The Restaurant Guys

TEASER! John Scharffenberger: Winemaker to Chocolatier

• The Restaurant Guys • Episode 100

Share episode

This is a Vintage Selection from 2007

The Conversation

The Restaurant Guys talk with John Scharffenberger about his premium line of chocolate which is the first “bean to bar” chocolate made in the United States. John talks about the history, sourcing and the crucial details in creating some of the finest chocolate in the world!

The Inside Track

The Guys were fans of John’s sparkling wine and are fans of his chocolate. This is how John describes his on-the-job training after his career shift. 


“ I think we were just stupid when we started and the only way we knew how to do things were the way I had done things in the wine business [which] was just to be really careful about flavor. So we treated the beans like we used to treat grapes. We did blind tastings, we did lots of blind tastings, and only accepted beans that had flavors that we liked,” John Scharffenberger on The Restaurant Guys Podcast 2007

Bio

John Scharffenberger started Scharffenberger Cellars known for their world-class California sparkling wine. He left the winery and started Scharffen Berger Chocolates in 1997 with Robert Steinberg. 

Info

John’s cookbook

Essence of Chocolate: Recipes for Baking and Cooking with Fine Chocolate

By John Scharffenberger and Rober Steinberg


Scharffen Berger Chocolate is no longer owned by John Scharffenberger and Robert Steinberg. It was acquired by Hershey in 2005, went back to private ownership in 2020 then acquired by Harry and David in 2024. 


If you want John’s Hot Chocolate recipe, email TheGuys@restaurantguyspodcast.com



On Friday, June 27 Come see The Restaurant Guys LIVE with Chef Andrew Zimmern at the New Brunswick Performing Arts Center in New Brunswick, NJ. VIP tickets include a Meet & Greet After-Party with Andrew. Restaurant Guys Regulars get a discount so subscribe https://www.buzzsprout.com/2401692/subscribe Tickets https://www.restaurantguyspodcast.com/

Our Sponsors

The Heldrich Hotel & Conference Center
https://www.theheldrich.com/

Magyar Bank
https://www.magbank.com/

Withum Accounting
https://www.withum.com/

Our Places

Stage Left Steak
https://www.stageleft.com/

Catherine Lombardi Restaurant
https://www.catherinelombardi.com/

Stage Left Wineshop
https://www.stageleftwineshop.com/


To hear more about food, wine and the finer things in life:
https://www.instagram.com/restaurantguyspodcast/
https://www.facebook.com/restaurantguys

Reach Out to The Guys!
TheGuys@restaurantguyspodcast.com

**Become a Restaurant Guys Regular and get two bonus episodes per month, bonus content and Regulars Only events.**
Click Below!
https://www.buzzsprout.com/2401692/subscribe

Francis:

Hello everybody and welcome back. You're listening to the Restaurant Guys, mark and Francis of Stage Lusting Katherine Lombardi Restaurants in downtown New Brunswick, and today our guest is Mr. Chocolate himself. John Scharffenberger, who founded Charfen Berger Cellars, one of the premier sparkling wine cellars in the United States. He, uh, sold his interest in that, uh, the winery in 1996. he, together with his partner Robert Steinberg, started, Scharfenberg Chocolates. If you haven't had Scharfenberg chocolate, you've been living under a rock somewhere because it's one of the preeminent American chocolates. And he is also written a book called The Essence of Chocolate Recipes for Baking and Cooking with Fine Chocolate.

Mark:

John, welcome to the show.

John:

It's great to be here.

Mark:

So, so John, why couldn't you make champagne and chocolate? Why did it have to be one or the other? Man?

John:

Uh, you know, it's, it's, it's good to try your hand at, at different things, you know, and, uh, I got to the point in the, in the wine business where my partners, figured it out, that they wanted to go on with things. They just wanted me to kind of help sell it. And I said, oh, forget it. I'd rather help make something uhhuh. And so I moved on and was looking for another project and ran into an old friend of mine, Robert Steinberg, who had this great idea about making chocolate. And I said, oh my gosh, it's just the same kind of thing I did when I was in the wine. I said, you know, why? Why? Why does all the good champagne have to be French? Um. And so I worked on, on California Sparkling Wine, and I did the same with chocolate. And, and I think we've done pretty well with our chocolate.

Mark:

Well, you've really become one of, certainly one of, if not the preeminent American, uh, chocolatier as far as somebody actually making a. Find chocolate.

John:

Well, you know, you know, there aren't too many people actually making chocolate in the United States. I think there's 13 companies in the, in the

Francis:

country. Chocolate. Well, let's, let's make that distinction right up front. Let's talk about the difference between, you know, being a, a Bon Bonier and a, and a Chocola Laier. Someone who makes. Candy out of chocolate and someone who makes the chocolate itself talk to us about making chocolate.

