Supernaut
Supernaut is a podcast about spirituality, sobriety, and the spectrum of self. Hosted by Beth Kelling, this show explores what it means to seek clarity, connection, and personal truth in a world that rarely slows down.
Since beginning her sobriety journey in 2020, Beth has been diving deeper into spiritual practices, emotional honesty, and all the beautiful, messy layers of identity.
Each episode opens the door to conversations about healing, growth, creativity, intuition, and everything in between — because who we are isn’t fixed, it’s a spectrum.
Beth will be joined by guests who share their own stories, perspectives, and spiritual paths — offering insight, inspiration, and the occasional cosmic detour.
Whether you’re sober-curious, spiritually inclined, or just looking to feel a little more human, you’re in the right place
Supernaut
Seeking Truth with Steve
What happens when siblings separated by fifteen years sit down to explore spiritual questioning, personal growth, and the courage to face our deepest fears? Welcome to the first episode of Supernaught, where host Beth Kelling invites her older brother Steve to share the moment that changed her spiritual trajectory forever.
Growing up in rural Minnesota where even yoga was considered taboo, Beth recalls the pivotal moment she overheard Steve declare he was "renouncing Christianity until he researched every other religion." This single statement opened a door Beth didn't know existed—the permission to question inherited beliefs and find her own spiritual truth.
Steve reveals his decade-long journey away from the narrow religious views of their childhood, where their pastor claimed members of other Christian denominations were "going to hell." He challenges the arbitrary nature of religious affiliation—"Where you're born decides what religion"—and shares how this questioning led him to a place where he now "believes almost nothing" yet finds peace in that uncertainty.
The conversation weaves through mental health territory, exploring how depression stems from both thought patterns and biochemistry. Beth shares her discovery that B vitamins trigger her depression due to a genetic mutation, highlighting how our mental state isn't always within our conscious control.
Most powerfully, the siblings discuss fear as a gateway to growth. Steve passionately advocates for confronting fears directly: "If they recognize something in themselves that creates fear or anxiety, go straight into it instead of avoiding it." Beth reflects on her journey from crying through high school presentations to confidently hosting this podcast, and how initially dreaded experiences like cold plunging have become transformative practices.
The episode concludes with Beth embracing "doing hard things" as her spiritual practice—a fitting philosophy for someone hosting a podcast named after the concept of a "voyager searching and striving for betterment."
Ready to question your assumptions, face your fears, and discover your own authentic path? Subscribe now and join us on this journey of transformation.
This is Supernaught. My name is Beth Kelling and I'm going to talk about spirituality, sobriety and the spectrum of self. I've loved talking about spirituality for as long as I can remember and I've been on a sobriety journey since 2020. The more I talk about sobriety, the stronger I become. The more I explore spirituality, the more fulfilled I feel. This is a space for stories and for the moments where struggle meets transformation. This is Super Knot, hi Steve.
Speaker 2:Hey Bethy, Bear.
Speaker 1:Thanks for being my first guest on Super Knot.
Speaker 2:Super Knot.
Speaker 1:For those who don't know, steve and I are brother and sister, and for those watching who are like how is that possible? Look at this drastic age difference. I'm so young and vibrant and're like clearly middle-aged. So why don't you tell the story that you loved to tell when I was growing up of how I came into existence?
Speaker 2:Okay. So back in those days every town had at least one or two drugstores where you didn't have to go all the way to Walmart or anywhere. You got a haircut, you got whatever you needed, you got your birth control. So I was with dad on a Saturday and we went to a hall drug and he gets something. And then he kind of looks down and tells me yeah, your mom wants me to get one of those vasectomies, but yeah, this is good enough. And then literally I don't know, three months later they were like well, it didn't work, you're going to have another brother or sister.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, they didn't want you. The rest of us wanted you. Mom and dad definitely did not, but Eddie and I and Michael wanted you for sure.
Speaker 1:Good, okay, all right. So that clears up this drastic age difference of 15 years.
Speaker 2:Oh, and then Dad did get a vasectomy shortly after that.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, yeah for sure.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right. So one of the main themes of this podcast is spirituality, and the reason I wanted you on as my first guest is because you were the first person I ever heard decide to question the faith that they were brought up in. You were the first person that made me realize I should go out and find my own truth. That just because I was born into a certain religion doesn't mean that I should naively, blindly accept the story laid before me. I was a teenager and I can remember right where we were.
