ADHDifference

S2E31: ADHD, Drugs & Alcohol Addiction + guest Hilary Momberger Powers

• Julie Legg • Season 2 • Episode 31

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Julie Legg sits down with Hilary Momberger Powers — actress, inspirational speaker, trauma-informed guide, author, and the original voice of Sally Brown from the Peanuts cartoons. Hilary shares her extraordinary story of early fame, childhood trauma, addiction, and four decades of recovery — and how her ADHD diagnosis in adulthood reframed much of her past.

With humour and insight, Hilary discusses the impacts of being an undiagnosed neurodivergent child in a high-pressure environment. She explores how ADHD and addiction fed into each other, how healing her inner child led to transformation, and why stabilising the body, mind, and spirit is essential for recovery. This is a raw and hopeful conversation about finding peace, embracing difference and living in colour.

Key Points from the Episode

  • Hilary's journey from child actor to decades-long recovery advocate
  • How ADHD traits were misread as character flaws or "too muchness"
  • The cycle of addiction and self-shame when ADHD goes unrecognised
  • ADHD and addiction as a mind–body–spirit triangle
  • The power of sensory grounding and daily stabilisation tools
  • Healing through inner child work and reframing self-perception
  • From victim to victor: embracing ADHD as a kaleidoscopic gift
  • How trauma, addiction, and ADHD often intersect in women
  • The role of connection, belonging, and self-acceptance in recovery

Links

WEBSITE: https://www.hilarymombergerpowers.com/

YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/@thehilarymombergerpowers

INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/hilarymombergerpowers/

LINKED IN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hilary-momberger-powers-078a604/

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ℹ️ DISCLAIMER: This podcast is for informational purposes only. The views expressed are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect those of the host or ADHDifference. Read More

HILARY: How do I help myself feel at ease? All right. Well, let's look at what I'm up against. I got this mind power disease called alcoholism. I've got ADHD that is a real thing. Like my brain fires a little differently than the average person. Do I shame myself, beat myself up? Oh, I did that for years, you know, and then that made me go driving deeper into my addiction because then I hated myself and I wanted to shut my hating thoughts about. So, it's a cycle, you know. That's the cycle we talk about in alcoholism.

JULIE: Welcome to Season 2 of ADHDifference. I'm your host, Julie Legg, ADHD advocate, author of The Missing Piece, a woman's guide to understanding, diagnosing, and living with ADHD, and an unapologetic doer of many things. This season, we're turning up the volume with a global lineup of brilliant guests, bringing their lived experiences, insights, research, strategies, and resources. And of course, along with a healthy dose of humor and humility. Whether you're neurodivergent yourself or just curious, there's something here for every curious brain. Let's dive in. Today, I'm joined by Hilary Momberger Powers, an author, commercial actress, print model, and inspirational speaker whose story is one of extraordinary resilience. Hilary began her career at just 5 years old, voicing Sally Brown in the Peanuts cartoons and worked steadily through childhood while carrying trauma that led her into addiction as a young teen. Decades into her recovery journey, Hilary discovered she also has ADHD, a realization that reframed so much of her impulsivity, emotional intensity, and coping patterns from those earlier years. Now with more than 40 years in recovery, she uses her lived experience to help women heal trauma, break old belief systems, and rebuild their lives with compassion and strength. Welcome to the show, Hilary. 

HILARY: Thank you. I really appreciate you inviting me. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening to everyone. 

JULIE: Excellent. Now, your story begins in such a unique way landing roles that many children could only dream of and then being introduced to drugs and alcohol as a young teen. So looking back with years of recovery behind you, how do you see ADHD showing up in those early years? 

