Supernaut
Supernaut is a podcast about spirituality, sobriety, suicide, and the full spectrum of being human.
Hosted by Beth Kelling, the show opens space for honest conversations about healing, identity, and the parts of life we often keep quiet.
As the show has grown, mental health has become a defining theme. Many guests have shared deeply personal experiences with anxiety, depression, suicidal ideation, and loss. In response, Supernaut is dedicating more space to conversations around suicide—approaching the topic with care, honesty, and compassion.
The goal is not to sensationalize pain, but to reduce stigma, encourage vulnerability, and remind people that struggling does not mean failing—and that help, connection, and light are possible.
Whether you’re sober-curious, spiritually inclined, or simply looking for real conversations that make you feel less alone, you’re welcome here.
If you or someone you love is struggling with suicidal thoughts, help is available in the U.S. by calling or texting 988. If you’re outside the U.S., visit findahelpline.com.
Supernaut
Sleep, Creativity, And The One Percent Rule - Kody Hughes
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Start with a song, end with a blueprint. Our conversation with editor and creator Kody Hughes begins with Billy Joel’s Vienna and opens into a candid exploration of creative ambition, perfectionism, and the one percent rule. Kody shares how a decade of pushing through stress turned into a simple resolution with outsized returns: get more sleep. Not as a nice-to-have, but as a system that sharpens thinking, softens reactivity, and makes better art.
We dig into the compounding power of tiny improvements and the trap of trying to overhaul everything at once. Imposter syndrome shows up, but so does the caveman test for modern fears and a practical way out: intentional constraints. From time-boxed “research” and AI summaries to replacing doom scrolls with focused analysis, Kody shows how structure protects attention. Atomic Habits makes an appearance via never miss twice, a wall tracker for fifty finished books, and a gym streak that survives real life.
The heart of the episode lives at the crossroads of creativity and livelihood. Kody unpacks the thrill and toll of commercializing a hobby, the ceiling-free draw of entrepreneurship, and the paradox of protecting play inside paid work. We explore the spaghetti theory—throw ideas until one sticks—and the courage to triple down when it does. Insights Discovery adds a collaborative edge: understanding yellow vs blue minds turns friction into fluency. And Rick Rubin’s The Creative Act threads through it all, reframing creativity as a way of seeing: mindful meals, present walks, and noticing the inner signal beneath the noise.
If you’re balancing family, deadlines, and an inner critic, this conversation offers an honest map: sleep more, aim small, miss once not twice, and let imperfections be the human signal your work needs. Subscribe, share this with a friend who’s building their craft, and leave a review telling us the tiniest change you’ll make this week.
0:00 Meet Kody Hughes And A Song That Stuck
2:50 Interpreting Vienna And Timeless Lyrics
5:35 One Percent Better And Perfectionism
9:40 Turning 30, Kids, And Risk Tolerance
13:05 Fear, Imposter Syndrome, And Stress
16:35 Sleep As A Superpower
20:10 Resolutions, Books, And Cutting Scrolling
23:15 Habits, Gym Streaks, And Atomic Habits
26:15 Personality Colors And Communication
30:05 AI Summaries, Time, And Podcasting
33:40 Commercializing Hobbies And Perspective
38:30 Career Pivots, You Betcha, And Drive
The most important thing, and it's the thing that I've neglected my entire life. It's the easiest thing to throw away. It's like the one thing you can control.
SPEAKER_00:Welcome to Supernaut, where we explore the inner and outer dimensions of the self. Today my guest is Cody Hughes. Cody is the editor of Supernaut, so this literally wouldn't be what it is without him. He's a multimedia content creator for Grand Casino, has his own company, Focal Point Media. He's a videographer, a graphic designer, a commercial, and real estate photographer. And after talking to his friends and family, I think he's really capable of anything. So I asked you to pick a song for us to listen to before we started. What song did you pick and why? Actually, you picked two. You have to tell us about both.
SPEAKER_03:My first pick was uh Ram Ranch by Grant McDonald. That was I had this plan that I had figured that you'd never heard that song before, and it's just super vulgar. So I thought, like, whoa, this is crazy. But my real song was Vienna by Billy Joel.
SPEAKER_00:And why did you pick that one?
SPEAKER_03:I really like Vienna because I remember where I like literally right where I was when I first heard that song. I was 18 years old in my dorm room at college, and I remember someone introduced me to Billy Joel, and I always thought, like, this is like old people music, you know. But then I was like, wow, like the words are so timeless, you know. I've watched so many YouTube breakdowns of like what it means and like how you can interpret it, and it's crazy because that's one of those songs where like every single person has a different view of it, and every person's perspective like injects their own meaning into it. And for me, it's like you can afford to take some time to yourself when you need to, and I that's like something that I'm really bad at. So, like that for me is like, yeah, okay, I can chill for a day, but also at the same time, it says like whatever you want, like just go get it. Like, what's in the way of getting what you want, or really like separating noise from signal in your own life and just focusing on what really makes you happy, is really what I get out of it, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Well, that was the first time I've heard it, which made me desperately sad because it's so beautiful. Like, I'm already obsessed with it, and I was thinking, like, I need to figure out what this song means. So I'm gonna go on a deep dive YouTube after this and see what other people think. Cause yeah, it was so beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah, you're welcome.
SPEAKER_03:It's a great song. I like it a lot. Yeah, I like I mean, it really opened my eyes to like all genres of music, I would say. Up to that point, I was pretty hard-headed and like I really only like like rhythmic, melodic songs. But then I'm like, wow, this is there's a whole bunch of songs that I just like wrote off because I think I didn't like them. Yeah, but that's like that's a powerful song. Yeah, it's cool.
SPEAKER_00:Like, obviously, I've always heard of Belly Joel, but I've never looked up any of his songs.
SPEAKER_03:Everyone always thinks piano man, you know?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, right, right. Yeah, yeah. But wow, yeah, that was very touching, very nice. Thank you. Um, okay, so you've given me lots of advice since we started, and um one of the newer ones that you gave me was um a few months ago you said if every episode you get one percent better, you know, like that will add up after time. And yeah, it made me think like I'm really bad at math, but I'm pretty sure after a year, that's like you're 52% better, right? If you start at zero, like if I started at zero percent good after one year, like 52% better, that's crazy.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and that's what's crazy too about this industry and just like podcasting in general, or just like making just creation in general. It's like it's all perspective. So whatever your version of better is, there's probably someone who has a a version that's even more crazy than that, you know? And there's always something you can change. I mean, even from mic placement to what cameras you're using, where the cameras are, what lights are you using, how are you talking, who are your guests, what kind of how what did you do to prepare? You know, so there's always something to improve at, which is crazy. Like there's never a 100%, you know? There's never, and I think I mean I come from a place of like I'm a perfectionist when it comes to anything creation. And there's never anything I've I've ever made where I look back a year later and be like, that was perfect. I always look back and like, damn, I would change this and that and this and that. But yeah, that idea that's a direct quote from Mr. Beast too. He was on Diary of a CEO, Stephen Bartlett's podcast. And he said that in there, and that was like, wow, that makes so much sense. Because you I get stuck in this like loop of trying to change too much, and then I get into analysis paralysis where like I'm too busy studying what I need to be doing that I'm just like not doing it. You know what I mean? So just focusing on like the little things that you can control, you know, in relation to budget, skill level, whatever, you know, like that for me, I was like, whoa, that's kind of eye-opening.
SPEAKER_00:And cool, oh yeah, you can go from zero percent to infinity, like that doesn't stop at a hundred percent.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, literally. So then what does one percent even mean?
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_03:You know, I mean one percent could literally be like, I'm gonna say more than one word, or what you know what I mean? Like it's so so much perspective that it's like kind of open to interpretation.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but I thought that was a good thing to bring up for the new year because it is January 2nd, so new year's resolutions are probably on people's minds. And if you have a resolution and if you're just gonna get one percent better at something every week, that means a year from now, you're 50% better. Like that's crazy. At least, like, like, yeah, because then that compounds too, doesn't it? Somebody told me like something about it compounding, totally, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, because if you think about it, I mean, like in 50 episodes, you're gonna be so much better. Like, you're gonna be way better than 52%, which whatever that means, you know. Half, you know what I mean, or one times better, you know, like what even is that? Yeah, you're just gonna be so much better, right? And in terms of other people's expectations, you're probably gonna be like a hundred times better.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, because the things I cared about, um, the first couple episodes that I'd like would tell you, like, change this, and you're like, nobody's gonna notice that, nobody's gonna care.