Speaker 1:It was in the office here, and you said to E that you were renouncing Christianity until you researched every other religion, at least the mainstream ones. You made it sound so obvious to me that it was wild and maybe even irresponsible to grow up believing what you were told, and so I wanted to say for the record that I'm getting more and more excited about Christianity all the time. But what a blessing it is to have the opportunity to be excited about it because I alone am choosing it to know that I went out and searched and have found my own version of truth. So I'm not sure how long it would have taken me to do that. Maybe everybody realizes that maybe it's obvious to everybody that they should do that, but I'm not sure, because in Mora, minnesota, rural Minnesota, I was in my mid twenties before I could openly say that I was going to yoga classes, because people thought that was voodoo devil's juice, you know.
Speaker 1:So for you to have given me at such a young age the opportunity to think outside of that because I didn't even know it was okay to learn about another religion, let alone dive into one. So when I was 19 or 20, I told mom that I was interested in Buddhism and she brought me to a couple temples in the metro, but she literally said like let's just not tell your dad about this. So, um, my question is what brought you to this decision? This had have been 25, 25 years ago or so, but how did people react? What was your mind state?
Speaker 2:Um, well, it's probably a 10 year process process of the first time I thought about this just doesn't seem right to me to being able to even say it out loud to myself, let alone telling other people and very few people probably the first 10 years that I ever talked about it with openly. Because, yeah, a few hundred years ago you get burnt at the stake, you know, for saying that you didn't believe in Jesus or you know whatever religion you were supposed to believe in and it was scary, I mean, and I think that that's, you know, part of the stronghold of religion is that gets burnt into your brain at such a young age that it is sinful to even think about anything else other than just to follow exactly what you're told. In Mora, the pastor there told us openly that every other person in the city of Mora at every other church was going to go to hell because they went to churches other than Zion Lutheran, missouri Synod Church, like, oh, you know, you can talk to them, but just don't plan on seeing them after you die because they're all going to hell. So it wasn't even like Muslims or Hindus or some completely radically different religion. It was other people that were supposedly also Christians. So what started me on the path of questioning it? Well, just the idea that where you're born decides what religion. And because I happened to be born in a family that not only was Christian but happened to be German, missouri Synod Lutheran and I was one of the select few out of billions of people because of where I was born Bullshit, complete, complete crap.
Speaker 2:And every religion has a story you know, or followers of the religion have stories about how, what makes them feel like it's real to them, the experiences that they've had, external and internal. Well, they all have it. There's no religion that survives that doesn't have people who, to their core, internally and externally, feel like they have justification and relevance for believing what they believe. Well, how is that possible? So it was like a 10-year process of just stripping away every layer, every detail of well, why do I believe this? And it wasn't just religion by any means, it was every single thing, thing. Do I believe this to be a truth because I, this is what I was told, or because this is what I've observed? And then, even when you get down to the things that you believe, it's because what you've observed you realize that you've observed such a tiny fraction of you know experience that your judgment can be completely biased or skewed, or the sample size is just too small to you know to make decisions on.
Speaker 2:So uh yeah, I believe almost nothing at this point because and and it doesn't, it probably the breakthrough was was accepting that it doesn't matter. You know so much of what we're concerned about every day. It really has no effect on utility, value of our lives, quality of life. It's just our opinions. I like that sweater color or the knit pattern or whatever. Okay, that's fine, you can like it all you want, but it's not better than my pattern. It's completely benign and most of our lives are completely benign, and so it doesn't matter what you believe or what you think is true or not true. If it makes you happy, great.
Speaker 2:If it gives you inspiration great, but it really doesn't matter.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so can you remember who the first person or first couple people that you did say it to I mean Probably maybe Devin was?
Speaker 2:the first person or first couple of people that you did say it to. I mean, uh, uh, probably maybe Devin was the first person.
Speaker 1:How old he would have been.
Speaker 2:It was probably in college, yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, I was a teenager when I heard you tell Ethan. But well, maybe, maybe.
Speaker 2:Ethan was the first person that I started arguing with, because we argued about everything. Whether, whether I believed it or not, I was probably in the process of getting there. Yeah, because there was a point where I severely criticized and chastised him for not going to church.