HILARY: Well, it's funny because you know back in the day they would say things like, my mother would say, "Stop fidgeting. Stop moving." That was her favorite line for me. And I just couldn't sit still, you know. Everything was go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go go. And it was... I was an irritant. That was how my family would you know, it's "Oh my god she's all over the place. She can't figure you know, she starts things she doesn't complete them." My brothers and sisters would be like "Oh we got to clean after up after Hilary. She's always in you know always in a hurry." That's my one thing you know, and the fidgeting thing. So, it wasn't really, I wasn't told what was wrong. I just felt like I was different and I felt like something was wrong with me because I would... I meant well, but I couldn't do well. Like I would say, "Okay, I'm going to sit on my hands." And then I would start rocking or whatever. And I just thought I was hyper. And I would do things like five and 6 years old, I lived an hour away from my school and I would have to walk. And I'm supposed to be at school at 9:00 a.m. And I'd show up at 10:30 because I had stopped at every dog, every house, picked every flower because I just get completely lost in, you know. Today I've honed it down that I am so grateful I have it because I am just a kaleidoscope and I see things so differently than the average bear as we say, you know. And you know, I get to be interested in A B C D E F G and I don't have to do one thing which has really been... I've actually embraced it instead of having it as a defect. It's my asset. It's my warrior side. It's my gift. [And I love your term being a kaleidoscope. We see so many different angles in so many different colours. It is remarkable.] Yeah, it's really, you know, if you look at your... like the world will see us as a defect, as you know, like, oh my god, you know, I always say people want to have letters behind their name. Well, those are letters I don't really care to have behind my names, right? It's like I'm an alcoholic. I got ADD. I, you know, I'm hyper. I'm always in a hurry. I'm turbo. I'm, you know, whatever. I'm Hilary and this is the package. And lucky you, you know, when I was a kid, it was utilized because my brain was so firing. My synapses were firing so grandiosively, not in a big way, but it was like and over here and over here. So I was easy to rein with my mother. So being a creative, I would come up with these great ideas like where does that come from? Thank you. my mind is a little wacky and I take that as a gift. And so I would come up with playful things and I would book jobs because of it. Or they'd say, "Act this way." And I go, "Oh, okay." And I jump right in it because I'm constantly on the move. My mind is firing off so many things so quickly. And I would just grab one and they would say, "Oh my god, you're so creative. Such a creative little girl." But inside my head, I'm like, nothing ever... it didn't feel like anything stuck. That's the ADHD. Nothing sticks. It's not like that. "Oh, I found it." You know, I'm like, what does that feel like? It's like, what are we doing next? You know, my drugs and alcohol, you know, I was this child star and there was a lot of pressure. And I had a narcissist mother and I had an alcoholic mother and she was her ego was never satisfied. I was her little project. When she didn't feel good, I could change. I could keep changing. Do you like me now? Am I okay now? How about this? How about that? And I was so malleable, you know, and so it worked for her. And for me, I thought I was, you know, I always pictured it like my life is about spinning tops, all the plates. I kept spinning all the plates. Plates until I hit my bottom with drugs and alcohol and I let them all fall. I was like, I'm done. I'm exhausted. I've exhausted myself. And so when I was doing these, you know, the acting and such and there was a lot of pressure, I had to support the family in my mind. She would say things like, you know, "They're going to starve because of you if you don't get this job." And it was like, oh my god, I was taking care of seven children. Oh, so there was a lot of pressure, which you know, my characteristic, I like pressure. I do really well under pressure. So, I think I get a little sloppy after a while, but I do I like the surge. I like the, you know, I just did an audition right before I jumped on with you. And my best friend says, "God, you are so good under pressure." That's my mind. That's a gift. That is my blessing behind this so-called curse. 

JULIE: We're talking a lot about addiction today and you've described addiction as a mind, body, and soul dis-ease. So as someone with ADHD, how did those ADHD symptoms and addiction feed into each other and in what ways did they perhaps complicate each other? 

