Supernaut
Supernaut is a podcast about spirituality, sobriety, and the spectrum of self. Hosted by Beth Kelling, this show explores what it means to seek clarity, connection, and personal truth in a world that rarely slows down.
Since beginning her sobriety journey in 2020, Beth has been diving deeper into spiritual practices, emotional honesty, and all the beautiful, messy layers of identity.
Each episode opens the door to conversations about healing, growth, creativity, intuition, and everything in between — because who we are isn’t fixed, it’s a spectrum.
Beth will be joined by guests who share their own stories, perspectives, and spiritual paths — offering insight, inspiration, and the occasional cosmic detour.
Whether you’re sober-curious, spiritually inclined, or just looking to feel a little more human, you’re in the right place
Supernaut
Scorpion Flower, The Sin of Wrath, and The Healthy Release
Have you ever considered that what you perceive as your greatest weakness might actually contain the seed of your greatest strength? In this soul-stirring conversation with Shawna, we unpack the powerful duality between her natural calm demeanor and what she calls her "wrath" – those moments of fierce emotion that occasionally break through her composed exterior.
Drawing from our nearly 20-year friendship, we dive deep into a memorable full moon party where Shawna's hilariously honest interaction with her inner child (telling it "why are you such an idiot?" instead of nurturing it) reveals her refreshingly authentic approach to life. This authenticity becomes the thread that connects every aspect of our conversation – from motherhood to sobriety, from setting boundaries to embracing imperfection.
Shawna shares how watching her 12-year-old son observe adults' drinking behaviors became her wake-up call. "I don't want him having this impression of you," she explains when discussing the challenging boundaries she's had to set with family members. The vulnerability in her voice when recounting how friends told her "you're more fun when you drink" opens a profound conversation about whether people unconsciously want to keep others in lower states to feel better about themselves.
We explore the mythology of wrath, learning how this emotion – when properly channeled – transforms from destructive rage into protective energy and clarity. Shawna’s story offers a masterclass in emotional alchemy: taking raw feelings and turning them into purposeful action rather than letting them fester or explode.
Perhaps most touching is her journey toward body acceptance, sparked by her partner's simple question: "What if that's just the way your body is meant to look?" At 36, she describes finding freedom from insecurity, developing personal hobbies beyond her children's activities, and finally caring less about others' opinions – a liberation many of us spend decades seeking.
Ready to transform your relationship with difficult emotions? Join us for this intimate, honest conversation that might just change how you view your own inner fire.
0:00 Meeting Shawna and Music Memories
2:36 Full Moon Parties and Inner Child
7:53 Staying Calm vs. Moments of Wrath
17:11 Setting Boundaries with Family
22:49 The Journey to Sobriety
35:19 Finding New Hobbies and Self-Care
46:14 Body Image and Self-Acceptance
51:34 Hopes for Future Generations
Shauna hi, thanks for being here. How are you today? I am well Good, so I asked you to pick a song for us to listen to before we started. What song did you pick?
Speaker 2:Mufasa by Fulton Lee.
Speaker 1:And why did you pick it?
Speaker 2:Well, I discovered Fulton Lee from my sister sent me like a sentimental song that he sang like about kids just growing up and stuff. Then I just like tootled around in his set list and just like that song. And now me and Millie vibe hard to that song. And it's got like Disney in there too, like you know and like I love Disney yeah, it was really animated and really fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so we've known each other for almost 20 years now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was just thinking about that this morning.
Speaker 1:Actually, we even lived together for a little bit, uh-huh.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:And just done so much together. So I wanted to start with. My favorite story of you is from a moon party. How many of my full moon parties did you come to?
Speaker 2:I think only one, maybe two, but Levi actually thought that this was like a moon he calls it moon babies and he thought that this was that. Oh, he thought that's what you were coming to do. Yeah, he's like, is that a moon baby thing? I was like, no, yeah, but we should be bringing that back.
Speaker 1:Yes, I want to start full moon parties again, cause, even if you don't believe in the full moon energy, it's like we would still just talk about what we wanted to work on and yeah it was always so helpful for me and it was like every woman's thing is insecurities, and so we, like, could all just bond over that and talk about that stuff.
Speaker 1:I have a feeling I know exactly what you're gonna say. Well, and I wanted to say, yeah, even if you don't believe in the full moon energy, like I wanted to call out. My old boss, kevin Tlander, used to make fun of me for doing moon stuff, but he also would never come into the bar on a full moon as a bartender because he knew that things get crazy. So you do believe in the full moon energy. You know it makes people either act crazy, or you can harness that energy for good.
Speaker 1:I think too, but yeah, so we had this full moon party and we were doing a meditation about um, your inner child, so like you're supposed to picture yourself in like kindergarten or first grade and like what you would say to yourself, and we all went around the room like, oh, I would nurture myself by saying this or that. We get to you and your face is just like I was like why are you such an idiot? Like your younger self, and I just couldn't stop laughing and that's like just so evil?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I even made fun of like what I wore back in the day, like why would you wear that? Don't change it up.
Speaker 1:I'm like Shani you're supposed to be loving your younger self, but you're just like what is wrong with you child? It was so cute.
Speaker 2:That's so valid. I would still say that.
Speaker 1:Cute. So I think of your superpower as, like staying calm, like you're not worked up right now. You never really get worked up. I don't see you angry. If you are angry which we'll talk about later the wrath, it's so controlled and I think that's why it ends up working for you.
Speaker 2:So are you calm inside, like as calm as you seem on the outside? Um, I don't know, I maybe not, but it's funny that you say that because I hear that so much and then my usual comeback is like, oh, you should ask my kids and they're. Then they're just like oh, that can't be true. But sometimes but I feel like they like I don't know, the older they get, the more they're, just like, like Joshua even said to me, like mom, like calm down right now, and I'm just like kind of brings me back to reality, like, okay, you're right, this ain't a big deal. But no, I do try to stay calm in like every situation, and I don't know, like in certain situations you almost have to be and it's I don't know. But I mean, it's a great compliment. I love being referred to as like a chill person.
