

Mus is harder to stimulate MPS Muscle protein synthesis. Yes, okay, muscles become less responsive to protein and training the older you get. This isn't due to increased muscle breakdown, but reduced ability to stimulate MPS.

Ben:

That's an important line. Does that make sense? Does that make sense, that line? Because that is important.

Fiona:

This isn't due to muscle, this isn't due to increased muscle breakdown, but the ability to increased muscle breakdown, but the ability to stimulate muscle protein synthesis. Okay, and they're like Okay. Yes, yeah. So if you're not stimulation, so it's because of the inability to stimulate the MPS.

Ben:

Yes, so the older you get, the more protein stimulus you need to get the same effect.

Fiona:

Yes, that makes sense.

Ben:

Okay.

Fiona:

Great. Oh, oh, you just said that, yes, I did.

Ben:

Yeah, and then finishing off, lucy and fresh old matt is more with age. You need a bigger hit to get the same result.

Fiona:

Yes, yeah, so you need to increase. So, would you say, as you get older, you need to increase your protein intake yes, ideally.

Ben:

Yeah goes back to what I said about get into the habit of eating more protein yeah don't poop the bed about the number as such. Just try and get into the habit of introducing a bit more like a yoghurt we'll get to whey protein. I think whey protein or wee protein could be the answer for a lot of people.

Fiona:

It's more expensive now, which is a shame, but yeah, remember when we losing fresh, old you spy on discount per scoop how much it costs, it's still.

Ben:

It's still a good option vegan veggie blind spots I'm a bit slouched I don't I feel like I'm not taking this episode very seriously vegan veggie blind spots.

Fiona:

Would you care to explain what you mean before I start rattling all this off?

Ben:

We've talked about the amino acids. Yes, yes, 20 in total.

Fiona:

Nine that are essential. Yes, ah, okay, yes, so that links in. Okay, fine.

Ben:

So it's yes, a lot of plant-based protein is incomplete of those amino acids, essential amino acids, exactly so.

Fiona:

You need variety and volume, lucian.

Ben:

We've said that word enough. Now, we've said it enough.

Fiona:

Yeah, but it's because I'm reading it.

Ben:

Shall I read more Lucian content.

Fiona:

You need to read the word.

Ben:

Would that be helpful? Should I talk into the microphone? Come here oh sorry there you are. Yeah, hi hi god. That's the first time I've heard your website. Didn't realise you were there.

Fiona:

Lucian content can't be seen on the camera can't hear you on the microphone. Lucian. Lucian, it's Lucene, it's Lucene, lucene yeah, but why is the U and the C there together? Maybe?

Ben:

we need to look at the show. We need to look at the structure of the show. I need to maybe read a bit more. Give you a break.

Fiona:

Yeah, because I'm getting fatigued now.

Ben:

It's just something to do.

Fiona:

I know Leucine content usually lower. Yeah, okay.

Ben:

Okay, so the leucine content in vegan plant-based foods is usually lower. So you to hit the thresholds, to hit the amino acids.

Fiona:

Corn protein has higher leucine but lacks other essentials so cannot be relied on alone. So if your plant-based excellent, just don't assume half a hummus wrap is doing the job.

Ben:

Charge your B2. Right, yeah, you just have to be more conscious, like supplementing, yes, vitamin B12, calcium, iron. There might be certain supplements, there might be certain micronutrients that you're missing, that you could be deficient in. We've discussed this before, haven't we? Yes if you are on a vegan diet or you are mostly plant based just something to be aware of. If you are on a vegan diet or you are mostly plant-based Just something to be aware of. I think we are rattling through this, but God, there's still a lot, isn't there?

Fiona:

Holy moly, what's that word again?

Ben:

Appetite Satiety.

Fiona:

Appetite and adherence. Why are you moving?

Ben:

the mic. The camera's still on. It's like you've. I'll just turn the mic off quickly. Just turn the camera off, ben, can you? What was, what were you doing? It's all on camera, I just don't want.

Fiona:

Yeah, but you can't see me, so it's fine, I'm a ghost.

Ben:

That's making me upset Ghost of Girlfriend's Past or that's the main thing. Oh bless you, let's move on. That's that we have lots and lots to get through.

Fiona:

So appetite and adherence. Protein has the highest satiety.

Ben:

Yeah, yeah, we've done that. It's yeah. Keeps you full for longer. Keeps you fuller for longer.

Fiona:

Oh, it impacts the GLPs ones. Glp-1, yeah, which is the ozempic and all that jazz.

Ben:

Well, the GLP-1 is a hormone in the body.

Fiona:

Yes, I know that. Okay, so protein has the highest satiety macronutrient yeah, it gives you fuller for longer. People don't stick to diets because they're hungry, not broken.

Ben:

God, chat, gpt, jesus. Where's that come from? The dodgy there? It's a bit of a buzzword. I think that as well. That's probably what it does. It's taken. It scans the internet, doesn't it? It just scans the whole internet, and I do see that a lot.

Ben:

You're not broken, you're just doing this wrong and I can help you. It just sounds good, doesn't it? Because it's like oh, I'm broken, I'm a failure, I'm never going to do it. You're not broken, you just need to eat more protein, and I'll show you how, for the low price of £99 a week.

Fiona:

That's good Bargain. Ultra processed foods often combine low protein, high calorie, plus high palatability.

Ben:

Oof, yeah, okay.

Fiona:

Which is the worst combo for hunger and control.

Ben:

Oh, it can be. Yeah, oh, it definitely can be.

Fiona:

High protein. Swaps aren't always sexy or exciting, but they can work. So if you swap Chris for boiled eggs and a baby bell, what?

Ben:

Again again my notes. But he's butchered those. He's really butchered those I would have had in my notes about boiled eggs. Or I've got numerous guides about low.

Fiona:

I might have a boiled egg today.

Ben:

Low calorie swaps or high protein swaps. So he's taken that and gone. Oh well, you know, ditch your crisps. It's a boiled egg, come on.

Fiona:

And your baby bell. Don't forget the baby bell, baby bell's fine, yeah, good, yeah, you can.

Ben:

Yeah, but I don't know, Are they quite expensive? Baby bells. Baby bells are really expensive, yeah, and then they've got some protein in. You have to still knock them back to get a good amount of protein. Just get a boiled egg for them.

Fiona:

And then you're hitting your leucine thing, leucine, leucine, threshold. Yeah, there you go. Add protein powder to a yogurt.

Ben:

Whey protein, whey protein, it's there again.

Fiona:

Leftover chicken Eat that it's better than toast. Oh, this is.

Ben:

You've got some chicken in the fridge. This is poor.

Fiona:

It doesn't have to be exciting, it just has to have protein.

Ben:

Yeah, okay.

