Man: Quest to Find Meaning

Facing the Shadow: A Live Coaching Session on Unveiling Your Hidden Self with Kenny Mammarella De Cruz

• James Ainsworth • Season 1 • Episode 26

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People often meet me at a crossroads in their lives. At a loss or in emotional crisis lacking adequate tools, community or awareness to ‘deal with it like a man’.

Either that, or they’re a success story and even through everything is crossed off their bucket lists, something deeper is stirring inside that wants to come alive. 

I ask the right questions and help things authentically fall together. Then the pennies drop and you become your own authentic man.

Before I tell you how I do this, I’d like to tell you why I do it. This comes from personal experience.

I came from dramatic beginnings: death threats, refugee camps, paternal abandonment, maternal enmeshment, childhood mental health issues and racism.

I moved to London and became a high-flying adrenaline junkie. Tight deadlines, extreme sports, anything that might distract me from the pain and emptiness I held deep within. I realised that in order to free myself, I had to own my shadows and release the depressed ‘pause buttons’ from the past that kept me stuck in the same old story. So I sat with my shadows and unlearned my limiting stories, turning addictive adrenaline into an enlivening endorphin buzz that I calmly share with my clients.

Be the love ~ Share the love - Kenny

https://www.themanwhisperer.co.uk/private-sessions

www.mensgroups.co.uk

https://www.themanwhisperer.co.uk/accredited-menfacilitate-training

Today's episode. We demonstrate shadow work. Through an in-depth coaching session. We look at the role of the ego. The inner protector. And we look at how emotional reactions. Often stem from unresolved childhood experiences. Such as feelings of neglect. Or unworthiness. Welcome to Man Questifying Meaning, where we help men navigate modern life, find their true purpose, and redefine manhood. I'm your host, James, and each week, inspiring guests share their journeys of overcoming fear Embracing vulnerability and finding success. From experts to everyday heroes. Get practical advice and powerful insights. Struggling with career, relationships or personal growth? We've got you covered. Join us on Man Quest to Find Meaning. Now, let's dive in.

James Ainsworth:

If you breathe into an uncomfortable feeling and follow that feeling back, it will take you into your dark shadow where a pause button is depressed in your past. which needs feeling and healing. This will release it, as well as what might be in the gold shadow in the present. Opening up to the future. So this is a statement that Kenny gave me. Can you explain a bit more Kenny?

Kenny De Cruz:

Rather than explaining. So we demonstrate it.

James Ainsworth:

Can do

Kenny De Cruz:

practical. Let's go from the head into here. And now did you, have you had any uncomfortable feelings recently? Anything that's come up?

James Ainsworth:

It's funny you say that yesterday. Yes, the last few days I've had, probably yesterday, I realized that I've been having shadows coming up but never really clicked till yesterday. And it's down, this is going to be straight into the vulnerability side of things. I've, for years, and I still do quite a bit now, have, I've always had problems when approaching women, especially women I like. And Quite often, when I approach women I like, I tend to freeze, I tend to forget what I was going to say, I shy away, there's that un feeling of unworthiness, and what I've noticed is that, Like the last 24 hours or 24, probably 36 hours. Now there's been occasions where something's happened and I've gone like freezing. I almost come across embarrassed. I almost come across a sense of. I start to feel a little bit weird. Am I a weird person? And that is something I've been working on. Weird, to accept weird as a part of who I am. And so it's these shadows coming up of weirdness, of not feeling worthy of yeah. But I know there's gold in there.

Kenny De Cruz:

Wow. So this is live right now. If you breathe into it and just feel it back here and now. It sounds to me, I've got to work with this so much with men. If there's a woman that they like, it's almost like shock or panic or they turn into scared little boys or something. If you feel into it and you breathe and you follow the feeling back, where or when does it take you?

James Ainsworth:

Takes you back to what always comes as a little boy. There's this sense of that boy who's afraid, who almost feels unwanted.

Kenny De Cruz:

And how old were you then? If you follow the feeling back, when can you see around you what's going on? Around six?

James Ainsworth:

Six. Yeah. Around about six.

Kenny De Cruz:

And what was going on for him?

James Ainsworth:

I think it was more, I feel as though. The child then was like being a little bit neglected, nobody was coming to him. I don't know the exact situation, but tuning into my inner child is a sense that he feels as though he's not getting his needs met. He feels lost. He feels lonely. He feels unloved.

Kenny De Cruz:

Thankfully, this isn't about the facts. The facts don't come into it, this is about the feelings. And you followed your feeling back and you've taken me to a place where it feels like you were vulnerable and maybe invisible or neglected or not noticed or not protected, not cherished, not taken into consideration. And the details don't really matter right now. What matters right now is you've taken me to a place, a very real place. And it feels like you've built on this place. And I wonder what this place has to do with women. And it might be that you wanted the care or the nurture from your mother. And it sounds like this comes up more from being around women than men. But some people it's both, but some people it's men, but some people it's, I don't know, social climbing, famous men, businessmen, God knows what. What would you say that boy needs? He

James Ainsworth:

just needs some love and attention. To make him feel wanted. To self soothe myself. Hug myself, kind of thing. And allow that inner child to feel that he is wanted. And that he is needed. And yeah, he exists. There's a big one. He exists.

Kenny De Cruz:

He

James Ainsworth:

exists. There we go.

Kenny De Cruz:

Wow. And I'd say there might be another part to it. Firstly, he's not invisible. He exists. Secondly, he needs to feel safe. Surely.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

And right here and right now, I would say that you are the man who can be with the boy, probably the only adult that he can rely on to always be here. So he is safe.