SPEAKER_03:Small pauses or like a fumble on a word, it's like they don't notice that. They're not gonna care.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Did you make any resolutions?
SPEAKER_03:You know, I'm actually like, I'm really I'm working on that. I don't know what I really want out of this year, you know. I think like I've reached a weird point. Like this year feels the most different for any year that I've ever had because like I'm 30 now. I just turned 30 in October, and so like that to me feels really weird because from my perspective, at my age right now, my dad was divorced with two kids, 10 and 6. I was 10 years old, my my sister was six. At my age, I'm like, wow, that is crazy. Like, I remember at 10 years old thinking, like, my dad is old, and now I'm that age. And being like, wow, I am I'm at a crossroads here, you know. Like, I'm not like a young kid anymore. But also, I wouldn't consider myself to be like old enough to be like your experience, like you know what you're doing. Yeah, you know what I mean? So mentally it's this weird crossroads.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, 30 is a weird age. I remember my 30th birthday. I ran a few miles and cried and then just went on with my life.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I didn't run, I didn't cry yet. We'll see. I'm still a couple of months behind it, you know. It hasn't really hit me.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Still gotta figure it out. It's different too now having two kids. Because like my whole perspective on life is totally different now. It's like I was so willing to experiment and risk it all on any idea that I had. Like at any point, I'm like, I don't care if I drain my bank account to zero. This is just what I want to do today. But now it's like, dude, if you're living in a car with two kids, like that's kind of messed up.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, you're right.
SPEAKER_03:Before I was like, I don't care where I'm living.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, now you have to be responsible for other humans.
SPEAKER_03:Now there's like a a higher risk for everything that I do, and I feel that. Whether that's real or not, I don't know. Some of that I'm sure I'm just kind of putting into my own brain, but it's like, this is different, this feels different. So I guess long answer to your question, I have not made any resolutions, but I am working on making resolutions right now, actually.
SPEAKER_00:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:So I'm like trying to figure it out.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. Um, well, another piece of advice that you told me the first piece was that in a hundred years no one's going to know your name. Like you kept saying that over and over again, trying to get me not to be scared to do my first episode.
SPEAKER_03:It sounds dismal when you say it back to me.
SPEAKER_00:I was like, okay, but we're not a hundred years in the future right now. We're right now, you know, but like I knew what you were trying to say, and um, it was very helpful to be like, yeah, I mean, nobody cares. So anybody that's thinking about podcasting or coming on, like, you know, nobody really cares about um what you do. Um, like, yeah, people might be rude, but in general, like people don't really care. So you started a podcast in 2020. Did you have to think like that?
SPEAKER_03:No, I twenty in 2020, my mindset was totally different. Like, my outlook on life and the world was totally different. I was like, I don't care what anyone thinks. I'm gonna be unapologetically myself, and you know, who cares?
SPEAKER_00:That's good.
SPEAKER_03:I don't even like I had no thought of like there's no way that this can fail unless I stop doing it. That was my whole mindset. That's the only way that this won't work.
SPEAKER_00:Well, that's a good mindset, isn't it?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it is good, but to the detriment of, you know, probably my um, I guess, people's outlook on me, you know, because I'm sure I did things that people are like, you know, that's not cool, or probably I don't like that, or whatever, you know. We definitely tried to maintain relevancy at certain points of having my own podcast and own show and YouTube channel and making skit form content, you know, stuff like that. Definitely tried to like have this like shock factor about it sometimes where it was like purposely kind of in your face. And I think that just more aligned with my mindset at the time. I was just I was younger, I didn't have any kids. I was like, I'm just gonna do whatever I want.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:So do you regret any of that now?
SPEAKER_03:I don't I don't regret it, but I wouldn't do it the same if I did it again. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Interesting. Well, we both listened to the diary of a CEO episode with Chris Williamson that just came out. Um, they talked about the shame of small fears. Remember that part where he was like, like our ancestors would beg to have the problems that we have right now. Like if we went and told a caveman about um, oh, like I have this fear of sending this email, and the caveman would be like, Okay, well, you know, are the enemies gonna see this email? And you're like, no, okay, um, is a saber-toothed tire gonna smell the message? No, like will it be etched in the wall for the rest of time? And it's like, no, well, what are you scared of? Like, in case somebody doesn't like it, somebody doesn't like me, and the caveman would just laugh at you, like, but then also going into but you you can't deny yourself the the shame and the fear that you do have either. You can't like suppress it, so it's like this perfect balance. So, like, what did you take out of that part of the episode?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I'm definitely guilty of that. I get like real bad imposter syndrome, like really bad. But I also think like my partially my superpower is like coming off that I'm not totally nervous or super anxious. I think like I have really high anxiety, but my form of showing that is like locking in, you know? And I think like to my own detriment, I kind of like purposely put myself there sometimes because I know that I perform really well when I'm like high stress, but also it like is a definitive thing. It's like good for your physical body, right? Definitely.
SPEAKER_00:I know because I just told Shannon that yesterday when she's like, Well, what are we gonna do for the outline of this thing that I'm planning? And I'm like, um, I work best under stress, so I'm gonna wait till a couple of days later.
SPEAKER_03:Literally, yeah, I do this.
SPEAKER_00:But then I can feel my t chest being tight saying that. Like, okay, is that healthy though?
SPEAKER_03:Definitely not. I mean, that's definitely something that I'm trying to work on. I think, you know what? Actually, I I one of my resolutions, I'm not setting this in stone because I don't want to pigeonhole myself right now, but I think the top spot right now for resolution for me is get more sleep. And I think like my entire life I've sacrificed my own sleep for everything else. Yep. You know, like especially in college, I would, I was like, you know, there there's that uh Venn diagram where like you can either have uh social life, money, or sleep, and you can't have all three. And I was like, well, definitely cutting sleep out, you know, I'm working full time, going to school full time, and I would go out party all the time. I'd stay up till five in the morning knowing I had to work at 6 a.m. You know, like go straight to work from the bar basically, or from my house or from a friend's house, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and I know your sleep isn't still great because I'll wake up in the morning and like you got done editing an episode at like midnight or whatever.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And then with your casino job, like you were out late a lot, I feel like.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and that's like something that I'm really trying to work on too, because like having my own business, but also like not having the confidence to do that completely full-time and still relying on having a full-time job, you know. Like I obviously I have to give them the time that they need and want from me. So a lot of times I can't work on stuff until after my kids go to sleep because they'd also deserve some time, and then my wife also deserves some time, and so it's like this this pie only has so many slices. And so if sleep is one of these slices, I feel like that's the easiest one for me to neglect.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Or get rid of the fastest, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Somebody told me this morning, though, about um this book, the war of art.
SPEAKER_03:I've read it, yeah. Or I listened to it on audiobook.
SPEAKER_00:And that's about procrastinating, right?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so it's like uh the muse, you know, like how um distraction is the enemy, basically. Yeah, and how distraction is basically the enemy of everything you want to get done. It's how I kind of interpreted it. And it's like any little distraction takes you out of anything that takes you out of flow state, basically, like what you're actively working on and locked in on, that is what you need to go to war against, you know?
SPEAKER_00:Cause yeah, I told you that last night. Like I didn't start working on your episode, like the outline until last night, but what like because I just kept pushing it off and pushing it off. But once I started, it was the funnest thing. I was like freaking out, doing my hand thing, like this is the funnest thing, like you know. So why did I wait till last second? Because then I didn't sleep good because I was like needed to wake up early and double check it again, whatever. Anyways, um, I think so. My a week ago, when people asked me what my resolution was gonna be, I was like, no, I make a resolution every Sunday and fail by Tuesday. Like, I'm not doing a resolution. But then after watching a few episodes that happen to be about resolutions and everything, I decided, like, this is crazy, but I'm gonna finish 50 books this year.
SPEAKER_03:Dang.
SPEAKER_00:Not read 50 because I have at least a dozen that are halfway through. So like, you know, kind of one a week. That's kind of crazy. That's a lot. A little less than one a week. Some of them are gonna be small, some of them ones that I've read before, and at least a dozen that I'm halfway through. Audiobooks count, but what I did is where my bed is and my TV is right here, and then my white wall, because I want to paint it next year. I wrote one through 50, and I'm gonna write every book that I finish there. And so then it's gonna be like, okay, I want to watch TV. Like, no, that wall is gonna be staring at me.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Because just think what knowledge I'll have in a year. Yeah. If I can read 50 freaking books, right? Like this is the year to do it. I don't have kids, I don't have grandkids yet. I don't have an annoying, significant other trying to get me to do other things. Like, this is the year to do it. So I'm committed, and yeah, on diary of a CEO, they're like, you have to give something up. So mine's easy, it's just like TV. Yeah, I'm not a huge scroller, but I obviously could last.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, definitely. That is one of my biggest detriments is that I do mindlessly scroll all the time under the guise of I'm researching.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, right, right.
