Why Financial Success DOESN'T Equal Mental Health | Shocking Truth | Therapists Unhinged Ep. 7

In this episode of Therapists Unhinged, we welcome our very first guest, Jeremy Lindquist, owner and financial advisor at Skypeak Financial. Our conversation delves into the profound connection between finances and mental health, a topic that resonates with everyone.

Jeremy shares his insights on how today's luxuries can quickly transform into tomorrow's necessities, urging us to recognize the importance of acknowledging our current circumstances and the paths that led us here. He highlights a common issue: many individuals, despite having financial security, struggle with their identity and purpose, which can lead to feelings of depression and disconnection.

We discuss the challenges faced by clients, particularly those navigating significant life changes like divorce. Jeremy explains that many people approach him in survival mode, often unaware of the financial tools and strategies available to them. He emphasizes the need for stability and understanding one's financial situation before making any drastic changes.

Throughout our conversation, we also touch on the emotional aspects of financial discussions. Jeremy points out that clients often wear their financial struggles on their sleeves, and he stresses the importance of creating a supportive environment where individuals feel empowered to make informed decisions about their finances without the pressure of immediate change.

As we conclude, we reflect on the significance of building a strong foundation of trust and communication in both financial and mental health practices. Our partnership between Skypeak Financial and Bella Mental Health aims to provide holistic support to our clients, helping them navigate their financial journeys while also addressing their mental and emotional well-being.

Transcript

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Today's luxury becomes tomorrow's necessity and we start to frame our stability and our success in our lives based on what we've grown accustomed to, not what we really need. You're not where you started, you're where you are. Now let's set the bar higher because if you're not growing emotionally, spiritually, family, business, You have to acknowledge the space that you're in. You have to acknowledge how you got there, what abilities or capabilities you have to grow and move forward in that. They could have all the retirement. They could have their disability. They can live comfortably financially, but they don't know who they are. They don't know what to do with themselves anymore. And then they go into these Welcome, everyone. Today is episode seven. Seven. Yeah, and today we have a Our very first guest. And we have Jeremy Lindquist. Yes, he is the owner and financial advisor for Skypeak Financial. So today, if you haven't already guessed, we are going to be talking about one of the biggest topics that affects literally everyone. everyone. It affects everything in our lives, including mental health, but also relationships and businesses and everything else. So we thought we would bring in the best person that knows everything, which is about money, right? Money affects everyone in every way. So that would be Jeremy. And Jeremy, I've known for now A little over a year, I feel like. Yeah, a little over a year. He has become a friend as well as a business partner. He helps me with my side of the business and employees and things like that. I thought he would be a very good guest to have on here and talk about finances and how they do affect mental health. So again, welcome, Jeremy. Welcome, Woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, woo, Robin always has to do something special in the beginning. Made a ring with the money. Oh yeah, we are wearing green. We didn't even I know, it's pretty funny. The yin and the yang, perfect. So, Jeremy, if you want you can tell us a little bit more about you or if you could just tell us, you know, what you think about you know, finances and how that does, what you've seen in your The first thing I want to do is thank you three and Bella Mental Health for one, inviting me to come on the show and two, for the role that you play in this community. I've learned over the years that building any practice, any business, the initial drive that people have is, hey, I want to be in business. I want to make money. And as we mature in our view, we start to recognize that it's not about generating more patients in your case or more customers or clients in our case, it's a responsibility. And what we've been able to identify creatively together and in discussions over the last few months is the powerful connection between the work that we do with financial counseling and the work that you do with mental health and behavioral counseling to make people's lives better around here. So podcasts like this, discussions like this, which really should be happening everywhere. They kind of are, and sometimes without guidance, right? They're happening all over the community. And by creating some structure to it, by shining a light on some of these things, maybe hitting some of the key points, someone is going to find a path to feel better, to do better, to know something more than they knew before. And that's better. And that's really why we're here. So I'm thankful for the fact that you do that. I'm honored to be part of this community and having these conversations. So hopefully our reach will be great. And I am passionate about what I do. So yeah, I've got all kinds of interesting correlations with mental health. from my own experiences and from the folks that I work with. And I'm really excited to TJ. Can I just start real quick? Because I think that's the quietest You're like, you're like you're getting an award or something. because it's nice because we do we work really hard and I mean we're good but I mean it's so funny because he just the other day when somebody says about we're like oh I'm sorry what because we're so in it we're so in it that we'd someone's forget I know you're out there but our rewards change as we're sure. and the reward of being acknowledged and also being thanked. It's like, that's what makes me sleep good at night. The fact that someone feels cared for, appreciated, I think in a larger sense, loved, is a powerful feeling. And you can suffer a lot of financial struggles and be completely at peace. with some of that connection to deeply held values and Well, wouldn't you say, Jeremy, too, that being that you are the financial guru and help people every day and you have business owners and maybe just even individual people in the community that come to you and say, hey, I need help with this or I'm struggling. Do you find that people already coming to you are already kind of having, you know, struggling So most of the people that we're working with have pretty good prospects for their financial prosperity. They're doing okay with the money. And what has started to happen in their lives is they recognize that the value it represented when they started, and the value that it's expected to represent in the