Chuck Schroeder--From Agriculture to Art and Many Hats Along the Way

In this episode, we sit down with the legendary Chuck Schroeder, a leader who has worn many hats across an eclectic and influential career. From serving as Nebraska’s Director of Agriculture to leading the National Cattlemen’s Beef Association, preserving the Western way of life at the National Cowboy and Western Heritage Museum, and helping shape the future of rural communities through the Rural Futures Institute, Chuck has spent decades at the intersection of ag policy and culture. Now, he’s taken on a new role--the role of an artist--exploring familiar faces and landscapes through a different medium. This conversation traces the common threads running through his work and reflects on leadership, reinvention, and what it means to keep creating new chapters in a life well lived.  

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:02

Nebraska, it's not just a place, but a way of life. It's 93 counties that are home to innovative individuals, caring community, and a spirit that runs deeper than its purple story. It's a story that should be told. Welcome to 93, the podcast.

SPEAKER_02 0:25

Welcome to 93. This is a podcast about Nebraska, its communities, its number one industry agriculture, and the people who make it happen. I'm Mark Folson, your host for today's episode, brought to you by Nebraska's law firm, Rembald Lutke. Our guest for this episode has worn lots of hats during his lifetime. He's been at the Center of Agriculture and Public Service, as Nebraska's Director of Ag, as CEO of the National Cattleman's Beef Association, and as a national voice for producers at moments of real challenges and change. He's helped preserve Western history and identity by leading the National Cowboy and Western Heritage Museum. He's worked to imagine what comes next for rural America through the Rural Futures Institute. Each role required leadership, conviction, and a deep understanding of people and place. But today, our guest wears a different kind of hat, the hat of an artist. These days, Chuck Schroeder tells stories not through policy or institutions, but through creativity, reflection, and canvas. We're going to explore the through line connecting all those chapters, as well as perhaps the ones to come. Chuck Schroeder, welcome to 93 the podcast. Before uh we get into the many, many hats you've worn throughout your life, uh, let me ask this. When people today ask you uh what you did what you're doing these days, what do you tell them?

SPEAKER_01 1:51

I say I'm an artist. Where did that where did that come from? Well, I I I have to say, I mean, it's not only true, that's that's what I do seven days a week right now, but uh 25 years ago, uh my wife sent me, me being very reluctant at the time, sent me to the Taos Institute of Art in Taos, New Mexico for a summer session. And uh I came under the tutelage of Renata Collins Hume, who has become a huge factor in my life. She's a great artist uh in her own right, uh, but also a Jungian-trained clinical psychologist and um uh Tai Chi instructor, was a fireman. She's done all kinds of stuff. Anyway, uh Ms. Collins, uh, she was at that time famously at the end of this course, took me out in the hallway and said she was German, born at the end of World War II in Berlin. Took me out in the hallway and said, You may lie to me with that mouth of yours, but I have seen you speak through your hands. I know who you are. You are an artist, and I want you to say it right now. Don't tell me you fool with art or it's some silly hobby. You are an artist. You speak through your hands, I want you to say it. So, in her honor, I happily say I'm an artist.

SPEAKER_02 3:17

Had you done that before? Is that something I mean you were in high school or college? Had you been uh doodling or at least some indication that you had some talent for art?

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Oh yeah. I mean, I've done art all my life. From the time I was a little kid, uh used to draw cartoons and and uh through high school I did little stupid doodles that would on my test papers and such that would get me in trouble with uh members of the faculty. But um uh which which led to one creative teacher saying, Well, so why don't you illustrate the annual this year? So I did. Anyway, uh so I've I've done art at some level all my life, and it's always been uh important to me personally as a as a means of communicating. But um it was uh when Kathy uh sent me to the Taos Institute uh for my 50th birthday, and I came with this very intimate encounter with a serious instructor in Ms. Collins. Um that changed my life. And um and she forced me to recognize that it's art is part of my soul and part of who I am. And I was uh a CEO of the National Cattleman's Beef Association at the time. Uh six months later, I left there and went to be CEO of the National Cowboy and Western Heritage Museum uh under Ms. Collins' uh encouragement and guidance, and uh and that became a full-body immersion in the world of art. And um while it was also running a museum, which I knew nothing about, and uh a museum that was in serious financial trouble at the time. So it involved a lot more than art, but it uh brought me in contact with a number of really great artists, uh, some of whom became very dear friends, and then um uh Sherry McGraw in particular, another Taos artist, uh, invited me to come work in her studio in uh 2015. And um that that was a huge turning point. Um I it was at the same time as I came back to Nebraska to start the Rural Futures Institute. Uh, but I started working seriously with Sherry, and uh four years later she sat down with me in Taos and said, Why don't you commit your life to this? Uh as she put it, you may have another 20 years if you'll eat more salads. Um but uh uh you're pretty good. I'll help you. But um I want you to consider committing your life to this. Six months later, I left the university and I've been doing this full time ever since. And I love every day of it.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

That's awesome. So where are you originally from?

