Episode 24 - Beyond Technique: Kelly Kane on Movement, Intuition, and Teaching

What does it look like to lead with intuition, science, and a little bit of weirdness?

In this episode of Three Questions, I sit down with Kelly Kane, educator, innovator, and someone who helped reignite my own passion for movement. We talk about what it means to trust your instincts as a teacher, why being yourself is the best permission slip you can give others, and how collaboration, not competition, can shift the entire movement industry.

In this episode you’ll hear:
 ✅ Why intuition isn’t “woo,” and how to practice it without projection
 ✅ What it means to define your own voice and brand as a teacher
 ✅ How aging, listening, and connecting with nature shaped Kelly’s unique perspective

Whether you’re a movement professional, a teacher trying to find your footing, or someone who just wants to think differently about bodies and learning, this episode is an invitation to embrace curiosity, collaboration, and your own authentic weird.

More About Kelly Kane

Kelly Kane is a movement maverick who has an insatiable curiosity for exploring embodiment through movement. Kelly exacted her assessment skills and study of human biomechanics and arthokinematics as a medical school student, through studies of anatomy and human cadaver dissections and through working with the ultimate teachers, her clients. Kelly Kane founded The Kane School 27 years ago with the goal of training the most knowledgeable and adaptable Pilates professionals in the field. She currently co directs The Kane School in NYC with Matt McCulloch. 

Kelly has been on a quest to review and resource all of the content and research on aging well, specifically the research that is conducted for and by women.

Resources mentioned:
Get the book we talked about & wrote chapters for, Pilates Applications for Health Conditions, HERE! (use code - PAHC15 for a discount!)
Visit Kelly's website HERE
Connect with Kelly on Instagram
Find a Neuro Studio Teacher Near You
Connect with me on Instagram
Connect with me on Threads

Chapters

• 0:00 Beyond Technique: Kelly Kane on Movement, Intuition, and Teaching
• 2:10 Kelly Kane's Unique Approach to Pilates
• 5:36 The Importance of Intuition in Teaching
• 14:24 Navigating Professional Challenges
• 27:28 The Role of Collaboration in the Pilates Industry
• 30:23 Navigating the Pilates Community
• 33:30 Finding Your Tribe
• 36:40 Empowering Through Movement and Sexual Health
• 38:44 Personal Growth and Connection with Nature
• 47:21 Advocating for Reproductive Rights
• 49:00 Final Thoughts and Gratitude

Transcript

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Welcome to Three Questions where critical thinking is king, and my opinions and research are only here to support your learning and deeper understanding. Hi, my name is Meghann and I am your host of Three Questions, and I am really excited you clicked on today's episode. Because I have a very, very special guest of the name Kelly Kane.

Hello, Kelly Kane. Yes. Yes. And if you're listening to this on, um, you know, Spotify or Apple, she's doing something ridiculous with her hands, which is very on brand. But what I wanna say before we even get into it, uh, I'm gonna tell a story. So Kelly, you're gonna have to sit there and look interested. Um, I am personally grateful to you, Kelly Kane because you brought me back to my love of movement.

You've had a lot of students, so I don't assume you remember the story, but maybe you do. So I had sold my Pilate studio that I had had for five years, which was very successful 'cause I didn't have any openings, but I was making no money. So not really successful, you know the deal. Yeah, yeah. And I was burnt out and I lost my passion for things.

So I was planning on going to work for my dad as an insurance consultant, which I know it sounds very exciting, but long story short, um, I found Kae School in New York City and I'm looking, and we spoke on the phone and we just kind of vibed immediately. So what really drew me to Kelly and the work is.

Your critical thinking and your weirdness, like you're a bit weird, right? Agreed. Sure. I mean like am I normal? And it was just interesting. It started my professional journey again. I was going to give up teaching movement with a master's degree. All that stuff was about to give up movement. So I'm so grateful that you ignited my passion for movement again, and I'm pretty sure I'm probably not the first person who's told you that.

Kelly Kane: Yeah, luckily I feel very proud of that. I mean, I think that, you know, in terms of the Pilates world for sure, I was not at that time when we met each other, I was not in the mainstream at all because I was more interested in like what might be called somatics and. Biomechanics and 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: art. Well, wasn't that before somatics was somatics.

I mean, I, I you were, you would like wax poetic about a shoulder for like hours in a way that was very exciting. Uniquely Kelly, but still grounded in biomechanics and science. 'cause I came from a science background. Yeah, right. And you know, young people with our egos. I was quick to point out when some of these Pilates teachers said the wrong thing.

So you were the first, and I didn't say it to them. I thought it, you were the first Pilates teacher, in my opinion, that took the time to understand your intuition, to try to teach it to others. 

Kelly Kane: Oh, thank you. Yeah, I'm proud. You're welcome. Yeah, I'm really proud of that. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: So. Being around people who wanted to elevate the conversation motivated me to get back to what I love and elevate the conversation and be the person in neuro and just kind of keep going.

But something I do is I really always want to credit the people for me or who were there for me who saw something in me that I didn't see in myself. So thank you. 

Kelly Kane: Thank you. Thank you for that. I appreciate 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: that. So now that we've told that story, Kelly told me a story off camera that I don't remember, but I guarantee I said it.