Speaker 1:You do have anxiety, though.
Speaker 2:Sometimes. Yeah, like it was funny, I asked Joshua, my son, the other day. I was like what's one thing that like absolutely stresses me out? And he's just like I don't know planning stuff and I'm like ding, dong that nail on the head, like that's it, like stresses me out to a T, which is such a weird thing to stress you out about. And he does know me like so well.
Speaker 1:You mean like planning a party or an event, just anything in general, like planning the week out planning meals, yeah.
Speaker 2:So in general, like planning the week out planning meals? Yeah. So like I watch my niece and nephew during the summer and they are always asking me can we do this, can we do that? But they don't pay attention to like weather, money stuff, like important stuff like that. And so I wrote on the whiteboard like we're gonna do this on this day, like just general big things, so that they don't ask me because I'm like look at the board, you know, but it yeah, planning stuff, like I do. I just wanted to get be right, or like I'm one of those people that if we go on a trip like like I gotta start getting ready at this time, pack it this time, leave it this time type like everything planned out?
Speaker 1:yeah, I had a time. So when you wake up in the morning on a normal day, do you have the whole day planned out?
Speaker 2:uh, sometimes, sometimes it's like we're just gonna play it by ear, but I in the back of my mind I have like ideas still. So it's. But then like when we went to new york, that was kind of like willy-nilly, so yeah, but that was fun though, yeah which I think we both had like an idea in mind of stuff we wanted to do, and so it wasn't so stressful.
Speaker 1:Yeah still because some trips I've ruined because I've over planned, like we have to be here for an hour and then there for an hour and then it's gonna take this time to travel from this restaurant to that restaurant, and then yeah, and then I just like don't have fun because it was too structured. But I love planning. It's like my favorite thing in the world.
Speaker 2:I like it, but I want it to like go as planned yeah yeah, my sister's like the opposite. So when we try to plan stuff, she's like, yeah, let's just figure it out. When we get there, I'm like no. I don't want to do that.
Speaker 1:I don't want to get there and like be looking for restaurants or deciding what to do like I don't want to waste time when I'm on the trip like I'm gonna do all the work yeah time yeah, like when we we just took a family trip to Michigan and, um, I'm like, where are we gonna stay?
Speaker 2:and Levi's just like, yeah, we'll figure it out when we get in that town. I'm like what? I'm like, okay, that's, I'm just gonna crochet, like, like you do that planning, then this is your planned trip, I'll just sit back. So if I don't have to do any of the planning, then it's fine. And then did it work out. It did it worked out Well.
Speaker 1:one time I was in Mankato for a concert and I was trying to find a so that's like what four hours south of here and I was trying to find a hotel on my way back at like one, two in the morning.
Speaker 1:I just figured I'd easily find a place but, I, never did, because it was the state fair and so every place was booked. I mean, I pulled over and called like 10 different places, stopped and walked in two, never found a place and had to drive back to more. I didn't get home till like four in the morning and I was like this is why you need to plan because it doesn't always work out.
Speaker 1:I didn't realize the state fair was in town and all the hotels would be booked. Yeah so. But I'm glad it worked out that time, and I do try to plan less and just go with the flow yeah, have like a vague plan, that's okay too, but just have no plan in general, like too tough.
Speaker 1:I don't feel like moms can do that, like no, there's, there's too many people to protect to just go with the flow sometimes. Yeah, so I asked you about your deadly sin, which you thought was mostly yours, and you said you get a little envy, like a little FOMO, which like, yeah, of course everybody does, like I want to do the things that everybody's doing.
Speaker 2:But you also said wrath, yeah, so tell me about that, which is crazy because it's like super opposite of calm, yeah, but like, so I don't know. Example most recent, like, and it's so childish sometimes and I like I acknowledge that, and it's so childish sometimes and I acknowledge that, but it's like last night I was trying to set a sleep timer on Millie's TV. It froze and I'm just like what the heck Like taking the batteries out, putting them back in, and it was just like not working. So I just like smashed it on her nightstand and I'm like, well, it's broken now, so let's try to fix it. It's not working. And then trying to call joshua because he's like our tech guy at home and he's just like well, yeah, this is broken, just calm. And millie's just sitting there, like okay, she was calm too.
Speaker 1:She didn't like get mad no, she didn't.
Speaker 2:And uh, levi had popped in and he saw that the tv was like frozen. I'm like struggling and and he's like, well, just unplug it, plug it back in. But it's like up high, and so I unplug everything and I'm just like I looked at Millie who's just sitting there waiting and I'm like, well, you're just going to bed tonight there's no TV. So and I was like we're going to have to buy a new remote. She's like okay. So I was like okay, like this is cool and normal you know, not normal, but yeah.
Speaker 2:So that was just like I don't know, and it's it's only frustrating Cause, like I see, sometimes like my son acts like that sometimes and I know exactly he's like me, but him, you know. So it's like certain flaws that I have, like he picks up on. So it's getting better, that those types of like anger thingies. But it doesn't happen like often. I'm just I'm not chucking stuff around the house and freaking out all the time, but it's I don't know.
