SELF | Deep Dives
Exploring how to develop our SELF through health, wealth, and connection.
SELF | Deep Dives
The Science of Getting Better | Ep. 06
Diving deep into the science of skill development and motor learning, we explore Nikolai Bernstein's revolutionary ideas about how humans actually improve at physical activities.
• Unlike machines that wear down with use, living organisms have "exercisability"—we get better through practice
• The vital force theory was wrong—improvement is specific to what you practice, not a general enhancement
• Skills aren't stored as fixed formulas but as dynamic problem-solving capabilities
• Sensory feedback is crucial—your brain constantly makes tiny adjustments based on what you feel and see
• Learning occurs in stages: figuring out the movement pattern, experiencing "aha" moments, automating processes
• "Creative pauses" (plateaus) are normal and necessary for reorganizing control systems
• Thinking too much about automated movements causes deautomation (the centipede's dilemma)
• True practice is "repetition without repetition"—constantly seeking improvement, not mindless repetition
• Building "dynamically stable" movements where physical forces assist rather than hinder performance
• Skill resilience comes from practicing in varied conditions to prevent breakdown under stress
Think about something you're learning right now. What stage are you in? How could understanding these principles change your approach to practice?
Have you ever like really wanted to get how something works? You know something you do all the time, but like never really thought about the how of it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1:So that's what we're looking at today, like how do we actually get better at things? We got some really interesting stuff from a listener, some excerpts from Nikolai Bernstein.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, bernstein, he really goes deep on this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he does. And it gets to to this question we all think about how do we improve, how do we get better at the things we do?
Speaker 2:Exactly, and it's not just like oh, practice, practice, practice and you're golden right.
Speaker 1:Right, there's more to it.
Speaker 2:So much more. Yeah, what we're going to do in this deep dive is really dig into Bernstein's ideas on how we learn and develop motor skills. We're talking about. You know everything from the brain to like the actual movements themselves to well what it means to be truly skilled. So, like the science of dexterity, Exactly the nitty gritty of how we get good at things, and Bernstein starts off with this like really basic observation this contrast between how inanimate objects work and how living things work, you know.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, Like a machine versus I don't know an animal.
Speaker 2:Right A machine like the more you use it, the more it wears down. You get parts breaking and all that. But living organisms, they've got this thing Bernstein calls exercisability. The more we use our bodies, you know, in certain ways, the better we tend to get at those things.
Speaker 1:Exercise ability OK. So like I'm getting better at playing guitar, the more I practice, I'm exercising that skill.
Speaker 2:Exactly. You're not just wearing down your fingers, you're getting better.
Speaker 1:Right, but like how did people way back when explain this whole getting better thing?
Speaker 2:So initially it was all about this like vital force, you know this mysterious energy that living things have. They thought it would like fight the wear and tear, even make the parts being used stronger.
Speaker 1:Like a natural upgrade system or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like some kind of built-in mechanic.
Speaker 1:Powered by magic, basically.
Speaker 2:Basically, and there was some like surface level stuff that seemed to back it up. You know, you get calluses, muscles get bigger. But then Bernstein's like hold on, there are some holes in this vital force idea.
Speaker 1:Because if it was just making everything better, then if you trained really hard at like one specific thing, shouldn't you see improvements everywhere?
Speaker 2:Exactly Like if you're a discus thrower you get amazing at throwing that discus. Maybe you even get a little better at, say, throwing a javelin. But that training doesn't magically make you a master woodcutter.
Speaker 1:Right, no sudden carpentry skills just because you're good at discus.
Speaker 2:Nope, same muscles, same joints, but the improvement is super specific. So that kind of poked holes in the whole vital force thing. What we see is improvement is tied to what you're actually doing.
Speaker 1:Makes sense. So this vital force thing, it wasn't just wrong, it actually led to some bad stuff, right?
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, for sure they thought kids had the most of this vital force, so they pushed them way too hard, you know, in training and stuff like to the point of causing real harm. And there was this idea you could like surgically change muscles and ligaments to be better, which was, yeah, not good, especially for musicians.
