Authenticity In Mental Health | Therapists Unhinged Ep. 1

In this inaugural episode of Therapist Unhinged, we dive deep into the often misunderstood world of therapy. I'm Nella, the owner of Bellarmine Health Services, and I'm joined by my incredible co-hosts, Miss TJ Johnson and Dr. Robin McCormick. Together, we aim to create a space that is raw, real, and relatable, breaking down the stigma surrounding therapy and mental health.

We discuss the importance of authenticity in therapy, emphasizing that it's not just for those with mental illnesses but for anyone seeking personal growth and understanding. Each of us brings our unique perspectives and experiences to the table, Dr. Robin shares her journey from education to therapy, highlighting how her background in sports psychology informs her practice. TJ, our advocate for women's empowerment, focuses on helping clients embrace their authentic selves, while I share my passion for forensic mental health and family counseling.

Throughout the episode, we touch on the realities of being a therapist, including the emotional challenges we face and the importance of self-care. We acknowledge that therapists are human too, often navigating their own struggles while supporting clients. Our conversations highlight the need for emotional safety in therapy, the significance of building rapport, and the value of understanding the biopsychosocial aspects of mental health.

We also address the misconceptions surrounding therapy, particularly the fear of being labeled or judged. Our goal is to empower listeners to seek help without stigma and to recognize that therapy can be a valuable resource for everyone, not just those in crisis.

Join us as we embark on this journey to demystify therapy, share our stories, and encourage open conversations about mental health. We hope to inspire you to embrace your authentic self and seek the support you deserve!

Therapists Unhinged is where mental health gets real. Hosted by licensed therapists who tell it like it is, this podcast dives deep into the messy, meaningful, and hilarious parts of being human. From mastering resilience to navigating the chaos of everyday life, we bring raw conversations, expert insights, and unfiltered honesty...no jargon, no BS.

New episodes drop weekly. Subscribe, leave a review, and come unhinge with us.

Produced by APodcastGeek.

Transcript

Nella:
Sometimes we lose our shit in our own personal life. Sometimes we're like, you know what? I'm going to cry when I get home because something else is going on. And I want to keep this space raw and real.

Dr. Robin: You got to show up in the world. Even with my athletes, I used to always say, listen, it's four walls and a floor. It doesn't matter where you are, it's who you are.

TJ: That's it.

Dr. Robin: And you got to be you no matter where you go.

TJ: I just shared with one of my clients today when we were working on self-development. And I shared that. I said, listen, I've learned I don't have to be the loudest person in the room. But if I want to be, I can.

Nella: Hello, everyone. Welcome to the first day of Therapist Unhinged. So I am Nella. So I'm the owner of Bellarmine Health Services. And then to my right, I have Miss TJ Johnson. And then to my left, I have Dr. Robin.

Nella: McCormick.

Nella: Yes.

Nella: It's okay.

Nella: So we basically are here because, you know, we know that a lot of people are misinformed about therapy and we want to keep this real raw and relatable to everybody. So our goal is to talk about different subjects. um that you know are on our heart and then on also the audience's heart eventually once we get some engagements and you know the purpose of this is really to kind of bring more awareness about what therapy can do for everyone's life it is not about you having a mental illness it is not you know just about something's got to be wrong with you in order for you to get to see a therapist and you're gonna see three different very different personalities here so me i'm a very you know you're gonna see me as a very very direct uh individual why don't you guys introduce us to you as you can see i'm in my battle fatigues today because um you know she is very direct

Dr. Robin: And yes, and these two lovely ladies got to go to their beautiful luncheon, and they're dolled up. And Dr. Robin McCormick, and did not start off as a therapist at all, and started off as an educator, actually an athlete, and then did sports education, wanted to be a sports broadcaster. And Robin Roberts, that was my girl, I figured Robin, that's what we do. And I've just kind of had this weird obsession with sports. It kind of saved my life. And now I get to use my degrees in education and also in sports psychology and marriage and family therapy to problem solve and use a lot of the, actually a lot of stuff I learned being an athlete and coaching to help families. I do a lot of psychoeducation because my big thing is that you cannot change what you don't understand. and we have to start from somewhere. And so, you know, I'm also pretty direct in a kind of a fun way. If you see me dancing or doing floor angels, that's probably not, you know, out of the question either. So, you know, and I love it because again, like who even knew what therapy was? I mean, it wasn't around when I was growing up. So, you know, I love that we get to bring mental health That's a hell.

Nella: You just gave away your age by saying therapy wasn't around, by the way.

Dr. Robin: Fifty-four. Fifty-four. Gen X, right here. Yeah, I'm fifty-four. I'll just put it out there. I don't catch up. But she don't catch up. So, yeah, I'm fifty-four, and my age is just a mindset, which clearly mine is. So anyway, that's a little bit about me, and I'm going to roll it on over to TJ2Smooth.

TJ: Okay, so I'm TJ2Smooth. I'd like to call myself the jack-of-all-trades. Of course, I've done many different jobs. I've been a workers' compensation adjuster. I have my real estate license. I've done administrative work. You name it, I've done it. But I definitely am, as a therapist, all things women empowerment. Yeah, definitely something I could relate to. You know, I always say I wish I had me when I was 17. But I definitely like to empower women. I, you know, I serve many different age groups and, you know, in my clientele. And I really like to, you know, kind of focus on being your authentic self. I think that, you know, and especially it doesn't matter in any whatever room you show up in, show up your authentic self because, you know, hey, everybody else is already being who they are. So you might as well be yourself. So as a therapist, I'm very empowering. I like structure. I am compassionate and empathic. But I can be direct. So I always say I'm nice until she's nice until she's not, y'all. But even when I'm not, I'm still very respectful and I treat people the way I want to be treated. And that's how I, you know, my practice is designed to help my clients just advocate for themselves, speak your mind, yet be compassionate and respectful.