Ben:

Stick to the basics you know I think we've talked about this before, but fall in love with boredom. Fall in love with boredom, the whole. I only want to eat the foods that I love. Okay, yeah, you can still eat them, but if your goal is to get more protein in, if your goal is to lose some body fat, to start lifting some weights, to find a form of excising stomach and a diet you can stick to for longer than 10 minutes, you might have to find alternatives to the foods that you love or try and find a higher protein option.

Fiona:

But we don't like change.

Ben:

Because it probably exists. It probably exists already. Or you can take some of the foods that you love and put some protein with it, and then maybe that might mean that you reduce the amount of the foods that you love. Because you're fuller for longer, so you can still eat the foods that you love. You still eat them, but just not as much. What's?

Ben:

with the love, so that might be an easier way, without worrying about tracking or counting all the calories or counting points and zens or juicing or whatever. It's just trying to find easy ways to start being more conscious of all the things that you shove in your gob, based on your goals. If it's your goal to that, if it's not, I don't care. Good for you.

Fiona:

Excellent, stop watching this okay, your discipline problem is a protein problem. Protein tells your brain you have eaten ultra processed food just keeps the appetite engine running okay, okay, yeah, does that make sense? Yeah, it's all right, isn't it? Yeah, it's all right.

Ben:

Your discipline problem is a protein problem. It's okay, yeah.

Fiona:

Could do better, but yeah.

Ben:

If you're hungry all the time trying to lose weight, it's not the discipline, it's the. You might be relying on motivation and willpower, but your protein might be quite low, I'm peccish you might not be eating a lot of protein why protein way? Protein. What's it called? What's actually called?

Speaker 4:

where why way protein, way protein complete, easy and it's fast digesting.

Fiona:

God, I sound like I'm in an advertisement that's more like it.

Ben:

that's a bit of energy. It's nice, refreshing.

Fiona:

It's not a steroid, it's not unnatural. It's made from filtered milk, which is the same source of cheese.

Ben:

That's all it is. That's all it is. Is it a supplement? It's food.

Fiona:

It's food. It contains casein, which is a slower digesting protein, useful before bedtime. It can do.

Ben:

Yeah, oh, you remember casein.

Fiona:

I remember. Yeah, it is, that's how I knew it worked, I'm sure it's a lot better casein.

Ben:

I'm sure I haven't had it for years, but you remember I was having those old casein shakes before bed. I remember, oh, it was rough Did that help.

Ben:

Well, it's because it's slower digesting. So it's, if you really get into the weeds, it's like, oh my God, when you go to bed and you sleep, your muscles start becoming catabolic. Oh, they start wasting away because you've not had a protein feeding for God knows for eight hours. Oh, you lose all your gains Protein shakes. So your casing because it's slow digesting. It's like, oh God, okay, I won't go catabolic, my muscles won't waste away because it will just slowly eke its way through during the night. Oh, phew, can't swallow it, it's unedible. But think about those gains.

Ben:

I am a gym bro you are a gym bro so for the vast majority of people, don't worry about casing, just just focus on whey it's filtered milk that's what it is yeah, don't poop the bed. It's filtered milk, same sauce as cheese, and you could be eating plenty of that. I like cheese do you worry about all the cheese you're shoving your girl?

Fiona:

no, no, not at all so miss moffat was basically sipping her post-workout shake in the 1700s. Was she working out in the 1700s? Yeah, sorry, was she having her shake?

Ben:

Sorry, we need a bit of context now. This is from the lecture. Oh, there's, a picture of Miss Muffet.

Fiona:

Yeah.

Ben:

You know the nursery rhyme, miss Muffet.

Fiona:

Sat on her truffet, yeah, eating what was?

Ben:

she eating Curds, oh was that her whey protein. Yeah. Oh yeah filtered milk yeah yeah. Curds and whey in a bowl yeah, I imagine that's grotesque. Yeah. So maybe don't eat that. Okay. You can get some pretty nice tasting whey protein.

Fiona:

Oh, what was the one that you used to get. That was really nice, was it salt and sugar?

Ben:

Chocolate honeycomb.

Fiona:

Oh yeah. Yeah, that's pretty good, yeah, again.

Ben:

That's the thing. It's really get some protein powder that you enjoy Chocolate, vanilla, whatever.

Fiona:

Pop it in a shake. A shake isn't cheating. Put some milk with it, it's cheating. Hunger.

Ben:

Put some milk with it as well. So that really boosts up the protein.

Fiona:

And a bit of what do you call it soft fruit?

Ben:

You can make a shake out of it.

Fiona:

Yeah, well, I've got here, I've got here, I've got here, fiona breakfast reality check. We're moving on to that over to you, sweetheart no, no, you can read, it's fine.

Ben:

No, you've, you've. You've done everything else, but I just added this in because this was to is this aimed at me? Everyone okay, that's fine, I keep going back to the whole way. The wee protein the why and this breakfast reality check. I don't know why I had to title it breakfast reality check. I didn't obviously write that that's chat gbt, but these again are my notes okay.

Fiona:

So, as ben stated twice, this is breakfast reality check, so forget the recipes, the guides and the meal plans.

Fiona:

Yeah yeah, yeah, that's right so forget the recipes, the guides and the meal plans. I'm not here to plans. I'm not here to change Well, ben's not here to change your life in one meal, but you've got to show up. Someone always asks well, where do I start here? Start here. Buy some whey or pea protein, whatever. Have a shake with your coffee. Start a day with 25 grams of protein. Do that for a week. Keep everything else the same day with 25 grams of protein.

Fiona:

Do that for a week, keep everything else the same. Boom, that sounds okay, doesn't it? Yeah, I want to start having shakes again, does that?

Ben:

sound okay.

Fiona:

Yes.

Ben:

We'll get to the different options and the snacks and stuff like that, but maybe just start there. What high protein foods are there? I don't know how to eat protein. I don't like protein okay, so is there any point me giving you all these guides, then all these recipes. Do you really need another recipe that you're not going to make? No, I've got all these recipes saved on instagram. How many have you made? How many have you made?

Ben:

none I keep seeing that guy there's, there's like they're all the same, that guy. You know, the guy clicks his fingers. I've joked about it before. I'll make a video in the future. I'm sure it's a lovely bloke, but oh god, watching him watching someone else make a recipe. Let's give it a go. I'm sorry, let's give it a go. Oh, all the food's here.

Fiona:

You're a disturbing sweetheart.

Ben:

All the food's on the table. Now we have to listen to you talk about it while you make it. How many people are making this? You want to get some more protein in If you really want to try and find a form of excising stomach and a dieting stick for longer than 10 minutes. If this is what you want, if this is what you really want, just get the way Start there. Start there, you want. If this is what you really want, just get the whey start there. Start there, I'll give you some. Do you know what? I'll give you some reach out. I'll buy you some. I'll get you on the app. Maybe pay for the app, which is pretty cheap, and I'll give you some whey protein. No guides, no, no recipes.