And

Kenny De Cruz:

for me, that can literally happen in a breath. And maybe try this, just take a deep breath in and feel where you feel him in your body right now. And all you need to say, brilliant. And what I do is all I need to say is all right, I'm here. Don't need to explain anything, don't need to engage him, all he needs to know is he's alright.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

Because you're here. Two things happen there. Firstly, he's safe. Secondly, the man in you is here to make him safe. And with this woman, and with women, I'm guessing that they want to know the man in you. And the man in you is the part of you that's present and connected right here and right now. Yep. Yep. Yep. Not some monkey flashing the cash and twitching muscles or doing somersaults. That's not a man. That's showing off rather than showing up. But with your child safe, the man in you is here, and it's the man in you that can engage with her, with anyone and everyone, and with the world.

James Ainsworth:

Nice like that. It's it feels very empowering. Just before, actually, just before I came on, I allowed myself to step into my King energy. So I already feel empowered from sitting and being in the King energy, but then at the same time here in this moment, it's been able to bring that child self. And have the king, the one who rules your kingdom, the one who is able to do you know the archetypes? Yeah. So work with the warrior, the magician and the lover, and to be able to relay orders down to the rest of the kingdom, but with humility and to honor the child that will soon take over. He is the child, he's the one that brings it up.

Kenny De Cruz:

There's a lot more to it than king, warrior, lover, and magician. Do you want to tap into that kind of stuff? Do you want to do this? This is, these are the sessions that I generally do with people in one on one with one on one clients, which is a little bit different to what I do in groups. But would you like to experience that? And no is fine, if you'd rather not. So

James Ainsworth:

what we'll do first.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah.

James Ainsworth:

Is we'll just, actually no let's go for it. Let's go for it. And then perhaps when we've done it for a few minutes or whatever, we'll connect to your story.

Kenny De Cruz:

Okay how about we throw all structure and everything else out of the window and see what happens And at some stage I'll run through my story.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. If it's relevant. Yeah. That sounds good to me. You're making me feel uncomfortable, but that's good. That's good. That's roll with it. Because sometimes having that kind of idea that having that structure is great. But then sometimes changing a structure around or just completely binning it and making yourself feel uncomfortable is Just as good.

Kenny De Cruz:

And the first step we're going to do is to make you feel comfortable so you know that you're in control. What I'd like you to do, I don't know how wired up you are, is to stand up, go and knock on the door, or touch something, do something, and when you come back I would like to speak to your inner protector, the part of you that's been protecting you.

James Ainsworth:

I think he's already here. Inner protector, okay. You got the inner protector.

Kenny De Cruz:

So you are James's inner protector? I certainly am.

James Ainsworth:

Yep.

Kenny De Cruz:

I'm really pleased to meet you. I need one thing from you before we stop just hanging out and having a chat. The one thing I need from you, as James's inner protector, is that at any stage, During this podcast, our time together, at any stage, if you feel that James is too vulnerable, and you want things to stop, even just for you and I to have a chat, or to stop for good, whatever, you'll simply say stop, and I'll stop. How's that?

James Ainsworth:

I think I can feel the vulnerability already. I can feel the almost like he's going to say stop now. If you want to

Kenny De Cruz:

say stop now, you say stop now. Your job's to protect, James. No,

James Ainsworth:

let's carry on. Let's carry on.

Kenny De Cruz:

Okay. So yeah, safety first. As far as I'm concerned, and it's really interesting the beginning of this conversation I was speaking with James about how he can be in front of women. And then I asked him to follow the feeling back to where things, I called it a depressed pause button where things have stopped. And what he said to me is that at six years old he felt vulnerable, he felt literally that he didn't exist. Is that when you showed up to protect him from that vulnerability? Yeah.

James Ainsworth:

I turned up to attack him when he was roundabout two, when he felt a little bit alone, a little bit vulnerable, a little bit of loneliness.

Kenny De Cruz:

So you showed up at two. And what would you say in a nutshell, your job for James is? What do you do for him?

James Ainsworth:

So I make sure I keep him safe by not allowing him to Go beyond his boundaries because beyond his boundaries is the unknown. It's where fear kicks in. It's where he is stepping out. And I don't know what's going to happen to him. So by keeping him in his boundaries, he is safe. He is safe. He is protected. He is and there I can allow him to be loved.

Kenny De Cruz:

That's quite a job. And you've been doing this for him since he was two years old.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

Wow. Do you like your work?

James Ainsworth:

It's, I feel it's not about liking. It's about protecting. This is my role. Like you might have a role in your work and you might not like your role, but you get on and do the role as best as you possibly can. That's how I feel about it.

Kenny De Cruz:

So really it doesn't matter whether you like it or not. This is what you're here for, and you just do it.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. That's my role. I do it. It's done and dusted.

Kenny De Cruz:

And on a scale of 1 to 10, how in control of his life would you say you are? Six. Where's the other four? Does something else take over, or do you hand over to another part?

James Ainsworth:

James has been on this seven to eight year path of personal growth and spiritual development. And I feel as though by him doing this, he is kind, I am starting to lose quite a lot of control. So the other, that four is the part of him that it's growing and there's so many things which I've tried to protect him, but his stubbornness just kept pushing him and pushing him to go out and grow and to take on and to be a step into the fear,

Kenny De Cruz:

right? What do you think to all of this? Is it working? Is it dangerous? Is it risky? Do you approve

James Ainsworth:

if it was up to me? I would keep him where he is. So just to clarify a little bit here with this session is that he I keep him on the farm. So he's not a huge fan of working on his dad's farm. He wants to quit the farm, but I keep him up the farm simply on the bound, on the idea that he is, exactly what he's going to do is protected. He might not like it, but he is protected and he is safe.