Dr. Robin: Love it, love it. All right, and Lady Boss here, I know you said you are, she is our owner, almost five years next month, I believe.

Nella: So yes, so basically, you know, I love sitting next to these two women right here because they're, they're both complement me and each other very well. And I came into this in 2020 and was not my plan to own my own business. at all and I always wanted to be you know for the most part always wanted to be in therapy I did change my degrees a few times but It just kind of happened during COVID. And I realized how much more mental health was needed. And it kind of just spiraled from there. And it grew. And then I realized, OK, maybe I'm not too bad at this. You've learned a lot along the way, good and bad, for sure. And I know that we're going to continue to grow as we are. And it's been an amazing five years. And I wouldn't have it any other way. And basically, my whole take on therapy, and I do a lot of assessments, so I'm really into forensic mental health because a lot of people do get in trouble with the law because of mental health issues. So I'm very fascinated with what helps with recidivism rates. And that's kind of my niche. Also, family mediation, family counseling, big on the systems within the family. And I love what I do in general. And I also even love running a business. I never thought I would love it, and I actually do. I really do.

Dr. Robin: And you are very good at it. Thank you. Very nice all the time. People are like, don't you? No, no, I am too old. She has that business mindset. And no, it really is one of your best things.

Nella: And thank you. I appreciate that. But you know, it's hard to imagine because I never pictured it, you know, until five years ago, I never pictured it. And, you know, like I said, there's a lot of mistakes. I mean, I'm sure I'll continue to make more mistakes. But having YouTube on my side is amazing.

Dr. Robin: We just keep her entertained.

Nella: I'll take it back off you all. People compliment me well as well. Like I said, I know my weaknesses, I know my strengths, and I am very direct even with patients. I really believe in kind of beauty, Jay, like saying, be your authentic self. So if I see that or I encourage that as well out of my clients, because you don't acknowledge your past, you don't acknowledge your flaws and don't take accountability. I'm huge on accountability. I'm huge on telling my clients, you need to hold yourself accountable. What part did you play in that? You know, we've all had our own personal lives as well. And I think that's why this podcast too is really important because there is this image that still, unfortunately, there are therapists that portray a certain image out there that, you know, we have our shit together. And I read this one thing on LinkedIn the other day that, you know, this therapist was kind of speaking for everybody, all therapists, that we practice what we preach. And although we try to do that, right? We try to, you know, yes, we always try, but we're not perfect. So we can't, we can't put that out there because then that gives, that looks like for our new clients or even current clients, like, oh, we're, we're judging you because we have our shit together. It's like, no, sometimes we lose our shit. In our own personal life, sometimes we're like, you know what? I'm going to cry when I get home because something else is going on. And I want to keep this space. raw and real. So just FYI warning, if you get sensitive about things, this may not be the perfect podcast for you, but.

Nella: But it may.

Nella: You're right. It may be something that you need to hear a little bit. And we are, at the end of the day, all just human. We're not better than anybody. We may have all these degrees in education and experience, but at the end of the day, I know we all try to relate with our clients. Right.

TJ: And we go home to our families too. I mean, just like everybody else, we go home to chaos sometimes. Sometimes we go home to things that we never expected. I'm glad that you mentioned that because we are human. We do cry and I've cried in session with my clients. I was just going to say, it seems like when I get home and I'm like, whoo, sometimes I'm like, give me a minute. I say that, please give me a minute, get myself together.

Dr. Robin: Well, and that's the thing is that, you know, one of the things that I really love is that because, you know, growing up an athlete and, you know, whatever, but I did coaching. So I've been around dudes, like I'm a guy's girl. I'm a boy's mom. I coached girls and girls are fantastic athletes, but even coming in here and getting to work with women. And it was, you know, so our group of women that we have here are absolutely phenomenal. You know, I mean, the,

Nella: taking us a while to get there, but yes, we're good.

Dr. Robin: And even with that, it's, you know, there's always a, you know, you set up your parameters, you set up your standards, and as you grow, and as you learn, your expectations have to continue to grow and change. And that's the thing, but it all starts with, you know, I'm all my people know, you know, attitude reflects leadership. And, you know, even when coming in, I remember switching from education here and I forget the first time Nella was like, hey, yeah, so, um, you interested in it? I was like, no, no, ma'am. I appreciate you. However, uh, I'm. I'm not ready for all that. And I have not done this enough. And, you know, but just even with that, you know, I do take what I do so, you know, with so much, you know, not pride, I don't want to say pride, but I am integrity. Like everything I do, I want to have integrity. You know, I do not lie. I'm very authentic, very transparent. And even with that, I am a leader that likes to raise leaders. You know, I love autonomy, you go be your best you and that's cool. Listen, that's about you. It doesn't even matter. You got to show up in the world. Like when you said, talking about being in a room, even with my athletes, I used to always say, listen, it's four walls and a floor. It doesn't matter where you are, it's who you are. That's it. You got to be you no matter where you go. That's it. That is one thing I used to always say if I was in the courtroom, if I was coaching your kid, but I said, I'm going to be me. I'm always me. Even coming into mental health, I wasn't sure if I was going to be able to be me because sometimes me, it's a little much. No, but that's what makes you you. And it's taken me a long time to get here. And I will say the fact that we are in this practice with everybody and they are them and we celebrate everybody. Everybody's so strong and especially with females, there's so much attack on, there's just a lot going on and it is just a delight to be able to.

