Breaking Defiance: Thriving in Nonconformity | Liz Ponce, Embracing Authentic Success

Jän Simon interviews Liz Ponce, a twin mom and co-owner of Arizona-based LZR Marketing, about building a marketing agency without choosing a niche and balancing creativity, leadership, and family. Liz shares growing up in Jackson, Michigan and Chicago before moving to Buckeye Arizona, her competitive background in basketball and drumline, and how she moved through multiple schools to study graphic design. She describes early work in printing and a fast-paced role at Rapid Recovery where she expanded from design into web, events, and Salesforce. After COVID, Liz and her wife started their agency, landed early clients, and were fired from their education-focused agency job shortly after—pushing them to go all-in despite health insurance concerns. Liz explains the split between LZR’s white-glove retainer model and Early Bird’s packaged services, plus realistic expectations for marketing timelines.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:23

So when we started laser, we were intentionally like, we're not gonna have any niche. We've had a lot of people tell us that that's not a good idea. Um, I feel like every like business book you read and stuff like that is always like, you need to have this one specific thing you're working on. And back to the defiance, I guess that's one thing, or I'm just like, I can't, I can't do it.

SPEAKER_01 0:43

Hey there, welcome back to Above and Beyond Where Excellence Meets Elevation. I'm your host, Jan Simon, and this season we're raising the bar, diving into the passion, purpose, and defining moments of leaders who don't just aim high, they live there. Big ideas, real stories. Let's get into it. Welcome back to Above and Beyond Where Excellence Meets Elevation. Today's guest is someone who proves you don't have to fit into one box to build an extraordinary life. Liz Ponce is a twin mom, entrepreneur, creative strategist, obstacle racer, and co-owner of the Arizona-based marketing agency Laser Marketing. But her story goes way deeper than business success. From growing up between Michigan and Chicago to stepping confidently into male-dominated industries, Liz learned early how to compete, adapt, and carve out space where she wasn't always expected to thrive. That same mindset pushed her through over 50 obstacle races, motherhood, entrepreneurship, and the constant balancing act of creativity and leadership. But what makes this conversation powerful isn't just what Liz has accomplished. It's what she's continued to evolve without losing herself in the process. If you've ever struggled to balance ambition, family, identity, and the pressure to keep proving yourself, this episode is going to hit home. Liz, welcome to the podcast.

SPEAKER_04 2:07

Thank you. That was a good intro. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:10

I pride myself on writing amazing scripts.

SPEAKER_03 2:12

Yeah, yeah, they're good.

SPEAKER_01 2:14

Well, welcome. So let's do this. I do this with everybody. Let's start back at the beginning.

SPEAKER_03 2:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Between Michigan and Chicago?

SPEAKER_03 2:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

Were you like where in Michigan?

SPEAKER_04 2:27

Um, Jackson, Michigan. I don't everybody in Michigan always points the hand. I honestly don't know where. I think it's maybe central.

SPEAKER_01 2:34

Okay. Um near Kalamazoo. Kalamazoo's more western, right?

SPEAKER_04 2:37

It's probably like two hours outside of Detroit. Okay. Yeah. Which direction? It is like central. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

And then Chicago. So you went from cold to cold. Er. Yeah. Er.

SPEAKER_08 2:49

To like blazing hot. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:52

I'm done with that. How long were you in Michigan? Or were did you have parents and both, and you kind of bounced back and forth?

SPEAKER_04 2:58

No, we I was born in Michigan. That's where my mom was from, and my dad was from Chicago. I think they went to Loyola, Loyola together.

SPEAKER_02 3:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 3:05

And then they moved to Michigan maybe when they had my sister. I'm not really sure. And then we moved all together when I was five. We moved back to Chicago. Chicago. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

And then you're in Chicago. What part of Chicago? Not that I know, but somebody listening might Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 3:19

The s the city of Chicago. So anybody that's in Chicago will know. In the actual city. Like our address was Chicago, Illinois.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Oh wow. So you were actually you weren't like a suburb of.

SPEAKER_04 3:28

But it was in the suburbs, but it was in Chicago. It's kind of confusing. We didn't live in the city, downtown.