HILARY: Oh yeah, that's a really loaded question. Well, I call it the triangle. you know, the mind, body, and the spirit. You know, I have this mind power disease called alcoholism. Not was-im. So, I'm always going to have it regardless if I stop drinking or not. I still have the original root was this is the ism. And in alcoholism, the one of the characteristics is I'm always in a hurry anyway. And you topple that with my, you know, my ADD problem and all that, I'm in a hurry naturally because my mind's moving so quickly. And so when you tell me when I get sober, "Easy does it." I'm like, what does that mean? Oh my god, what are you talking about? Let go. Let go. Are you kidding? I'm holding on for dear life because I'm in a hurry. And so the characteristics of it, it also mirrors manic depressive. Everything is amazing. Everything is doom and gloom. I'm gonna die. So when I talk about the having the body, mind, and the spirit, well, the first thing I got to do is I got to stabilize. That's sobriety. I no longer get to drink or use because it's not working anymore. It doesn't shut my head down. It makes it worse. And that's even worse. Like when the drugs don't quiet their mind because I didn't get loaded to go have a, you know, a party and go, you know, dance at clubs. I got loaded to shut it down. Stop. Stop. I remember that going, "Oh, God. God, shut up." I mean, how many times have I said that to myself? Because that used to be my mantra. What's wrong with you, God? Slow down. Oh my god. I can't get everything. And I'm beating myself up. So the first thing I do is I need to stabilize. How do I do that? My seeing, tasting, touching, hearing, smelling. I got to get my senses stabilized because that's how I feel safe. And when you're in, when I'm in a cycle, my ADHD cycle of like it's almost like I'm a Ferrari and someone has put a brick on the gas pedal. There ain't nothing stopping me. So if I go firstly to my senses, I don't drink and use, there's a stabilization. I start feel a little, I feel a little security. I feel safer. I start drinking more water. I mean, these are so important for my brain synopsis. It's firing. And when I am dehydrated, it's kicking even harder harder. So, I don't even know this stuff until I start going, "Wow, it's okay for me to research who I am so I can take care, love, and embrace who I am." If I just say, "Take my drinking away," then I'm stuck with this and then I have a mind power disease above with having a little neurotransmitter oopsie, you know, firing whack whackadoodle. So, I got to know, okay, so if I'm always in a hurry, which I am, there's my it comes with my that's with my alcoholism and my ADHD. How do I stop myself from being in a hurry? Then I get into take a breath. There's my seeing, tasting, touching, hearing, smelling. I take in something different. I drink water. I show up at the same place three times a week. Whoa. That's hard for me because I want to be all over the place. I like it. An it's an energy. I like the insanity. It's fun because I think I'm in control. But that's the illusion of my alcoholism. I thought I was in control of my drinking. I wasn't drinking. I was being drunk. 

JULIE: Very, very interesting things that you've said, Hilary. One, you know, with this substance misuse, abuse, that self-medication you know, self-medicating, using the only strategy that was available to you that you knew of, yet it didn't work. And replacing that with this grounding sense, as you've said, works better for your brain. And that's wonderful that you can. They're two extremes, aren't they? 

