Manhood Matters Podcast
Conversations around challenges dominating a man's journey through life. These topics are explored by real, everyday friends, with a lot of experience... And we have the occasional expert guest.
Manhood Matters Podcast
Mental Health Fitness: Filling Your Cup Before Pouring Into Others
Ever wonder why you're constantly drained, struggling to keep up with life's demands, or finding yourself irritable with the people who matter most? The answer might be simpler than you think.
"We have to stop pouring into people. We must fill ourselves first, and then everyone else catches the overflow," explains psychologist Jonah Bell. This conversation brings him together with Kenneth “Scooter” Reddick, founder of Brothers Brunch Foundation and Marine veteran Kelley Saunders for a raw, unfiltered look at men's mental health—a subject that affects far more of us than we're willing to admit.
Recorded in the authentic setting of U Got Next Barbershop in Douglasville, Georgia, this episode shatters misconceptions about mental health, especially for Black men. You'll discover why mental health isn't a diagnosis but rather a practice—like physical fitness—requiring consistent maintenance. The panelists offer practical strategies anyone can implement, from intentional breathing and proper sleep to understanding how our unresolved traumas manifest in our children.
"You can't cuss, fuss, or beat you out of your child—it's birthed into them," Scooter reveals, highlighting how our unhealed wounds become our children's inheritance. The conversation delves into accountability, purpose-finding, and why even eight-year-olds benefit from having a therapist as a "life coach." For fathers, husbands, sons, and anyone who cares about them, this episode provides the roadmap to better mental wellness without stigma or shame.
Ready to fill your cup first? Press play, take notes, and join us in changing the narrative around men's mental health. Your family, your work, and most importantly—you—deserve nothing less than your mentally healthiest self.
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So understand, we have to stop pouring into people. We must fill ourselves first, right, and then everyone else catches the overflow. Because if you're already happy, you're doing everything that you're doing right You're going to the gym, you're reading, you're going to work, you're taking care of the family right, you're still pouring into yourself. So when you walk outside, you should be in a good mood and whatever happens is not going to hurt you because you already filled yourself up first.
Speaker 3:That's definitely spot on. You know what I also say to add on to that, what's that? Don't wait till your cup goes empty to fill it up, man, yeah, I mean, we always try.
Speaker 4:Quick disclaimer guys, this show is for educational and entertainment purposes only. We have expert guests, but they are not your therapist. If you're struggling with anything, please contact a licensed professional and know that we wish you well, as well as send you our love and strength. This is going to be one of the most impactful episodes we have yet recorded. I'm your host, stefan. We have psychologist Jonah Bell joining Marine veteran Kelly Saunders and Kenneth Scooter Reddick, who is celebrating over three years of sobriety after a 30-year addiction. Through his Brothers Brunch Foundation, scooter now serves as the springboard people can step onto to emerge from the abyss of addiction, mental struggles and despair.
Speaker 4:June is National Men's Health Month. Now this is a subject that often gets overlooked by the very people it's designed to help. Trust me when I tell you. Believe me when I say more of us are struggling than you know. Now we're back at the barbershop. This time we're being hosted by you Got Next on Fairburn Road in Douglasville, georgia. Janet the owner does a lot of work in the community, so stop by and see her. You're going to hear scissors, clippers, blow dryers and general barbershop background noise, but I promise that will not take away from this amazing, insightful and extremely helpful conversation. Scooters, principles, jonas, key insights, kelly's experience are absolutely all priceless. So sit back. We appreciate you pressing play on this episode and, as always, welcome to Manhood Matters.
Speaker 4:Let's get to it. We are here in the you Got Next barbershop over in Douglasville so grateful that they have us here today and we're going to discuss mental health on the Manhood Matters podcast. I'm here with Scooter what's up? What's up, what's going on, brother, what up, though? And Kelly's here as well. Hey, what's good. My people Appreciate you guys so much for being on the podcast. I think today is going to be an extremely important conversation. We've talked about mental health and we've just kind of touched on it, but we've never delved into it as much as we're going to today. We've never had a professional on, we've never had someone who actually works with mental health pretty much as their niche, and this is exactly what Scooter does. So before I even dive into it and really just start dissecting this conversation, I want to ask Scooter to introduce himself. Man, just give us a little bit of background about who you are, what you do, man, what led you on this journey and this purpose that you're on right now?
Speaker 3:All right, all right. Yeah, I am Kenneth Sober, scooter Reddick II. I am the founder and CEO of Brothers Brunch Foundation. It's not a time to eat, but be fed. Mental health and self-care awareness. What led me on this journey is my lived experiences. I've suffered from mental health challenges, as well as addiction, for many, many years in my life and on purpose, I'm out here an advocate, activist in the streets, assisting those that may need some support through my lived experiences. So it's a pleasure to be here today at you Got Next Barbershop in Douglasville, georgia, being able to share my journey but also have the other fellas share their experiences as well, as we talk about. Mental health is not a diagnosis.
Speaker 4:You know I'm going to jump right into it, man. What does that mean?
Speaker 3:What it means is that, if we think about it a lot of times and I could almost ask you all when somebody says mental health, what's the first thing that comes to mind? Something wrong with you, exactly.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 3:Exactly, and that's the thing about it is. That's kind of how we've been trained and that's the stigma, especially in the black communities, is that mental health is something that's wrong. But the reality is is that mental health is just like physical health. We have to make sure that we protect ourselves from becoming ill. And once we start to make that shift in that mindset of looking at mental health as not a diagnosis but as a part of maintenance for our mental and life, then that's where we don't face as many mental health challenges.
Speaker 3:Because if you think about it I was riding in this morning, I was thinking about it you know, it's a lot easier to prevent an injury from happening than to repair from an injury. Yes, sir, and we have to look at it the same way with our minds. But we don't look at it that way. We take care of our bodies, we take care of our cars, we do maintenance on everything else. We take care of our cars, we do maintenance on everything else but our mental. And that's most important, because if we can't think straight, then we can't make the right decisions. And that's why I've learned on my journey, especially living in purpose, that I must be spirit led and get out my mind, that's dope man.
