Ozempic, Wegovy & Diabetes Remission: Beyond Lowering Blood Sugar w/ Dr. Jason Shumard

Her A1C was perfect. Her kidneys failed anyway, and Dr. Jason Shumard says it's the same blind spot facing anyone losing weight on a GLP-1.

Registered dietitian Ana Reisdorf talks with Dr. Jason Shumard, DC, a functional medicine practitioner who's spent his career working with type 2 diabetics, about what an A1C number can't tell you. They get into the cholesterol ratio that flags insulin resistance years before your glucose moves, why "eating healthy" usually isn't, and his real concern about staying on Ozempic or another GLP-1 long-term without addressing what's driving the disease underneath.

IN THIS EPISODE
- The triglyceride-to-HDL ratio that signals insulin resistance before A1C or fasting glucose ever moves
- Why a "well-controlled" A1C of 6.1 didn't prevent full kidney failure and dialysis
- Whether GLP-1 medications like Ozempic and Wegovy should be cycled instead of taken continuously for years
- What a low C-peptide reveals about your pancreas after long-term injections
- The bariatric surgery parallel that predicts diabetes coming back even after the weight comes off

ABOUT THE GUEST
Dr. Jason Shumard is a Functional Medicine practitioner with over 20 years of experience specializing in Type 2 Diabetes and insulin resistance. He uses a root-cause, lab-based approach to uncover why blood sugar rises, focusing on factors like hormonal imbalances, inflammation, and metabolic dysfunction. Known for simplifying complex science, Dr. Shumard helps people understand their bodies and take control of their health with practical, personalized strategies. His work is deeply personal, inspired by losing his mother to diabetes complications, which fuels his mission to help others prevent and reverse metabolic disease.

CONNECT WITH DR. SHUMARD
Website: https://drshumard.com
Instagram: @drjasonshumarddc
Free webinar "The Top 3 Secrets That Are Preventing You From Reversing Your Diabetes" : https://drshumardsolution.com/replay

SPONSOR
Tyde Wellness — licensed providers who adjust your GLP-1 dosing as your body changes, plus a real care team for plateaus, side effects, and long-term support.
tydewellness.com/GLP1Hub — code GLP1HUB50 for $50 off your first month

CHAPTERS
00:00  The A1C number that lied
01:54  Meet Dr. Jason Shumard
02:56  The mother who declined despite "good" numbers
05:55  Why there's no single root cause
09:14  The lipid ratio that predicts insulin resistance
11:40  "I eat healthy" — and why it usually isn't
15:23  Adrenals, stress, and hidden chemical load
20:47  The foundation you have to fix first
21:54  Where GLP-1s help — and the cycling concern
25:35  Microdosing, bariatric surgery, and the cell trap

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*The content of this show is for informational purposes only and does not constitute medical advice. The goal of this show is to provide various points of view about GLP-1 Medications. The personal and professional opinion of the guests and their content does not necessarily reflect the opinion of Ana Reisdorf or GLP-1 Hub.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

So, in some cases, you know, you may be able to manage it for a period of time. And I hear this all the time. I was pre-diabetic for five years. I was managing it, but then I became a diabetic. And that's a strong indication that person's likely doing a good job of how they're eating and lifestyle, but these other mechanisms are driving the bus now. And if they don't address those things, it's going to get worse with time.

SPEAKER_00 0:20

Today's guest's mother had a perfectly controlled A1C when she went into full kidney failure. The number that every person with diabetes is taught to watch wasn't telling the full story. And it's the same blind spot that he warned about for people losing weight on GLP1. Welcome to the GLP1 Hub Podcast. I'm Anna Reisdorf, registered dietitian and GLP1 user. And today I'm joined by Dr. Jason Schumard, a chiropractor and functional medicine practitioner who spent his career working specifically with people with type 2 diabetes, a focus he started on with his own mother. We're talking about what an A1C number can't tell you, the cholesterol ratio he says is one of the earliest warning signs of insulin resistance, his concerns about staying on a GLP1 long term without addressing what's driving disease underneath, and how to think about diabetes as something more than a number to manage. This conversation includes some perspectives from a functional medicine lens that may go a little bit outside what's typically covered in conventional nutrition or medical practice. As always, I want to encourage you to listen with curiosity, think clearly, and use this as a starting point for your own research and conversations with your healthcare team. And as always, if you're enjoying the podcast, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify because it really helps us grow. And if you're watching over on YouTube, drop a comment and let me know what you think. Now let's get on to the episode. Welcome to the Jopy One Hub Podcast. I want to welcome today Dr. Jason Schumard to the podcast. We are going to talk about diabetes and he has a very unique approach. So can you introduce yourself to the people, please?