HILARY: It's night and day because I always wanted that magic pill to fix me. I wanted that pill. I want that pill. Would that calm me down? I wanted that drink. Would that calm me down? So, I was self-medicating because I couldn't stop this from going on and on and on. And so, by me taking care of the physical, when I said the body, mind, I take care of the physical. The mind is I start learning more about who I am as a character. I start learning about all my dis-eases. Dis-ease means not at ease, not maimed. Hilary, how do I help myself feel at ease? All right. Well, let's look at what I'm up against. I got this mind power disease called alcoholism. I've got ADHD that is a real thing. Like my brain fires a little differently than the average person. Do I shame myself, beat myself up? Oh, I did that for years, you know, and then that made me go driving deeper into my addiction because then I hated myself and I wanted to shut my hating thoughts about. So, it's a cycle, you know, that's the cycle we talk about in alcoholism. So all of a sudden I'm not doing that and I'm filling my mind with like okay well pause when agitated, go to AA meeting, show up certain time, show up, and meet a sponsor. Meet somebody that you're friends with that you're in the same journey with that you can interact with, communicate with. Because a lot of times I don't tell anybody. I just think I'm what... I'm crazy you know, and I hate myself for it because then it's like Hilary's ... Oh, I call my treated side is Hillary. My untreated side is Helga. She's on crack. She is like, whoa. Either she's angry and mean or she's the people pleaser and she's doing everything for everybody and wants to kill herself at the end. And you know, by the end of the day, you know, we understand that one. But so then the third part component is this God aspect. And how do I get a God aspect? Well, I had to look at I've been this power over my life. I've blown it up. I've destroyed it. I have no self-worth or self-esteem. My family is like, "Oh, here comes Hilary again. God, she's so frenetic." That was my favorite word. Oh, she's so woo. She's so, she's a whoa. She's a wild you know, and I was shamed over that. And so I saw that when I'm empowered with Hilary and my thoughts I started getting some really shitty outcomes. Like I started losing jobs. I couldn't show up on time. And I meant well but I couldn't do, well I tried so hard many times you know. I tried to be. I remember going to work and saying I'm just not going to talk at work I'm going to shut my mouth, you know, by 9:30. I'm like, and people are like, we can't keep her around. She's too, she's too, you know. Unfortunately when you're sitting on a sound stage, you're not supposed to talk. Aka, it's supposed to be quiet. So, I started implementing some like I started talking to this power greater than me because I know something created me. I didn't. So, it's got to be greater than me. So I start opening up the idea that maybe then why did you make me an alcoholic? Why did you fracture my brain like this? So I start finding out the good stuff about it. Like I am a bundle of love. I'm a bundle of energy. I wouldn't be like this if I didn't have these defects or whatever these, you know, strongholds. They have become my assets. Mhm. I'm going to call you God for the sake of the word. That's where I started. I'm going to give you a name instead of higher power, universe. That's like way too big for me. I need to keep it simple. And I start learning that my mind will produce a thought that says, "You're never going to make it. You know, you're too you're too colorful. You're just too extra, Hilary." I love that one. And so I would get that thought. It becomes a feeling. I go, "God, I hate myself. God, I'm such a... I'm never... Why do I even try?" That thought becomes a feeling. Then my feeling becomes an action. I start blowing things up. I start throwing things or I start not calling people or I erase their numbers or I text them something. Oh my god, those are always great. You know, pause when texting, not when agitated, when texting. And then all of a sudden that action becomes my character. But I am colorful and I like to see it in many different colors. So, thank God that I have allowed myself to tap into so many incredible resources for me to know that I am not broken. No, I'm an incredible piece of art that God created and so I have these oopsies in my life. Oh well. 

JULIE: There are so many adults with addiction histories and you know and they discover it later in life that they were actually neurodivergent children trying to cope without that support which we have touched on. When you look again just back in your childhood, the pressure and the performing and some of the trauma around that, what were some other ADHD things that you see were missed at the time beyond your fidgeting? What was something deeper that you were experiencing that perhaps were missed? 

HILARY: Well, I couldn't read until I was 11 years old. Okay. I'm very good at parroting. So, I would be told what to say and what lines to say, but because of my inability to focus, you know, and sit still and allow things to be absorbed, because of my always that anxious feeling that's going on inside. And I never told anybody because I thought that was just me, you know, and because of all that anxiety that I would have inside, you know. And you know, I did the thing I bit my fingernails to the quick. I was, you know, those were a lot of the stuff and but it was more of the stuff that was going on in my mind that I couldn't express it because also these thoughts of not being enough was so rapid fire. It wasn't like one theme. Was constantly changing. And I really at the time I was only I'm the only one in the family who's like this. So I was looked at like, "Oh god, here she is again." So I kind of fell into that role of being different, odd, and you get to a point when you're a kid, you're just like, I guess this is who I am. And it's not that we accept it, we surrender to it, you know, as in a defeat. And so when I found drugs and alcohol, it became my cloak of comfort, of calming. It became my sounding board because I had a relationship with it that wasn't going to go. I saw a lot of people loved to know me but didn't stay because of that frenetic energy. I don't know if you get what I mean. And I immediately my interpretation of it is I'm not lovable. I'm not enough. There's something wrong with me. I'll never get anywhere. And that becomes the fear that drives me. My trauma wounds that just push me into addiction, push me into infidelity, into lying and cheating and promiscuous. It doesn't matter. I'm just going and going because I keep trying to run away from Hilary. And so you find the drugs and alcohol and you're just like, "Oh god, I feel great." Stops working. A compilation with a lot of trauma stuff because we create a lot of trauma. I set the ball rolling to a lot of my traumas. And I'm not saying bad Hilary, you know, flog myself. I'm just saying it is what it is. That's why it's been so important for me as an adult in sobriety, sober, soundness of mind, that's what sobriety is about, is learning on to tap into another power that actually is after my own best interest there. And I am... don't take meds anymore. I take nothing for me. 