Speaker 2:You could call it a tantrum, because that's kind of what it is, but so that's kind of wrathier, and then I feel like there's a different side of the wrath that comes to my mind and it's just like um kind of wraps in with like not getting closure on something which just like makes me like sad, angry. So it's just like, why did that happen? Why did they do this? Like? And it's so, then it just makes me like sad. And then I but I talk about it more now and like Levi's heard the same story and questions so many times and he just like gives me such a real answer back that it's I'm kind of just like yeah, maybe, but like you kind of almost want to hear it from the horse's mouth, like why it is the way that it is. So that's, I don't know, that's my other side, or twist on wrath, I should say.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, we're going to get to that ended up ended up asking ai um. Like I did in my first episode. I asked about um, my sloth yeah, and my gluttony um. So I asked ai to tell me about the mythological side of um wrath, and it said it represents unchecked destructive rage and in Norse mythology, thor and other gods embodied controlled rage and battle, valorized when aimed at justice, but deadly if uncontrolled. Wrath here could be divine or dynamic, depending on intent. So like, there's two sides to it.
Speaker 1:Carl Jung said wrath is an archetype of the shadow, a part of ourselves we suppress but must face. If not integrated, it erupts destructively. If acknowledged, it can become a force for boundary setting and courage. Each deadly sin has a healing virtue for wrath its meekness and patience. This doesn't mean weakness, it means discipline, strength, emotional intelligence and surrender of control. Hinduism like fire wrath burns the one who holds it before reaching the one it's aimed at.
Speaker 1:And I remember oprah said something I was like 20 when I heard this and I think about it all the time that revenge is like drinking poison but expecting the other person to die. Yeah, um like so. True, it's like manifesting in your body and making you sick if you really like, hold on to that. So it said, when channeled, it can become a force for protection, justice and truth. The key is transforming rage into purposeful action, not represent, not repression or explosion, and you get really passionate about some um stuff. So I could see this turning into a really positive thing for you if you use it right. Yeah, so it says some of the steps to use it for good is the sacred pause. Which pause is such a big thing? Right now, I feel like I see it all over social media.
Speaker 2:Like pause before acting yeah.
Speaker 1:So like, yeah, the little bit of I have a little bit of wrath in me, like I said in a over social media, like pause before acting, yeah. So like, yeah, the little bit I have a little bit of wrath in me. Like I said in a couple episodes ago with Jen P, like I sent out a bunch of emails like until I like paused and was like wait, sorry, I blew up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, I didn't mean any of that, I was probably really just hungry yeah, I definitely do that a lot more now, Like if I overreact on something and stuff like I need to take a minute reflect and then almost always I come back calm and ready to have like a real conversation and usually apologize for like how it was before and like let's move forward.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Kind of fix it right away and I've trained my brain to say take a pause here. But I haven't trained myself to actually listen to that all the time yet, but it's like it's just training your brain. You know, what I mean, just like practicing. Everything just takes practice. Yeah, so it says breathe deep into your belly and name the emotion I feel rage because I'm hurt, or whatever reason. This gives you distance from the fire and turns you into its wielder, not its victim.
Speaker 2:I could try that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, viktor Frankl from Man's Search for Meaning, one of my favorite books. He was in the concentration camps and he said between stimulus and response, there is space. In that space is our power to choose um, so channeling the energy into righteous anger. This is like where we could use it for politics. Is um journaling, asking yourself what needs to be protected, who or what is being harmed, what truth? Truth needs to be spoken. Use your anger as a compass for boundary and advocacy.
Speaker 1:Wrath becomes righteous when it fights for something, not against someone. Move that energy physically. So unexpressed wrath stores in the body, so like hitting a punching bag or screaming into a pillow and working out Like you will talk about how much you've been working out and how you have a really good schedule with that. Let it move through you instead of festering. An anchor in value is not ego, anger, alchemy. What part of me is wounded right now? Is this about truth or just pride? You can be fiery without being reckless. Practice writing or burning bowls so that we could do this at the moon parties. When, angry, write out everything you want to scream, then safely burn it and wrath transformed, looks like advocacy, like Martin Luther King's fierce urgency of now Encourage truth telling and passion. So the final reframe, it said, is wrath is sacred fire uncontrolled it consumes, directed, it illuminates and protects.
Speaker 2:I was gonna pull tidbit out of that, like write it down, burn it. Like I think, with being summertime and stuff, like we're having little fires and s'mores and whatever, like I think everybody like in the house could like write stuff down. They don't have to share it or anything Like. Their stuff can be their own stuff, but like write it down and burn it Definitely. I think that would be a good yeah, healthy release for the kids at a young age to like.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Because obviously I don't want them to, like you know, have my tantrums Like I want them to be able to figure out how to. You always want your kids to just be better than you, so you want them to have better outlets and ways to cope and get over things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that would be a beautiful family thing to do. Yeah, when you said, said that when you see, uh, joshua doing something and you're like that's me, it's like there is nothing crazier in the world than seeing your child.
Speaker 2:Yeah, act like you and you're like whoa and then it's crazy because when I do see him act like that, like that's when I become like the most calm and the most understanding and nurturing, and because, like I just know how that feels, and then I have give him so many good um, what you got like ideas on or advice. Yeah, advice, I like don't obviously listen to myself or need to listen to, but, but I feel like it's easy to give someone advice but not listen to it yourself 100%.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but I did find something. Can I grab my phone quick? Yeah, I found something on wrath that I was like, oh yeah, that sounds exactly what I'm thinking and it says the sin of wrath anger that is brought by disappointments after the expectations, which, how I feel a lot like you expect so much of people like, um, your expectation of someone is like up here, but they don't ever meet their expectation. I think I we even talked about this before and it's just like having to like you can either sit and wait for them to reach that expectation or you can just like acknowledge that they're just not going to get to where you expect them to be, like they could reach that potential, but you just have to be okay with them. And that brings a lot of anger for me sometimes, when you like see someone's potential but they'll never get to that potential and you have to just be okay with that.
Speaker 1:So true, but that is a form of control and wanting to change them, you know. So, like let people be them, but 100% I mean, I struggle with that all the time Like it's tough, it's super tough.
Speaker 2:So then I feel like, then that brings like, if they can't meet that expectation that you have for them, then you have to put up boundaries. Then and boundaries are also tough, but that's a whole other pickle.