TJ: I just shared with one of my clients today, we were working on self-development and I shared that I said, listen, I've learned I don't have to be the loudest person in the room, but if I want to be, I can.

Nella: I like it.

TJ: And I've learned that, hey, silence is a statement. Because I always thought that if I'm not heard, then I'm not seen. But that is so not true. I can be silent. I can be in the back of the room and still have power.

Nella: Well, I don't know if you've ever heard of the saying, confidence is silent, is quiet. Confidence is quiet. Insecurity is loud. I like that. It's true. Yeah, I heard that, and that's true. So the most insecure people are the loudest, are the ones that have to hear themselves, are the ones that always just have to make a statement. And then the more confident ones, you gain more by sitting back and listening. That's true. And I'll admit this.

TJ: There was a time where I was insecure.

Nella: Oh, yeah. I think we all.

TJ: And then there are times where sometimes we still feel those insecurities, but we still have to just lean back and just really refocus. and say, okay, who am I? And then answer the questions, who are you? You know what I mean? So there are times like, you know, the more like elevation with elevation, sometimes there's like some insecurity or some, you know, you gotta work on, you know, another level of confidence, but just knowing who you are. And that takes a lot of work. It doesn't happen overnight. It's not an overnight thing. It takes a while. It's a process to develop yourself.

Dr. Robin: And even with that, wouldn't you say it's never ending?

TJ: It never ends. Every day I'm learning to be a better version of myself. I will never say I am the best version of me. Because as long as I'm living, there's always going to be something that I want to be involved in. I always want to elevate. So I'm always working on being the better version of myself every day.

Nella: That's what makes you a good human being. And I think that's what makes you a strong person, a strong leader, which is what I saw in you is because if you are working towards just being a better you, you're not trying to be anybody else. You're not trying to be better than anybody else. You're just trying to be a better you so that you can impact more people, so that you can just show up better for everyone around you. Right, absolutely.

Dr. Robin: So funny, you should mention that. My last session, It's not funny. Here we go. That's exactly what we're talking about. I said, listen, you're so busy living right now. She goes, surviving. I said, not anymore. I said, you were in survival mode, but you were also in training. As athletes, we always say, Championships are one of the off-season. That's what he said. I was like, 24. I said, we were training. My gosh, so many things. We're all just like, come on, enough of the labor pains already. Show me the baby. That's what I said. I said, because when you know that you are on the right path and you are doing the work, you don't know what it looks like, but you just know this makes sense. You're so busy living. the blessings just come because you are always in the right spot that you're supposed to be. And that's that opportunity preparedness, that's where it is. And it doesn't ever stop. But it's interesting and I'm gonna kind of piggyback on what you said only because I taught this today. We were doing development in my psychology class and we're doing psychosocial Eric Erickson's. And one of my favorite things with that, cause that really resonated with me when, Because I did this degree so much later and had just gone through a divorce and a single mom and I was just like, I got to figure out how to not ever do this again. Like what is going on? And you know, and so that's the thing we always talk about like physical development, cognitive development, like that's where we are. And so when I love to bring in the psychosocial piece, because it's like, A lot of people only see behaviors because that's what you can see, you know, and I said that nobody's really understanding what's Why are these behaviors happening? And so like even when you talked about, you know people being loud and you know We talked today about, you know, I said, and you've got these little broken babies that were not, you know, there's no trust, there's no nurture, there's all of this stuff where you don't really understand who they are. They, you know, they're trying to navigate. We are all built on connections. And I said, so, you know, you hear people say, oh, well, they're just attention seeking. I say, you're damn right they are, because you're not getting it. Because again, there's no connection. And so they get loud. I had actually a client say to me, she goes, I feel like I am screaming in a box and nobody can hear me. And I said, well, let's go. Let's open the box. Let's open the box. You know, and that's what I'm saying. So I tell my clients, I said, I learned so much from y'all. I said, you know, you just got to need where they are. And I said, oh, my gosh, I've grown so much with them. And I said, you know. They make me a better person, you know.

Nella: We learn from them and sometimes they don't realize it too. Like I've learned so much from my clients, their stories, their backgrounds, their, you know, the way they think and how there is just so much diversity out there and hearing everyone's story and it does, it shapes who you are. And I think that's why it's so important why therapists need therapists because Because how are we going to understand, because we're in it, right? We're emotionally connected. Just like, that's why we can't be a therapist or a family member or a friend, because we're emotionally attached. But when we hear these stories and we can connect in that way, it's just, it's amazing.

TJ: Definitely. I've had clients actually ask me, do you see a therapist? I'm like, of course. If I didn't see a therapist, I wouldn't be able to help you.

Nella: Although we do have a connection and stuff, sometimes we can just be like, all right, you know what, Robin? You gotta reel it in a little bit. Right. And then Robin always, she, so I'm very, it's very hard for me to hide when I'm stressed out. I'm one of those, like, I can put on a face, but at the same time, when you can read my emotions without me, I can put a smile on and like, it's all over my face. Like my husband tells me, you've told me, you're like, no, I know something's wrong with you. And I'm just like, oh, it's fine. It's the greatest day ever. Right? Yeah, not for you.