SPEAKER_02 3:36

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 3:37

But we lived in the city of Chicago. Chicago zip code. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 3:41

Kind of confusing. I'll give you that. Yeah, we'll take it. It wasn't like Naperville. Anybody that's from Chicago will know.

SPEAKER_01 3:47

Yeah. I'm trying to think who I recently had on that was from Chicago. Maybe Tednick. I think he was. I think Eric was. Maybe. Outside of Chicago. Anyways. A few Illinois people. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:01

There's a lot here.

SPEAKER_01 4:02

Yeah. I think everybody's, I'm done with this. Yeah. Come out. So Chicago. White Sox or Cubs?

SPEAKER_04 4:08

Cubs.

SPEAKER_01 4:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 4:09

I was the only one in my family, though.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

Oh, really? Yeah. Everybody else is White Sox? Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 4:13

Because I grew up on the South Side, so usually you would be a Sox fan.

SPEAKER_01 4:16

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 4:17

But I had to be different with everything. So.

SPEAKER_01 4:19

What do they call it? Optional defiance disorder?

SPEAKER_04 4:21

I think so, yeah. Sounds about right.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

Y'all can't see this, but Riley's nodding her head in the background. I'm sensing a little bit of tension there. So Chicago, how long were you in Chicago?

SPEAKER_04 4:34

Uh 11 years, 10, 11 years.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

So around 16-ish.

SPEAKER_04 4:38

Yeah. So we moved right after my sophomore year in high school. Ouch.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

Yeah, it was rough. Yeah. That what what moved you guys down here? Or did you come here? Is that I mean, I guess I'm making an assumption.

SPEAKER_04 4:48

No, no, we we all moved down here. I think my mom got a job. I don't know exactly why they wanted to move. I think maybe just a change of scenery or something. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 4:56

I don't know. Sick and tired of shoveling snow. Yeah. Probably. Nine months out of the year.

SPEAKER_04 5:00

Yeah, it's not fun. It's fun to visit.

SPEAKER_01 5:03

Where did you go to high school here then?

SPEAKER_04 5:04

In Goodyear. So desert edge.

SPEAKER_01 5:07

So you're basically East LA.

SPEAKER_04 5:09

Yeah. Yeah. So we moved from Chicago to Buckeye, actually.

SPEAKER_01 5:13

When there was nothing in Buckeye.

SPEAKER_04 5:15

Yes. Like 17 years ago. And they were like, this is going to be a target. I think it like just got built last year.

SPEAKER_01 5:21

Oh my God. Hey, Buckeyes is going in out there. Isn't that going in out there somewhere? Oh God, I could not imagine. I mean, not that Buckeye's bad. There's a song by a local band. Oh crap, the name just Christine's gonna ride me on this one because I forgot the name. It's going out to Buckeye, going down to Buckeye. The name of this, the name of the band just totally left my brain.

SPEAKER_04 5:44

Yeah, I don't know. I never heard it. I didn't know anything. Funk Junkies. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

The name of the band is called Funk Junkies. Uh-huh. And they're a local band with Christine knew somebody, cousin of somebody, I don't know. And uh they had a song called Goin Down to Buckeye. That's funny. Ever get a chance, look that one up.

SPEAKER_04 5:59

Yeah, no, we're gonna have to listen to it.

SPEAKER_01 6:00

Yeah. Going down to Buckeye. Anyways.

SPEAKER_04 6:04

Love it.

SPEAKER_01 6:04

So you moved out to Arizona.

SPEAKER_04 6:06

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 6:06

Did you do sports?

SPEAKER_04 6:08

Um, I played basketball in like grade school.

SPEAKER_01 6:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 6:11

And then I just, like you were saying, the defiance thing. I just like wanted to be done with it.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

And I I'm good enough.

SPEAKER_04 6:17

Yeah. And my parents were like, no, I think you should do it. Like, you're pretty good. And so I just I went to a couple games and I just like did nothing. I was like just kind of standing there.

SPEAKER_01 6:27

And the coach is like, you're done.

SPEAKER_04 6:29

Well, yeah. And they were like, okay, I guess you can be done.

SPEAKER_01 6:34

You played Piccolo in band.

