Where Did We Go Wrong? | Are Women Better Off Without Men? | Episode 9

🔥 HEATED DEBATE: Are Women REALLY Happier Without Men & Kids?

 A YaleGlobal study asks: Should Women Stay Single?—suggesting single, child-free women are healthier and happier than their married counterparts (Read the study here). Angie breaks down the findings, but Vlad pushes back—calling out bias and defending men who try their best in relationships doomed from the start.

This episode gets spicy as they unpack marriage, fulfillment, and how cultural expectations shape modern love. Expect laughs, sharp insights, and some serious “did they just say that?” moments.

🎧 Listen now and tell us — is marriage still worth it for women, or is the single life the real winner?

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Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00)
What's up everybody? Yes, welcome to another episode of the Roots & Rhythm podcast where we explore the rhythms of life one story at a time. It's your boy Vlad the Bull, your number one embrace coach and I am joined by my lovely co-host, the one and only, Ly Cyber Mami is in the building, the bull's in the building. Sis, as always, we always check in and ask what is going on, so what's new with you?

Speaker 2 (00:13)
Angie, la Cyber Mami.

What's new with me? It's the last week of summer camp. We got three more weeks with the baby girl at home. And then she starts kindergarten in September.

Speaker 1 (00:27)
Okay?

baby girl when you said baby girl baby girl. All my 90 Day Fiance fans out there reminded me of Usman.

Speaker 2 (00:37)
Go.

⁓ I don't think I'm there yet. I'm trying to watch 98 fiance, 90 day fiance as time allows, but I'm like way behind and you're like all caught up. You've watched all the remakes, the spinoffs, all the

Speaker 1 (00:56)
My Drew, we've been watching it though for like, in real time for like years. Julie was actually watching it before she met me, which I'm like, didn't think it went back that far. But there's this guy named Ousmane on there. And if you are not a Dayfam, make sure you put that in the comments. But before you do anything, what do we like doing? Subscribe. Subscribe to the YouTube

Speaker 2 (00:57)
In real time.

to our YouTube channel. Good

job, Vlad.

Speaker 1 (01:16)
You're

to find the YouTube right there. Subscribe. Make sure you like comment and subscribe. Share with a friend. Share with a friend. Share with your communities because we want to make sure this content gets to more people. Yes. But yeah, baby girl, baby girl. So Usman, everybody he dates, he has an appetite for older white women and he always calls everybody baby girl. So the other day on the show, they asked him to do a song on the spot. It's like a dating show for singles. And he was like, I love you. I love you. I love you.

I love you my baby girl Lisa or whatever it was. I love you my baby Cassidy. Where is he from? He's from, I think he's from Nigeria. Okay. And it was just the funniest thing because everybody's a baby girl. There's a baby girl Lisa, there's a baby girl Kimbali. It's when you get that Kimbali, it's Kimberly. It's the African Kimbali. Sometimes I find myself just saying it because the semblance is in my, it just feels good.

Speaker 2 (02:03)
Is that Kimberly?

Speaker 1 (02:12)
I also want to give a shout out to the one and only, the one iota, Mr. Wal Tom. You can't see him, but he's in the green room. That's her man's. We call him Mr. Ball in the house himself. Yes, sir, yes, sir. Is in the building. Shout out to you, Wallace. What up, dude? Yeah, yeah. So I can't wait to dive into this topic today. This is going to be controversial and it's going to be kingdom building.

Speaker 2 (02:19)
That's my man. He's here, my man.

Yes, and so the reason we came up with this is I randomly saw a video, you know how it just pops up, but pretty much it was like this woman, she just turned 100 years old and they asked her what is like the secret to living that long and she pretty much just said never get married, never have kids and I was like, ooh wee, Vladimir. Yikes!

Speaker 1 (03:00)
Yikes

Speaker 2 (03:02)
Am

I going down to an early grave because I made these life choices? So yeah, so let's talk about it, Vlad. And we did find some research. Yale put out a whole study and Vlad's going to dive into some research.

Speaker 1 (03:16)
Yeah, let's let's let's dive into it because this is when the reason why we decided to make an episode about this Was because once Angie said this to me I was like that is a hundred percent bullshit But if there's science behind it, I need I feel like we need to explore

Speaker 2 (03:30)
And

it made sense to me, and again, I'm pro marriage, like I'm pro having someone to share your life with, but the research was kinda like, ooh, if I didn't love Wallace, maybe.

Speaker 1 (03:44)
So let's break this down, okay? So this is a study right out of Yale, Yale University. it's, title of the study is Why or Should Women Stay Single? Now check out these stats, right? A number of studies report that single women tend to be healthier and less depressed, living longer than married women. Single women generally experience fewer stresses and compromises than married women. Furthermore, single women feel more empowered, enjoying greater,

personal autonomy and freedoms than married women largely because they don't juggle the challenging multiple roles of work and home. Which, I'm like, time out. Unless you live at work and you live at home because work is home and home is life, whether you're single or not, you're going to have to juggle home

Speaker 2 (04:31)
Yeah, but it's not the same Vlad. Okay, it's not the same. Because again, this is partly what women do, right? There's like this societal and things that we do to ourselves. Like we have to perform. We have to be working mothers that are still like number one mom at home. We have to be employees that act... Well, what's the saying? You have to act like you don't have a job and you have to act like you're not a mom at work.

because you're trying to do too much. But that's what's expected. Why? No idea.

Speaker 1 (05:04)
Now, let me ask you this. Do you feel like that's a woman problem? Specifically, do you feel like that pertains to women only? Is that a hurdle that women have to jump over and having all those...

Speaker 2 (05:15)
I think so because no one at work is like, the working dad. No one's like, he's a working dad. It's always like, she's a working mom. You know, so it's like you already think and you sympathize with another working mom because you know what she's going through.