So like you're gonna have to go to YouTube because, because if I said to Kelly, what are you, the Steve Jobs of Pilates, she's wearing a black turtleneck. But tell me why you brought the black tur. Why you wore the black turtleneck? 

Kelly Kane: Because during the pandemic you were working. Uh, at Connected, and we were meeting online, we were doing like these.

Like Friday cocktail hours, like more just like, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: no, I think you were doing that HIIT class just to like get people moving. Yeah. Wasn't that it? 

Kelly Kane: I think this would, no, this was during, I think one of our Friday evening connected, like getting together and, and I, and you were like, you said something to me like, um, you're in that black turtleneck again.

And I was like, yeah, this is all I got. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Oh, you said, I think it was, we were going around like, oh, what did you learn new about one of your coworkers? And I think rudely. I was like, well, I learned Kelly only has one shirt. 

Kelly Kane: Yes. So I wore my black turtleneck or a different way. Thank you. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: But now I feel like I like the name better.

I'm, you're now the Steve Jobs of Pilates to me. So there you go. Which I, I think is a pretty big compliment. Right. So guys, I am not going to spout out all Kelly's accolades because I won't even do them justice. I don't remember all them. I'm gonna put a full bio. I would love you to go to the show notes and read them.

But again, Kelly's background is in biomechanics, fitness, somatics, all these things before there was actually words, okay? Mm-hmm. So why I wanna jump ahead is I feel like we have so much to talk about and I like to keep these episodes tight. Because apparently people have lives and they don't like to listen to me all day long.

I mean, who thought? So I'm gonna jump right into question one. As I said, you are one of the first Pilates educators to critically think and to use intuition as a way to teach in a way that with all do wasn't hokey. Mm-hmm. Okay. Okay. Yeah. It was grounded in biomechanics. It was a bit radical. So tell me, looking back now, what made you lean into that?

What allowed you to trust yourself to say, fuck it, I'm not teaching this way, I'm going that way. Um, I 

Kelly Kane: think,

you know, my training was in anatomy and biomechanics and. I really, and in manual therapy. So I had trained, I dropped out of medical school or pre a pre-med program to go to massage school. And in massage school I realized that as human beings we can sense and feel a whole range of things that we just, just don't practice feeling.

It's just not part of our culture. It's not important to, um, I guess. Success in this culture. And so I kind of, you know, had this long history of assessment through anatomy as, as like a map on any, on every individual. But then I would hold people's hands, put that map on their body and see what their body said to me.

Or simply if I, if I held people's hands, I could feel up the chain. Like, you know, I could feel I knew all the structures more or less. I mean, you know, I'm constantly reviewing my anatomy, but. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Yeah, but you're pretty tight up. You're you're good there. I'll vouch, I'll vouch. You 

Kelly Kane: know, you, I feel like we always have to study.

I always, oh my God, I have 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: to review. I mean, I still do, and when I stopped teaching anatomy, I kind of got a little less sharp at it. Yeah. But can I, can I, can I interject you ask another question? Yeah. Is. Working with a lot of teachers, I find sometimes they see it, try to see it through my eyes. Mm-hmm.

Right. And what I've learned is the people who have, um, a woo hooey intuition, I hate that word. It's not woo hooey. There's science behind it. There's, there's structure behind it. There's. So what I have found is I've met students who actually see color, they feel energy, and I feel like you are one of them.

Mm-hmm. Do you, do you identify it as, you feel the energy fields, you see colors? Like is there anything that kind of, or is it just a sensation you have? 

Kelly Kane: Um, so it's changed. It changes all the time and it changes with the individual. What I'm always trying to do. Is not project like I've spent a lot of years trying to, um, cultivating my capacity to perceive and not project onto the individual in front of me.

So, um, there are times like when I put my hands on someone, I'm trying to just feel what this body in front of me wants to tell me. There's been years where, um, I would see stories. I would see, um, like, you know, I remember once I saw a liver that was like, had a face on it that was like, right, was it a 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: drunk liver?

Kelly Kane: Well, it was, there was a liver issue. Mm-hmm. Um, so it's, it, I really, what I try to do is, is dissolve, projection, and dissolve my. What, you know, I think that what we do is we see what we know and I really try to not do that. I really try to be, I love that vessel. Not 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: anticipating, 

Kelly Kane: no, like I really try not to, like, I'm scanning through the anatomy, so if I still know some, hold someone's hands, I, I know all the anatomy in their hands up to their shoulder and to the neck.

Brachial plexus that, you know, all the things. And I most of the time is just try to center myself. And, and the question that comes through me is like, what does this body want me to see? What does this soul want me to see? What does this person need that they might not even know they need? But their body will communicate it to me and I, and I don't think it's magic.

I don't think what I do is magic. I think I've just been practicing it a long time. No, but 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I hate when people, I don't like when teachers diminish their skill to magic or voodoo. That is disrespectful to your gifts. Yeah. Um, I think. You know, I've had teachers be like, I don't know, I just always know where to put my hand.

I'm like, bullshit. Why do you put your hand there? Is it always hot? Is it cold? Like, trying to figure out, and I just, I kind of love that you don't have a word for it. And maybe correct me if I'm wrong, maybe you don't think it needs a word. You're like, that doesn't bother me. If it doesn't have a word. 

