Charlotte Voisey, New Leader of Tales of the Cocktail Foundation

The Banter

The Guys talk about remarkable Italian wines that you should try including an alternative to the amazing, and pricey, Amarone. 

The Conversation

The Restaurant Guys appreciate Charlotte Voisey, newly minted Executive Director of The Tales of the Cocktail Foundation, taking time to talk to them when Tales of the Cocktail Conference is merely days away. They go over the past, present and future of both Tales of the Cocktail and Charlotte and how the intersection created The Contemporary Cocktail Landscape, internationally!

The Inside Track

The Guys have been attending the Tales of the Cocktail Conference in New Orleans for years, crossing paths with Charlotte. 

Francis: I remember the first time I met you. I was in a bar in New Orleans, I think, and you came in in full regalia at a Tales thing and you were carrying a croquet mallet and then you opened your mouth and a British accent spilled out. And I thought, wow, that girl's really going all the way with it.

Charlotte: That sounds about right.

Charlotte Voisey on The Restaurant Guys Podcast 2025

Bio

As Executive Director of Tales of the Cocktail, Charlotte Charlotte Voisey oversees the Foundation’s mission to educate, advance, and support the global drinks community. Prior to the Executive Director appointment, Charlotte served as the Overall Chair of the Spirited Awards from 2016 to 2024. In 2010 her contributions were recognized when she won a Spirited Award for “Best American Brand Ambassador.”

Her career is also marked by her tenure at William Grant & Sons, where she led the company’s globally respected Brand Ambassadors. 

Charlotte has been recognized as UK Bartender of the Year, Mixologist of the Year, and a Silver Medal at the World Female Bartender Championships.  

Info

To attend the LIVE podcast in NOLA on July 22, 2025 email

TheGuys@RestaurantGuysPodcast.com

Tales of the Cocktail Foundation

https://talesofthecocktail.org/

BAR 5 Day 

https://beveragealcoholresource.com/bar-5-day-program/

If you'll be in New Orleans on July 22, join us for a LIVE show with Jeff "Beachbum" Berry and Annene Kelly at Latitude 29! Tiki talk and tiki drinks. Email theguys@restaurantguyspodcast.com for more info. We hope to see you there!