Speaker 1:Wow. So how did we get to a better understanding of all this?
Speaker 2:Well, the big shift happened in the 1800s with neurophysiology. That's when scientists really started to see how important the brain is for movement, and this is key motor memory.
Speaker 1:OK, so it's not just about muscles getting bigger, it's changes in the brain.
Speaker 2:Right, it's like you practice something and that actually changes the wiring in your brain. So skills aren't just, you know, stamped on your arm or leg, they're stored up in your brain.
Speaker 1:So the brain is like the hard drive. Exactly so then how do the skills get onto the hard drive, and that's where we get to the whole conditioned reflex idea, right, you got it.
Speaker 2:Pavlov and his dogs remember.
Speaker 1:Ring the bell. Dog drools even without the food. Classic.
Speaker 2:It was a huge discovery understanding how we learn and it seemed like, okay, maybe that's how skills work too. You practice a movement, you're strengthening that neural pathway, like carving a groove.
Speaker 1:I can see how that seems to fit.
Speaker 2:It's a nice idea, but Bernstein's like hang on this analogy. It's not perfect. In fact, it's got some big problems when we're talking about complex human skills.
Speaker 1:OK, so where does the dog and bell thing break down when we talk about us?
Speaker 2:For starters, the way we learn is totally different. We're actively trying to figure things out, Like think about a kid learning to catch a ball. They're watching it, moving their hands and bodies, problem solving. It's not passive, Right. It's not like they just hold their hands out and wait, Exactly. And those dogs? They were usually restrained, they're just receiving the stimuli and not actively engaging with it. And then there's the speed of learning. Conditioned reflexes like in a lab take a long time and lots of repetition, but in real life we often learn stuff, especially important stuff, way faster.
Speaker 1:Like touch a hot stove once.
Speaker 2:Boom, you learn real quick not to do that again.
Speaker 1:So this slow bell ringing thing isn't quite how we learn skills.
Speaker 2:Nope, and this wrong analogy led to some bad ideas about learning. Like that, you just got to repeat, repeat, repeat without really thinking about it. But anyone who's tried to learn something knows that mindless repetition doesn't work very well.
Speaker 1:So what's Bernstein's big point here?
Speaker 2:He's saying, developing motor skills is not just about, you know, carving out these neural pathways. It's dynamic. We're adapting, problem solving, getting feedback and using it. We're building solutions.
Speaker 1:That brings us to like where did this whole getting better thing come from? Right, the evolutionary side of it.
Speaker 2:Right Bernstein says exercise ability. This ability to improve is pretty recent in the history of life. It goes hand in hand with the evolution of the cortex, the outer layer of the brain. As things got more complex, being able to solve new problems like movement problems was a big advantage.
Speaker 1:So simple organisms don't really have this ability to improve.
Speaker 2:Not really. He gives examples of like jellyfish snails. You can't train those guys to do anything fancy. Even insects, as diverse as they are, don't show much learning.
Speaker 1:So they're kind of stuck with what they've got.
Speaker 2:Pretty much. They don't have the brain power for real exercise ability.
Speaker 1:So, as things evolved, they got better at getting better.
Speaker 2:Exactly you see it with vertebrates like fish and amphibians. They can learn basic reflexes, but it's slow. Reptiles, similar deal Birds. They start to show more potential, they've got good memories, they can mimic, and then you get to birds like falcons and they can learn some pretty complex skills.
Speaker 1:And he talks about how the Russian word for dexterity love cost. It's linked to lavshi, which means hunting or like a hunting bird.
Speaker 2:It's really cool, shows how important these skills were even way back then.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but even those super skilled birds, they've got limits, right.
Speaker 2:They do. They're great at learning gradually and repeating things, but they struggle with like improvising or doing something totally new.
Speaker 1:So that's where mammals come in.
Speaker 2:Exactly Bigger brains, more adaptable and primates top of the class.
Speaker 1:So the more developed the brain, the better you are at learning and adapting.
Speaker 2:Right. So exercisability is like as old as the early cortex.