future might be different than what they thought. So there's like this lack of being like congruent, right? So yes, some people do come to us and say, oh, geez, I'm going to have a rough landing here. I'm losing my business. We're getting divorced. I think I'm only going to get half, whatever it is. But it's interesting because those people are living in what we would consider to be a in many ways, a financial survival mode. No one has to say, if you're hungry, find food. If you are exposed to the rain, go find shelter, right? So once you move to that next level, if you could imagine like a fountain. It's got the top and the water goes up to the top and then pours into the larger bowl and then it pours over into the larger bowl, right? I always tell people we'll be a little corny and we'll build this foundation on trust, okay? That first bowl is stability. That happens after survival. You got enough money to buy the groceries. You got enough money to have a place to live probably for the next month or two. Maybe you've got a little insurance in place to protect if you crash the car or something happens to you, you can't get to work. Or you know you're disabled or something and as those pieces start to come together and you have the stability develop in your life is when you start to have the space. In your mind where you start to ask more questions and i would say that that's where we're encountering people everywhere from that stability. Which is the first realization i'm probably gonna be financially okay. And now can I do better? Well, the other question that comes in is how should I be thinking about all this? And I think that's where the teaching on the financial side and the awareness of the true value of You nailed mental health right there. Did y'all catch that? Nailed it. So when you're talking about, well, first and foremost, I would like to say, I was going to borrow it, but I'm just going to go ahead and pay you for that statement because I'm putting that in my teaching. I've never heard it said like that. No one has to teach you survival. I was like, drop what? Like, because I'm always looking for ways to, but that right there. And then you said stability after that. And so when we go again, I'm always talking to the logic limbic. you know, and it's like when they come into mental health, and of course, I mean, people are coming into mental health or because, you know, life is overwhelming them. And so they're having a hard time thinking logically and having that space because they're in survival mode or, you know, the mental health. And so it's like, once, you know, we could do that, build the foundation on trust because, you know, they're pouring into us, we're pouring into them, then it's, Oh yeah. Okay. Maybe that's what happened. You know, I'm not holding on to that anymore because that's just who she was or that happened and it wasn't my fault. And I'm sitting here going, it's right there. Get some nugs, man. That was awesome. It's It's actually super hard to teach in survival mode. It's hard to retain because we're looking at the, I don't have the abundance that I need to be okay. I think that's where your expertise supersedes mine is like, okay, first things first. Let's just acknowledge things are bumpy right now, right? Give yourself permission. And I think there's different levels of stability because if you can have a real tough thing happen. you know, a death of a family member, a loss of a job, maybe you're half a step away from losing your home. And then you can reset and say, wait a minute, I've got shelter with a family member. What's that next step? I've got shelter with a friend. I have 60 days to ask questions because I don't know what foreclosure means. This would be the hard landings where someone who's a soft landing and say, wait a minute, you're not in survival mode. You're still ready, brace yourself. Probably one of the most wealthy people statistically across the entire globe. But your expectations, this is today's luxury, which luxury having a condo, having a house becomes tomorrow's necessity. and we start to frame our stability and our success in our lives based on what we've grown accustomed to, not what we really need. And as soon as you can acknowledge that the platform for survival is way lower than where you don't think you are, now You know, what's funny is you caught on to the survival. What I heard him say too was acknowledgement, which we always say, like, we can change what we don't acknowledge, right? Saying that you have to acknowledge that piece is is huge because that helping I know in my head, like, connect the dots of if you have to acknowledge the space that you're in, you have to acknowledge how you got there and also. what abilities or capabilities you have to grow and move forward in that. And I know that's one thing that you do when you help businesses. Because I know when I first met you, I didn't even know I needed someone like you. I was just like, going along, chucking along. 4 years in and your son approached me and told me kind of what you do. And I went and met with him and all the things I never thought about being a business owner. You just don't think. And then Then you help me, you know, look at things a little bit differently. And I think that's what a lot of us need. I mean, even in different spaces. So like, although my take is from like a business owner and therapist, like, like you said before, like people going through a divorce, you know, that's, that's huge too, because that's, My gosh, we help people all the time with going through divorce. And I know finances is one of the biggest thing that and custody of children. Those are probably the two hot topics. So finances, what would you say is one of the biggest factors of someone struggling or mistakes that they make going through Well, it's interesting. When early on in my career, it was like, as soon as I met somebody, this is an opportunity to do business. We're going to open some accounts, we're going to do some commissionable transactions. And when someone came to us, who had encountered that the relationship wasn't working, Everything in there, evaluate, identify the situation, start to learn and kind of reset. What are my expectations? Where am I going to live? What's going to happen with the kids? They don't know what they don't know, right? And then they're saying, great. And I also need to understand the finances. And here's the thing. The first thing that needs to happen is they need to recognize that financially you just have to stop. Buy the groceries you normally bought. Make the car payments you normally bought, you normally pay for. If you're saving and investing your retirement account, perhaps continue to do that through work. Set aside cash for emergencies. If it's an amicable situation, even though there's a relational strain that's not as what it used to be, then it's a little easier to do that. Sometimes with divorce there's erratic behavior sometimes erratic financial behavior causes divorce like he just keeps coming home with new cars or she just you know is out doing shopping or spending sprees or vice