Kelly Kane: No, I think it, I think it's like, um, I think all humans can do what I do.

Like I really do. I think we have. As animals, we have the capacity to sense and and feel in myriad ways, which we don't because we don't practice it. And I think that this is the way that I figured out how to practice sensing and feeling. And a lot of times it, I think it has to do with like. You know, fluids and, um, like, you know, because I did, uh, body mind centering, we did a lot of, uh, you know, focusing on how the fluids move in the body.

Um, I, I work with a lot of people now up in the Northeast. I have Lyme and I can feel like often what's happening on a cellular level. And it's very interesting. It's common like amongst, amongst a lot of different people. Yeah. I, I can like, and it's, it's that, I think it's just that thing of really asking the body to show me the thing.

And as a, as a human animal, I get to feel because I've just, I've just tried. That's, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: and going back to the first question I asked is. You know, there's a lot of teachers out there like you, her intuitive and sometimes they shy away for, or people are like, oh, voodoo and stuff like that. Like what gave you the confidence?

Like how did you lean into it? What would be the advice? And I always say like, I like to clarify my questions as we go because I didn't get the answer I wanted. So I'm gonna ask again, not because you didn't answer my question, I didn't ask a good question. Mm-hmm. What would you say to someone who's like a you who.

Isn't finding success because they can't lean into it. 

Kelly Kane: Mm-hmm. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Give me the Kelly. You would probably tell 'em to, 

Kelly Kane: to keep I think it's like, I do think it's this thing of fake it till you ma make it. I really believe in faking it till you make it and keep trying and keep, um, I often think about this, I don't know what the quote comes from, but, um, see what everyone else sees, but think like no one else think.

And so like, um, continuously refining our capacity to listen in myriad ways, I think is really one of the biggest things. Like, how do I listen with my heart? How do I listen with my hands? How do I listen with my eyes and my like, kind of spidey sense, you know? Mm-hmm. How do I in those ways? Um, and I think that.

It. I do see with students, you know, so much of teaching is about interpersonal relationship. It's about understanding how the body moves, understanding the choreography, understand how to program, and I always felt like if I could really, truly listen to the body in front of me and see that body in front of me, then I could really program in a way that felt meaningful.

And I think that that takes time. Like, that takes, it takes, you know, I don't know how many years. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Well, when we're done learning, it's like time to die. Are you ready to die yet? No. You got shit to do. 

Kelly Kane: Yeah. And I think I go through cycles. You know, I worked in a studio recently where, um, up in Vermont where the, the peop the woman who owned the studio, um.

It was hard to accept, I think, for her to accept that part of me. And so I really dampened that part of me to support what she was doing. Like she had a very clear mission for her studio and. I wanted to, like, I've owned studios, right? So I wanted to be supportive to her brand and to what she was doing there.

And even though I was renting space there, I wanted to be create like a community. And part of that process for me was dampening that part, part of me. Yeah. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: And I don't love hearing that though. 

Kelly Kane: I know. Well, it's interesting. We never, you know, I didn't even know I was doing that really until I was out of that space, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: but, but maybe, but maybe there was more to that.

It's like, you know, I talked to a Clienty big time, CEO, retired really young, and I say it's like, you know, owning the company and owning the neuro studio, it's like, yeah, people are looking up to you, but at some point people aren't gonna wanna listen to me anymore. It's like, how do we deal with those transitions and talk about it and be honest about it?

So I love that you're like, yeah, I've been on top. I've been here. Everybody listened to me. But maybe it was a time to take a step back and maybe I can take a lesson from that and everybody else listening. 

Kelly Kane: I mean, I really, you know, when I moved to Vermont, no one knew what my history. Like no one. Yeah. And so I really, well, a lot of 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: teachers have a problem with that.

I won't mention names, but Yeah. 

Kelly Kane: But it was interesting for me to be the newbie. Right. To be like, I am, I'm not the person where, you know, people are coming to me for my authority. Right. I, I really found it interesting to be the person who people didn't, you know, no one knew who I was. Every once in a while someone would show up and be like.

Wait a minute. I heard some things about you, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: but, but don't you think that's more exciting though? I mean, when I started at Connected and worked with you, I had already been teaching for like 15 years and I'm coming in and all these girls who were new teachers thought that they were more senior than me 'cause they didn't know me.

But it was such a good, humbling experience. Like shut up and work. 

Kelly Kane: Yeah. Shut up. And I agree and I think it's good to understand how to help. Incoming teachers navigate coming into a new space. Like what does that look like? How are you gonna define your personal brand within the system? And that's part of what I was doing.

And how are you going to express yourself within a specific community? Because when I was living in New York, I was working with professional dancers, like I was working with some of the most. You know, trained bodies on the planet and coming here, I'm working with, um, people mostly between, it's either high performance athletes or by by and large people between 60 and 95.

And many of them are, it's not that they're not athletes, but they are aging athletes, alpine athletes, horse, women, and men. Um, you know, but I 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: feel like those are your people. That's why I think you and I bonded. We, we were both old souls. I was like 94 when I was five, like worried about taxes, like asking my mom questions.