Kenny De Cruz:

Safety first. It sounds like your job is his safety.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. I'm the, I'm not the safe, I'm the safety officer. I'm the one within the the magician who keeps him safe as being the safety officer, which kind of limits his movements.

Kenny De Cruz:

And would you say it limits anything else in his life?

James Ainsworth:

It limits a lot of things, but it keeps him safe. It limits relationships. It limits his way he wants to grow. It limits his progression with regards to life. It limits his ways of purpose. But as I said, he is quite a character in himself and he is starting to really step out. But I'm also seeing that when he does step out, he can quite often be safe anywhere. So I have over the last seven to eight years, I have relinquished a lot of control that I once had. On the grounds that he is, with his growth, he is able to step up and be protected. And also, there is other powers at play here as well, powers bigger than myself. And bit by bit, I am relinquishing a lot of my control.

Kenny De Cruz:

And things are working. He remains safe. He remains protected. He survives. Yeah. And when would you say he's at his happiest?

James Ainsworth:

He's actually at his happiest, actually, when he steps out. Which is why I'm starting to relinquish a lot of my control. And it's mainly not because he is pushing me away, because I feel as though he is almost working with me, rather than against me. And I'm able to protect him where I can. And it is idea that with regards to life, generally, I do feel he has a purpose bigger than himself. And he is stepping into that. And he is safe.

Kenny De Cruz:

Would you say that You and his purpose, his stepping out, his alignment with himself, his passion with life is in alignment. Or would you say there's a tension there? Because I wonder whether this could be made easier, more efficient, calmer.

James Ainsworth:

I feel as though at this moment in time, there is a little bit of a, there's quite still a little bit of resistance now over the last eight years, eight years ago, he had lots of resistance. He had lots of limiting beliefs. He had lots of things going on, but over the last eight years. 78 years with his growth, he has been able to work through a lot of this resistance with limiting beliefs. And he's come to a point where there's a few odd things here and there. And I suppose the one key area, which I try to keep in the safe the most is in relationships because he has been hurt quite a few times. And it's this idea that if he's able to really step out, if he steps out too much, He gets burned.

Kenny De Cruz:

Okay. How well do you know the man in him?

James Ainsworth:

Not very well, but enough to relinquish through in my control.

Kenny De Cruz:

So you trust the man in him, the two of you work together and get on?

James Ainsworth:

He hasn't shown me not to trust him, so I trust him enough not to put too much control in front. But the idea that he has so, with what's been going on recently, he has really stepped out, but he's never been in a place of complete unsafety. So I trust him enough to know that he has the, he has myself and the inner child back.

Kenny De Cruz:

Interesting you say that. Because I wondered whether when you're around the child is surviving, and when he's around, the child feels safe. And the reason I say that is you showed up to take care of the child. in the absence of an adult. And therefore, the two of you, you're going to keep that child as safe as you can surviving. Your job is survival. Though, I wondered about when he shows up, he is an adult, and if he's taking care of the child, then survival's over. And because that job is done, which was your core job, I wondered whether your skills could be used rather than surviving the present and past, but more informing the present and what might be letting him grow into a bigger life because you've got skills. I bet you've got really sharp skills where you know what's going to happen, you know if there's danger, you know if something's going to kick off, you can read the room, you can read the energy etc, because you probably had to do that to make sure that he was safe from the age of two to date. Those are fine skills. And those skills can be adapted for his growth. How do you feel about that?

James Ainsworth:

It's funny you say that because there's a idea that Deep down, I know that there's big changes going on, and I can connect to the big changes and know that sometimes I can be in the way. And it's a sense that I'm able to sometimes take a step back and allow the other part to take over, the James, the B and the, his soul to take over. And Sometimes, yes, I do, I feel a little bit neglected as a safety officer because he's taken charge and I've lost my role. So maybe, yes, there's a more of a way that I can take more of a back step back and I can, I'm able to then connect to that inner child when the inner child needs me for a safety purpose. And in a sense that. he's started to change his idea around fear, because now he started to see fear, not necessarily as a bad thing, but as the unknown. And so I'm starting to be able to relinquish my control on that too.

Kenny De Cruz:

Very interesting. It feels like we're meeting at the right time. If you're questioning these things, there's one more thing I want to run by you. I've got a hunch that you and That boy from the age of two, from the age of six, that boy in childhood who was invisible and didn't quite exist, was neglected or unseen, have a couple of things in common. And for you, I wonder whether you realize that if it wasn't for you protecting him and taking care of him all these years, that he wouldn't have survived. His survival is down to you.

James Ainsworth:

Thank you for saying

Kenny De Cruz:

that. How

James Ainsworth:

does that

Kenny De Cruz:

feel? Breathe it in.

James Ainsworth:

It feels good to know that I have protected the boy when he needed me the most and it takes almost sometimes a bigger man or a bigger person to take a step back when he knows his job has been done and to allow something bigger to carry on the role, but being able to stay in the background. in case there's a sense of need.

Kenny De Cruz:

Spot on. Absolutely spot on. The first thing that I need to do is acknowledge you for what you've done. And that job is well done because he survived and is on the edge of growth and really stepping into who he is. And the second thing you said straight away there, which is personally, I wouldn't want you to go anywhere because if for any reason the shit hits the fan or like in the cartoon, suddenly a piano falls from the sky, then without any hesitation, I would expect you to take over at the drop of a hat, move them from the falling piano or whatever the danger is, and he's safe again. If that's your job, that's your job. When there's danger.

James Ainsworth:

Thank you.

