Becoming Without a Blueprint: Navigating the Messy Middle of Reinvention with Laura Trejo

Standing at the hinge of winter and spring, we explore what it really takes to evolve when there’s no clear roadmap. Lizzy welcomes Laura Trejo, the heart behind @evolvingandresilient, for an unfiltered conversation about identity shifts, postpartum depression, and the brave decision to leave patterns that no longer fit. Laura opens up about grieving the family she imagined, redefining loyalty, and choosing practices that help her regulate instead of react; breathwork, somatic awareness, and a supportive circle that reflects truth without shame.

We move beyond inspiration into integration. Laura shares how ayahuasca ceremonies and mindful microdosing supported her through the fog of postpartum and the ache of transition, not as escape, but as structured spaces for intention, medicine songs, and communal processing. She demystifies what a ceremony looks like, how to protect sensitivity afterward, and why integration is where change takes root. Along the way, we decode the body’s signals, panic in the chest, skin breaking out during misalignment, and show how listening early can spare months of confusion.

This is also a reclamation of maternal power. From medicalized birth narratives to the “boss mode” grind, we unpack how culture praises output while discounting the sacred intelligence of motherhood. Laura reframes success around timing, nervous system capacity, and community care, finding deep confidence in a body that carried life and continues to lead her home. If you’re outgrowing an old self and can’t see the new one yet, you’ll leave with practical anchors: track your sensations, choose friends who are clean mirrors, and practice devotion over perfection. You don’t have to know the way; the way knows the way.

Episode Links

• The Myth of Normal: Trauma, Illness, and Healing in a Toxic Culture by Gabor Mate
• Sacred Contracts: Awakening Your Divine Potential by Caroline Myss
• Connect with Laura on Instagram @evolvingandresilient

Transcript

March As A Threshold

SPEAKER_02 0:09

Hi, I'm Lizzie.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

And I'm Nikki. Together, we welcome you to the Modern Zen Collective Podcast, a space where we explore holistic living, spiritual alignment, and personal growth.

SPEAKER_02 0:20

Each week, we'll share conversations, practices, and wisdom to help you live with more joy, purpose, and connection.

SPEAKER_00 0:37

And now on to take.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

March sits in that quiet, powerful threshold between seasons. Winter hasn't fully loosened its grip, and spring hasn't fully bloomed. And energetically, many of us are feeling that too. A strange in-between. A subtle restlessness. A sense that something is shifting, even if we can't quite name what it is yet. Instead of rushing towards clarity or forcing forward momentum, this month is about recalibration. It's about listening to your nervous system, honoring the identity shifts happening beneath the surface, and allowing emergence to be soft instead of abrupt. Throughout March, we'll be talking about the messy middle of transformation, the balance of light and shadow around the spring equinox, the role of resilience when life pivots unexpectedly, and how to support your body through seasons of change. If you're in a space where the old version of you no longer fits, but the new version hasn't fully formed, you're not alone, you're not behind, you're not stuck, you're emerging. Let's move through this month gently and intentionally together.

Naming The Messy Middle

SPEAKER_02 2:39

This month we've been talking about this weird in-between energy, that feeling like something shifting, but you can't quite name what's next. And if I'm being honest, I've 100% felt it too. So today's conversation feels especially meaningful to me because I'm joined by one of my really, really best friends, Laura Trejo, someone I deeply respect and genuinely admire. She's the heart behind Evolving and Resilient, and I've had a privilege of watching her navigate some pretty major life pivots in real time. I've seen her wrestle with the unknown. I've seen her choose courage over comfort, and I've seen her stay rooted in who she is, even while everything around her has been shifting. She's not sharing from the polished after, she's sharing from the middle, the messy middle, from the becoming, from that honest, sometimes uncomfortable space where the old version of you no longer fits, but the new version hasn't fully formed. In this conversation, we're going to be talking about identity shifts, nervous system responses, relationships, fear, resilience, and what it really looks like to move forward when you don't have a blueprint. So if you're in a season where things feel undefined,

Laura’s Catalyst For Change

SPEAKER_02 4:00

where you're outgrowing parts of your life but aren't fully clear on what's next, I hope this conversation feels like a deep exhale and maybe even a little reassurance that you're not behind, you're becoming. So let's dive in, Laura. Thank you so much for being here and sharing your time with me today. I love you so much, and I'm so excited for everyone to clean this wisdom from you because you're just, you're just in the thick of it. And it's just wonderful how you're always trying to improve yourself. Like, look at it. Where where can you take accountability? Where can you improve yourself in what's going on? So thank you so much for coming on today.

SPEAKER_04 4:42

Of course. I'm a I'm trying to hold my tears out of that introduction. I love you so much too. You've been such a great support system.

SPEAKER_02 4:49

We need that. We need that support system. We really do. So I really I want to start off with like, when did you realize that something in your life needed to change? Was there like a specific defining moment that shifted, or was it more of like a slow awakening to being like, I'm ready for for something different?

SPEAKER_04 5:12

I guess um from um this big shift, which it was separating from the father of my kids, I feel like there was something even before all that started happening that I just became very aware of our tendencies. And, you know, because we have the kids now, I I feel like this huge responsibility of making sure that I'm showing up as the best person that I can be, and that and that involves taking a look at myself and acknowledging everything that maybe I didn't grow up with things that I was supposed to. And um so ever since then I started realizing that there was there was something off on the way that we argue and something needed to change. So we keep trying and it was like same thing, same pattern, same patterns. And I was like, okay, I can't figure out these shit this piece of the puzzle. So I was like, I just need to work on myself, face my childhood trauma to un to become a different person, and with time I will show up differently, and the argument will be handled different.

SPEAKER_02 6:24

And I've definitely I've definitely seen that because how you share with me like how you dealt with the arguments year a couple years ago versus now, it's like night and day. It's totally different. What has surprised you the most about yourself as you've like experienced this shift?

SPEAKER_04 6:47

Um I guess just looking at how I didn't know how to properly set boundaries where I was trying to, and they just kept getting pushed over and I didn't see it, like I didn't see it, and not just that, but just um realizing that they just there were just things I couldn't see then until now. And I'm like, like I get it now. Why didn't I get it? But then I feel like everything's very meant

Boundaries, Loyalty, And Letting Go

SPEAKER_04 7:20

to be, you know, like our soul contracts are a certain way with certain people at a certain time. And I feel like even though it was very um hurtful, um, it it was meant to happen that way. Like he was supposed to teach me those lessons that I'm learning, and you know, just I just feel like I just outgrew that because I kept pouring so much in myself and my healing that I started, you know, um showing up differently. And with that, like I even like the arguments, like I was like, I couldn't even keep going because it's like I see the pattern, this is not about this, and I just you know backed away. But also something that I really learned about myself is like my level loyalty and just um resilience, like with you know, it's like well, what's the alternative? Shit's gonna be hard, divorce is gonna be hard, being with someone, it's gonna be hard. There's gonna be those seasons. I was like, well, no, like my family, you know, because I come from a broken home and I see how that affected me. I didn't want it that for my kids. So I I feel like I probably stayed there longer, even though the signs were there that things were not gonna change.