SPEAKER_04 6:36

Yeah, Piccolo. No, I played snare.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

You played the drums.

SPEAKER_04 6:41

Yeah, I did play the drums.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

Were you in a marching band?

SPEAKER_04 6:44

I was, yeah. Okay. Yeah. So I did I started band in grade school, like in fourth grade, like the first time you can never take it. And then just continued until I didn't end up doing it in high school here, but I did it all through high school in Chicago.

SPEAKER_01 6:56

Okay. So I was fortunate enough or unfortunate enough to pretend like I played drums for a little bit. Does the cadence for a marching band still run through your head sometimes?

SPEAKER_04 7:08

Oh yeah. Yeah, I still haven't memorized. Every now and then I could still play the whole thing, probably. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:15

So do you still play the drums?

SPEAKER_04 7:17

I wouldn't say we have a drum set that's supposedly for the for the kids, you know.

SPEAKER_01 7:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 7:22

So I'll mess around with it every once in a while, but nothing, nothing like I used to.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

I would love to get a kit sometime. That's just one of those, like, if I ever had nothing better to do.

SPEAKER_03 7:30

Yeah. Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 7:31

Just because I I do love to play.

SPEAKER_03 7:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:34

I actually played saxophone, baritone sax.

SPEAKER_03 7:36

Okay. Nice.

SPEAKER_01 7:37

And then we needed a drummer.

SPEAKER_04 7:39

You're like, I guess I'll do it.

SPEAKER_01 7:41

Yeah. Well, and I used to just mess around. We had we had a really, really, really talented drummer when I was in in high school up until my I guess my sophomore year is the same age as my brother. So going to my junior year. Yeah. And then we really didn't have anybody that would play for a while. And so I and I messed around.

SPEAKER_03 7:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

I can't even say that I played well. But they stuck me in jazz band. I remember going to jazz competitions.

SPEAKER_04 8:05

You're like, what am I doing here?

SPEAKER_01 8:07

I had no idea how to play the stupid drums. And I'm just making shit up. I never read a lick of music for drums. I could read obviously for saxophone and stuff. So I was in jazz band for the baritone sacks.

SPEAKER_03 8:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

And then yeah, and they moved me. What am I doing here? I could I could play a little, you know, swing ride or something. But it's like, mm-mm. No. I'm I'm not coordinated enough to do different things. There's a a guy that comes up in my feed on Facebook. I can't think of his name now all of a sudden, but anyways, some of the r riffs that he throws out are just Yeah, it's crazy. Insane. Like all four limbs are doing different things.

SPEAKER_04 8:48

I know. It's like it's something I think when you're doing it, you don't really realize how crazy crazy it is until maybe like try to teach somebody else to do it. And you're like, what are you doing?

SPEAKER_01 8:55

Yeah, it's like, why can't you? They're all opposite. Just do it faster.

SPEAKER_04 9:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:01

Alright, so you moved here. You you said you didn't do band in here in high school.

SPEAKER_04 9:05

I didn't, no. Okay. I still played like just like personally by myself, but I wasn't in band or I wasn't in a band or anything like that either.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

You were not in a band.

SPEAKER_04 9:15

Here, yeah. Okay in Chicago I was. So why'd you quit? I don't know. You just decided it was just like everything is so different here.

SPEAKER_01 9:22

I'm just not gonna you're moving me to Arizona, I'm not gonna do anything. Yeah, I will teach you.

SPEAKER_04 9:27

The defiance again. I think it was like it was something I don't know, I felt like I worked so hard in Chicago that to like it almost seemed like I was gonna have to start over, and I was like, well, that seems like a lot. I'll just do something else.

SPEAKER_01 9:40

I'll just figure something else out. I work so hard for all this other stuff. Yeah. Forget it. Down the drain. Okay, so you do a lot of stuff.

SPEAKER_04 9:49

I do do a lot, yeah. I get bored easily.

SPEAKER_01 9:52

Tell me about this this running thing.

SPEAKER_04 9:55

The run oh the the OCRs?

SPEAKER_01 9:57

Yeah, the obstacle courses. Have you done like a Ragnar in those?