Kenny De Cruz:

But, or maybe I should get my butt out of your face and say and. And. In his progress, I feel that you would be the most perfect advisor of, as he moves forward, as he's faced with a new person, a woman, a work thing, a social thing, whatever comes up in front of him in his life. that he listens to you and you advise him, trust this one, say this, don't say that, don't trust that one, turn right, don't turn left, stop for a minute and just think before you make this decision, whatever it is that you have to say in that moment, that you advise him. And he hears you. And to me, with your skills, knowing him, knowing the way he's wired and where he's coming from, and clearly having his best interests at heart, because your job is his safety and your protection of him, who'd be better to advise him as he grows? And how valuable would that be?

James Ainsworth:

I feel as though you're right. I am an invaluable asset to James and to the, as I call him little to Jimmy, I call him. And it's more along the lines that, yeah I'm here if he needs me kind of thing.

Kenny De Cruz:

Then how will you know if he needs you? Because I feel that you're literally going to hand Jimmy over to the men. So he's just, Safe. And that job is done. And then you can be free to advise James. as he moves into a bigger, better life.

James Ainsworth:

It's not necessarily about when will I know, I almost feel like there needs to be a partnership between me and James, his true being, the truest thing, a partnership where he knows His role, I know my role, and there's got to be a sense of intertwined ness, that's the word, intertwined ness between us both, where certain situations might require James more, whereas certain situations, May require me more, but it's not for me also. It's not about taking full control. Like you should do this, and this it's about me saying, okay, go into a little boy and saying, okay, we need to do, this is a, this is what I'm suggesting. We need to do this and then allowing. The boy or James to take the necessary steps, but creating a fully wedded relationship,

Kenny De Cruz:

let me see if I've got this right. And there might be some things that I say that might be a little bit different to yours. So hear me out and then correct me at the end, because this is really important the way that this is set up. So it all fits and works together. And. You are in alignment, your all the different parts are in alignment, not just within James, but also with life, the way that life wants to meet him and leave him, lead him forward. So my take on this as well as what I'm hearing, is that you literally hand Jimmy over to the man because then Jimmy's no longer surviving. Jimmy's safe and he can just play or. be part of nature. Or, for me, a safe in a child is the closest part to inspiration, or to God, or to nature, or to love, or to guidance, or however you want to put it. So with Jimmy Safe, it's almost like there's spiritual connection. And with James, the man in the middle, he's got that spiritual guidance. He's got your guidance. which is worth its weight in gold because you know him inside out and it's logical and it's safety and it's linear and it's exactly what he needs to guide him. With these two, he can be present in the center, attract what life will bring him, and he'll listen and be able to respond, be able to take a step in or a step out or a step forward or stay still, know what to say or what to do. But with The committee and who knows who else right now is on the committee on side, then James can be present and your job with the child, unless there's real danger is literally done and your job with his growth. is literally just beginning. But this means that James is in the center, and either you'll take over if there's real danger, or he'll listen to you all the time, or he'll hand over to you if it's a job that he knows is yours. Like he might hand over to the part of him that works on the farm, or the part of him that plays pool, or the part of him that has a hobby, or the part, different parts for different things. How does that feel? Is that about right? Or did I take over or get it wrong?

James Ainsworth:

That feels right, but also wrong. It feels as though the child, yes, needs to be in the center. But there has to be an ounce of, rather than allowing the child to say, Okay, you need to take over.

Kenny De Cruz:

Oh no, not Jimmy. Jimmy's safe. It's James, the man who's in the center. Okay. Jimmy's just playing with Love and nature and freedom and, seeing the beauty in everything and attracting the goodness of life. That's what free spirited children do. No job for the child. Child is safe and free.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah, I think there's a time and a place for me to also to be able to grow and evolve. And this is, I feel, almost my time, it's almost my time to do that, so that I can help the collective James to achieve what's on his purpose in this moment, in this life, in this world. Because I feel as though, With regards to the past and towards other lives, there's been a big shift in how the human race has changed over the last 20, 30 years. And it's time for us to change our narrative, to change how we communicate, to how we can help those to grow into the people who will lead this world and take the steps necessary to help this planet thrive. Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

How does it feel to say that?

James Ainsworth:

Feels good. It feels good to know that we are on the forefront of change, big change. And it's a sense that we, as a collective, as in safety officers of people who are at the forefront at this moment in time, can help. Children who are going soon to come into this world to feel safer.

Kenny De Cruz:

And I feel very often this is where purpose comes into the picture. Your purpose started with Jimmy. And James's purpose, I feel, will continue to take care of kids like Jimmy. Kids like Jimmy. Won't have to go through what Jimmy went through. And very often for me, I find that the people I work with, their purpose is putting something right for others that wasn't right for them. So I feel you've gone full circle here and that just feels good inside.

I feel

Kenny De Cruz:

like present in my body and safe and satisfied listening to you hear that I feel that the way that your mind works so quickly reacting to what might happen or what is happening, all of this is so valuable and so quick as information for the man in James to receive. So he can listen, evaluate, take a breath and choose how to respond. It's like you carry on reacting and operating at the speed of light and let him ground everything you have to say and respond. listening and being in touch with everything. So it feels like we're at a stage now where it's time to build a bridge between you and the man in James. So the two of you know how to work together. And something that James read out right in the beginning was I feel what we've done, which is I've met you in James's Dark Shadow in the past, where there was unfinished business with being invisible, neglect, etc. Being unnurtured, unprotected, uncherished. And now that pause button can be released, because we know it. We felt it. And we're literally taking Jimmy from there, and putting him with an adult, to Perpetually be safe and loved and cherished and seen and nurtured and just be able to play, just to I don't know, fly around the Garden of Eden or whatever it is that to be in bliss, to be in love. So with this work in literally doing that, it's opening up the gold shadow, because can you imagine how much love this inner work can bring? James can bring with a free spirited child into the world. It's not doing fixing. It's being loving. And I feel this is the alchemy that we can do now. Now, what I need you to do initially is to support the man in being present, because he will be used to you taking over and you being in charge. And he needs to be used to being present and connected all the time.