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Yeah, thanks for having me. My name is Dr. Jason Schumard. I'm a doctor of chiropractic and I specialize in functional medicine, specifically working with type 2 diabetics, metalbox syndrome, et cetera. We have a very unique approach in the sense that we evaluate individuals to understand what is actually causing their insulin resistance, or we try to make it very simple, their cellular disease process, if you will. And so we do a comprehensive testing to identify what it is and using more of a holistic approach, the functional medicine approach, using nutrition and supplements as well as herb herbs and uh nutraceuticals as well to help these individuals to just get more stabilization back into their body, that their body has their ability to regulate its own sugar. It just needs that help to get back there.

SPEAKER_00 2:53

Okay. So what made you passionate about diabetes care?

SPEAKER_01 2:56

Yeah, this really came from my mom. I I was not intending to work with type 2 diabetics when I was becoming a chiropractor. I was going through the same process of, you know, learning the skills to take care of spines and joints and, you know, sports, athletic type stuff. That was my intention. I was very athletic growing up, and I just, you know, wanted to kind of be in that same type of model. But while I was going through school, my mom was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes. And like many people, I just thought typical diagnosis, it can be managed, lifestyle changes, and she's gonna be okay. Well, that was not any further from the truth. I saw her declining, having to take more medication, and just her quality of life declining over time. And I was like, there's gotta be a better way. And luckily, I went to a school that was really open to other types of techniques and uh came out, came around, uh, came upon um functional medicine. As a student, I was able to start going to some of those courses at a discounted rate, which always is a positive. And I started just learning more about it, understanding more about it. And I just started realizing that there's a better approach, that diabetes could actually be reversible or essentially put into remission. And I thought that was amazing as I as I kept going through these courses through after postgraduation, I eventually got to a place where I felt really comfortable. And I took this information to my mom because that's who I was doing this for. I wanted to help her. But what was interesting, I learned something right off the bat, is that she didn't want the help. She was not interested in the help. Even though her quality of life was declining, everything was not going the right direction, she was going off what her doctors were telling her that she was doing fine. Her A1C was in a good place, her blood sugars were being managed, and she was good. And it wasn't until things really got bad where she finally started asking for help, but that was a little too late. But I had this model and I started introducing it to my current chiropractic patients and started working with some individuals. Some of them were diabetic, some of them were not, and really started seeing this model showing a better improvement. So we were really taking a holistic approach, right? Working with the spine, nervous system, and now the nutrition aspect of it. It was it was pretty amazing the results that they were getting. And then I eventually went full-blown into functional medicine roughly around 2007, 2008, right around there. I hired an associate doctor. He ran all the chiropractic, I ran all the functional medicine, and we just took off from there.

SPEAKER_00 5:14

Okay, so does the diabetes care involve so like the like what I think of as traditional chiropractic or or no?

SPEAKER_01 5:21

Or is it just like no? Okay. Of course, we recommend it because I think it's beneficial to have a good sound homeostatic nervous system because the nervous system is what's allowing the body to function and work and et cetera, the communication between the brain and the organs and tissues. Of course, it's gonna be beneficial, but that's not what we do. We strictly work with more of the nutrition um and the supplement approach in our office just because we're virtual. We have a virtual practice and we work with individuals all over the country. So I I don't have a brick and mortar anymore. And of course, we do refer and we recommend individuals get under chiropractic care, but that's not specifically what we do.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

Okay, cool. So like a total, total shift away from uh what one would traditionally think of as chiropractor. So you mentioned a few times root cause, right? To me, like root cause, I think type one diabetes, autoimmune disease, right? Type two diabetes, genetics lifestyle kind of stuff. So, what do you see as the root cause of diabetes?