SPEAKER_02 8:29

Yeah, I remember us talking about how it was so important to you to like have your family together as like a whole unit because you knew the effects of what that had on you from coming from a family that wasn't necessarily together in the way that you wanted them to be. I feel like in this shift, you know, with you now becoming to this other side of like being okay with letting this go and seeing that it can be better for your kids having y'all separated. Did you ever have a time where you like really grieved that version of you or that version of the family that you thought you needed to have that you were leaving behind?

SPEAKER_04 9:13

Yeah, yeah. Uh well, I feel like, you know, I was very impressed in in the way that I handle everything because I knew that a few versions of me ago it would have destroyed me, which it it did still knock me down. Like I felt knocked down, but just the way that I handled it and just like I didn't react and like just put up with all the other stuff in the middle. I was like, who are you? Like, this is not the lore that I know, but I feel very proud of the work that I put in. But um, you know, with that, like obviously I've still had to take care of my kids, so I try to like um, you know, I guess you would say distract myself. So it's like, well, uh, okay, this is tough. I dealt with it, but like let me go balance it off and go dance a little bit and like uh balance it off with some fun, you know. Or I mean sometimes to I I hate to admit it, but like I'll doom scroll like just to distract my mind from like doing these things. But obviously, you know, I'm very committed to my healing journey, so I also, you know, do plant medicine and one of those ceremonies. It was very hardcore. Like I was just I felt literally like my heart was broken and I was just crying over my family. It was in, you know, I have a cried in ceremony many times, but not like ugly, ugly crying, like it was so hurtful. So yeah, I definitely had to like grieve that and do that and just I mean, basically my whole foundation and everything got demolished. It was not the life that I thought I was I was gonna have. And then from there I had to like, okay, well, if this is not an option, then what? And then I started seeing my patterns too. I'm like from my relationships, I'm like, I never last single. I'm always like in a relationship because I'm always chasing that family. You know, I didn't have one, so I want that family. But now it's like, Laura, you have a family, and it's like you want to keep trying to build with people, and and then unfortunately, it's like us the womans, we're the most vulnerable because we're the ones that have to um cut down on our jobs and take care of our kids, and when we want to be with good moms and we want to be present, and we can do it all. And that's something that I realized through motherhood, we cannot do it all. I thought that we could, and it's just not realistic. And at the end of the day, you know, I feel like I was I very embraced the boss bay mentality and I loved it and I was very masculine. And and once motherhood came, I realized that like actually, no, I'm gonna nurturate, I'm supposed to be with my kids, you know. So um finally I feel like once I like accepted, I I hold on to my job for so long because I was like, I worked so hard to build this, you know. I my families are immigrants, like it's just already tougher on us. Like, I came here when I was 12, I didn't even know the language, and here I am trying to make something of myself and make my family proud, you know. And it's like me, mom, my mom being a single mom, I'm like, or I want to be successful on my own because God forbid something happened. I didn't want to depend financially on a man, and that was the plan, but you know, things happened along the way, and finally I I've when once I felt like comfortable that I could leave it, then shit just fell apart. And I told myself,

Grief, Postpartum, And Coping

SPEAKER_04 12:20

I was like, look at everything that you put into this relationship, like the resilience, like trying to figure things out and trying to fix it and like going above and beyond with all these things. I'm like, you know what? Fuck that. Like this time, all that energy, it's on me. I already have my family. I don't, I don't need, I don't need that right now. I just need to focus on myself and build on my own because I I won't do this a third time where I try to build with someone and then for what you invest all this time and it's just, you know, not just that, but I don't know if you're aware, but just basically where society's at, it's like a lot of women, you know, it's not like back in the days that, you know, you just the men just provides and you know, you just have to put up with whatever bullshit they give you. It's like it's not like that anymore. We are, you know, we can do it, we we can work and do all these things, but it's like I feel like men are a little behind on their healing journey. So like just where we're at in society, I feel okay that if I find someone, great, but that's not my priority. But I'm also very realistic that I might not, and that's fine. Right now, like I really like my life, you know. I have awesome friends, and it's just so beautiful how the universe works that all these things and relationships that come with that, like, you know, not just that relationship, like other friendships, and like, you know, once you go through the hardshit, you see who your true friends are, and all those go away, but it's so beautiful to see how the universe literally blesses you with new people along the way. Like, right now I have my friend, like, and he like he's he's so helpful, he's gone through this stuff before, and like I literally told him I was like, I think you're my spiritual teacher, like dead serious, and it's just been such a beautiful relationship, and I'm like, I feel so blessed. I'm like, we were meant to, he was meant to help me through this, you know. So even though it's been hard, there's also a lot of beautiful new things coming. So the duality of it, it's just um great because I don't know if you saw one of my recent posts, I was like, hey, like, you know, we have to be grateful for the little things, but then also like don't get me wrong, like my fucking life's hard, you know, like and not just that, and you know what I realized too, it's like you see everything going on in the world, like the big issue, it's like people are not being held accountable, you know, like based on the climate that we have in the country going on. And if I like look at my life and the problem that I have, it's the same thing, holding people accountable. So it's really awesome. Well, interesting to see how, you know, it's in a bigger scale, but also in a smaller scale, how that relates. And I'm sure the planets have something to do with it.