This,

Kenny De Cruz:

maybe this could be seen as trickery. It's not meant to be seen as trickery. After you've supported him and he knows to take his place, I don't want you to trust him unless he has proved that he will always be here. It's not your job to mollycoddle him and take care of him. It's his job to take his place so he can work with you and you can work with him. He needs to prove that he'll be here all the time. Now, the way to bring him in is literally, as soon as you notice that you're in charge and he's not here, is literally to take a deep breath in, get in your body, get into the ground, And be present, and as you breathe in, you feel little Jimmy, and as you breathe out, you hand him the child, and you say, get on with it, I'm by your side. So you're here, your breath is inviting him in. Would it be fair to say that you live in James's head?

James Ainsworth:

Yes. I'm the head, and I must admit, he, there's a sense now that he is here more often than he wasn't a year ago.

Kenny De Cruz:

What we're looking for is every moment. Simple as that. It's the only option. It's not an option that Jimmy, for one moment, is not being protected, or is not feeling safe. So he needs to be here at every moment.

And

Kenny De Cruz:

also, with him here every moment, then life can happen. Because I know in my life life would bring me all sorts of good, bad, and ugly things. But I was off in my head, being attached to how I want things to be, and I didn't even notice the goodness that life brought until I got here. I made this change in my life, and then I chose what to engage with and what not. And if he's not here in every moment, then we're going to go to an old script of, no women, no love. Bob Marley, wasn't it?

James Ainsworth:

singing.

Kenny De Cruz:

And also the drudgery of life of what has to be done, rather than the joy in life of having an attitude of living a bigger, better, more fulfilling life. So we're going to flip that. So it's literally breathe in. include yourself in the mind, because he lives in all of your body and is grounded right here and right now, not just in alignment with himself, but in alignment between heaven and earth. So one breath, and that's how powerful your breath can be. And you're here and he's back and the child is safe.

So

Kenny De Cruz:

far, does anything not fit? Do you have any questions? And how does this feel?

James Ainsworth:

No, it feels powerful. It feels liberating. It's a sense that he's able to, I'm able to be present to be in the moment, to be that sense of purpose, that drive. And is this a feeling of complete power in the inside myself? And there's a sense of warrior like, ah, kind of thing. But also the, there's the intuition, there's the connecting to the emotions, the lover. And obviously I'm using the archetype series, but yeah, it's just connective, collective to all.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah. It's a much bigger picture than you and surviving Jimmy against the world. It's seriously. Congratulations for a job well done.

James Ainsworth:

Thank you.

Kenny De Cruz:

That chapter, that hard work for how many years, you've done it, and that chapter is over. And good on you. That was a lot of work. Relentless. You're not kidding. This reminds me, before moving on, this reminds me of one thing. I remember when we first spoke on the phone. I said to you that my first home in the UK was in Eccleshawn in a refugee camp. Yesterday was our 52nd anniversary of landing in the UK and being taken to Eccleshaw. And I remember it was less than 10 years ago because I would phone my mother because my father wasn't there. He was supposed to be killed. So it was my mother, brother and I phoned my mother and I said, happy refugee anniversary. And she said, we survived. And for the first time in my life. In my fifties, I heard her words, we survived and I could feel it in my body that we have survived and I can stop that battle and I feel that I'm in a very similar place to you right now is you survived. And that chapter is over. It's done. Amazing. And now it's time to live.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. I can feel it. I can. And this is, the last 39 years have led to this point here. Where now it's Linguishing control to just step into something, a purpose bigger, something bigger than ourself.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah.

James Ainsworth:

Something where it's something ginormous. And that's the power of being able to work with these parts. So work with the shadow.

Kenny De Cruz:

Your job has never been boundaries. That's not a protector's job. It's the man's job to have boundaries and boundaries is where men meet women, men meet men meet life, men meet everything. It's this is where we meet. And now where shall we go? It's like an initial meeting and then the merry dance of life. So There's a whole new dimension going to open up from here, and with your help, James can do this. In fact, I believe he's been aching to live into this, and we'll put things in order to make it happen. Unless you have any questions or anything else to say, take your time sitting here, but when you're ready, go and knock on that door or kick the bin or whatever you did, and I'll speak with James again.

James Ainsworth:

How are you? Feels good. Feels really good. Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

I so respect your protector. And I could see the way he changed from the beginning when we first met to the end. He changed his arms were out. He was present. He was alive. When we first met, it was almost like I have to survive this shit. I have to work on the farm. It's like perpetual groundhold day, but he changed and he seems really up for it.

James Ainsworth:

It felt very much like he was up for a challenge. And there's a sense that obviously within challenges, that's where the growth. And our growth happens the most. And it's this sense that from my own perspective, it's there. So then I've done quite a bit of shadow work people and stuff. And it's it's so powerful to be able to connect to these parts of ourselves that have been there to serve us, but sometimes we see it more as it's restrictive and it almost come, it can be keeps us. almost locked away sometimes until we are able to have that conversation with these deeper parts to say that, you, your job's done, your role's done. Now you can grow into it. You have, you can let go of control. You can allow these parts to really step in to Allow something to something else to take some of the burden. When he sees the burden.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah, and I would say it's very male and to be respected that men need to know and understand first. Because there has to be safety first.