SPEAKER_01 6:20

Well, unfortunately, there's not a one size fits all approach to diabetes, right? It's like having a roof with 30 holes on on there. You can't just fix one of them and think the roof's gonna be fixed. So when you look at diabetes, it's a it's a it's a multifactori approach. It's usually a multi-level breakdown because diabetes or insulin resistance takes decades to develop, right? In the early stages, you may have a small percentage of your cells that are damaged and you're not gonna notice it. Your sugars won't even be out of range, and you'll be, even if you go for a regular checkup, you'll be fine and having minimal to no symptoms. Now, of course, we know that lifestyle is a component because if you're eating poorly, you're gonna have massive spikes in sugar, massive spikes in insulin. And those spikes on a large scale, meaning months and decades, will eventually cause disruption or desensitized desensitization at the insulin levels of the cells, right? The insulin receptors, if you will. So it's like throwing too much water on a plant. You're gonna cause the plant to die essentially. If you have too much insulin, it's gonna do the same thing, and eventually I can skyrocket into other problems. But there are other issues that can be involved as well, which is why we need a comprehensive approach. And so there are issues when we look at different organs, because we know there are different organs and glands that are involved in blood sugar regulation, things like the adrenal glands. I mean, I mean, if I had a nickel for how many times I see it on social media, talk people talking about adrenal problems. I mean, it is a very common issue people are experiencing. Liver is another big one that's massively involved in blood sugar regulation, the GI, because that's where all of our food is assimilated. Um the nutrients are then brought into our body for cellular function. Our brain, obviously, is a big component to blood sugar regulation. It's the master controller of our entire system. Thyroid, another big one, very common problem that a lot of diabetics have that is linked to their problems as well. And then let's go and even further, right? Chronic systemic inflammation, which can be damaging the cells at the cellular level. We could have chronic toxicities like heavy metals, molds, and environmental toxins, infection patterns, like the list goes on, hormonal imbalances. There's so many things that could be going on. And unfortunately, they're not all the same for every single person, right? So one person may have, you know, five to 10 problems, the next one could be 15 to 20 plus different problems, and et cetera, which is why there has to be the analysis to identify which we call our root cause analysis. And then we do the customized approach based upon what we see on the testing.

SPEAKER_00 8:48

Okay. So I feel overwhelmed by all of those things. And I don't even have diabetes, but where do you start? You're a person, obviously. Like it would be great to come and meet with somebody like you, but like, how do you even unpack all of that? Because that's every organ in your body basically that you just named. So is there like a few handful of tests you can start with, or one, the first step? Like, what would that be?

SPEAKER_01 9:14

The first one I would do is a blood test, right? And so the and you can even you don't have to do a comprehensive testing like we recommend. You could just go and look at your own tests because the common tests that are ran by the medical physicians, you can gather data and information to see if you are vulnerable. One of the biggest ones we can look at is triglycerides to HDL, a common test on the lipid profile, right? People, if you look at your tests, you're being calmly checked because they love prescribing statins. Like that's a common one that's going to be given. So if you look at your um triglycerides to HDL and you do that ratio to divide the two, and you get the ratio. We want to ideally see that like below two, below 1.5, right? That's like a really good ratio. If you're going above a two, and if you're above a three, you have you are you are developing insulin resistance. It's an indication that your body is developing this cellular disease process. So you can tell even in the early stages. And this at this time, your glucose could be still in the normal ranges, as well as your um A1C, which is not a common test on traditional testing, but you will have a fasting glucose. So you can see a fasting glucose in the 90s, which is totally fine, but your HDL to triglyceride ratio is off, indicating that this is developing. So it's a strong indicator that things are happening. Now, depending on the individual, some individuals are go-getters, they're like, I gotta take care of this. Other ones are like, if it's not broken, don't fix it. Right. So sometimes people have to get into a place where they're feeling bad before they finally do something. And that's the majority of individuals that we typically see because they're already seen, they have the diagnosis, they're already feeling some of the symptoms, and now they're looking to get results and just human nature, right? If we feel fine, we think we're healthy. I probably talk to um, I don't know, between we we evaluate 100 to 200 people on a monthly basis, typically in our office. And I would 50% of them or more tell us, I feel fine, I'm healthy, I just have diabetes. And it's because they don't feel the symptoms that they believe they don't really have a problem. And that's really scary because the body is very intelligent and it's a very good adapter. And so unfortunately, when that adaptation goes away, it could be a very dramatic event for them.