She's like, what? What are you worried about? Like, go, go play with the kids. I wanted to gossip with the adults. I didn't wanna play with the kids. Mm-hmm. But I feel like you're an old soul, 

Kelly Kane: maybe. Yeah. Who knows? It's, you don't 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: think, 

Kelly Kane: um.

I don't, I don't know. Maybe, I mean, people used to say that to me when I was young, you know? 'cause 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: yeah, 

Kelly Kane: my parents died when I was a kid and so there was in an accident. And so like in my, in the lore of my family, I think, like there was two things that people always used to say that I was, you know, mature beyond my years and that I was always.

Smiling. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Yeah. Well, I'm sorry to bring that up. Um, in a way if that was not a choice, but when I say old soul, it's, it's just always feel grounded to the earth. Yeah. So I think my definition of an old soul is maybe not the correct one, but like always grounded and knows who you are. Like, I kind of wanted to ask you that question and you be like, just be yourself.

Like, I, I just feel like. You've always uniquely been yourself, which I think gives permission to everybody else around you to be themselves. Yeah. I don't think in my twenties I fully leaned into that as much as I am now. Like I'm kind of like, well, I am a little bit ornery. I am a little bit funny. Mm-hmm.

I am a little bit lazy. Like it's just who I am. So, um. So maybe you need to hear that, that, you know, you give Permiss people permission to be themselves. So 

Kelly Kane: I like that. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I mean, I think 

Kelly Kane: when your parents die, like for me, like I had to decide who I was, period. You know, that came early to me and it came with some coaching from my grandmother because she was the person who raised me.

Um, and so I, I think, and I'm, you know, I'm raising two teenage girls. I raised one child who's now 29, and my daughter is 16. And I think like watching people, you know, under women, young women understand who they are and what they stand for is no small task. It's just, especially now, like, I think it was a different time in the eighties, that's when I grew up.

And um, I do think that there is a real crisis around that where it's like, it feels really hard to be separate from the tribe because the tribe is global now. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Mm. You're like competing with people all over the world and you're not competing. I was saying this to my niece who's 13, I was like, Hey, I'm like.

On social media. Mm-hmm. Ever. And I was saying to my nephew, everybody's having the best time, but let's be honest, what, have you ever had that good of a time? I mean, like, nobody's having that good of a time all the time. Like, happiness to me isn't like always doing great things like happiness is sitting right here with you.

Like it's just, and I just feel bad for kids that they, there's always this comparison. Yeah. But I think it's, I mean, I may, I think. And I hope you take this as a compliment, um, is that you've always reminded me of my mother again. You are just had a big birthday. You wanna say it? 60, 60 baby. And my mom is 73, so she's much older than you, but just like vibes.

And I always compliment my mom 'cause she's hard on herself. I'm gonna kill my husband. He's printing something out while I'm recording. Joe, my sound guy. Have fun with this one. I always, those be dog barks, but my mom raised two daughters who actually like themselves, like each other and have a good female group.

And I see that with your girls. Raising two girls is not easy. 

Kelly Kane: Yeah. Yeah, they do. My kids love each other and that I think is that's, and they love you and they do and, but it's one, a joy of any mother's life to like look at their kids and see that they really like each other. It really truly is one of the things that makes me the happiest.

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Alright. My parents kind of enforced it, but not, Kim and I did not get along in high school. Mm-hmm. Uh, we're 18 months apart. We're very different. And I think we were jealous of each other on the things that we didn't have, but they had. But we really are best friends now. We are so close. I'm so grateful for her.

So, as you know, my dad is sick right now. So just hearing you say that means a lot. 

Kelly Kane: Yeah. It's important. It's really important. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: It, it's hard, those, those realizations. Like I looked at my parents one day and then I'm like, oh my God. How much more time do we have? It's almost like those thoughts, you know, and I hate that you ought to do that at such a young age, but it's like it sucks.

Kelly Kane: Yeah. But you know what? This is the thing. I think we, you know, I've seen a lot of people pass, you know? Mm-hmm. It's been the plot. It's been part of my life my whole life. I've been there when many people have died and. Um, I, I really believe that there's such, um, divinity and grace in the process of that walk.

I think that as a human being, become the caregiver of our parents, like, and that's like one of the many blessings I had caring for my grandparents when they were dying. And it's not easy. Like it is so that easy. It's exhausting. It's, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I try to keep my patience. I find when I lose my patience, I'm like, they wiped your ass.

And not that I have to do that by my parents, but it's like, like, get it together. 

Kelly Kane: Oh 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: yeah. They've provided everything for you. Be patient. 

Kelly Kane: Yeah. Yeah. That's it. Hard. I mean, and I think that that's like, it's a, it's a real blessing. Like I did that with my, both my grandmother and my grandfather, and I remember so many.

Hard days that I was exhausted and things were messy, and yet it's, for me, it was like karma and the right thing to do. Like they took care of me, so I wanted to take care of them, and I think that that thing of divorcing death from, mm-hmm. Life is really not the way that I've ever wanted to live. I've always wanted to be in.

Presence of that process. I've always wanted it because I think, yeah, and 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: it's funny if I, if I'm it, this thought just, it reminded me of when I started working at your studio connected. It was when I lost my cousin who was like my brother. 

Kelly Kane: I remember that. Do you remember? 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Yeah. Yeah. He came in and was my body a lot.