Speaker 4:So there's something you said yesterday that I thought was really, really critical because you talked about when I think about mental health. Right, the opposite of health is illness. So when I think mental health, you know I go straight to these stigmas. In conversation with scooter, well, he's mentioned if you got burned out, if you've got anxiety, all of these things, they kind of factor into mental health and I never think of it that way. You know, I'm, I am burned out. I'll admit it. I am totally burned out.
Speaker 4:I got plenty of stress and I don't think of it as being mentally unhealthy. I just think of it as like that's part of life. I'm a man, I go to work, this is what I do, that's what I'm supposed to deal with, and I don't think about any of these other factors at all and consequently, I end up not being my best self, the best version of myself. I can't show up and be there for my family the way I want to be. There's a portion of me that's there. There's a portion of me that's got some resentment. There's a portion of me that just deals with anger. I regressed to my New York days of road rage. I brought that shit here to Georgia. That's how it shows up. Right, it shows up in very unhealthy ways. How about yourselves? I mean Scooter's been working in the field, helping a lot of people. So when you hear mental health, what does it mean to you? What stands out and what stigmas do you typically think of first?
Speaker 2:Well, I think of mental health as having mental stability and mental management. In my experience dealing with a lot of stuff just like you, stefan you're dealing with a lot as a man, right? So you take on everything everyone has, you're taking on the world and you're not really thinking about managing your mental health. You know what I'm saying, yeah, and when you're telling people like, hey, I'm working on my mental health, know what I'm saying, yeah, and when you're telling people like, hey, I'm working on my mental health, they automatically assume that, okay, something's wrong with you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're broken you're crazy, he, he's suffering from major depression. But sometimes you know you, you had a bad day at work. How do you manage that? You don't want to take it out on your family, you don't want to take it out on your friends. So you, you have to find ways to manage your mental stability.
Speaker 4:Maybe I'm part of the problem in that sense, because a few years ago I would hear mental health and we got to get well and everything else and my first thought was this world has gotten so soft that everything is wrong with everybody. Everything is a nebulous word that we just overused and I'm like maybe something's wrong with everybody. Everything is a nebulous word that we just overused and I'm like maybe there's nothing wrong with you, man. You just need to get up and go to work. You know, put less garbage in your body. That's what's affecting you. It's not that you have a mental health issue. But in talking to Scooter again, you know mental health itself is the big gamut of it all, and then there are their different segments into mental health. You want to touch on that a little bit, scooter.
Speaker 3:As far as what I want to do is I want to let Brother Bell, because he's actually a clinician in the field- mental health field.
Speaker 4:So he'll recognize that I'm the problem for sure.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, let me default to him on this one.
Speaker 1:Thanks, scooter. Let me introduce myself. So my name is Jonah Bell. I am a recent graduate of Northwestern University, with my master's in clinical mental health counseling, actually studying right now to become a LPC. So here, within the next couple of months I'll be fully licensed and then I'll actually have my own practice. What's up, bro?
Speaker 4:Congrats, bro, man. Thank you, man, it was a long, hard road.
Speaker 1:Man Trust me. Mental health.
Speaker 2:Yeah right.
Speaker 1:Imagine this, right Working on your mental health while learning about mental health, while teaching people mental health. Right, yeah, it's so many layers, and I enjoyed it, because the one thing that we really need to start looking at when it comes to mental mental health, the real key word is accountability, because if you actually start thinking about what issues and traumas that you have, you had to take accountability for them. Now, some of them may be for yourself and some may be because someone hurt you as well, and so we had to start taking accountability, because sometimes the weight that we're carrying it's not even ours. Like I said, once I got my degree, I started working in outpatient mental health right, so I work with those who've been diagnosed with schizophrenia, bipolar 1, 2, borderline personality disorder, autism and also ADHD. Right again, the first thing I started working with them is accountability. The second thing is their emotions.
Speaker 1:Steph talked about anger, so one thing that I do is I start teaching everybody the real definitions of the emotions that we have, and once you actually know the definition, cool. That's the first step. The second step is now let's acknowledge it. Right, yeah, you were upset and you cut somebody out, but what were you really feeling in that moment? Were you feeling ashamed? Were you feeling guilty for something? Were you feeling ashamed? Were you feeling guilty for something? Were you frustrated? And they're telling me this and I'm like doesn't this make a lot more sense, you having a conversation with me and telling me that you're frustrated, or you you feel ashamed, or you feel disappointed in yourself?
Speaker 1:You're like yeah now you're learning emotional intelligence.
Speaker 4:I like that. So first you identify it, because we all use these words it's true. I just thought about it just now. I mean it clicked. There are words that we're using to describe an emotion, but is it the right description for what you're actually feeling at that moment? So how do you help people decipher what's what? Because I'll just say I'm pissed off, got you, that's all I know.
Speaker 1:So here's the breakdown of this. Right, we are, we have kids, yes, cool. So when your baby is born, right, and they start crying, we are automatically know. It's a couple things right, they're hungry, they're wet, uh, they're irritable, something like that. So they can't speak, so they cry and cry. Yeah, so as an adult, if you upset and you mad and angry, what is that? Still no different than a kid. You just don't know the words. Yeah, you're frustrated, but you don't know how to articulate the emotions that you're going through right now. Right, and so when we realize that if we talk to each other again, like this space, like here, we talk more about our emotions, man, people will build a connection and then we'll start building the black community back, but until then, it's everyone for themselves.
Speaker 4:So do you find that there are, specifically with men in general, what you just described? It sounds almost a bit philosophical. I hear the truth in it, right, but what about the person you know who would make the argument like no, I'm not angry or ashamed or dealing with anything in my past. I'm mad at you right now because you did this exact thing. Sometimes is it just what it is, or is there always something behind the emotion, based on how the person reacts?