Speaker 1 (05:30)
But, ooh. She didn't open it up. Okay, say that again. I want you say that again.

Speaker 2 (05:32)
god.

But

that we sympathize with working moms? We do because as a working mom, I sympathize with a working mom because I know like you're trying to be the best at home, but then you're trying not to let work fall to the wayside and then you're trying to be the best employee and not trying to have home fall to the wayside. And I've shared it before, like I'm grateful where I work that they let me be a mom that works versus a working mom. Cause I don't, nothing at my job comes before my kids.

Speaker 1 (05:40)
Yeah.

So let me ask you this, how much time did you get from maternity leave?

Speaker 2 (06:09)
Well, thank you, state of Massachusetts. I got five months.

Speaker 1 (06:12)
You got five months. weeks. OK, and those 20 weeks, were those paid? Yes. OK, you know how long a man gets?

Speaker 2 (06:19)
yeah, four, maybe eight if they're lucky.

Speaker 1 (06:23)
So when I was working in state police when Leto was born, or when Leto, when Julie was pregnant, the maximum amount of time I would get when Leto was born was 10 days. And the reason why I wanted to hone in on the empathy part that you empathize with other working moms is because that is the piece that's, that's the link that's missing in male circles is the empathy of working dads. But that doesn't change the fact

fact that dads work too. In a two-parent household, everybody's working. If everything's going well.

Speaker 2 (06:54)
Everybody's working, correct.

Yeah, if everything's going well. But I also don't think that men, most men, let me say, because you and Wallace do a pretty good job at this, but I don't think most men are leaving work, like their day job, coming home, and then thinking, I have to do all these things. That's how I come home from work. Like, I'm working, then I'm like, and even at work, I'm thinking, okay, what am I making for dinner? Okay, did the girls, did I?

wash that shirt that she needs for the field trip. Okay, is this done for this? Oh, she has an appointment coming up. That means I have to pick her up early, which means I have to finish this project before I get to leave. You know, so it's like all these, like Wallace calls them tabs in my brain. And I feel like, man, even the best dads are focused on one thing, which is fine if that's how your brain works, but my brain doesn't work like that.

Speaker 1 (07:45)
Now let me ask you this, all of those tabs that are open in your brain as a mom, were they open before you became

Speaker 2 (07:52)
There were tabs, but not this many tabs.

Speaker 1 (07:54)
Okay, so here's what I want to bring our ladies in on, on the male side, because this is very important. And this is a conversation I've heard in your circles, as long as among many, many women. A man, and let's go on the example of Wallace and I, because as you see, this is great dads and husbands. A man who is driven, who wants a family, who wants a legacy to build, to leave, and to live, has those tabs open in his brain as

as somebody sees him as a man. So the reason why I asked you, when do you start have, when did those tabs start going off in your brain? A man who is driven by the concept of legacy will start planning for his funeral the day that he decides he wants to be a dad. So all those tabs are open all the time throughout life and men don't get that break. They don't get the break of empathy. They don't get the break of brotherhood. And a lot of traditional male circles,

Men are only allotted and are only applauded, I should say, when they succeed, it's something that they can produce. And so when a man has a high paying job or a man has a high power job or a man has a home or he has things that he can prove to people that, to other men, that's what we call male currency. When we have that currency, then yeah, we're able to, I don't know, maybe give ourselves a pat on the back, but that doesn't shut down any of those tabs.

We're always thinking about not necessarily what Letho's having for dinner or the tie-dye shirt, but I'm always thinking about how much money is in his investment account? How much money did it just lose? How are we gonna pay for his school? How are we gonna pay for this program? What am I involving my son in that is going to help him be self-sufficient when it's over, right? When I'm no longer here. See, a man who is kingdom-driven and legacy-driven will look at apparent hood as

not as something that he has to do, but something that he is required to provide for and set up. I'm thinking about generations from now. And so, I'm glad that you brought that up.

Speaker 2 (10:04)
think the difference too, Vlad, is women are also thinking about those things, not necessarily to the degree that you just mentioned, but it's also a tab in our brain. Am I going to be able to retire when I want and still pay for school? All those things, but I feel like what's missing in the disconnect between traditional men and women as we're talking right now is that we're...

in the details of what's going on today. And I feel like that's why women get burned out because yes, you're thinking legacy. Yes, your fears and what you're thinking is valid, but it's like, okay, what does that have to do with right now? And this shirt, you know what I mean? Like right now she has to eat and she's going to come home hangry. So yes, think about that 529, but what does that 529 have to do right now? If she's going to be upset and I got to deal with that attitude today, you know? So it's like,

Speaker 1 (10:43)
I to do with this.

Speaker 2 (10:57)
If a little bit of that can be put into the day-to-day monotony to you, but real life to me, that would be wonderful.

Speaker 1 (11:04)
But how are those real-time events from the day to day not affecting the man or the husband?

Speaker 2 (11:10)
It affects, it affects Wallace, but I'm talking about in the grand scheme of men and the, what you see the resentment on social media from women. It's apparently not affecting them at all, because they're like, who cares?

Speaker 1 (11:21)
So I want to dig in on that the resentment piece ⁓ because here the next line in this study says that wives are generally less happy than single women. Remember the same study from Yale with many resentful of being married to the wrong.

Speaker 2 (11:37)
That's the main piece of it Vlad, the wrong man.

Speaker 1 (11:41)
Okay, so that being said, I really want to break this apart because a lot of the conversations I see happening online among women being resentful to the men for not helping out more around the house, my question has always been, what was your selection criteria? What was your application process? Did you just want a man to fulfill your...

need or vision of being a mom and of being a wife and then maybe some things changed and maybe you realize you didn't want to give up as much of your autonomy or maybe you realize you really wanted to hold on to your goal or did you just choose the wrong man or you just chose any man that was willing to give you what you want?