JULIE: You entered recovery in 1983 long before public conversations that we have today around ADHD and trauma and addiction. So, so what did recovery look like for you back then back in 1983? 

HILARY: Oh my god. But I was a young girl. I was 21. And all I knew is I found a place where I could... I was around, you know, once you get into an into a recovery room, there's a lot of us out there. We're all trying to self-medicate. And I you can see it because you all of a sudden you have a group of friends. You're all on the same wavelength. We used to call it. Remember that? It was like, "Oh yeah, we're on the same wavelength." It's like we're whack jobs, too. We're sober and crazy. That was like so exciting. I found some of my people. I was so crazy. So, I felt like I had found, you know, when I talk about the stabilization, the seeing, tasting, touching, hearing, smelling, all of a sudden I'm in a room full of people and I feel a sense of belonging. Oh my god, finally I feel like I belong somewhere. And I don't I used to describe it that I felt like I was in a roller skating rink going around and around and I couldn't skate and I couldn't get off. That's how I felt. My mind was constantly. And because I just thought I was, we would call yourself a little different, a little special, you know, because there was no... no one talked about any of this. They didn't know that we had some, you know, really there was stuff going on. I thought that I would get sober and I would all of a sudden become calm and it never happened. I was still rapid go. And so then I thought something was wrong with me in sobriety. I guess I'm one of those people that are inconstitutionally incapable being honest with themselves. I would all of a sudden start making, thinking I was just something's wrong with me. I'm maybe I did a little something. Little did I know I was treating my mind because I couldn't quiet it. And I found substances that would do that for a second. And then it started and it started producing more ill than it did health. Meaning friends, family, money, jobs, all these things were dying. And then it stopped working in my brain. And then you tell me to go work in inventory. I can't even write. I can't even sit still to write. I remember that, you know, it took my inventory to like a year and a half because I couldn't focus. I just, you know, and now knowing that, you know. And then I did go the med route and my I remember my sponsor saying, "Hilary, I think if you really focus on doing a proper inventory, like really like emptying your cavern and going to a power other than you, that you may have some calmness and still keep that pizzazz." Because I like the art side of me. I like the gifts that it comes with. You know, I have a writing partner. We're both sober the same. We've been in AA the same amount of time. She has it, too. And so, she has it differently than me. She's like, she'll get really focused and say, "Okay, we're writing the script by tomorrow." And I'm like, "Let's go for it." You know, and she's like, "You're all over the place." And I'm like, "Dude, you are all over the place." But we but it's so funny because we are so likeness of being different. You know, I'm straight, she's gay, she's.. you know. We're just like all over the place, but we're best friends because I get her. I get her. I understand that she'll sit and focus and do it for 19 hours and then sleep for a week. And I'm like, I get you. I know. Yeah. Your head hurts. She goes, "Man, I got to stop." And I'm like, "I know. It's crazy, huh?" I had a bumper sticker on my car that said 'sober and crazy' and I was so proud of it. 

JULIE: Hilary, you've spoken about the inner child work that helped you move from victim to victor. And I was just wanting to ask about how that intersects with ADHD, especially for people who grew up believing these struggles were character flaws rather than a wiring difference. 