Speaker 1:Yeah, any boundaries coming to mind right now?
Speaker 2:Yeah, which tips into like drinking and stuff like or not drinking, like you just see, mostly with the kids like I don't know, that's like just a whole other like section.
Speaker 1:You think I'd like to Okay.
Speaker 2:If you want to Sure, like setting a boundary for like family like that do drink, and now if you don't drink, you're just like I don't really want my kids being around that to a certain extent, you know. And then having to set up a boundary and then that boundary being followed for like an X amount of time and then kind of brushed under the rug and then it's like the boundary was never there. So you have to like reset that boundary and then you're the bad guy. But you're just trying to like protect your kids and that's difficult.
Speaker 1:Super difficult.
Speaker 2:I've never had to set a boundary like that before, so it's just like it's when you want to still be in someone's life, you know. Otherwise it's kind of just like peace out, like we're just not going to hang out anymore, I guess. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So it's like if they're having a few beers, that's fine, but like if they're getting into drinking heavily, then you're just like we need to leave. Is that kind of what you're saying?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Or if, like say, my kids are somewhere and it's just like just be present with them, Don't?
Speaker 1:just go, ham, don't even need a beer. Yeah, just be present with them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's just like I don't want my kids.
Speaker 1:That's my expectations for my kids and that's final.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So it's hard to like, but it's also hard because you're not there then. So it's just. But as my kids get older like especially Joshua now like he just he sees things, he like puts that in the back of his brain and then he'll like bring it up pretty casually with me and Levi, and then it's just like oh, I didn't even notice that you noticed that or that you think that way. And so it's like hey, he's, I don't want him having like this impression of you. And like just a couple years ago he thought you know so highly of you, and now he's just like that's kind of gross, you know. So I don't know. That's been a boundary thing that I'm working on, but I think it's getting better.
Speaker 1:It gives you the opportunity to be able to have these conversations, though, and keep the communication open. Yeah, so, you know, I try, I've tried with James like anything that has happened in his life that I wish hadn't happened to him. I just think this is for him to grow, for him to learn. You know, did he choose this before he came here? For him to grow, for him to learn, um, you know, did he choose this before he came here? For him to to grow and learn and help the evolution of the planet. You know, but, of course, your job is still to protect them and not put them in situations where they're gonna, yeah, be scarred or hurt, you know.
Speaker 2:So that's great. He talked to you about it. Yeah, he's like it's yeah, of those. And now it's funny because if we like happen to be somewhere and someone has drank too much or you know, get into that point like we have just silent communication where we make eyes like it's just like we shouldn't have those eyes, yeah, but it's also nice that he like trusts me enough to be able to have that silent communication. And how old is he? 12. So that's great. He's going to be 13 in a couple months.
Speaker 1:I don't think you're going to have to worry about him growing up and drinking too much.
Speaker 2:No, he says well, it's funny because when he was younger, me and Levi were having a beer at dinner. And he's just like what, if I like, I will. I hope I like beer when I'm older. And Levi's like I don't know, you might, you might not, like everyone's different. He's started crying and he's just like I want to like beer and we're like what. And now he's like, yeah, I don't want to drink. And I'm like, oh good for you. Yeah, like yeah, I don't want to drink and I'm like, oh good for you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Like I hope you don't, but that's cool. Yeah, but cool that he, like, is deciding that on his own 100%. Yeah, whether he sticks with that, who knows, but it's cool.
Speaker 1:It's setting a good foundation, though. Yeah, how long has it been since you drank Beginning?
Speaker 2:of January and it could have been longer, I feel like. But it was kind of one of those things. It was at a hockey tournament, because my son's in hockey and I had just brought bubblers because I didn't plan on drinking, and then someone had offered me one at the pool and I was like, oh, I've never tried that one. So I was just like, oh, I'll try it. And and I was like I don't need to have a whole one, and I didn't even drink the whole one, I just drank half. And then we're playing cards later at night and I was didn't want to open up a caffeine bubbler, like I want to go to sleep at a decent time, and so I like had one of their drinks, only drank half, passed it to another person because I was just like just having something to drink but not needing that to drink. So that was like my last time, so that was about six and a half months ago.
Speaker 1:Six months ago, um, but before that, I mean you had really slowed down yeah for like a year, a couple years, yeah, like.
Speaker 2:I had boughten, like like, if I bought a box I think it was like in the fall, like I still had it sitting in the basement A box of it was like flavored beer and then some like similar to like White Claws or something like that. But I ended up giving that away to somebody else because I'm like well, flavors like taste good, but they don't taste good enough Like I wouldn't even finish a whole can probably. So I was like well, slavers like taste good, but they don't taste good enough Like I wouldn't even finish a whole can probably. So I was like meh.
Speaker 2:But it also started because, like the kids just like noticing stuff and then like I would just slow down or like have a couple, but no one else around me was just having a couple and so I was just like gosh, if my son is noticing that people are getting gross, what has he thought of me this whole time? But maybe he didn't because he was younger, but it's kind of and Levi's kind of jumped on the boat of not drinking. He says he didn't quit quit. But I tell him it's way hotter him quitting, and so he hasn't had anything for like a few months now and, um, I told him I'm like how cool is it that we are both deciding to kind of quit drinking while our kids are still young?
Speaker 1:like I think that's super cool. If I could go back and do anything in my life differently, it would be to be more aware in James' youth. Yeah, 100%. Like do more on weekends because I didn't sleep in or lay in bed all day. Yeah, hungover, mm-hmm, I would do anything yeah.
Speaker 2:So it's just one of the perks, I think, to not drinking now.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm. So was it a conscious decision or just kind of like slowly evolving until you liked it less and less?