Speaker 2 (12:23)
Don't do my sisters like that because what I think happens what I think happens is This picture is painted of this is a great guy and he could be a great guy He could be a wonderful partner But then the realization of everything that comes with starting a family having kids getting married having a home It's like not what you imagined it would be because you you're fed these like false narratives like ⁓ I'm gonna have

my two kids, a boy and a girl, and my wife pick a fence, and it's gonna be this, but then you don't think about what it takes to be an actual parent. You're not gonna sleep in those first couple years. You can't do anything that's for you. Everything is for the family. You can't just think about yourself. You can't just run to France when you wanna go to France. You have to think about all these things, and I feel like you don't realize it until you're in it, because again,

Anytime something's about to happen to us and I'm like so excited I'm excited the moment that it happened like we think about it start planning and For Wallace, he doesn't get excited until the thing actually happens. Like we're in it. We're on the airplane going We're on the ship going the baby is out and here like he's not nesting like you were like getting all these things ready So it's like when these bad ⁓ Husbands are not ideal partners

that thing happens, then it's like, well, they weren't equipped for this. So it's not that they're a bad person, they just didn't realize what it took to have this thing.

Speaker 1 (13:53)
Yeah, and I think that's what this study is pointing at. Because when I saw this, was like, huh. So the issue isn't necessarily marriage as an institution or as a life's choice that is making, in this study, unhappy or unhealthier. It's being out of alignment with their partner. And that's an important distinction to make. being out of alignment can happen. Two people can be on the same page, and then life happens, events happen, and then suddenly their philosophies change or their outlooks change.

But on the onset, if somebody is not who you want them to be, I feel like a lot of people, and this happens with, actually, let's talk about this too. I feel like this happens with men. Men are more visual at first, and then secondarily comes, can this woman, how can I see her as a mom, as a partner? But women, I feel like a lot of times, and correct me if I'm wrong, will select based on potential, and not necessarily based on what's in front of them.

Speaker 2 (14:51)
And that's the problem, because I feel like sometimes those signs are there. Like, they've never been around kids. They hate actually being around kids. They just like the idea of, like you said, legacy, having my kids doing this, that they shouldn't have been parents in the first place.

Speaker 1 (15:06)
Alright guys, this is a new segment that we're doing called Rhythm of the Neighborhood where we highlight local businesses that are the beat of our communities. Yeah, so you guys know we gotta show love to the local community. So our Rhythm of the Neighborhood today is none other than Genevieve of Beautiful Blends. Why don't you tell them about them, sis?

Speaker 2 (15:22)
So Genevieve is a dual licensed cosmetologist and barber and she specializes in braids, locks, lineups, anything barber related. So now that it's back to school time, check her out, get your kid's hair done, get your hair done, look fly, look fresh. And we'd love for you to share some of the work that she's done on your hair if you want to share with us.

Speaker 1 (15:46)
Yeah, and what I love about Genevieve is that all you have to do is book one appointment with her. It's a one-stop shop. You can even bring yourself, get a trim up, and then bring your young king or your young queen, and she can get her stuff done too. Gone are the days that you have to make a separate appointment for your child and a separate appointment for you. You can just bring all of you, bring the whole family, make it a fair.

Speaker 2 (15:51)
It's a one-stop chair.

Yes, family affair. Love it. One stop chair, one stop shop. Get it all done in one place. So yeah, check out Genevieve. Information's here.

Speaker 1 (16:14)
Check it

out on our description, you'll find the link there. And if you are a local business and you want your business highlighted in our Rhythm of the Neighborhood segment, make sure to send us a DM or send us an email.

Speaker 2 (16:25)
Yes, thanks, Vlad, and thanks, Genevieve. Deuces.

Speaker 1 (16:33)
So women are far more likely to file for divorce and report feeling happier after ending their marriages. And such unhappiness is not limited to women being married to men. actually, married to other women, are more likely to divorce than males who are in same-sex couples. And women have higher expectations of marriage, to your point, than men and have higher demands for meaningful communication and relationship quality. So that actually goes back to what?

We were just talking about how was saying how men are primarily visual, secondarily attributes, looking for attributes that will make for a long-standing partnership, whereas women, many times, will sacrifice compatibility, as they see it, for potential.

Speaker 2 (17:20)
brings up something else too Vlad. I feel like women ⁓ are conditioned, especially when we're like little girls, to prepare to be a wife. It's always like, ⁓ remember you set the table like this. and maybe it's just in Caribbean culture. Put it in the comments if it's, you know, you're from somewhere else and you also experienced this. But it's always like, we're always teaching girls how to be wives and mothers, but we're never teaching sons how to be fathers and husbands. We never have those conversations. And again,

Maybe it just in my household that those conversations weren't had. But my mom would sit us down and be like, okay, because when you're a mom, you do this. When you're a wife, you do this. But she wasn't having, my dad wasn't having those conversations with my brothers. Like, remember when you get married, when the women, and never.

Speaker 1 (18:03)
Well, I'd actually push back gently on that. I think there are three scenarios across the board, whether you're a man or a woman, whether you're a son or a daughter, there are scenarios in which a conversation is not being had and the expectations are being implied. There's another scenario where the conversation is being had, but it's not a conversation conducive to a long-term partnership, right? So those conversations happened all the time for me growing up. Not necessarily

how you should be as a husband or a father, it was either through the prism of this is how you should not be, and this is how your wife should be. especially in Caribbean culture, as men, we're constantly being coached on how our wives should be to us. And not how we should be to our wives. And that is problematic. So I think the conversation on a societal level is happening, but what we have as expectations,

for men and women in traditional relationships is skewed and outdated and not sustainable, right? And that's how people get into relationships where they're out of alignment from the onset. And so if we're talking about women dating and making marriage decisions based on potential, the potential that is for that husband, that prospective husband to become the husband or father that they want them to be, then yeah, you are gonna be unhappy.