TJ: Can we shut the door? You got issues. So that's what you wanted to be.

Nella: Yes. And that's the hard thing too about doing this job sometimes is because we have to show up for them and we have to be like engaged in something that's going on in our personal life. Like sometimes we just have to be like, all right, you know what? I just, I can't today or I need to do events or I need to do something.

TJ: But how do you feel like when, you know, outside people, I'll say it like that, think that, you know, we're supposed to have it all together, like we're not supposed to show emotions. We're not supposed to, you know, like lose it or whatever, you know, because sometimes people do look at us like, OK, well, you can't have emotions. Or if we're going through some family situation, we say, you're the therapist, you have to behave a certain way. And it's like, no.

Nella: But that's what I established when I first see people come out.

Nella: That isn't broke at all.

Nella: But that is what I tell them. Initially, I'm like, hey, if this is not a good fit, or if you're not connecting with me, or I tell them, very first session, look, I'm not perfect. Therapists need therapists. I'm here for you. And if it's not a good fit, then let me know. I will push you with someone better. But yeah, and I try to connect in that way without oversharing, obviously, personal life. you know, over time and building rapport with people is when I try to like say, I get it. I, you know, if I hear a mom struggling with, you know, divorce and stuff, I'm like, it's hard. It's the hardest thing I've probably ever done in my life. And it, it doesn't make, it makes me a human first. And it makes me an ability to not only know, like, you know, psychologically what you go through, like what we were taught how to teach and what that does to us, but also relate like personally, you know, on the emotional level. So because that's one thing to like, even before I started school for this is we were taught or we looked at therapists as the picture perfect. When I see bios of people and they're with their families and their dogs and their white picket fence, I'm like, I'm glad. I'm glad they have that and all. I'm happy for you. You've been married for 45 years and all, but you're portraying that to people and sometimes they get intimidated and they feel like, They're going to judge me. They're going to judge me. They'll never get there.

Nella: Or I'll never get there.

Nella: Or I'll never get there. Or that's picture perfect to you. That's what I want. And it's like, no, you want your story. That's it. You want your story. You want how you've gotten to maybe a different place. I didn't ever picture getting divorced. I didn't picture struggling and barely able to afford diapers and groceries at a certain time in my life. But I've been there, and that is what made me who I am. people's weaknesses and trials and tribulations will make them stronger and embracing that is important.

TJ: Absolutely. I agree with that.

Dr. Robin: Well, and you know, but it really comes down to because I've, I will tell you that coming from education and also being a health teacher. So I was literally teaching life skills to teenagers, you know, I was doing sex education at 26 to 18 year olds. And I was like, I graduated PE, excuse me, where's the jump rope and a basketball. Cause I was not going to talk about penis and vagina. But it was like, okay, well, here we go. Knowing this class, by the way, anyway. They sure did not because they just wanted to know what the heck is this girl going to do today. But the funny thing was, is that I came from such a rigid religious background, it was not spoken about. There was so much just of, Okay. Green, as the day is on, I mean, didn't have anyone to talk to, didn't know really what to do. And then it was just so funny that I was like, oh, I'm like the HIV liaison for the whole county. Like, we can go, listen, we got the baby. What do you got? You got what, Pierce? Girl, sit down. But we can't, you know. But again, my students even know, like, listen, I love you. You know you can come to me. I'm going to put my foot up your behind because you did something stupid. Oh, guess what? You're going to do it another stupid. But okay, you need help. But I think even bringing that into therapy, because like I said, and I always said, I don't know why like therapy for me is so weird. I think it's just because I am so not the mold at all, like at all. And yeah, at all. So. Not at all. But that was still my issue. They talk about transforms and counter-transform and everything else. But it's funny because I think as I've done this, I've really had to just figure out what works for me. That's where as we work with our younger clinicians and stuff, and sometimes you do use like, but the book says this and they said that, and oh my God, what is this and what is that? I'm just like, I don't care, it's a book, it's cute, but application. which is the same reason why I wanted to go marriage and family. Because again, I'm so glad I came from education, but I was like, you bring me any baby you've got, you bring me any teenagers you have, and plus I was helped. So I was getting the mainstream kids, I was getting everything you've got. I was like, well, here we go. One notebook on that. I know how to lesson plan, but I think that, and that's all it is. Exactly.

TJ: Like you have this new client and you try to find whatever they're struggling with in the book and you're not. You're not going to find it the way they're telling it. So you do have to, you know, make it whatever works for you, make it work. And of course, whatever works for that client.

Dr. Robin: But even with that, you gotta be your best researcher. Oh yeah, most definitely.

null: 100%.

Dr. Robin: And that's where I see a lot of people get, well I did this and I did that and I get complacent. I'm researching that as we're talking. What was that you said? And you did what? Because that to me is like, that's important for them. Right, absolutely. You know, and that's what I'm saying. I think it's just really being able to be uncomfortable. Yeah, absolutely. You know, because there's no growth without discomfort. So I'm like, I'm growing all the time too.