Yeah, I remember that. So, but I just, I like having these conversations like. I don't mind getting upset 'cause I was like, oh, the, the, the, the, the Santa is so big 'cause the love was bigger, but like to able to have these conversations. So it all goes back to, you know, if you're listening to this and it's making you uncomfortable, I gotta let you be uncomfortable.

That's fine. I can't control the way you feel. But it's nice to have these conversations and. Talk about the good and the bad times, right? Mm-hmm. I feel like it helps us be better listeners. Mm-hmm. I agree. Because I, I knew that about your parents. I forgot. Mm-hmm. I forgot. Yeah. And, uh, you know, I don't always think I was a great listener when I was younger.

Kelly Kane: Yeah. Well, I, I agree. I don't, I think I spent a lot of years, especially being a teacher, like talking. I spent a lot of years expressing my ideas. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: You and I like to talk. 

Kelly Kane: Yeah, I do like to talk and, but the great, but you keep attention. I listen to you all day. But the thing that happens is when you age, you know you wanna listen more.

It's, that's one of the things I found. I found that I've talked a shit ton and I wanna listen to like. I wanna listen. I wanna listen to other people's ideas. I want to like, I want to show up as a listener. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: no, I, it's actually something I've been working on this past year and like I've been hearing so many really interesting things lately, um, in a way.

That I'm grateful for. You know, um, I am going to segue here. Mm-hmm. Only because, um, we could talk for three hours. Yeah. So I do have to mention I'm on your many accolades. You we're one of the current contributors to the Pilates application for health conditions book, right? Yeah, yeah. Giant. I got mine, right.

Is Giant here? Yep. And um. You know, what I found was great is being, the thing I liked about this book is a lot of diverse voices. Mm-hmm. A lot of people with different backgrounds. Mm-hmm. Um, to be in the group. So, um, my chapter was the Pilates for Parkinson's. Kelly's is aging, which I know Madeline was like, it's not really a condition, but I really wanted Kelly to do that chapter.

It was important to Madeline to have you do that chapter. Yeah. Um, aging, um, and gait. So. I don't know. We could talk about aging and all the things, but I feel like that's a boring conversation. Mm-hmm. What the question I really wanna ask, because I feel like people need to hear this more and I wanna be part of the solution, is how can we encourage more collaboration and less competition in this industry?

This is one of the reasons why I'm bringing the authors on the podcast. Mm-hmm. I just feel like. If I wanna be part, if I want people to collaborate more and be less competitive, I have to be part of the solution. But do you have any insight in this? 

Kelly Kane: I don't. I'm not a competitive person. Like I'm just not.

And so like for me, say more. Yeah. It always felt like I want to continue to broaden my community. And that's what I think is uniquely human. Like, I need you, you need me. It's what we do as humans to, um, to, you know, to better the collective. You know? And I think that if there is division I, I, I'm not really a part of it, you know what I mean?

Well, maybe '

Meghann Koppele Duffy: cause again, like you're not really on social media. You're not really there anymore. But listen, it's a lot of, in my opinion, Kelly, it's a lot of scarcity mindset. Yeah. So my light shining bright is gonna diminish yours. Absolutely not. My light shining bright is, Hey, I used to work for Kelly.

Like there's a lineage there like. My light shining bright, makes yours shine brighter. Your light shines mine. And I feel like people say that a lot, but I do not see it. I try to comment on all my Stu students posts, not because I'm this great person. I just, I just think it's important for teachers just to be supporting other teachers, and I have to be honest.

I just feel like I'm banging my head up against the wall a bit. Am I wasting my time? Chill out. Meghann, what do you think? 

Kelly Kane: Well do, what do you mean? Like when you're, when you're talking to people, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: explain that more girl, 

you know, the Pilates industry. Yeah. Don't play COI with me. Yeah. But, but I, I love that you didn't partake in it.

And Kelly, honestly, I don't either, but that's why I'm not really well known in the Pilates community. Yeah. I kind of didn't wanna go to the conferences. Like I didn't feel comfortable. Yeah. And I feel like that's why we, our Kane school community 

Kelly Kane: kind of was so tight. Yeah. But like I feel like the community school community is 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: a 

Kelly Kane: little, we're in our own bubble.

Like 

Yeah. And I, what do we branch out? Yeah. Well, I mean, I think that, you know, I've 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: been in 

Kelly Kane: this like, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: you know, 

Kelly Kane: you had Madeline Elizabeth on, we b we all have been doing this 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: a 

Kelly Kane: long time. Like I've been, I've had my teacher training for 30 years. 

Mm-hmm. 

Seen. All kinds of trends 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: in 

Kelly Kane: the Pilates environment.

And I do see this, you know, I'm in 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: the 

Kelly Kane: middle of the current trend, not in that I am producing a million reformer Pilates teachers, but you know, we're having 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: a 

Kelly Kane: lot of people come to my teacher training who have done just like a reformer training. And they've done it at a specific studio and that specific studio taught them their exercises.

And then now they don't work at that specific studio anymore and they're trying to get a job someplace else and they realize they don't have the dexterity and the kind of a more comprehensive skillset to be able to move from studio to studio or 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: build their own brand. And so, um. 

I people who are asking questions, that was 

Kelly Kane: always your audience, right?

Am I wrong? 