SPEAKER_02 14:58

Of course, of course. That's you know, you bring up so many good points though, like through all of that. It's as women, you know, we're taught from a young age to be independent, especially coming from single moms. Both of us came from from parents, divorced families where our moms were the ones working all the time, providing for us and taking care of us and trying to be there, you know, support us, but while having all these responsibilities out of the house. And so as we grew up, you know, we're trained like, you need to be able to do everything for yourself, you need to be able to provide for yourself, you need to uh work really hard to make sure that you have this, these skills that you can sell so that you're always, you know, gonna be able to be employable and you're gonna be able to rise in the ranks and like that total boss babe thing. And we we were in it, like we bought into it. We're like, yes, I'm doing this, I'm good at this shit. Let's go. I'm gonna be running this shit. Like, you know, I got this. And like, you know, we're confident, independent, like women, and we are really confident in our abilities. And that's one of the things that I struggled with a lot as well, because Jackson, my first son, he was a surprise. And I was building my first company, you know. Uh, Laura and I met while I was had started Wild Woman Yoga, and one of her friends brought her to one of my yoga classes in the park. And then we started developing a relationship. We did sacred women's circles together and everything. And I was so excited about all of that and passionate about all of it. And getting pregnant with Jackson just took all of my juice and like all of my fire away. And I felt this like business that I had worked so hard to build, like slipping away from me, and I wasn't able to like keep it up. And having that identity shift of like being so tied, like my ego being so tied to my business and who I was and what I could offer society and the world in terms of like my productivity and my output to becoming like someone that really her value was within the home, within the raising of the children, within like providing that healthy, wellness-focused, spiritual, like caring household. That shift was very difficult for me.

Plant Medicine As A Healing Tool

SPEAKER_02 17:30

Like it was really hard for me to let all that go. Like you're talking about, like letting go of that heavy masculine energy that we were living into, and then going into that feminine nurturing side. And it was so crazy because my dad said to me after I had my, after I had Jackson, was like, you're way more nurturing than I thought you were. He's like, I never expected you to be like this. And I'm like, actually, if you think about who I was as a child before I took on all this bullshit from y'all's divorce and all this other stuff, I was actually a very caring kid. I just turned into a monster, you know, after all of that stuff. Have you experienced something like that too? I mean, I feel like you spoke to it a little bit, but like what was that shift like for you? Like, what did you have to do to like get yourself to let that go and step into who you really naturally are?

SPEAKER_04 18:25

It took me some time. It took me some time, and you know, it's like because my mom was a single parent, like, and you know, she worked. To me, when I saw a stay-at-home mom, I was like, uh, she could work. Like, that was my yes. I'm like, yes, it's just lazy, she could work, you know. So then um, I had Sebastian, and the first six months I was busy with work and like, you know, he was tiny, so I was still going feeling productive. It was fine. But you know, real estate, it's up and down. So sometimes, you know, you have like slower months. So at the six month, uh, that's whenever I started. Um, I started like just like I got super depressed, dude. Like, I have bit bad bad postpartum depression. I was just like, I didn't want to get up during the morning. Like, I just wanted to be asleep because I didn't want to feel, and I was just like, man, like I love be I love my kid. Uh that that wasn't the problem. It was just that like I'm like, how am I here at the house? Like, I'm gonna stay at home, mom. I need to be fucking selling and performing. And like, what like what the fuck am I doing here? Like, how did I end it up like this? You know, and I resented my partner a little bit because I was like, this is not fucking fair. He still gets to go do and excel his career and all this stuff, and I I like I don't like it's not fair, you know. But regardless, like I kept working, like, and he will tell me, he's like, Well, you know, he's like, Okay, like I get it. Like, I feel like he just kind of wanted me to like get on with it, like, okay, cool. Like, now we realize that gender worlds work, and like he did offer, like, why don't you just stay home? You know, and I was like, No, like, you know, but um, and then you know, I feel like that sometimes I was unhappy, and like sometimes because I was unhappy, I'll bring up other arguments, but it was because I was unhappy with like the that, like the I guess yeah, the identity shift, you know, and he was like, Okay, like, and it was like the same thing. He's like, Okay, like, okay, we get it though. And I'm like, I understand, but like I just can't get over it because this is what I I am very intentional with how it built my life. Very intentional. Like I knew my mom wasn't present, so I said, I need to make a I need to have a career that gives me enough money that I don't depend on a man. I want one, but I don't need one. And if shit goes out, I can take care of myself and I can be present for my kids because my mom was never there, she couldn't, you know. So um I told him, I was like, I understand, like we get it, but I can't, like, it's so hard. This is what I thought it was supposed to be for 30 years, just to realize that I was fucking wrong. So it took me some time and like eventually, like I didn't resent him for the job anymore or anything. Like, like I would work and I was like, hey, it's fine, like I'm not working full-time, I'm working part-time, and that's that. But during that process, like I feel like I was really just trying to find like a way to help myself out, and like you know, whenever you are postpartum, you're like very foggy and stuff. Um, whenever I was with Sebastian, my hormones were really bad that I had to get on antidepressants to help me take the edge off. And then after um, my mom obviously realized too that I was struggling. She's like, You need to get back on your mans. And I was like, I don't want to, like, I'm just freaking numb. Like, I'm just numb. I want to get to the root of the cost of this. So, you know, our friend that introduced us, we always kept we we have some similarities and we kept talking about like awaska and we're like, what? Like, we did all this research. I was like, What? Like, he does this, is that stuff. I I read this really good book. It's called The Myth, uh The Myth of Normal by Gabor Mate. And he like talks about addiction and how people used to grow up back in the days and how we're growing up and how that affected us, and people

SPEAKER_02 22:00

kept asking him too about this plant medicine that was ahuasca and they were like do you know about this and he didn't so then he actually had to go and research about it and realized that yeah like it actually helped people heal so then I saw one of my friends um share on Instagram no yeah on Instagram that she had an experience I was like what so then um I was like where she's like in Dallas I was like oh my god I don't have to go to Peru and do all this stuff so I was like this is great so yeah so um I went and I sat and it took my depression away like it really did and it just you know it's one of the tools that I I still like to use for um you know I feel like it just brings so much more awareness and it helps you um um how do I even say it like be look at the bigger picture and just connect the thoughts and it just gives you so much wisdom that um yeah it just that's what really helped me get out of that rot and then um I mean things got better or relationship got better things

Visions, Integration, And Trust

SPEAKER_02 23:00

were better and I was like even my friends you know like or friends uh they will be like dude like we can tell like we can tell just how you are and just things that you know I had to deal with life and you know people bad friendships doing things and I'm like everyone's like I we can't believe Laura's handling it like this because we know how she is and I'm like yeah so that's yeah that's really been like a life changing experience along with you know I also do like breath work and also do the holistic canceling and then you know all the other modalities akashic records and all this stuff just trying to understand the whole piece by piece um what feels right yeah I love that I love that you're sharing about that because I feel like sometimes people shy away from saying that they use you know plant medicine to help them spiritually but I know that I've never tried ayahuasca it has been something that I've been interested in but I feel like when it's my time to actually do it I'll feel more called to it and I am I am really interested I love hearing about like all of your stories with that my only experience with plant medicine is with mushrooms and really I didn't do it for like the spiritual side of it when I first started doing it but I would always be in nature and these connections like you're saying these connections between things that have happened and other kinds of things it's like all of a sudden everything makes sense to you and you see these things in different ways and it's almost like beautiful there's like this beauty to the mess there's this beauty to the puzzles that all of a sudden you solve and you're like oh my God that was easy you know we're like oh it just came to me oh my gosh you know and it's been something that's been plaguing you for years or for your lifetime and and all of a sudden it like opens up these doorways in our mind that connect these dots. It's it's absolutely incredible.