SPEAKER_03:With my brain is such a good way to stay on top of current events and what's going on and best practices on social media and what posts are performing well from other people and why are they performing well.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:That's always in the back of my mind, like you need to be doing this.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But I'm still absorbing mindless content for hours. So I think that's what I need to cut out.
SPEAKER_00:But if you quit your other job, if you quit your job, and then this was part of your job from two to four every day, I scroll because it's part of my job. And then you won't be doing it at night or times that you don't want to.
SPEAKER_03:True. Yeah, and I have to be more intentional with it too, where it's like from this time to this time, I'm gonna look up these specific pages. That's what I used to do and analyze real data, not just scroll. Because I find myself like watching videos and like actually just getting sucked in. But the craziest part is too, I listened to this one podcast talking about like if you scroll even under the guise of your researching or trying to get something else out of it. Think back like, do you remember those videos that you even watched? No, no, maybe one, yeah, but like I don't remember like that's just time gone that you just deleted.
SPEAKER_00:There's too much information for you to be able to retain it all.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, our brains aren't meant to handle that. Yeah, you're not supposed to have a hundred different points of information in 30 seconds, right? You know, you just can't retain that.
SPEAKER_00:No, the ones that I really want to remember I save and say I'm gonna go back and watch again and don't, because that my brain wants no.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, my watch later on my YouTube is crazy.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, isn't it like four thousand?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it's thousands of videos on my watch later. Some of them I did watch and I just don't delete it off my watch later, so it's not all, but I'm gonna say three-fourths of that is videos that I have not watched. That at some point I was like, oh, that's really interesting. I'm gonna watch that later.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I just never did.
SPEAKER_00:I have to delete them or it stresses me out if I watch them, but I have like at least a hundred in there just from this year.
SPEAKER_03:Like, yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, it's actually nuts. I mean, it's an interesting time that we're living in now with AI too, because on YouTube now they give you the AI summary of some of the videos. And so I've Find myself like now, like this is really interesting if it'll say like top 10 books I read in 2020, yeah, 2025. But you know, this is what I got out of it. And I'll just find myself like instead of watching the hour and a half long show, I will literally read the AI sound and be like, All right, I'm good. I don't need to watch that now.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I've been like the worst and typed in an episode named AI and be like, okay, it says this expert is gonna tell me this. Can you just tell me what they're gonna tell me? So I don't have to watch, you know, like that's so horrible as somebody who I want people to watch my videos, but I know there's just not enough time for everything.
SPEAKER_03:No, there's not. There's not enough time in the day, is the problem. And especially with podcasts in general, like the standard being an hour to three hours, like I'd only want to just watch the pieces that are relevant to me. But the like the hidden gem of it is like a lot of times when I watch the full episode, there's plenty that I get out of it that I didn't know that was in there or that I needed to hear, you know.
SPEAKER_00:And if after one I write something down that I if I've written down one thing that I remember, like I feel like that's was a successful podcast time.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so I mean this goes back to like the like the guise of saying that I'm researching before I started my podcast. I had never listened to a single podcast.
SPEAKER_00:Really?
SPEAKER_03:When we recorded our first episode, I had never listened to a podcast.
SPEAKER_00:I just I didn't until 2020 either, so yeah, it makes sense.
SPEAKER_03:I just knew that people talked, yeah, and that was it. Yeah, and I was like, we can talk. That was that was the start. Then I'm like, okay, now I need to understand the what the quote unquote the podcast is. So then it like that's all I did. And now I listen to podcasts more than music, even in the car, car especially, because I'm driving a lot. But yeah, it's such a strange thing.
SPEAKER_00:So the other resolution that I'm doing right on the next wall next to that, I have um days that I didn't go to the gym. And yesterday I didn't want to go to the gym, but I'm like, then I will put a mark there. And I don't have a bathroom on my main floor. So people that come over have to go upstairs and walk in my bedroom to go to the bathroom. So I'm like, not just for myself, but it'll be embarrassing if there's like a hundred marks in there this year, you know? So that's my motivation too. And it's written in marker on my white wall, so I have to look at that all year. If you see me like bringing some paint home, Veda call me out.
SPEAKER_03:Have you read Atomic Habits by James Clear?
SPEAKER_00:That is definitely this month's book. Like it's so good. I want to finish Creative Act, this awake book, yeah, Atomic Habits, The Art War of Art. Devin gave me an AI book. He wants me to read for work. So yeah. I mean, it's just crazy. I have to do that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so in Atomic Habits, that's one of like the biggest quotes that people always quote from it. I think it was in that Chris Williamson, Stephen Bartlett podcast, too. One miss day of whatever you want to do. The gym typically is what people reference us in, but one miss day is an error, two miss days is a habit. So, like, give yourself some leeway because the problem with a lot of resolutions is that like when people say, I'm gonna go to the gym every day and they miss one day, you're done.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Like that ends it. Right. And then you have an excuse to not go for the rest of the year.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:So it's more like building the habit, you know. So like that's one thing that I've really tried to maintain where it's like you can take a day off, but don't take two days off, you know? And that seems to work for me.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And then I have on other walls I have all these other check marks I can make. Like if I walk down to the river, I can give myself a check mark if I journal, if I meditate for 10 minutes, if I do breathing exercises, so then I get that dopamine from making the check. And I want to walk by it and see as many checks as possible by the end of next year. Like I'll paint on New Year's Day.
SPEAKER_03:Have you ever done an insights discovery test?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Like your colors or whatever it is. Like red, blue, green, yellow.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Do you know what you are?
SPEAKER_00:I can't remember right now, but yeah, I've done a bunch of tests like that.
SPEAKER_03:At the casino, that's like a big part of the gig. I think any big corporate job that's like insights discovery is important because then they know how to communicate with you, whatever. I'm like 90% yellow, you know, which is like super extroverted. My biggest eye-opening, I always thought this was like really woo-woo, and like I'm you can't pigeonhole me to a specific personality, whatever. But um, this was like really eye-opening for me because it said like, my my uh advantages are that I can pick up tasks and run with it really quick, that I can go all in and make a good quality product if it's a project that I'm working on. But my disadvantages is that I always lack preparation and that I lack the ability to stay analytical. So when you talk about like making check marks, do you find yourself having it be bothersome at all? Because if I hold myself to that kind of regimen, I find myself like annoyed with having to task myself on that.
SPEAKER_00:No, I love check marks more than anything. Like I love having a list of things to do and cross them off or check them off. So this is perfect for me.
SPEAKER_03:Interesting. Yeah, everyone is so different, so that's always so interesting to me.
SPEAKER_00:Right. That's not true.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I would I would be curious to know what your what your color is on the insight thing, you know?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I'll have to look it up. I know the color test I took when I worked at Lakes and Pines, and that was like 2012, so I'm not sure. But like other networking things I do, there's other tests like that to take. And yeah, I love personality tests.
SPEAKER_03:I do too. I've always thought they were kind of silly that they like didn't really matter.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Until this insights one, and I'm like, damn, this is like how do you think I'm reading through this? I'm like, this really is me. Like all the good and all the bad. I was like, wow, this is really eye-opening.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And my wife and I couldn't be more opposite in that regard, you know?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Especially like how we were raised is so different too, that like how we communicate is so different. That like looking back to when we first got together, that's like a lot of these friction points are just we're two totally different personalities.
SPEAKER_00:That's why it's so helpful to know what your personality is, and everybody at work should have like a color above their desk. So it can be like, oh, that's why they didn't do that.
SPEAKER_02:Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_00:That's why like they literally don't c care about cleaning their washing their dishes after themselves because their brain doesn't work that way. Yeah. Instead of like being mad at them, like give them some more space or whatever. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:When I first took that insights test, they had this app called Clover that would like input everyone's insight data into it. And then if you had a meeting coming up with one person, it would tell you like how they effectively communicate and how you should present ideas to them and how you should collaborate with them. That's all. So, like there was this girl that I work with. I don't want to name her just in case she listens to this, but we I feel like really butted heads. Not that I didn't like her, but I just didn't like communicating with her because it was always like she has a much different idea of on how this needs to go. And it's like, don't tell me what I need to do. Like, I know how to do my job, like, don't do my job for me. But come to find out, she's just the exact opposite of me. She's like 90% blue, which is more analytical, more planning, more, you know, the execution part for her is so small. Whereas for me, it's like that's the whole thing is the execution. Like, screw planning, like, let's just do it.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I'm just gonna do it.