SPEAKER_01 6:12

Uh little town of Palisade in southwest Nebraska, west of McCook, about 30 miles. Uh it's where I was where I was born and raised on a ranch, farm and ranch operation there.

SPEAKER_02 6:23

If I'm not mistaken, there are two counties that claim Palisade. Which county did you do you call home?

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Well, uh the fact is I claim both of them. I I was actually in 4 H in both counties uh growing up. So um we our ranch operation was on both sides of the county line, so uh I could do that legitimately and and had had great friends in on both sides of the line, and and uh so I'm I'm really a native of both counties.

SPEAKER_02 6:50

That's Hayes and Hitchcock. Hayes and Hitchcock, right? So what license plate prefix did you have on your license plates?

SPEAKER_01 6:56

Well, we had uh actually we had some 79 from Hayes County and some 67s from Hitchcock County, depending on where they resided on one of our places.

SPEAKER_02 7:07

We're doing this podcast so we get someone from all 93 counties, so I'm claiming two with claim two, yes, you may. One great question I love asking farm and ranch kids is how old were you when you first got on either a tractor or a horse?

SPEAKER_01 7:20

Well, I have to I have to laugh about that question a little bit. I it was a horse, and uh I don't know, I was three or four. I I rode with my dad uh from from very early on. Uh I have no idea when I first got on a tractor. I all I know is that uh a tractor seat never fit my butt very well. And um so I was honestly from early on, it was recognized that I was probably not gonna be a great asset on the farming side of our operation, and I I spent most of my time with cows and horses.

SPEAKER_02 7:57

Yeah. Uh where do you live now?

SPEAKER_01 7:59

I live southeast of Eagle, Nebraska, a little town uh just uh east of Lincoln, and we're we're still horse people. Um uh we have a we built a barn, paddocks, and a little arena uh southeast of Eagle, and and uh and we love it uh there in Odo County.

SPEAKER_02 8:17

Where'd you go to high school?

SPEAKER_01 8:18

Palisade. Uh we had our own high school in those days. It was a Class D school, but it's now Juanita Palisade. Uh and uh my wife is from Juanita, so uh we claim both schools.

SPEAKER_02 8:32

Well how many kids in your high school class?

SPEAKER_01 8:35

Uh 14. Uh if I remember correctly, yeah, uh 10 girls and four boys.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

So what things kept you busy in high school? What activities?

SPEAKER_01 8:45

Well, I I was in all sports uh for sure, and uh, but I I high school rodeoed. Uh I rope calves. I I uh actually I had a brother-in-law uh married my oldest uh stepsister who worked all three riding events and had uh as a pro and had all the attendant injuries that come with work in the riding events. So by the time I came along and was interested in rodeo, uh my options were working the timed events, and and my dad uh had some some really good friends who were pro-caf ropers, and I just became really fascinated uh with that event early on, and those guys were my heroes, and so um yeah, I I I loved roping kies and and my dad and I uh started the quarter horse business when I was 16 years old. We leased a band of marriage together in a stud. And so I've been in and around the quarter horse business uh really since I was a kid as well.

SPEAKER_02 9:47

When was the last time you did a rodeo event?

SPEAKER_01 9:50

Uh the truth is I was competing um in Oklahoma until I moved back here in uh in 2014. I went to the Select World Championships in in 2011, 12, and 13.

SPEAKER_02 10:02

Um do you miss it?

SPEAKER_01 10:04

Uh no, I mean I'm still horseback twice a week, and and uh two mares that uh I showed that are they're just great horses and both are products of breeding decisions my dad and I made over 50 years ago. Um so and and they're they're really, really important to me and my mental health as well as physical health. And it just it means a lot to me to be able to go out and and fool those mares that uh uh I mean they know me better than I know me in some cases. I mean, I've got all kinds of shaggy dog stories about uh Jenx, the older mare in particular, that took me to the world show so many times. But um, when I when I moved back to Nebraska, it isn't that there aren't really good cowboys in Nebraska. There are uh plenty of them. But Oklahoma was just, it was a that was a whole different deal. And uh I had so many just really close friends that I roped with there and uh who coached me and and helped me in so many ways. And uh so when I left Oklahoma, I I knew I was probably gonna leave the competition side behind. I I didn't really want to try to reestablish that whole infrastructure uh somewhere else. And so I I still enjoy the horses and still have the pictures, and uh I'm I'm still in touch with uh so many of those guys. Um actually from going back 50 years, I mean my my college rodeo friends uh that that I stay in touch with on a regular basis. And and uh so we still gossip and tell stories about the old days and and it's great fun. And I uh well and I just I just rely on them uh as part of my whole social structure uh so much. I just I know them and trust them in a in a unique way.

SPEAKER_02 12:01

After graduating from Palisade High School, where did you go?