Yeah. And people who wanna like see, you know, just think differently. Yeah. People want to think differently and that's always been, you know, that's always been my fantasy, is that the 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: people have 

Kelly Kane: the Kane School mark on them. But it's, it's their brand, it's their way of seeing the world. It's the, but they have some kind of context 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: and 

Kelly Kane: container.

Okay. Got, yeah. And, and so 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I 

Kelly Kane: do think that, um, and I, and I really try to, you know, I 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: don't judge, 

Kelly Kane: I really try not to judge people too. And, and I think that that's. Um, one 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: of the things 

Kelly Kane: that I think it's endemic in the Pilates, it's part of the roots of the old school Pilates is to be, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: it 

Kelly Kane: is, you know, it's like authentic Pilates versus Physical Mind Institute.

They were like, we, it's our way. Or, you know, this physical Mind Institute was less so, but I think that that is in the roots of the Pilates history, you know, and I, I just like. I 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: don't 

Kelly Kane: think we do, we just don't do it. That's not, we're not 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: doing that. That's not what we do. 

Yeah. So I guess the answer is either, you know, and, um, 

Kelly Kane: do you know 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Daria Bronstein?

I, yeah. Out in Santa 

Barbara, good friend of mine, she, she developed a motor. Yeah. She always said to me, I remember years ago, just find your tribe. Yeah. And I, I love that. So maybe the question guys, isn't. Because I have to be honest, I hate when people are like, oh, you have to support all women. I don't have to support all women.

Men don't have to support 

Kelly Kane: all 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: men. Yeah. But I think you don't have to put women down. There's a big 

Kelly Kane: difference. Yeah. But 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I think 

Kelly Kane: maybe the answer to the question is, is find your tribe. 

Yeah. 

And, and 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: be supportive for 

Kelly Kane: the people in your tribe. 

Yeah. Yeah. And 

people. 

And people. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: You 

Kelly Kane: know, when I used to do my teacher training, people who came to me who weren't a good F fit for what 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: we 

Kelly Kane: did, I didn't.

I would refer them someplace else, you know? I just was like, that's what, what you're looking for is not what we do here. But these are the places I know who will do that. Because if you come to a program like mine and you just 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: want 

Kelly Kane: to 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: learn, you know, beginner, intermediate, advanced on the reformer, 

Kelly Kane: and you 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: don't wanna do deep 

Kelly Kane: dive into anatomy, biomechanics, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: intuitive touch, 

Kelly Kane: you 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: don't 

Kelly Kane: wanna do any of that, you are not gonna be happy with me.

Yeah. And we 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: don't 

Kelly Kane: need, yeah. It's, it's identifying your audience. 

Yeah. 

And I do think, you 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: know, I'm 

into the whole like, I mean. I, you 

Kelly Kane: know, one of the things I do really enjoy is seeing 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: bodies do evolved choreography. I 

Kelly Kane: like it, you know, 

and it's, what do 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: you 

Kelly Kane: mean by evolved choreography? 

Like, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: not classic choreography, but like, you know, you see so much 

Kelly Kane: stuff now on, you know, social media that is really like complex.

You know, 

it's cool to see what people 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: can do 

Kelly Kane: with their bodies and brains, isn't it? 

Yeah. I mean one of the things I would like to do and is see more what I would think of as just average, like average humans 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: doing 

Kelly Kane: that kind of work. You know, it's very rare to see like I can do a lot of things and I'm sure you can do a 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: lot 

Kelly Kane: of things and Madeline Elizabeth can do 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: a 

Kelly Kane: lot of things.

But that's not 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: the bodies 

Kelly Kane: you generally see doing 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: all that complex choreography. The other thing I think is that in working with your average populations, that complex choreography is, it's just not it. It's, it's too much. 

It's just, I'm always like, what are we doing? What's the purpose of that? Like, listen, and that's my clientele is.

No advanced movers. They've lost movement or they're older and stuff like that. And to me, it's the critical thinking of how, how we're looking at neuroplasticity, how we can actually replicate things rather than just saying repetitions. I, I just love elevating. I, I joke elevating the small talk to medium about movement, just asking questions and not anticipating, letting, like my study since I've seen you, has been really on the cerebellum is that should be the teacher.

You are not the dictator, you're the translator. So I love how, I hope the listeners, you might have a way different approach than Kelly, like I studied with Kelly and we have a way different approach, but at the end of the day, it's all about listening, seeing and adjusting to that body, which is why I loved your approach.

It wasn't rigid. And so I say to students, if you're coming, when people go, what should I do for an MS client? Do not take my course. Yeah, there is not. A magic exercise that is gonna make people feel better. Like, come on. So, you know, I know you didn't answer my question, but that question wasn't important to you.

You answered a different question, so I appreciate you giving your insight on that. And the last, but not least, we could talk about movement for days. I'm trying not to be nerdy on this podcast so much. Um. Mostly because like my sisters and friends listen to it and they're like, sometimes you talk too technical.

Mm-hmm. But I'm like, you're not my audience. Love you. You love you, but love you. Bye. But what I wanna ask you, and I'm afraid for the answer frankly, because I know some of the things you're so. What is lighting Kelly Kane 

Kelly Kane: up these days? 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I 

Kelly Kane: don't wanna 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: say 

Kelly Kane: guilty pleasure, but what's, what's a rabbit hole you're going down?