SPEAKER_04 25:01

Yeah yeah so with that you know since I learned all these things also um with my son uh after that I started microdosing mushrooms you know obviously I will do them recreationally but then it was mindful and like whenever I I felt that you know that like that nut on your head that you're just like you just don't feel like yourself when you're going through postpartum and I remember when I started microdosing it just poof took it away and I was like oh my god I feel so much better so the second time that I had Natalia uh at the four months that's when everything you know kind of hit the fan with him um honestly like if it wasn't for me microdosing to help me through postpartum and me doing ceremonies I feel like with time I got more comfortable with it where like you know after everything started falling apart I was doing ceremonies every three months because I felt that comfortable but it also like it helped me cope so much more like so much more and like I know I haven't told you this but like even now looking back at those ceremonies like ayahuasca always brought a vision of like what was gonna happen and like at first I didn't understand it because you know it's like you have ceremony but it doesn't stop there. You still you know integrating afterwards and I now looking back every single time I will see like a little image of what was to come wow yeah because I remember like one time we were um I was there and like I remember seeing our souls he's an eyes that we were like as souls we plan we plan for this and we're like this is gonna be tough and then uh there was another time that I was like wait like this is not over and like I saw us in our home with our kids and I was just like okay like it's gonna work out and it was like that time where we were trying to mend things I remember being sitting down on the couch with the kids and I was like oh like it was that but then it was like and the other time when I was like griefing everything well it was a time after that I think it was like my sixth time that it was like okay like that's that and like and then it it you show me that I can still create a beautiful life with the kids on my own you know so um yeah it's been very uh just insightful and I just feel very blessed and I I definitely feel called and like I know how you were saying like oh whenever your time comes like it's crazy because I really do think it like calls you like sometimes I'm just like scrolling and I'm just you know I don't I'm not even talking about it or nothing. And all of a sudden like you know it's like makeup mom content or like music and then all of a sudden it's like they supposed and I was like she's calling me I know she's calling me and I'm like yeah and like every single time like the relationship is more profound but even the tough one where I

Inside A Ceremony

SPEAKER_04 27:45

like I felt all that grief even after that I I felt so much better and lighter and just you definitely feel like the layers of the onion are you know slowly peeling.

SPEAKER_02 27:54

That's so cool. So I'm curious because this might be like the first time a lot of people are even hearing about ayahuasca or like a ceremony what what does a ceremony entail?

SPEAKER_04 28:04

Like what does it kind of look like when you step into this space and and have this process um so I go to um Darren Davis here in Dallas uh he has a group called Medicine Monday so he's kind of like prepping you before um so everyone's there very like minded you know and they talk about their experiences with it and you're already basically getting ready for it. And I feel very blessed that I came across this circle because he's done he's done done it so many times in so many settings and he's he's very um detailed on how he wants things handled and it's a smaller intimate group so you go there and you go with an intention of what you want to work on. So um you know there he like seals the room with Palo Santo and stuff and then we yeah we go over rules or intentions and then we take it and then we wait a certain amount of time and sort of starts kicking in and then it everything is just so beautiful. There's all these medicine songs you know it's nothing weird like just like the lyrics of them are so simple and meaningful and basically like we're healing while we're singing. So now that with time that I've been going so much it's like I know the songs and sometimes we're like singing on the medicine like you know like uh cleaner bodies and love and nature and like the like you know hold my uh there's like this song it says basically like my tears are so fast that it fills the oceans but then also like um my love is so big that it blooms everything so it's like the duality of things you know there's you know and at the end of everything what holds us together it's love you know so it's like so it's just so beautiful. I I know you're gonna your first time is gonna be with me in that setting and like even even people that done it in other places and they sit with him they're like he's just like great and like he sings and like it's it's so awesome and then after that obviously uh when once the ceremony is over we'll talk about our experiences and it's just so funny because since we're all in it together sometimes someone shares something of their experience and you can resignate and you're like man like I need to hear that and then we just kind of like piggyback of each other and we're like man like even one of my friends who's just like man like whenever you share that like I can so relate. So I feel like we're all kind of like intertwined through that you know sitting together. So I've been able to develop like very awesome friendships from that too and I just I mean yeah I feel very blessed to be there.

SPEAKER_02 30:34

That's awesome. It sounds like like very deep you know and like everyone's so vulnerable. So it's like a different kind of connection that you have with people when you're able to share things like that like feel safe sharing that with each other.

SPEAKER_04 30:48

Yeah yeah and sometimes we share yeah one of my friends too she shares some stuff with me between her and her son and she's like I've never said that out loud to anyone she's like thank you for holding space I'm like of course like it's just yeah

Safety, Vulnerability, And Support

SPEAKER_04 31:00

in time Wow that's beautiful well I'll you know I'm definitely be letting you know when it's time it's time I think sometimes it scares me a little bit because I feel like there's so much inside that like wants to come out and I'm I get scared that I'm just gonna fall apart you know and like how long is it gonna take me to to put myself back together enough to show up from you know in my home. Well see I feel like all that that you just explained it it ends within the ceremony. Like if you're facing something heavy you feel it and you cry like I have cried so many times like one of them I was like realizing that because my mom was always working I didn't have this physical care that I give my kids like the cuddles and all that stuff and like obviously at night like I slept with my mom you know but I was like realizing I was like oh my god I like that so much and I was just hugging myself the whole time and I was just like crying tearing like feeling bad for myself that I didn't have that but then I was like oh my god that makes so much sense what that's why one of my love languages is physical touch like non-sexual like I love being like nurture and like whole because I liked it you know but even after that after I felt that at the end of it like I still felt really good you know so it wasn't like I struggled to integrate or anything like that or um whenever um whenever I I was grieving about my family I still I still felt good afterwards like it wasn't the only I guess there was just the second time I guess you just gotta be mindful like if you come home like don't go into a chaotic uh environment you know because then you're really sensitive but um yeah I think one time I did and then I pushed myself to like go to lunch and people were saying things and I was just getting fucking triggered and I'm like you know but I left from that time and I'm like no no no no after ceremony I'm just gonna go chill and nobody bothered me. It's fine and like it's it's it's been fine.