SPEAKER_01 12:04

Uh University of Nebraska, Lincoln. Majoring in animal science. Uh I had animal science uh production and business options. My dad insisted that I take a lot of business courses, uh so I did. But uh yeah, that was uh that was really a great experience here at UNL. Um I've actually done portraits of what we call the legends of animal science. A lot of those uh faculty members that were around back in those days. You know, this doesn't happen anymore, but uh those guys were around here 35, 40 years and uh stayed in touch with their students. Uh I mean, if if you were serious about it, they stayed in touch with a lot of their students long after graduation. And uh and that's uh I just I really treasured that time.

SPEAKER_02 12:53

Was one of those the legendary R.B. Warren?

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Absolutely, yeah. I mean, RB uh it it used to be a good story in our family. Um uh I first judged in front of R.B. Warren at this at the state uh 4-H horse judging contest when I was 15 years old. And uh gave a set of reasons to him in Lexington, Nebraska. I can remember it as clearly as if it was yesterday, uh, on some aluminum bleachers. I swear I had the bleachers were rattling for my knees uh uh chipping together. But uh I just I knew at that time that I I wanted to judge for RB Warren and we had two neighbor boys uh that were real heroes to me as well, the McClatchy brothers, uh, both of whom had judged for RB and and uh and helped us a lot with field days. My dad was a great promoter of youth, and um, so we had livestock judging field days at our ranch from as early as I can remember. Anyway, and those guys helped, and so that was kind of how I got to know him. Well, so I come to the university and and uh I I go out for the junior judging team. Well, I'm gonna tell you, I I was not doing well. And um I'd we'd been gone about a month, and I called my dad one day and I said, Look, I I just can't I can't put up with this guy. Um, we do not see eye to eye, and he's kind of a tyrant. And I said, I just I I I'm I'm gonna quit. And my dad said, just listen to me patiently, and he said, Why don't you give it two more weeks? And then and then let's talk again. You you've you've got plenty of time. Just give it two more weeks. Well, two more weeks and then two more weeks and then two more weeks, and and uh RB just uh I mean it's he's he's legendary. I mean, he was very demanding, very uncompromising. I mean, if you judged at Nebraska uh in those days, I mean you you were among the elite. Um you were gonna look at more livestock, make more decisions than maybe at any other institution in the United States. I mean, it it was a real big deal. And uh uh and you know, I mean, there were 60, 70 guys that uh come out for the junior team. Um, so it was it was no small thing. Anyway, uh I I just fast forward, uh, ended up on the junior team and then on the senior on the varsity team, and and uh and then RB got me my first judging gigs um after school and um and then just over the next, well, till he died, uh we just we became very, very close friends. He he tracked me. He tracked me around on my goofy eclectic career everywhere I went. He would show up unannounced, uh, always, no appointment, no nothing. I I always remember when I was at the National Cowboy Museum, um uh I came walking out into the this we have a long, long marble hallway that's kind of the the center of the institution, and I heard this voice echoing down that hallway, and I thought, God, that sounds like RB. Well, he was down talking to one of the security guys, asking him, I'd only been there a short time, asking one of the security guys how I was doing. And uh, and that's just what he would do. So it was always it was never just a social call. He would he would always begin with, Well, how are you doing? Uh, what's your biggest problem? Uh, what are your plans? What's your what's your biggest objective here? How are you addressing that? And by the way, you need a haircut. So and that's no kidding. So anyway, yeah, he was a he was really a hero to me, and and um I I treasure that uh relationship.

SPEAKER_02 16:55

He was an intimidating man, especially you mentioned 15. I think I was a little bit younger when I had to first give a set of oral reasons to him. And you have a gentleman who only has one arm, right? Often had a huge dip in his mouth, and he has a large presence, and he was, I mean, he was larger in life when it comes to Nebraska animal science, beef cattle industry, horses. Uh uh, there are a lot of great stories. They don't just don't make him like that anymore.

SPEAKER_01 17:19

Oh, yeah, yeah. I uh actually after when I when I moved back to Lincoln um after I'd been at the ranch 10 years, uh uh he called me one night and and uh said, Do you still rope? And I said, Well, yeah, but I said, you know, I don't I don't have it, I don't have a horse here. And I mean I would I was really out of pocket. And he said, Well, he said, I got a horse. And I said, Well, I don't even have my he said, I've got ropes, I've I've got all that. We're we're gonna go to York on Saturday uh for a jackpot. So I'll pick you up, okay? Okay, and so away we went. So so we got to rope together, uh, some at that stage of life, and and I it was really an opportunity driving up and down the road and often late at night with that, for me to go back and say, why did you why did you do that? Why did why have you invested so much of your life into coach and livestock judging teams? And uh, and it was fascinating. And he said, he said it was never just about judging. He said, I knew early on that I wanted to try to make men out of boys. I mean, it in those days it was still an all-male deal. Now that shortly after that, he started including women, and and they they're they're a huge part of it now. But anyway, he said I I wanted to help guys grow up. And so he said livestock judging was a way for me to do that. And um he said I just I just wanted to be the best I possibly could. And so and boy, he did. I mean, I have to say, he believe me, he changed my attitude as a human being, my confidence in who I am and my capacity to make a decision, to stand up to resistance, uh, to criticism. And um uh I mean, and I'm I'm one of hundreds, if not thousands, that he influenced in that way.