Nella: Yeah, no, and I think you made a good point, too, when you said that people, they get comfortable, they get complacent, and they go to the book, and that's why I always say, like, we need to change this about therapy. Like, yes, the book is helpful. It is a guide. We need to know, like, certain, if they're having certain, you know, symptoms, the symptomology part, but we also have to remember the biology part. we have to remember like look into like all right is are all your hormones in check you know did you get all this checked out because people immediately want to go like okay i'm i'm have depression and anxiety and all this like i need medication right away and it's like okay well let's look at the background where is that coming from let's look at the and so I think that's one thing that people have been so afraid of going to therapies, because first of all, they think, all right, I must be crazy. They're going to try to give me medication. And that's not what I want. And so it's like, okay, good. I'm glad that's not what you want. Let's talk about that part first. And you know, the medication all that can come later. And If it even needs to.

TJ: I think there's certain sessions where, you know, depending on who it is, where most of those things have come up and we always, of course, rule out medical first. So I'll ask, have you been to your primary care provider? Have you been to, you know, have you had blood work? You know, get all that. And actually I had a client who was experiencing some of those things and that's what I shared with him. Like, hey, go to your primary care doctor, get some blood work, get a complete blood count, you know, do cholesterol, all that good stuff. And, you know, it was discovered then that there were some, you know, just some small minor things that it can change. And it actually helped with the depression because I didn't know what was wrong. So sometimes you're right. Like, you know, check out the medical part because there's not any misdiagnosis that I've seen.

Nella: And, you know, like working in inpatient, as you did as well, like everyone is slaps on like three different diagnoses on you. It's like, oh my god and then this person comes out and that becomes our identity and that's what bothers me too it's like okay just because you have depression just because you even let's say you were correctly diagnosed with bipolar disorder that does not mean that's who you are right that means it's something that you have to work through it's some kind of chemistry that has to get figured out and there's other things you can do, but like that becomes our identity. So you have one mental health breakdown in your life. And I don't know if you two have ever been there, but I've been there to where I had a bottle of pills in my hand for my anxiety pills during my divorce. And I looked at it and thought about it for about 30 seconds. I'm taking that whole bottle because I was in such a deep depression. And I threw that bottle across the room because I was like, you have two kids, two little tiny kids. I was like, I could never do that. But in that moment, what, now I'm crazy? No, I was having a deep moment. I'm going through an environmental change to me. That doesn't mean that I need to be on like 10 different meds. We need to educate people about that. And I think that's what we need to change a lot because there's so many people that just don't buy the book. You have this. We were going to diagnose you with four different things. And that bothers me personally. And it really does, because that's not what therapy should be all about.

TJ: And that's what I think is so great about Bill. you know, because we do, we, we get down to the nitty gritty with our audience, you know, and we look at it from different aspects, not just one dimension, but we look at it like three dimensional. And so, you know, that's what makes us a good team because we're not just, oh, okay, well you have anxiety. Oh, okay. Well you have bipolar. Oh, okay. This, we try to rule out different things before we actually, you know, make a diagnosis or, you know, just, you know, do a treatment plan for our clients. So I think that's very important, too, because, you know, our clients, they want to be heard and want to know they're important. They don't want to think that they're crazy. And so and we don't we don't treat our clients like, you know, they're just a number that or, you know, a name that we check off next and go to the next person. So I think that's what makes us very unique as a as a team.

Dr. Robin: Well, it's funny, put this on the board again today, you know, hearing all this, and it's really because, again, it has come top down, you know, Attitude Reflects Leadership. We literally practice what we preach, we really do. We do even business, whatever, but I'm always, like I said, I'm education. So to me, every time I'm doing something, it still comes down and One of my favorite sayings is love finds solutions and difference makes excuses. And, you know, today we were working on stuff, you know, what's the opposite of love? You're like, hey, I'm like, yeah, good try, no, but try again. But, you know, we talk a lot with, you know, our logic brain and our limbic brain, and that's where so many people, you know, get confused. Because again, if we go biopsychosocial, you're welcome, college kids, because it is three-part, you know, and that's the thing. Yes, there is a biology to it. Absolutely. And even when you were talking about that, some of my male clients, low testosterone. We were talking yesterday, you guys shifted into hormones. women going through menopause and they're like, I feel crazy. I mean, guys, you should.

TJ: And look at all the symptoms that's added to that. Like if you look, okay, now you're depressed. Now you can't, you know, so yeah. And that's funny. I'm like, you shouldn't be feeling good right now.

Dr. Robin: And the fact that you even made it here, dude, give you some nubs, man.

Nella: And then just think about the generation too, like the generation X and stuff. Like you were taught, we're taught like, okay, you can't, if you're a man, you got to be a man. You can't feel anything. You can't be, if you're a woman, you got to have your shit all together, you know, even in your fifties. And it's like, hello. I mean, but the thing is, is that we can't help our hormones. You know, we got to be able to, to look at that. And then men too, like they have a lot of pressure. Like there's these like great songs that like artists are coming out with. And I can't think of the name of Brandon was here. He would know, but it's about like the, the amount of, of like, Bricks and and stuff that are on the men's back that like is completely like disregarded and then men don't come to therapy and they don't ask for help because they feel like they're not a man if they ask for help and it's like No, I love seeing men to come to therapy. I love seeing I don't even smell like 40s like I kind of like I you know, professional baseball players come. I've had, like, firefighters. I've had grown husbands. Like, you would see them walking, thinking they have all their shit together, and they're just, like, this perfect man. And it's like, no, they're a human, too, and they're going through their own shit. They're in crisis or whatever.