Speaker 1:Oh, robin says, you did him too.
Speaker 2:Yep. So when I was a thumper and then I would see these other people who were apparently Jesus followers but not doing anything about it, never going to church, not bringing their kids to church, yeah, I mean, I was a complete dick about it At that age. If I believed it, everybody should believe it. And especially if you tell me you believe it but you don't actually act on it, well then I was going to be a total asshole to you. So yeah, I was to everybody.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So it was like, literally when he started going to church was when I stopped, yeah, and then it was like, fuck, it's because I always love to argue. Well, the difference doesn't make much. Pick a side. I'll argue either side for fun, because you never lose an argument. You just learn. If somebody can shame you with the dumb, you say something and then you can't defend it. Okay, I learned something.
Speaker 1:Well, you always get mad at me for not arguing with you enough, and then I'm like but I agree with what you're saying.
Speaker 2:What use are you to me if you don't argue with me?
Speaker 1:Except that one time a week, after you said it to me, and then we're talking about drive time. Oh, yeah, and you were getting upset and I was like you literally just told me to argue with you.
Speaker 2:I didn't say I wasn't going to get upset, that's okay. I mean yeah, Ideally, I mean yeah, I mean ideally. You don't get emotional about an argument. You argue the points, the merits of your point of view, and if you can't defend them you fucking lose.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm. Yeah, so did you dive in to other religions or did you kind of just stop believing what you? Yeah, so I did hear you say that you were going to research other religions. So there's still time, you're not that old yet. Yeah yeah maybe you don't want to, and that's fine.
Speaker 2:The other part about it is I don't think we have as much control as we think we do, or we wish we had, in how our own minds work, so like I could wake up tomorrow and be like, wow, I've been an idiot for the last 20 years. Jesus is real, I can feel him right here. That literally might happen tomorrow and there's there's very little I can consciously do to control that you know, because mom and dad used to always say well you know faith.
Speaker 2:Faith is a gift. That you know because mom and dad used to always say well, you know faith.
Speaker 1:Faith is a gift. Well, I guess I don't have the fucking gift. So who is in control then?
Speaker 2:I don't know what comes into your brain a perfect example of I don't know and it's okay not to know yeah right and I don't want to bash you know our father too much here, but he needs to know answers to everything, everything. He can't walk by somebody's desk without picking what's this? Why is this here? Who does this belong to? He needs to know the answer to everything, and I observed that and just decided I don't need to know the answers to anything except what directly affects my day-to-day life. Everything else is.
Speaker 1:But that's real faith.
Speaker 2:It's just trivia at that point.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I think that's what God wants us to feel is yeah, we don't have to know everything because we trust Him. I think Dad is a bad example of somebody who is religious, who does need to know everything. That's just how his brain works. But I mean, so that's almost like a faith that you're putting faith in something, aren't you, by not needing to know everything because somebody hasn't?
Speaker 2:figured it out. I don't need to have faith. I wake up every morning.
Speaker 1:I'm alive.
Speaker 2:My legs work, my arms work, my eyes are working, I get up. Even if I didn't have all those things, I could crawl out of bed to find nourishment. What do I need? To have faith in? Everything works. I survive, and if it doesn't work, and I die, well, so does everything else. I'm not special. I'm not going to live forever.
Speaker 1:Everything dies. Well, I mean, with modern technology we might live quite a while.
Speaker 2:Yeah, who knows, Maybe. But yeah, the next generation evolution progress can't be made. I mean, if we lived forever, we'd probably just be holding the world back, Mm-hmm Right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. I think there's something special about knowing you're going to die and that life is short.
Speaker 2:and then you To me it's more meaningful because, no, there's not some magic place you're going to go to after you die and you're going to get to see everyone and you get to make up for all the bad stuff you did in purgatory, if you're a Catholic or something.
Speaker 1:No, this is it, and that's why I'm not scared of AI, because I think that they're going to be jealous of us for that exact reason.
Speaker 2:Not jealous like mean to us jealous, but like respect us for that we have that and they don't, Because we're precious and fragile and only here for a short time. So they better appreciate us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, hopefully they help remind us that that's why we're here and help us hold on to that and help us be more creative.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know why we're here. We are, and maybe we'll find out when we die Either way, but I'm fairly confident that because I don't believe in a very specific thing, that I'm going to be somehow tortured in hell for eternity. That's absurd. I don't think I'm ever going to wake up and think that is a real thing.