SPEAKER_02 19:33

So one of the works of art of yours that I have seen is one of RB himself. What what was the story behind that?

SPEAKER_01 19:40

I really um once I got into art in a serious way, um, I I was I was principally a portraiture artist at that time. And I really wanted to um I I really wanted to honor him uh with a portrait. And so I I drew him a number of times. And uh anyway, and then they they were of course developing the RB Warren Arena uh at uh in the animal science department. And I quite honestly I can't even remember all of the interactions that went on around that, but uh, I also at that same time got reacquainted with his two daughters that I had only known tangentially uh when I was a student. And um anyway, uh they became very interested uh and enthralled to some degree with that project. And um uh anyway, it it ended up being used in the animal science department at the entrance uh to the RB Warren Arena, and I'm I'm very very very proud of that. Uh but it was a uh um I went through several iterations and and working um with um Gail and Lisa uh on that to you know he was a complex guy, and so many people think of him as that gruff stern uh and which he which he was and could be, but he also had a he had an enormous kindness at his core and a great sense of humor once you got into that. So I wanted to express all of that uh in that portrait, and uh I worked on it for several months. And uh and anyway, in the end, I think it does tell that story.

SPEAKER_02 21:40

Other than the uh livestock judging team, did you do any rodeo in college?

SPEAKER_01 21:45

Yeah, I was on the rodeo team at UNL and and uh again, just roping calves at the time, and so still uh gosh, guys um that were on the team uh at that time are still just. Some of my very closest friends on earth. And some of them, I actually art has given me an opportunity to reconnect with some of those guys after 50 years, which has been a lot of fun, uh, as they've been coming to my shows. And and uh, but I yeah, I really treasure those relationships.

SPEAKER_02 22:16

You used a word earlier, eclectic. I think probably there's probably no better word that describes your career. Uh uh one of the jobs you held, and uh, I told you coming in that that when I first met you, and uh again, uh really held you in the highest of esteem is when you were the director of agriculture in the state of Nebraska. How did that position come about?

SPEAKER_01 22:35

Well, um certainly unexpectedly and was not part of my life plan, although you can say if I ever had a life plan, it was uh momentary because it didn't play out. But um uh when I graduated from UNL, I went back to the ranch and I very much expected to spend my life getting calves and foals in and out of cows and mares. That was that was what I was gonna do. Very involved in the Hereford business and uh in the quarter horse business and whatever, and uh judged a lot of livestock shows, and we did, you know, that was who I was gonna be. Well, the ag crisis of the 1980s uh came along, and um I I just I got pretty upset about the way I thought rural people were being treated. Um I which I thought was unfair. Uh, I mean the ag economy was a wreck. Uh you know, commodity prices were low, interest rates were very, very high, and um uh people were losing their farms and ranches uh right and left. I felt a good bit of it wasn't necessarily their fault and that they warranted somebody to stick up for them. And and I'd been shooting my mouth off since I was about 14 years old uh on various issues, uh including being editor of the school paper that was shut down by the superintendent for one of my editorials. So so sticking my nose or leading with my chin, if you will, in these things was not particularly new. But anyway, um I was very involved with the Nebraska stock growers and and my family had always been involved uh in cowboy politics, if you will. Thought it was uh we just thought it was part of our obligation. Anyway, um uh Bob Carey was uh running for governor. I mean, I was a lifelong Republican and all this and that. But uh I met him early in the campaign, and I I just felt like um we we spoke the same language. I respected him, and um so ended up supporting him in that campaign with no expectation whatsoever that I would uh get involved in government um beyond just that. Well, he called me one day and said, uh, you got to come help me do government. And that led to conversations, and um, and again, I just felt like people that I knew, loved, and respected were being abused by the system and by people with money and power. And um as as one of my old business partners, Harold Thompson out in Washington, who I started partnering with when I was a senior in college on bulls, cows, horses, et cetera. And uh Harold once told another party in a business transaction, he said, you know that Chucky, he's the nicer guy you'd ever met, but he said, Boy, he don't take pushing worth a damn. And so I and I don't. And so I just felt like perhaps I could I could at least stick up for people that I thought were being kicked around. And so I away I went. I'd I left the ranch, which I thought was going to be my lifelong endeavor, and uh moved to Lincoln and started out in an uh as assistant director in an egg policy role, and then uh later became director.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

And how did you come to join the National Cattleman's Beef Association?