What's poking 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: at 

Kelly Kane: your brain? I'd 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: love 

Kelly Kane: it to be outside of movement if it is. Uh, both Madeline and, um, Elizabeth had a similar 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: question. 

Kelly Kane: They both were in movement, but I wanna know what, what's, what's in your brain these days? 

Um, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I. 

Kelly Kane: So one of, I think back to like what my chapter was about in the book is I, you know, I got divorced five years ago and I'm 60 now, and I've really been able to create a 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: life where 

Kelly Kane: I can truly take care of myself.

Mm-hmm. 

And that is not the life I've always had. It's not the life I 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: afforded myself 

Kelly Kane: when I was building my business in New York. Um, it's not a life that I afforded myself and my partnerships, and that to me feels, uh, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: like the gift 

Kelly Kane: of aging is that you, at least for post fertility human beings, uh, with what we think of as classical female 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: biology, 

Kelly Kane: um, I really have.

I spent a lot of time like looking at the earth and the phases of the earth around me and getting to know paths over and over that I ride my bike on my mountain bike, getting to know waterways that, um, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I see 

Kelly Kane: I've seen through the seasons now in Vermont for 10 years, um, getting to understand 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: how the cycles of.

The seasons work here and what the earth looks like and how I'm a part of 

Kelly Kane: that. Mm. 

Um, I thought you were gonna talk about sexual health. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: You're talking about the Earth, mother Earth. You're talking about mother Earth sexual health. 

Well, I'm a, I 

Kelly Kane: would say I'm a little eco 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: sexual, actually, 

hold on. Well, wait, hold on.

Rewind. Rewind that 

Kelly Kane: back. Oh, what did you say? 

Well, I think I, you know, I 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: don't 

Kelly Kane: know. Eco 

sexual. I love that for you. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I love 

Kelly Kane: that for you. 

I, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: well, 

Kelly Kane: there's, you know, I studied with Annie Sprinkle, I don't know if you know who Annie Sprinkle is. I don't. And so 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: she's a, 

Kelly Kane: uh, she was a, you know, she. Is queer and she was in 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: porn and 

Kelly Kane: she was one of my first like sexual health and wellness teachers.

Mm-hmm. And 

she calls herself an eco sexual, and I think in the, like I'm really at this place 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: in my 

Kelly Kane: own personal life where, you 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: know, I 

Kelly Kane: think as women, or at least for me, when I got divorced, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I was 

Kelly Kane: like, oh, okay, partnership. Right. I gotta find partnership. 

Mm. 

And then I realized I actually didn't really want partnership.

Right. I was just like, and it, part of the primary 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: relationships 

Kelly Kane: I have now are with my 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: children and 

Kelly Kane: with the outdoors. And 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: that's just 

Kelly Kane: simple. And, and it's a relationship. 

Yeah. 

That 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I've, 

Kelly Kane: I've been inadvertently 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: developing 

Kelly Kane: since I got divorced. So it's not, you know, I think people think of it as an eros, like an erotic attachment.

That's not 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: necessarily how I think 

Kelly Kane: about it. So you're not 

having sex with 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: trees? 

No, no. Rubbing up on the trees quite yet. 

And I laugh why I said that guys that I was afraid. 'cause like Kelly during COVID, you were like, you were like really going into the vaginal health. But I think it's important that women understand their bodies.

Yeah. Like I have an easier time talking about. Like with my male clients talking about erectile dysfunction and peeing a lot at night and understanding their anatomy. One of my clients, he's like, Meg, we're talking about the head you're, you were telling me about this writing reflex. Like I feel like my genitals are always to the left.

Like a lot. Is that bad? Like I wish women could. 

Kelly Kane: So it almost like, as much as it would like make me blush and when you were like 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: talking about vaginal 

Kelly Kane: eggs or whatever you were talking about, but 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I feel like again, it's like you being authentically you. Mm-hmm. You know? 

Kelly Kane: So 

I mean, when in the pandemic I did the sexual health and wellness stuff because I shit got 

weird.

Well I just, you know what, during 

Me 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: too. 

Kelly Kane: No, not with you. Shit got weird. I meant shit got weird with 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: the 

Kelly Kane: world. Not 

you. I'm sorry. I mean, the thing is, is that I was, it was 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: happening during Me Too, and 

Kelly Kane: one of the things I realized, and you know, this concept of 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: consent, 

Kelly Kane: and one of the 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: things I 

Kelly Kane: realized is that if you, first of all patriarchy, we are, all our vaginas are all ruled by the patriarchy to some GR degree.

It's just the way it is, right? Mm-hmm. And so I started to feel like women, like if I could do something to help women understand their bodies, to understand what they like and 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: what 

Kelly Kane: they don't like and what they say. Nobody teaches that well, what they say yes to 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: and 

Kelly Kane: what they say no to. Because if you don't know what you like, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: what 

Kelly Kane: this body in this moment, at this time likes and 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: doesn't 

Kelly Kane: like, you can't.

In the system of the patriarchy, feel empowered to say no or yes. Mm-hmm. And so, and then I 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: started 

Kelly Kane: to like be talking to young women and they were like, you know, I wanted to help them feel empowered to redirect any sexual contact they had. Not by saying I don't consent to that, but by understanding. I'm present with 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: my 

Kelly Kane: physicality.