Speaker 1:There's always something behind it, so I can't give all my trade secrets, but, uh, you know. So, um, there's a um, you got built for that. Yeah, I do. Um, it's called the anger iceberg, right, this is just a foundation, and when you see anger, again it's just a tip of the iceberg. We know that the iceberg is up here, but underneath the water there's a lot more, down there, right? So again, we have the shame, the guilt. We have to address these things and I'm like, okay, you can be mad at me, cool. And then I show them the words. There's 21 words, brother, please let me know what it is. What did I do? And if you can tell me exactly what I did, cool, you know, now we can have dialogue, but if you don't know the words to articulate, how can you say that Good point, good point.
Speaker 3:If I could add on to that part. One of the things, just like Brother Bell was just saying, is that a lot of times when people are triggered, are put into a certain situation, as I like to say, a setback. I've heard from a psychotherapist that says that is healing inside that hasn't taken place, because if we've healed, that's like he talks about what's under that iceberg.
Speaker 5:Right.
Speaker 3:You know, and that's where a lot of times we may get to the root. But until we truly get to the seed of what's causing us that reaction, then we're going to continue to have those mental health challenges. But that's where, even if we back up taking care of your mental health and another phrase that I like to say is mental health fitness what are we doing for our mental health fitness? And part of that is that accountability, as well as that acknowledgement of any challenges that we may have. And the reality is that we all still suffer from grief. You know, we all still have certain burnout, as you talked about, with jobs, anxiety and those sorts of things. But just because you have those things doesn't necessarily mean you have a mental illness. But it still takes our mental health fitness to make sure that, when those things arise, that we don't get, as I call it, stuck.
Speaker 3:Because for me, as diagnosed bipolar depressed and was a 30-year alcoholic, if I don't do the work and continuously do the work on my healing journey and I'm going to be honest, I fell short not too long ago, very recent, where I wasn't doing the work that I needed to do for my mental health and I started feeling stuck again. So I had to get back to those things that kept me. Well, it's kind of like going to the gym. You know you're going to work out to be stronger, but if you stop going you might lose some of your strength. Yeah, and when that next blow hits you, somebody comes up and they come on, man, come on, man, tighten up, tighten up. And they grab you. You can't handle them the same way. So what you got to do, you got to make sure you go back into the gym.
Speaker 2:But then my other thing is is like mental health shouldn't stop when you got over an anger spout with your wife or something went wrong at work. I'm trying to paint a picture of you can't stop loving on yourself, you can't stop providing that space of peace for yourself, because when that stop, then everything else crumbles on top of you.
Speaker 2:So, um, when you're pushing through, like let's say something, going on at work and saying, damn, I'm going through all this shit. It's been two weeks I've been getting tasks over tasks over tasks and it's building up, it's building up, and then I get a sense of relief and I'm like, okay, I'm done right. But it shouldn't be that you should create healthy habits for yourself to continue your mental stability journey. Because, just like what Scooter said said, if you go to the gym and you're working out, working out, working out, and you get the results and then you stop going, results go away the results go away, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:So you have to consistently build healthy habits to maintain your mental, mental health to help your brothers out.
Speaker 1:This is especially with burnout. I had to realize that because me and my family, we are giving people and I had to realize that I had to stop pouring into people. Now hear me out when I say that you're like wait a minute? Wait a minute I'm always supposed to pour into people yeah, but but listen, here's how you're actually supposed to do this.
Speaker 1:We got to stop pouring into people and understanding that when you understand that you have boundaries and things of that nature, people are supposed to catch the overflow. See, people are not filling themselves up first, right. If I'm happy.
Speaker 4:That was deep. Say that again. It took me a second to catch it. Listen, yeah.
Speaker 1:So understand, we have to stop pouring into people. We must fill ourselves first, right, and then everyone else catches the overflow. Because if you're already happy, you're doing everything that you're doing right You're going to the gym, you're reading, you're going to work, you're taking care of the family right, you're still pouring into yourself. So when you walk outside, you should have a be in a good mood and whatever happens is always it's not gonna hurt you. Yeah, because you already filled yourself up first.
Speaker 3:that makes sense, it makes sense yeah, that's, that's definitely spot on, you know. You know what I also say? To add on to that what that don't wait till your cup goes empty to fill it up, man.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I mean we always trying to refill, say my cup empty, I got the refill. No, we should be refilling, right?
Speaker 1:That's that mental health fitness, and that part is your choice, that part is your choice.
Speaker 4:Yes, All right. So I got a question. I'm a layman and I'm going to ask for a lot of people. First, I want to touch on what you said a little earlier. Scooter man. Congrats, man, for everything you've overcome, everything you've gone through. Brother. That's extremely commendable and people listening to this. That's an example. But the other thing is I hear physical fitness. I understand that. Do some pushups or some sit-ups. I get it Makes sense. I can maintain that. Four or five days a week or five days a week, Mental health or mental fitness, as labeled by Scooter here, what does that mean? What is doing the work every day mean? What does that look like? I can't wake up and do mental push-ups. So what does that mentally look like to me?
Speaker 1:Man therapy counseling right, Because there's some real deep conversations that have to be had.
Speaker 4:So should everybody be on some kind of counseling and therapy Can?
Speaker 1:I be 100% honest, please, for real. Yeah, absolutely Cool. Everybody has a diagnosis. Can we really go here? Everybody has a diagnosis right.
Speaker 1:It's either you know what your diagnosis is because you've been assessed and you know it, or you go undiagnosed, right, but when you come see a therapist, guess what the first thing we do Figure it out and give you a diagnosis. Everybody has one, yeah, but the thing is most people don't know how to point it out. Now, especially when we talk about autism. Right, boy, I can really go into this, but we have a lot of autistic people that are high-functioning, autistic people who are the geniuses, and one of my businesses is you know, you are brilliant, telling young black boys and girls, right, that they're brilliant, but they don't know it because, guess what, their families don't know what brilliancy looks like.
Speaker 1:However, if you can understand that, if somebody is a DJ, if you break down what a DJ does in the moment in the surroundings, you're like it's a special type of person. Right, you got two turntables, so you're using your left and your right brain and you're using your left and your right hand. Sometimes you're using your feet, using your brain as your metrodome. Right, you got to think ahead of what you're about to mix.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you like like merging these things, these these different components of life, really make us who we really are, and understanding that. If you look at Robert Kennedy, he wants this autism registry right, right. It's for a reason.