SPEAKER_04 10:02

Yeah. I was gonna say whatever you're gonna say, I probably have done it. Yeah. Yeah, I did a couple, two or three Ragnars, I think. I did one here, I did one in Zion, and maybe here again.

SPEAKER_02 10:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 10:12

I did a bunch of Spartans everywhere. Rugged Maniac, no kidding, tough mutter, all of them. Yeah. I think probably like 95% are out of business now.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

Oh really?

SPEAKER_04 10:23

Yeah. I think Spartans are the only one mainly. Still. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:26

I've actually maybe I should do it before they all go out of business. I've thought it'd be a good goal to set to do one of those things. Now that I'm older and my body's deciding to break down, I don't know if it's a good idea. But sure you'll be fine. It'd be I just think that'd be kind of cool. I also I used to think that would be really cool to do a triathlon. I could do the swim and the bike.

SPEAKER_03 10:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:48

It would take training, but I could, I mean, hands down, I could do it.

SPEAKER_04 10:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

The running piece of it.

SPEAKER_04 10:53

Oh, really? Yeah. The swim one is the part that I'm like, I don't know how I would make it through that. Like I can swim, but I don't know if I can swim that well.

SPEAKER_01 11:00

Yeah, swimming, I I used to swim all the time as a kid, and so it's like I'm not gonna say my jam, but like Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:05

You gotta jam.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

We go to camp in the summer, and it was we would literally swim across the lake and back. That was like the big thing you got to do. And it was, I think they said a mile, mile and a half, something like that. And I used to do that as a kid, just and I just I just loved it. Yeah, get out there and just go bike the same thing. I can get them, I still to this day can get on my bike and just go.

SPEAKER_03 11:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:27

And obviously I start to cramp up after miles and miles, but I would have to really get into good shape to be able to do all the hills and all the other stuff that they do for a hundred and whatever many miles it is.

SPEAKER_03 11:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

The running piece of it, man, I'd get like a mile in and be like, I'm done. I'm out. I'm out.

SPEAKER_04 11:44

On second thought.

SPEAKER_01 11:45

Yeah, exactly. Can you substitute somebody in for me and I'll do the other piece, have somebody else come in and run. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 11:55

Okay. I really don't I don't like it, but it just seemed like something that I have to do.

SPEAKER_02 11:59

Just to do.

SPEAKER_04 12:00

Yeah. Even still, I mean, I barely run anymore, but even when I do, I'm like, this feels feels right. Like it feels like I should, but I don't like it.

SPEAKER_01 12:07

Yeah. See, and I can't stand running. What I do like, and maybe it's similar, is like trail running. Like I've gone out too.

SPEAKER_04 12:16

That's why Ragnar's a little bit better.

SPEAKER_01 12:17

Yeah, you know, it's like you get on the usury pass or somewhere and and not that I've done that a lot at all. But when I do that, it's like it's almost easier for me to do it. And I think it's because it keeps my mind occupied. Yeah. When I'm just running on flat surface, I'm like, this is running AF. And I'm not going anywhere, right?

SPEAKER_04 12:35

Yeah, for some reason, I don't know if it's the views or what trails just seem more exciting. Yeah. I don't know what it is, but yeah. But for me, it was just running to get to the obstacle was the the best part of it.

SPEAKER_01 12:47

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 12:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:48

So you graduated high school from Buckeye?

SPEAKER_04 12:51

I didn't. How many people I didn't even I didn't go to graduation.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

No.

SPEAKER_04 12:54

Now I'm just gonna bring up all the time. Yeah, my parents really wanted to do that.

SPEAKER_01 12:58

Did you go to Disneyland or something?

SPEAKER_04 13:00

No, I just didn't go.

SPEAKER_01 13:01

I was like, I'm not going.

SPEAKER_04 13:02

I was like, this doesn't really seem like an achievement.

SPEAKER_01 13:05

Okay, so I have a very serious question to ask you.

SPEAKER_04 13:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:07

Were you like goth in high school?

SPEAKER_04 13:09

No, no, not at all.

SPEAKER_01 13:11

And just I I'm picturing this like black lipstick.

SPEAKER_04 13:15

Exactly. No. No? Okay. Uh-uh.