CTA: Modern Zenco Plus

SPEAKER_02 33:10

But yeah I think once you do it you're gonna realize that like what you're saying it's it's you're gonna laugh okay good good I would prefer it to be like that we've been so moved by the response to Modern Zenco Plus since launching and if you've been curious March is a beautiful time to join us. It's our curated bonus subscription for exclusive interviews, guided practices, channeled insights and honest no BS conversations that go beyond for just $4 a month, Modern Zenco Plus is designed to support real integration, not just inspiration. Actually so many of you have stepped into this first days already and Mickey and I cannot be more critical. If you're feeling called to be part of this growing circle we love to you can find the link in the show notes. See you in there well I'm curious because you've talked

Listening To The Body

SPEAKER_02 34:20

I mean you've talked about like you know physically holding yourself and things like that to help you work through that. Like how did how has your body responded to all of these changes that you've had like within yourself?

SPEAKER_04 34:39

Well you know I also within ceremony space I met someone that um she's like basically a holistic counselor is who does my records and she's heard me share some of those things. So along with her help she has guided me to like well what do you feel in your body and what do you know so I feel like with the ceremony and then integrating in real life I'm able to catch myself like how I'm feeling I'm like okay like I feel like tense in my chest. So then I'm like you know she gives me these other tools she's like okay you feel that breathe breathe like your breath is so powerful you know and sometimes you forget so I feel like I've just been becoming more aware of how I feel and I also been able to reflect like the relationship and like the whole journey throughout the relationship that I realized like there was a lot of big red flags at the beginning but I just kept like disassociating and I just kept going with it. You know or I will say things and I'm like I don't know but then you know or I I used to like I used to have like anxiety like I remember one time I had like a panic back attack like it was his birthday I took him out to eat and like I was just like I just couldn't breathe but like I never told him I was just like I'll just go into the restaurant and I was just like man like I have this pain in my chest and like I would breathe but then I'll just party and then but I didn't really understand what was going on and I'm like bitch you were having a panic attack that was probably your body telling you that you should not like something is wrong and I just didn't know so now I feel like with my body I'm more aware of like those things and like going forward like I I catch on to this those things more.

SPEAKER_02 36:23

That's awesome. I love that for you because the body never lies to us and our minds like always can just shit like show the opposite show different things like show all these different things and it can it can get us confused and we can like you say like there's so much going on sometimes in our mind that we lose that connection to the body or that awareness to the body or even like that we even give a fuck anymore what's going on with the body you know so I I love that you that that's like what has been a big one of the big shifts for you.

SPEAKER_04 36:57

Yeah and even like something like you're gonna laugh whenever um you know I I I had already made up my mind I was like okay this is really done that's okay I have to rebuild myself what do we do when we knock life knocks you down you just get back up right and whenever we're trying to work things out I started breaking out the only thing that had changed is that we were trying to fix things and I started breaking out no way yes and I knew I was like it's that I was like so what did you do? Did you were you like no it's over were you like oh I'm breaking out okay sorry we're not gonna keep working on things obviously once you know I realized that we we weren't gonna work on it um then I realized I was like man like why am I breaking out and I was just like it was that and then as soon as we stopped my fear started clearing up again and I was like my body trying to tell me you know that's wild that's wild oh my gosh that is so crazy. I really don't break out like right now I'm breaking out just because you know I had like this facial treatment done so it's like perching but other than that like I mean you've seen me like I don't break out yeah no well this I mean I just there's just so much there's just so much it's it's so I love that

Modalities For Regulation

SPEAKER_04 38:20

you're sharing all about like the tools that you've used.

SPEAKER_02 38:24

I know you mentioned that you have a like a holistic wellness therapist that you've been seeing too like from there she does your Akashic records readings like what other modalities you know besides the ayahuasca ceremonies and um the breath work like what other modalities have really helped you during this like in-between time and help you like regulate yourself and really help you stay rooted while so much is changing around you.

SPEAKER_04 38:53

Yeah um I think I also done Reiki with her but something that um I'm not sure what it will be called but sometimes whenever I have certain feelings she will take me back and ask me like when was the first time you felt this so it's like childhood trauma work you know and I'm like oh the first time that I felt unsafe it's when I had to defend my mom and I was three years old. You know and then I realized like oh my god I took this like parenting role that was not assigned to me and ever since then like I stopped trying to push my mom or treat her like my kid like why aren't you doing this do this do that get on with it like I was just like she's not my responsibility you know so that that has really helped a lot to like you know it's like I feel like trauma is you know when we're little we don't know how to process it and it's like we're a little rope and then like this not stays in the rope and we think like oh it's in the past it should stay in the past but it doesn't something now in the present comes that triggers you and it makes you feel just like you did back then.

SPEAKER_02 39:56

So in order to heal it you have to go back look at it understand it like she really she she asked me to basically paint the whole scene of that what happened is like okay they were wrong now you ask Laura yourself go in there and be there for her you know so yeah it's childhood trauma work right yeah a hundred percent I've had experiences like that I went to this um I went to this little mini conference in Austin one time and it was just like a day thing and it was all about you know it was with Sahara Rose and um who I don't do much with anymore but she was very like impactful on me when I first started my spiritual journey and she sang this we she played this song and we like were in you know we were on a dance floor so it was like you were able to move and all this kind of stuff and it was Christina Aguilera's beautiful song. And I don't know if you remember that song but she had us picture our younger version of ourselves in our mind and like sing that song to them. And I remember standing in the dance floor like with my eyes closed, you know, with my hands on my heart and like swaying back and forth and like singing this song to like that for me it was like that 13 year old version of myself and I was just like tears were streaming down my face. And it's just there are so many things that happen around us when we're children that we take on as ours and I had a lot of that with my parents' divorce and so much anger and so much resentment and so much that I had taken on around my mom and my dad's relationship that wasn't mine to hold. And it can be it can be very impactful like you're saying to actually do that work with your childhood self.