Speaker 4:People for a reason, so I don't watch the news enough. So I have no clue what you're talking about here.
Speaker 1:So yeah, right now Robert Kennedy is trying to get a national autism registry. So those who are already diagnosed with autism, of course the states have those Again me working in the state funding a nonprofit, so he would get that information, say this person here has autism, this person here has autism, gotcha has autism.
Speaker 5:This person here has autism.
Speaker 1:If you understand autism and how to work within it and how it is a superpower, you can look for me on oakandgraycom and, yeah, I can help you point those things out.
Speaker 3:Let me tell you from a peer perspective, even though we all peers, because, like he said, everybody got something going on. For me, my mental health fitness includes number one sleeping.
Speaker 3:I got to make sure, if I know we all peers because, like he said, everybody got something going on. Yes, we do right. For me, my mental health fitness includes number one sleeping. I gotta make sure, if I don't sleep, I'm not gonna function, I'm gonna be agitated. Number two is breathing intentionally, not just when I'm upset, to get the oxygen flowing to my brain okay. Number three is meditation. I gotta receive my instructions through the spirit and get out my head. So meditation. And meditation doesn't have to look like me sitting, the indian style meditation for me is at night, every night, listening to meditation frequencies as I'm sleeping to calm my mind.
Speaker 3:Okay, number four is exercise and activity. You ain't gonna find me in no gym, but you might find me at yoga. You might see me get the massage. You might see me go to the esthetician taking a hike, whatever it may be, but just having some intentional exercises and activities in my life, I call them woosah moments. And number five, like he said therapy.
Speaker 3:Therapist, therapeutic, not problematic, once we start realizing that therapy is our mental health life coach yeah and even if it's not a therapist, if it's a peer, a peer coach, yeah, if it's a peer group, just something that keeps you focused on your mental health, keep something positive being fed. That's mental health fitness, you know. But the reality is my mental health fitness. But the reality is my mental health fitness may look different than yours. True, because that's what we have to realize is that everybody's okay is different. We can't put each other in the box. We can't put a black man in the box of what is going to make him successful with his mental health, because each one of us is unique and each one of us is made individually through the spirit. The way I got sober ain't the way that somebody else gonna get sober, and I can't give the answers, but I can share my experiences and give them hope that's it and as long as I keep showing up, even in settings like this, when I'm sharing my story, this strengthens me, but that's a part of that.
Speaker 4:Mental health fitness that that was really powerful and that's what I was asking for a practical answer, because not everyone has either the funds, therapy is not free Right, or the time. I can't take the time. I can't sit around for an hour, an hour and a half. Some people feel guilty about it. It's almost like I'm just going to sit for an hour and a half and not do work when I, my family needs X, y and Z, but you just dropped some crazy gems here and people can go back and rewind and listen to this, because you talked about four things before you even got to therapy, that they can be doing, that are very practical, that anybody could do on their own right now.
Speaker 3:I got to push back just a little bit on that time thing.
Speaker 4:Go ahead, go ahead. I know.
Speaker 3:Because, you know, we all make time for what we want.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but we don't make time for what we need, ok, and as you talk about the professional that's working, guess what? We got benefits. Everybody's benefits may look differently, but our health insurance's benefits is not like car insurance. We don't save that for emergencies. We supposed to use that so that we can be healthy and maintained. So one of the things that I was doing when I was working as a pharmaceutical rep for 25 years I looked into my benefits.
Speaker 3:Therapy Therapy is a part of your benefits. Sometimes they give you extra benefits on top of that. That's a medical appointment, just like you got to go to the doctor, just like you got to go to the dentist, massage, chiropractor, physical therapy. Check your benefits, because what I would do is I would put it on the calendar just like it was a medical appointment. Then it's not looking like I don't have time to do it. It's a necessity to do it. But it goes back to that accountability. I took my mental health seriously and I realized what I needed to do to do the work to help me stay well, and nobody else couldn't do that for me. That goes back to pouring into others before you pour into yourself, and one of my good brothers shared with me one time and I always carry this with me about putting my oxygen mask on first. Yeah, even even on the airplane they say before you even put your kids oxygen mask on, put your oxygen mask on first. Yeah, I still have to check myself on that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, checking myself is part of mental health fitness as well yeah, I challenged you, brothers, right, this is one thing that I work with clients and it's the actual time study. You can go out on google and print it out. It'll basically break everything down daily, hourly. If you actually go in and start putting your time slots for when you get up, when you got to leave out of the house, you know when you get to work, what time you get off work, that time, from the time you get off work to the time that you go to bed, how are you really fulfilling your time? Because you have time. We just not using it at, you know, at its maximum peak. And so if you really do a time study about your actual day and how you go about your week, you will find out that you have a lot more time than you really think. But if you go ahead and do the sleep study and get your schedule knocked out, you'll become very proficient. Can I add to that?
Speaker 2:This goes out to all of my veterans out there in the military right, Marine Corps in specific. Before we went on missions, before we went in training, we always sat down in a room.
Speaker 2:We had a whiteboard of what's on that mission laid it out and in the military we always had health benefits. So you know, if you go into med, call or hey, something mentally wrong, you're going to get evaluated, that type of thing. But but when you get out, no one's telling you to go x, y and z. And for the longest I was used to that structured. And when I got out that disc crumbled, you stopped, it stopped. So now I was getting more angry, I was just getting more depressed and all this other stuff.
Speaker 2:And of course you know, um, you know I had to go see someone. So I went to the VA and got a counselor and it was like, yeah, you're suffering from major depression and anxiety. Have you ever thought about that? And I was like, nah, so it got deeper into you know, my childhood and all this other stuff. But today I use my whole wall as my schedule. And like where you was talking about that time study, I always do every day a time study what tasks I need to get done today, my family needs needs me after work, so I have to get these specific things priorities done before I can be off. That takes all of the pressure yeah off of me.