SPEAKER_01 13:20

Were you a troublemaker?

SPEAKER_04 13:21

I don't I don't think so. I think I, you know, I I think I had like a normal high spirit school experience, like, you know, drinking and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01 13:29

But drinking drugs.

SPEAKER_04 13:31

Oh, you know. Just like weed, you know, nothing crazy. But I I was also the youngest, so I think I always say that if you're the youngest, your parents are tired of parenting sometimes, or not even parenting, just of like So as long as they stay under the radar.

SPEAKER_01 13:48

Well, they shut you up if I give you this lollipop. Okay, go away.

SPEAKER_04 13:51

Smarter about things than they're just like, whatever, just do whatever.

SPEAKER_01 13:55

So yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:56

Not to not to the point of they weren't like the parents that let you drink at our house or anything. Yeah. You know, but I I assumed they knew I was doing things like that, but they're just like, have you ever had that conversation with them? No, I haven't. I should have.

SPEAKER_01 14:10

Did you know what I did in high school? Do you have any clue?

SPEAKER_04 14:13

Wait, I do randomly sometimes tell them the stuff and they're like, What?

SPEAKER_01 14:16

I th I feel like I've dropped a couple truth bombs on my parents at times. And it's funny because I think well, my mom's got dementia and Alzheimer's now, so she's she remembers history, like past stuff, more recent stuff she doesn't remember. So it's funny because like I can see my dad's face like what? But he'll be like, Oh, we knew that.

SPEAKER_04 14:41

He plays it all.

SPEAKER_01 14:43

It's like, uh-huh. Sure you sure you did. Sure you did. What would you say? So uh uh up to that point, what would you say people assumed uh about Liz? Oh, interesting. That was probably inaccurate.

unknown 15:00

Hmm.

SPEAKER_04 15:01

Like in high school? Yeah. Oh, I don't know. What do people assume about me? I've never really thought of I tend to not think about what people think of me.

SPEAKER_01 15:10

Huh. Yeah. That's a good thing to think about. I mean, it's a good thing not to think about. However, you want to say that.

SPEAKER_04 15:17

Yeah. I don't know what they thought about.

SPEAKER_01 15:18

Still to this day.

SPEAKER_04 15:19

I think people I was I was a pretty shy kid though. Pretty quiet.

SPEAKER_01 15:23

See that? Goes along with the goth.

SPEAKER_04 15:25

Yeah, exactly. We're gonna have to like Photoshop a picture of me and Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 15:30

Yes, I'm going to. I'll be an AI tonight.

SPEAKER_04 15:32

You're like, more goth. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Darker.

SPEAKER_04 15:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:36

Body modifications.

SPEAKER_04 15:37

So I feel like people also probably thought I was like introverted. I don't think I'm really introverted.

SPEAKER_01 15:42

You're just quiet.

SPEAKER_04 15:43

Yeah, yeah. I like a few words.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

When there's not a lot to say, I mean Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:48

I'm not a space filler. Come in.

SPEAKER_01 15:50

Coming from a a perspective that is similar.

SPEAKER_04 15:53

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 15:53

I don't need to talk.

SPEAKER_04 15:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:55

Although I talk a lot.

SPEAKER_04 15:56

But if we're sitting around host a podcast and you're like, I don't talk.

SPEAKER_01 16:00

I'm good with silence.

SPEAKER_04 16:34

Yeah, yeah. Right? I'm a time filler with things, but not with words. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:40

Don't tell Christine I said that. Okay. So I got I got questions. I got it. Growing up between Michigan and Oreg um Oregon. I should have my glasses on. Growing up between Michigan and Chicago, were you a competitive type kid?

SPEAKER_04 16:56

Hmm. I think so. I think I've always been pretty competitive.

SPEAKER_01 16:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 17:00

Yeah. With basketball and stuff like that, competing for starting spots or in high school competing for for snare because only a certain number of people can get it because there's only a certain amount of snares and then And you didn't want to play the little bass drum.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_04 17:15

I don't know. I I had a hard time. Yeah, I don't know. That that one just wasn't for me. Yeah. It's weird. Like the beats on it are different. They're like a little bit off, and I yeah, it just wasn't my thing. Yeah. Yeah. So oh, and then once you're on the snare line, then there's like per second. Per second. Yeah. Same with most uh instruments, I think.