Fiona:

Just protein.

Ben:

Not going to start tracking your calories. Let's just start there. Don't change anything else.

Fiona:

Can we get some protein? I want to start having shakes.

Ben:

Yes, don't change anything else. Don't change anything else. Have a whey protein shake. Pick a flavour, any flavour.

Fiona:

Add some milk to it.

Ben:

It's not bad. It's really not bad. If you don't want to buy one of these cheap yoghurts or whatever, start there, have it with your coffee.

Fiona:

You can do the next one, the potbelly protein deficiency, because I can't read it.

Ben:

What do you mean? Deficiency? That's the joke, fiona, right, come on. What are we on? Oh God, we've got to work the film. The film's a good film this week as well. It's a good film. It's a shame. Pot belly and protein deficiency. Here we go.

Fiona:

Kwashiorker. Mmm. Kwashiorker Kind of yeah, Washiorker.

Ben:

Yeah.

Fiona:

Wash your car. Probably along the lines yeah, you correct me Ben.

Ben:

Yeah, so what is that?

Fiona:

It's protein malnutrition.

Ben:

Yes, okay.

Fiona:

Yeah, so if we continue, I think it will make more sense. So this is the standard belly. It's not fat, it's just imbalance. It's seen in heavy grain, low protein diets. It's seen in heavy grain low protein diets. It's caused by a lack of amino acids to create essential proteins in the body. The muscles waste, the liver function drops and the fluid balance is disrupted. It's not always fat. It's often a symbol of what's missing. Protein isn't optional.

Ben:

So I think this originated in Ghana, so you would have seen on TV these kids with their pot bellies You'd think well, what's going on there?

Fiona:

Just because of lack of protein.

Ben:

Yes, interesting Fluid retention. Yeah yeah, pretty grim.

Fiona:

What's that keyword? Cash wash quicker.

Ben:

Why don't we?

Fiona:

No, it's because it's got the ores and it's all.

Ben:

This episode's gone to crap anyway, hasn't it, fiona? We can't even see you, can't even see you.

Fiona:

No, you can see my hand.

Ben:

Let me get it up, shall we? Just so we're all on the same page.

Fiona:

I won't remember it in 10 seconds. Oh, look at his sweet little face.

Ben:

Can't see him.

Fiona:

Do you see his little bald patch?

Ben:

Mercifully, here we go, right, you ready for this?

Fiona:

Yeah, put it to the microphone. Quashiorkor, quashiorkor.

Ben:

Quashiorkor.

Fiona:

Quashiorkor.

Ben:

Let's do it slow. Quashiorkor.

Fiona:

Quashiorkor. Okay lovely Quashiorkor Okay.

Ben:

Quashiorkor.

Fiona:

Learn something new every, every so, yeah, yes.

Ben:

What's even more grim about it is I think they run studies on it based on the first child who is born will be able to get a decent amount of nutrients from the breast milk oh, oh yeah, Within reason, based on the mother's diet. So it's still not going to be great, so they might get away with it. And then it's any children after or the second-born child is in trouble Because of the nutrients. Yes, they're already deficient.

Fiona:

Yeah, so the born, not born deficient.

Ben:

So the first child will get as much as possible, and the second child is just getting none, so they are more likely to get. Potbelly yes or kwashiorkor. Yes.

Fiona:

That was very good.

Ben:

Dairy is not the devil Okay, moving on, poor kids. Dairy is not the devil Okay, moving on, poor kids.

Fiona:

Dairy is not the devil. It's cheap and it contains all nine of the essential amino acids.

Ben:

Jeez Louise. It's a complete source Fantastic.

Fiona:

It's a great source of calcium and protein. It's great for the older adults as well, because it's easy to chew, it's naturally high in calcium and protein. It supports muscle retention and healthy bones. Greek yogurt, milk, cottage cheese easy wins and they're actually not overly expensive. It's not the dairy making you bloated, it's the 14 biscuits you dip into it.

Ben:

Yeah.

Fiona:

Cut out foods high in dairy made me lose weight. Chocolate, ice cream, cheese, butter. Elimination of energy dense, highly palatable foods leads to a decrease in calories. High fat versus low fat not much difference for heart health, it's just the calories.

Ben:

Okay, should we discuss that briefly.

Fiona:

Aye, yes, aye, I go for it. Yes, let's do it.

Ben:

So your dairy is demonised a lot of the time.

Fiona:

Yes.

Ben:

And if you're lactose intolerant, yeah okay, yeah, of course, jesus. But then I think there's been a lot of studies that have shown that even if you are lactose intolerant, you may be able to still handle some dairy.

Fiona:

But some people just can't have. Some people are able to have no cheese, but they're able to have milk.

Ben:

Right, okay, so it's. It's like a lot of foods. They get demonised, so they get cut out. People who do the keto diet Carbs the devil. Cut them out. Oh, I've lost weight, okay, great, so you've just managed to get yourself into a calorie deficit, congratulations. Yeah, it's because carbs insulin. Oh, we'll get into that in the next episode insulin making me fat making me fat insulin spikes okay yeah.

Ben:

So if you cut out all those foods, ones that you just mentioned chocolate, ice cream, cheese, butter high in dairy, also high in calories, so if you cut down on those and your goal is to lose weight, you will lose weight. It's not necessarily the dairy, is it? It's the calories. Yes, have been reduced, which has enabled you to get into a calorie deficit. Which is the bread and butter, so once again. Do we need to be demonising dairy? No.

Ben:

For a lot of people it can be pretty bloody useful. I like dairy and can be a really good way to start getting some more protein into your diet.

Fiona:

Yeah, unless, of course, you are vegan you're not allowed no dairy for you and none of the next stuff either talk into the mic, if we can, oh sorry, I'm just having a little break and the high fat versus low fat.

Ben:

Yeah, there's been studies that have shown in terms of heart health doesn't make that much difference if you're consuming a lot of higher fat foods or lower fat foods go down about cholesterol as well and salt and everything oh, there's loads, there's loads just yeah, it's not just one thing which is not a massive surprise, is it really?

Ben:

sometimes, if you're going for the lower fat option, it might not taste as good which means that you're not satisfied, which means that you might end up over consuming because you didn't just eat the one that you wanted sure we changed.

Fiona:

We changed from low well skim milk to full fat milk, didn't we? Because of the protein content?

Ben:

yeah, a lot better. Yeah, don't know why, but then, yeah, we were cool. We all get cool in it, don't we? Yeah, we just got used to having semi-skimmed low, the low-fat option, semi-skimmed, yeah, just got used to it. It tasted okay. I don't drink milk. I have it with my yeah to drink a glass of semi-skimmed milk is dirty. Right, okay, dirty dog, there you go.