Speaker 2:If you can visually see everything laid out and not try to keep everything in your mind, I feel like that is a great benefit to practice good mental health management.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because when you miss something and you remember it later on and you're like damn, I didn't take care of this, then you're beating up on yourself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it piles up.
Speaker 4:I got to take better care of myself, and I'm telling you because I fail myself every single day Some of you just mentioned a little while ago I remember as a sales manager, right, I was doing this for a long time. I would train my team and I would tell them there's 100, I believe it's 168 hours in a week. So what we did is we basically broke it down 40 hours for work, right, and we even went to 60. 60. Then you take a couple hours to eat, grooming, take care of yourself and things like that, some time with family, dinner time, leisure time and we still left a whole bunch of hours that were just wide open, and what I would get onto them about is obviously at the time I wasn't thinking mental health I was like this is when you become better, you know, this is when you train.
Speaker 4:This is when you do your role play and you go back and forth and go through your books for self-development and things like that. But you're right, we have the time. We just need to prioritize this in a way and, to your point, just put it on the calendar, because I'll go through so many days when I just like in my head, I have to call this client, edit the podcast. It just piles up and piles up and piles up and it compounds to by the end of the week. You're like if.
Speaker 4:I can just erase everything and start over and not feel like a failure. I would.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean you again. Making these small adjustments, you'll really figure out that you have a lot more time for your family as well. Right, you can be more intentional with date night. Right, you can go home tomorrow. Baby, guess what? We need to come out with a date. What day or how many times are we going to meet for dinner every week? Put it on the books, leave it there First priority.
Speaker 2:I've been fucking up. Yeah, I get it. I've been there too.
Speaker 1:It's accountability, right. But think about it. If you say to your wife or a significant other hey, guess what? Every other Tuesday at 7 o'clock you need to be dressed right here. Now, if you decide to go out and do something else outside of our date night, there's going to be a penalty. But you guys get to have fun with stuff like that, right, come up with. The penalty is you know, somebody got to cook breakfast or whatever it may be, but make it fun. But you got to be intentional with those date night times for yourself, your wife, the kids. Again, I say for yourself, the wife and the kids, for yourself.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:For yourself. Yeah, this goes back into making sure you pour into yourself so that your family and everyone else catches the overflow.
Speaker 4:I got a question for you guys. So and I know this is not a therapy session but how do you deal with the, as men, we definitely face being inadequate, because there are things that we want to do, there are things that we want to accomplish and we never feel it's enough. Are there certain mental exercises, affirmations or different ways of approaching things where you can stop feeling less than Because I just kind of feel that I'm not doing enough or whatever I'm doing is just not working out?
Speaker 1:Great question. I was just talking to a 27 year old yesterday and he's, you know, used to be a football player and he stopped playing football and he's trying to find himself and he wants to date. And I'm like, dude, you need to find yourself. So to answer your question, you gotta know your purpose, listen. Your purpose drives you to where you're going. For the single people that may be listening to, especially the single men, the only way most women are going to follow you is if you have a purpose. We can go back to the Bible Adam had a purpose, right. Job had a purpose, jesus had a purpose. They walked. They purpose right. Most of us are walking this world, lost in the wilderness. So the first thing I would say is find your purpose, know the direction that you're going into, because there's going to be some anxiety, there may be some depression, but if you understand, you got to take accountability for your purpose and your drive. That's all on you, damn okay. Find your passion, yeah.
Speaker 2:Your passion is this podcast, man, because you were in podcast for what? Six, seven months. This is month number six, so you've been doing very well. Like you went from zero to 100 real quick. You know, listening to your shows, I'm like man and you say you was, you know, kind of struggling with public speaking, but your speaking is just like off the charts, like I'm trying to get back to a better public speaker when I was in the Marine Corps, talking to Marines and stuff like that. But I think this concentrating on your passion, the passion is consistent because you'll never get tired of doing it. And next thing, you know you found your purpose. Your purpose is to preach to these young black people. You're not alone. Alone you can do it, giving them words of affirmation. Your show is like that beacon that people can come to to find guidance in their life.
Speaker 2:So if you feel like, hey, you know I'm not, I feel like I'm not doing enough, look where you are right now. Yeah, you know what I'm saying. So be thankful for the time that you have on this earth in this present moment. Appreciate that, kelly.
Speaker 1:Real quick, and then you can ask. I just want to say the same thing. Like the very first time being a musician, when I heard the last podcast you know what I'm saying when LaJoy sent it to me, I was like yo this man's audio is clean, because I do the audio at my church and it's funny because I'm like my audio is perfect, yours is.
Speaker 1:You got to understand that because your pitch is the way that it is, which meaning that the word is getting out in the purity that it's supposed to get into. Appreciate that, thank you.
Speaker 3:I was just going to say. One of my other favorite phrases is my purpose is my peace. You might disrupt me for the moment, but you're not going to disrupt my peace. So when you talk about those challenges and understanding and not feeling enough, you know we've been trained mind, body, spirit. Why in the world do we put the spirit at?
Speaker 1:the end, I don't know, go ahead, we're going to talk about it. Go it, go ahead, you know.
Speaker 3:But the thing about it is is that when I talk about that meditation okay, and being spirit led, then that eases my mind through all the frustrations and it helps me to make the decisions that align with my purpose, with my body.
Speaker 3:And so I think, as we talk about a lot of these things around mental health versus mental illness, programming versus reprogramming, we can even go to conscious versus unconscious, but either way, the thing about it is is that once we get out of our heads, have that accountability, as we talked about, and understanding that you know what, and and then also understanding are the things that I'm thinking, that I want, that are for me, is that more of a external want versus an internal need, because you know, I I know people that have done well and I'm gonna use catering, for example.
Speaker 3:All right, I'm not a caterer, but there'll be great caterers. And then they want a restaurant, but then the restaurant doesn't go the way they want it to, and then I have to remind them do you remember the special touch that you used to give families and people as being a caterer? You know, we all have a special gift and that's our purpose, and when we understand what our gift is, I won't say all frustrations go away, but I'd say the majority of them have gone away for me, just because I've understood my purpose greater yeah, scoot, I want to go back to when we talk about this mind, body, and well, it is the soul, the spirit, and the mind and the body.