Speaker 1:And dexterity is even newer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, bernstein calls it the younger sister. Dexterity is being able to solve new movement challenges, quickly coming up with new patterns. It needs an even more developed brain.
Speaker 1:And he gives the example of the grasshopper. It's fast but not dexterous.
Speaker 2:Totally. It's zipping around but not really in control. So quickness isn't the same as dexterity.
Speaker 1:But we humans, even though some of our movement systems are like evolutionarily old, we still benefit from this whole exercise ability thing, right?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Even those older systems. They're still influenced by the cortex. It's like our cortex is the boss making sure everything works together and gets better.
Speaker 1:So if a skill isn't just like a program in the brain, how does Bernstein define it?
Speaker 2:He says it's not some fixed motor formula or a cliche stored up there. Our bodies have so many ways to move. Think about it All our joints, muscles. A single command from the brain couldn't possibly cover all that.
Speaker 1:Right, like reaching for something isn't just one command.
Speaker 2:Nope, your brain's constantly getting feedback, making tiny adjustments, even if it looks like you're doing the same movement. There are tons of little changes happening.
Speaker 1:So sensory feedback is super important.
Speaker 2:It's everything your brain uses sight, touch and proprioception. That's your sense of where your body is in space.
Speaker 1:It's like your internal GPS.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you're not just memorizing a pattern, you're learning to solve a motor problem.
Speaker 1:Your brain's figuring out how to deal with all the variations and hiccups that happen, and that's why practice is important, not to just make the groove deeper, but to give your brain all that feedback.
Speaker 2:Exactly. It's like building a vocabulary of sensory information. The more your brain experiences, the better it gets at making adjustments.
Speaker 1:Okay, that makes sense. So learning a new skill, it's not just this smooth straight line, right?
Speaker 2:It's more like Stages.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like building a house.
Speaker 2:Perfect analogy. Bernstein talks about different staves in skill development. First you've got to figure out the leading level. That's the main system that's in control of the movement.
Speaker 1:Okay, and then there's motor composition, which is like the overall plan, right, right.
Speaker 2:Like the technique in a sport or the order of actions you need to do. And figuring that out can be tough right, Especially if you're learning on your own Totally Like. Imagine trying to figure out how to build a fire from scratch with no instructions. You'd have to invent your own motor composition.
Speaker 1:It's a lot of challenge.
Speaker 2:But even if you have a teacher or a demo, you still need to tweak things to fit your own body. And then you got to start actually doing the skill right.
Speaker 1:And that's where it gets real.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You see someone do it perfectly and you think easy. But then you try yourself and it's a mess.
Speaker 2:Totally. You suddenly realize you have no idea what corrections you need to make or how to even make them.
Speaker 1:It's that feeling of wait. How did they do that?
Speaker 2:Exactly. So you've got to start experimenting, getting a feel for the movement. Bernstein calls it, quoting another professor here playing the skill around, trying different things, seeing how your body responds, Like when you're learning to ride a bike. You're figuring out the pedals, the handlebars, how to balance, and sometimes your brain tries to cheat at first using what Bernstein calls surrogate corrections, like relying way too much on what you see instead of using your internal sense of balance.
Speaker 1:So look, when you first start riding a bike, you're staring at the ground trying to stay upright.
Speaker 2:Exactly. But then you get that aha moment, when you finally feel the balance. Your brain starts using those genuine automatisms, those automatic adjustments.
Speaker 1:That's the best feeling, and once you've figured out the corrections, you've got to assign them right.
Speaker 2:You got it. You're giving those specific tasks to the right systems in your brain. That's where automation comes in. You're freeing up your conscious mind to focus on the big picture.
Speaker 1:So automation isn't just like slowly fading away, it's more like a handover.
Speaker 2:Totally.
Speaker 1:That's so cool. And those automatic corrections, they might need some work too, right.
Speaker 2:Definitely they're not always just sitting there ready to go. Think about like a runner learning to do a long jump. They know how to run, but they got to fine tune that running to work for the jump.