This does not feel okay, and I'm going to redirect. And if the redirection doesn't happen, I feel empowered enough to be like, this doesn't feel okay. I gotta bow out. You know, this isn't good. Mm-hmm. And then if that doesn't happen, how do you get out? And so for me, that's what it, what happened. And then I was also teaching.

Intra vaginal structures over zoom, which I felt like it was a perfect opportunity. You, I could walk people through feeling all the structures of, you know, compressor, urethra, and pubic hoge, iio, gyus, transverse perennial structures, but very 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: simply. Over virtually. So people would turn off their cameras and I would take them through identifying their cervix, identifying those structures.

Mo you know, we talk about pelvic floor all the time, but it's so weird, like, how do you know where your parts are if you've never seen them looked at them, or nobody taught you about it? And like, if you think about the. The male genitals or like a penis and testicles. They're external. Yeah, they hang. Yeah, they give sensation.

Whereas females, it's more internal, so it's not like in our daily proprioceptive awareness and it's just so amazing. The lack of education women give, but I also 

Kelly Kane: don't think that women don't teach it to younger women. 'cause I don't think they know. Mm-hmm. Right. 

I, most of the people who came to my, my, um, to 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: my 

Kelly Kane: little program were, were they older?

No, young, younger. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And what I thought that was so 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: interesting, '

Kelly Kane: cause I was anticipating it was gonna be 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: older 

Kelly Kane: women and it 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: was 

Kelly Kane: really, truly, I had big groups for some 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: time. Yeah. And it was mostly between, I would say 21 and 32. 

Well, I think every generation says the one after them is a bunch of idiots and isn't doing anything right.

But what I can say about the younger generation is they don't. They don't if something, or they're not afraid to question authority. They're not afraid to ask questions. Where I remember like being like very uncomfortable asking questions, so I didn't want people to think I didn't know that. Like, it's like, oh, the clitoris.

Yeah. I know where that is. Like when I was a teenager, I, I don't think I knew, right. So I think it was more out of embarrassment where I feel like kids now, like even look at my niece, the confidence, I remember her saying to me, she's 

Kelly Kane: like, oh, I'm a theater kid. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: Like 

Kelly Kane: I'm not in the cool group 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: or something.

Kelly Kane: But like, she was kind of like, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: but I don't care. 

Kelly Kane: Like, it was just, there was just this different dynamic where 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: I'm 

Kelly Kane: like. The kids will be all right. 

They will be. Yeah. Yeah. 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: And 

Kelly Kane: I think, I think my biggest 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: thing 

Kelly Kane: was, you know, just the, I believe in am, I'm involved with reproductive protecting reproductive freedoms, and I believe that, you know, one of the first signals of authoritarianism.

Is trying to control anyone's body. And the primary way that that authoritarianism 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: gets 

Kelly Kane: expressed, the first parts of it 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: are regulating 

Kelly Kane: female bodies. 

Mm-hmm. And 

so I, for me, I was feeling all of that. I was feeling this 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: moment 

Kelly Kane: that we're in right now. Um, and I started working with abortion care too at that time, and trying to get meth, meth, like, you know, different kinds of access to abortion pills.

And so I, I think that that 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: was, 

Kelly Kane: for me as a elder, I think of myself as an elder. Now. I think that that was my, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: it 

Kelly Kane: felt important to. Focus some attention 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: there for sure. 

So thank you. 

Sure. Thank 

Kelly Kane: you. 

Thank 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: you for reigniting my passion for movement in 2011. Yeah. Nice. Thank you. Thank you for not 2011. Yeah, dude.

Isn't that crazy? 

It's, we're getting old baby. We are getting old. 

And we are getting better. I, I love, I 

Kelly Kane: know it's corn. My mom always goes, 

Meghann Koppele Duffy: just wait till you get old. I getting old to me is a privilege. Not everybody gets to do it. Unfortunately. My loss was someone my age, and so I realized, oh shit like.

Things can change in a minute. So like do everything, say everything, say the wrong thing, you know, who cares? It'll be fine. Yeah. Yeah. So thank you for that. Thank you. Thank you for not being competitive and even hearing that maybe yes, we can all be less competitive, but I also do think, um, that we can all be more collaborative as well.

Like what I saw in this book. Um, of sharing ideas. It doesn't have to be my way or the highway. Mm-hmm. We can all be a little right and all be a little wrong. Yeah. So thank you for that. And thank you for loving nature and protect protecting female reproductive rights. 'cause your generation and the generation above laid the groundwork.

I do believe my generation dropped the ball a little bit because it wasn't in our front. Um, hopefully we're, we're really trying to, um, get more involved now, um, because I think what you said is, uh, critical to understanding our bodies and understanding our rights. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you for the three questions.

No, thank you for your time and I hope everybody listening, listen. I hope everybody who has listened to this easy for me to say has enjoyed the 40 or 50 minutes with Kelly Kane. And don't let it be the only 50 minutes you spend with Kelly. I will put in the show notes how you can contact with her, learn from her, move with her, um, be in her presence.

Um, you won't regret it. I love you, Kel. Love you back.