SPEAKER_00 11:21

Yeah, definitely. I mean, diabetes is very severe, and some of the severe end stage of it is is no joke. So let's say you have that HGL triglyceride ratio that's off. Okay, and like you have nothing else. So, what would be a step towards improving those numbers?

SPEAKER_01 11:40

Well, the first thing I would do is like you said, lifestyle, right? That's the easiest thing to do. But the problem is what I've found is that, you know, people tend to think they're eating healthy, right? And they're not eating healthy because they don't understand food and they don't understand, you know, the right types of food to buy, how to cook the food. And it's just there's just so many mechanics. You know, what we try to do is we try to educate from that level, like getting back to a place where we understand what real food is and how to consume food. And in some cases, it's like it going back to the basics of, you know, this much protein, this much carb, you know, it's it's it sometimes needs to be that way. And, you know, I had a guy once, he's like, Man, I eat healthy. I ate well. And I'm like, okay, what do you eat? Well, I go to Denny's every day and I have a chicken fried steak. And that was his healthy. For him, no, he was he was eating healthy. And that's the type of thing that we have to start changing. Or when someone says, I don't like to cook, and I'm like, well, all you well, what about is it difficult to take eight breasts of chicken, throw some salt and pepper on that, throw it in the oven, right? And now you've got chicken. You can make throw some lettuce in a bowl, put some avocado in there, maybe some cucumbers. I know it's challenging to cut that cucumbers, throw a piece of chicken on there, and there you go, with some avocado oil dressing, or you can do balsamic vinaigrette, like just very simplistic stuff. And this is like blowing their mind because they're so used to just things like, you know, like easy stuff, like the carbohydrates and you know, putting the pasta in a bowl and throwing this spaghetti sauce from Ragu on there, and there's my healthy meal for the day. And I think that, you know, we if we can go back to educating on that in those early stages, we can make a huge difference. But again, the other components of this is that there's a huge percentage, and I think it's larger than most people believe. I believe it's probably about um 60 to 70 percent of individuals who are still eating well, they're doing a good job, and their diabetes is still progressing. And that's because of these underlying mechanisms I was talking about before that are going on. So, in some cases, you know, you may be able to manage it for a period of time, and I hear this all the time. Oh, I was managing, I was pre-diabetic for five years, I was managing it, but then I became a diabetic. And that's a strong indication that person's likely doing a good job of how they're eating and and lifestyle, but these other mechanisms are driving the bus now. And if they don't address those things, it's gonna get worse with time.

SPEAKER_00 13:57

You guys remember my conversation with Beth a while back, the one that became one of the most popular episodes? Well, Beth is from Tide Wellness, and that conversation is the reason I'm comfortable telling you about them today. So many people lose weight on GLP1, feel amazing, and then six months later, they're back to where they started because the program ended or the provider disappeared, or they were never set up for the long haul. But Tide Wellness is built differently. Licensed providers who actually adjust your dosing as your body changes. A real care team you can message when you hit a plateau or have a question or need help. Nutrition guidance designed specifically for how GLP1s change your appetite. And if you've got questions, you can book a consultation and actually talk to a provider, a rare find in this space. If you're looking for more than GLP1s, they also do microdose GLP1 programs, hormone therapy, longevity peptides, and the kind of support that matters when you're trying to feel your best long term. Tide is built with support by a team that really cares. Go to tidewellness.com backslash GLP one hub and use the code GLP1Hub50 for $50 off your first month. Again, that's Tide T Y D E wellness.com backslash GLP, the number one hub, and the code is GLP1Hub50. So you mentioned at the beginning adrenals, and that's related to like stress response and other things like that. Can you talk about maybe that's the next step if you think your diet is a little improved?