I

Kenny De Cruz:

wouldn't say the female mind is like that, but the women that I work with, they don't always have to know anything, everything. And it's just different traits, different hormones, who knows what. But to know and to have that safety first, and I would say most men fear humiliation and abandonment more than anything, from when they were boys. So to have this structure, and then to have the experience of it enables and empowers them to move on. And your protector earlier on said power. And I really liked the way he said power, because I could see that he was in power in his old role, and moving into his new role. But that was in power, with the willingness. Almost felt like the yearning to empower other people rather than the boy way or the fair way, which is power over other people. And that's detail is so important. And for me, that's the difference between a boy and a man. A boy often comes from fear and survival, and it's all competition, where a man can come from love and living and collaboration. He knows when to pass the ball, he knows when to score. A man can come from feeling his feelings and meeting other people, where a boy can't afford to feel feelings. It's all keep it on the surface. No one will hold me. No one will meet me. It's like you and Jimmy. It was all the, all of that, but save it up because we need to survive. And maybe once we've survived and it's safe enough, then things can all unpack and it's all doing where the feeling feelings and being with other people at that depth, that's very men. And for me, traits that make a man, strangely, are having access to the masculine and the feminine traits. The ability to respond is more feminine, react is more masculine. One isn't good and the other one's bad. They're both necessary. The ability to listen is more feminine, where boys make a lot of noise. And sadly, bad parenting in the old days would be to humiliate and abandon a boy to break them into good behavior, because the noise is inconvenient. These days, that still goes on, but it's putting them in front of the screen, and then they get programmed by all of these things, and they're used to being in front of the screen rather than around other people. Ah, time to move on.

James Ainsworth:

What I'm suggesting here is that, would you be willing to do a second part?

Kenny De Cruz:

I would like to do a little bit more now. Yeah. So this is complete.

James Ainsworth:

Okay.

Kenny De Cruz:

And then let's see. Because otherwise, we're half arsed.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. Okay, in that case Let's come back to your story another time. Yeah. Let's go a little bit deeper into what it, what does it mean to be a healthy man?

Kenny De Cruz:

Rather than the theory of it. Go and knock on the door or something, and I'll speak to the man in you, or the man emerging in you, and let's find out.

James Ainsworth:

Okay, let's do that, and

Kenny De Cruz:

Are you the man in James?

James Ainsworth:

I certainly am.

Kenny De Cruz:

I've been waiting to meet you. And James almost suggested we did it another time, but no, I want to meet you now. Here I am. How is it with you taking care of the child? Because I spoke to James's protector. about him handing the child over to you. And it was very clear that the child was in his heart. And I said, look, when is with the man, then it's like, you can say it's all right. I'm here. The child's just free and you're present. Was I being presumptuous or is that about right for you?

James Ainsworth:

For me, there's a sense of being present in the body, but sometimes I have noticed in the past. Maybe not now. There was a kind of a battle between heart and head and so being able to switch and to become present enough to be able to drop into the heart is the key, I feel, to being the man, to stepping into your power, to, to having a bigger purpose, to, To interacting with other people, other beings, whatever you want to call them. And it's a sense that within the heart space. That is where expansion happens within the heart. This is where love originates.

Kenny De Cruz:

Do you feel that now?

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. I thought it's, it feels very liberating to be able to feel that expansion, to feel that, that bliss, that, that love, that connection, that sense of wisdom, which comes from here and to be able to be in that place of. Growth. Expansion.

Kenny De Cruz:

Can I invite you to change one word from what you've said? Unless I'm wrong with this. Because the way that I feel you now, and the way that you're saying this, it's not that, it's this. Because I'm feeling it with you right here and right now.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah, that feels powerful. This. This.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah. You are here, right here and right now. Not only can I feel you as the man in James, but I can feel safety. I can feel love. I can feel grounded. I can feel presence. I can feel an expansion. This feels great. And what you said in the beginning about the head and the heart is I can feel you coming from your heart. And I can feel that you can listen to the protector who's in charge of the head. So you have access to that rather than being distracted and overtaken by the head or handing over to the protector. How does it feel to you? Because what I said to the protectors, what I'd like from you is just to be here all the time, which is an invitation to feel this bliss. And this presence and this love all the time, and you can listen to him and you can follow spirit because the child is safe and you're here all the time.

James Ainsworth:

Feels very empowering, very connected, interconnected as we are all one. And it's almost that. connection within the heart, within our our growth, our destination, our destiny. There's a collective power. And so by being present, by being in the body, you are able to connect to people on a more deeper level.

Kenny De Cruz:

I have another suggestion with a change in words. I wonder whether your we is more of an I.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah, okay.

Kenny De Cruz:

The reason I say that as well is when I do, then I notice that those around me also do.

James Ainsworth:

I.

Kenny De Cruz:

But when I say we, then I'm almost saying we all need to do it. And it's a need to in the future, rather than are doing it now.

James Ainsworth:

I. Yeah. Powerful.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah. And what I heard so strongly in the beginning of my time with James today was how he was literally invisible. And I know that in my experience, I've been doing my work for almost 30 years now, when people move into I and me. They exist. You so exist. Your presence is lovingly, calmly, powerful. You exist. And I bet that women would like you and will be able to engage with you. Where they wouldn't quite know what to do with the protector.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. I can feel within my heart space the words, I exist. And there's a sense of, I can feel the power. The expansive, my body is just, I'm upright. I am expansive kind of thing. And my whole body posture has changed.