And so that's why when I heard the study, I was like, are you unhappy because you were wrong? Or are you unhappy because it is wrong? Make it make sense.

Speaker 2 (19:38)
Yeah,

and it always goes back to communication, right? It's like, okay, you met this person, like you said, most women go from potential versus what they actually see, especially depending on how young they were, because you're not going to meet your six, five basketball millionaire, whatever women these days want when you're when you're 19.

Speaker 1 (19:57)
Don't get me started on that, Don't get me started on that. Well, here's the thing. I think it's a joke me and my cousin Steve joke about all the time. Women's expectations for men in 2025. Six feet, big you know what, six figures, all this stuff. But what you gonna do?

Speaker 2 (20:00)
I know, sorry Short King.

It's like, what are you bringing to the table? Yeah, no, exactly.

Speaker 1 (20:21)
Like,

so you want me to grow seven inches, you want me to grow seven figures, but you just gotta sit there and look cute? No, no, no, no, we ain't got time.

Speaker 2 (20:27)
Yeah, no, that's funny.

Speaker 1 (20:29)
Here's

another piece. Women's expectations, again, same study. Women's expectations of marriage can be hard to satisfy, increasing the risk of disappointment and questions about whether marriage was the right decision. Whew, that is so good. Okay, let's pick that apart. But in many instances, husbands are unaware of the wife's dissatisfaction. Communication. Consequently, husbands are more likely than wives to be surprised by requests for divorce.

Speaker 2 (20:51)
Communication Vlad.

Speaker 1 (20:58)
So what that tells me is folks don't communicate.

Speaker 2 (21:01)
They don't talk because

let me tell you, let me tell you.

There will never be a time in my life when I'm not happy with something that I'm not going to say that I'm unhappy. Like, why would I sit in that uncomfortable?

Speaker 1 (21:14)
Okay. But how?

So how, okay, so you will say it. Like if you got a problem with Wallace, you'll tell Wallace you have a problem with Wallace.

Speaker 2 (21:23)
If I got a problem with anyone, you will know because in my mind, you got 48 hours to tell me if I did something to you because after that, I'm oblivious. And why wouldn't you tell me that you have a problem with something I did or said? 48 hours, if you bring something up to me and it's from three months ago, I would be like, bro, you should have brought it up three months ago. I'm over it. We're moving past.

Speaker 1 (21:34)
Boy, 48 hours.

Okay, all right, I was gonna ask you what's the consequence if somebody brings it up after the

Speaker 2 (21:49)
It

depends. mean, obviously I'm gonna hear you out if I care about you, but I'm gonna be like, well, why didn't you bring it up three months ago? Like, that's gonna be my first question. Because you've been living with this bitterness, just anger towards me, and I'm just home chilling, dancing with the girls. Like, bring it up. Like, now you're like, I don't know, it's just so wild to me. But anyway, so I'm gonna bring it up.

And Wallace knows, I'm gonna bring it up and it'll be like, and Wallace is big on I need time to think about this, but then obviously I'm respecting you because you need time, inside I'm boiling because I need to talk about it because I feel wronged. ⁓ But yeah, communicate, just let the person know and then they're like surprised, but can we be upset that they're surprised when it hasn't been brought up? Now if you're bringing it up and then they're like, I'm so surprised. No, you're choosing that at this point, so why are you surprised at?

the mayor just falling apart or whatever, if it was communicated.

Speaker 1 (22:51)
Yeah, yeah, and I think actually there's a point I wanted to bring up as well. I think what happens oftentimes in relationships is maybe there might be somebody who has a qualm or they have the satisfaction, bring it up to the partner, and then the partner either hears them or they don't. They're like, want to listen to that, that's not true, whatever, we're going to dismiss it on sight. Or they do hear them out, and then if they're asking for help or if they're...

raising an issue that hurts them or that bothers them, they don't see any action after that. So the communication can be happening, but there's no follow through on the other side of that communication. So then that partner who's raising the issue becomes discouraged and is like, well, what's the point of me saying anything to you if you're not gonna do it now? Are they just gonna get up and leave the relationship? Probably not. But they'll eventually just stop bringing things up out of fear of disappointment, lack of follow through, so on and so forth.

So

Speaker 2 (23:48)
And that's why it's important to go through these things before you decide to get married. Like, I feel like there's so many scenarios that you need to see your partner, potential spouse, go through before you get married, just to see how they would react, how they would treat you in that situation, before you decide to even commit your life to them. One thing, it's funny, but it's not. Like, how would they react with slow internet? ⁓ my God.

Speaker 1 (24:12)
We

talk about this in the 90s episode.

Speaker 2 (24:14)
Yeah, right. Are they patient? Are they like freaking out? Are they, you know, these bouts of anger because the internet's low? Like, be for real. You know, like, how would they handle, like, someone that's sick in their family? You know what I mean? Like, how do they go through that? How do they process that grief or, you know, losing someone in the family? How do they process that? Just anything where it takes you out of character or it could take you out of character depending on the situation.

I'm trying to think of another example. Like if a waiter or someone gets some in order wrong, like there's people that go nuts over little things like this. It's like, would you want to be with someone like that? Or you tell them about these feelings you're having about something they did and then they do dismiss it and they keep dismissing it. They don't hear your side. Would you want to be with someone like that?

That's why I think a lot of the times the red flags are there, but we have these rose colored glasses that it's like, it's just one time or that's actually their whole personality, but you're not seeing it because you're in love, you know?