TJ: And they, you know what? And they have every right to feel the way they feel. Absolutely. You know, I share with, you know, my male clients. I'm like, you know, I know, you know, I don't have brothers, but I have, you know, male first cousins. And I remember growing up with them, and all you hear is, oh, you're a punk, or you're a sissy. Get your stuff together. Men don't cry. You're crying. You're acting like a girl. And all of these different things piled on them, and that is how they think. And so they hide their anger, or they do things because they're not allowed to express themselves. And so I teach my clients, like my male clients, look, it's OK. If you need to cry in here, go ahead. I got tissue. you know, let's get it out because what's in you has been hurting you and it's manifesting in different areas. So let's, let's, let's do a treatment plan. Let's try to, you know, resolve some of the things that you're dealing with so that you can show up and be, become your, a better version of yourself.

Dr. Robin: Even with that. And it's funny, cause, um, Again, we're talking about our dudes, which guys, girl, and even like you said, being a single mom, all this stuff, I relate very well to guys, not just as an athlete, but being at a household, having all the responsibilities, working two, three jobs, never being able to even- Raising a boy. Raising a boy, and my two other ones. But also everybody that was dying and being sick and it was all came down on me. Even I know what it was like to walk in the house and I'm like, Can I just take a breath? And so when I tell my men that, they're looking at me like, okay. And then I say, yeah, I go, listen, I go, dude, I know that emotions weren't even invented. Like we weren't allowed to do anything. You know, we were grown at seven. And I said, but here's the thing, you know, anger is never even a true emotion anyway. I said, so I said, but here's the thing, when was the last time you ever felt emotionally safe? They don't even know what that means. And I said, here's the thing, whatever it works, whatever it's going to be, I said, because it's not about me, it's about you. You know, I said, but then I had this one young kid who was somebody else's way back for I was here, beautiful kid, tall, you know, just you look at him like. I don't even know what's wrong with me, because every time I come in, I sit on that couch. I'm sitting right there. I already know. I don't even cry for anything. And I'm just like, I mean. He just starts crying right away. Oh my god. It's a crying chair. And here's the thing. And clients, how many of y'all have had said, I knew I was coming to see you today. And they feel safe. And I said, because that's the thing. And that's what we're talking about. When I go, yo, girl, shut the door. What's going on? And we do that very well, because we know with each other, we are emotionally safe, you know? And there's so many times that none of, I mean, we haven't.

TJ: And I was just going to say that. I think this, honestly, this is one of the first times, you know, being around, you know, a group of women that I felt the same, you know? So, yeah, you're right.

Dr. Robin: It's only competitive, you know? And I love to compare, you know, and compare a lot of insecurities and always, I'm going to get mine, I'm going to get that, actually, you know?

Nella: Yeah, that's why we got to change that though. And you know, we were, I think a lot more selective of who we bring in now. And like I said, a lot, a lot of growth. And I look forward to seeing, um, all the great things that we do. Now we're doing a lot of stuff in wellness. Integrating that because like we were just talking about like hormones and getting older and our metabolism slowing down and all that stuff. And so really thinking about everything as a whole, how you're sleeping. I mean, everything, things that you put in your body. Even since I've become certified, I'm like really looking at the back of labels now even more than I was before. Like just everything is like,

Dr. Robin: you know just very important all around and um well and and i'm gonna kind of pull back a little bit because what's happening and again i'm like did i teach all this stuff today i really did our young people i say y'all are the researchers they have more information at their fingertips and Who are they asking? They're like, well, what about this? What about that? What about that? What about this? And nobody's got any answers for them. And so that's what I said, the fact that we are not afraid to go listen. If I don't have the answer for you right now, you give me two minutes and we'll go find it. Yeah. That's what I think has not been happening for a long time, too. Everybody got real, just like, nope, nope, hands off, hands off.

Nella: Nobody wanted to- You meet the check marks of this, so this is what we're doing. We're putting that in a box. Then you pass it. Yeah.

Dr. Robin: So nobody has any accountability because they're too afraid. Absolutely. That's change. I mean, you just listen. There's no fear. Let's go. Balls out. That's what I'm saying. When you get to go in there and just say, hey, I'm here with you. And, you know, people say all the time, even like athletes, they're like, Oh, I'm nervous about this. I said, that's all right. Cause I'm a good coach. We're going to be fine. And I just walk away and they're like. Oh, am I supposed to fall? Okay.

TJ: Because I'm just like, but you got to, you know, that's, that's a part of building the rapport or building relationship with your clients. Cause before you can do anything, you got to build a relationship. Right. So when you make them feel comfortable, when you make them feel safe, when you make them feel, Hey, I can discuss it. Cause I had a client tell me, he was like, I don't know. He goes, it's something about this room. Like every time I sit here, like, I just feel like I could just pour out and tell you everything. I'm standing back on my mind. Like, don't tell me. Don't tell me everything, but tell me everything. But it's just something about the atmosphere that you said, that we said in our sessions, that people feel like, hey, I can just tell you everything like my whole life.

Nella: Because that means they're not feeling judged, they're feeling heard, and maybe it's the first time in a long time that they're feeling that. Absolutely.