SPEAKER_03:But she's the opposite. So it's it's really interesting to see those little things and like how you should be talking to people because like they'll not only will they listen better, but you'll probably have a much better experience because you're like speaking their language, you know? Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_00:And then that just helps us be open-minded with the next person.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:The next person.
SPEAKER_03:Definitely, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I love that. Well, you sent me the modern wisdom annual review that they talked about in that episode. So, my favorite questions from that, did you fill it out?
SPEAKER_03:I'm like 75% of the way through it. Okay, it's a lot longer than I expected.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I only filled out like half of them. Like half of them, I'm like, this doesn't even pertain to me, whatever.
SPEAKER_03:But yeah.
SPEAKER_00:What habit or system accounted for most of your success in the last year?
SPEAKER_03:Sleep. No doubt. Wow. This is what made me think of sleep needs to be a priority for 2026 for me. I think partially just because I'm getting older and I noticed a lot more. At 21, I could literally get no sleep and still function to what I I mean, looking back, maybe it wasn't even really functioning, but what I thought was optimal, like I could convince myself I am totally wide awake, I'm totally fine off of no sleep, like not sleeping at all, and just going straight to work from my friend's house, like I was talking about.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But looking at 2025, every single time that I got a good night's sleep, I always was more efficient the next day. I think clearer, I do better work, I'm way less agitated, like I'm nicer to everyone, you know. Like I definitely get in modes, especially at home with my wife, where it's like, if I'm super stressed out, like I get really snappy, you know, like something's out of place, and I'm just like, oh my god, this is like the end of the whole day, you know. And it's like I don't get that way when I'm not tired, yeah, or stressed out, but I think stress directly correlates with it too.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, get an aura ring.
SPEAKER_03:I have it.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, how long have you had it?
SPEAKER_03:I got it like last summer, probably.
SPEAKER_00:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:Taylor convinced me because my watch was broken, my Apple watch broke, and I was like, actually, no, it was September because it was when I got my new phone. Um, Taylor's like, you should just get an aura ring. That doesn't give you notifications because that's like the distraction.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I think it is so cool, specifically for the sleep and the stress thing, like tracking my sleep and my stress. And that has been a big eye-opener too. Like, yeah, the more I sleep, the less stressed the next day I am. Every single time. It's a no-brainer.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, same thing. If I don't get enough sleep and then I see one thing out of place, it's like everything crashes. I have to clean every cover, like, and I don't because I calmed down before, but in my head, I'm like, I have to burn my whole house down and clean it, you know? It's so funny how it adds up like that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it's like the most important thing, and it's the thing that I've neglected my entire life. It's the easiest thing to throw away. Right. It's like the one thing you can control. And I just never do it. So yeah, okay. You know what? I am pigeonholing myself. I am, I'm just gonna sleep more. Sleep. Sleep.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, what would you do this year if you wanted to make 85-year-old you miserable?
SPEAKER_03:Sleep less.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_03:Definitely.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I would say this was one of those questions on the sheet when I'm going through, and like, this is kind of eye-opening.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I would work out less. You know, I've definitely been slacking. We've been taking so many trips lately, and the kids have been so busy and going through these like phases where they just need more attention from us. And I've I've, you know, been less active than I have been the last like year in total, in the last like four or five weeks, probably. And I notice it. Like my attention is less, my productivity is less. I'm not optimizing myself to get more work done or better work done. I'm just kind of like coasting, you know. So I think if I wanted 85-year-old me to hate me, I would work out less and I would sleep less. I think those are two of the most important things. And they're so simple and it sounds so canned.
SPEAKER_00:And you feel so good with both of them.
SPEAKER_03:I've heard it so many times in my entire life, but now is the first time in my entire life that I really truly believe that. Like sleep and activity are the most important things. Because like if I go to the gym in the morning, hit the sauna, and then shower, and I like start the day with like a workout, I'm clean, it's like whoa. I'm so focused and I'm so present that it's like kind of a life hack.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's why, yeah. Maybe I should journal every day in the morning, and the days that I don't start my days like that, I'll realize, I'll be able to look back and realize how much worse I feel because I know that's so true.
SPEAKER_03:It's so important.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Hey, are you a stoic? Are you into the stoics?
SPEAKER_03:I mean, um kind of. I think I'm too emotional to like really buy into it. You know, I would love to be, but I think I'm too emotionally driven.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:Like I think that's I don't even know if this is true or not, but this feels like that's what makes me high performing when I'm stressed out because I care and I get emotional about what I'm doing, you know? Yeah. Not necessarily sad when I say emotional, but just like I care and that's what makes me perform more. So I think I've kind of just like perpetually put myself in this spot of being emotional to the point where like that's what it determines my motivation. Does that make sense? But I don't know. Are you yeah?
SPEAKER_00:I'm well, I want to be more Marcus Aurelius' biggest thing is journaling, and he says that's like the key to success.
SPEAKER_03:That for me feels so analytical, and I I want to so bad. Yeah, I've had this journaling app on my phone for like three years, and I've never used it once. Yeah, it feels like so I'm put like putting myself in this box of box of like you have to do this task today. And I don't know why.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and it doesn't feel good to even tell myself what I have to do. I don't want anybody telling me what to do, let alone myself.
SPEAKER_03:I'm really bad with authority in that regard too. And even myself, like if I'm trying to pose tasks on myself, like yeah, I'm really hard with that. So I can't. Do you journal every day?
SPEAKER_00:That's one of my things that I'll give myself a check mark when I do, because when I have looked back at journals, I've like been so surprised at what I said and what I felt in the past that I'm like, okay, that you forget it does sound important. So that is the goal of the journal. Every day I just haven't really decided what time of the day I want. So I'm thinking, yeah, in the morning, so I can look back and be like, every day that you start your day how you want to. And then it's like, yeah, what is more important than sleep or exercise? Because it's really hard for me to wrap my head around that I should sleep in instead of waking up and exercising. But sleep is so important too. It is.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so it's like if you have to pick, what do you pick? I never ever considered journaling until I read the book Green Lice by Matthew McConaughey. And I remember thinking, like, dang, this guy's journaled for like 35 years, or maybe it was longer, I can't remember. Every single day, never miss a day. And I was like, wow, the insights that he got for this book from doing that for so long and like seeing these patterns, like that is so valuable. But then I'm thinking, like, where would I keep all that? Like if I lose it, or if it burns, or if something happens, in the app, it should never go anywhere. Yeah, I know. Yeah, yeah, and I still don't do it. I should start. Maybe that'll be a 2026 thing.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. The last question from that annual review that I liked was knowing what you know now, what advice would you give yourself 12 months ago?
SPEAKER_03:Care less about what other people think because everyone else is too worried about caring about themselves, anyways? Like they don't even notice what you're doing. Why are you so focused on their opinion of you if it really doesn't matter? It feels so huge in the moment, but later on you realize how small it is, and how much that that impacted your happiness at the time, too. One quote from that diary of a CEO episode with Chris Williamson that really stuck out to me was I can't remember who it was from, but it's it said let go or get dragged. That is like so true. Like you have to let go of everyone's opinion, otherwise you just keep getting dragged behind this idea, and you're just constantly getting beat up for it, only to realize like, why did you even hang on in the first place?
SPEAKER_00:On my notes app, that's the first thing that's penned. It says let go or be dragged.
SPEAKER_03:So good. It's really true. Have you read The Alchemist?
SPEAKER_01:Mm-mm.
SPEAKER_03:That's on my list. I haven't read it yet, but I just listened to this like synopsis of what it means, you know. It's basically like this guy goes on the super long journey only to realize like what he really wanted was right where he was in the beginning. And I think like that goes really along well with let go or get dragged.
SPEAKER_00:Doesn't he tell that story, uh, Chris Williamson, of like the guy says, Oh, I'm probably gonna butcher this, but he's like, Oh, you should do this so that you can do this, and then he says, Spanish uh with the Spanish fisherman. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:An American fisherman meets a Spanish fisherman, and uh the Spanish fisherman is just fishing by himself every day. And the American says, You should hire your friends to fish for you so you can sell the fish, and then you can afford to um buy more boats, and then you can afford to pay more people, and then you can commercialize it and sell your fish at the markets, and then you can have more time with your family. But it's like he already has time with his family, so why would he want to do that?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and he already gets to fish, which he loves to do. Like you'll have more time for your family and a fish. Like, that's what I do right now. Why would I do all those?