Fiona:

It's watered down.

Ben:

Okay.

Fiona:

Low-fat milk is okay, but oh when you have a.

Ben:

You like the cat that gets the cream. Hey, even Ben from Pushball Health, he gets cool. I consumed whole grain rice for years. It sucks, oh, but it's whole grain.

Fiona:

It's stodgy. It cooks stodgily, doesn't it?

Ben:

Whole grain bread. Oh, it's got more fibre in.

Fiona:

I do like whole grain bread. I bought white bread, it's okay.

Ben:

Whole grain rice is terrible. Actually, no, that's not controversial, no one cares. Jack Black is terrible. I'm sure a lot of people would agree.

Fiona:

Keanu Reeves, what about him?

Ben:

Keanu Reeves yeah, he sucks. Yeah, he's really, really overrated. John Wick films fine, entertaining, but Keanu Reeves is awful he's a nice block door, isn't he?

Fiona:

oh, he's lovely.

Ben:

Yeah, oh, I'm sure, yeah yeah, I'm pretty sure some of the comments were oh, but he's lovely, he donates for charity. I'm not disputing that. Okay yeah, he's just not a very good actor.

Fiona:

Oh my. God.

Ben:

Well, monster, uh-huh. It's great though, isn't it? Whole grain rice is awful. Jack Black sucks. So does Keanu Reeves go comment say horrible things about me not me can't say it. Oh god, I have to go back after we finish this episode. I have to go back and see you red meesh, don't panic, it's got keratin let's not worry about red meat.

Ben:

We've discussed red meat before, I think and there's lots to discuss about red meat, but one of the biggest things about red meat is that a lot of people who demonise red meat and talk about it a lot are people that aren't eating red meat it's gone very expensive right, but most people that aren't eating red meat it's gone very expensive, right, but most people that demonise red meat and whinge about how unhealthy it is aren't consuming it, so really don't worry about it.

Fiona:

It was lovely. It's lovely. Sorry, our dinner was lovely yesterday.

Ben:

If you're an omnivore and you like red meat, no problem, enjoy it. Maybe think about not eating it all the time.

Fiona:

No, we don't eat it all the time. That was the first time in. How long Do?

Ben:

you need to go carnivore? Probably not.

Fiona:

No, you tried a carnivore diet before I did. Yeah, yeah.

Ben:

Yeah, I was eating a lot of liver and eggs. Oh, I remember that for about two weeks maybe, and it was like this is terrible now.

Fiona:

You quite like that liver dish? Do you remember I put the flour on it and stuff? Yeah, it was okay, but really it was madness, wasn't it?

Ben:

Yes, I was trying to convince myself that I was having a good time.

Fiona:

Normal? No, not particularly no. You were having a shit time, A crap time.

Ben:

It takes a long time to adjust. You remove carbs from your diet if you're training, if you're a gym bro like myself, it takes.

Fiona:

It takes a while to adjust your workouts will take a battering was that the time when you got really skinny before I went to Greece?

Ben:

I was keto.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I cut the carbs down yeah, I've done all sorts of wackiness but it's great, bloody hell.

Ben:

Carnival meat and eggs every day. Steak and eggs for breakfast every day yeah, I'd probably eat that it's just not sustainable.

Fiona:

Is it your bank account?

Ben:

yeah, exactly, and it's. You would get bored of it. I'd miss the bagels. But yeah, keto sounds great, doesn't it?

Fiona:

yeah, unlimited cheese unlimited bacon yeah, but it's not unlimited it's just avocado, if you like avocado oh, I've got another, then you can't smash it into the sourdough bread because avocado.

Ben:

If you like avocado, oh I've got an avocado, oh I've got an avocado but then you can't smash it into the sourdough bread because you can't eat bread oh, we've got bread oh, it all sounds great, doesn't it? Yes, and if it works for you, go for it if you want to eat carnivore do it if you just want to eat meat, fine, you do.

Ben:

You fruity, I think, with carnival, they, they, they eat meat, they eat their eggs. They have double cream, organic milk. Some carnivores are now eating honey and a little bit of fruit. Oh yeah, why are you doing that? Yeah, yeah, why not? Doesn't make you feel a bit better, does it? No, no, just what?

Fiona:

because the sugar who knows?

Ben:

but there's some people out there who are just, who are just creeping in these additional foods. Yeah, I just thought I'd try it oh right, but it's like carnival, isn't it? Fruit, yeah, why not, but meets the answer okay okay what was the point of that? Oh yeah, so red meat. Yeah, the people who whinge about red meat the most are people who don't eat red meat. So yeah just like anything, moderation is key, I'm sure it is okay, finishing off, isn't it fiona? It is track your protein eat more real food yeah, chachi bt, I don't.

Ben:

I think it means it's taking my notes. It means just be conscious of the ultra processed foods that you're eating. Where possible, can you start eating more whole foods, which may contain more protein. Eat more real food, it's like. What does that mean?

Fiona:

Yeah, supplement if you need to. Yeah.

Ben:

Is wh if you need to. Yeah, is whey protein a supplement? It's filtered milk, isn't it? Yes. So, yeah, I guess it's up to you. If you want to call it a supplement, no problem.

Fiona:

Eat high protein snacks such as Greek yogurt, boiled eggs, cottage cheese, chicken, tuna.

Ben:

High protein snacks.

Fiona:

Chicken be a check.

Ben:

I should have proofread this a bit better, should have put it in. There's a lot of high protein snacks out there which I think we've touched on, haven't we? We have. I've got guides as well. That's the thing about this. If you listen to this, you need to reach out, you need to meet me halfway.

Fiona:

For God's sake, you've got a whole guide.

Ben:

I'm brought in loads of guides millions of guides, so if you actually need, millions many, many guides.

Ben:

If you need some help and support and you're very confused, I can send you some guides that are quite. You can stomach the guides. They're quite easy for different supermarkets. If you are completely lost and you don't know what we're talking about and this episode has been horrendous, which it has been reach out If you need them. But, as I said, start bloody simple. Find a source of protein that you maybe already eat and just try and eat a bit more of it, or just try and go for, in some cases, the lower fat option, like Greek yogurt, for example, because it might have more protein in it. So if you're trying to, at the same time, increase your protein intake and be more conscious of your calories, something like that might work. But if you can't stand low-fat Greek yogurt, don't do it. If you like the higher-fat option, eat that and we'll find another thing that you can consume.

Fiona:

Or you can put some whey protein.

Ben:

There we go.

Fiona:

That's it, that's it.

Ben:

You're thinking Good.

Fiona:

I'm thinking like a gym bro.

Ben:

Yeah, evidence-based practitioner.