John:

Yeah, actually, so, so what to make chocolate, you, you have to buy beans, uh, which are co cacao or cocoa beans. we import these beans from all kinds of different countries than Venezuela, um, Ghana, Dominican Republic. Um, they all have really interesting flavors. We, we put them together in, in different blends to make different chocolates, uh, actually to, and then to, to actually make the chocolate. We have to roast the beans, take the shells off, grind them down with sugar. you know, it, it sounds simple, but it's, it's, um, a lot of machinery. A a

Francis:

actually no, no, it doesn't. It sounds like it's, it's a heck of a lot more complicated than buying chocolate in bulk and making candies out of it.

John:

Yeah. So, no, a lot of people will do this. They'll, they'll actually buy co match or, or cocoa liquor from one of the big companies and they'll mix up the liquor and then, and then, uh, basically, uh, already. Partially made chocolate. Um, and then they'll add in their own sugar and milk and all that stuff. So that's an, um, a lot of candy bars, a lot of chocolate bar companies. I

Mark:

think you better tell people what chocolate liquor is.

John:

Chocolate liquor is actually, um, it's also basically chocolate. It's already been, you know, um, made. So basically somebody who buys the beans. and grinds them down. Um, and, uh, and then sells it that way. and that's the way most chocolate makers are. So, uh, the only people who work with beans are the, about the 13 companies I talked about.

Francis:

Why, why go to all that trouble to, to make chocolate from the bean?

John:

Because that's where the flavor is. You know, we, we really had to go all the way back, uh, to, to the bean. And, and, and that's where we're finding the real difference in flavor is, uh, we work with different, uh, growers and the growers tend to be villages or cooperative. Uh, you know, either in Venezuela or, or in Dominican Republic So they're very small sources of, of, of really exquisite flavors that, uh, we buy and, and then can, can use. And I don't think you get that, um, when you, you know, you're buying somebody else's liquor.

Francis:

Well, now do, is it that you, you are able to source superior beans or is it what you do to the beans after you get them that makes Charfen Burger chocolate different than, you know, some chocolate from a big, big company?

John:

You know, I think we were just stupid when we started and the only way we knew how to do things were, the way I had done things in the wine business was just to be really careful about flavor. Um, so we treated the beans like we used to treat grapes. You know, we, we did blind tastings, um, and we did lots of blind tastings, only accepted beans that had flavors that we liked. Um, and so I think Robert and I both. You know, kind of developed this system together where we, we were just very careful about it, and I think it shows in the eventual chocolate

Mark:

in the food business and in the wine business, we do a lot of, uh, things that we call blind tastings. And what, and what a blind tasting is, is, is just what it sounds like. We don't know. From, from where the products come from. And we'll taste 2, 3, 4, 10, 20 different, uh, products and decide which one we like the best without necessarily knowing from, from where they come or, or the origin. And then, and then make our, our purchasing decisions from that.

John:

Right, right. And it, it, it's a great way to go because you know, in a sense you're, you're just. Really honing in on, on, you know, what the, what, you know, what, where the rubber meets the road. And that's really, uh, the experience of flavor

Francis:

in the, in the finished product with the flavors. How do you think the flavors of Charfen Burger Chocolate are distinct and different from the other chocolates that are available on the market?

John:

I, I don't know how they are, they just are. We, we have, you know, we have the flavor of caca in art, in our chocolate. Um, we also don't process very heavily, so, uh, we don't have to use a lot of sugar. We have of not very sweet chocolate. Um, uh, in, in general, our chocolate doesn't have a lot of sweetness,

Mark:

Which means you can do anything you want with it. Sweet. Not sweet. You know, sugar is, is is something very easy to add.

John:

E Exactly. And, and also not having a lot of sugar, um, means that the other things have to taste good. Mm-hmm. So, you know, sugar sort of

Mark:

covers that. Sure. Sugar can be a be a mask.

John:

Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, so basically you end up tasting a lot more chocolate.

Mark:

The same exact same thing in wine too. People use sugar as a mask.

Francis:

Our guest is John Scharffenberger. Now you know the name Scharffenberger from Chocolate that you see all around. John also has a book out called The Essence of Chocolate Recipes for Baking and Cooking with Fine Chocolate. Now, this is a recipe book for chocolate, which is a, a great holiday gift, I think, or for anyone who likes chocolate, which is everyone I know. Um, but it's not just a recipe book. There's really the story of chocolate in here. What story are you trying to tell with the book besides just giving people recipes as to how to use your chocolate?

John:

Well, we're, we're trying to, you know, tell the story that, you know, all the stories we've learned, uh, over the last nine years. Because having come to it, to us, everything was pretty new. So we want to let people know,