versa whatever it is or you're going to renovate but she never talked to me about it right so not being equally guilt with the finances so by the time someone who's going through divorce is referred to me It's not a time for financial change. It's not a time for financial learning, except for this is probably what is going to happen. Okay. The court is going to say, okay, great. You're going to get divorced. You're going to have to do a childcare. you know, agreement, right? There's going to have to be, all the assets essentially get frozen from any major decisions beyond a certain point. I'm not an attorney, but this is what we see and what we understand to have happened. I've been in the middle of helping these things before. And then depending on how long people have been married, couples have been married, and you know, what's the disposition and who owns what? It's going to be kind of a halfsies thing that's probably going to happen. Maybe some income is going to shift back and forth, but that's all got to get figured out. So the first thing is, is recognizing that they're coming from a place of emotions. And that's probably the driving force there. Everything else that has to do with finances is almost like, let's maintain the status quo. We're not going to be able to impact change without me going into too much detail on the divorce and finances. You're not going to be able to go into too much detail on the finances beyond, let's not give it all to legal advisors if we don't have to. Let's find someone who's more resolution oriented and less, hey, let's fight. While we figure this out, I know it's going to cost you a little, but we're going to go and get that. We're going to go get that. And she's going to try to go get that. And so all of both your money is gone. Okay. So we try to stay aligned with legal advisors that we can introduce, you know, two or three that are more results. Like, um, promoting more of a, you go find Yeah. So my lighthouse resolution. Yes. Pretty much in the, in the depth of what's going on when, when people are getting divorced and kids and stuff. So, but I know your piece, cause we always have like financial advisors or someone in there that's expert in that. Cause obviously You can open the accounts and move the money after the decisions are made but by and large it's like okay I'm here. Here's about what's going to happen. Let the legal advisors tell you what's actually going to happen, make your decisions. And I'm here. And our job is really to sit and And we do a lot. And again, with family mediation and just family systems. And I work with a lot of people going through divorces. And of course, I love what you said, because first thing I told him, I go, listen, there's no place for emotions in a court of law. I said, I'm just telling you, I said, get it out here. Talk about it here. But I'm also very much like you, like, basically, I just kind of give them that thing. Listen, not attorney, but I play one on TV, but I really don't, but I mean, same thing, but this is what pretty much what you're looking at, you know, and the rest of it, though, is, you know, again, don't. you Don't do, you know, I'm just kind of like this kind of lock it down and let's focus But like, I'm not afraid to have a hard conversation with them either. And I, and I think that that, you know, listen, Jeremy's not either. I, that's what I'm saying. I love that because, because I tell him, I don't have a dog in a race. I go, I'm here for you. But, and I think that's where the educating, this is what it is, you know? And so let's just kind of, you know, and I think sometimes even though they don't want to hear it, You know, later on, But I think that can also alleviate a lot of mental stress, Well, you can also tell them, listen, 90% of the time you both get Oh my gosh, I can't. Hey, it's a good way to look at it. It's like an A-minus, Well, I mean, I can only imagine, you know, I know that we have seen a lot and we have patients who are struggling a lot with different things. But like, let's say in cases where they're struggling with divorce or just finances in general, like, you know, let's say someone's like heavily in debt or doesn't know what to do or their business is like starting to go sideways. You know, how are you able to like maintain your own composure? Because I know sometimes like we have to do like poker face sometimes like when they say something even though internally we're We hit it every time. We're like, this title is about the So this is interesting, right? So for one, most of the time when we're meeting with people, the things they think are problems aren't nearly as bad as they think they are. Most people that we have found that have businesses or financial life that are anywhere between a business that's doing a couple hundred thousand dollars a year up to even 10, 15, $20 million a year got there by working real hard. But there were so many things about the financial picture that they just didn't know. You come in here with the spreadsheet, you come see us with, you bring your CFO, you bring your, they usually don't have one, but they bring their other financial advisor that's probably going to get replaced soon. It happens all the time. All the time. And they lay their stuff on the table and say, listen, We'll get through it where we scramble, right? We're scramblers, like in golf. I can get up out of the woods, I can get on the green, I can get in for par, right? And we look and we say, fantastic, congratulations. I know you took the drive to come down and see us. And I look under what they have. Because they start off with the initial feeling, well, I'm willing to have the conversation because I'm hurting and I'm struggling. The stuff they're concerned about probably isn't where the problem is. And then they flip back the other way to tell you how well they've got it under control because now they're feeling they're out. And they're still wrong. And we do not assume that the person that got to this level of wealth knows the Literally, I'm like, listen, that's what I'm saying. You're I'm going to buy another sandwich. And that's what I'm saying. Basically, you got to meet them where they are, but also because you know where they like, and that's the thing. They, they, they definitely go into that maladapt like, no, no, no, I'm good. I'm good. And you start seeing the fence, you start doing all this stuff. Yeah, but you're going to look under there because it's under there. It might be smelling Well, and some of it, the positive of that is that I call it lifting your chin up because part of it is, wait a minute. I want to be, where do you want to be? We talked about this a little yesterday. Where do you want to be? And you start with the end in mind. A goal is the end to which all effort is applied. And in businesses, most of them don't have that goal. Well, bigger, bigger, bigger, bigger. Well, what's the number? Because most people have no target for their business and they're hitting it with amazing accuracy. Whether it's $50 million or a million dollars, or they're just trying to get out of their own way and get going. And