Fiona:

Do you see his little paws moving? He's dreaming. So what does 25 grams of protein actually look like? Oh, stretchies. So it's 110 grams of chicken breast. It's 110 grams of tinned tuna, 260 grams of 5% cottage cheese, 240 grams of 0% tuna, 260 grams of five percent cottage cheese, 240 grams of zero percent fat greek yogurt, 100 gosh, 120 grams of five percent beef mince, four medium eggs. It's a 30 30 gram scoop of whey protein, y protein, whatever and whey protein 775 mils of whole full-fash lovely milk.

Ben:

I've had this hat on this whole time.

Fiona:

Yeah, and it's flat, it's completely flat. It doesn't look like a hat.

Ben:

Okay.

Fiona:

Like a chef hat.

Ben:

The annoying thing is you keep saying all this stuff when we're already finished on.

Fiona:

I told you at the beginning it looks like a father hat, did you? Oh, okay, one of the recordings. We had to record this four times, so it's like the lights and the camera.

Ben:

You say all this stuff and it's a little bit too late.

Fiona:

High protein vegetarian friendly options.

Ben:

Yeah, oh. So we're covering all bases here. We are Omnivores, vegetarians, vegans. Yeah, I've got you.

Fiona:

Tofu, corn, mince, corn, corn yeah, greek yogurt, cottage cheese, whey protein eggs. Watch out for high calorie, low leucine combos such as nut butters, snacks seeds.

Ben:

Nut butters are fine, seeds are fine, they're all fine In moderation. Higher in calories, so be mindful of that, ugh.

Fiona:

He's so cute, so that's it it. I actually don't think that was that bad. It was okay. I actually enjoyed my little self.

Ben:

Yeah, it's fine, yeah, yeah but it's everything else, isn't it fiona?

Fiona:

it's.

Ben:

I don't know how this is going to sound you're telling me that we can't see you, so I rely on you. I've relied on you to to set this up and, yeah, I could tell that the lights aren't. They're not very bright either, so I probably should have changed that, but I didn't. I didn't, and we've got the sun streaming in, which is fine, which is okay, I'm not sure where you are now. Okay, okay, if the lights aren't very, it's because you're hard to see.

Fiona:

I told you you blended into the wall.

Ben:

If the lights aren't very bright. To the wall. If the lights aren't very bright, that's a bit of a problem. That's a bit of a problem because why are they on?

Fiona:

Wasting electricity, you know as you do.

Ben:

Okay, yeah, okay. Oh, we've got some vegan stuff there very quickly, fiona.

Fiona:

Oh, I don't have any vegan.

Ben:

Yeah, no, if you just click into the guide, Should be a guide. There Should be. Oh, that's a shame Okay.

Fiona:

On you.

Ben:

Right. So, we've got. What have we got? Linda McCartney veggie sausages.

Fiona:

Oh, I love them.

Ben:

Yeah, okay, lovely.

Fiona:

The rosemary and onion ones are very nice.

Ben:

Protein per serving in grams 22.5. Calories 200. That's two sausages, that's good. Well maybe I'll put that in the fridge, in the freezer Not. Not too bad. Beyond Meat Burger. I've never had them. I don't know how many vegans eat the fake meat stuff.

Fiona:

I think a lot.

Ben:

So, beyond Meat, Burger Protein per serving in grams 19. Calories per serving 269. Per burger 113 grams. I'm not sure about the order of these Lots of nuts. Various nuts nuts are good nuts are good just be conscious of your calories, just be mindful. Very easy to overeat nuts, but depends what your goals are. I like the Brazilian, depends what your goals are.

Fiona:

Brazilian nuts covered in chocolate. Does that count?

Ben:

Uh-huh, okay, we've just talked about lots of vegan-based food. Silly being a vegan's not silly but what I can do is I can just send you the PDF Instead of me rattling off all these different foods. Let's just do that, shall we Fiona? Yes, ben, we've. Let's just do that, shall we Fiona? Yes, ben, we've got to talk about the film. Oh Jesus, yeah. So anyway, vegans, omnivores, vegetarians reach out, reach out, and I'll send you anything that you need 100 quid you said anything based on protein and nutrition.

Ben:

Oh okay oh sorry, donald. Yeah, we're almost finished, mate. We've got to talk about the film and, annoyingly, annoyingly, this episode.

Fiona:

Shame, shame I actually don't think it was that bad.

Ben:

Yeah well, the content's okay, but how does it look? Oh yeah, can you see everyone? Let's just talk about that. Can you hear them yeah? Yeah, you, yeah yeah. You're in charge of the equipment. I'm a talent, so I did my job. I did my job.

Fiona:

As always. Well, chabit, did your job.

Ben:

As always, sweetheart, did you do your one.

Fiona:

Oh, he's just changing positions, okay.

Ben:

So the film is.

Fiona:

The Menu 2022.

Ben:

I think the title of this episode will be what's on the menu for the healthiest foods?

Fiona:

Protein.

Ben:

Yes, it was meant to be carbs, fats and protein, but 7.2.

Fiona:

It's just protein 7.2 on the IMDB oh it was fun, good film. Yeah, so a young couple, oh gosh. A young couple travels to a remote island to eat at an exclusive restaurant where the chef has prepared a oh yes, with some shocking surprises.

Ben:

Oh, my goodness.

Fiona:

Oh golly gosh, Directed by Mark Mylod, and I just did the three main actors.

Ben:

Okay, that's fine, I'm lazy.

Fiona:

Ralph Finis, who was Chef Slovik.

Ben:

Finis, finis Okay.

Fiona:

Anna Taylor-Joy.

Ben:

We've seen her, yeah.

Fiona:

Margot, she plays your one from the Queen's Gambit.

Ben:

Very good, oh yeah.

Fiona:

And Nicholas Hout, who plays Tyler.

Ben:

Yeah, what's he been in Fiona? Where did he start? What's that film that he was in when he was young With Hugh Grant? I see dead people. Is that it? No, that's the sixth sense with.

Fiona:

Bruce Willis About a boy. Yeah, war on bodies. Mad Max X-Men.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, he's been in some stuff. Yeah, yeah, he's been around.

Fiona:

I did not, could do that, that I just click onto them and I'd bring me to them uh-huh, okay, is there, is there not some irony of critiquing this film?

Ben:

I mean, well, that's the point, isn't it? We're now critiquing the film the menu. Why and that's what the chef got so cross about- oh people critiquing his food and he just lost the love of it there's not an irony of us sitting here going, yeah the menu. Is it a good film? Oh, I don't know. I didn't like this bit very much. I suppose, oh my god oh, there's an irony there, isn't there, surely?

Fiona:

well, I did. Like the way it ended, because but I don't understand why the others didn't follow suit. Why didn't they all say they wanted a bloody cheeseburger? I would have if I seen someone doing it. I would just oh, chef, could you make me a cheeseburger, because I'm still hungry too, and then I can go and take it away and get on the boat.