Speaker 1 (25:12)
And I think that adds to the broader conversation about marital dissatisfaction, right? So if we're talking about this study that suggests that women, and it focuses on women, I think there are probably other studies on men that we could find, but that women are generally healthier, happier, more prosperous, more autonomous, having not been in a relationship or having not been in relationship at all. To me, flies in the face of

all of the studies that promote us as social beings and that we need to be around people now. Can you get the same, you can still have and derive satisfaction and a sense of community and belonging from people that are not necessarily romantically connected to you. ⁓ But as a married woman, let's flip this on its head. What do you feel are the marked benefits, things that add to your life being a married woman and a mother?

Speaker 2 (26:10)
would say that emotional support is constantly there. Someone to share all the good and bad with. There's always someone there, again, in a healthy relationship, there's always someone there that you can bounce ideas off of. And Wallace supports all my dreams. So it's like when I get that dream, again, because I still don't know what I'll be when I grow up, he'll be there to support it, and I know that he will. So it's good to have someone there to do all those things. ⁓

And then the kids, drive me nuts and they run me ragged, but I couldn't imagine not having them. You know, I don't think my, all of my joy and fulfillment comes from them. So I don't want anyone to think that. And don't be out here having kids because you feel like you're an empty person because that's not fair to them putting all that on your kids. Like they're only there because you want to fill a void. They don't do that for me. Yes, it's great that they're there. I love them. Like you said, legacy building. But

I'm happy as me by myself and they just bring, it's like the icing on the cake. And like to your point, I feel like if I didn't have kids or a spouse, I would have like the same love and support just in other things because I'd have time to find other things. I think that's why the study says that married women are less happy or whatever is because they don't have time.

Speaker 1 (27:34)
So let me ask you this, if you had a girlfriend or a sister, we know you got several sisters, say one of your sisters was single and hadn't yet found a long-term relationship and they were on the fence of whether or not to even pursue that, right? Say they have a really good job, say they have a really strong career and they have, they're independent, they provide their own place to live, but they have their own house, everything they've given is their own, so they're like, I don't

Speaker 2 (28:00)
T-Vide.

Speaker 1 (28:01)
Yeah, like I don't really think I need to I don't think I need a relationship. What would you say to that person?

Speaker 2 (28:05)
Good for you. If they honestly are happy, Vlad, like your happiness and that joy shouldn't come from one person, kids, whatever, it should come internally from the things that you find joy in. know, yes, we shouldn't do life alone, but that doesn't mean we should do life only with a spouse. You could be single and not alone.

Speaker 1 (28:28)
Conversely, you can be.

Speaker 2 (28:30)
full of community and feel lonely.

Speaker 1 (28:32)
Right, you can be together in a relationship.

Speaker 2 (28:34)
There's plenty of married people, Vlad, that feel lonely every day. Because they're not getting those needs met. One, because they don't communicate or the spouse doesn't want to do whatever. But you can be single on paper or whatever, let's say single on paper, and be the most fulfilled person because you have those needs met from your family, from your friends, your community, your job.

Speaker 1 (28:57)
Yeah, but you can't have sex with your coworkers or your family.

Speaker 2 (28:59)
Well, that's, some people don't need to have sex, Vlad, so it's fine. Or they can just get those needs somewhere else. This episode isn't about sex. This episode is about are women better married or not? And who's saying those needs aren't met just because they're, again, single on paper?

Speaker 1 (29:11)
Come

Okay, so, ⁓ wait, just real side note, are we really saying that people do not, they do not need to have...

Speaker 2 (29:24)
Again, episode isn't about sex, but there's a lot of people that are asexual. They don't have the desire to have sex.

Speaker 1 (29:31)
That's different though than people who select not to. Either way, it's not even about physical. The reason why I'm saying that is because this study, I feel like is making a case against or for women to decide not to get into intimate relationships.

Speaker 2 (29:37)
They're

don't think it's pushing that. think it's just presenting the facts, the studies of the women that they interviewed, whatever, reported, the women that reported all this, it's reporting into it. But to me, I see why. Because again, if I was a single person, I only have to worry about myself. I have all the time in the world, because I can do what I want. I'd be in the gym every day 24-7, because I have the time.

Speaker 1 (29:54)
reported

Speaker 2 (30:14)
I'd be researching and having money because I'm not paying for daycare, I'm not paying for someone else, it's only my needs. I'd have the money to hire a private chef to cook me healthy meals.

Speaker 1 (30:24)
I think we're getting a little bit of a bird's eye view into, like, several mommy's brain. What do you mean? No, like, damn, that's a lot of, all those things sound good.

Speaker 2 (30:31)
Why are they happy?

They make sense. Again, I love Wallace, I love the girls, but if they weren't there, I will find fulfillment in other things, is what I'm saying, and I understand. To me, Angie Thomas, I don't think that I need those things because again, I made my choices and I'm very happy with my decisions. I don't think I'm unhappier than I was single. I think I'm happier. So I think it also depends on the actual person. more facts.

Speaker 1 (31:02)
Yo, check this out.

This is crazy. Okay. There two things I want to break apart here. Number one, this study says, in general, husbands have not demonstrated willingness to increase their relatively low contributions to housework and childcare. Facts. Pause there. I want to come back to that because that is incredible. That is an incredibly emphatic statement. But here's this. People also, meanwhile, while debating whether this is good enough,

and not for women, try alternatives to marriage. And so the study shows that while marriage poses negative effects on women's health and longevity, dog ownership provides benefits for men and women, such as lower blood pressure and reduced cholesterol, and pets don't come within laws. there's that. So I want to talk about the hard thing first, and that was a little difficult to read. If you can taste it, maybe Vlad's in his bag. But.