SPEAKER_01 15:34

100%, because when we think about stress response, everyone immediately goes to mental stressors, my financial situation, my relationships, my jobs, my kids, blah, blah, blah, all those things. And don't get me wrong, that is a component of the stress response that we're referring to, but I refer to that one as the cherry on top. That's the one that broke the camel's back. It's usually not the one that's driving the problems because most of these stress responses are physical and chemical stressors, right? We're talking about physical responses that their body, their organs are breaking down. They have chronic inflammation, have these, these, this systemic issues. Maybe it could be lifestyle, or just this, it's a chronic problem that's been going on 30, 40, 50 plus years inside their body that's breaking things down because your adrenal gland is like any other gland. It can become fatigued. And when it can no longer do its job anymore, then you get worse. Common symptoms are going to be things like brain fog, sleep issues, weight gain, um, and and you know, the inability to function. But we normally say, Oh, I'm getting older. It's because I can't sleep well. And I I gaining weight because I'm getting older. They blame it on age, but it's usually a mechanism. Chemical stressors, most of these people are on pharmaceutical drugs. That's a chemical, right? The water they're drinking is filled with, you know, um chlorine and fluoride and all these toxins that are in their water, even from the municipal, not drinking filtered water. The food they're consuming is filled with pesticides because most people don't know the difference between buying organic and not organic and the and the reasons behind that, or they're they're not, they don't know that the meat that they're eating was GMO corn, that they were being feeding those cows and now getting their body. So all these chemical stressors are building up. And the chemical and the and the physical stressors are the mountain that's really stressing the adrenal glands out. And now you bring in the other stuff and it just takes you over the edge, and we just focus on those things and we forget about all this other stuff. So if we focus on, you know, removing or reducing our physical and chemical stressors, think about how easy it'll be to handle our mental stressors.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

There was a documentary on Netflix that I watched the other day, and it was a woman who talks about plastics and chemicals in the food, and she worked with these couples, and they were they were infertile, and they were able to conceive after they reduced this chemical load. And I found that really fascinating that it could have such an impact. And it was a short period of time, you know, that she was able to like turn it around for them.

SPEAKER_01 17:51

It's a major problem. Uh, and the the issue is, you know, people always say, well, we're all exposed to these toxins. You're 100% right. That the difference is in one person's ability to remove and break down toxins that could be genetically predispositioned for that, or it could be overall poor detoxification skills in the liver, the kidney, and the GI. And those are probably more common. It's like you build this congestion up in those areas and you're still able to have a bowel movement and it urinates, but you can't eliminate properly. And so if you can't get these things out, it just builds up in your body. And the next thing you know, you get these conditions. It leads to diabetes, cancers, organ failure, cardiovascular disease, dementia, Alzheimer's, GI issues like colitis, IDS, hormonal problems because there's a lot of endocrine disruptors, um, and infertility issues. I mean, the list goes on and on, and that can't tell you how often we run these toxin tests, how severe. We're talking 30, 40 different toxins that they're they're just built up in their body and they're just causing this catastrophic event. I mean, you cannot heal in that type of environment. You have to get some stability in there first to allow your body to finally heal.

SPEAKER_00 18:58

So when you've discover that, is it usually like stuff they're using to cook their food? And, you know, I don't know, there's a combination, right?