the fact is that we can say, wow, you're doing these things really, really well. And you're taking these steps really, really well. So first of all, let's give yourself credit. Emotionally, we've watched many of our most successful clients or business owners pay themselves $40,000, $50,000, $60,000 a year, while their businesses make it $5 million. And I said, you know, not for nothing, but you just hired that person, that person, that person, that person, and that person. And they're going to take all that money home. They don't hire their future, which is making a commitment to put money away that they get back later in different types of ways to mitigate taxes, retirement plans, and things like that. They don't pay themselves. By the way, the value of your business comes from paying yourself and showing someone else that if they ran your business, they too could get paid. So we hit them in the chin and say, look up and look around. You're not where you started. You're where you are. Now let's set the bar higher. Because if you're not growing emotionally, spiritually, family, business, financially, physically, mentally, you're dying, okay? But let's set that bar higher and let's understand how you got to where you are. Was it just hustle? Did you learn a few of these things along the way or just go to your trade, right? So that's an emotional release. I've had people go from 50,000 to 250,000 in like two or three months. I know, I need that. So you guys realize- Hold on, I need another dollar, because I'm paying for that session too. No, no, this is, he just told me why I have a turkey neck, because he's hit me so many times underneath my chin, because I'm always, he's always hit me, you know, what I'm doing wrong, but- Well, it's actually more of a reminder of the things that you're doing right, and an acknowledgement. Look at that. Yes. Look at that. No, seriously. I know, see, he's hit me again. No, no, me too. That's right, that's right. Now I will tell you as a, because I've met you before and it was funny because I will say, you know, grew up, you know, we were very, very poor and then single mama, you know, all the things. So money's always been a, I think we talked a little bit and I was like, money was always something that kind of scares me because I've never had it. I don't understand it. I don't, I mean, I just right here, but I mean, I, as somebody who that is not one of their strong and had had to learn it literally You know, I will tell you that I appreciate that you explain it If that makes sense. And I think, too, the way you explain it, and I think our listeners will appreciate it, is that it doesn't matter where you are or what you do, you know how to verbalize how money can be important. It's important to all of us. We all need it to survive. We have to have it. And I know one thing with us, in our field, is being in mental health, nobody gets into mental health because they want to be billionaires, because we just know that's not our field, right? And I think that that's why Robin has had issues. I know me too. It scares us a little bit because it's almost like we have a very humbling job and position. And I know the way you've verbalized finances for me and growing the business, it's like you make it in a way to where I know that I'm doing it all for the right reasons. This is helping other people. So if I grow my business, I'm in turn helping other people. I'm employing other people, giving other people the opportunity to do what they love too. So So let me do a little something with the three of you. I want you to close your eyes for a minute. I know it's a small room, but I haven't done anything inappropriate yet. and I want you to tell me what you see in your future. And you know, you're sitting across from, so let's pretend this is your meeting with your, you know, at Skype with your financial expert. And tell me what you see in the future. Just Oh, I see. My name, Bella Mental Health, being in multiple places and other therapists and other prescribers feeling outside the business, I mean my family, obviously, everyone not stressing about money because like Robin, I grew up stressing about money with my family, so So you see people involved in your life, you What do you see Robin, in your future? No matter what you say, it doesn't matter. It doesn't have to be related to me or any of this direct conversation. What does the future look like when it's the It's just funny because my client, one of my clients this week, and I, we talked about this, which is so crazy. I said that, um, I think as a, as a little kid, I always had like this weird idea that Like I was, like my purpose was big. And I think the platform that we are working so hard on right now is setting the foundation through Bella, you know, and Nella and, you know, her, just the people that we're meeting. And, you know, TJ and I, we're definitely like sisters from a whole other, I don't even know where, but I just think that there has to be a shift and I'm not afraid to be in that shift. but creating more of like a holistic, um, My kids, um, my boys, you know, all three of them has faced so much in their young lives and, uh, see How are they doing? Great. Okay. TJ, what do you see? What does your future look like? Where are you Definitely family, because I'm a family girl. I see, you know, financial wealth and security for Right, excitement. It's joy. I'll say it's better than happiness. Just being, you know, joyous. You know, just not just climbing the, you know, the money ladder, but just being joyous. I see joy. And the people that I care about and just helping others like pull others up because I'll just say this. I didn't come from money either. Um, you know, and money's always been like an issue. Like, you know, I start savings and then something happens. You got it. So I, I just see So, so let's, so let's all open our eyes. I peaked a couple of times to see the deep thinking basis that I know Nella was I got serious. Cause I saw myself like, I saw like, I'm like, like, you know, like almost like a car, but like driving through like scenes of my life in the future. So I So that is hard for me. So here's the thing. We're in an office talking about finance and like. mental health, but no one here said a bag of money is what they pictured. And what I wanted to highlight is whether you are a child or a kid just getting out of high school, whose value comes very much from the people around them. And there was a gentleman when I was teaching at Vieira, I teach the seniors most years. I don't think I, I got invited. I think, I guess I missed out this year somehow by timing. As they get ready to graduate, when I asked a room full of kids, I had six classes throughout the day, I said, where do you get your value from? And he said, he stood up, big kid, he said, from everyone in this room. And what I did was I looked at the, I was the financial teacher, but you only have an hour with each group. And I said, You guys were valuable before you got to school, before you were even born. You were valuable along the way, before you played piano, before you took your first jog, before