SPEAKER_01 26:31

Well, um, again, that was uh was was quite unexpected. Um I was I was at the University of Nebraska Foundation um uh at the time. I'd been there nearly 10 years. Uh and uh again at that point I thought maybe that's what I was gonna do for the rest of my life. Well, the the beef industry was going through some real turmoil and introspection. Uh they were they were the beef industry was losing market share to poultry in particular, uh uh in dramatic numbers. And um there were there were so many different organizations representing, purportedly representing the interests uh of uh beef producers and the beef industry generally. So there was all this turmoil. Anyway, uh so a group of leaders in the industry uh got together over a I think it was an 18-month period of time to establish a single long-range plan uh for the industry, which would include creating a new consolidated organization under one leadership and focused on delivering on that long-range plan. Well, uh, which I was just I was really an outsider at that point. Um I mean, I was still involved uh with the ranch to some degree, but not that much. So I was just sort of watching all this happen. Well, I got a call one day uh from some guys I I really respected uh asking if I would be a candidate uh to be the first CEO of the new organization, which by the way was not yet even formed, uh, but they were starting this search, and so I kicked that around. Uh again, it was it was really not something that was high on my list of ambitions, but I I had to sit down with myself and say, I I would not be where I am today if it were not for some real heroes in the beef industry who went way out of their way to support me as a as a kid, as a young man. Um uh I mean by the time I uh left college, thanks to leaders in the beef industry, I'd I'd spoken in 35 states. Um I'd seen a lot of this country, I'd seen things that I would never uh have otherwise seen, experienced things, gotten to know uh people that I had great respect for. And I I had to say, if I can help in this, I really feel like I have an obligation to do that. So I agreed to be a candidate. Well, they had 50 candidates, and I thought this may not amount to anything anyway. Well, one thing led to another, and I ended up being their uh chosen candidate. Uh interestingly enough, with the support of Bob Carey and Clayton Yider, uh, who you you couldn't be farther apart on the political spectrum. Philosophically, they weren't that far apart. But anyway, uh I I have always treasured that those two guys both stepped up and supported me in any way. So I ended up uh uh taking that role to organize, uh really come and organize what is now in CBA. And how long did you do that? Uh I was there for seven years, uh, which was sort of an interesting thing, and that everybody told me up front the new guy won't last three years because you had to make a lot of really, really hard decisions about downsizing some offices, consolidating things, changing direction, reorganizing, uh violating old political uh allies. Uh you just had to do a lot of things that were gonna not make you very popular. Well, I survived three years and then it was five, and then it was six, and I thought, well, I guess I could stay here forever, but I I never I never had any notion of being an association exec for all my life. I don't I don't think it was my best talent. I I think I was maybe the right guy at the right time for that particular thing. Uh, thanks to the support of Don Clifton and some other folks that you wouldn't think had anything to do with the livestock industry. But anyway, um I did I started saying to myself, is that all there is to a fire? Uh, you know, what else might be out there? And then that's when Kathy sent me to the Taos Institute of Art and and uh Ms. Collins and uh made just this very dramatic, what seemed at the time a very dramatic uh career shift uh from association exec to uh museum director.

SPEAKER_02 31:34

Yeah, National Cowboy and Western Heritage Museum, Oklahoma City?

SPEAKER_01 31:38

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_02 31:39

So what explain the history behind that?