SPEAKER_01 19:08

Yeah, it's a combination. So there's there's exposure they're currently being exposed to, right? But a majority of them are previous exposures, right? Because I like people have like high amounts of BPA, right? You're familiar with BPA, and most people are. And they're like, but I never drank out of plastic water bottles. I'm like, but did you before? Well, yeah, when I was like 20, 30 years old, exactly. So you're exposed that time and it's still in your body here today, and it's affecting you. Another common one is like it's a derivative of um DDT, it's called DDA. Well, what's interesting is DDT is a pesticide that was used back in the 70s. So that means that that person was exposed in the 70s and they're still in their body, impacting their body today. So we see things not only from current exposures, but previously. So when we're educating our patients, we're educating things that they were previously exposed to and the importance of getting these things out, but also the things that they do now, right? So we we promote, you know, evaluating their home to see if there's any mold growth anywhere, making sure there's they're limiting or staying away from grains or taking mold-free coffee. Those things are important because we can be consuming these things, right? Heavy metals, making sure you're drinking from clean water, you know, staying away from, and we know that a lot of white rice, which is not really great food anyhow, and it's in itself, but is filled with arsenic. And so we have to be careful about these exposures. And then, of course, the environmental factors, we do an overhaul, right? We change their cleaning products, they change their um cleansers they're using, their makeup. Like we go over everything with them to try to reduce as much exposure as possible because we can do all the work to help them remove these toxins from their body, but if they're gonna keep re-inoculating themselves, it's just gonna get worse down the road. And we want to prevent that.

SPEAKER_00 20:47

Sure, sure. So, how long does this whole process take? Because it's it sounds like a lot of steps.

SPEAKER_01 20:52

Yeah, it is. Just typically for just the toxin removal that we have found is somewhere between about seven and nine months, just for that alone for most people. Sometimes it could be longer, by the way. We've seen up to 18 months of some people, but that's that's a huge thing. And I kind of I refer to this as like foundational work, right? I always give the analogy of building a home. Like the most unsexy part of the home is the foundation, right? It's the guys up there in the rubber boots putting them putting the concrete out there. And that's us. That's what we're doing. Because if you don't have a strong foundation, you can't build that nice pretty house. You don't have the nice carpet, you don't have the nice cupboards, you know, the the countertops, et cetera, because you don't have the ability to build that back up inside your body. Once we get this foundation stabilized, then you can start working on those other areas, which are commonly can be done by most individuals with the right steps. So by when we get done with their heavy toxic burden and their overall, you know, systemic inflammation and and getting some organ stabilization, then it's easy. We just give them the lifestyle they need, give them some recommendations, they can keep doing this on a regular basis.

SPEAKER_00 21:54

So, you know, this is the GLP One Hub podcast. So, where does GLP one come into? Diabetes management or insulin resistance because they do play a role in um helping people manage that.

SPEAKER_01 22:06

Yeah, I mean there's a couple components there. Not many people know this, but GLP1 is actually a natural peptide inside our GI and our brain as well, by the way. So what happens is in the world of insulin and GLP1, when you have a heavy insulin load, mean over multiple years and months and years, that starts to suppress our normal GLP1 in our gut, which is why we typically see individuals gain weight, right? They want to eat more because that GLP1 is a communication to the brain, shutting off the hunger and making sure you don't want to eat any more food. Well, that suppresses over time. So no wonder we're seeing these individuals overeating, getting bigger, and their metabolism decreasing. It's because that component. So we do know that GLP1 through it is a peptide. So we'll just call it what it is is a peptide. Injection peptides can actually benefit and improve that functions at the body, which then starts to stabilize the communication between insulin and GLP1. The problem that I have with it is that when it's being utilized for too long of a period, right? Because we know the negative side effects of it being overly used. When you look at peptides, for most, for most peptides, they should be cycled, right? It's a cycling aspect of it, just like anything else. Like you don't want to overdo things and allow your body to no longer produce on its own, right? That's why we see individuals when they're ingesting or injecting insulin into their body. If we do a measurement of C peptide, which is a measurement to identify how much insulin their pancreas is producing, it oftentimes will be on the lower end or even low. Well, no duh, because it's suppressing the ability for the pancreas to produce its own insulin. It's not because that person can't do it, it's because there's no reason to. The brain is telling the pancreas, we don't need insulin, so don't produce, right? And so, and so it's the same thing that happens in our body if we're not if we're injecting it for say a year, and yeah, you're gonna have some weight loss, improvement sensitivity, you're gonna have a lot of the benefits, which I know is there, but you're gonna have increased risk of the ability for your body to do on its own, slowing down peristalysis, and there's like huge stuff now with like paralysis and the and the GI, like there's so many things that could be a negative. But if we're cycling it, and again, I am not an expert in this, but I would, if I were to do this, if I were putting someone on this, I would cycle somewhere around 90 days and then have them go off for a period of time, whatever that might be, even if it's like just four weeks, and then we, if you want to go back on and just continue that cycle, that's be a better option because you're stopping it, letting your body stabilize itself again, and then if you want to help support it again. And some people would even say quarterly, right? 90 days, stop for a quarter, then bring it back again. Cause you can work on other things when you're when you're doing that type of worlds. But I've seen individuals just stay on this. I talked to someone just last week and they've been on it for three years. I'm like, man, I've been on it for three years.