Ben:

Yes, but they didn't see, they didn't have the backstory, did they? And the whole? Point is that these people, other than what's her character in this called.

Fiona:

Margot. Margot else is quite ugly, aren't they? That's the point. That's why they're ugly. Well, they're there for different reasons. They're not. They're not great people for different reasons. They're frauds, margot is it margot?

Ben:

margot yeah, margot, is is not part of this, of this group well, she's just.

Fiona:

She wasn't meant to be there, was she? No, she doesn't have this relationship when it comes to food yeah, so she was different because she wasn't planned to be there. Everyone else was there for a reason they were obviously very rich. Some of them were quite fraudulent.

Ben:

Yeah, the point is, everyone else is quite unsavoury, yeah, which is fine. I think the film would have actually been better if we'd have just had lots of Margot's floating around.

Fiona:

Nice people yeah, but then that's not the point no, I know, of course I know it would have been too dark wouldn't it, it would have been all these nice people.

Ben:

Oh, my god, I'm so lucky to be here. This is lovely, god. You know it's cost me an arm and a leg, maxed out the credit card, but I'm in the presence.

Fiona:

I'm in the presence of the chef you've got the other couple, the older couple who gets his finger chopped off. They've been there like eight, eleven times, yes, and he couldn't mention more to me exactly. It's gross it became more of a novelty they're all gross. Oh, I can afford to do it, so I'm going to do it yes, they're just bored, aren't? They bored, yeah, yeah. And then your man that was with hold on a moment.

Fiona:

Nicholas Holt or Tyler, who was with Margot. He knew what the ending was and he still brought her yes, oh, yes so it shows what type of person he was. He didn't really care if she was going to die or not, from once he got the experience, because he wouldn't have been allowed to go on his own that was probably the best one actually style over substance he knew everything. Didn't know how to cook a lamb.

Ben:

Pretty sinister that was quite a sinister bit, where he whispers in his ear. I wonder what he whispered. It must be something along the lines of he must have just told him to go off and kill himself.

Fiona:

He didn't deserve to die with everyone else yeah and he didn't deserve to die with the chefs well, he was kind of like an imposter wasn't he he definition of style and no substance yeah, well, and I'm being an imposter he was saying he was a know-it-all about everything you know he doesn't deserve to see the ending of this menu. So just go off and deal with yourself yeah, well, that's the same what his um, his chef, his sous chef, wasn't that? You will never be as good as me, so there's no point in you being here anymore. So kill yourself for the sake of the arse, so to speak.

Fiona:

For the sake of the menuse so to speak For the sake of the menu. Is it part of the menu? Yeah, Just yeah, it was a good film. I didn't really know what to expect with it and I wasn't expecting that.

Ben:

No no.

Fiona:

But I don't know. It was a weird film. Would I watch it again? I probably would watch it again to see if I've missed it, missed out on anything? Yeah, maybe I would watch it again. I actually think, I would like, I think I'm okay actually, yeah, yeah good film, but I don't think I missed much.

Ben:

Maybe there's some easter eggs that you can go.

Fiona:

Oh look yeah it's all foreshadowing but what was the point? I don't understand what the point of killing your man in the pond was, who actually owned the restaurant and owned the island, because he was killing himself anyways. So what was the point in killing your man?

Ben:

So the restaurant dies what him made it, but the guy was on the angel wings.

Fiona:

Yeah.

Ben:

Well, he was just part of it, wasn't he? He was just part of those sleazy little gym bros. They're probably gym bros.

Fiona:

Yeah.

Ben:

The investors.

Fiona:

But it was. The idea was that the restaurant and the menu will die with the chef, and that's why he had to overtake the business, because now the business owner died and the person who was handed over to is also dead, so it ends with him.

Ben:

Yeah, the thing is, Julian's just pulling a bit of a hissy fit, isn't he? Yeah.

Ben:

And he's just bringing all these people in. He's bringing all these people with him to die, and there's all different reasons as to why he's doing it, but he's doing it, but he's just. He's lost his love of food, he's not very happy, he's miserable, and all these people, for different reasons, have led to him losing his love of food. And they're just quite gross people in different ways and, like he says, he says well, you can escape, but if you put a bit of effort in, you'd probably be able to get off quite comfortably but you're not you're all still here.

Ben:

Why so? That implies that everyone's gone. Oh, do you know what? I am actually a pretty vile human being well, they're all enjoying the experience.

Fiona:

Deep down, that critic, your man shot himself in front of her and she was oh she was grand. Like it's all part of the act, his brains were splattered all over the countertops with a bit of effort they probably could have put up more of a fight anyway, than they did the only one that actually tried was Margot, so as they go through the menu.

Ben:

It's like oh yeah, do you know what? Yeah, maybe I'm not a very nice person, maybe I deserve to be here, so, alright, I'll see how this plays out why did the actor, why was he there? Because he was just an actor talking about him, he's in Spawn. So if you're telling me that Julian's offended by a film that he was in, lucky he didn't watch Spawn because he wouldn't have made it past the first course oh why? Have you seen Spawn?

Fiona:

no, I don't think. So have I. You know what I've seen? I don't.

Ben:

John, oh no.

Fiona:

John something.

Ben:

What's his surname? Oh no, I'm struggling with the pronunciation. He's got an awful surname.

Fiona:

John Legizimo Zamo.

Ben:

Oh, that's no, that's no, we've done the potbelly stuff.

Fiona:

Legizimo.

Ben:

Legizimo yeah, yeah, that sounds about right. Oh yeah, I'm pretty sure. No, he liked my post when we did an episode on Spawn on the, did he? John Legizimo liked my post? Yeah, unbelievable.

Fiona:

Were you giving out about him?

Ben:

well, I was saying the film was terrible.

Fiona:

I don't know.

Ben:

I must have watched it if we did a no, no, it was Meantime, meantime did it yeah okay, but yes, film, and he plays this morbidly obese clown and it's. It's such an offensive performance, it's so offensive. I like him. Good actor, he's fine, he's fine, but no so is that why he was there?

Fiona:

because he just didn't like one of his films yes.

Ben:

So what I'm saying is if he had a scene spawn, he wouldn't have made it past the first dish right, because he'd have been really offended by that.

Fiona:

Right, but that's a bit unfair, considering the critique, the food critic. She literally ruined some of his life, and that's why. So that makes sense? Well, no, she ruined.

Ben:

She a food critic. How do you even become a food critic? That's quite the job, isn't it? Going into restaurants, these Michelin star restaurants, restaurants, these chefs oh, jesus Christ, here she comes, yeah, because the. Michelin star is like you've made it and then someone comes in and says nah, nah, didn't like the soup nah, sorry, I'll have to take your star.