SPEAKER_03:Exactly. It's like capitalism injected into every idea, you know? And maybe that's the wrong way to think about it, but that's always my mentality goes there too, and it's so bad. And that's one thing that I realized with getting into media and digital creative, is that like when you commercialize your hobby, it changes your perspective over time of it. And it definitely changes the way that you uh do it because it can't necessarily be a hobby anymore. And so you really have to be careful when you're commercializing your hobbies or trying to make money off of your hobbies. And that was something that I always grew up. I grew up in a in a bar and restaurant. My family owns Wings North in Pine City, and uh it's a hunting club. So like top priority was like, we're working, but we're gonna have fun while we work, because it was always like friends and family are the members of Wings North, you know? So my whole philosophy growing up is like you have to love what you do, so just convince yourself that it's fun, and it will be fun, and that basically just everything is perspective, you know. So, like someone would kill to just be happy working, so just be happy doing what you're doing, but now I've realized like switching gears from now doing something that I just genuinely love doing and making money on that, it changes things for sure. Like, we were just talking about this on family vacation. My grandma was gonna hire a professional photographer to take pictures of us on the beach when we went on vacation to go visit my grandparents, and it was the first time that our whole, my dad's whole side of the family was like together in one spot, especially now that we all have kids and it's just as hard. So my grandma was gonna hire a professional photographer. I'm like, no way, like I'll just bring my camera and tripod. And then I had my camera there, so I was like, why don't I just take pictures of everyone's kids and their families individually and just like candids around the house when I think of it and whatever. And then my wife and I got to talking about like, why don't you ever bring your camera on tripod? Like these photos are awesome. And then I started thinking, like, damn, it kind of feels like work. Like this is what I do for work. So like I don't want to do that. It was fun once I'm doing it. Cause then I remembered, like, oh, I do enjoy doing this. And that's how I started doing it.
SPEAKER_00:Well, if you think of it as work, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So that's like the boundary of commercializing your art or commercializing your hobby.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:It's definitely a slippery slope.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Because I'm sure a lot of people would have a better time with this than I would, but I definitely get in this mode of like, it feels like work. I don't really want to do it. But that's what I love to do. So like it's this weird paradox.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. My mom talked about, oh, you could move to Duluth because it's so beautiful, but then it's not gonna be as it's not gonna be this beautiful place to go visit.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:It's kind of like that.
SPEAKER_03:Totally.
SPEAKER_00:So I guess it just depends on the people because some people probably wake up in Duluth every morning and are happy they're there.
SPEAKER_03:I totally agree. When I was a kid, my parents split up when I was like six years old. And not long after that, my mom moved to North Dakota because that's where she's from. So I only got to go visit her like once or twice a year. So every time that I was there, I was like, this place is awesome. You know, like my mom would let me sleep in all the time and I could stay out as late as I wanted, and I could eat whatever I wanted and do whatever I wanted. She always bought me like the new Xbox and the new games, and it was so much fun. So when I went to college, I was like, I'm moving to Grand Forks, North Dakota, because that place is awesome. And then I live there, not that it wasn't awesome, I do actually genuinely love the town, but it's not the same because it's not this once a year thing. It's now I'm here all the time. So it changes your perspective on it for sure. Yeah, so I could see that. Yeah, if you move to Duluth, it's no longer this like really beautiful fall tourist area. It's your home that just gets really busy when the trees turn pretty. You know, it's like a totally different perspective.
SPEAKER_00:So yeah, I guess you have to think about that when you're deciding what to do with your life. You know, is this gonna ruin this hobby for me or is it gonna mean that I love what I do all day, every day? And maybe we can all have either one. It's just a mind state shift.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it's so tough because again, it's just one of those things that's all perspective. Because when I was selling cars, I would have told you like I will literally give anything to be doing creative work all day and not sell cars.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But now that I am doing creative work all day, every day, I'm like, damn, some some structure being able to clock out at 5 p.m. would be kind of cool. You know? Now it's just myself putting my own schedule together. And it's like I definitely don't clock out at 5 p.m. and my phone never leaves my pocket, you know. Or it's I mean, it always leaves my pocket, I'm always on it because I'm always answering emails, texts, whatever, you know. So like that's just like that's just part of it. But starting the podcast in 2020, I remember thinking, like, if I could pay my bills because of doing something that I love, like that would change my whole life. And I do think that that, I do think that that did. I think that's real happiness. Like being able to sustain your lifestyle with doing what you choose to do versus something that you feel like you have to do, like that to me unlocked a different part of my brain, no doubt.
SPEAKER_00:I always tell people, be careful when you tell me about your dreams because I'm gonna be the one that's like pushing you to do it constantly. You know, I've kind of done that to you. I like backed off because I understand. Um, like you just have to let people do what they want to do. And I mean, this is a new perspective too of maybe if things are a hobby for people, I shouldn't push them. Like, but yeah, growing up in a family business, it's like I just my brain automatically goes to like how do you monetize everything?
SPEAKER_03:Same.
SPEAKER_00:Because work is fun. Yeah, let's make it fun.
SPEAKER_03:So yeah, and also like the ability to find the small pieces that you can capitalize on too is that's definitely kind of a superpower because a lot of people do things for free to the detriment of their own lifestyle or their own happiness, because like if you can't sustain what you're doing and you have to give it up, that's almost worse.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but the other side is like we talked about on an episode a week or two ago with Veda, or like talking about how I talked about with Veda that um you should write just to write, not to make a thing out of it, too, you know. So it's like, I don't know, both sides.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and it's tough because for me, like that insertion into my life would be like you should just make videos to make videos. Yeah. Who cares if you make money on it? Then I'm like, dang, okay, well, that eight hours to two days worth of work that I put into that, I could have been spent making money on something or doing something for someone else that they're willing to pay me for, or whatever. And that money that I get from that I could use to better my family or like my lifestyle or save for my kids' future or whatever, you know. So, and I think that's a slippery slope because you can really put yourself in a bad mental state under the guise of I'm doing it to better myself, but you're not really bettering yourself, you know? I'm definitely guilty of that.
SPEAKER_00:It's such a balance. I heard and I can see it, that when that you have an insane drive and commitment to every wild idea that comes to your mind. Do you have any examples? And where do you think this comes from?
SPEAKER_03:Well, the podcast for sure. Like just I wanted to in my mind, and it it's changed form so many times, but in 2020, I wanted so badly to be like the guy, the go-to guy for like I want a creative ad agency to do this video for me. Like, who do I talk to? Like, I wanted to be like, oh, Cody is who I need to talk to to do this. You know, like I wanted that so bad that, like I said, I hadn't even listened to a single podcast. I was like, I just know that they're about to that they're talking. You can talk about anything. So if that's the only difference, that's what I'll do. And I remember without even knowing how to run any of the equipment or how anything even gets connected, I ordered microphones, mic stands, a board, memory cards. I had done a little bit of videography work, so like our you know, so I kind of knew an idea of how it worked, I knew the camera side. I was like, how hard would audio be to figure out? So literally just bought everything. I mean, like I had basically no money to my name, and I spent$2,500 on all the podcast equipment. I'm like, we're podcasters now, to me and three of my friends. They're like, oh, okay. Yeah. And then a couple months later, bought a studio, bought an office that they're like, we're not even making any money. Like, where why are you renting this place? I was paying someone to help me edit it because I was selling cars full-time, and that became way too much. I'm like, I am just gonna have to learn it myself. I cannot afford to pay this person. Like, I'm bleeding myself dry. I cannot do this. And so, yeah, basically just went all in until it worked. And my whole mindset the entire time was that it the only way that it can't work is if I stop doing it. But it led me to some crazy paths. I mean, um, I worked at You Bet You, which is like the biggest Midwest podcast and content channel, you know, probably ever, in the terms of the internet in the Midwest, I guess. And that was strictly because of the podcast. Like Miles was our 10th guest on the podcast, 10th episode. I paid$300 to have him on, and and we just kind of hit it off, me and his business manager at the time. And then I would just like she did a terrible mistake giving me her phone number because I would text her, be like, Hey, how does this work? Like, how do you how do you get people to pay you to read ads? How do you get people to edit? Like, how do you train someone in? How do you do like more of like the logistics of it? I would text her all the time and she'd be like, I don't have time to text you back, call me at five. And so I'd call her and I'd just talk her ear off. She'd finally be like, All right, you're just gonna have to talk to Tyler, which is now the the manager there, the me the content manager. And um, yeah, basically they started some golf channel and um met up with them in Fargo because we're like, hey, we should do some sort of a collaboration. And so we like had them on our podcast, and as a joke, we're like, Yeah, we're coming up there tomorrow. We're gonna go golf at a simulator with you guys and we're gonna beat you or whatever, completely as a joke. And they're like, All right, see you tomorrow. So we're like, well, now we gotta do it. Like, this is such a cool opportunity to go hang out with these guys that we're genuinely fans of, and we really hit it off, and they're like, Hey, we got a job opening coming up, like you should move up here. I was like, Taylor's gonna kill me. So we had just bought a house not that long before in Pine City. I was like, damn. All right, we're gonna sell the house, sold it to a friend, and then moved to Fargo. I lived there by myself for six months, and then Taylor moved up there. She had just finished school, she had like three months left of school. So she moves up there, and then like after a month of her living there, I'm like, hey, I don't think I want to work here anymore. I kind of want to do my own thing. I was like, I feel like, and this is definitely a mindset thing at the time. I don't I don't think I would feel that way at this point, but I was like, I feel like I'm doing 90% of the work for 1% of the reward. Like I I just want to do this for myself. And so she's like, You're joking. Like I literally moved my entire life four hours away, and now you want to leave? And so, yeah, I left and then just started my own thing. And the podcast did really, really good right after that because I just like literally went all in for like four months, probably. That's all I did full-time, worked on the podcast, probably 60 hours, 70 hours, 80 hours a week into it at some points, and it was doing really good, getting really good traction, millions of views, ton of advertising dollars. Like it was so much fun. But then it's like we just got we just started getting older, and like my friends started, it was like uh the channel was all about like a beer drinking, basically like conversations you would have at a bar with your friend, and that was kind of all we did was like hang out at the bar and have fun. And none of us had kids, and none of us had wives, and now between us, there's you know, three of us are married, there's six kids between all four of us, so it just like slowly but surely one by one, everyone kind of started backing out, and I just stayed with it, but again, to the detriment of my sleep, of my hobbies, of you know, probably my relationship. And so it was just easier to be like, you know what, I'm just gonna do it when I want to do it. But now I'm just so busy, we just don't do it. The last time we recorded, I think was like March of last year. It's coming up on almost a year of no recording.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's yeah. It's like casual, but the discipline is important for a reason because then if you don't have that, like when are you gonna do it?