Speaker 1:Right. Well, I believe you can be in hell on earth. If your thoughts are controlling in a negative way, that's hell on earth. A lot of people are living in a negative way.
Speaker 2:That's hell on earth A lot of people are living in it, yeah, so, yeah, that's sad.
Speaker 1:I think you can live in heaven and on this earth as well.
Speaker 2:But just like you know, I was saying that you can't control. You know how do those people get out of that. You know, it's not like you can just Well, I think, think, meditating deep breathing medication in some ways.
Speaker 1:Yes, that is needed at times when you really can't get out because brain um chemistry. So I have realized that b12s or any b vitamins get me depressed and 25% of population has this mutation that I have. I took that Gary Brekka mutation. I think I had to send my blood in and it's like M-T-R-R-M-R-T-T. I can't remember which mutation it is. Look it up. No, but not right now. But I was drinking these B12s for two days last week and all of a sudden I got home and all of a sudden, out of nowhere, it was like my brain did something where I was depressed and I was like what Do I have to be depressed? Well, there's nothing literally going on. But then it clicked that three other times when I've. I know this, I know I shouldn't take Bs.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I stopped and now I'm feeling better. But it was like my brain did this thing where it was so clearly a chemical imbalance. So of course I support medication for people who are having a hard time and can't get out of things, because I think sometimes there's nothing else you can do.
Speaker 2:But for me, it's too bad that there's a stigma to it. But, yeah, uh, I wear cheaters because, uh, my eyes aren't perfect. Yeah, right, yeah, uh, people use hearing aids. They do all sorts of things, uh, to make their lives better or to improve what isn't quite perfect. And just because, yeah, you have to take some meds because of a chemical imbalance that messes with your mind, that's just. It's too bad that there's such a negative stigma about that.
Speaker 1:And those meds, or before you're on the meds, your brain might be in patterns of talking negatively to yourself and about other people.
Speaker 2:But so then it's also your responsibility.
Speaker 1:Once you have some kind of help to get you out of that compulsive thinking. You have to make an effort at thinking positive thoughts, meditating, shutting your brain off, breathing.
Speaker 2:But even getting to the point where you're willing to do that, isn't always a choice either, for sure. Sometimes it just feels so much better to be angry and to be upset.
Speaker 1:It can be addictive.
Speaker 2:You would ask me to pick a song. My favorite songs are like Seether, like horrible.
Speaker 1:I was scared you were going to pick a song that was like a rager.
Speaker 2:I hate the lyrics. You know it's not. I love the music, but then, you know, you end up listening to these lyrics. It's like you know, I feel bad for these people Because this could be a really cool song about something you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, something great, but you can't listen to the lyrics.
Speaker 2:But there's just so much anger out there, and so I think that there's a pretty easy pathway in society for people to feel um bad for themselves and and like a victim. Right, I mean, if you want to be a victim, there's, there's. It's not a pathway, it's a freeway to allow you and to encourage you to embrace victimhood. Why, I don't know, there must be money in it for somebody.
Speaker 1:I mean, that's why I think the media is making so much money right now, because they are what's the word? Taking that out of people? I mean keeping people stuck in that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, pharmaceuticals making money off people who do take the drugs and convincing people that it's somebody else's fault.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, it's a feeling and it's an emotion to feel negative and sad and that can be hard to let go of when you've felt it for so long, or if you grew up in a household where you felt that way yeah I mean. So it's like almost, if you let it go, you're abandoning that part of yourself yeah, but okay.
Speaker 2:so, but at the same time that that, uh, that that somebody who feels like a victim and then embraces that, I don't think that that's their fault and rights, and so I don't think we can take credit for being like oh, we're these smart, enlightened people that we haven't fallen into that trap.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:It's not our. I don't know why.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:Why we're not those people?
Speaker 1:I think it takes work, it takes conscious work. Why we're not those people? I think it takes work, it takes conscious work. What's that movie about? What's his name, mr Rogers?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I love that movie. Did you ever watch it? I think I told you to. So his wife goes up to the reporter and says he's not just naturally this nice and good of a person, he has to work really hard at it. He swims every single day. He gets his demons out some way. That's why people run, that's why people work themselves hard. I think that's why people do lots of things.