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Transcript

the-restaurant-guys_2_07-08-2025_134431: 0:50

Hello everybody and welcome. You are listening to the Restaurant Guys. I'm Mark Pascal and I'm here with Francis Shot. Together we own stage left in Catherine Lombardi, restaurants in New Brunswick, New Jersey. We are here to bring you the inside track on food, wine, and the finer things in life. Hello, mark. Hello Francis. And this week we're also gonna be bringing you some of the finer things in cocktails. Yeah, well that is one of the finer things Absolutely. On our list anyway. We know that for sure. Our guest a little bit is gonna be Charlotte Foi. She is the Executive Director of Tales of the Cocktail. Uh, it is the preeminent cocktail conference in the world. We've been there over a dozen times. It's down in New Orleans. It's next week. If you can go, you should sign up for Tales of the Cocktail. And if you happen to be down in New Orleans, we'll be recording a show with Jeff Beach, bum Berry from his bar, latitude 29. We're gonna be doing that in front of a live audience, and the live audience will get service from cocktails. So if you want to come. Email us if you're gonna be in New Orleans next week. The guys@restaurantguyspodcast.com. And, uh, we'll take, uh, restaurant guys regulars get first dibs, but we'll, uh, we'll have some, some seats for you in a live audience. We also have coming up a, a tasting of amarone and wines from Val Pello, uh, here in the restaurant. And. Just, it's such an interesting category of wine that I, that I thought it might be something that you and I could just spend a couple of minutes talking about on the show. Well, we should. We should tell people when they can come though. Friday we have Jam Batista Alini, who's gonna be here just for wines. It's a cool wine tasting. You can find out about that. Sorry for all the plugs, everybody, but it's a, it's a big week for us. But, uh, jam Patusa Alini is an actual knight of Val Pelli. He was knighted by the Italian Republic and, and the wines are outrageous and if you want to come, go to stage left.com/events, so people will often look at aone. So, so from the region of a Pella and we, we, you know. A lot of people, when they think Val Pella, they think about, especially if you're our age, Bowl of Val Pella was everywhere, right? It was$7 a bottle. It was People's House wine. It was one of those things that just, just everybody in the United States was drinking for a little while. Mm-hmm. And then you kind of saw Val Pella pullback. You didn't, you didn't see as many people in the United States drinking Val Pella and I. We're missing something. This region of the world makes some really, really cool, interesting wines. Right? SCO was a victim of its own success. Mm-hmm. So Val Pella is the region where you get this. The Val Pella is the, is the, is the regular wine. Of course, the most famous wine of Val Pella is the Ammar. Yes. Which is made from dried grapes. But Val Pella was one of those wines that after World War ii, Italy was very poor. The wine market was contracting around the world, and it was one of those names that was recognizable in the United States. And the, they, they just produced as much as they could. it all went into this kind of commune wine. And you got paid by the ton and, and it was crap. It was, you know what, it was serviceable. Mm-hmm. And it was cheap and Americans knew how to pronounce it. And you'd get it at Chiante or Ello. Yeah. Uh, you would get, and, but unfortunately there are always people who made great wine. In Valla. Yes. Uh, and, um, you know, and then the brittani family started com started showing their amarones in the sixties and seventies. I mean, wine connoisseur is always new. Mm-hmm. But when, when the, the demand is there for the cheap wine and you are in a poor country recovering from a world war, and you make what we'll sell. And, because there was so much serviceable, cheap Val Pella on the market. Americans were very reticent to the idea of paying money for a licella. And so the quality producers were kind of forced out because they, they, their brand was devalued and it's very sad. So now there's kind of, obviously like any wine in any place in the world, there's differing levels, right? Differing levels of, quality. And so you, you have that kind of basic Val Pella and like you, uh, said before, A is kind of the most well known. Wine from the region, right? Am Do you want me to explain what it is? Yeah, so, so what's cool about Amarone is they bring in the wine and it has to be at least a, and, and again, we don't call it by its grapes. So a lot of people don't understand. In the United States, it's a, it's a blend, but it's, it's specific. Gotta be at grapes, at least 50% of this grape called corvina. And. You bring the wine in or the grapes in and then they spend a amount of time drying on straw mats. Yeah. Yeah. And it's re a really interesting way of making wine because when you dry the wine on the straw mats, you're partially raisin in the wine. You're creating what, basically raisins, right? Right. Same, same print. I mean not, not as dry as the sun made raisins you have in your. Counter, but with half of the volume of water that they had when they went in. And so when people look at Amarone and they're like, wow, these wines are expensive. Right. The first thing that that comes to my mind is, well, you know, it's like a, a demi gloss versus a Right. You know, a, a gloss. Right. You, it's reduced. You've, you've taken the volume that could possibly come out of those grapes and shrunk it in half. Right. Right. So, but thereby. Concentrating those flavors. So eroni is singular in, in what it is and how it tastes because of those just intense concentrated raisin flavors from, from those grapes, two bottles of wines on every wine. And Well, and the, the, the funny thing is, um, the, a lot of the classic wines that we had in the sixties and seventies would taste a little of raisins. Mm-hmm. And most amarone today does not taste of raisins. Correct. You don't get that dried fruit quality. Except in small amounts. And then also, as the wine ages, sometimes that will come out. Mm-hmm. But when you get an incredible concentration, and, you know, these are very high in alcohol for European wines. These are on the higher end. They approach California cabernet levels of, concentration of alcohol, but it's not like a fruit bomb. it's Mark and my our favorite kinds of wine. And it's not just a matter of drying it. And, and there, you know, why doesn't everybody do that? Well. That only really works with certain grape varieties. There are a few other regions that do it, very small regions that do it, and. one of the things you have to be careful of, it has to be grapes that can, where it can happen, it has to be in a climate where it can happen because you can get mold on grapes. Yeah. Mold is a big concern, right? In most places. Um, some, some grapes just don't do well with it. But when you can make it ammar style, there's, um, are totally geeking out here. But in, but in, in Lina, in, um. Lamberty. They make a wine out of Nelo. They call it something different there, but it's Nelo and it's called Val. Perhaps you've, our Pepe is the most famous one you see in America. Mm-hmm. But they make a type of wine called a Sato or versa. It's the Amarone style. They do do the Amarone method, the drying method there. It's just, it's something that you can't always do. And when it's done, it's very expensive and, and it's usually something Mark and I really love and our. I also, there's another wine out there called Repaso. Oh yeah. And Repaso is a really cool wine'cause it gives you some of the flavor of a true amarone without the, the big expense. Right. So. Basically what they're doing is they're, is they take a, the amna of Ella, they take the Ella, well, they take an amna, they pour it out of the barrel. Mm-hmm. Okay. Then they take a new Val Ella, and they pour it in over all the junk that's still left in the barrel. Right, right. Junk. You didn't like that word, Francis? No. I just, I'm laughing because I was gonna say, Lee's, you said junk, whatever, you know, it all works. Oh. Stuff down there in a barrel. But what happens is there's a lot of flavor left in the stuff that's at in the bottom of the barrel. And that flavor now ennobles, that Val Pella that you're putting in that barrel. So you can get, and this is what I recommend to people before you go out and spend$150 on a bottle of, or a hundred dollars on a bottle of am, uh. Have a bottle of a Ella and decide if you like tho that style of wine, if you like those flavors. So there's re repaso or repaso, interesting difference between the two words. One of'em is trademarked by somebody, so the other one just use the other one. Yep. So, uh, the repaso, it means the resting wine. So you rest mm-hmm. Your regular Val Pella on the remnants of your amarone and you get a better wine. There's a little wine buying advice from the restaurant guys. Rep pastas almost always are. I have never had one I thought was not good and there's always, there always a great bargain. So Francis said that, you know, Amone are big style of wines, California, big style of wine. So one of the things we commonly say in the restaurant are, what do you drink after Amone? Another Amone. Yes. Port. It's pretty much it. That's But what do you do after you learn about Amarone? You sit down with the restaurant guys, you listen to an interview with Charlotte Voice C. Looking forward to talking to her in just a minute. We'll be back in just a moment.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 9:25

Hey everybody. Welcome back. Our guest today is Charlotte Voi. Charlotte is the Executive Director of Tales of the Cocktail, the world's leading cocktail conference, which happens in New Orleans next week, July 20th to the 25th. So pick yourself up a plane ticket and get yourself a ticket right now if you haven't already. Charlotte started as an award-winning bartender and then helps to define the role of brand ambassador. She's been a voice within the industry, but you've also seen her on the Food Network and shows like today and even Iron Chef Charlotte, welcome to the show. We're so happy to have you here and congratulations on the new role.

Charlotte: 10:00

Oh, thank you so much. It's a lovely intro. I'm super excited to be here with you. Thanks for having me.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 10:05

Yeah, it's Head of Tales of the Cocktail. That's a big deal. It is. And I, and there's no exaggeration. It is unquestionably the most important cocktail conference in the world. And that's a pretty big, pretty big role you've taken on there. Yeah. How'd you come to do that? No pressure on you. Yeah. Yeah.

Charlotte: 10:22

Yeah, no pressure. No, it, it is tales has, has always been, in my mind, the most important, uh, gathering for cocktail and spirit professionals anywhere in the world, right? My first tales was back in 2006, so I've had a front row seat to see the thing grow and expand and blossom. Um, really evolving as the industry does. So, uh, super excited. That this is my role. Super happy that this is the next chapter of my career. and it still gives me those butterflies. When I hear someone else sort of say it out loud, it's shall we?

Francis: 10:55

Well, you were involved in various committees, as many of us in the industry have been involved at different times in various committees, but this is your job now like how did you wind up doing this? I, I was surprised when I, and delighted when I saw that you had taken over this spot. and I think you're right, the right person to do it. How, how did it come about that you wound up taking this position?