SPEAKER_01 31:41

Yeah, it's uh it's it's a it's a great institution. It uh started in 1965, and um uh my first memory is uh I mean I was a senior in high school, 1969, and uh my dad and I, I don't remember if we were it was probably on some livestock adventure of some kind, we were always taken. But anyway, he took me to Oklahoma City and to uh what was then the National Cowboy Hall of Fame and said, this is about our kind of people. And and he's he was a supporter uh early on. He had this plastic model of the original building uh in his office. But uh he just thought it was really important, and so um this place was uh it it's it's it's really a great story when um Chester Reynolds uh led the way, who was a who was an exec with with Levi or Lee, uh Lee Jeans back in those days. Uh anyway, he led the effort to establish a national uh cowboy hall of fame. And there were several cities that were competing uh to host the new Cowboy Hall of Fame, uh Denver, Fort Worth, Oklahoma City, there were several. And uh uh I I love this story in that uh as Oakies will do, uh there was to be a presentation. I believe the meeting was in Denver, I'm not certain of that. There was to be a presentation from each of the major cities about why they should be so. While most cities showed up with their fancy presentations that some ad firm had developed for them, and what a wonderful city it is, and and their cowboy roots and all this now. Well, the Oakies uh they went out and got a piece of land uh uh up on top of Old Persimmon Hill, donated, and raised a million dollars, and just came and sat down and said, uh, we've got a place and a million bucks, and we're ready to build this. And that was in the conversation. Well, I'm just I mean, it just blew the minds of some of these folks that were thought they were better promoters. But anyway, Oklahoma City was a was a perfect place for it. And they, the the city, I mean, raising the money included uh little kids with uh plastic bank boxes or cardboard in which they'd put their pennies that went to the Cowboy Hall of Fame. And they I mean, they raised a a dollar, two dollars, ten dollars. I mean, there were some there were some major donors, the Gaylord family in particular. There were some very large donors to it, but it was really a grassroots effort, and um and they've they've always embraced it and loved it. Uh, but it is a national institution. It is all about honoring, remembering, uh, celebrating uh the heritage of the American West, and in particular the people, uh, the cowboys that built it. And um I've it it's it's one of the world's greatest uh Western art collections, uh, it's one of the greatest collections of Western memorabilia, one of the greatest archives on the American West, anywhere. Um, make no mistake. But there are other great Western art museums and art collections in the country, uh all of whom I respect, but none of them were built on that foundation of this is about these people and why they were special and why they're important to this country and to the world. And I just um quite honestly, I at the time I took the job at the Cowboy Museum, I I had uh the same offer uh from the Buffalo Bill uh Western Heritage Center in Cody, Wyoming, uh, that had lots of money and had a had a great Western art collection and a beautiful setting and all this and that. Uh uh Senator Al Simpson was chairman of their board and a great guy and one of the great personalities, and that I'd gotten to know uh while I was at National Cattleman. And uh so I had to make that decision. And so I went to Taos uh to meet with my old teacher, uh Renata Collins, and um spent a whole day uh going through, and I you know, I had my my legal pad with the line down the middle and the pros and cons and pros and cons and you know size of endowment and strength of board and all this sort of stuff. And Ms. Collins listened to me for hours and finally said, Stop, stop, stop. She said, You're asking all the wrong questions. And I said, No, I'm not. I said, I'm a business guy. I mean, these are the boy, these are big deals. Bah. She says, you already know what you're wanting to do. You're just trying to convince me. Let your heart tell you where to go. The money will follow. Believe me. And so next day I had to call Al Simpson and say, hey, I'm not coming to Cody. He was very unhappy. And I and I went to Oklahoma City that had lots of financial problems and all kinds of stuff. But it was the right thing. It was the right thing.

SPEAKER_02 37:06

Is there a Chuck Schroeder original hanging in the museum?

SPEAKER_01 37:09

No, there is not, and probably will never be.

SPEAKER_02 37:11

Someday.

SPEAKER_01 37:12

You never know. But uh no, and that's that's really not my ambition. But uh, but I do I still love the place, and and uh Kathy and I both um, you know, we'd lived in a number of different places and and we had friends and all this. Our our Oklahoma City adopted us in a in just an amazing way, and we continue to have just very, very dear friends uh in Oklahoma City and the Oklahoma area that uh we we go back down there two or three times a year, and and I still I just have been talking to Pat Fitzgerald, their uh new director, uh this week. And I I still love it, and I think it's one of the most important institutions uh for and about the American West anywhere.

SPEAKER_02 38:01

You mentioned a stint at the Rural Futures Institute. Uh what is that and what'd you do?

SPEAKER_01 38:07

Yeah, so uh yeah, the reason that I came uh back here from Oklahoma was um uh Ronnie Green and J.B. Millican. Uh JB was president of the university, Ronnie was uh vice-chancellor for ag and natural resources at the time, and both longtime friends of mine for whom I had enormous respect. They had a they had a really big idea about establishing uh a university-wide institute that would bring together a broader array of resources to addressing the challenges of rural community um vitality, of just being able to sustain uh rural communities, the largest collection of resources in history. And um anyway, they asked me to come back and um uh uh help start that uh at the university. So uh which I it was a huge idea. Um I'd been at the National Cowboy Museum for 12 years, uh, which is is a long time in one of those roles. Um uh we had resolved uh, at least for the time, um the major financial problems that they were facing. It was on it was really on solid footing. Um and anyway, I've I have two granddaughters uh here at Seward, my daughter and son-in-law uh both here in Lincoln. And um it it seemed like a good time uh that I thought maybe I had one more big start in me, so uh came back here. Um it budget issues and other things that I I probably don't even want to get into. Um we we we we didn't take it as far in in terms of long-term establishment uh as had been our dream. But um there are programs that we established during that time that are still going, the uh the rural fellows, the students that were sending out uh into rural communities that made a huge difference. Um number of those things are still going on, and I'm I'm very, very proud of that. But um anyway, I did that for four years, and and that's when Sherry McGraw sat down with me and said, Why don't you commit your life to art? And so I did.

SPEAKER_02 40:28

So speaking of your art, what's your favorite medium as far as the type of art that you do?