HILARY: Yeah, that's the wonderful thing. It's like, oh my gosh, when you're different from your fellows, you know, not just alcoholic because we've already then we glass, they say glass in hand. I've warped my mind. So, it says glass in hand. I haven't even drunk yet. I'm already have a warped mind. And then I have this other issue. My mind's really warped. So, when I think of that, I think, "Oh, does that mean I'm a throwaway?" No, it just means, remember I said I'm a kaleidoscope? Mhm. I literally see different colors than you. So, I started putting on pen and paper when I did my inventory and I started looking at how most of my problems had to do with me not completing things. I caused a lot of problems by not completing lots of problems all the way financially, friends, family, relationships. I just can't follow through. And I thought I was a mess. So, I started looking at the things that I had done that branded me as, you know, wacky, right? And then I started looking at what's if I have a a coin that's got a heads on it, there's got to be a tail on it, right? So, I started looking at the assets of it. Okay? I bring a lot of light into the room, right? I bring a lot of energy into the room. You know, I used to say to my ex-husband, I'm a fire. I used to say, I'm a heart attack and you're flatline. Bingo. So, I started, you know, that's why I always say it's the pony and the horse [ __ ] Like, okay, I most people see [ __ ] and they go, "Oh god, I have to clean it up." I go, "Oh my god, there's a pony close. That means there's a horse close. How exciting." So because of my mind being this way, I can see good things in when most people can't. I can see it beyond what the face value is. That's why I keep trying for new. So I started writing down all the assets I have because of this. And I started to make friends with it because when I'm hating it so much, I'm a victim. Because nobody I know that's a victim is happy. But if I look at the heads and the tail of the coin and I look at the assets, that's a higher vibration. I'm like happier. So I start focusing on this. There's where my victory comes in. It's like, dude, I am special. Instead of, oh, she's extra. She's special. And now it's like, yeah, I am. That's right. Oh, you want to start something? I'll do it. We'll do it in 10 minutes. You know what I mean? I'll do it. And then all of a sudden, I start getting self-worth and self-esteem because it's helping me stabilize. I start looking at the good about me. I'm not a defect of character. I'm not maimed. I'm not crazy. You know what? I am a light of being and I am filled with colors. How lucky am I? So, I start focusing on my positive aspects. And then other people are like, man, you're so great to be around. You're so positive. And I'm like, I know. Isn't that great? And I got to do that by doing my inventory and looking at, yeah, I've done some things as a results of these things, but what if I look at the assets and I start focusing on that instead of the defects of it? Because whatever you think about, you bring about. Absolutely. What if I think about all the great positive aspects of what I have? I'm so grateful and so lucky. I would tell your listeners, I want you to get a piece of paper, write out the things you hate about it, and then I want you to look on the other side of it. Because every... behind every good, there's an evil. Behind every evil, there's a good. So go ahead and look for the positive aspects of it. And I want you to celebrate that. Like it's awesome. I can paint, I can sew, I can dance, I can have podcast, I can be a script supervisor, I can be a nurse, I can be... I wrote a book called The Hope Chest and it's a 80-page book about I want you to be okay with change. Celebrate it. Celebrate new things. I celebrate that as an asset. That's how I become a winner. That's how I become a victor instead of the victim. 

JULIE: I love that. Now, there's a lot of stigma of course that one has to deal with around addiction, but even more so around ADHD when that's part of the picture. So, from decades of recovery and your advocate work, what do you think people misunderstand most about the link between ADHD and addiction? 