you hopped in the pool and swam, before you were scared, before you asked permission to go in the other room by yourself, before you even had a grin on your face. And I just wanted you to know that before you achieve at whatever it is or struggle or have failures along the way, you're already immensely valuable now. So, the reason why I share that in a financial conversation is because the things that people picture in their lives are tied to peace, they're tied to relationships, they're tied to inherent value without specific performance. One of the, one of my favorite quotes, and I think, I don't know if it was from somebody else. I know Blaine Dyer often quoted a lot of other people, but it's, if you are what you do, then when you don't, you aren't. And I wanted to tell all these kids, if you are what you do, and when you don't, you aren't. And I think that's where everybody starts and they don't have to. So I gave these kids permission to be complete. When you close your eyes and you pictured your future, you realize when we talk about it, that money is not the goal. It's a medium of exchange for free time, for food, for a place to live. for the ability to, to do the things that we want to do with the people we care about the most at the times that we see the most fit to do them. That's what it is. And so when someone is just driving for money and more and more and more, and then they get it, then they jump off the roof because what they realized is they were so focused on the money when they got it. And they're sitting there with their legs swinging like Scrooge McDuck. And it wasn't enough, but most of us do learn along the way. It took me a very long time to learn that the value When I'm a child, when I'm in the midst of my career and my young life, and I move into middle age, and as I get older, the value is something far greater. And when you recognize that the value is already there, then now we're free to start to consider the behaviors that keep our rudder in the water during our careers, that strengthen our relationships while we're working and saving, and that we're building something Yeah. This question actually goes with what you, with the piece you just did. How do you help clients who feel like their financial struggles define their work for success? Ooh, that's a good one. Kind of It's interesting because that kind of people wear it on their sleeve when that's the case. So that ties to something that you had talked to me about a little earlier, which is a little bit of a different wording of the same question, which is, you know, that feeling of disappointment. And then when we're insecure about something, we wear it on our sleeve. Hey, I just want to let you know, doc, that I get white coat. So if you're going to take my blood pressure, it's going to go up, right? And then whenever it happens, your blood pressure goes up. See? Right? And then you kind of wonder, like, if we stop believing it, we stop saying it to ourselves, we stop saying it to everybody else. There are some wonderful people I work for who look around at the struggles people are having around them to make their current struggles acceptable. I am struggling right now in this way because that's what people do at this point in life, and that's just what it is. And so therefore, I'm one of the good people that's also struggling. When your self-talk, when your worldview is designed to justify your own failure, you'll I know, we need more money. She just gave you money. So what we'll teach is, And it's not, you know, weirdo, weirdy manifesting because it's like in the secret, have the person who looks at the necklace and then is wearing the necklace. It's not that one dimensional, is it? Have you ever noticed the person that you offer the opportunity to? I mean, we influence and connect with a lot of people. I literally said to somebody once, if you bring your small insurance company and your clients to my mortgage company that I owned years ago, I'll be able to bring you about $100,000 in commissionable business in the next year. I like you a lot. I'll give you all of it. What did the first thing in their head, what would it say if it were me? I would say, perfect. I like you. I trust you. I believe you. And I want to make sure I don't miss out on that opportunity. A hundred grand. Wow. And I can help all your clients. Like that's a great mix. But the phone never rang because someone offering you the opportunity, it's outside of your familiarity with like that, that could happen. Isn't going to, he never called and I called him back. Did you Right? So with somebody I was talking to yesterday, he said, well, we waited weeks. You need time when you're in survivor mode to absorb and recognize where you are. No matter how good your therapist is or no matter how many things you know, because of the stories you could tell and the people you've already helped, I'm not going to learn until I'm ready. And I need time to look in the mirror. before I'm gonna learn and absorb and And how many times, I'm just sorry, that we say that to our clients. You gotta stop, pause, and look in the mirror before you can do So in our industry, we say needs-based sale, needs to get paid, right? That doesn't inform, that doesn't give a client an opportunity, a person, the chance to understand and then to be empowered to make a decision on their own behalf. So that intersection where a salesperson goes, want to do the thing? Next person who talks loses, right? That's what everyone was taught. They still get taught that today. But we say, tell you what, we don't have that intersection. We're going to come around a different way. If we've heard you, if we've understood. And sometimes the sale is the understanding of who you are, where you are, how you should think about things in a healthy way. You have to come to that realization. If I can't do it, I can ask your permission to advocate for you. Can I advocate for you? I have an associate at my office, Gregory, who's really good at framing that. We're going to turn that teaching about two degrees this way, if it's okay with you. I had a client that did not want to put insurance on himself because his family was going to be fine. And one of the first things that he said to me is, the main thing I want to do is make sure my family's okay if I'm not here. So these things didn't line up. Everything was ready. He said, you know what? This is just not something I'm going to do right now. And I said, that is okay. And it's been a month and a half. And we had a call yesterday after a very short impromptu call a couple of weeks ago. I said, you didn't hire me to tell you what you wanted to hear. You hired me to tell you the things that you didn't know yet and give you the opportunity to know them a different way. He said, that's true. I said, so at the risk of the boundaries of our relationship, I'm going to ask you permission to advocate for you in our next call. And this is what I said, with the money you have saved, your family is going to get about$8,000 a year for the rest of their lives if you're not here. And your business is going to, your employees and