SPEAKER_01 40:33

Well, that's a that's a that's a fun question uh at our house. And it uh quite honestly, it makes me so treasure. I I've had four major instructors in the art realm uh over the last 25 years, uh, starting with Miss Collins, and then Sherry McGraw, uh, and then uh Chris Morrell, who's a great landscape painter in Taos, and now Scott Christensen, uh also one of the great landscape painters in the world out of Victor, Idaho. And I say that just to say I've been very blessed to have teachers at every step along the way who said, don't be afraid to try other media. So I started out as a watercolorist uh primarily. I mean, I mean I've always done work in graphite and and that sort of thing. But um started out in watercolor. But anyway, now I I work uh a lot in in oil, uh, but I also still do watercolor, uh I do a lot of gouache, um uh opaque watercolor that Scott Christensen got me interested in. Uh I do pastels, I do uh charcoal, Conti. Uh but the only thing I don't, I'm not a sculptor, and I don't do acrylic. But otherwise, I mean people say, what's your favorite? And I always just say whatever's in my hand at the time. Because I I might I might work in in three media in a day just because I'm working on different subjects. And Sherry always says, uh let your subject determine your medium. And and I try to do that.

unknown 42:11

I try to do that.

SPEAKER_02 42:13

Uh I assume someone has not been to your studio, describe it for us.

SPEAKER_01 42:17

Well, yeah, so it's in my in my home uh there at Eagle, and it's the first time that I I really have had a significant dedicated uh space for my studio, which uh when we we bought the home then built everything else around it. But uh it was an unfinished uh downstairs walkout basement, and so uh we took a significant portion of that and turned it into my studio. But it um I'll have uh actually I have one, two, three, three or four easels going at at any one time. I'm I'm a I'm a bit of a dilettante as uh is reflected in my career. Uh I'm always interested in lots of things at once. Uh uh Jack Maddox, one of my old heroes uh who got me involved with the Nebraska Stock Rowers. And Jack uh had been a uh very distinguished uh pilot, uh uh military pilot um and uh and flight instructor. And I said to Jack one time as we were driving to a stock grow, I mean, I said, you know, I'd really like to learn to fly. And he said, why? I said, well, you know, just save time. And I said, I just I I think it'd be good. Uh he said, you know, Chuck, he said, I've I've taught a lot of guys to fly in the military and then private. I said, Yeah. He said, you may be the least appropriate candidate to be a pilot that I know. And I said, why is that? He said, because of your constant tendency to want to think about three things at one time, and you can't, and that that would make you a single Why don't you just keep driving and hire somebody to fly if you need to fly? So, anyway, that that's the way my mind works. So, anyway, uh going back to my studio, um, I uh I actually have two large easels now that uh for larger oil paintings, larger one for smaller oil paintings, and I have a a table where I do a lot of gouache uh and watercolor, and then I uh will often have one or more uh easels with drawing paper up on them than I'm that I'm either doing studies for uh the paintings or I I do a fair number of uh charcoal conti uh uh drawings of both uh portraits and landscapes. So um there's always always a lot going on.

SPEAKER_02 44:53

So where do you get your inspiration from as far as what works you're gonna do?

SPEAKER_01 44:57

I I I have to say, again, I'm always I've always been interested in a lot of different things. I mean, uh when I was a when I was a little kid, uh there was an older woman in Palisade, uh, Mrs. Larson, that my folks would engage to babysit me when they traveled, and they traveled a fair amount. And so she was she was very close to me from the time I was an infant. And uh uh people in the community remember that uh when she would see me on the street, she would say, Chuck, who are you today? Because I I was always at one time I wanted to be a doctor, a vet, uh I always wanted to be a cowboy, I wanted to be a politician, I wanted to be an actor. Uh it I've always had a lot of different interests. So point is, um I guess I have a heart that's that's easily grasped by uh things around me, and I get fascinated with them. And so um, whether it's people, I've always been fascinated with other human beings in the broadest array of walks of life. Um I uh so that's always thanks to Sherry McGraw, who really threw me into portraiture when it used to terrify me. Um, and then it just became an obsession. Um, but people uh inspire me. Um certainly now in working with with uh Scott Christensen and Chris Morrell, uh I find landscapes uh that that really grab me and um and just make me want to work hard enough to be able to say what I want to say about or what it what these things are saying to me and to try to to be able to convey that to people who see my work.

SPEAKER_02 46:54

Are there any common themes or parallels between your role or many roles as a leader of various organizations and entities in now your work, your creative work as an artist?