Charlotte: 11:13

Yeah, thank you for saying that. So, um, I've been with, I had been with William Grunt and Sons for 18 years. Um, I moved to the US to work for Hendricks Gin back in the day. and enjoyed such a wonderful career. Only good memories, leading the Ambassador program for them. But, you know, sometimes. Change is a good thing. And after 18 years, doing what I loved and, and honestly in, in some ways could have done that, that job forever, realized that it was time for a change. Um, I didn't wanna leave the industry. I enjoyed the people that I've gotten to meet over the last 20 odd years, uh, both in the UK and over here and globally, and. Give back, um, have a meaningful contribution to the industry, but also learn, right, grow and develop in new ways for my own sake, for my own career. so when the opportunity for executive director of the Tales of the Cocktail Foundation, which is a non-for-profit organization, I. Came along, I thought, well, that kind of ticks all of those boxes that I just laid out for myself. I'm working in a different section of the industry. I actually get to work with everyone now, right? Because tales is like that, Switzerland, that neutral body in the middle that gets to work and bring everyone, uh, together. I get to leverage my skills and experience from the brand side, but I also get to lean in and learn how to run a company, work in non-profit. Bring people together in different ways that I gotta before.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 12:45

Well, you know, I think the bar community is, really excited to see you move into this position because we feel like one of us. Right, and I, and I think that position hasn't had one of us in that position before, and we're really excited for the things that are gonna come from this.

Charlotte: 13:03

Yeah, it's, well, thank you for saying that. And when I thought through the process of taking this role and when it was announced, you know, I, I made the comment that I, I didn't step into this lightly and in a good way, I do feel the weight of the industry on my shoulders. Um, and, and that's part of the duty, it's part of the privilege as well, of having this role. I know what tales can be for the industry. Um, I know that it's very precious to so many people. Many of the industry feel ownership for tales and quite rightly so because it's. The industry that has built tales based in New Orleans, obviously with the local community, but then the global industry have helped make tales what it is today. So tales truly belongs to the industry. So when I take on this role, I do it representing the industry as much as I do representing tales.

Francis: 13:54

And I want to say to the listeners, we're gonna stay in the industry inside track here for another minute or two, and then we're gonna bring it out to the broader world just, regular drinkers as well. but I, I do wanna spend a moment talking about what you did for the last 18 years.'cause, so brand ambassadors a weird, it's a weird thing, right? And brand ambassadors didn't exist five years before you became a brand ambassador. you're not in the industry, you, you might not know what we're talking about,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_150544: 14:21

So we should tell

Mark: 14:21

people

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_150544: 14:21

what a brand ambassador is. Brand ambassadors responsible for the image of a brand and the connection of that brand between the restaurant or business or consumer and the people who distribute those products. so they can show you the product in its best light.

Francis: 14:38

you kind of created the role. You and Simon created the role of brand ambassador and you kind of piloted the of the best of what that is. And it sounds like a very corporate term. And in some companies it actually became that, sadly. What was the role of a brand ambassador as opposed to a sales rep?

Charlotte: 15:00

Yeah, it's a, it's a great topic. I love talking about this and I do owe a lot to Simon Ford, um, who at the time worked for Plymouth and really paved the way ambassadors in the. Um, essentially my role as a brand ambassador was to make people fall in love with my brand, which at the time was Hendricks Gin and later the full portfolio of William Grandsons. Right. And that's a lovely, lofty North star to have as a, as a role profile. Right. How you go about that. You know, a lot of the brand ambassador work was around education, and events. Bringing the brand to life so that people would understand what makes your brand different, hopefully, um, so that they could understand it and then recommend it on to guests. and that how you get there can look very different. In fact, you know, we would always say no two days are the same, let alone two weeks. The role of a brand ambassador is anything you can think of that gets you to that end goal. But the important thing to remember, and you're quite right, the term brand ambassador these days can mean many different things because every company, every brand or portfolio of brands does it slightly differently, and that's. Now that there are many brand ambassadors, the role can look different. So no two brand ambassadors are the same for us at William Grant and Sons. Um, brand ambassador was all marketing. It wasn't a sales role. There weren't sales goals, there weren't numbers and cases to chase. It was all about marketing. So it was storytelling, education, pr.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 16:33

I, I wanna, I wanna stop you right there'cause you know, mark and I. I with wines, it's all estate. Bottled wines from small producers, right? With, distillers, we love to deal with small distillers when we can, but small distillers are few and far between, and most small distillers eventually are gonna get bigger and sell to a, a bigger house if they're good. William Grant has a family owned, company, distribution company, and, um. I have to say that the way that you guys did brand ambassador and the way that some people still do, uh, even with William Grant and some others, is by creating a community around the brand. And I know, geez, I sound like a corporate shill, but we're so not about this, but really. Everyone knew everyone at Tales The Cocktail, like you, you, they, you involve the bar owners and more importantly, the bartenders who weren't even owners. And it wasn't like, you need to buy five cases from me next week and I have a special deal for you. It was, Hey, let's talk about this product and does it work? And I remember the first time I met you. Um. I was in a bar. I, we were in New Orleans, I think, and you came in in full regalia at a tails thing and you were carrying a croquet mallet and, and, and then you opened your mouth and a British accent spilled out. And I thought, wow, that girl's really going all the way with it.

Charlotte: 17:53

That sounds about right.

Francis: 17:54

But I thought at the time I thought, you know, this is my life. This is part of the crazy life I like being a part of, you know? Um, and then I think that bartenders then can bring that back to their customers. It's like they bring the same kind of party back to the bar. And I, yeah, it kind of works. what I, what I would like to just include in that is. There's a couple of people I think who do it similarly, but it seems to me the philosophy and, and you said it, everything you need to say is they were not responsible for how many cases were sold. They were responsible for all the external things that caused cases to be sold. Yeah. And you felt that, But I can tell you every person from William Grant who's ever walked in the door here, because they did it differently. And there's a culture in that organization of being a brand ambassador. And I, and I, again, I know we're getting a little geeky here, but there's a culture in in William Grant, and again, family owned company. And you feel it, and it comes from the top down, and I think you've left them in a really good position and you have to be very happy about, and I'm sure they're very happy for you because I, I feel like they're in a really good spot because of the number of people who you've lined up underneath you.