Speaker 1:See, people want to separate this and of course, in the Bible we'll go here. I give it to you First, that's Thessalonians 5 and 23, which is one of my scriptures that I use. Do I know of verbatim? I don't Not going to lie to you, because I got too much other stuff right.
Speaker 1:Because I'm not a Bible thumper like that. But people have to understand we believe that the soul, we need to go to church for the soul. That's wrong. There's a word in Greek, a psi, which is soul right, which is a root word for psychology. So how can we put something, especially with the church, that's in your spirit, so your mind and your spirit are one, right? Just like I can say these things out loud, but I can also close my mouth and still say the same things in my head.
Speaker 1:So, your mind and your spirit are one, when you really start understanding that they are one. And your soul is the counseling, and then you're working on your body. If you're doing those three things at least three or four times a day, you're talking about it, says it, you will find peace. Until Jesus comes, it says it's in there. Your mind and your spirit are one. Your body and your soul.
Speaker 4:That's powerful stuff. So my son's 13 and I just started taking him to the gym. So this is more or less his way of life for the rest of his life Because, like we talked about, you don't use it, you lose it, right. So he's going to keep it up, hopefully, right? So how early should I start his mental fitness? You know? I mean, like, you have these teenagers, they go through things, what I've always said, they just being teenagers and they are looking for themselves, but how early do we intervene and say he or she needs this?
Speaker 3:I'm just going to tell you from personal experience. My son is already proactively in therapy and he's been in therapy for over a year. And he's eight years old. Ok, for two reasons. Number number one that's his life coach. Also, that's my coach. As a parent, I'm generations removed from my son. What happens is we, as parents, think we know what's best, but then we're still parenting out of trauma. Yeah, and I jokingly said but I'm serious. I said we all have p PTSD. It's called parenting because our parents only our parents only parent what they know and that's of the past. Yeah, so now when my son wants to do something, I could say let's ask your therapist, and my son loves to go to his therapist. But the key thing to that is it's already broken the stigma.
Speaker 3:Okay, so if he does have any challenges that arise, he already has a life coach in place, a therapist, to help him with those problems, versus me trying to figure out, okay, how is he going to feel, or even me feeling as though I don't want them to know everything that's been going on. So what I say is every child when they start school especially because we as parents have the least amount of time with our kids to have the best opportunity for them to be the best that they can be, and not what we want them to be give your child a therapist.
Speaker 1:Yeah, again, it depends on the child and how they're moving. One thing that parents don't realize and I learned this when I was in school from zero to five, your kids can't talk, but they see everything, but it could be traumatic to them, but they can't tell you because they can't talk, can't talk. The things that we do around our kids are traumatic and you wonder, when they start talking, why they get not. They've watched you for years, you know, do whatever you did in front of them and it's a scary situation. So these kids are most of them are lost, right, that's why they have hoodies.
Speaker 2:So again eight years old. Oh man what.
Speaker 5:Wait okay, so let's go here right Explain that.
Speaker 4:It's funny.
Speaker 1:I started sitting down thinking about it.
Speaker 4:I love hoodies.
Speaker 1:I get it, but it's a way for you to hide.
Speaker 4:Yeah, really For the kids. They're hiding. That's so interesting they're hiding. Okay, here's like this Because my son we were living in Florida dude. It's always hot and he would wear hoodies. And now I will always say him and all of his friends they're walking around, it's 100 degrees in florida and they got hoodies on.
Speaker 1:Yeah so here's how you gotta look at it, right? If I'm this highly intelligent kid and I live in the hood and I've never seen anyone get out of the hood, all I know is to, I don't know how to act. My friends that I grew up with think I'm. They probably think that I'm better than them. Are you too smart for your own good type thing? Right, or you're gonna be outcast. So most of the kids now wear hoodies. So they wearing hoodies to hide. My nephew just told me this like he's like man, I wear the hoodie cuz I don't know who I am. Wow, they have locks, yeah, cuz they can hide and I need them.
Speaker 4:That's a lot of self-awareness for a young man because I mean, I just thought it was just style is something they did early on and eventually grew out of it. Although I still wear hoodies again, I get it, it's comfortable for us too.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I hide. I mean we got beards, our beards are hiding Like really serious. Most men didn't get attention until hey, I like beers. I like salt and pepper beers. So now I'm going to put the beard on.
Speaker 5:I'm out here. You know what I'm saying but, it's really not you.
Speaker 4:You know what I'm saying it's a comfort thing. I was sexy either way, bro.
Speaker 1:But yeah, they're hiding man and it's sad because we sit back and we talk about them like they out here, it's 90 degrees, they out here, it's 90 degrees, but they're hiding. We hid at one point in time. Yeah, so eight years old for me as a therapist, that's too young for me to work with. I work with adolescents. So once you get about 12, 13 years old, now we can sit down and talk. Now I can see and ask you questions about what your future looks like.
Speaker 4:It seems to me that this particular generation of 10 to 18 years old, I feel like they're from a different planet, you know, because my kids. They range in age where I was able to connect to the older ones more than I can connect to my younger ones. Right, what advice would you give to a parent within the realm of mental health, to better connect and not just judge them? The realm of mental health to better connect and not just judge them, because I would criticize, I would think in my head what the hell's wrong with you guys, the way you act, the way you move. They seem to be in dreamland. I'll tell my son man, take your head out of the clouds.
Speaker 4:And I've said some things where, now that we're having this conversation, I'm rethinking, I'm going damn. I missed a lot of cues and a lot of opportunities to address something that, because he's really quiet, he's an introvert by nature and it's hard to reach in and grab that stuff. So parents like myself and I guess a lot of parents out there because if you're raising a 13 year old in 2025, how do you reach those kids in that world easy?
Speaker 1:man? Very easy. I ask them about, like you said, social media. How much social media are you on? Oh, five hours, six hours a day, somewhere around there. It's about to be summertime.