SPEAKER_04 42:03

Like it can shift a lot in just a few moments yeah it and it sounds silly like oh your imagination but it's like yeah and your imagination like you really like you know but I mean we're moms we have big responsibilities I was like you know at um their dad um had addiction problems at some point of his life and then I had like suicidal moments too I'm like okay like he has he he has tendency of those I have tendency what are the chances of our kids to go through that extremely likely extremely likely so I'm like no like yeah it's tough to look at yourself but I'm like for my kids and I'm sure you heard it this before it's like if if it's not us like or the generations to come will benefit from this work even though I might not fully heal or anything like that that will be better you know off than us. I mean I know the way that you parent the way that we both parent

Motherhood, Power, And Birth

SPEAKER_04 43:00

we're very aware of like helping them handle their emotions and all that stuff and it's like that that's all it is it's like when you're in an argument with someone it's because we don't know how to regulate ourselves. You know we don't know how to do that. And yeah like even when sometimes I see Natalia having a hard time and I'm like damn baby girl like I sometimes feel like that as an adult. So I have so much compassion for her that I'm like let me you know my mom didn't know how to handle it so she would just walk away and I'm just there like thinking that something's wrong with me and then I'm broken for feeling these emotions and uh with the whole suicidal issues it was like my emotions are so much they're too much for me to handle like I just don't want to feel them anymore. That was you know when actually like we're human we're supposed to experience all these emotions you know and like even with the the whole uh separation it's like it hurts so much because at some point that we love each other so much. Like I he was everything to me I remember it was like you're my home baby like just you know but But um it's it and that's the same thing that I tell myself and that gets me through this middle transition. It's like it hurts so bad, but misbelieved what's coming next, it's gonna be fucking awesome, you know? Because it's been I'm going on what, like uh a year plus of just going through it and still like you know, I'm like, yeah, there's things that are looking bright in my life, but there's still like all these other stuff that I deal with that are pretty heavy, but I'm like, it it can last forever, you know? It's just our lives were so intertwined. I mean, just because we didn't have a paper, I mean, we're houses together, kids together, we were basically married, you know, like yeah, it's so so much is shifting, so much is shifting.

SPEAKER_02 44:46

So I know I love that, like we talked about before, I love that you changed your Instagram to like evolving and resilient. Like, I love that so much because that's totally you. And so I'm curious, like, what does evolving mean to you right now?

SPEAKER_04 45:02

It's just taking a look at taking a look at yourself and see where it needs improvement, you know. Um, when I was in college, I first um became aware of personal development and I fell in love with it. And I saw it like I was I worked three jobs, went to school, um, couldn't even remember what the last time that I slept in. And I would just wake up so happy with the smile on my face, you know, and I kind of lost track of that and um in a relationship that I had. So after that, I was like, never again will I let my personal development go. You know, so um I I keep going with that, and it's just like, why not? Why wouldn't we want to be the best self or ourselves during this lifetime? I don't want to waste potential. Like, I just don't, like I it just I don't know, like it's just I want to be the best version of myself. I don't know, like I just feel very passionate about that. Like, you know, I I I don't know, it's just why wouldn't you?

SPEAKER_02 45:56

Like, why why wouldn't I know? I mean, I mean, exactly. Those are the kind of people that are listening to this though, like people who are seeking, you know, to be better and to be the best version of themselves. So you're speaking to your people right here, like you're speaking to your people. But I'm, you know, we mentioned it a little bit that like your friends and people have known you from before, you know, from all this time through all of this to like who you are now, they've seen the changes. And I'm really curious, like, how have these people, like who have been really close to you, how have they responded to all these changes? Like, have you outgrown different friendships or like spaces that you used to go in? Or are you still able to step into them just as the new version? Like, how have your relationships kind of like evolved as you've been like shifting and intentionally changing all of these things in your life?

SPEAKER_04 46:52

So I have some friends from high school that I'm still really cool with, and obviously, like they were like I could tell them these things and they respect them, but that's not something they will do. But they're very happy for me, you know, and they're very encouraging, and they're like, Okay, that works with her, you know, she's a little different, but they love me regardless, you know, and they're there for me, like through the breakup and everything, you know. But um, just recently, yeah, um, I definitely had some friendships fall out, and I'm just like, you know what? And um it was a friend from like 10 years ago, and I'm just like, right now when I need you the most, like this is what you're doing, but at the same time, it was like I feel like I'm just so like such a loyal person that but but at the end of the day, like I can talk to her like I can talk to you. I can't talk to her about childhood trauma or uh or spiritual experiences or you know, perception, consciousness, like uh projection, like I just couldn't talk to her like that. But now, like I have you know, I have you and I have other friends too that have, you know, uh I met them at some point of my life and then we just kind of distance ourselves, but we then we just kind of find each other again, and like I can do that with them where I can call someone and we're like you know, we know about her stuff, and she's like, Hey, I think I think it's your control issue, hey, I think it's your abandonment shit. And I'm like, those are the kind of friendships that I want because we elevate each other and like I point her stuff out to I'm like, friend, I think it's like the abandonment issue that won, you know, it's like so it's like, yeah, I feel like I have definitely uh grown friendships, and um, but I'm grateful that a lot of my friends still accept me the way that it is, and it's like every, you know, every there's levels of friendships, so you know, there's comes the seasons with someone is like your go-to best friend, like you can talk about all those other things, and you're still friends with them, but it's like in a different scene, you know, like oh, for like for Friends' birthday, okay, we catch up and stuff, and we like to know that everybody's good, but there's just depth to all these friendships, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:49

Yeah, I totally feel you on that. I love that. So I'm curious then, like, is there are there pieces that still feel like really unresolved and like undefined that you're kind of like working, like what are you working through right now? Like, what's the main thing that you're like, this is the thing that I really want to work on?

SPEAKER_04 49:16

I feel like um, you know, with the whole changing my page and the name of it, I feel very passionate about sharing my story and you know, hopefully help people out, but especially like women, you know, it's like nobody tells you what's gonna happen.