Men have demonstrated little interest in contributing to their relatively low contributions. Ouch. Ouch. Ouch. again, is all studies are only as good as the information that's been given. Right? So how do you interpret that?

Speaker 2 (32:09)
Yeah

Well, you brought up a good point earlier when I was like, all the details and like, we're thinking bigger picture. Well, thinking bigger picture, Vlad, what do the dishes have to do with legacy building? You know, like, what does that have to do with it? You know, I'm thinking the dishes need to be done because I need to cook because I need to do this. Again, I'm thinking everyday tasks. But if every man, and again, I don't think what you said is wrong. Yeah, legacy building is very important, but.

What does that have to do, again, with the day to day? So you're thinking bigger, so you're like, well, what I'm doing is more important and more impactful. The dishes are nonsense.

Speaker 1 (32:55)
Well, and I think there's another aspect to legacy building. Like legacy building is one browser with many tabs that are open in a man's mind. But also keep in fact, and keep in mind that men have been socialized to love and show love by ways of provision. Not necessarily by way. And that provision is, okay, you wanna do the dishes, but the dishes wouldn't be, the dishes can't be cleaned if there's no water. If the water bill's not paid, then there's no water. We wouldn't have a kitchen if.

We didn't qualify for this home. We wouldn't qualify for this home if I didn't make more money. I wouldn't make more money if I wasn't drilled into me that in order for a woman to love you and see you worthy as a husband, that you have to make enough money to be able to provide for one or both of you at any given time.

Speaker 2 (33:40)
And Vlad, you said it. You weren't conditioned just like dishes are conditioned to be a woman's job.

Speaker 1 (33:47)
I'm a push against that. ⁓ my my well, that's That's

Speaker 2 (33:50)
Remember

remember in my house again, I'm only talking for the Hernandez household Girls did the dishes because that was a girl's job You know what I mean? But it's wild but it's in a lot of houses, right? And what did the boys do take out the trash trash is a boy's job And we joke about it in my house because I'm like Wallace take out the trash. That's boy's job. That's the only boy here

Speaker 1 (33:59)
Okay, that's.

That sounds light, damn, if all I had to do was change the trash,

Speaker 2 (34:16)
Take

out the trash. Ain't nobody telling you to touch the trash. Ain't nobody telling you to dig in the trash. You just got to put it outside.

Speaker 1 (34:21)
⁓

no, no, no. So let me clarify for all my Caribbean folks. Yo, men, I actually, can't even speak for everybody, but let me tell you what it was like in the Luisena household, okay? Doing the dishes was a me job or a search job. Doing the scrubbing the bathtub.

Speaker 2 (34:37)
But

let me tell you why though, let me tell you why Vlad, your mom would have ran herself ragged. She didn't have daughters. If you had a sister that lived with you, your post sister, she's the only girl, at least there was four of us. We could divvy it up and we all took our turns. But one girl in a Caribbean household, I feel bad.

Speaker 1 (34:45)
BOOM

One girl in a Caribbean household is the equivalent of four male.

Speaker 2 (35:02)
It's ⁓ it's a lot. I talk about, ⁓ elder sister, elder sister, but thank goodness it wasn't just me. Me and five brothers? my goodness. It's too much. ⁓ So yeah, so we're conditioned to think, again, Caribbean household, that that's a woman's job. Not in your case, because you only had boys in your house. So who else is going to help your mom? I think she did a great job teaching you guys that. But what did your mom even tell you, that you have to marry who?

Speaker 1 (35:30)
have to marry a woman that will do all the things that I'm teaching you to do and expect a woman to do.

Speaker 2 (35:38)
Right. So make it make sense.

Speaker 1 (35:40)
Can you repeat the part with the thing? That's a Simpsons reference if anybody wanted to know. Can you repeat the part with the things? ⁓ Yeah, yeah, no, no, I agree because on the other side of my house where my cousins lived, my cousin Lisa was the sole female, not the sole female cousin, but the sole female cousin in that house. In a house full of women. All the women did the cleaning, all the women did the cooking, all the men did...

Speaker 2 (35:43)
Yeah

house.

outside things. If you had a yard, you're out there doing that. Well, there you go. They ain't doing nothing.

Speaker 1 (36:11)
and

my aunt owned the house. Damn. That was completely lopsided. That was crazy. ⁓ And actually, if you guys watched the earlier episode about finances, we were talking about my family. The reason why things fell apart was because my aunt was expected to do all of that plus own the house. And she's like, wait, time out. That's not what's written in the societal code. I'm not supposed to own anything or manage anybody. Like, I'll do the cooking, the cleaning, and I'll...

I'll make this a homely home and all that, but you can't ask me to own anything. That's a man's job. yeah, to that point. ⁓ Yeah, I feel like this study is itching me, man. It makes me itch. It makes me itch because, but to that point, I do think that there's credence to women feeling dissatisfied. Now let me keep it a buck. It's not like I don't see this.

Speaker 2 (37:03)
Right, we see it in the people that we know we see it online people at work that share, know information but yeah, it's definitely an epidemic of Men not doing what they're supposed to do I Try not to cuss

Speaker 1 (37:19)
So let's talk about that then. So

from a woman, now listen, can cuss, this is our podcast. Roots of rhythm, if there's a rhythm in your mouth that needs to come out, then let it come out one story at a time. So let's talk about that now, moving forward. What do women need, these women in the study, what do these women in this study who are ragged, who are tired of being let down, what do they need men to do?

and to be in order for the study to be redrawn years from now and for the outcomes to be better.

Speaker 2 (37:56)
⁓ I think women need men to open their eyes and see what needs to be done around the house. It's like, why do I need to make you a list? may I make me a list of what you want me to do around here? Like a honey do list. Open your eyes. Like, literally you see the writings on the wall, what needs to be done.