Speaker 1:We talked about purpose, right? How can you sit down? And this is me as an adult. I have a 19-year-old. Well, she'll be 19 in August, right? I say, how can you watch somebody's purpose on social media and you even thought about yours? You're giving somebody all this energy and you ain't even thought about yourself, right? I ask him again how do you want to live If it's up to you, the average man lives about 72, 75. Let's think about 65 in today's day. When you get 65, are you? Did you put the work in? See, we don't never think about the end. That's where the anxiety comes from. We all, we see the end. Did you do the work to get what you wanted so that you can have the life that you wanted to live? If you haven't thought about that and got there, we got some work to do what's a practical approach, because I don't want to come off as lecturing sit down, talk, talk to him.
Speaker 1:He's you. How would you talk to your younger? See, and this goes back into the healing part Some of us need to have conversation with our younger selves to heal, so that it can fit the broken adult in you and you can start moving Right. So just sit down and talk to him, have an open conversation.
Speaker 1:The thing that gives them what you didn't get the thing that gives them what you didn't get, the thing that most of us, as men, we won't get right the stories from if we grew up in a single parent household, you're only going to get one side of the story most times right.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm saying At the end of your parent is not here right Now. You definitely can't get that story, and so it's a lot of men and women out here that are stuck because there are conversations that need to be had and they can't Just be open with them. You want them to talk. I'm telling you, if you don't have that conversation now and start building it when you put them in therapy, I tell all my parents they're coming to talk to you and if they're coming to talk to you, please be open, Because if you shut them down, then you're going to lose them to me, and I don't want that. You know what I'm saying, Cause now that I already got 30, 40, 50, 600, you know a hundred clients that I'm dealing with when all you had to do is take the accountability and say you know what I need to talk to my son, Son, how can I help you?
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's super strong. Super strong, do you get?
Speaker 3:involved, scooter, when your son is going to therapy. I'm pretty sure in the first session or two you were there there, but do you just get out of the space now? Do you could just get out of the way and let him talk to his therapist, or do you stay through the session? Oh no, no he's. He's always had the freedom to express himself with his therapist so you're not there, I'm not there no no, no, no, I mean, I don't, I don't want to be there.
Speaker 3:I want him to have that trust factor. Uh, same way, when I'm talking with people, you know, if I'm dealing with a young man, I have to let them know. Hey, you can feel open to share with me, and I'm not going to go back and tell your parent, you know. But one of the things that Brother Bell mentioned, though, was that parents have to understand the process as well, and that's where that accountability comes in, because what can happen is the therapist can talk to the child I could talk to the parent or the child but if the parent still goes back into the same environment and there is no change, then everything is falling on deaf ears.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and that's why I say, you know, for me having him proactively, but then I also that accountability of what is in me, or what was in me that can be in my child, because what I see is, when we look at these intergenerational traumas we look at a lot of times. We talk about the external behaviors, but what's being birthed into our children? And if we have generations and generations of unbirthed trauma, that's one of the reasons why my son is proactively in therapy, because I'm bipolar, 30 year alcoholic. I don't want to be reactive and if there are things that we know about ourselves, especially that weren't healed before we gave birth, that's our seed. We want to jump up and say that's my seed, that's my seed. But do we really think about?
Speaker 4:what's in that seed's in that sea?
Speaker 3:yeah, and that's why I tell parents you can't cuss fuss, I beat you out your child oh say that again wait hold on say that again you can't cuss fuss for the people in the back.
Speaker 3:You can't cuss fuss, I beat you out your child, it's birth into them. Yeah, so we have to give them the tools. When we talk about what we didn't have, I grew up with both parents. I grew up very privileged, but there were some other adverse childhood experiences that happened that molded my mind through my life, and when people ask me, well, what could your parents have done differently? I say the only thing they could have possibly done was get me a therapist. Yeah, because that, like you say, there's some things that we do miss, some things that we want to miss in our kids because we see it, but then we have, we try to handle it our way and it's time to let go of some of this. Our way, our way, you know exactly what's crazy?
Speaker 4:my parents you know they are four children, three boys, one girl and I see my father in all of us. My father had a lot of mental issues. We had not talked in a long time, all the way through his death, and that was due to a lot of the way he handled things and it affected me greatly. I would watch myself at times and recognize something that's broken and I'd be like that's my dad and I'd see it. It's not clinically diagnosed, because I haven't been to a therapist to get it clinically diagnosed, but I I'm smart enough to know what it is, so I'll go. Yeah, yeah, I'm like I know this and I've heard the term, so I'm like I recognize this.
Speaker 4:So what I'm having to do is outside of therapy for now. I'm not going to let it win. So this is how I'm going to deal with it, because I saw what it did to my dad and I saw how it affected his family. So I try to have a holistic approach. I go back to my spirit. I try not to be higher than that. I see my two brothers and I see what they deal with. If you want to piss my brother off, tell him he's acting like his dad, tell him he's acting like his dad.
Speaker 2:Tell him he'll want to fight you.
Speaker 4:That's not me, man, I'm like you're doing the angry thing right now You're pissed off. You want to fight.
Speaker 5:You got this.
Speaker 4:Napoleon complex.
Speaker 3:AMG strong.
Speaker 4:Yeah, man, I'm telling you, I'm like, and I see it, he'll fight anybody. I'm like dude, that's the thing.
Speaker 1:When you think about your therapist and a therapist, it's a relationship. It's almost like dating your counselor, like you really have to because that person is going to give you the advice and it may be unfiltered. You have to trust them because when you bring something to you know, bring something to your counselor, you want them to put you in the right direction and so make sure that that person you get along with them, because they're going to be along your ride. They're not your best friend, they're not your person that you call your cousin or aunties or something like that. This person, you know 100%, has your best interest at heart and they're going to help you get there. But you got to take the accountability because as therapists, our job is to not work harder than you.
Speaker 4:OK, that's good, All right, so we got Ash, one of the barbers, over here. Man, go ahead, ash. What's your question, brother?
Speaker 5:OK, I had a question real quick about what y'all were talking about is basically doing preventative maintenance. So you got a situation. You don't basically wait until the situation arises. You do preventative maintenance to keep yourself from going to a place like where you used to go mentally. What are some of the tools that you can use to help you, to check, to see where you are?