Body Image And Confidence

SPEAKER_04 49:30

Everyone's just like, oh, the family, oh yeah, cute, oh yeah, let's get engaged. But then once you're in the thick of it, you start realizing all this shit. And I look back, I like some of my friends. I had kids in, you know, high school or college, and I had no fucking idea. I had no idea, and I feel so bad that I couldn't be there more for them because it was like, oh, we'll still invite them. Sometimes they come, sometimes they don't. And it's just like, oh well, they have a kid, whatever. Um they have a kid, whatever. You know, and like even um one of my friends, um, when she got pregnant, yeah, or other friends, she's like, um, are are y'all gonna like, because we were both pregnant, she made a comment, like, oh, are y'all gonna uh something like basically like she sounded us, she made us she made us sound lame. And you know, me and her are not lame.

unknown 50:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 50:15

And I told my friend, literally, I was like, Yep, that's mother here for you. Now your friends are just like, oh, well, she's pregnant, like she's not as fun. You know, so I I feel like I want to share like the reality of what to expect because I wish someone would have brutally honestly told tell me, like, hey, the hormons, hey, like, you know, like even um so I'm still trying to figure it out a way of how I want to share this with people. And like I want to make sure that my delivery is correct. I want to make sure, like, I don't want to waste the wisdom that I have by not delivering it in a way that I think it would resonate. But yeah, I want to talk about that and like, oh, you you really want kids, right? Like there's a lot of girls that are like, I just always wanted to be a mom, you know. And it's like, okay, you're serious about that? Start healing now. Start healing now. You know, whenever um before the kids, like I feel like there was like um, I knew there was things that I need to to look at it because of arguments and situations that me and him had, but I just didn't want to look at it. I just didn't want to at all, I didn't want to feel the pain, I didn't want to do all that. So here I am now, like I have no choice. I gotta face myself for me and for my kids, you know. So I just advise us like, hey, like do this, you know, do the healing work before and like motherhood expect this, the hormones this, like, hey, and like, you know, it's it's crazy. It's like I wish like there was just more awareness into this. Like, why didn't in our health class did they teach us this? Where they just teach us like the super basic stuff, but it's like it's important, like our brain literally shrinks when we're building a baby and you expect me to be my hundred percent, bro. Yeah, no, like that's when they the men needs to protect us the most during pregnancy, doing everything, and sometimes

Friendship Evolution

SPEAKER_04 52:00

they're the ones that instigate the stuff or forget that we're pregnant, and or like it's not a big deal, and it's like it is a big deal, and you know, I just saw something earlier today, and I've been seeing it a lot. It's like we are a big deal, everyone's here because of a woman. Damn straight. We're the portal from the you know, from the spiritual to the physical world. Like that's that's a huge thing.

SPEAKER_02 52:27

It really is. I totally agree with you because while I knew that everything was gonna be fine and we and I was gonna understand how to how to be the right mom for my kids, there were a lot of things that I didn't like, you just you weren't told until you until you start to go searching for it. Like I'm like, oh shit, I'm dealing with this. Now I need to go and search for that information. I need to search and find out like why weren't we told this when we were younger? And I truly believe like it was meant to steal our power. Like I feel like they've purposefully did not teach us these things because of how powerful we are. Because, like you're saying, like we are the portals, like we are the ones that create and sustain life. And the men want to keep us small. And I think men don't, so most men don't consciously want that, but it's been something that's been entrained in our society since the early 1900s and even earlier than that when they've been trying to strip our power away. And like I think one of the things that like becoming pregnant and starting on that journey really showed me was open my eyes to that. Like they took birth away from us and made it a medical, like a medical thing that like men doctors are trying to tell us what's right and what isn't, when for hundreds and thousands of years, women have been giving birth with other women and have been doing it without all these interventions and just honoring that natural wisdom that is in our body already that was given to us by the divine creator so that we and our babies work in tandem throughout this whole process and through the birthing to make it an enjoyable spiritual experience. And they're stealing that away from us with all the stuff that they try and pump in us, all these different things that they try and do to like make it some medical emergency. Like, I fucking gave birth to Blake in my hallway, like no issues. My husband cut the umbilical cord with a fucking hunting knife. Like, you know, we can do anything, you know. We we are so powerful and we're like divinely created to be like that. So I think like they did that shit on purpose. And like I think it's wonderful that we, you know, as women are here like reclaiming that power and you're trying to share that with other women. Like the more women that can reclaim that power and feel strong in their decision

Sharing The Work Publicly

SPEAKER_02 55:00

and their internal knowing of what's right for them and what's right for their babies without having to listen to what the fuck everybody else and all these damn Karen's are telling us we should ought to be doing. Like, we know we just have to feel confident in our knowing.

SPEAKER_04 55:14

Yeah. I did so much reading when I was pregnant. Like, I read all the stories about, you know, um, what is that lady called? Um it's um what do you call the lady that helps you birth? Uh midwives or dualists? Midwives, yeah. It was like a bunch of stories about those. And then I read about the whole like medical field, how it's a business and all these things. And I was just like, you know, like learning through all that. And um, yeah, it's just um no, and then like just even you know, like I have so much compassion too because it's like, dude, you and I are so lucky that we bounce back like really fast. Imagine all the shit, the identity shift, the hormones, and then on top of that, your body, dude. Like, I mean, we were lucky, dude, that we didn't have to deal with that, but it's just like so much. But even now, like, you know, with my body, like I have so much more confidence in my body now that I'm a mom. Like, I feel like such a bad bitch. Like, I know I was always a bad bitch before, but I try to like make myself small, like, oh, like let me not show myself too much because like you know, like I'm probably one of the fittest ones of my friend, and like, ah, you know, and I want to make them feel bad. Yeah, and it's like, no, I've worked my ass off to be this build, and yeah, I bred those babies and I look like this. Every time someone's like, you have two kids, I'm like, yeah. And not just that, it's you can do it too, but you have to have that discipline too, you know. Like, I know you're like very fit into fitness, and it's like all these people are very religious, but they don't take care of the temple.

SPEAKER_02 56:43

Okay, you know, like yeah, I'm totally with you on that. So I'm super curious. Like, now that you're in this place where you are now, still in the thick of it, but on the other side of like a lot of this deep healing work that you've done, what would you tell the version of you who was like just beginning this whole shift?

SPEAKER_04 57:09

No matter what, you're gonna be okay because it's you. And not just that, like, I was talking to my friend this weekend and I was just like sharing some stuff about my past, and I was just like, I was made for this. Like, I feel like all this struggle that I went through when I was younger, it was to prepare me for this moment, not to be destroyed. One of my friends, she was like, Man, friend, she's like, whenever you started telling me about everything that's going on, I was so worried about you. I was like, Laura's gonna be depressed for at least two years to get over this. She's like, six months, bitch, you're over here like nothing, like just glowing, just thriving. And I'm like, Yeah. And then, you know, also something that you said earlier, how has my my transformation impacted my other friends? Dude, some of my other friends, uh I'm gonna sit with one of my friends in ceremony. I've been knowing her since I was in seventh grade, and she's seen the change, and she's like, I want to do ayahuasca with you, so she's gonna come and do it with me in April. So, and also, oh my god, I haven't told you this. My mom, I brought my mom to circle. Like, she was like seeing it, yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. So she's like, she she she's planning on doing it soon. And I was just like, What? So it's like, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 58:20

You're inspiring other women in your life to do the healing work as well because of what they've seen in you, like the changes that have happened in you. Wow, I just got goosebumps, like my hair is like standing on end for sure. That's I mean, that's so incredible. I'm I'm honestly getting a little emotional. Like the ripple effect that like what you've chosen for yourself and how you're showing up for uh the people around you in their lives. Like, look at what it's doing for other people. Like, that's so incredible, Laura. It's so incredible. I'm so I'm so grateful that you're now feeling comfortable and like you actually want to share these kinds of things more in like a more public space because look at what you've done for just the people that you touch in your daily life. Like, look what imagine what you could do for those millions of people that just

Self‑Trust Through Uncertainty

SPEAKER_02 59:10

randomly come across your stuff and decide that you're somebody that they want to follow. Like, imagine like this one thing could resonate with them and just shift, make a huge change in like something that they decide to do for themselves.