Speaker 1 (38:12)
But is that a male trait or is that just a person trait? Because it's not always the same.

Speaker 2 (38:16)
And right now we're talking about the women in this study. I think the women in the study need their gentlemen or female partners apparently to, yeah, gentle women, to open their eyes and see what needs to be done. And just do, don't ask, just do. If you see that something needs to be done, do it. Don't wait for recognition or for a pat on the back, like, way to go, you also live here, why wouldn't you want it to look nice? You know what I mean? So I think they need that.

I think they need to be appreciated for all the multiple hats that they're wearing because if they're also working and then they're home working, so now it's like you want me to be a, what is it, a housewife and bring money in to the home. So I'm doing it all. So if I'm doing both, why can't you help and do both? Then we're both doing a little bit less. ⁓

Speaker 1 (39:06)
But check this out though, like we said, many men are conditioned to provide, to show love through provision. Right, I think, and in that scenario, everybody's providing something else, right? But what if the man who's provisionally driven is working at home, is working during the day and then comes home, or doesn't come home because he's working even more, to keep the life, in order for the family unit to stay together financially.

Speaker 2 (39:12)
But I'm providing too.

So he has two jobs.

Speaker 1 (39:34)
he might have two jobs or, you know, I'm former law enforcement, he might be working hours upon hours of details every day so that we can live on the block that you see the white picket fence on, or that we can have the car that you feel comfortable driving, because you don't feel like driving a hoopty or something that's older. So what about those men who are multitasking and don't feel that they have the capacity or the need to see these things when they're spending most of their time out?

Speaker 2 (40:02)
So you even said Vlad that a lot of the men, law enforcement men, they were working those details to avoid being home. Granted, the house can be big, that's fine, but now you're missing out on helping me around the house. You're missing out on spending time with your kids. So we have this huge, beautiful home with no love in it. I'd rather be in a shack where we all like each other.

Speaker 1 (40:24)
Well, and there's a, that's a guy, I agree with that. So there is a number of men that I've worked with in law enforcement that married women who'd had no desire or any intention of having their own career, no one to be homemakers. And I think that's crazy. I think, whatever, I think even if you don't have a career in your mind, get a hobby that'll keep you busy and fulfilled, please.

for the love of everybody around you. But what didn't make sense to me, Angie, was that there were men who had those partners who were then getting divorced because they were never at home. And so my problem with that was, okay, my fair lady, you married a man who you knew was the breadwinner and you expected him to be the breadwinner. And then you had a lifestyle that you wanted to maintain.

and that you wanted that lifestyle at all costs, but you had no plans to provide any financial resources. Your main goal was to be a traditional wife, not work, be the homemaker, but now you're burnt out because you're doing all the child rearing, you're doing all the homemaking, your husband's not home because he has to work, and you resent him because he's working all the time and not spending time with his family, but he has to in order for his family to be here. So I'm like,

Both of y'all didn't talk and clearly did not plan.

Speaker 2 (41:54)
And it wasn't what she expected. And that's the thing. So it's like, just like the flip that we were talking about, these men that get into marriages have kids and the kids and all the things that come with kids, they weren't expecting it. I don't think she was expecting to be lonely ⁓ in the marriage that she decided to have because she wanted to be a traditional wife at home. But to your point, that's what it takes to have the house that you want when you're not bringing an income is going to take you being lonely, And so it's like.

You have to pick your battles. okay, maybe if she, again, has a conversation and is like, hey, I miss you being home. I'm going to pick up even, again, it doesn't have to be like this whole thing, but if you want to go back to school to make more money or whatever, or just pick up some sort of, you know, part-time job so he doesn't have to work three details, now he only has to work two, at least that's still time home. You know what I mean? Like work together to.

to get the life that you want. But yeah, I don't think that that's fair either, putting all those expectations on a man for you to just stay home with your feet up. And granted, not feet up, because being a stay-at-home mom, it's a lot of work. And I don't want to take that away from anyone. But in this example, working would help him be home. So let's get a little job or something.

Speaker 1 (43:00)
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (43:13)
Just a little something. out, you know?

Speaker 1 (43:15)
Yeah, well you hit the nail on the head. People don't plan on being lonely. People don't plan. You you can't plan for everything in life, but if you're curious enough, if you're nosy enough, you can actually see when things are happening right in front of your face, provided that you surround yourself with people and with resources that help you identify and assess, right? Those are two skills, or maybe they're the same skills, identification and assessment. Maybe they're separate skills.

that you need to master in life, no matter what you do. Whether we're talking about relationships, we're talking about work, we're talking about hobbies, we're talking about exercise. To talk about another episode, identification of a goal or a problem, and then assessing what is needed in order for you to achieve or surpass that problem. ⁓ Or a goal. So, there's some things, dog, that I don't think, the beef is not between men and women. I think if anything, the study shows that the beef is

with society, the is with messaging, the beef is with what are we raising our boys and girls to think? What are we raising our boys and girls to expect in relationships? That's where things are falling apart because if men are told that the only way they can provide anything, contribute to a relationship is to work, they're gonna be focused on that and then they're not gonna be raised to be attuned with their partner's feelings.

because they didn't think that was part of the package. like, yo, listen, I make the six figures, I'm seven feet tall, whatever. You know what mean? Like, leave me alone. I wore stilts today. You know what I'm saying? But then again, if women are told, well, a happy wife is a happy life, a happy home is a happy this, and then everything's gotta be nice and cute and cuddly and presentable, then men's are like, cool, I don't need to be part of any of that. And everybody's gonna be disappointed. So I think our beef really is with.