your customers are going to scatter if you're gone, which means that business is worth nothing. It would seem to me like it would be appropriate to allocate some small portion of your current and expected ongoing financial success in your business to buy a pile of an insurance company's money in the event that you don't come home. And then we sat quietly for what Greg said was about 10 or 15 seconds when he started to tell me the story of how he was brought up. And what abundance meant to them, which meant just food to eat and a roof over their head. And how he just didn't seem like, but then in that time that he had been given, he met a couple of people. It's your reticular activator, right? You buy the car, everyone has the car. He says, well, I met a couple of people who had a similar conversation with other people and they're 10, 15 years ago. And now they're living in the results of some of the decisions they made. And it's so interesting. It lines right up with what you told us we ought to do. They just weren't ready. So when someone called me, this is the funny story I was going to tell you about earlier. It's funny because the client came out of the woodwork after nine years and said, I told the other guy that I was working with on these other things in my life and in my business that I have a good friend who's taken great care of us over the years. Talk about perception. And so here I am talking to you because he wanted to make some changes. I haven't talked to you in nine years, but I'm a guy, right? So that was his memory of the care we had provided him, but his wife, got on the phone with me for the very first time nine years ago. And she knew the purpose of the call was to discuss finances. And she said, you're going to get mad at me. I'm like, not until I learned how to pronounce her name. I didn't know her. She was leading with her insecurities about her finances. I said, honestly, the things you think are bad are probably far better than you think. And the things you think you're doing great, you're probably screwing them up. Let's figure it out, right? So I love that. Like all I do, I literally deconstructed everything that you were saying because... every little piece that you said like that you have to deal with in the financial aspect of people's lives, they also need to channel that same thing in other areas of their life. It's like it really does all correlate, Nella and I started having conversations a couple months ago about But there's 3 main areas that we recognize where there's a really clear intersection between finances and mental health. That's when you're just getting going. That's when you can plant the seed and teach the young people that your finances, like, you don't have to be a multi gazillionaire by the time you're 20. which you can be, which you are valuable already. And there's that early life. And in the middle of the life, it's like, all right, cool. Like some things are starting to come in. Did I start some of the building blocks and the right thinking early? And now how am I doing? Here's the importance of checking in, having an ongoing relationship, not just an account. and some imaginary promise that you'll somehow have this wealth in the future that without some specific behaviors is never going to be there, right? Without some steps and some work and some proper thinking. That's the middle, what's going on with my career? Am I an entrepreneur? Do I own real estate? You know, am I kind of living in a simple career path where my priorities and my drive for a lifestyle is different than somebody else? but I'm looking for peace based on my own definition, right? And then you have this other season of life that says, oh boy, here's the things I was told early on, here's the steps I took, here's the things that went well, and here's where I might've fallen short. How am I doing? Right? So actually there's four. I'm getting closer to getting to the point where I want to live off of what I've built instead of what I'm making from exchanging my time for money, working, or running the business, which is a lot of the same thing. So now we've retired. So these are all little points where it's vital. It's not just a good idea, but it's vital to have a checkup. What's going on in the head, right? Cabeza, as the guy used to say, when I'm golfing, if I don't, I was in the Dominican Republic and every time I lifted my head on a golf shot, he said, Cabeza! Every time. What's going What's going on in your Cabeza? At all these levels, because that reset can keep the ship sailing toward where you want to go. And then here's the interesting one, and this is what we talked about, Nellen and I, was, now I've retired. And that just might mean you've got financial freedom. You've got peace because you did some things that went well, some things that didn't, but now you're living off of your social security. You're living off of maybe the sale of a business. You're living off of a part-time job. Maybe a spouse is involved, whatever's going on, right? And then you say, wait a minute, I used to spend anywhere from eight to 28 hours a day, I know that's not possible, you only get 168 a week, thinking about how was I selling a product? How was I providing a service? How was I working for somebody and doing the things I was doing? And now I'm in this new place in life where this entire definition of who I am that I thought for most of us was what I did. Am I what I do, right? And now how do you keep the rudder in the water after you retire? So there's this huge financial, this non-financial component to what is typically treated as just financial is that I'm going to move into another season of my life. How am I going to spend my time? How am I going to feel valuable and purposeful when I'm not spending somewhere between eight And 18 hours a day, for entrepreneurs and people that just never stop, 24 hours a day, thinking about the service that I'm providing with the product, the business that I'm running, there's a real gap there in the care that people are receiving. So we created a partnership between Sky Peak Financial and Bella Mental Health that we're pretty excited about. It's where we could do this thing, right? Where we can, our clients can be introduced and they've already seen people kind of in line to have some type of regular conversation and couple it with the thinking that's tied to not just, not really the financial decision, Right. And that's what I think, I, you know, when we, when we've been talking about this for several months, it's more of like, like I said, Even with today's topic, I mean, everything, I mean, we need money. It affects everybody. You gotta have it. We have to have it. So it's like, but like you said, like when people are getting into that zone of like retirement and they don't know what to do with themselves anymore. I mean, we see that with our military too. You know, a lot of veterans, when they spend 20, 30 years in the service, that was their identity. And then they retire They could have all the retirement, they could have their disability, they can live comfortably financially. But they don't know who