Speaker 4:That's a question for one of those two guys right here, and I'm not
Speaker 5:trying to. I'm not trying to get a therapy session, but it is a spark in my brain. So I don't want to at least ask?
Speaker 4:Appreciate your question brother, yeah, yeah, but it just sparked in my brain so I wanted to at least ask.
Speaker 1:Appreciate your question, brother. Yeah, yeah, that's a good question. Okay, the best thing to do? You have to find your structure and really what your purpose is. Right, You're doing positive things or you're growing your business. You know that's in the positive light in your life, right? So move towards there. But you got to plan it. We can't keep doing this. I'm a free spirit, Free. You got to plan it. We can't keep doing this. I'm a free spirit, Free spirit. Don't get too far in life. There's never I don't think there's been a millionaire out here that has no structure, they don't have a goal.
Speaker 1:So you start finding your structure. We talked about it a little bit earlier with the time study. Right, really, look at how you are really spending every single hour of your day, from the time that you wake up to the time that you go to bed, and look at the times where you're not doing anything, where you can be a lot more productive. I don't know, you can be selling merch, you can be, you know, expanding out however you want to, maybe going back to school or something like that.
Speaker 4:Figure that out but you got to make the time and the space for it.
Speaker 3:You want to add to that Scooter? I was just going to say, Ash, we're going to make sure you get in contact with Brothers Brunch Foundation, brother, because that's what we do. We help you get kickstarted on a new mental health and self-care journey, so we're going to look out for you. Okay, my brother.
Speaker 2:I say last words for me is have patience with yourself and trust your process. I created a image for myself. I wrote down what Kelly is going to look like in five years or 10 years and I wrote that down. Stick to that process. It's not going to be overnight. You're not going to see six pack abs overnight. You're not going to see, you know, big biceps overnight. You're going to have to stick to your process. And what Ash was talking about when you get knocked off course, how do you get back on course? Just remember your goal, your purpose and keep it rolling Scooter.
Speaker 3:I guess I'll close this out. I want everybody to understand that this mental health fitness journey is a holistic approach with a W. It's just like a pie If you take out one piece, it's not whole anymore. So we got to make sure that we're doing the work. We talked about therapy, we talked about meditation, we talked about sleep and I think one of the key things we talked about is accountability overall and purpose. Before we close out, I want to leave y'all with a few steps that might be helpful for you to take, and if anybody needs me to send this to them, I definitely will. Number one choose one self-care practice to start this week, as we talked about. We all have time. We just got to take it for ourselves. Number two find an accountability brother or partner to check in with. We all need somebody that's an accountability partner, but I'll tell you, the best accountability partner is a therapist. I ain't going to lie Schedule a therapy, a peer support session, Even if you don't go to therapy. We got Brothers Brunch Foundation. We got other organizations around Metro, atl and right here in Douglasville that we can tap into to continuously get some support.
Speaker 3:Write down one thing you're healing from, getting to the seed of what has been causing us the most pain, which also causes us the reactions that we may not want to have. Share this conversation with somebody else. Y'all might not realize it, but me coming in, having these conversations and talking on these podcasts and different things this is healing for me. The more we talk about it, the more we're not suffering in silence and that's what happens is we suffer in silence so much. And, last but not least, just set a realistic mental health goal that you can track. If it's having that list of those things and wondering when you're off so that you can get back on track. If it's making sure that you're doing your therapy once a month and if you miss it, you know you're not on track. If it's going to the gym, whatever it may be anything that can help you with your mental health. Please make sure let's take the action, set the goals and let's be successful on our mental health and self-care journeys.
Speaker 4:That's what's up. That's awesome, kelly. How did they find you brother?
Speaker 2:So you can follow me on IG, kelly W Saunders, and then also have a nonprofit called ETS Elevate Transitioning Service Members. If you're a veteran and you're looking to transition out of service or you need a support group, we're a partner with the veteran support group. This organization helps veterans obtain their disability benefits for free.
Speaker 1:So you can find me at oakandgraycom that is my life coaching at the moment and you also can find me on Instagram is? Im am dot mr. That's mr mr. Make it make sense. I am cut and dry, right, so I'm gonna make it make sense. So I am dot mr. Make it make sense. That's what's up, man scooter.
Speaker 4:How did he find you, your organization?
Speaker 3:tell us about it all right, uh, you can find me at brothers brunch foundation Foundation Inc. On Instagram and Facebook. Hey, you can Google it. Also, kenneth Sober Scooteretic, the second peer mental health coach platform. As my eight-year-old told me one day, daddy, give me your phone and he Googled my name and everything popped right up.
Speaker 4:So it's always easy, does it 's what's up nice?
Speaker 3:janet, thank you for hosting us today. We at you got next douglasville, fairburn road. Uh, hey, she, she is about it, about it in the community. She has a barber academy that's up and coming. She has the junior barbers. We go out into the street sometimes she gives, gets the junior barbers to cut hair to the homeless downtown atlanta and then I follow along to have a little mental health conversations every now and then. So we appreciate you for hosting us today.
Speaker 4:Yes, and much love to you now, the way we traditionally end the show is we flip a coin in the very beginning and whoever loses has to read the outro. While doing an impersonation of whoever the hell you choose, who are you going to?
Speaker 1:be, I'm going to be Iron.
Speaker 4:Mike Tyson, iron Mike.
Speaker 5:Tyson Iron Mike.
Speaker 4:Tyson. So LeDray jumped in at the last second to save the day, and he's going to be Iron Mike Tyson. Let's get it, brother Ready yeah.
Speaker 5:Please support us by following this show. Leave us a five star if you want Apple Podcasts. Thank you so much for listening. We'll catch you next week when we share conversations around real issues we deal with every day Manhandle Matters we're out.
Speaker 4:Yeah, baby man, that was damn on. I thought you was doing an impersonation.
Speaker 3:Hey this, how did you even? Buy me the spirit of this man talking about.
Speaker 2:I thought we was supposed to be doing that impersonation.