Speaker 2:There probably is some balance. Maybe that's the spirituality that if you're good at one thing, it's probably at the expense of something else If you're sensitive to one thing it's probably at the expense of something else.
Speaker 2:If you're sensitive to one thing, it's probably because you're ignoring something else. It's really hard to be super conscientious of your health and fitness and work hard and be in control of your relationships, or doing what you can to be in control and positive, and all at the same time. Usually it's I am focusing on work right now and fuck everything else, or I'm going to ignore work because I want to spend time with family, and then work suffers. It's impossible to serve more than one master.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can't be good at absolutely everything. You have to pick and choose. Maybe right now you're serving ice baths. Are you still cold plunging?
Speaker 2:No, I did that for about a month and then I really started to feel like it was. If anything, it was hurting my workouts because I'm working out right afterwards and I was frozen for the first 20 minutes. I could feel the cold in my bones for 20 minutes into my workout. Well, that has to be slowing my metabolism down. It has to be slowing everything. So I thought, well, if I'm going to do it, I have to do it dead center between workouts, not right before or right after.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've just been doing it on days that I think are going to be hard and I want to just get the hardest thing out of the way, and I wanted to today. But I also today I just really wanted to stay in my feminine energy and it seems like cold plenogen is kind of more of a masculine like I'm going to do hard things Bullshit.
Speaker 2:So I was perfectly happy if the water was 59, 60 degrees and go in.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Nicole would drain the tub because it comes out of the faucet at 40 degrees. She would drain the tub and get it down to at least 50 and be in there for like four minutes. She's always been a tough bitch. She is fucking tough. And if she happened to get up before me and drain the tub and get it down to that temperature, well you know I couldn't like add hot water, so I and yeah that it's brutal. There's a huge difference between 60 degrees and 50 degrees right.
Speaker 1:It comes out at mine at 57 and I can get it down to 54 with some ice, you would think it would get colder, but it wasn't. But when I was just in Iceland and we were in like this lagoon and they had a cold, so it was like I think it was probably 35, because that's what the temperature was outside 35, 36 because there wasn't any air flowing into it, it just yeah and the way that it takes your breath away. Yeah, I mean oh, it's just amazing it is.
Speaker 2:It is when you're in the tub. You can't get. You know you can't get your whole body in at one time. So, without thinking, I would just immediately go from bed to the tub, no thinking whatsoever, just sit right down and it's like five seconds of oh my God. But then every time you slide a little bit deeper into it, you have that process all over again because you're trying to get your whole body into it. So it was brutal, but at the same time it was like just proving to yourself that you're not going to die and just proving to yourself that you can do it if you want to.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no for sure. That's the main reason I'm doing it is to prove to myself that I can do the hard things.
Speaker 2:That's the main reason I'm doing it is to prove to myself that I can do the hard things. You asked about job sites in the spring and mud. My actual favorite memory of building was with Eddie, our older brother, in the wintertime. It had to be at least 20 below a job site in Zimmerman. It's right on 169, so every time I go down drive 169 through Zimmerman I get to look at this building but it was so brutally cold. There was four of us, eddie and I and two other guys, and we walked around the corner of the building and the other two guys were literally hugging each other like kind of almost crying because it was so cold.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:Ed and I just got this warm feeling of joy inside of us because, I mean, it was cold but we weren't started making snowmen and having a snowball fight, just to taunt the other guys that you know we were stronger men than they were.
Speaker 1:Cute.
Speaker 2:Yeah, favorite memory of building a shed with Ed.
Speaker 1:Very cute. I'll remember that one. Oh, so I am going to have to bring you to an EDM concert. I went to my first one last week and, because you said you don't like the lyrics, but you like the rager music noise like an EDM concert. You just stand there and it vibrates your whole body.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And I was definitely the oldest one there. I was almost 40 and just getting into them now kind of silly, but I don't care, because it was so amazing and I'm like already that's the name of the artist is EDM no, he was lane eight, but EDM is electric music, dance music, electronic dance music, I don't know, but um that's when it's just like. It's a genre, yeah, a genre, and it just vibrates your whole body Okay. And yeah.