Kenny De Cruz:

This isn't pretend. This is so real. This is literally as real as it gets and with you existing like this, you're available to life and you're available to love and what I said earlier on to James is as the man in James, it's your job to have boundaries, which means it's your job to meet life. And to choose how to engage in the merry dance of relationship in life with everyone and everything. Where, what I heard James protector say, is it was his job to keep him away from life. So life doesn't hurt him and he can survive life. In meeting life, I wonder whether you can check in or listen to the protector. So whatever he has to say is heard, then his job is done. Because I believe if he doesn't feel heard, he'll take over. He'll stop breathing. If there's no breathing, he's back. If there's breathing, he's back. You're here. He's a damn good guy with incredible skills. All I need for you to do is three things. Breathe yourself present so the child is safe. Listen to your protector so you're aware. And then choose how to love in the moment. How does that feel?

James Ainsworth:

It feels powerful. I can feel the shift those words. Yeah, I can feel the shift of my energy just through them words themselves and the words I exist.

Kenny De Cruz:

Yeah. Is there anything you would like to ask or say or anything? Take your time.

James Ainsworth:

The power within is the ability to love on a much deeper level, a deeper scale than I have ever been able to love. There's a sense of intertwinedness between myself and the people are and the people around me, which just give us that connection, that deep, loving connection and to be able to breathe into The body, that is love, and there's a sense that we, as I, have chased love and have always searched for it, but never really found it. But now, there's a sense now that all the love I need's inside, and whoever is meant to come into my life will come into my life at the right time, and they, I, will receive that love. and me theirs.

Kenny De Cruz:

This is so clear and powerful. And in my experience true, because my protector allowed me to chase love, but not accept love because of a fear that if I accept it and it goes away, I may not be able to survive. And my protector allowed me to give love. But if I received love. that would be too vulnerable.

The man in

Kenny De Cruz:

me allows me to be love and share love and live in love. And however I am inside is reflected on the outside. It's not I need to chase and fix or anything out there. I'll do it inside. Let's see, and I remember when it was time for me to meet the woman of my dreams and I did the sensible thing, or the basic thing of this is way before online dating, or maybe it was around, I didn't know. And I wrote my checklist of my ideal woman, and right at the top was very sensible. I thought of me or was on a journey of self-awareness and able to communicate. Because I've seen so many relationships come a cropper, where there is no communication, there is no self awareness, she will carry on, or he will carry on, however they are. And one on a path and one not can be very frustrating and painful and not always lost. I Had my list and I went into the happy hunting ground and I noticed the women that I attracted and the temptation was off the scale the most wonderful perfect plan B first reserve women and it's like how could I let this woman go if I want The perfect one for me, but maybe there's no such thing and I should be with this one. And I carried on changing something in myself or seeing in myself, where am I stuck? What do I need to unlearn? What do I need to let go of? How do I get myself in alignment? And then I met her. And it was very old fashioned courting. It took six months for the first kiss. It took, and I've been, we've been together now 21 years. It took, I think, 12 years before she asked me to marry her. We had no intention of marrying because we'd never seen any marriages that really worked the way that we wanted it to. But we've been married for about just over 10 years now. But it was all about me getting myself in alignment and changing me. inside, not let me be a different trick or act. It's what's not true. What needs to shift and get an alignment and to set myself free to have not just access to love for me to take it much further and to get a little cosmic is how much can I be? And the more I can be, the more access I have to energy, to life, to God, to whatever you want to call it. The more access I have to life and to love. And I feel this already with you is since I met you to now, the way that you've just settled and landed and the way that you are speaking, there's just a calm, loving presence.

James Ainsworth:

Feel that. I can feel the, yeah. It's a, the, it was the relaxed, calm, or even looking at my picture, I can see it. It's a small screen in the corner. Just the body posture is, the shoulders are down. I'm upright. Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

And your lips almost want to grin or smile, but you're holding it back, which just, which shows personality and life. That's charming. That's intriguing. That's playtime. That's just love beaming. How does your child feel?

James Ainsworth:

He feels safe and secure, he feels happy, he feels, he's playing, he feels like I can see him playing with a ball, running around, as a child does.

Kenny De Cruz:

That is success. There's no fear, there's no survival. What does your protector think to everything right now?

James Ainsworth:

He's happy, he's quiet, he's And behind him, he's at the back, but not, he's not forgotten. He's very much, he's doing, it feels as though he's doing what he can do. And watch with a smile on his face.

Kenny De Cruz:

Wonderful. I feel that we've done the doing and it's job done. Yeah. Unless there's anything else you want to say or ask?

James Ainsworth:

No. For me it feels the right point.

Kenny De Cruz:

Great. So Do you want to go and kick that bucket or whatever and come back and I'll speak with James?

James Ainsworth:

Yeah.

Okay.

Kenny De Cruz:

Cool. Yeah,

James Ainsworth:

that feels good. That feels

Kenny De Cruz:

I'd rather the practical and living it than the theory and talking about it or selling it. And here we are, and this feels fucking wonderful.

James Ainsworth:

That's it. I think sometimes you can listen to podcasts and they give all the words and stuff, but then there's nothing But people can actually do or take away sometimes from podcasts. So I feel as though this is just right. And I feel as though it'd be good to do sessions with other people similar to this so that they can witness there and then the impact that people can have.

Kenny De Cruz:

Absolutely. Totally. I remember that it's Lawrence John who put us in contact from the mankind project.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah. Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

And I remember I did, I've been holding men's groups for, I've been saying 25 years for a few years. So it's probably more than 25 years because I'm not very good at counting. And then in 2005, I did the new warrior training adventure. Because more than anything, I wanted to check that I'm not some megalomaniac blagger. And it's all about me and my power and that the work that I'm doing with men is in alignment. I went and did it, but the big, the first freak out was that in order to get to the site, which was just, I think it begins with a K, it's up the road from you and it's a scout place or something. Kebbleston. Kebbleston. That's where I did it.