Society and it changes with having conversations like this that are not necessarily easy to have But are necessary to have because we can't keep missing each other

Speaker 2 (45:13)
Exactly. And have those conversations early, Vlad. Again, if you're in the thick of it, in the thicket, and already in a marriage, start having those conversations. But if you're not married, have those conversations as early as possible. Like, what are the expectations? Because you don't want to make it have 10 years after the fact. And then you're still wondering, well, what about this? No.

Then you were like wasting time and then people stay because they're like, well, I already invested 10 years. No, have the conversations. ⁓ And I like to say happy spouse, happy house, happy house, happy spouse. ⁓ happy me, happy we, that's cute.

Speaker 1 (45:51)
Happy me, happy we.

Happy me, happy we. Because at the end of the day, whether you are heterosexual, homosexual, it doesn't really matter. I am a strong believer in that we are social creatures and that we need relationships of different types. Every relationship, every bond serves something different. Like, I'm not going to get what I can get from Julie, from my prayer partners. I'm not going to get what my prayer partner is from Julie and so on and so forth, or my cousins or friends and things of that nature.

Speaker 2 (46:22)
But I like that Vlad because you shouldn't expect to get all your happiness from one person. You need a diversified portfolio and you need a diversified friend group. Friends, spouse, whatever. It needs to be diversified. Like you said, you don't get the same thing from Julie, from us, from your prayer partners. You have to diversify because again, what happens if that person, one, you're smothering them. If you're only getting your happiness from one person, smother. Two,

And if that person goes away, decides to leave you, passes away, forbid, then what? Your life is over. But it shouldn't be. It shouldn't have to be. But yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:58)
And that's another conversation for another day. But the same could be said about parental relationships as well. Cut the cord. Yeah, it is our job to raise these kids. It's not a job to be everything for these kids. Because eventually, if we are everything, we are going to die. We're all going to go. And I think that's the way that I was having this conversation with my boy, Manny, the other day, how men see their sons differently than mothers see their sons. And you and I talked about this in an earlier episode about how

Speaker 2 (47:05)
forward.

Speaker 1 (47:27)
Mother see the baby. my gosh, my baby boy

Speaker 2 (47:29)
And

you're like, the world gotta be strong. world is still you boy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, they're still little.

Speaker 1 (47:32)
Welcome to

No, but seriously though.

They are, they're little, but we do know that they're, again, legacy-minded, right? When I'm gone, will you know how to be without me? It's already gonna be hard. Losing a parent is not something I've experienced yet, but I dread the day that I do. But I can rejoice in the fact that my parents gave me enough, not everything that I needed or wanted, but they gave me enough, the best that they could.

Speaker 2 (48:05)
the best they could.

Speaker 1 (48:08)
to give me a start towards building something of my own, becoming who I am. And I'll tell you, if you know me, I don't like being told what to do. Okay, I don't like, don't tell me what to do, which is why law enforcement was not the best choice of career. But I got that primarily from my mother, right? And so that being said, as we wrap up this conversation, listen.

We can go back and forth about it all day about whether women benefit or do not benefit from being in intimate relationships. Particularly, we focus on this Yale study with men. But I would implore that if you are a woman listening to this podcast or you're a man listening to this podcast, brother, do the research. Like we just did this Yale study research, okay? Do the research. Study your partner. Study yourself.

Study what you want, study what is good for you. Understand that if you're going to a relationship, is going to be incumbent on you to teach your partner how to love you. You should have standards. We should not be in 2025 willy-nilly and hoping for the best. Don't nobody got time for that. Hope is great, but execution is worship. Please do the research. And don't settle for a relationship that you know is beneath you or a situation that you know is beneath you.

and then be mad that you're disappointed later. Like have some standards, damn, and you won't be unhappy. There are so many competing factors, Angie, that'll throw you out of alignment with your partner, but if you're in alignment from the get-go, the elements will come and your house is built on stones, not sand, it will withstand the elements. What you got to say?

Speaker 2 (49:52)
I can't even add anything to that Vlad because your conviction is showing. You're very passionate about this. But I would just say, I feel like we say it every episode because it's like the foundation of everything. Communicate. People aren't mind readers. If you don't say what you need, the needs won't be met and then the resentment comes, the anger comes and it's 10 years and where are we? Communicate, communicate, communicate.

Set those expectations, set those boundaries. If there's a boundary, set it up so we know. But again, if people don't know, we can't get upset.

Speaker 1 (50:29)
So final thought, I'm leaving this final thought. Final thought because in respect of everything we spoke about today, where do you stand on the topic? Do women benefit or are they, do they benefit from being in relationship? Is that something that you feel that you would suggest to the love of your life who is a woman to pursue or do you think it's not worth it?

Speaker 2 (50:31)
Final, final thought.

Again, I think it depends person by person. Me, Angie, I need Wallace. People are like, you don't need no man. I do need mine. He's great. ⁓ But again, if a person feels that they don't need that romantic relationship and rather be single, like chosen to be single, good for them. But again, please have a community around you so you're not feeling lonely even though you are alone relationship-wise. That's it.

Speaker 1 (51:16)
That's it. That's

it. Listen, if you love what you hear, we had a lot of great important conversations. We were going back and forth. We were like, yeah, I want to fight.

Speaker 2 (51:27)
But respectfully.

Speaker 1 (51:28)
Yes, yes, this is the type of discourse that I hope that we encourage for you to have in your communities and your spheres of influence as You know it all the time if you like what you hear like and subscribe Make sure you check out our affiliate links in the bottom of this video and attach this podcast if you're listening to the audio podcast It's your boy Vlad the Bull your number one embrace coach We out of here stay rooted we'll see y'all next week

Speaker 2 (51:51)
and Angie LeCybert-Miller.

See you