SPEAKER_04 59:22

Yeah. And that's why I always try to be very authentic. Like, I know sometimes I could come off very um unfiltered, but I want it to be that way. Even like, you know, like the relationship, like through through it. I mean, you heard me talk about it. I'm like, no, this, like, my friends are like, well, yeah, Laura, but you know, everyone wants what you want. I'm like, yeah, I know. You are complaining because you don't have someone, but trust me, it's still a lot of work being with someone and like dealing with all this stuff. And like, I don't ever like to sugarcoat it because I want people to hear, like, oh, it's not just us. It's it's it's all of us, and even like the issues that we had when we gone when I go and like talk about it with so much shame to my therapist. She's like, hey, actually, this is more normal than you think it is, but people just don't talk about it. And it's like, yeah, no, because it's reality, like, tell me the truth. Just I'd rather know the reality of it than someone sugarcoating it for me. So that's why it's like I just I I always tell people, be careful what you ask me. I might just like met you, but if you ask me some deep shit, like I'm just gonna tell you. It's perfect.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:28

That's how I am too, honestly. I mean, but people need people like that because when we can show up like authentic, vulnerable, real about like the hard shit, it like gives people it like kind of disarms people and gives them the permission to like come back with something real to us. Like you don't have to pretend with me. Like, let's let's have a real conversation here. So I I love that so beautiful. That's so beautiful. So I want to like I want to close it out with with like a a last thing that you want to share. Like, if someone listening right now feels like they're in in this like messy middle right now where they're they're trying to get to this new version, but they're not they're not completely there yet. They're like still dealing with the shit, but they're healing. Like, what would you want them to know?

SPEAKER_04 1:01:24

Uh well, want them to know that everything is divinely orchestrated and for them to trust themselves and not to listen to other people outside because no one's leaving your life. There were sometimes, you know, people that would tell me, like, do certain things, or like my mom, get back on your mat. And I was like, no, I don't want to. And I follow my intuition, and like it just divinely guided me there. Like, just me seeing my friend post about her ceremony, like, you know, and just even now, because I'm like, okay, um, I don't know, I'm going through like my healing period based on my bird chart. Like, I'm like, okay, like I need to do as much healing. Like, what if what if I'm like missing the window? What if I'm not doing it enough? What if I like not end up being like the best version that I could have been, and all these things. And just this weekend, like, just the experience that I had this weekend

Closing Reflections And Resources

SPEAKER_04 1:02:10

with my friend, and we just like went through like so much deep work that I'm just like, I'm over here worried about the journaling, the meditating, and all these things. And it's like I wasn't even planning to have that experience this weekend, and I did, and I'm like, it's just everything is just divinely guided, so just trust that, you know. Um, there's this song and ceremonies, it's called uh, I think it's called The Way, and it says, Um, you don't have to know the way, the way knows the way. Feel your way, trust the way. And uh, dude, there's this book, it's called Soul Contracts, it's so good. It goes a little bit on like how the bird chart works, but just saying how when we come here we forget everything that you know we're supposed to know. They're like, of course, everything's orchestrated, because if it didn't, it will be a mess. So you have disappointments with people, a certain time of life to go through certain things. And yeah, the realities might play out a little bit differently, but you can there's still a little bit of control, but you like you can't miss, like you, and you just have to trust that, you know. So even though I I know that I really wanted that family, it's it might not look what I picture it to be, but I still have my family, and those are my kids, you know. So um yeah, I just feel like trust your intuition, I will say.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:32

And that wow, that's I mean, that's a yes, yes, I need to hear that too. Damn straight. Well, Laura, thank you, thank you so much. Like, I'm I'm honestly like so grateful for your honesty and like for sharing from this like middle space and not waiting until everything felt like neat and like tied up in a bow. Cause I think that's where so many of us are right now. We're like in this in-between space where like things are shifting, but we're not, we're not quite there yet. I mean, I feel like that in my life as well. And so, like, I love what I love about this conversation is that it really reminds us that like becoming this new version of ourselves, like it doesn't require like a roadmap. It just requires courage. It requires self-trust, and it requires us to like be present, to be open, and be willing to like constantly evolve. And so, like, if you're listening, you feel like you're in that messy, like undefined season. I hope this episode and this conversation like gave you permission to not have it all figured out. Like, you're not behind, you're not lost, you're just you're in motion. And so, like, Laura, I thank you so much for modeling like what it looks like to evolve without abandoning yourself. And to everyone listening, like, we're so grateful that you're here with us. We're here with us in this season of soft emergence, is what I'm calling it right now, where we're not pushing so hard, but we're allowing ourselves to emerge in our own timing. So thank you for listening, everyone. I will link the few books that Laura mentioned in the show notes. So if you're interested in taking a look at those, you can click on those links. And then if you're interested, I know we spoke a lot about ayahuasca and the ceremonies that Laura's participated in in Dallas. If you're interested in something like that, I'm going to link obviously Laura's information so you can reach out to her on Instagram and DM her because something like that is like very special. And so I'm not going to put all the information here. Like, if that's something that you're interested in, you need

Final Thanks And Community Links

SPEAKER_02 1:05:45

to go and talk to Laura about it. So um, thank you again, Laura. You're amazing. I love you so much. Love you so much, Rand. Thank you so much for spending time with us on the Modern Zen Collective Podcast. This podcast is at the heart of everything that we do, created to guide, inspire, and walk alongside you on your journey. If you're ready for more, explore our Practitioner Collective, a trusted resource of experts in healing and wellness to help you deepen your practice or fast track transformation. And be sure to join our email community to get first access to new offerings, challenges, and exclusive wisdom. You'll find all the links in the show notes, and until next time, keep trusting your path and honoring your unfolding.