they are. They don't know what to do with themselves anymore. And then they go into these They do. And so that happens, I know, with people that you have business with. Every time. Every single time that they run into all these struggles now, financially, with their family, personally. They don't know who they are anymore without their business or what they were doing their entire life. So now it ties in the piece, okay, that's where we come That's where we come in. We have to help them with their families. If they have divorce, if they have kids, what legacy they're trying to leave with their children, So they can have actionable steps to some extent, depending on the level of struggle, coping mechanisms. They can have real-life examples of people who said, oh great, my favorite is the story of the woman with the 20-year business plan at age 80. Like let it rip. There's a company out in California that teaches real estate lending and lenders how to build a business by referral. It's a very loving organization. I won't give it a specific endorsement for this particular conversation, but they were impactful on me. And the owner and chairman has become somewhat of a celebrity in the real estate industry, has been for many years. So you don't call the company and say, hey, let me talk to Brian. I mean you do and they say great we'd love to see you at a retreat. We'd love to send you a little bit of information on how to get a coach. We'd love to get you on a you know get you access to show you how to log into the podcast. So she calls this woman calls the business to talk to the owner Brian and says I want to talk to Brian and they hit her with all those little standard deflection right gatekeeper type stuff to help her and bring her in and she says listen I'm 80 years old. I'm a real estate professional and I have a 20 year business plan. I want to talk to Brian and I want to talk to him now. And she took the, he took the call, right? She probably could have called the white house and, and she sold real estate until she was like 97 years old. So it's not too late to do the thing that you want it to do. I mean, if it's Shaquille O'Neal and he wanted to be a jockey, it's probably not going to work out. You just picture him with his legs dragging on the ground. It's probably not going to work. The horse isn't going to like it. It's going to lose every race unless you're kind of like, it's diesel. Unless you're mid-stoning it with the feet at the same time. But from a practical standpoint, you can explore and accept challenges in this next season of life that are every bit as impactful, if not even more so, than Can I ask you a quick question, then? Because I think this kind of ties in. Because I mean, I'm hearing you, and I love listening. Oh, yeah, girl, we gon' chat. So excited. But anyway. Most of those people are not mental health people, age-wise, this is what I'm saying. You know, like generationally, if we go back to generation, how do we even get them to even have an idea of being able to ask for help? Especially like the, I hate to Stubborn. Okay, so who's their counselor now? Who said? at age 60 or age 55, how are you feeling about your finances? Who said to them, if we weren't talking today, what do you think you'd be doing next? When the market does that, how does that make you feel? Do you think there's a solution? How would you feel if tomorrow you were ready to start retirement and it happened to coincide with a year where the market was dropping that whole year? That And they start to learn and that foundational trust gets built. The definition of their stability gets clear. Hey, wait, that also pours over into success. And if they're really retiring, they probably have a stronger level of financial security, right? And in that conversation, because it's not just a good idea, you're like, I'm going to say this a lot, but it's vital is, you know, while we're doing this, you're going to have a whole lot of free time. Well, they've already said, yes, this is my name. Yes, this is my social security number. Yes, this is my date of birth. Yes, manage my money. By the way, let me introduce you to some very, very important partners of ours who have a program designed specifically for you because of how strong you are, how well you've done, and how valuable you are to the community that you live in, the people who love you. Would you be open to a conversation? Because I Yeah, that's empowering them. Right? Because that's Because I have this conversation and they're ready. And that's what I'm saying. Because I mean, we talked about was her and even like, that's all I keep thinking about is Even it goes back to our interview when I came to the company and she said, you know, who is like who? And I said, I know somewhere I'd love to work with men because I'm such an athlete and such as and I see these guys and especially these older men that are so. Lost. They don't know what they can do. They don't know how to do it. Of course, I work with kids my whole life. And I'm thinking, are you kidding me? Like these young mentor, big brother, big like anything. I'm thinking, always thinking about having a purpose for these generations who are fatherless and everything else. But it's like, I can't touch them. I can't get to them. That's when I was like, God, to a way to bridge that they're ready for that thank you thank you well and i think too is like you said earlier is that they have to be ready to they have to be ready to look in that mirror and say because like you said the stubborn like i know many successful you know either business owners or older men who are 5, 10 years from retiring and they don't have a plan in place. And I'm like, what are you doing? Oh, it's fine. It's fine. And I'm just like, oh my gosh. But they're not ready. And even if you bring it up, it's like, I got it. I got it. I got it. And it's like, we don't always got it. We have to I always say this in my little tagline, check yourself, is because we are not the end-all be-all of anything. Just like when you guys came to me like, oh, I opened my business. I may have done it. I kind of shot off the hip in the very beginning. I learned along the way. I made connections, mentors. Now you're teaching me about the financial and the business side of things. I mean, we have to be able to go to people that can help us and are experts in the field because we don't know everything and we have to be ready to say, Jeremy, I'm messing up. I'm messing up. Tell me what So here's the interesting challenge for you. Someone's given you guys permission. your team to discuss the most personal stuff in their life. And some of these people have great businesses. Some of them, most of them have wonderful families and they just are navigating these different challenges, right? So one of the key steps, and don't make it step eight out of eight, maybe it's step three or step five, okay? While you're solving some of the, helping them to solve and grow through some of these challenges and problems, There is a component called the finances. There's a component that's the family. There's a component that's the business