Speaker 2:yeah, it was, I don't know kind of like I think, when I first started drinking. Like I was listening to one of your other episodes where, um, you had said like your parents tell you like, oh, you can't have that till you're an adult, and then it's something that you look forward to and then you just like think that that's just the normal, like to just have drinks. So then everyone's having drinks and then, as you get older, you're just like like my goal always before going out was like I just want to have a couple and just chill. It's just never the case. Because then, like someone that's like a bunch of fun comes in and was like I just want to have a couple and just chill. It's just never the case. Because then, like someone that's like a bunch of fun comes in and was like let's do shots and you're like we're doing shots and then you're like, before you know it, it's one in the morning and you're like, oh geez, I gotta get home. How am I gonna get home? But so it was kind of like just slowly falling off and probably mostly because of the kids Like really put that like nail in the coffin for me.
Speaker 2:But and now it's funny because when I told friends at the beginning of when I stopped drinking, I was just like, nah, I think I'm just going to quit. And like a family member had asked me if I wanted to come out and have some drinks and I was like I don't want to, so I'm just going to like stand on it, that like I don't drink anymore, like just saying that statement like I don't drink anymore, instead of saying like I don't really drink because, like I don't want to drink, so it's like I don't really drink because, like I don't want to drink, so it's like I don't drink anymore, and then just be like boom, there it is. But I had a friend say, oh, why, like you're so fun, and it's just like, oh, and then aren't I fun, just being me, right, I think so sometimes. And then like months later get invited um with that same friend and someone that I like didn't really know, like we're playing a card game and I had to go on. She's like, oh, but you're so fun.
Speaker 2:And I was like, oh, everybody hear that, yeah, no alcohol in me. And I try to like purposely bring now like my big thing to bring to like functions is a big like Mr Gulp from Quick Trip, little Diet Coke blast me all night. So it's just like no temptations or of anything. So it's like, nope, I got my one thing. So that's all I need. Because, like I don't know, I sometimes I feel like when you drink, you just get thirstier, oh yeah. So it's all I need because, like I've I don't know I sometimes I feel like when you drink you just get thirstier, oh yeah. So it's like I don't diet coke, don't do that, I guess.
Speaker 1:So and when we golfed together two days ago, we were like we don't even have to stop to use the bathroom because we're not drinking right.
Speaker 2:Another perk of it yeah, because those bathrooms are a little gross sometimes he's super gross out there yeah and.
Speaker 1:But you've said like it's uncomfortable, sometimes with people too, like you know, when you say you're not drinking, like is there. Why do you think that is that it makes people uncomfortable?
Speaker 2:I don't know. It's because I feel like, well, now it's almost weird, because it's like what do you do with that friend now if you're not having drinks? Like you almost have to hang out at a place where there are no drinks, which is kind of frustrating because it's like, well, you could just come over and chill and we don't have to have any drinks. But I don't know.
Speaker 1:I've tried to find things with each person that I've wanted to stay in a relationship with. You know, like, what deep down do they care about? What can we do together? And a lot of times it is just hanging out at each other's houses.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which I love doing.
Speaker 2:Like when you were um, cause I feel like my friend group is just getting like smaller and smaller, which is one of those things where it's like why? And then like mad, like why is it getting smaller and smaller? And the other night, when you stopped over to chat, dinner was like almost ready and Levi I didn't want to say this to you because I didn't want to make you leave soon, but Levi's just like Beth, like it's like dinnertime but I time, but I don't want to tell her to go because she still wants to hang out with you and be in your life and I'm just like sad, but thank you for letting her come.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you guys could have ate in front of me. I had just ate.
Speaker 2:No. But so I was just like, yeah, how weird is that that you're just like, yeah, let them come, because that's someone that wants to be part of your life.
Speaker 1:So I was just like yes, yeah, we have to be conscious of those people, very thankful for you. Thankful for you too.
Speaker 2:So is there anything you do miss about drinking? The fun flavors, I guess, but that's about it. Like there's been like, uh, my brother the other day had a cider and he's just like it was a mixed one and he's like you should try this. And I was just like nah, and he's like try it. And I was just like no, I like don't drink, but I don't want to be one of those people that's just like I don't drink, drink.
Speaker 2:I'm like fancy, you know, and because I don't think it's that, I think it's just like. It's just something like I just don't like doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I literally had made up rumors about myself at one point. I'm like I'm pregnant, like I can't drink because I just didn't want to deal with the come on, come on, come on. And I mean everybody like knew right away. They're like she's lying, she just doesn't want to drink. Where's the baby? That's what I have to say to get people to not push me into it or tell me that I'm more fun when I do drink.
Speaker 2:Well and I don't think that's true at all People saying like, oh, you're more fun when you drink, it's like no, I'm just stupid, I'm more stupid when I drink.
Speaker 1:I can be stupid, sober, sober well. And then I wonder that sometimes. I'm like do people want me to be the like because I was ridiculous. You know I was obnoxious, and do people want that to feel better about themselves, like when Beth is being the like, obnoxious person? Does that make them feel better about themselves, or when I'm making bad decisions you know what I mean?
Speaker 1:yeah, I hope that's their decisions not so bad yeah, I'm not like trying to judge people and think that they're thinking that, but that has crossed my mind Like do people want to keep me low?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know Well, and something weird too when I would drink like something super weird that my family would do back in the day would like they'd pinch like the inner part of your leg and I would do that. When I'd get to a certain point, I can see you and knock people in the chest with my knuckle. Yeah, this is where I can see you being wrathy, and I don't know why, but I would just probably because when people would do it back to me, it wouldn't hurt or they wouldn't do it right. So I'm just like, ha, I have this power, and then it just hurt people. I was a blind mouse one time with a stick and I kept whacking people with my stick for Halloween and then people were like getting mad and I had to get taken away and I'm like I'm just trying to have fun, Like, isn't this?