Charlotte: 19:05

Well, thank you. I'm very proud of everything that I was able to do there. I'm also very proud of the team, um,'cause it's an exceptional team. I mean, you guys know Eric Anderson very well on Hendricks gin. Um, there's a hundred ambassadors for William Grant around the world, across 40 different countries, and I can tell you they might not all be quite as special as Eric, but they're very good. Rare characters, amazing personalities, and it's just the passion that drives them, right. They genuinely care about hospitality, food, wine, cocktail, spirits, how things are made. They can get geeky. They can also just make sure someone's having a great time. Um, and it's, as you guys know better than anyone, it's the people in this industry that make the difference.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 19:46

It's true.

Charlotte: 19:46

and that's a great team.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 19:47

It's true. So now we, we are at tales of the cocktail. Let's move on to the next phase. you are doing this not beholden to any specific brand It's about being a center of the community. What is tales of the cocktail? I think it, it surprised everyone, including its founder Ann Tarman, we have to say who, who started this, that she, she, I know was surprised by how it kind of took over the, you know, takes over the city of New Orleans for a week and how much it's taken over the imagination of the bar world. But what is the role of tales of the cocktail today and how is it different from, say, Portland Cocktail Week or other festivals? It, to me, it still is the beating heart of the, it's the one time a year. Everybody comes from around the world, not just across America, and you're in New Orleans and it, it still is at the center. What's its function?

Charlotte: 20:35

Yeah. The answer to that question is twofold, really. First and foremost, tales of the cocktail in July and New Orleans is the largest gathering of spirits and cocktail professionals anywhere in the world, right? And it is the opportunity to gather, network, connect, educate each other. And inspire each other first and foremost, that's what Tales serves to do, and it serves to do that up and down the industry. Meaning if you are someone like Aon from the bar, you come to Tales every year and you. Share your contributions and achievements with others through educational seminars, popups, you, you share your gift, um, but you're also able to sit down in a seminar room and hear from others and, and continue to educate yourself so the event itself serves, um, to really support the industry in that way. The second part of, of the answer to that is Tales of the Cocktail Foundation is a year round effort with a mission specifically to educate, advance, and support the industry globally.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 21:38

So you're the boss now. What's gonna change the tales of the cocktail?

Charlotte: 21:42

Well, we only need to make big changes if things are broken. And

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 21:45

Right.

Charlotte: 21:46

cup over the last few years has, uh, built back up to a really responsible, fun, successful, meaningful, well programmed event. Um, so it's, it's a privilege for me to take that over. And obviously as I go, I will, um, make suggestions and enhancements and changes where they need to be made. Right? The first thing I need to do is learn tales of the cocktail from the inside, um, and go through it this year. And this is my, probably my best opportunity to have a little bit of bandwidth to step back and listen. To listen from a neutral perspective to everyone. What are, what are the needs of bartenders, of bar owners? What do journalists come to tales for? How can we truly deliver on what I said our mission was, which is educate, advance, and support. Like what does that really mean? Because it only benefits the communities we're trying to help if they get what they need. So this year it's all about me stepping back and listening so that I can start to enact the change that will move the needle next year onwards.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 22:46

I think that we should point out that tales the cocktail, it had, it had a bit of a bumpy road right before COVID it has done a great job in making sure it's respectable and safe but at the, at the same time, you know, it was always a place for rebels. It was always a little bit on the edge. It was always a little more of a pirate ship than a Disney cruise. And as corporations come in and they are not all, they don't all have the same ethos as William Grant. Um, how do we keep tales of the cocktail? Not just for drinks, executives who have an NBA who, you know, it's about bartenders who you know, are in the drinks industry or the, or the restaurant industry, because we're not corporate people. We're, we're a little bit on the outside I presume most of the people coming to tails are coming from, you know, smaller. You know, they own 1, 2, 3 places Are, are they, I mean, let's, let's, that's, that's the question. That's, that's my presumption. Is that true?

Charlotte: 23:42

It's a good mix, honestly. Uh, we do have like the data by demographic of where people are coming from. First of all, global us, the states that are most represented, obviously the age bracket, so we can understand are the younger generation coming through. They are, um, an important stat that

Mark: 23:59

The old people are still coming too Charlotte, right?

Charlotte: 24:02

Of course, and we love them. Um, one step we've seen the last couple of years is that 50% of people who come to tails are coming for the very first time,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 24:10

Wow.

Charlotte: 24:11

which yes, it wow is the, is the correct answer, right? Like that speaks volumes if you think about, uh, tails still being relevant, but then also what we need to deliver at tails,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 24:21

Right.

Charlotte: 24:22

Speaking to a new audience every, every year, but also the old guard are kind of coming back and, and still in the mix. So it's just, it's an interesting dynamic. Um, where tales sits right now in terms of your original question, how do we sort of it for the industry? Uh, we put a lot of effort in making sure that the industry. Guide us onto what the programming is, right? So for every committee, whether it's spirited awards, education, the wellness program we have called Beyond the Bar, those programs are chaired by industry members. So we invite in and they roll off every couple of years. So we've always got fresh perspectives from bartenders from around the world, um, making sure that they're advising us on what is the content that we need to be putting out there, and how should we be communicating to the industry so that it's not just. All brand dictated, which there's a place for that. But to your point, it can't just be that because otherwise it's, it becomes,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 25:17

Yeah.