SPEAKER_00 24:50

I've been on it for three years.

SPEAKER_01 24:51

You know what I mean? I just, I just I for me, I we don't know what that impact is going to be on the individual when you're staying that long. And that is where the only my concern on these these Yelpy ones, but I do think they have some massive benefits for sure.

SPEAKER_00 25:03

Sure, sure. I think that there's more understanding, especially when I first started. There wasn't an understanding that you could flex the dose. There wasn't an understanding that you could go slower. There wasn't an understanding that you could this micro dosing thing came up, you know. I think that we're still, at least from talking to people about this all day, I think there's still like a lot that we don't understand about what the optimal dosing is and how to go up and how to work with the people and all that stuff. Like, but I see there's openness to it at least now, which was not the case when I started.

SPEAKER_01 25:35

Yeah, yeah. And I agree, the microdosing is another component that's not commonly discussed, right? You see people on Ozempic taking 1.5 milligrams and for years. And I'm like, that's probably not good, or even go up to two, right? And so that's like that's probably not good for the individual. And what kind of impacts are they gonna have when they stop this, right? Are they gonna are they gonna start to gain all that white weight back really rapidly? And next thing you know, they have all these other problems that are going on. I compare I compare this not fully, but very similarly to bariatric um surgery. Back in like 2008, 2010, bariatric surgery was the miracle cure for diabetes, right? It was like these studies were coming out, everyone was saying if you have if you're obese and you have diabetes, have the bariatric surgery and it'll complete reverse and the cure diabetes. And I was saying it at that point, guarantee within 10 years, we're gonna see those individuals coming back with shrunken stomachs, poor digestion, full diabetic again. What do you know? Around 2019, I started seeing more people coming into my office, bariatric surgery, full-blown diabetes. I was cured before, and now I'm not where they weren't cured. They had a rapid weight loss, which reduced the stress on their insulin and their and their sugars outputs, and they were able to stabilize things, which lowered their sugars, but it never fixed the cells. And this is huge because oftentimes people do these fad diets and do like GLP ones and they they reduce and get off medications, but the cells are still sick. And the next thing you know, they start their sugars start going up again, they're scratching their head saying, What is going on? I'm still doing the same things, but I'm getting worse because there are other mechanisms I missed.

SPEAKER_00 27:11

Right, right. No, and I I think that the underlying issues still definitely need to be addressed, whether it's through bariatric surgery or not. That's where I started my career was in bariatric surgery. Okay. Like I, you know, I saw like a good result was maintaining 50% of the weight that you lost. Like it wasn't permanent results. And a lot of people regain the weight. And and not even to mention the diabetes or the other things that came along with that, but it's it's much more complex over a lifetime. Yeah. You know, it takes a lot more a lot more than just the surgery.

SPEAKER_01 27:43

Yeah, there's a there's a lot of things, and you're probably well aware of this that have great outcomes for lowering sugars. But if our end goal is lowering sugars alone, that's not gonna fix our diabetes, right? Because that is a symptom of diabetes. And we all know that symptoms can be changed very easily with many people. But when you look at the real underlying problems, those are much more challenging and more to affect. And if you don't work on that alone, and you only focus on the symptoms, then the outcomes are gonna be very poor. And this is a perfect example of my mom. Like you said this before, the the long-range aspects of diabetes are very dangerous. Well, that happened to her. She had full-blown kidney failure, right? So she went into full-blown dialysis. What was interesting, though, is that when she went to dialysis, her A1C was a 6.1. Very regulated blood sugars, very regulated A1C with the medications in her lifestyle that she was running. But because we know that diabetes is a cell disease and every single cell in our body makes up our tissues, organs, and systems, that's why we see complications of one diabetic in the kidneys, the next in the heart, the next in the brain, the next in the nerves, because it can impact any area with cells. And wherever it's happening fastest is where that person's gonna have the complications. Her situation was her kidneys.