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_00:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so it's so tough. I don't know. I don't even remember what you asked. I feel like I just kind of rambled on you.
SPEAKER_00:Well, I hope you don't lose that insane drive for if like in your 30s now, because it gets harder. I mean, the young for me at least, I did all sorts of wild stuff in my 20s and 30s, and it just gets harder though. You would think like because you've done it, you'll be able to do it more. But you get older and things get scarier, and it's harder to take risks.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:So it really is. Look at all the paths that that brought you on by going all out on that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, very true. Had I never accepted that job, I would have been like, that would have been my what if for the rest of my life. Like, what if I would have done that? And it was so cool. I think had I got that job right out of high school, I probably would still be there to this day. Because it was so cool getting to meet all these celebrities and going on these trips and getting to golf for my job. Like, just go video people golfing for my job and hanging out with the guys. Like, there's a huge beer fridge that we had a deal with Bush Light at the time. Huge beer fridge that gets restocked every single month with a pallet of Bush Light, and you can drink at work. The only prerequisite is that you just had to get your work done. Like, done, easy.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I'll do that, you know.
SPEAKER_00:So does any part of you wish that you were still there?
SPEAKER_03:I mean, a little bit, but I think that would be a lot different now than it was at the time because at the time I was kind of like the youngest guy there. I was new, I had fresh ideas, I had like I was the first million view video they got with Breakfast Ball, their golf channel. So like that was like a big accomplishment. But I think it would look much different now. I think I would have a much more reserved take on it before I was like, I'm willing to do anything. I will stay here till three in the morning. And I did. I would stay there till like three, four in the morning editing and then get there again at six in the morning to start editing again. Like I was just excited, I was fired up. But now having kids, like that's the time that I would rather be with my kids than working on that. So I think it would be much different now. If the money was better, maybe I would consider it, but I don't know. It's tough to say.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:It's for me, it's like while I don't make, you know, an unlimited amount of money now, the opportunity is so much higher if there's no ceiling on it. And just the opportunity, the muse of this opportunity, regardless if it's really there or not, just the idea of it being there for me is enough to make me not want to work for someone else. I guess, without the opportunity to feel like I want to earn more. Because before I had left, you betcha, I did approach them two separate times and say, hey, I love this job. I will literally do anything. I just want to make more money. Like, that's my thing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I'm living paycheck to paycheck. I love what I'm doing, but I live paycheck to paycheck.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And I was living in an apartment. I didn't have anything besides a car payment. I'm like, I feel like I should be able to save money. I don't have anything, you know? Not that's what it was about, but it was like, I want to be able to like save money. I want to be able to buy a house at some point if I'm gonna stay here. I don't want to live in an apartment forever.
SPEAKER_00:And growing up in a business family, yeah, I'm sure.
SPEAKER_03:Definitely. That was like, I will literally do anything you want me to do. I just need to make more money. And it was like small raises. And then the second time I'm like, I'm just I gotta go do my own thing.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Can you tell me about the spaghetti theory? I don't know anything about it.
SPEAKER_03:The spaghetti theory, yeah. So you just throw uh, you know, when you're cooking noodles, how you can tell if it's done is when you throw it at the cupboard and it sticks. That's how you know that the spaghetti's done. So basically the spaghetti theory is like you throw a bunch of noodles at the wall until one sticks, and then that's your thing, you know? So that's my interpretation of the spaghetti theory, I guess. That maybe that's not even the right explanation. That's how I've always taken it. It's like you just keep going and keep going and keep going, keep going until something works, then it's like done triple down on that thing.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. I like it. Um, what do you think life wants out of you?
SPEAKER_03:I don't even know. I know you asked me this question. I'm having a tough time thinking about this because I think selfishly, I want it to be like my work is like what life wants out of me. But I think it's probably more on like me helping people achieve their own creative aspirations.
SPEAKER_00:Why do you think that? Why is it wrong to think that your own work can't be beautiful and change lives?
SPEAKER_03:I think a lot of it is that I'm so hard on myself about the perfectionist aspect of everything that I do, especially if it's for myself, that it's just never good enough. Like it's never done. Basically, I just pick a point where it's like, alright, I'll re I'll I'll just stop here.
SPEAKER_00:What would Reck Rubin say about that?
SPEAKER_03:He probably wouldn't agree with that. Yeah, that would definitely not be kosher with the creative act, that's for sure. Um That is one thing in the Creative Act that they that he does say is like nothing really is done. You just decide when it's done. Because the more you keep touching it, the more you keep working with it, the worse it gets. You just have to find a good point that you're like satisfied with. And I feel like I just don't ever get that with my own work for some reason.
SPEAKER_00:Maybe you need a theme for your journaling, and maybe it could be that like trying to change your mind state, like how every day, how what can I write about every day that will change my mind state into believing that my work is just as important as helping other people. I mean, I think the point to life is service, so I think you're on to something there too. But how you said that made me think that you just need to accept that you also have the art inside of you that the world needs to see.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. You're probably right. You're probably right, but that's really, really, really hard for my mind to wrap around for some reason.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, I think it is most people, including me. I'm not preaching.
SPEAKER_03:Part of it, I think, for me is also like um I'm very self-aware. And I think like I'm a very big critic of myself. And anything that I put out, like I said, if I look back at something that I did myself for myself, like a year ago, I'm like, oh god, I would change so much about this. So I think that's partially a deterrence for me too, you know?
SPEAKER_00:What excited you most when you were a kid?
SPEAKER_03:I think like learning new things. I remember like getting this philosophy book from my aunt. I think it was an accident, even I don't even know if she meant to give it to me, but it was called the the I know I'm butchering this name, I always say it wrong. The Tao of Piglet. The Ta Tae of Piglet.
SPEAKER_00:Tao.
SPEAKER_03:Tao of Piglet. It's like it's a Chinese philosophy book.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And I remember reading this at like 10 years old.
SPEAKER_01:Wow.
SPEAKER_03:And being like, whoa, this is wild. And there's a there's a poo one too. There's a piglet one and a poo one. And I read both of them really young, and then um yeah, I guess that really excited me. Like learning new perspectives, like thinking like, oh wow, like how I thought you're supposed to think about things is not really, you know, there's not one way. There's so many perspectives that people can give here about the same thing. Oh, that's why I don't get along with this person, because they view life like this.
SPEAKER_00:My first tattoo was supposed to be the word perspective on my arm because I was obsessed with the idea of different perspectives, also. And that's kind of what you have done with your life. As you're videoing and angling different perspectives and how you see it and how you want other people to see it.