James Ainsworth:

Kebbleston, yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

Kibblestone.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

I remember that on the way there, we were near Eccleshaw. We didn't go past it, but I saw the signs and that gave me the heebie jeebies. And then we literally drove past a house on where it begins with a W and it's a roundabout and there's a post office. And that was where I lived for a short time between refugee camps and had the most horrendous time of my life. So before even getting to Kibblestone, I was triggered by refugee camp, I was triggered by trauma, I was triggered by so many things that fucked me up. And I got to the site, a raw gibbering wreck, before anything even started. So it's great that, that brought us together, and here we are.

James Ainsworth:

Yeah, I did the warrior, new warrior training in 2022, and I think it was November 2022. And I need to go back and actually help by assisting other people. I'd love to do that next year, possibly. Cool. Talkable. Yeah.

Kenny De Cruz:

So what would you like to know, or do, or talk about before we end this podcast episode? And thank you so much for having me on as a guest.

James Ainsworth:

Absolute pleasure. So let's finish off by just telling people what, actually, what you do. What do you do?

Kenny De Cruz:

I am strangely an agony uncle, so men write in with their problems to the eyepaper and every Monday there's a question and answer online. Every Tuesday, usually I'm on page 35. I've been holding men's groups for, I've been holding mixed groups for 28, 29 years, men's groups, probably 26, 27, 25. I don't know. I started holding men's groups because I was away from the UK for five years. I moved to Fiji where I did work in development. I sat with the elders in villages and islands. I worked with Mother Teresa in Calcutta with dying men. I had an actual health centre in Sydney. It's then that I started holding men's groups, travelled the world, had lots of adventures, came back to the UK and my friends. Turned into fuckwits. So I got them in the room, about 16 of them, I think it was. And I basically said, you used to be my best friends. Now you're a bunch of fuckwits because you're distracted by drink, drugs, sex, power, money, love, addiction, God knows what's going on, but I need to be met at some depth. I don't know what a men's group is, but we're starting one now. You're all in it and I'll still come raving, but I need more. And that's how it all started. And then people heard about it and people heard about it. I took it out of my lounge. I got ground rules together and everything. And it's just grown and grown over the years. So it's been many years that I've been holding live. open groups and closed groups in London. And then I started with what do you call them, online groups. And just before the UK went on lockdown I was in a West End show, my friends girlfriend, now wife, was the star of this amazing musical. So we watched that, my wife, some friends. On the way back, I got a text from the guy who did, who filmed and organized my online training, Adrian. Was it's his partner and I've got an online training to train people how to communicate with men and hold men's groups and use various tools. So it was his partner and another guy texted me saying I've got the symptoms. You might have COVID isolate. So I isolated, I was working on zoom third floor flat in London, working on zoom day and night. And I noticed that I kept looking out of the window and expecting to see the military. And I noticed that I kept listening and it's like I was listening, when you hear the fridge go off and you realize it, I was listening for the gunfire to come back because I thought the silence was between gunfire and I was having strange feelings in my body. And then I realized that I was triggered back to when I was in Africa, when my family were on the death list with Idi Amin. And there was curfew and there was a lot of military. on street corners, people weren't allowed to stop and talk to each other. And we lived near Idi Amin, and there was a lot of gunfire. And we had to go into hiding, we had death threats. So I was triggered back to then, the day we went on lockdown, I started online groups. And they've been on every day ever since. And The thinking behind that, because a lot of my friends and clients have been to boarding school or detention or locked in their room or whatever the trauma was, and I thought people are going to be triggered. And if men can speak things out, they're not going to lash out on other people or lashing on themselves. So people need to speak things out. So either I Or people who I've trained hold these groups every day online, just go to mensgroups. co. uk and people basically hang out, be heard and get real about what's going on in life. And it's brilliant. So I've been holding those groups every day. I just launched a training, I'll do another one next year for men and women who are leaders of men or therapists, coaches organizational psychologists, whoever wants to learn the tools and it's online and live. So at 60, at the tender age of 60, cue you saying, Oh my God, you don't look 60.

James Ainsworth:

Okay, you didn't look 60, sorry.

Kenny De Cruz:

Thank you. Now that I'm 60, it's clearly time for me to just share my tools. Whether people want to hold groups, or work with men, or lead better lives, it's here are my tools, take it all. And that's NICE's my mission now. Yeah. I've got a lot of clients. Very powerful. Go to London and it's just so much fun because for so many years I just held groups and I didn't tell people my thinking behind why this and why not that and how, and whatever. But now to be able to share my toys with everyone, it's that I get better company. And the, it's exactly what you said earlier. It's preparing for a better, caring, sharing world beyond the separation and destruction that I feel we are going through and will continue to go through. And things need to fall apart before they fall together. Yeah. I agree. And we're in the fall apart stage and we can hold it together with love. With exactly what you did in this last hour, this is how to hold it together by being present and connected and here we are.

So

Kenny De Cruz:

in a nutshell, that's parts of my story and what I do. And I, my, my public face. is really quite shit because I don't really do social media. My profiles are probably crap because I'm just I love people. I'm not really great with all of that, but what's my web address? themanwhisperer. co. uk Yeah, probably. And I'll get someone on the whole social media stuff to tidy it up at some stage. I'll

James Ainsworth:

add the links to the the bio which is the description of the podcast. But yeah, thank you very much, Kenny. And thank you very much for the coaching session.

Kenny De Cruz:

My pleasure.

James Ainsworth:

Absolutely. Absolutely. Incredible. So thank you very much.

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James Ainsworth

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