SPEAKER_01 47:05

I I love that I love that question because uh it has through the course of my life if there's if there's one thing that I've learned, it is that you have to believe in what you're doing, whether it's a subject matter for a painting or whether it's an organization that you're going to lead. I've uh Robert Henry, uh one of Nebraska's greatest treasures, uh, and who wrote a great book uh called The Art Spirit. Henry always said, don't invest yourself in drawing and painting uh things just because you can. Focus on those things that really touch your heart. Um and and the truth is uh through the course of my my leadership career, I've seen all kinds of people who come with their NBA or their kit bag of plans and schemes and and uh structures uh that they think they can apply anywhere. Um uh and so they they they apply for jobs and leadership because they they don't give one hoot about the organization or its mission or the people that are in it. They just want to come do this thing. Well, I think that's wrong. And so uh it's wrong for me. And so I I have to say I've been I've been enormously blessed my my mother, God bless her, uh, recognized early on that I was always gonna be interested in a lot of different things, and she was way okay with that. Uh, you know, what are you gonna be when you grow up? I never had a very good answer for that. Um so I just always had a lot of different interests, and I've been very blessed to have had the opportunity uh, you know, to be on the ranch. I mean, I really I believed in high-quality livestock. I mean, a great bull or a great horse, I mean, would just keep me up nights. And I so I had a chance to do that for 10 years and you know, produced SC Classic. It was one of the great Harford Bulls in history. Uh anyway, here nor there, I had a chance to do that. I had to had a chance to work in politics uh with people that I really believed in for a cause that I thought was enormously important uh at the time, and uh, and I was very inspired by them. I had the chance to go to the National Cattlemen and work with people from across the country and around the world, actually. Again, on things that I thought were important for people, for beef producers that uh man were so important to me uh culturally and every other way in my life, the chance to serve them in a way that I thought was important. Uh, then going to the National Cowboy Museum. I mean, it was a man, that was it was hard work. But I loved it. I loved the institution. I had the opportunity every day to walk down those hallways, look at works from you know Albert Bierstadt to Charlie Russell to uh Tom Ryan to my old friend Bill Owen. Um see that great work every day. And you if if that doesn't touch your heart, you don't have one. Uh anyway, to do that for 12 years and work with such wonderful people, come back to the university and and uh which which was also a great experience. I mean, uh uh working with Jim Linder when he was interim president of the university was an enormous experience. And if if if he were still there, I'd probably still be there. Uh, but anyway, worked with some great people in rural communities across Nebraska. Oh my gosh. I mean, people from West Point, COZAD, I can I can go on and on that that were just absolute heroes, and then to for the final chapter, now be able to seven days a week uh either be in the studio or out on location somewhere, uh using the gift of art. God called me to do this art thing. I there's that's just all there is to it. He called me to use it to touch other people. My my wife says I get up every morning hoping to make somebody cry. Uh that really isn't true, but I have to say, when when I can unveil a portrait with RB Warren, when I can unveil a landscape uh for a farm and ranch family that have invested generations of their life in a place, and it does elicit a tear or two. I I think I'm doing what God called me to do.

SPEAKER_02 51:58

So if people want to learn more about your artwork, where should they go?

SPEAKER_01 52:02

Uh we have a website that actually is uh thanks to uh Hannah Nelson Robertson, who was a uh product of the Angler Agribusiness Entrepreneurship Program at UNL, which I just love and have enjoyed working with Tom Field and those kids uh now for a number of years. She's overhauling my website right now, but it is uh uh schroederfineart.com. And um it's uh it's gonna be better soon. Uh otherwise, uh Kathy and I have done something that uh we're having a lot of fun with. We we've done uh nearly 20 one-man shows uh at uh from from galleries to business institutions um uh all over the state and elsewhere. But we have recently uh taken part of this downstairs space where I have my studio and uh created essentially a gallery space there where we have very much enjoyed uh entertaining guests that uh that want to come and they can look at over a hundred pieces of my work uh from portraits to landscapes to cows and horses and dogs and sheep and uh all these things um uh at one time in all media. And for that, they can just give me a call uh or uh go to give me an email at Chuck at SchroederfineArt.com and uh we'll set up an appointment and uh we love to show this stuff off.

SPEAKER_02 53:30

Chuck, one question we ask all of our guests, and you get just one word. What is the one word that to you best describes this state in which you were born and raised, where you attended the University of Nebraska in Lincoln, served as the director of agriculture, and have worn many, many hats and today serve as uh I'll I'll tap you as Nebraska Nebraska's artist in residence. Uh what uh what's your one word for Nebraska?

SPEAKER_01 53:53

Well, again, I love that question. And um for me it is plenty. Um and I uh every morning I recite the the 23rd Psalm, the Lord is my shepherd, uh I shall not want. He maketh me to lie down in green pastures, he leadeth me beside the still waters, he restoreth my soul. And to me, that's Nebraska. Nebraska is all of that, uh, and it's so much variety, and it's uh it's it's it's just really an extraordinary place of plenty for the human soul.

SPEAKER_02 54:30

Chuck, thanks for joining us. What a treat. Thanks. Folks, if you enjoyed this episode, consider subscribing. You can do that on Apple, Spotify, or whatever app it is that you get your podcasts at. Be certain to share it with someone who might find it of interest. And please keep on listening as we release additional episodes on Nebraska, its great communities, Nebraska's number one industry agriculture, and the people who make it happen.

SPEAKER_03 54:53

Thanks. This has been Nighty Three, the podcast, sponsored by Nebraska's law firm, Rembolt Ludke.