SPEAKER_03:Definitely. I had this this like really funny theory when I was like 12 years old that like if you could read people's thoughts, that you would never be able to understand what they're actually saying because like how they learn about something is totally different from how you learn about something and how they view it. Like if I'm thinking about the color green, I'm thinking about grass, trees, yeah, money, uh whatever, you know. So like that interpretation in thought process is like a to it's not English, you know, so it would just be like a jumbled garbage of memories that you would be like, what the hell is this? Yeah, you know. So I thought to myself, like, dang, if I could like re listen to what the people are thinking, I would have no clue what they're saying.
SPEAKER_00:Wow. I always think about how like even twins will see their mom as a different person. Like nobody sees you as the same person. Your two sons see you as a completely different person, even if they were born at the same time, because they're looking at you from different angles. One of them sees you steal an extra cookie out of the cookie jar and the other one doesn't. That's gonna change their perception of you forever. Yeah, and I'm also So you are a different person, every single person in the world.
SPEAKER_03:Every single moment, yeah. And I'm interacting with them differently too. Yeah, it's wild. It's all perspective, it's crazy.
SPEAKER_00:And even if both kids saw you steal the cookie out of the cookie drawer, their perspective of what that means about you is different. Oh my god. So we are just non like you can never nail down what somebody is because we are just light. We're just a million different peoples, we're just fragments of everybody else's imagination.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, like well, and that's the thing too, because like even your perspective changes based on everyone else's perspective. Collectively, how people interact with you also forms your own opinion of yourself, yeah. And I think that has changed a lot in my mind too. The older that I've got, I've cared less about what other people think because it's like, well, like what I'm doing is it's either working or like whatever way you're trying to impose on me, I know that that doesn't work for my life.
SPEAKER_00:So, like, that doesn't in a hundred years we're all gonna be dead and nobody's gonna know no one's gonna know my name in a hundred years.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I mean, there's such a few so few. I mean, um, how does that quote go? It's like, how many people can you name from a hundred years ago? Yeah, I could probably go five.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Do you know your great great grandparents' names?
SPEAKER_03:Nope. I don't two greats? No, I don't. And that's crazy. It's like without them, I wouldn't be here. They're pretty damn important.
unknown:Right? Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I don't even know what they did.
SPEAKER_00:Right. Um, so I've never asked you what you believe spiritually. Why do you think we came to this planet and to this human form?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that is crazy to think about. I don't know. I spent a lot of time thinking about this when I was a kid. I went to Catholic school from preschool through sixth grade. And I think like being so exposed to that idea of what spirituality is really turned me off of the idea of religion as a structure. And I think I have more of like a fluid idea of what spirituality is to me. Like, I definitely don't think that we're in control of our own destiny from the standpoint of like us as a race, but I do at the same time, I guess. I think I take more of like a like a Buddhist mentality of it, where it's like everything is a net and all the connections on the net, like every point that crosses is a person or an interaction or an idea, and that everything's just kind of connected. All life, you know, the like the earth is living and breathing. You know, I guess like that's kind of my philosophy on it. But even saying it out loud seems like, ugh, I don't even you know what I mean. There's no way to really put it into words, I guess, how I feel. Somewhere in between a regular quote unquote religion and like that, just everything is kind of the same, and we're all kind of the same. Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, well, I believe we're all God, like everything is, every single little atom and molecule.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Experiencing, and it's or the universe, is God or the universe just experiencing life through us.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Like we got put in this body to experience it through this lens.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Yeah, it is weird. I am grateful for growing up in a Catholic faith, you know, just because I think it's like it's very structured. And when you take out the author entirely, like the the rules that really are written in the religion are good to live by. Like, just don't be an asshole. Be good to everyone else. Don't steal. You know, like at its at its basis, it's I think it's cool.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But it feels a little culty when everyone's like singing together in unison and like praising this one guy at the front of the room. It just feels weird to me. I don't like that aspect of it. No, no shade to anyone that does believe in that. It's just like that's not for me for some reason. Not that I don't believe in it, but I just like I don't feel it. I'm like, this feels weird. This feels like I'm a cog in a wheel, unless of like there's meaning to this. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00:I do. Yeah. So you gave me the book, The Creative Act, A Way of Being, by Rick Rubin. And I love every line of the book that I've read. But uh, this is the one I decided to bring up. He says, when we repeat the exercise of opening our senses to what is, we move closer to living in a continually open state. We build a habit, eating meals mindfully, slowing, slowly savoring each bite with appreciation, taking daily walks in nature, looking at everything, entering a field of vision with gratitude and connection, taking time to marvel at the feeling of our heartbeat and the movement of our blood through our veins. Are you good at practicing mindfulness?
SPEAKER_03:No.
SPEAKER_00:Did the book make you want to be?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, definitely. It's like, um, I feel like I keep myself so busy to the point where like that smaller inner voice, I don't hear that a lot. You know? That and it's definitely the most important, but I don't, you know, like there's so much noise that I don't sometimes I sometimes miss the signal. And I think it's because I'm not mindful enough of what is going on. I'm not as present sometimes as what I could be because of that.
SPEAKER_00:And he says the purpose of such exercises is not necessarily in the doing, just as the goal of meditation isn't in meditation. The purpose is to evolve the way that we see the world when we aren't engaged in these acts. We're building the musculature of our psyche to more accurately, acutely tune in.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Just really like that.
SPEAKER_03:The Creative Act is like the best book that I've never read. I've never read it all the way through. Yeah. Because the first time that I ever heard of it was an interview with Rick Rubin and it was with Cole Bennett and him saying that every time you open the book, regardless of where you open it to, it should feel relevant to whatever you have going on at that moment. And every time you get to that same part, it's gonna mean something totally different. And so I've literally never read the book start to finish. I've I think I've listened to the audiobook start to finish, but the book itself, I literally would just like open up a random page and start reading. And I feel like I get so much more out of it from that because it's less like a graphic novel and more like a a rule book, you know, or it's like Bible for art because yeah, you can open up to any page.
SPEAKER_00:The chapter that I read last night didn't really pertain to me, but when Veda got here, we haven't seen each other in a while because it's been Christmas break, and what I read last night pertained to something I was excited to tell her after she brought something up. So just never know.
SPEAKER_03:It's weird how that works. It and it always is like that. It's cool. It's the best book I've never read.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And he says when you're working on a project, you might notice apparent coincidences appearing more often than random randomness allows, almost as if there's another hand guiding yours in a certain direction, as if there is an inner knowing gently informing your moments. Has that ever happened to you?
SPEAKER_03:Definitely, definitely. Yeah, when I started video editing for sure, I noticed that where it's like patterns come up that are like I didn't really think to do that, but it is just that's just the way that it happened because of this other thing that I do or whatever, you know, and it's like that's a weird coincidence.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it's hard to get through the book because it's it's intense because it really makes you want to be more present and more aware, and that's really hard.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, it is. It really is, because it kind of means sacrificing what you think you want. You know?
SPEAKER_00:Mm-hmm. Um, when you aren't feeling creative, what do you do?
SPEAKER_03:When I'm not feeling creative, what do I do? To be honest with you, I don't really feel creative at all. You know, very I would say rarely do I really feel like this is a new idea and this is something that I'm actually creating. I think when I'm not feeling creative, I am in a mode of I guess uh sustainability or like a worker be mentality. You know, like here's the task, get it done. I guess it's either creative or that. But I feel like more in the worker bee mentality.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. So if you acquit your job, you'd have more time for that. Okay, well, now we're gonna get into the segment where I reveal to you how uh you the people in your life see you. So I asked you to give me a list of people I could reach out to to describe you, and then I put those words in a theme so you could see, because I think part of the human experience is that we don't see ourselves as good as other people see us. So do you have any guesses?
SPEAKER_03:I'm kind of nervous. I think like I think the people that I gave you will say that I overwork myself, that I am always busy, and that I fill my plate with a lot.
SPEAKER_00:Well, um, oh, so I'm not sure how many people notice this, that um everything is like themed around an S for Supernacks. Oh yeah. Like every episode starts with an S. And the only reason, so I tell people pick six or seven people, and then they're gonna each give me six or seven words. And it was just like two weeks ago that I'm like, Veda, six, seven. Like that was not on purpose. It's just because they both start with S's, you know. Yeah, but it's so funny. One of your people was like, I can't, I can't narrow it down to six or seven. I need I have like 20 words, and I'm like, that's okay, yeah, you can send me 20.
SPEAKER_03:Um, was that my mom?