SPEAKER_00 28:56

Yeah, that's it's unfortunate that it that it progresses like that. So do you have hope that with maybe more understanding and of this illness that we could reverse course? Because it's not going well.

SPEAKER_01 29:06

Yeah, I agree. And I hope and pray that's the case. But unfortunately, human nature, human psychology is if I feel fine, I must be okay. So until we start to shift the mindset, and unfortunately, it's probably gonna have to happen in the medical model, which may not happen in our lifetime because there's more of that trust and belief in the medical model. And their belief is if you just keep your sugars lower, you're fine. But if we start to educate individuals there and say, listen, your sugars are great, now you're you have a less chance of complications happening, but your problem is still there. You need to go find somebody who can help you identify where this problem's coming from and we'll help you manage your sugars, but let's go help you find someone who can help you, you know, get those cells healthier, get your organs functioning better to reverse this insulin resistance going on here. It's gonna be very challenging and people are gonna be very skeptical of these types of options.

SPEAKER_00 29:53

Right, right. Yeah, I mean, I'd like to see, you know, that if we could change course a little bit, but there's it's it's complicated. It's not just one thing, you know, it's a lot.

SPEAKER_01 30:02

And this is there, it's and this is an example of why I love coming on like platforms like yours and social media, because we can keep on putting the message out there. I I've I rarely watch TV. I'm I'm more of a sports guy. So I was watching, I forget what it was, a baseball game or something, and I couldn't believe like every single commercial break, there was two to three different drug commercials, specifically diabetes. That is a massive problem because if I say something to you about diabetes and then you leave and you hear these commercials more often than when you hear me, what are you gonna believe more? Sure. And and it's oftentimes easier to take a pet a medication than to have to put in this extra work that's necessary for longevity. You know, all we can do is keep trying and and go after the ones that are looking for help and help those. And hopefully that ripple effects creates bigger waves in the future.

SPEAKER_00 30:51

Definitely. So if if people want to come and talk to you about their diabetes or prevention, where can they find you and learn about your work?

SPEAKER_01 30:58

So the first place would probably be my website, R Schumard. So it's dr shumard s h-u-m-ar-r-d dot com. It's a great place we you have access to attend. Um, I have a webinar that I do that helps educate individuals that we talked about here today. Obviously, we go into more depth to talk about that so you really understand that. On my other platforms as well, YouTube, same thing, Dr. Schumard, and then also my you know social media uh um uh Schumard. So those are like the best places and easiest places to find more information. The website's a great easy location because you can find everything from there. So that's why I usually point people to the website.

SPEAKER_00 31:34

Perfect. I'll make sure to put all that in the show notes and thank you so much for sharing this valuable information. I'd love to have more conversations about root causes and you know, get away from hopefully improve people's lives long term.

SPEAKER_01 31:46

Yeah, let's get away from symptom-based only and let's get with a holistic uh approach.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

Thank you so much, Dr. Schumart, for being here.

SPEAKER_01 31:52

Thank you so much for having me. Appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 31:54

And thank you for listening to this episode of the GLP One Hub podcast. I think Dr. Schumart had a very interesting point of view and shared a lot of different aspects of diabetes management that aren't frequently discussed. So I hope you found it an interesting conversation. If you want more support along your GLP1 journey, I have a store where I've created several digital products to help you along the way, meal plans, recipe collections, and a guide called the Beyond the Shot Guide that tells you everything that you need to know about how to manage side effects, how to eat correctly, and how to optimize your results. You can find that in the show notes below or visit shop.glp onehub.com and check out all of those resources. And I'll see you in the next episode.