Speaker 1:fun guys. I would bite people I'd like like on the shoulder, like I think my brother Ed had like a scar on his shoulder from like my bite marks. Like why was I, yeah, so mean, yeah, I don't know why that it must have been the fun side people really wanted. Well, and then and I would just be so ridiculous, like how could you like? Being around me Like I was so loud and annoying and telling the same stories, but whatever.
Speaker 2:Well, and then the next morning thinking about it and just little bits and pieces kind of come back and you're just like and then you text people apologies, like so sorry about last night, and they're like no, you were fine. It's like, but the anxiety is so real. I don't know the way you're saying that kind of sounds like maybe it wasn't that fine.
Speaker 1:But I think they probably were fine because they were in their own heads.
Speaker 2:They were, you know, just focused on themselves yeah like we all are, like nobody judges you as much as you think that they do yeah you know what I mean well, and then just the thought like this just popped in my head but like like the puke and rally, like go throw up, and then like come back out like nothing happened, like let's do some shots like gross wild and when you think about like your kids drinking to that point, you're like devastated and it's like but you're somebody's kid and you did that four nights a week, at one point in your life.
Speaker 2:See, and I feel like my family, like my family history like has a thing with drinking and it absolutely like drives me nuts when people say like oh, it's in my jeans because it's like well, put on a new pair of pants then, because, like, I don't want that in my jeans, so it's but I love that.
Speaker 2:So I think at a younger age like it was like having sips of you know mom's wine cooler and like that being totally okay and it it's like now if my kids like wanted a sip, I'd been like you don't want that.
Speaker 1:You know it's gross.
Speaker 2:You don't.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, that's. I talk about Alan Carr the easy way to quit drinking quite a bit, um, and he talks about that when you're little kids and, oh, you can't have that until you're older. It's this glorified thing that you, like, you're brainwashed into believing, is a great thing.
Speaker 2:Like that's the next milestone of your life being able to drink and no matter what your first sips are gross Like.
Speaker 1:nobody likes the taste of alcohol. The first couple times they try it Because it's poison.
Speaker 2:Yeah, even when you like crack open your first beer, like it's still like me, it was still like like once I get done with this first one, they're gonna go down smooth, because like I'll just have acquired that taste, and but it's just like, or you're not a beer drinker and you have to drink something that's like stronger than beer, and then, oh yeah, vodka's not good, see, yeah yeah, and like wine is still the thing that I miss the most for the taste.
Speaker 1:But even the first sip is like kind of bitter tasting, you know.
Speaker 2:See, I've never had a relationship with wine and the thing I say every time and my sister thinks I'm like nuts is that I think wine has like a cream cheese taste and they're like why? So I'll be like oh, this one don't taste cream cheesy. That's so funny.
Speaker 1:There's only been a couple. Cream cheese is my all-time favorite food. Sometimes, when people ask me what's your favorite food, I say cream cheese.
Speaker 2:Would you drink it?
Speaker 1:Obviously, If it does taste like wine. That's why I loved wine so much. Next time you come over, I'm going to melt you some cream cheese yeah.
Speaker 2:To drink yeah, take a shot of this cream cheese, yeah right yeah, so I don't know I forget what the first question was, but maybe it was like what what do you miss?
Speaker 2:about drinking. Yeah, just like fun flavors. Like the state fair has a bunch of fun flavors coming out and I'd be like, well, well, that'd be cool. But like if I I also like bringing my kids everywhere. So it's like I don't want to drink and then have to be responsible for my kids anymore, Like obviously I'd still bring them before, bring them to places have some drinks.
Speaker 2:But I feel like if they were with, I'd always be like consciously aware that they're with. So I wouldn't like especially if me and Levi were together like one of us is probably going to go ham, the other one's going to like rain it back or just not have any drinks, but now it's nothing, it's cool, it's just a lot easier to navigate, yeah. And then when I see other people getting a little like whoa, what's going on with you now? Like it's kind of like whoa, what's going on with you now? It's kind of like yeah.
Speaker 1:I think it's time to go, but it's not out of judgment. No, it's just we're not on the same frequency anymore, and for me, I just want to be in bed. I like being in bed more than anything. Yeah, 9 o'clock is like late for me, I'll stay up in bed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just I watch TV in bed.
Speaker 1:I want to be in my bed. Yeah, so for the flavors when I went the year with no alcohol, I didn't even like oh, I want to just taste that pickle-flavored beer and take a sip. You know, I just wanted to say like I'm not even having a sip of anything, just to make sure that the boundaries were clear.
Speaker 1:And same with it now since March, when I had my last drink, like, even if there is a flavor I want to try, I mean, I'm just like I just don't want to start to go over that line and like oh, then you take two sips, you know. So I'm just like it's just not a flavor I have to try, and they're coming out with more and more. Yeah, na beers.
Speaker 2:So I'd rather try food. I love food 100% but I don't want food to replace. I don't want to have an unhealthy relationship with food either.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So yeah.
Speaker 1:But yeah, so maybe you working because you have like the steady workout routine now yeah, how long has that lasted for?
Speaker 2:Well, we're trying to do a home gym in the basement, so like we only have like so many weights, Mm-hmm and so so like my strength has gone down. But I want to keep it like consistent so that I'm just not. I mean I'm, my goal initially, when I first started working out, was I want to crush a watermelon with my legs that's harder than you think.
Speaker 2:I tried to do that after like a year and I had to like rain it down to like a tomato, which was like a joke, but like that was easy, super easy. And there were some teachers at school that were like laughing at me for that. They're like Albie, you can crush a tomato. And I'm like, yes, baby steps, cute. But I tried to do it Before it was like five days a week, but that was like with the gym membership and stuff and wanting to get your money's worth. Now it's like four days, sometimes three, but I don't know. I give myself a little more grace, but it's nice being able to go whenever I want in the basement.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what has kept you consistent?