Charlotte: 25:17

and that's not what tales is and it, that doesn't meet the mission of supporting the communities around the world, right? So we have to keep, come back to the North Star and we do that by making it for the industry, by the industry.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 25:29

Well, while it is for the industry and by the industry and I, and that is true, and like a lot of us will come in a day early and, and meet up with old friends and you, you know, the, the thing is, but for people who've been going, we've probably been going as long as. As each other to this thing is your, everybody who's in the industry is busy doing things like, because you're committed, but then you also wanna make time to meet your friends and, and, uh, and reconnect. It's, we all, we all leave specific gaps in our schedule. Yeah. Just to, just to make sure that we're available to, to meet up. It's, it's, it's a joyful time, I think there's an interesting mix of consumers who aren't necessarily connected to the industry, but who just like are enthusiastic cocktails and think it's a great time and it is a great time. How, how does that work in and how many people are, and that more on toward the weekend or how, how does the non bartender consumer, um, or ex bartender I used to bartend years ago and I'm gonna go to tales of the cocktail. How, how, how did that clientele work in, what do they do?

Charlotte: 26:23

Yeah, I mean, they're welcome, right? Doors are wide open and tickets are still on sale. Tales of the cocktail.org, um, they're welcome to come. I mean, there are certain parts of the program that definitely pertain more to the consumer, the guest, right? Whether it's the spirited drinking or dining series, meaning go along to a great bar or a restaurant in New Orleans and you might meet a bartender behind the bar from who's popped up there from Hong Kong or from Milan or from London. And you can get a little bit of a. Tells are done in other parts of the world. That's always fun. I think while getting to know the great bars of New Orleans, um, some of the seminars we put on, particularly in the culture track, you know, you can go along and listen to Dale tell his story about, um, how he started through Joe Baum in the Rainbow Room, a story that. The three of us have heard many times, but does it ever get old? I

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 27:13

Yeah.

Charlotte: 27:14

inspiring, right? Dale tells a story and everyone's hooked. So there are, there are different like parts of the program, of the tales, of the cocktail agenda that definitely speak to the guest, the non bartender who can come in and, and just enjoy. And also of course. Learn, right? Because if they're interested in cocktails, there are maybe some basic TE seminars that they could go to. We saw during COVID, people started making at not come to knowledge further Your in in this.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 27:43

Yeah, I think that YouTube did a very interesting thing and it was exacerbated during, uh, the COVID era, you know, people. You know, Jennifer learned how to fix the dryer, you know, and, and, uh, and, uh, I, we all, we all in the industry did cocktail seminars for our guests. We did some virtual cocktail parties. Yep. And, uh, I think it's great that people are embracing the cocktail at home in a, in a more than a gin and tonic kind of way. But listen, we're gonna take a quick break. We'll be right back on the other side with Charlotte Voie from Tales of the Cocktail. Don't go away. Hey there. Welcome back. We're here with Charlotte talking about tales of the cocktail, Charlotte tales of the cocktail.org that people can go.

Charlotte: 28:22

That's right.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 28:23

Yeah, if you're gonna be down in Tales of the Cocktail, email us at, uh, the guys@restaurantguyspodcast.com. Maybe we can run into each other or go to something together. It'll be, it's a great time to be in New Orleans. Um, you know, we've been going there for such a long time and the city, you know, we've seen a lot of different movement in the city and different neighborhoods popping up as kind of the hot new neighborhood and, and New Orleans has, has changed a lot. In the 20 years that we've been going to tales and, and it's, you know, again, some things for the better, some things for the worse, and then some things for the better again. So how are you dealing with the whole dynamic of, you know, we used to do it at the Monte Leon was used to be the center. Now it's Ritz.

Mark: 29:01

Now it's the Ritz. How, how is, how does tales deal with the, the evolving situation in Orleans? New Orleans

Charlotte: 29:07

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, first of all, you know, couldn't be happier that New Orleans is our home. Right? It's such a wonderful city, and I think there's no coincidence that tales has become the most popular event because it's in New Orleans, right?

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 29:19

Mm-hmm.

Charlotte: 29:19

people travel because. Yes, it's for work. Yes, I get to see these people and learn these things, but I also get, world class jazz, great food, um, and fun times. So yeah, very grateful to New Orleans and I think, you know, tales is owned by, um, the Solomon family who have deep ties in New Orleans. So in terms of keeping pace. Finger on the pulse with what's happening in the New Orleans community. Um, we have that in spades and half of the tales of the cocktail team who work full-time during the year live in New Orleans. So we've got that bloodline back to the community. We've got cons, constant understanding of, of what's going on, what are the local issues, you know. How can tales of the cocktail contribute when we can appropriately to, to the priorities? Um, so it's always that balance, right? It's about sort of thinking local while we're acting global and also thinking global while we're acting local, if that makes sense. Um, but, but New Orleans is very important to, to tales.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 30:17

It doesn't. I remember when Anne started Tales, I had a conversation with, I wasn't at the first Tales, but I was at the second or third. The first Tales was like 14 people, you know, walking around New Orleans with Anne. And um, but I remember that she said one of the reasons that she was looking to do it, and she was not a drinks professional, she was a tourist person looking to promote New Orleans and to plop it down in the middle of the summer is not New Orleans high season. Yeah. Maybe January. Can we move to January? Well, the reason New Orleans, she said, I wanna bring. A, a conference to New Orleans when New Orleans needs it most. I mean, we've seen recently, uh, Venetian tourists skirting water guns at tourists to tell them to go home. That it's, there's too many tourists there. How do, how do New Orleans and how do New Orleans businesses and residents react to, uh, the influx of 20,000 bartenders?