Dr. Robin: Well, that's what I'm saying because I really believe and I know just personally, I strive so hard to be a person of excellence in everything. I do not lie. I do not placate. I, you know, and, you know, I try not to judge because that's the thing, you know, people that judge themselves judge everybody else. because they see people the way they see themselves. All of us have been through that. All of us have been, and how come this happened to me? Oh my gosh. It's always like, why me? Why me? Why me? Now I'm like, okay, why not me at this point? Because I am strong. It's supposed to be me and it's not even about me. We were talking the other day about purpose. I'm doing the academic assessments and TJ and I were talking about something and she was just like, mate and I said because I've been living it my whole life, you know, and myself and my son and teaching and advocating and understanding and so now when I have these, you know, I work a lot with the you know, the neurodivergent community and just the processing and understanding that and for the first time and I and I get it now they come in and I go, okay, so anyway, and I just start throwing stuff and they just Like, you can just see them going, it's the first thing that's ever made sense to me in my life. I'm like, all right, we're gonna have a good time.

Nella: And they're just like, who are you? Are you? That's what I said, I wanted to say, I'm you.

Nella: And that's what makes you connect so well with your clients. And one thing you said in the very, very beginning, and it was funny, because it actually was brought up today at our event that we went to, you said physical education saved your life. that part of you, that is like, it's ingraining you. Like I know you run like a maniac, you cycle, you do all this crazy stuff, which I wish I had as much energy as you. However, I think about it and I'm like, that is what we were talking about earlier. Like it saves kids' lives and that's why the whole wellness and everything was like, get active because, or get your kids active. Get them to do something because it can save their life. My daughter, you know, she said, she'll tell you now, she's almost 18 years old and she said, I don't know, I don't think I would be where I am today without cheer. It actually gives me chills just thinking about it because her being a cheerleader has changed her life and saved her. She said it. I don't, because while she was going through, you know, the terrible things when she was younger with divorce and all that stuff, like, That is what kept her going. It kept her feeling good. It kept her focused on something else other than the crap going on at her house and things like that. So it's so important to get your mind off of it in a healthy way. Again, healthy ways to cope is working out, is reading, whatever, but not instead of turning to drugs and alcohol and all that.

TJ: Absolutely. And I share the same thing, you know, is what Nell is saying, you know, like with my granddaughter, you know, cheer saved her life. It's therapy for her. Even with the event today, I saw two of the young ladies who started the program where my granddaughter is. I had to give them their roses. I'm like, you guys, if you ever think that you're doing this in vain, just remember this conversation. I go, you are changing the lives of these young ladies. And this is what we want, because we want our girls, and our boys, to grow up to be good people. People with emotional regulation. They can regulate their emotions. Emotional intelligence.

Nella: Right?

TJ: Emotional intelligence. They can stand up for themselves. They can be whomever they choose to be, as long as it's positive. So that's what we want. And it takes a village. It takes a good village, you know, know your village, identify your village, make sure your village is not, you know, like conspiring against your kids. But, you know, it's up to us as parents, therapists, whoever you are, to set the foundation for our children so that they can have that village. If you can't, you know, get through to your daughter, you know, Robin can, or, you know, vice versa. So I said that to her. I'm like, Robin, go get it. We heard that little thing. Reagan's always like, oh, he ain't never said this. I'm like, you mean Robert, because I'm the short one. Don't talk to me, because I cannot hear right now. And it's wonderful, though.

Dr. Robin: Well, and even with that, and it's funny, because being a coach and being an educator, so many times, our parents are like, all right, listen, your name is said more in my house. I had to come meet you. Who are you? And I'm like, oh, I'm sorry. But they're like, I told my baby this and this, but here's the thing. And you know, I'm family systems girl. I love my families. And to the haste, I need a system. It's a bicycle. Gotta make it all work. And I said, but here's the thing. And again, we go back to that logic limbic brain. And I said, when you are operation, you know, operating from that emotional, you already, like, all you're doing is, that's the way that person makes me feel. So you're not hearing anything. You're just like, there's mom again. Oh yeah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But because Coach Robin or TJ or whatever it is, is coming in and you're not in a limbic state, you are there to learn or whatever, your logic brain is in focus. So then you go. Wait, what was that? Hold on. I do that also with my females that I work with that have come from a lot of trauma and especially toxic relationships, which that's also a big thing in female ADHD. That will definitely going to be a topic we're going to have to get into later. But there are certain people, because I'm not a big social media person, but I do follow a couple. There's a couple and I said, I want you to follow this, I want you to follow this, I want you to follow this. I said, because here's why. You come in and you start to beat yourself up and you're like, well, why didn't I do this? And how come I do that? And oh my God, and I, and I'm doing all this again. I said, cause you're not rational. You're like the little drunk friend that can't drive home. I said, you can't be rational in life.

TJ: I know I do.

Dr. Robin: I actually picture it, right? I mean, yeah, take the keys, whatever. You're not supposed to be there. But I said, and that's the thing, you're not thinking logically. But then you start to beat yourself up in your logic brain and then you start to spiral. But then what's happening, so you start doing this, okay, let me just see, oh, dot run. And you're in a logic brain, you go, oh, wow, wait a minute, that makes sense. You take it in differently, you're processing it differently. So then when something happens, you already have something to hold on to. Wait a minute, hold on, no. I don't have to, I don't need to, I feel myself, you know? And that's what I'm saying, that's why I'm all about the psychoeducation. Because you cannot change what you don't understand. And so that's what I'm saying, I love that by the side of it. And that really took that last degree in the psychology that really got in the neck, because marriage and family, like I said, I can do divorces, I can do anything else. But like you said, that's why I went clinical into the crisis unit for a year and a half, because I was like, I need this. Because I came from education. I didn't have a clinical background. And so I was like, I do not want to ever come into anything not being prepared.