Speaker 2:Just wanting to be strong, I don't want to be a weakling. So when Levi needs help in the shop to push his truck in or do something, I was like I could do it Not everything. There's been some times where he's like you go to the gym, you lift weights, you could do this, and I'm like, no, I can't and I definitely can't. But there's been some times where I'm like, well, let me try. And then sometimes it's successful and sometimes it's not, but it's nice and it makes me want to work out more. When it does work out and I can lift the endorphins yeah, and that's how we really are as chemicals, right?
Speaker 1:so what other hobbies you said you've been diving into a bunch?
Speaker 2:I really like reading and crocheting like basically a young grandmother yeah that works out.
Speaker 2:But you said it gets annoying because the more hobbies that you add, because then you want to do them every day yes, like yesterday I was a just a zombie on my phone looking at like an unfinished crochet project and looking at my book on the table and I'm'm just like I really want to go do those, but I just didn't have the energy that day. So it's like, but I know that I will finish them and do them the next day, like going to the pool, like I'm going to finish this book that I'm reading, but I'm like purposely reading it slow because it's so good that I don't want it to end.
Speaker 1:What book?
Speaker 2:It's called the Last Party. It's like I'm just into murder mysteries so if there ain't any murder or thrill or whatever, I'm probably not reading it. I was describing this book to my niece yesterday and it's about this mom that is wanting to recreate this murder that happened years ago at a 12-year-old's birthday party and she's planning on murdering her own child at her birthday party and she's like that sounds awful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that does sound awful.
Speaker 2:That sounds awful, but the storyline is just good. I don't know. I'm not planning on doing that at all, but like I don't know, it's just written to where it's like it's got my interests Okay.
Speaker 1:I don't know. It's just written to where it's like it's got my interests. Okay, I'll take your word for it. That's wrath there, I'm just kidding, harnessing it All right, healthy. So when I was thinking about you I've been thinking about you for the last week I thought of you as kind of a rule breaker, like because you, you do have this sassy attitude. You know where do you think Millie gets it from?
Speaker 1:that's her own thing, but I think she gets it a little bit from you. But I asked you if you think you're a ruler breaker and you said you didn't think you were. And because I am, I am like I can remember being five, six, seven years old and my mom saying don't, don't drink water that's been left out overnight. And she said I think she said that she doesn't remember saying that, but you know so maybe it was just like casual, like oh, don't drink that water, it's been out all night. I don't remember, but I remember being like don't drink water, that's been left out all night.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:I was like I'm going to start leaving water out every night to drink in the morning.
Speaker 2:So, since I was very young, I hated rules.
Speaker 1:I don't like baking because everything has to be perfect. With my ex even I remember him I was making pasta and he's like you have to run it under water and I was like there are no rules in life literally. And if there is some, I am going to do the opposite. Women are supposed to get married. Hi, sign me up not to get married like I don't want to.
Speaker 2:I don't want to do what I'm supposed to do well, if you think of rules like that like I don't plan on getting married, but I think it's like I'm engaged and I'll just stay engaged probably change my last name at some point, but not tie it to a piece of paper so if that considers me a rule breaker, that's me. But otherwise I feel like when I go to work I mean you should follow the rules at work, but it's like if I see someone not doing the work I'm just like what the heck?
Speaker 1:Like what are you doing? That bothers me too, so that's a really good point.
Speaker 2:So I don't know, maybe that's just a thing that you should feel when you're at your job, so that gets frustrating. But otherwise, when it comes to rules, I feel like I follow them pretty well. And then I like make my kids follow the rules, like if and I don't know I keep them like close little chickens, I keep them close and we only can for so long, so yeah, and then it makes them like I'm probably making them more paranoid than I need to about the world. But the world is kind of crazy. So I'm just like keep them, make them just more aware and you know their surroundings and stuff.
Speaker 2:Like sometimes I go extreme. Like Joshua wants to ride bike, like with his friends around town. I'm like what, do you want someone to steal you? And he's just no, I was like then stay close. So I don't, I shouldn't say I don't think that'll happen, but um, no, I think I, back in the day, like I think my parents would say like that I would kind of follow the rules. Like my dad would probably say that I was just sassy and he called me a brat actually this last weekend. But I think that's just the stuff I say.
Speaker 1:How about, compared to your brother and sister, who follows the rules the most and the least?
Speaker 2:I think my sister the least she's a pretty free spirit, like a responsible free spirit, and my brother, I think is he's also, as he gets older, like he's pretty responsible, and then I'm just like mother hen responsible, but also like I think my mouth, just the stuff I say, is like like what the heck? Like more trying to be funny witty sarcastic yeah, yeah, but other, so that probably gets me in trouble.
Speaker 1:You said some rules that you follow. Like you're annoyed that you follow, or what did you say?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Like sometimes at work, like and I don't know if a lot of people feel this way but like you follow the rules, you do your job and then, but you see other people not doing that. So you're just like, why do I care so much? Like, if everyone else don't care, like why should I care so much? But then you can't like make yourself care less, you know, which is a good thing, I guess.
Speaker 1:But Well, yeah, this is something I would definitely talk about on my other podcast about leadership is like there's nothing worse than having a leader that doesn't care about the roles being followed, so like nobody else is, and you're like I'm over here doing everything, right, right, and like they just get away with doing whatever they want. Like that is super annoying yeah, very so.
Speaker 2:It's just like why are we on this? We're like here, we're supposed to be like the same. But yeah, why are we not doing the same? But yeah, like, why can't I be?
Speaker 1:shitty. Yeah, like that's how it feels sometimes but then if I do try to, like you know, rein it back or care slightly less and it's, I feel, like bad, well then you don't feel purposeful, no, so, yeah, I think that's a leader job, but anybody can be a leader, so just got to start doing it and show people how good it feels to do the right thing. Yeah, what's your favorite tattoo?