Charlotte: 31:04

Yep. We've heard from many people, business owners in particularly, that uh, they are very grateful for tales of the cocktail being there in July, that it is critical to their economy, um, that it's become a must have. Um, we did a media preview in New Orleans. At the end of May this year, and as my first time in this role, you know, people were keen to make that point to me, and sort of making sure that I didn't have any grand ideas of picking up tales and taking it to another part of the country or, or the world that, you know, tales needs New Orleans. But New Orleans also, you know, benefits from tales of the cocktail. Priority to make sure that we continue to deliver that economic impact as well as a morale impact, hopefully, um, to the city, to the local hospitality community, to the bartenders of New Orleans. Now, there are pros and cons of having tails of the cocktail on your doorstep, of course. but overall I think it's a, it's a good thing for the economy, and that's what I've heard from locals.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 32:05

You know, I remember back, you know, in the, the old OG stories, um, when Tales of the Cocktails first came to New Orleans, the cocktail revolution in America was underway, but had not yet reached New Orleans and New Orleans. I. Was a very important city to the history of the cocktail. But like the rest of America, it was gone. I mean, the View Carre was invented at the carousel bar at the Monteon Hotel and they didn't know how to make a UVU car view Carre. I remember the carousel bar getting not great view Carre at the carousel bar in the early years and uh, but I think the tales of the cocktail then kickstarted New Orleans cocktail. Seen and it is once again a very, very important cocktail city. 12 months a year. the cocktail was helped to be brought to America and the world by New Orleans, but it was brought back to New Orleans by tales of the cocktail.

Charlotte: 32:55

Uh, that's a very nice way to put it. And yeah, and that's why I think there's just this beautiful, mutually beneficial relationship. Right. Um, certainly New Orleans has benefited from having just such great people in our industry coming through and spending time in those bars, um, and giving inspiration to,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 33:14

Sure.

Charlotte: 33:14

and of course, you know, they're only able to do that because they're inspired to come here for the history of New Orleans.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 33:21

Yes.

Charlotte: 33:21

To walk around, um, the city and, and go to these places where those cocktails that we've read about for years are actually were invented. I mean, I remember coming for my first time to the city at all, and it was in that way. It was like walking around a cocktail museum. It's incredibly inspiring. So the two things go very much hand in hand. And is an exceptional city for cocktails now.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 33:44

Sure. How many, for sure how many people come. Can you give us some stats?'cause I'm, people are always impressed, like, oh, it's a cocktail conference. That's nice. Give us how many people, how, how much business comes through. What, what is, how big is tales right now?

Charlotte: 33:56

It is big. I mean, the numbers are approximately, approximately 10,000 people, I believe came last year to tell the cocktail. and most of the majority of those are flying in from somewhere, right? Which means hotel nights. Obviously restaurants, bars, as well as the money they may spend on tickets to tails itself. Ubers stores, tourism. I mean, the city does definitely benefit in many different ways from people spending money. And because it's New Orleans and because a lot of people are coming from far, they're not just coming for those. Five days. To your point, France, they're coming in early because they can, because they wanna, because they're connecting with others because maybe it's their once in a lifetime to be in New Orleans or they love it so much. It's something on their annual calendar, so they add in, which, which only adds to the benefit.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 34:48

I have to, I wanna share one funny story from. I think it was 2009 or 2010, but it was at the Monteon Hotel and it wasn't as big as it eventually became. And we, I, we came in on the first day, mark, I don't think you came with me this year. I don't remember. You'll, you'll remember if I, if I say this, I, I had a, a gaggle of children in between there, so I didn't come every year. I only had, the only people depended on me were the local bartenders and they all were tails. So I had to go there to take care of them. But we went. I went down to Tales and I was at the Monteon Hotel and we didn't have to take up the whole hotel at that point. And I, I looked around and I talked to one of the people I knew from the hotel, and it was, um, we were one of three conferences going on at the same time. It was, tales of the Cocktail Bartenders. It was cardiologists and it was swingers. And it was, and there was some maybe for some wild elevator rides, right? So, but we all thought that the swingers would hook up with the bartenders by the end of the week. Incorrect. The cardiologists and the swingers all went up together. Who knew? Who knew?

Charlotte: 35:55

Listen, any story that begins with, I remember in the old days the tales of the cocktail. It's gonna be a good one. So yes, I do remember that year, I believe.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 36:04

so one of the things we haven't really touched on is, yeah. We understand your life as a brand ambassador, and we understand your life here now, your new life here at ahead of tails of the cocktail. But before that, it was, it was Charlotte, the bartender, it was Charlotte, the person opening new places. how did you fall into this life?'cause most of us fell into this life, right? We didn't, we didn't go to college and think, okay, mom says it, it'd be great if I became a bartender.

Charlotte: 36:33

Yeah. No, I got very lucky early on. I, I was one of those people that I never really knew exactly what I wanted to do. I mean, you know, asked me when I was five years old. Sure. I wanted to be an astronaut like everyone else, right? But I didn't have serious defined career plans. Um, so I kind of postponed that decision for as long as possible. I went to university and I picked a course that gave me a year in industry, meaning I wouldn't go to school that year. I would actually work, and it was with a great restaurant company called My Kind of Town, which if you actually research, a lot of great people came from that. Company based in London, but global. They had franchises all over the world. So I joined them and I worked with them in London and Spain. And then once I graduated, I went to Argentina for two years with them then that, that was like 2000, 2001. And I got the call in 2001 to come back to London because the same company were opening a cocktail specific bar because classic cocktails were sort of coming back in London. And I was like early twenties, like. Sure that sounds great. Um, opened a Barco apartment 1, 9 5 in Chelsea in London. And then I can say the rest is history, um, because that was the era that I met Simon, Ford cocktail competitions were just starting to happen in London. Dale came over to work with the Match Group Milk and Honey London opened. Things were starting to happen around that era that you could get. Serious about cocktails and start pursuing a career as a serious bartender, which before then wasn't necessarily an option. So I just kind of kept following the stepping stones because they were fun and enjoyable, and then they'd sort of turned into a real career. So very, very lucky.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 38:19

So what brought you to the United States? I mean, because you became bartender of the year. A couple of different publications just as the London cocktail scene was launching. so why did you come here?

Charlotte: 38:30

I got a offer I couldn't refuse.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 38:33

Wow. And then you got stuck and now you're in New Orleans as far away from London as you could possibly be.