Fiona:

Well, if it was me and somebody was serving up shit like breadless, a breadless dish. I swear if someone was serving up breadless plates, I would just talk into the mic what is this?

Ben:

I want a bit of bread yes, I know that's part of the silliness, the idea of this food is it's all fancy, dancy and complex. Sometimes you just want a burger and chips at a restaurant well, I know, or you want a lasagna, but like Julian was saying the bread is for the poor and they're not poor no, so they're not deserving of the bread.

Fiona:

No, the bread is for the poor. So, and they're not poor. No, so they're not deserving of the bread no they deserve better they deserve better than the bread hmm, I'm sure you could have given something else we should have closed the door.

Ben:

There's noise in the background.

Speaker 3:

That was a bit of a silly yeah, but lots of mistakes have been made in this episode. Yeah, but sweetheart's been, so it's okay.

Ben:

You got the menu up there, haven't you, of each dish.

Fiona:

Yeah, I will in a minute. Yeah, I do.

Ben:

I guess you could briefly run through all the characters. I don't know all their names, but Tyler, yeah, takes pictures, knows what to do but can't cook.

Fiona:

Talked about that, but why would the chef even eat that lamb?

Ben:

Sure it was terrible. He was dying anyway, so yeah, Couple bored need to spend their money. Can't name one dish. Yeah, yeah, there's the. He knows, margot.

Fiona:

Yeah, she was a prostitute, wasn't?

Ben:

she yeah, and he was paying her went out for dinner and then he was paying her to. He was paying her to say that she was his daughter while he touched himself. Yeah, yikes. That was that she was his daughter while he touched himself. Yeah, yikes, that was so that implies that the daughter's not around anymore and he had a inappropriate relationship with his daughter yeah, all right, oh boy, okay, right, yeah, okay right, what about?

Ben:

investor bros. Family life going to shit also, family life going to poop. So one of them talks about how? Oh yeah, family life, yeah, I text, I text the maid or whatever. Who he said? Who did he say he texts a co-worker, so he's having an affair?

Fiona:

but hey, we're here.

Ben:

Look at this. This is great. Who cares about the family life?

Fiona:

but why was he there?

Ben:

because of the investment they're investors, yeah, into the restaurant when the when the bread dish. Well, when the bread list dish comes out, they're the ones who are like oh yeah, come on. Like this restaurant exists because of us, so can we get some bread please?

Fiona:

and I'm assuming his mother was there, which isn't. She's not really mentioned, but I'm assuming his mother was there because this is the source of his pain in some elements, because taco cheese tonight oh yes which resulted the bit of chicken with the scissors in yeah, yeah.

Ben:

Pretty deep, pretty heavy.

Fiona:

Yeah and oh, she's drunk. This is not unusual.

Ben:

Yes, telling Lillian.

Fiona:

Which one's that the critic ends yeah.

Ben:

What did he do? Was that his I?

Fiona:

think he was just her guest, but he was her advisor, he was was a sicker fan.

Ben:

Oh, lillian, oh my god. Oh, let me pay for this what about the girl?

Fiona:

I loved the way he took payment at the end. I loved the way he took payment at the end.

Ben:

Oh, yes, and everyone paid, everyone paid, everyone just got into it, everyone just got into the spirit of it. Everyone was like, oh yeah do you know what?

Fiona:

Maybe, but he's right. The only one that didn't pay was Margo, and she got off the no she paid $10, didn't she?

Ben:

That was the joke, wasn't it? For her burger, £10, yeah.

Fiona:

Yeah, but no, they didn't pay for their meal, as in their other meal. What other meal?

Ben:

They did. They all got their credit cards out, didn't they Well?

Fiona:

he was dead. He was hanging in the corner and she was eating her cheeseburger.

Ben:

Oh right.

Fiona:

So she only paid the 10 quid for the.

Ben:

Yes, well, she didn't eat the rest of the food.

Fiona:

No, that's true, yeah.

Ben:

Yeah, okay, yeah. So again, he did say you can't leave, make some more effort. Why are you still here? So what else? Yeah, the ending, the ending's quite good and he's right. He's right about s'mores rubbish marshmallows oh yeah, biscuits what? Are they called graham crackers? Just rubbish chocolate. It's a really rubbish dish. He's right, it sucks rubbish. I like maramellos quite a good set up, though everyone's sitting there. Marshmallows on chocolate hat.

Fiona:

I love the way it's melting down onto their faces, that's good, that's good.

Ben:

That's a good ending. Visually that looks pretty good.

Fiona:

Because it was. It's like a chocolate helmet, say, going over her head and that's melting down onto the marshmallow, that was quite good.

Ben:

They, they all deserve to die A room full of people where life isn't worth living by the end of it they were just accepting of what was going on. Accepting of their fate, like, yeah, do you know what I do? Suck, actually. Yeah, he's right. All right, fine, I'll play along. You will eat less than you desire, but more than you deserve. Ooh, that's quite a good line, actually.

Fiona:

Who was?

Ben:

that Elsa? What was her name? Elsa? Was it Elsa, his?

Fiona:

yes, his assistant yes yeah to that guy.

Ben:

Good line, very apt for him. For him as well and for most of them, but they always want more, but they don't deserve it hmm, hence why I don't get any bread yeah, good hmm, anything else? Fiona that buzzes, no, nothing else, and so I don't get any bread yeah good Anything else, Fiona that buzzes. No, nothing else.

Fiona:

Trying to satisfy people who can never be satisfied. That's true Especially with that bunch of people in the room. And then he was just so happy when she took the bite out of the cheeseburger and she was happy, that's lovely.

Ben:

I don't think people were enjoying the food, were they actually?

Fiona:

No, they were enjoying the concept of being there.

Ben:

Yeah, that's what it's about, isn't it? It's just, it's like oh my God, I can tell people, I've been here. Yeah, tyler wasn't even enjoying it, differentiate the different flavours. Oh, that's a oh yeah. But he was a fraud, chef. Is that a yes? It is yeah, oh, I thought so. Are you enjoying it, though? Are you enjoying this moment? And that's not even because he knew that everyone was going to die. I'm sure he probably just thought, oh, he's just being a bit OTT, isn't?

Fiona:

he, but why did he know everyone was going to die? Why didn't everyone know that they were going to die?

Ben:

I don't know. He just told him that was part of the menu, wasn't it? That was Tyler's part of the menu and I'm sure Tyler probably thought oh well, if I show how much I know about all these foods and how much I love the chef, how much I love Julian, he might go. Do you know what Everyone's so ungrateful? Do you know what Everyone's so ungrateful? But I, like you. You can stay, we'll let you live.

Fiona:

So do you think that he was quite Tyler was quite fanatic and obsessed with the chef, that he did all of this research in the hope that he would survive.