Speaker 2:I'll check it out. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's like a massage for your brain. Somebody called it.
Speaker 2:Wow, mm-hmm. Well, that could be good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and there's not too many lyrics. There's some, but like you said, the lyrics on Seether and some of these bands that you like.
Speaker 2:It's not good to put into your soul.
Speaker 1:It probably isn't yeah, yeah, but you need the beat, you need the I don't know.
Speaker 2:I like the guitar, yeah, I like the drums, I like the bass, but yeah, the lyrics are all pretty silly.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, cool. Well, I think that I'm going to have you on Super Knot quite often, hopefully once a month because you have so much insight. Super Knot means a voyager searching and striving for betterment and working to improve themselves, their lives and their surroundings. So what do you do right now that you don't want your grandkids to do when they're your age?
Speaker 2:What do I do right now that I don't want my grandkids to do? Uh, I listen to uh audio books instead of read books. So it would be great if they learned to love to read actual paperback uh books instead of just listen. Listen to audio. It's always been a huge weakness of mine. If I won't if I can't sleep books instead of just listen to audio. It's always been a huge weakness of mine, if I can't sleep, pick up a book instantly, I'll sleep. So I hope they learn to read.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a good one. What do you do that you hope your grandkids do do when they're your age?
Speaker 2:do when they're your age. If they ever recognize something in themselves that creates fear or anxiety or doubt, that, they go straight into it instead of avoiding it, trying to circumvent it or pretend it's not there Fucking tackle it, it's the biggest thrill.
Speaker 2:I mean if you weren't afraid you were going to die, skydiving would be boring. I mean whoa, okay, wow, but it's the fact that there's a real chance you're going to die is what makes skydiving awesome, or rock climbing, or driving your motorcycle faster than you should. I'm not saying all those things are wise, smart things to do, but the fear of public speaking, that's one of your greatest accomplishments in life, of overcoming something. Literally crying, when the teacher made you do your first speech in high school. To now you do it almost every day. Yeah, I mean you could have done the exact opposite and taken an F on that or whatever, and never engaged with it, but you hit it straight on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we talk about that often chasing the things that scare us the most or even dislike. It's so funny. I know I'm not going to be able to think of any examples right now, but things even that I dislike that. I start to lean into and I'm like, oh my gosh, there's a reason I dislike this, because I had to figure out something, some aspect of it that I did like and yes, especially public speaking in high school cried every time, um my, when I became crew manager at Sherman and I did a speech in the morning meeting and then I went home that afternoon and cried for like three hours.
Speaker 1:I just had to get all the emotions out. And even this is so scary to me. But I never would have been able to do this if it wasn't the small steps that I took going towards it.
Speaker 2:But I mean, you look back at it now and it's silly right. So it's not going to take long before you think that this was silly and it's all being nervous about it was silly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the cold plunging too. I mean, I dislike being cold more than anything. I've tried to move away from minnesota, so many times. Yeah, one of the six blanket people yes, yes, a heated blanket, of the heated little packs that I just get home and I put all over my body, um, but the cold plunging. And shout out to my friend shannon. She literally was dragging me to this cold plunge. The first time I ever did one at a retreat in Bayfield, wisconsin.
Speaker 1:There was like an outside tub. It was like 36 degrees and I was like I'm not going to do that. There's no way I would ever do something like that. And she's like it's right here, there's a sauna, right here, you're going to do it. And the mind clarity and the natural high that I got from that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so glad I did it, so thank you, shannon, and it's a stepping stone, a building block to everything else, because you get a few of those under your belt, things that you were afraid of or didn't have the right level of self-confidence.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and then everything just kind of tips like dominoes. After that it's like, well, okay, well, what can I logically be afraid of after what I've been through already?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so that's kind of my spirituality is doing hard things.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Cool. Yeah, all right, thanks for coming on.
Speaker 2:You're welcome, love you, thank you. Love you too.
Speaker 1:Not comes from the Greek word sailor and means voyager or traveler. Like an astronaut searching the stars, a supernaut is one searching the inner and outer worlds of self, navigating life, consciousness and reality, striving for betterment. The paradox is that seeking and striving can create more unrest and more unhappiness. So, while calm seas may not make great sailors, I plan to explore the idea of light rescuing darkness instead of fighting it.