HILARY: Well, I think what they, what they miss the most, first of all, if you're going to go into it and start wearing what the world believes as a flaw on your lapel, what you're doing is you're leading with your wound. And the reason why I know for me that I was leading with my wound is because I hadn't made peace with it. It was still outside of myself. That's why I put it on my lapel when I say, "Oh, yeah. Yeah, I have ADHD." Like, first of all, it's nobody's business, right? But sometimes I would say it because I want to see, do you love me now? Do you accept me now? Am I okay in your eyes? Can I continue living? That's really what I'm asking. Because in my mind, I think there's something wrong with me. But that's where making peace with it, making friends with it, seeing the assets with of it. You no longer have to subject yourself. You know, put in that word subject. That's, you know, you become the talk. That's the subject. The subject line is what we're going to talk about. You don't have to subject yourself to being pointed out as flawed because you're already going, I'm good with me. I got it. Oh, well, you know, making friends with yourself is so much more important than letting them, than staying, putting it out there so you can be stigmatized, so you can be ridiculed. Because that's just beating yourself up more. By me accepting. Yes, I'm an alcoholic. Yes, and I have ADHD. Okay. And because I've already made friends with it, I focus on the good parts about it. And because all my childhood, I focused on the negative of it because I was so isolated and different and just too much. And I was so ashamed of who I was. You know what? Nobody's perfect. At least I'm okay with not being perfect. 

JULIE: That's awesome. And it's not just an acceptance. You've gone beyond acceptance. You're actually very comfortable with everything that you've learned in the, your journey. And that comes across very powerfully rather than just accepting, yeah, I'm a bit different and that's the way it's going to be. Love it. I really do love it. Now, you are an international speaker and a trauma-informed guide for other women. You're a commercial actress and model and author and someone with over four decades of lived wisdom. What are you currently working on now? 

HILARY: See this is great you guys. It's so exciting that when you have this, you get to reinvent yourself all the time. How blessed are we, right? So, what am I doing now? I've just finished I have a just finished a couple more e-books. I do speaking engagements. I do a lot of podcasts. I just finished another children's book about being different. Hello. Go figure. What's that called, Hilary? That one is called, it's Slim Katie. It's about a turtle. Ah, awesome. Yeah. And then I have two other children's books. So, Zack the Yak and Zack and Tack Fight. It was fight back, but they don't like that word. So, Are Back. So, I've got, you know, four books that I'm getting published that I'm seeking different publishing houses. So I just like writing. I've realized that life isn't about a finish line. And there is no ending of retired, but I'm not even tired, so I can't retire. That's what I joke around and say. How can I be retired? I'm not even tired. I'm doing books and speaking engagement. I love cracking people's egg. 

JULIE: I love that. And links to everything that you've talked about, they'll be in the show notes, so listeners will be able to dive in and reach out and contact you. Very exciting. For anyone listening who might be struggling with addiction or emotional pain or trauma, what would you most want them to know?

HILARY: First of all, you're not alone, which is pretty 101. And you know, the good news is not everybody is on the same place on the same journey at once. So if you're feeling really down, I want you to know that there's somebody who is no longer in your seat that you took and they can actually help you get out of it. And there's angels everywhere. I call other people like little angels that pop in and go, "Hey, how you doing today?" You know, when that opportunity knocks, open that door and just say, "You know what? I'm having a rough time." It's okay that you're not in a great place because guess what? This too shall pass. And it's and it sucks because when you're in a great place, this too shall pass. So that's when you get to the plate is going, "Okay, buckle up, buttercup. It's going to be a ride." And right now I'm a little... it's my turn in the barrel, as I always say, but I'm not going to be in it forever. And you know, if you need to take a nap, take a nap. That shuts it down like that. Take a nap. You know, they used to tell us that in kindergarten, remember? Are you tired? Do you need a nap? Do you need some water? Are you hungry? Stabilizing. They were stabilizing. Our little kids were all over the place. Stabilizing. So, anyhow, yeah, this is going to pass, my friend. I promise you with all my heart. 

JULIE: They're marvelous words. Thank you so, so much. And on that note, I'd just like to say thank you so much for joining me today. I really appreciate how we managed to deep dive so much into really personal areas of your life. And I really appreciate you sharing that with me and the listeners. So, thank you. 

HILARY: You're welcome. Thank you for inviting me and I had a lovely time meeting you. Thank you.

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Julie Legg

Host
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Jel Legg

Co-host
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Hilary Momberger Powers

Guest