Speaker 2:I was thinking about that. I have quite a few, but I think my scorpion made out of flowers is my favorite. I'm big into horoscopes, moon, baby vibe and always wanted to get one. But I didn't want the generic scorpion, scorpion or like the M and whatever. I wanted to get something that was like unique and something that went with the vibe of the tattoos, which was really flowery, and not that I'll regret any tattoos when I'm old and wrinkly, but like that one's probably my favorite because it's well, it's one of my newer ones too and it's well, it's one of my newer ones too, and it's just, I don't know like fits, the vibe and it like scorpion, which are also sassy I keep reading, but Makes so much sense.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what is something that you're less insecure about than you used to be?
Speaker 2:Definitely more, and this is like just in the past, like years, but more like not insecure about my body and what people think of me.
Speaker 1:Do you think that came from working out or just age? Because, like they definitely say, the older you get, the less insecure you are about physical stuff.
Speaker 2:I'd like to say from working out, but I've always been insecure about my stomach and no matter what I've done, it hasn't changed. And Levi actually said something that is now going to stick with me forever, because so many years ago I wanted to do like a, like a liposuction, but Levi was just like do not do that. And so I didn't do that and um, like regretted it for a while, but then, like I go to the gym, I eat healthy and like my body, just that section just wasn't changing for me. And he said just not too long ago, he's like well, what if that's just the way your body is meant to look?
Speaker 2:and I was like dang okay, yeah, and like I don't know it doesn't bother him, which isn't like the main reason to not care, but like it just, I'm just like, yeah, that's just who I am at some point I have to like.
Speaker 1:If my significant other is happy with my body, it's time for me to be happy with it too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, while he always seems like he's never not been happy, it's just me that's been unhappy and insecure and like I don't know, always trying to like, like this whole time I haven't, like, shaken my shirt out, or you know, adjusted myself or anything like that which I just find. Instead of like fitting into clothes, I just find clothes that fit me, that I like and like by my style I like. I choose comfort over style, for sure. Yeah, sacks and sandals.
Speaker 1:And I try and dress up at work Like I say. I want to, one, two, two, three days a week, but every day it ends up just being sweatshirts.
Speaker 2:I love all kinds of clothes, yeah, but it's just so much easier to be comfortable which then brings into the um, not caring what other people think, like it's just the older, like 36 has been the best year for me, like not drinking and like staying consistent with like working out, finding hobbies that I actually like never had a hobby before. So that was like my kids and family have just been like whatever their hobbies are my hobbies, but like something for me. So and then just like, yeah, just the older I get, the less I care and the more I'm just like let's just tell it how it is, because we're adults and who cares?
Speaker 1:one life. Let's like live it for us. Yeah, what is something that you do that you hope your grandkids do when they're your age?
Speaker 2:I hope that they try new things. Me as a kid, I did not like try anything new in fear of like not being good at it, so I hope that they try new things.
Speaker 1:What's something as a kid that you wish you would have tried?
Speaker 2:Sports? I wasn't in any. I was a softball manager in like 11th grade and that was the closest I got to being in a sport um.
Speaker 1:What sport would you try if you could, right now?
Speaker 2:um volleyball, but do not sign me up for an adult volleyball, but that's something that I really liked as a kid. So now, millie, she's tried volleyball and I really hope she sticks with it, because it's just fun to watch.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, we should just set up for just us to volley back and forth. I just got tennis rackets.
Speaker 2:I have tried tennis. Well, I tried it with a child, but I was like chasing balls all over the place. Yeah, it'd be cool to check out pickleball.
Speaker 1:I think yeah, me too. I've still haven't tried, but really want to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that seems like in like um a not very active, intense sport.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it sounds great. All right, we'll do it this summer, for sure, okay.
Speaker 2:And what do you do that you hope your grandkids don't do? I hope they don't um make themselves small for anyone. I hope they just be themselves and like or be their truest self.
Speaker 1:I don't want them to like change for anybody. The first TED Talk I ever listened to was somebody saying that before you go into a job interview you're supposed to make yourself as big as possible. You know, like take up space to get confidence. Because, um think about it, like when you are, when you literally make yourself small, when you're insecure like this so practice getting big. So that's something I think about, a lot make myself do.
Speaker 2:That's something that I could totally like do myself, or even like everything I want to do for my like change, for me, like I want to have the kids, like practice too.
Speaker 1:So I could totally be like if you're nervous, just like yeah, especially when your kids go to their first job interviews or show up to something that they're nervous about. And also, I have a theory that that's why we overeat as humans because we want to show the world. Yeah, like subconsciously, we're like we want to take up space, and the only way we know how to do that is by eating, you know, and get bigger.
Speaker 2:I don't know. It's like a weird theory.
Speaker 1:It doesn't really make sense, but it does in my head.
Speaker 2:Like look how much.
Speaker 1:I can eat, yeah, yeah. But it does in my head Like, look how much I can eat, yeah, yeah. Well, is there anything else that you wanted to talk about today? Anything we forgot? I don't think so. Okay, awesome, well, you'll have to come back on soon.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's so fun, thank you.
Speaker 2:We'll have to do that sushi thing too.
Speaker 1:Yes, I want to make sushi, my favorite sushi, for you and the other, shauna. Yes, shauna, shauna and sushi, yeah, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:Or however, you had called it before yeah, okay, love you, love you too.
Speaker 1:Knot comes from the Greek word sailor and means voyager or traveler, Like an astronaut searching the stars. A super knot is one searching the inner and outer worlds of self, navigating life, consciousness and reality, striving for betterment. The paradox is that seeking and striving can create more unrest and more unhappiness. So, while calm seas may not make great sailors, I plan to explore the idea of light rescuing darkness instead of fighting it.