Ben:

Well, he just liked him, didn't he? He was obsessed with him and he liked his food, and he probably thought, well, once he knows this, once knows this, once the chef meets me, it'd be really impressed. And this whole thing about yeah, everyone's gonna die, by the way, so just give your heads up it, let me live and everyone else will die, because they just don't get it well, they don't appreciate it.

Fiona:

He allowed him to choose his own fish, I suppose right, okay, okay that's it good film?

Ben:

yeah, very good film, hey it makes you want to bring back the old film no, it does not.

Fiona:

It does not good film.

Ben:

Not sure we've done it justice, but I'm going to go and get my breakfast menu sorted.

Fiona:

Yeah, same same what's on the dish, what you're serving it's one of those films where it's almost like if you break it down too much.

Ben:

It's just you become like I started with the irony of trying to break it down. What does this mean? These people are so undeserving of being here. Do we deserve to even talk about this film? But at least Julian got a little bit of joy at the end.

Fiona:

He got to make a cheeseburger yeah, and he was happy about it and the second, Margot walked out.

Ben:

he was miserable again. Yeah, Do you want to go through the menu very quickly by finishing off just going through the menu, all the exotic and wacky dishes.

Fiona:

So the tostache or appetiser or whatever it was, it was a lemon caviar served on raw oyster with mignonette.

Ben:

Oh right, this is what the boat was before they even got to the no, no, no oh right, and it's the only dish on the menu that isn't explained.

Fiona:

However, we're not sure what the meaning is meant to be, but it does have a history in the sourness of the lemon. Oh lovely Amuse Boucher.

Ben:

Oh yes.

Fiona:

The early hint, Early hint, that Chef Solvac is in control. It traditionally is not ordered by patrons but instead served solely on the chef's selection. First course is the island. It's a metaphor about the fleeting nature of human life. From the seaweed to fresh raw scallop, every ingredient of the dish comes from the island itself. Second course, which we have mentioned quite a lot Outrage. The breadless bread plate, A veiled commentary on the guests at the Horton. As explained by chef, bread and grain have always been the food of the impoverished throughout history. Third course Chicken tacos with scissors in it. The threshing dish with a chilling past. The personalised tacos also subtly reveal why Justin had chosen, why Julian had chosen these specific guests. The fifth course the mess. A comment on the futility of pursuing perfection. The meaning of the Mess is simple and clear. The pursuit of culinary perfection to please strangers puts chefs under tremendous, sometimes lethal, pressure.

Ben:

Oh sorry, I thought you were just going to be talking, just saying the dishes. I didn't think you were going to be actually doing this as well. Oh no. But yeah, this makes our review sound awful, because this is how you really say it oh, palate cleanser.

Fiona:

Wild bergenot with red clover tea oh, my favourite, the evening's final moments of normalcy. The palate cleanser is a darkly ironic bit of comedy that fits wonderfully into the tone of the movie Man's Folly, which is the Dungeness crab Yogurt Whey. Ben, did you hear that Yogurt Whey?

Ben:

Oh yes, whey, whey, whey, whey. There it is.

Fiona:

A culinary exploration of male insecurity, made with mostly ingredients from the sea. It also symbolises the futility of trying to escape Passard egg hot and cold, sweet and savoury, soft boiled eggs which is a traditional gourmet dish. Curiously, the Passard egg is a typical dish served at gourmet restaurants. Tyler's bullshit, terribly, terribly swearing.

Ben:

That's what it's called. I know, I know Terrible.

Fiona:

Terrible lamb cooked by an even worse human being.

Ben:

Yikes.

Fiona:

Although viewers do not know what was said to Tyler, it can be imagined that chef's disappointment in him and his humiliation led to his suicide.

Ben:

Oh right, yes, okay.

Fiona:

Birthday cake, a surreal moment of levity. It perfectly adds to the dark comedy of the menu as Solveig and the staff happily present the cake to a traumatised birthday boy. And then the supplement course, or the supplemental course A Cheeseburger which is Margaret's successful bid for survival. So this course is why Margaret escapes the menu and is the only one who survives the end.

Ben:

Jeez, what about the s'mores?

Fiona:

Oh yeah, sorry, the final dart, the human s'mores, the fiery end to Slovak's final meal. At this point in the evening, the diners have seemingly come to accept their fates and even embrace the show of the final courses.

Ben:

Right, I didn't expect you to read all those out, I just thought you were going to just go through the menu.

Fiona:

Always expect the unexpected, babe.

Ben:

What am I going to do with that? Am I keeping that in? Wow, wow.

Fiona:

Oh, I have to take a picture of that.

Ben:

Okay.

Fiona:

Can you add this onto your?

Ben:

Shall. We finish off Fiona.

Fiona:

Yeah, can you add this to your thing? So?

Speaker 4:

all the viewers can see what it looks like. I prefer not to.

Fiona:

Oh, that's so cute.

Ben:

Okay, there we go. Wow, that was. Long I can't wait, can't wait to go upstairs and have a look at this.

Fiona:

Well, I talked into the mic, didn't I?

Ben:

Will you do a better job next time? No, on the equipment, absolutely not.

Fiona:

When you were the one that came down, I told you not to have these lights on. I said, leave the blinds open.

Ben:

Got to have the lights on. Got to make some effort.

Fiona:

Ben, it's like 30 degree heat out. The sun is shining high in the sky.

Ben:

Through the windows, we're indoors.

Fiona:

Through the windows and the blinds.

Ben:

Okay, and the blinds okay we'll try to go next time. You know, this is fine, it's fine, the rougher ones are fine. It's just because they go on YouTube. They go on YouTube.

Fiona:

So everyone's going oh, you're light and crap, ben, you need to be able to see the person yeah anyhow, on that note, thank you very much. Okay, push for health oh, that's right.

Ben:

God yeah, mnu health, oh mn oh that's right, god. Yeah, mnu, yeah, professional mnu, evidence-based, evidence-based nutrition. That's what we're doing here. Push for health. They do an outro as well, dan mackles. We also need an outro, so I'm gonna work you hard do what you need to do because I don't want to do it.

Ben:

Push for health. Find a diet you can stick to for longer than 10 minutes. Find a form of exercise you can stomach. Empowering you what am I doing? Empowering you to give your yo-yo diet and half-arsed exercise routine the middle finger in just 30 days? Okay, okay, I'm starving Right, ad days.

Fiona:

Okay, okay, I'm starving.

Ben:

Right.

Fiona:

Adios, goodbye.

Ben:

Oh boy.

Fiona:

Auf Wiedersehen. Ciao.

Ben:

I feel like Julian.

Fiona:

Sláinte.

Ben:

I'm losing the love of this.

People on this episode

Contributor

Ben Davis

Host
Contributor

Fiona Bohan

Co-host

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