SPEAKER_00:Maybe.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I can totally see her saying that.
SPEAKER_00:Um, so yeah, your first word is kind, because four people said kind or kind-hearted, and two said caring, two said sincere, loving, compassionate, generous, giving, selfless, faithful, genuine, honest, understanding, considerate, devoted, trusting, helpful, and dependable. And your second word is kind of might go in with what you pictured is determined, strong-willed, strong-minded, brave, daring, driven, diligent, ambitious, and motivated. So they see it in a good way.
SPEAKER_03:That is a kind way to spin it for sure.
SPEAKER_00:And the third word is uplifting. Three people said optimistic, two said humorous, two said witty, warm, lively, guiding, bright, enthusiastic, outgoing, supportive, dynamic, funny, and silly. And fourth, of course, is creative. Three people said creative and imaginative, innovative, philosophical, wise, open-minded, and passionate. And fifth is charismatic. Um, handsome came up three times, but that was all by the same person.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:She just couldn't stop.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Attractive, alluring, charismatic, muscular, plump. Sure you can guess who said that, and amazing. So your synopsis is that you're the rare harmony of warmth and will. You don't announce your strength, you offer it. Your ideas, your dreams, your humor, your care. You lift others without keeping score. Um, so as far as how I said we're insecure and we don't see ourselves, how other people see us, another Rick Rubin quote was that self-doubt lives in all of us. While we may wish it was gone, it is here to service us. Humans are flawed, and the attraction of art is the humanity held in it. If we were machine-like, the art wouldn't resonate, it would be soulless. With life comes pain, insecurity, and fear. We're all different and all imperfect. The imperfections are what makes each of us and our work interesting. We create pieces reflective to who we are. And if insecurity is part of who we are, then our work will have a greater degree of truth in it as a result. So don't get too cocky about these words. You need to still say insecure. Um, how do you perceive imperfections in your own work? Are you willing to embrace them as opportunities for uniqueness and beauty?
SPEAKER_03:You said you're a perfectionist, so yeah, I'm very hard on myself about imperfections in my work, and I notice it at every single step of the way, whether it be planning, execution, after the fact, like how I'm dealing with people, like I could always tweak what I'm doing and notice downfalls in every aspect of the way. So, not very good.
SPEAKER_00:Okay, sounds like something you can journal about. Are you good at shifting your focus from fixating on the end result to enjoying the process?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that is something that I've definitely learned to be better at the older I've got. But I think part of that is me learning to just not take on things that I just genuinely don't want to do. You know, especially from a creative aspect.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. You don't seem like the kind of person that likes to say no. You want to say yes to everybody. That's part of your kindness. So yeah, yeah, I mean, boundaries, it's an overused term nowadays, but it is so important.
SPEAKER_03:Definitely. Yeah, that is definitely something I struggle with.
SPEAKER_00:But coming from a family like you said, where they like to work, I mean, hopefully in those moments, you're like, am I enjoying this? If I'm not, I need to find something else.
SPEAKER_03:Definitely. Well, and even if I'm not enjoying it, like I'm really good at just disassociating for a little bit to get through it. You know what I mean? Like, if it's really hard work, but it know what needs to get done, like I can just do it. And I can just numb myself for the next five hours or whatever it takes, you know. Like just constantly thinking, like, it'll it'll be done eventually. It's not a big deal.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. But shifting to like, okay, I'm just gonna pretend like I like this.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Maybe.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. When you're editing for supernova.
SPEAKER_03:I do like that. I do like that.
SPEAKER_00:Um, well, my favorite thing about you is the snaps, snapchats of your kids. Because I think if any kids have a chance of growing up happy, it's yours because you let them be kids and you let them be creative and just goofy and silly. And I just love it. I love watching you and Taylor be parents.
SPEAKER_03:That's cool. I appreciate that.
SPEAKER_00:Um, what do you do right now that you hope your grandkids do when they are your age?
SPEAKER_03:I think I could list more things that I would like them to not do.
SPEAKER_00:Well, we'll get that.
SPEAKER_03:That I would do, but that I do I think do things even though you don't want to do them. I think that is a trait that has helped me more than it has hurt me. And not that I necessarily always do that, but there's more times than not where I have done the thing that I just didn't want to do, and it just pays off so much more because that quote, like, to get things that nobody else has, you have to do things that nobody else will. Like that has always kind of been like my true north. Like you have to just do it, even if you don't want to do it. Depending on what it is, obviously. From a work perspective, it's like there's so many people that are unwilling to just show up and just give that a hundred and ten percent effort when they only have eighty. That if you're the one person, like it's a no-brainer, then you're gonna do more, be more, get more. Not necessarily just monetary, but just in life, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Higher reward.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I don't think that there's anything that I regret ever doing just because of that fact, you know. Plenty of times where I'm like, this sucks. I hate this. But once it's done, it's like so rewarding that it negates a hundred other instant gratific gratification things, you know?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Right? What do you do that you hope your grandkids what's one or two things that you do that you hope your grandkids don't do?
SPEAKER_03:That I hope they don't do. I want them to sleep more and and eat better, treat yourself better.
SPEAKER_00:It's gonna be called sleeping something. Yeah. That's the thing.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think like just be kind to yourself, you know, be easier on yourself, sleep more and take care of your body. I guess that would be my three things that's like if you just do that, you'll be alright.
SPEAKER_00:Is there a quote or idea right now that you're mantra in and you're still working on it for this year?
SPEAKER_03:A lot, a lot, honestly. Especially from that diary of a CEO episode with Chris Williamson. I think the let go or be dragged is like it's just keeps coming up in the back of my mind that it's like that makes so much sense.
SPEAKER_00:Do you have a tramp stamp yet? You could tattoo that on your tramp stamp.
SPEAKER_03:I have my wife's name on my butt tattooed on my butt.
SPEAKER_00:Cute.
SPEAKER_03:Um, but you know, I could I could put that on my lower back for sure.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Veda, do you have any questions?
SPEAKER_02:No. No, I don't. Sorry.
SPEAKER_00:That's okay. Anything that we didn't talk about that you wanted to talk about?
SPEAKER_03:I'm trying to think. I guess I did want to ask you a couple questions.
SPEAKER_00:Oh.
SPEAKER_03:In your time of doing supernova. It's been now like how long has it been? A year now?
SPEAKER_00:No, it'll be a year in April or May.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. Nine months-ish. What have you learned in podcasting for nine months-ish?
SPEAKER_00:Well, in general, just that yeah, do the hard scary thing because it gets so much easier. Today I was very nervous because we hadn't recorded in two weeks, and I was surprised at how my heart um beat was kind of going crazy. But otherwise, the last three or four that we've done, I haven't even been nervous. So that's gonna teach me for the rest of my life that I don't have to be as scared or do it because you'll even if you are scared, you'll get less scared. Podcasting in general, I've learned I'm not really the best listener, but when I'm in here, I am a really good listener. So I think um that makes me feel good that there is a space where I can be a really good listener, and um, I just need to bring this space to other parts of my life. Otherwise, um just that it's fun. I mean, I just love it. I love writing the outlines, I love talking to people. I um hope that other people will come try it because it's really fun and it's kind of the future.
SPEAKER_03:It's such a weird thing, too, because there's no other excuse to just like sit down and be fully present nowadays. Even if you like go to lunch with someone, you would never sit down for a full hour plus and not look at your phone or like have some sort of distraction that it's like it's a full plane ticket to just be totally present.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, you're probably right of like, yes, because if I'm trying to have a conversation not doing this, I probably would be thinking, Oh, I should do this, I should do this, who's texting me, who's blah blah blah. But here it feels like it's a balance of work, yes, or I mean it's work, so it's like this is what I'm supposed to be doing, so I can be fully present. So I'm capable of doing it, it's in my brain to be able to do it's just my brain, my my state of mind, so I can do it other places.
SPEAKER_03:It's like a paradox of structured mindfulness, yeah. Like mindfulness in and of itself can't really be structured because it needs to be this organic flowing thing, but putting it in this box allows it to be so much more, which is so weird. Like putting rules on it makes it easier to do, which is so strange. It's like the one thing that feels different.
SPEAKER_00:That's so true. I love that. Um, okay. Well, uh, to tie everything we talked about together, I thought this was a good quote from the Creative Act. Good habits create good art. The way we do anything is the way we do everything. Treat each choice you make, each action you take, each word you speak with skillful care. The goal is to live your life in the service of art.
SPEAKER_03:Amen.
SPEAKER_00:Thanks so much for coming on.
SPEAKER_03:Thanks for having me. This was fun.