Speaker 1:Right or like a pianist, those crazy finger movements that's years of training, those automatic responses.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:And sometimes skills can transfer right Like learning one thing helps you with another.
Speaker 2:Definitely, Although we don't fully understand how it works. But it's probably not just because the movements look similar. It's more about the types of corrections needed being similar.
Speaker 1:So, like skating and cycling, they both need you to balance, so the same corrections come in handy.
Speaker 2:Right, but sometimes what you already know can mess you up.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, like if you try to steer a rowboat like you're driving a car.
Speaker 2:Exactly, unlearning those old habits can take time, but once you've got those background corrections working, they need to play nice right.
Speaker 1:Harmony of background corrections yeah.
Speaker 2:You got it. All those automatic things need to work together through the same muscles and joints. Sounds like an orchestra.
Speaker 1:things need to work together through the same muscles and joints Sounds like an orchestra.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and you know how. Sometimes, when you're learning something, you hit a wall. You feel like you're not getting better, maybe even worse.
Speaker 1:Oh, those are the worst.
Speaker 2:They are. But Bernstein says those are sometimes creative pauses. Your brain's figuring things out, but if you push too hard you end up with smudging.
Speaker 1:Smudging.
Speaker 2:Like neither correction works right, you end up with a lower quality skill.
Speaker 1:That's frustrating. So then we get to standardization, where you're trying to do the same thing perfectly over and over. But earlier we said, variation is important.
Speaker 2:It does seem like a contradiction, but there are reasons for it. For things like walking or running, it's about finding those dynamically stable patterns.
Speaker 1:Dynamically stable.
Speaker 2:It's like the forces from your movement actually help you. They don't get in the way Like a ball rolling smoothly downhill. It's more efficient and easier to repeat.
Speaker 1:So it's physics working for you, and that's why you see certain styles in sports that just work better.
Speaker 2:Right, and for movements that need to be super accurate, like a surgeon's hands, standardization is key.
Speaker 1:You got to be able to do the basics consistently before you can be really precise. And finally, there's stabilization. This is about making your skill, you know, bomb-proof.
Speaker 2:You got it. You can have two people who seem equally skilled, but then throw a curveball at them bad lighting, uneven ground, whatever, and one falls apart while the other keeps going.
Speaker 1:So it's like stress, testing your skills.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and the big danger here is deautomation. That's when you lose that automatic control, and it can happen because of, like fatigue, getting sick, distractions or even just changes in the task itself. So you need to build that resilience by practicing in different situations. Right, it's like that mower in Anna Karenina One guy, tit, could handle anything, but the other guy, levin, struggled when things got tough.
Speaker 1:Tit had experience, he'd seen it all.
Speaker 2:And Bernstein warns about overthinking things Like once something's automatic, don't try to control it consciously, it'll just mess you up. He uses the example of the toad and the centipede. The centipede's walking along, no problem. Then the toad asks hey, how do you move all those legs? And suddenly the centipede can't walk anymore.
Speaker 1:I've totally had that happen Like. I'm playing guitar, not thinking about it, and then I think wait, how am I doing this? And I mess up.
Speaker 2:Exactly. Your conscious mind needs to stay focused on the goal, not the individual movements. And finally, Bernstein comes back to exercise. He says true practice is repetition without repetition.
Speaker 1:Okay, what does that mean?
Speaker 2:It means you're not just mindlessly repeating the same thing. You're constantly looking for ways to improve, refine and adapt. You're building the skill, not just copying it.
Speaker 1:So it's like every repetition is a chance to make it better exactly, so we've learned a lot today.
Speaker 2:It's not just about practice. It's about how our brains build skills, use feedback, automate things and deal with challenges and we've had some what were they? Uh-huh moments totally like the idea that the forces from your movement can actually help you, that automation happens in jumps and that thinking too much can be a bad thing.
Speaker 1:So, for our listeners out there, think about something you're learning. How do these ideas change? How you think about your practice. What stage are you in? What challenges are you facing? Use this new perspective to understand your own learning journey. Thanks for joining us.