Charlotte: 38:37

Yeah, I couldn't have written this. No, I, I was approached by William Sons to move to America and work for them. Um, a fantastic, uh, ex-colleague now of mine, but still good friend Jeremiah Courtney had a vision. for the US and he did a lot of the early work on Hendricks gin. So when he has visions, they're usually pretty good. His vision was that he needed somebody who understood the bartender community to connect the brands with the bartender community in the US and he wanted that person to meet Be Me. I said, yes, came over. Uh, and that's pretty much what I built.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 39:11

I think one of the interesting changes, and I'm curious for your perspective on this,'cause we've both been parallel in the industry for a long time and running the same circles for a long time and have watched the same developments from different perspectives, right? We have a lot of friends in common. We've seen a lot of things come and go. I think it's very interesting to me that there are more and more bartenders who are interested to learn the techniques. They want to have a cocktail enter the cannon, or be known for a cocktail or be written about, and they're enthusiastic about the drinks they're putting before you. Um,

Charlotte: 39:46

Mm-hmm.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 39:46

I think that. Sometimes a young bartenders don't realize that without the context cocktails don't mean anything. The story of the cocktail, the story of the things that go into'em, the story of the ingredients, cocktails are part of our culture and that's why they're important. It's not just a random mix of ingredients and I think tales of the cocktail. You have a, you are kind of the keeper of the story and the educator of the story, to young bartenders. I mean, do, what do you think about that dichotomy? I.

Charlotte: 40:17

Yeah, I think you're right. I mean, it's interesting, right? Like we all have generational context and reference points, so as we go, go through life and through our careers, you kind of, you, you get used to that one frame of reference like. You know, I first started bartending in the late 1990s, so those cocktails that were around then and people knew, I, I know those, and those are kind of my reference point. If I was to quote those to a young up and coming bartender, now they probably wouldn't know what I was talking about. Or they think it was a joke because those strings are so retro, uh, that nobody likes them anymore. So it's all about that frame of reference. Um, and on the one hand I get excited learning from the younger generation because. Uh, in some ways they have like a freedom to innovate. They perhaps have less reverence for those classics'cause they weren't brought up on them. Right. So that's on the one hand, but you're absolutely right, history is important. And just like we learned from the 18 hundreds, maybe young bartenders now are learning from, you know, the eighties, the nineties Dale era, the early two thousands when things took a massive turn. Like how did those changes happen and what did we learn from? So education. Continuously through the eras is really important, and that's why we have sessions like this year at Tales. We have the last 20 years of the Museum of the American Cocktail, Phil Green talking about what happened over the last 20 years and then putting that in the context of the broader history of the cocktail. And we're also hearing from Dale this year specifically, he's telling his story. As I mentioned before about Joe Baum and the Rainbow Room in the 1980s in New York City because there are a whole generation of bartenders who haven't heard that story, which is inconceivable to someone from my generation because we grew up on that, but, and it's not that story serves to inspire, but it also lets them know like who the giants have been that have helped them walk into this role now as a bartender and certain luxuries and benefits that bartenders have now that. Day or didn't have that'cause he had to basically reinvent them.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 42:28

Well, you know, and I think what's I, I just as important is that Al and David Wonder, Ted Hay and all those guys, Taught us about the origin of the cocktail and where it came from and its role in a bar. And then we lost it for a while and they had to resurrect it. And I think with things like tales of the cocktail, we have to make sure we never lose it again. Yeah. I think that I, I guess that's one of the things that tales is, is. For me, one of the purposes of tales is to make sure we don't go off the rails again. Yeah, right. Francis was talking about innovation and, and needing to know the past in order to, to innovate without, blowing it all up again. because I do see people who don't know the past and don't understand the basics of the cocktail and don't know where this drink came from or why we're doing, or why drinks are important. Right. Why or, or why we're, we're mixing these ingredients and. There's still a lot of crappy cocktails out there. There's still a lot of people who are just putting two things together because it's cool and nobody did it before. Well, sometimes it's cool and nobody did it before is crappy. Yeah, yeah,

Charlotte: 43:31

Yeah.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 43:32

yeah.

Charlotte: 43:33

you know, there are, that's why having great people are in, in our industry is so important. Like, take someone like Julie Reer, right, who's been around,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 43:40

Mm-hmm.

Charlotte: 43:40

just as long as those guys and consistently putting out great cocktails that speak to people. You know, Julie's so great at just making drinks that people love and integrate in the, like the next generation at New York. Yeah, I'm sure you guys have been like, there's

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 43:55

Yep.

Charlotte: 43:56

a young fun energy and Julie's always great about, yes. I mean, she knows what she's doing with her eyes closed, but she always listens to the next generation and incorporates their ideas. And in some ways I think that's a great way to like blend history with modern thought and make sure the two kind of have their place as a bit of a.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 44:14

Listen, we're we're old guy bartenders, but we need to listen to our younger staff. Yeah, a hundred percent. You know, when they're talking about what's happening, where it's happening,

Charlotte: 44:22

Yeah.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 44:23

you know, the next thing, the next thing they want to try. I, we, we have to listen to them, but it's our obligation to teach them the, the foundation.

Charlotte: 44:31

Yeah. It's a two way street, right?

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 44:33

And I'm sort of amazed. One of the nice things about tales of the cocktail is, you know, so many different activities in our world are segregated by age, right? Everybody's within five to seven years of each other, and you're down at tales of the cocktail and. You know, there's OGs and there's young kids and there's everybody in the middle. And it's really every class, every seminar, every exhibit is intergenerational. And that's, and that's a, a, a beautiful and and rare thing. So listen, we've heaped a lot of praise on Tales, the cocktail because we have, um, had a lot of amazing experiences at it, and we're super thrilled. That you're gonna be there. we have to, um, mention,'cause we're talking about young people and moving the story forward.

Charlotte: 45:12

Yep.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 45:12

you guys have the, the cocktail apprentice program.

Charlotte: 45:16

Yep. Okay.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 45:16

we've sent some people to the cocktail apprentice program and it's a, it's, it's a really cool thing that serves the purposes that we were talking about. So can you tell us about that?