or how you make your money, your career. There's the personal, physical, and mental health. And there's your connection to deeply held values and a clear sense of purpose, which is whatever your spiritual life is. Okay. That doesn't mean church for everybody. Sometimes it's sitting quietly in the woods or sometime where you stop and reflect on how do I serve the community that I'm part of and get outside of myself. But when you say it's not step eight out of eight, it's step three. You don't get to step four without it, at least having the conversation. We have a partner, right? Because sometimes the headache isn't coming from the head. Sometimes it's coming from somewhere else, right? And if you're unsure about this over here, you can frost that cake all day long, but I don't know where I come up with those. Sometimes they make sense. Sometimes I lay an egg and I step back and admire my little analogy. So you could do the same thing I can do, but remember, I say, fantastic. You are 90% of the way there because everything that you've been doing and all the wonderful financial things that you have, some of my, especially my wealthiest clients. You're like, you know, let me, let me give you some permission. Can I tell you a story? And I tell him a story. Let me tell you about a business owner that came to me that was in this position that had a negative net worth or did this and that, or the person who got to retirement and sold the business and had pictures of all the adventures and all the things he had done in his life. But in the absence of permission, in fact, even a step to take. to know what is next. When you are done kindergarten, it's time to sign up for first grade. When you're done first grade, it's time to sign up for second. When you sell your company and you physically don't feel as good to go up on the top of the mountain heliskiing or go stay in one of And it's at every level. Right? You get to that point where like, hey, I'm going to be okay. Like if we haven't had the financial conversation or the financial strength is there, but we haven't had the mental conversation or the healthy mental health, personal time, physical connection to things other than work and career and finances, then we're not done. So I can put up the tent, we can put up three poles, right? And we can anchor all three of them, but if we don't have the fourth one down with an anchor in it, it's going to blow away. And if you want it to be strong, you got to do what we got to do all four. Right. And I think otherwise it's I love this. I mean, I mean, I guess as a final thought, because we're wrapping up here, but I mean, I wish I had all that money in front of you. You got it. You got paid today. Look at Actually, I'm just gonna let you know it's Miss Tina's. And so Miss Tina, I promise you'll get it back. We tried to buy some of Oh, I love that. Let's do a WeVenture, Family Promise of Brevard. Two of my favorite places. But just I guess just to wrap it up one last question is if what would be your advice for anybody just kind of Knowing that they don't know where to go or what to do with their financial status right now, but they know that they need help in some way. What would be the I think that planning. the intellectual capital of planning, understanding the different phases of your money and the seasons of life and how who you are and how you feel. That's kind of this piece here and what you have and your creativity and how you build wealth and the logic that helps you do it. Finding that intersection is vital. We're probably not going to do it by ourselves. Right. And I'm not saying that it has to be our firm, but you've got to make a connection with somebody who is bringing a process. inviting for a relationship, willing to allow you to absorb and consider what that looks like, right? But that is capable if you have a business or, or a career of talking about the whole thing holistically, right? And then, and then having an ongoing relationship, right? The best coaches have coaches, So we can always do better. We got the things we know, the things we know we don't know. And then we've got this big giant category over here called the things we don't know we don't know. So I think my best answer to that is start asking questions, start looking around, maybe get an introduction to somebody that might be bringing more of a holistic view to it. There's not a whole lot of companies that do it. It is something that we do, but it took a long time to figure it out. We do have some capacity to meet more people, but I think that's it. Ask the questions, do some reading, watch some videos, listen to some podcasts, and make a connection with someone who specializes in helping you to navigate that. and start pivoting towards some type of a regular consideration for the relationship between what's important to you in your life and how your finances impact that, I love it. Great advice. Jeremy, yes, thank you. And one thing you said in there too is it doesn't matter what season, all the seasons of life, like you have to consider that. It doesn't matter if you're 20, or 50 or 80 like you're a person that you said. It's just we have to consider all seasons of life and everything that life is going to throw at us too because we never know. So, we always have to plan for You probably have more than you thought you did when you think you have a little and it's not about massive wealth. And it's not about other people's opinion. Oh, gosh. But I'm glad you said that. And I know we're wrapping up. I'm glad you said that, though, because, you know, I know people, been one of those people, probably still there, sometimes that think, OK, well, I have $5,000 in the bank or I have $10,000 in the bank. Is that enough to go and seek out a financial plan? You know, because sometimes people think, oh, that's not enough, you Here's the beauty of it. The driving force behind financial fruits is how you're thinking about it. and how it aligns. Your best definition of success comes from you. It's okay to see other people's success and maybe form your view of fruit. But it's like someone says like, Nella, you have to take this step with your finances because it's the right step. That's just features and benefits. I'm going to buy the TV with picture and picture. If it doesn't align with who you are and what's important to you at any level, then it's not good advice. So you have to be able to find the way to think about things properly. And then the steps you take with 5,000 or 50 million, becomes vivid, then you know what to do. And the next thing you say is not, you want to do the thing, it's, what's next? How do I grow from where I am? And until you acknowledge where you are, understand how to think about things properly, framed by who you are and what's important to you, and when you close your eyes and see, at that point, when you do that, the steps become obvious, no matter how That's the whole lesson. I mean, you had to protest the whole quiet I'm learning, too. Oh, yeah. I really am, so that's why I was like, overtaking it all in, but yeah, I'm I think I got unhinged. You're a little unhinged. I was