Nella: I learned so much from crisis unit. Like, oh my gosh, I just like soaked it up too. I had a really good, there was a really good doctor that I used to sit in with. And Man, the things that I learned from him and he was very biology based. So he would find people coming in being vagrafted. And you know what the bottom line was? They were having like hallucinations, all these things. So they think that they're in that psychosis. They were. A lot of them had UTIs.

Dr. Robin: Yeah. Older generation.

Nella: Yeah. And it was like, they never had anything happen to them and all of a sudden they had a UTI and they fixed that and then no more psychosis. And I was like, I was just like in awe. And that's the thing, like soaking all those moments up. It was like, yes, it was an experience. Some, some days were not good. I got a crap beat out of me one day from somebody in psychosis, but I will never, I'll never regret doing it because of the amount of information that I gained.

Dr. Robin: Do you think that, and I think that's probably why you and I are very similar because Nothing really rattles us, you know, it really doesn't. And I remember you saying, even your husband was like, that Robin Lloyd, she sure is something. Because, you know, she just doesn't, because I think, again, high school, you know, everything else, I've been in so many fights, blocking this one. But you can't take it personally.

Nella: Because it's not about you. Yeah, oh no. Gosh, we cannot take anything personally.

Dr. Robin: And that's why I think even here sometimes I'm like, okay. You know, even some of our young people, they say, well, this is it. I go, okay, but it's not about you. Listen, there are this, but let's look at it this way. And you can't get, you know. But what she's saying is I got to get beat up. I mean, listen.

TJ: If y'all beat me up tonight, listen, I'm going to make it so that I can talk into this, like, thing that y'all keep me up late. I promise I won't fight back.

Dr. Robin: No, I waited the crap out of it. I don't know if it was a little over the top.

TJ: Oh my gosh, they didn't have a tear pool. I thought it was like, uh, somebody like a whole foot taller. I broke up those few fights. My kids used to fight. I broke up those fights.

Nella: They were four.

Dr. Robin: Did they count? Yeah. No, but I think that's what it is. Is that most times that it is not, that's the first, I say like, people kind of, are you pro this? Are you pro that? Are you pro whatever? Are you mayor, JJ? I ain't go, It really doesn't matter. It's not about me.

TJ: But that is so true. It's not about us. Ever.

Nella: There's always those, there's always clients that try to poke the, like, what do you believe? Why does that matter? How would that change our interactions?

TJ: I have clients that come in and go, okay, I don't believe in God. I do believe in God. I don't know if I believe in God. Do you believe? And I say it, I know it's not what I believe. Now, I do do Christian counseling. That's different, right? So, you know, we're on the same page. But even with that, there are still certain beliefs that, you know, my clients as Christian clients, they don't believe or they haven't gotten there yet, I'll say. And it's still not about me. It's like, okay, well, what do you believe about that? You know? I never tried to, you know, say what I believe so that they can believe. Because again, at the end of the day, I always say, this is your session. This is your session. What do you want me to know? What do you want me to help you with? So that you can go out of this room and show up for yourself. It doesn't matter what I believe. I don't care. I mean, I care, but I don't.

Dr. Robin: Yeah. Well, even with that, because I look at it and I go, you ready for some mental gymnastics? Because you know I'm going to Toro. Oh my gosh, I didn't say that. And I'm just like, why does it matter? Why did I just jump off the mat? I can't do that. Oh, you can. I mean, I can spot you. But I think that's what it is. And again, people come in, they're very nervous. You know, they're very nervous and try to put it all out there. And okay, once you're done, I'm like, okay. That's wisdom. Like I said, especially when you've got people that come from really heavy stuff. I literally am like, okay, well, if you want to lay it on the table, let's go because the elephant's here. We're either going to ride it, You're color it or something, but I'm a little squished, so.

TJ: I love your analogy. I love it. Right? Because I've said that too. We're going to eat this elephant one session at a time. You know what I mean? Or I say, you know what? There's so much stuff that you're burying. You know, there's only so much you can put under that rug before the rug becomes the ceiling. Oh, yes. And then you just shut the door going, no. And it starts to stink. Yeah, dead bodies. But you know, heavy stuff too. And now being trained in EMDR, it actually does help with the trauma. And it's not just for trauma. I learned a lot from the training that a lot of times when clients think about EMDR, they think about trauma. It doesn't have to be trauma. It can be phobias, anxiety, depression, the things that you have dealt with maybe two weeks or two years or whatever that EMDR can actually help with too. So that's one of the other things that we offer here at EMDR.

Nella: Yeah Well, we will be taught having a lot of different topics We want we want you guys to reach out to us and let us know Um, we'll be doing like q a little bit for sure. That'll be coming up There's gonna be so many topics that we get to talk about guest speakers. We're gonna have some guest speakers, uh, obviously because we learn from our people in our community and their own experiences and

Dr. Robin: I was even thinking we'll have a thing because I was even thinking in my class, y'all give us topics. If there's lessons to go on, yeah, y'all give us something. I mean, we'll spell. We'll spell.

Nella: Absolutely. There's so much that we can talk about and I just love all of our different takes on it. I totally hope that everyone enjoys. We hope that you all tune in for every episode and we look forward to keep going and having their piston hit.

Dr. Robin: That'd be a roll.

Nella: She will dance for you at the end. If you just request a dance. I'm sure she will do it for you. Yes, I will. Thank you.