Charlotte: 45:25

Yeah, so the Cocktail Apprentice program, fondly regarded as cap, um, is a annual program where bartenders from all over the world apply to be a part of, of this program. It's essentially, um. mentorship, part education, part execution. Right. So the caps come in a few days before tales, um, and they basically spend the week working in the kitchen, prepping all of the ingredients and cocktails that are served primarily in the educational seminars at Tales of the cocktail, as well as some of the other events like spirited awards. Um, it is one of the most sort of fulfilling experiences a young bartender can have or any bartender can have in the industry. Um, it's very intense. Uh, the focus is on to have these bartenders leave knowing a lot more than when they started. Um, and it's become a community. It's been running for many years. And the CAP alumni, if, I mean, you, you pick up 10 names out of the air of well-known bartenders, I can guarantee eight or nine of them have been caps.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 46:29

Yeah, and there's a real collegiality among caps that have been going on for a long time. So if you have a bar and you have a young, an up and coming bartender who you think should apply, it's worthwhile. Or if you are a young, an up and coming bartender, and even if you think, you know. What, you know, um, it's worth going to cap and, and making this network. it's been my experience in life that the best way to network and get yourself involved in a community is not to visit or go to a seminar, but to work somewhere for a week. And then you'll really get to know, I mean, like, working the harvest, people have to know it's, it's a job, right? Yeah. You're gonna, you're gonna work if you're, if you're a cap, at least the people we've sent have got gotten great learning experiences out of it. For sure. Charlotte, you still involved with PAR?

Charlotte: 47:08

Yes, I am. Yeah. Still involved with Bar five day, um, each year working with Steve Olson and Doug Frost. Yep.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 47:16

Can you tell us about Bar five day?

Charlotte: 47:17

Yeah, so Bar five Day is the most accomplished accreditation in beverage alcohol in the us. it is a five day intense. educational study program that happens once a year, spirits are taught through tasting primarily. Um, so students come and the, the students that come to the class are not beginner bartenders. They are seasoned professionals who already excel in their work are looking to. Um, accredit their work or get to the next level. So spirit categories. Every spirit category you can imagine is taught through tasting, through blind tasting. So we learn, we teach and we learn how to identify spirits by nose in and tasting them. there's also a mixology component where. The students will make drinks for a practical exam at the end, and then a very intense study of the history of our industry as well as but also being bartender and running.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 48:21

Francis took this course, what, 15, 20 years ago? I know it was an early graduate. Well, I will just say when he came back, it was as if he had been beaten every day for five days until he passed. It would, no, but it, it's intense. You have five days, so you need to, you learn all day and then you need to go home and study and then you come back. But I will remember my bar exam. I was in camper English, who's a, an accomplished mind writer, was also a, a student. And so I'm standing next to camper English and, um. Examining me in the, in the bar practical was Jacque Weo and Dale Degra, who are friends of mine. Right. And my hands are freaking shaking. I'm like, I've made you drinks before. Why am I nervous? No, I haven't been nervous behind the bar since I was 22, but I was 35 and I was, uh, yeah. But it, but the bar five that I learned, I went in knowing a lot. I came out knowing a lot more than I knew going in. It's really worth it.

Charlotte: 49:15

it's incredible. It's, it's, it's phenomenal and, and if anyone does get the opportunity and some people, you know, have to wait a few years, it is an investment, but it's an incredible opportunity to raise your game to the next level.

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_140118: 49:26

so I'm afraid we do have to leave it there because we've gotta go pack for New Orleans. We'll put links in our show notes to the bar, five day details of the cocktail, and you can email us the guys@restaurantguyspodcast.com. If you'd like to come meet us in New Orleans and maybe be present for a live podcast from down there,

the-restaurant-guys_3_07-08-2025_150149: 50:02

She's pretty amazing. No, a a great, she's done everything in this business now. I mean, really everything I do, I do remember the first time I met her with that Croquet. Mallet and then, and then she opened her mouth and there was a British accent and I thought, all right. This, I was wondering if it was a real British accent or that was part of the cosplay and it was super fun. I'll tell you though, tales the cocktail. I've, we've had so many great memories there and I will tell you. As a a young bartender or a young bar owner, it's great to go and just attend the seminars and attend things where you meet people. Even if you don't go to the structured things, there's tasting rooms that you can be a part of and you buy a different day pass depending on the things you want to do that day. It's a little bit complicated, but that's because I think. People want to engage on different levels. Some people wanna do tech to learn, go to seminars about techniques. Some want to go to seminars about history. Some don't wanna go to seminars at all. They have spirited dinners. Um, if you're in the industry, there are a lot of parties. Uh, some of the parties, you're invite only if you do business with those companies. You can ask your rep if you can get invited. There's, there's plenty of fun things to do there. Yeah, tons. And there's plenty of learning things to do there. I've always really enjoyed that. That both of those things existed there. Yeah, and it's all, it's why it's always been one of my two favorite events of the year. Right then Italy and tales of the cocktail Yep. Have been kind of the two events and obviously one's around wine and one's around cocktails, but those are for me, the two premier events of the year. You know, the other thing about New Orleans, I think first of all, they're friendlier down that part of the country than we are up here. Yes, okay. They just are, but. At Tales of the Cocktail, it's not only about the people who are down there, it's sort of the ethos of tales of the cocktail. Bartenders are chatty people. Mm-hmm. Right? Brand ambassadors are chatty people, spirits makers are, are chatty people. It is really easy to just marinate New Orleans, get a tasting pass, visit, cool tasting rooms, go to one or two seminars, go to one or two, two-spirited dinners. If you're a consumer. And just start talking to people. Yep. I, I really, you know, not the swingers or the cardiologists, I guess the cardiologists, the Uber drivers are good people to talk to. Yeah. Oh, they're great. What? They're just all this information about the city and what's going on. Yeah. It's a good old time. It's a good old time. Love going down there. Anyway, uh, I hope that you have enjoyed this with Charlotte Boise and learning about tales of the cocktail. We're gonna go pack and we'll be down there. I hope we see some of you down there. I'm Francis Shot. I'm Mark Pascal. We are the restaurant guys. You can find out more as always@restaurantguyspodcast.com.