SPEAKER_01 17:35

Yep. But drumline would be really cool. Like I said, do not profess to be anything close to even, randomly good. But like watching good drum lines is oh yeah.

SPEAKER_04 17:46

We watch videos of that. It's fascinating. Yeah. The kids even love it. Like we'll watch we'll turn YouTube videos of it on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:52

I love it. I mean, I literally I I think back, it's one of those things that I I mean, aside from everything else I wish, that's one of those things I wish I would have actually become good at because I just think it's so cool.

SPEAKER_04 18:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:05

But it's fun.

SPEAKER_04 18:06

Yeah, it was a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_01 18:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 18:08

I think if I would have stayed in one place, I probably would have drum done like drum cores, which is like I don't know, the the sport equivalent of like club teams.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 18:18

But because they were like really big in Illinois. Oh, okay. I don't know how big they are out here, but I have no idea.

SPEAKER_01 18:23

I think it feels it feels to me like, and not Illinois Southern, but it feels like that's kind of a more East Coast Southern type thing. Kind of similar to the uh some of the sorority like dancing sorority stuff. Yeah. Where you see the you know more competition things that they do and stuff like that. But um so kind of competitive, maybe sort of a little bit.

SPEAKER_04 18:45

Yeah, I think I still am too.

SPEAKER_01 18:48

Do you feel like I mean so I'm psychoanalyzing you now. You're got to it.

unknown 18:54

I'm God.

SPEAKER_01 18:55

But so like you do do you feel like you were constantly trying to earn approval from people being the youngest and kind of going through different things and or trying to prove to yourself oh, I don't need to do what I've always done, I can Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:09

Yeah, probably. I think I always chose the like you kind of said in the intro, like male-dominated fields. So like on the snare line, I was the only girl. I think it used to be an all-boys school, so I was the first girl too.

SPEAKER_02 19:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 19:22

I don't know, just all my hobbies have just always been like male-dominated ones, so then it's always like the younger person and the only girl. And the female, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:32

We had I think we just had one girl, Galen Thomas, I think was her name.

SPEAKER_04 19:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

I don't know why that just popped in my head. But she was shout out to Galen. Yeah, shout out to Galen. I think she was the only female drummer that I can remember. But she came in behind me, I think maybe a year or two behind me, but she was really good.

SPEAKER_03 19:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:52

I was like, thank God for her, because I sucked.

SPEAKER_04 19:55

Yeah, we had I think we had four total, but like one plate bass drum or one or two plate-based. One was younger than me, so like when you start out as a freshman, you have to play cymbals basically. Cowbell. Yeah. They say that for the triangle. You gotta do that in concert. Yeah. That that season! Oh, that was it. Concert season was the worst.

SPEAKER_01 20:13

I hated that. Oh yeah. Yeah. I I was the same. Like, I even I I enjoy going to concerts and watching them. Like we went to Christine's nieces not too long ago, and I enjoy that. But I can remember as a kid, it's like, oh my god, this is killing me. Yeah, it's so boring. And you go, like, especially like we go to the competitions and stuff, so it's like you wait around all day and then you perform and you're watching everybody else, and you're like, it's killing me.

SPEAKER_04 20:38

Yeah, so boring. I think also like marching season, a lot of it is like based in the drumline, you know? You know, you're kind of like, I feel like piloting the whole thing, yeah. The whole performance. And then once you get to concert, it's like you'll sit in the back for five minutes until you had to play like one note.

SPEAKER_01 20:54

Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_04 20:59

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 20:59

Um so you finished high school.

SPEAKER_04 21:01

I did, yeah. I graduated a semester early. Okay. Um, because I also hated high school. I didn't really ever like school. Um, so I was always trying to figure out how to make it through as fast as I could. Yeah. So I did like online school, graduated a semester early, and then did like community college for a semester, I think. Nice. Yeah. And then I went to ASU for a year. Again, hated school. So I was like, I don't I don't think I'm gonna stay here. And then I went to like a small design school that was like a little bit faster paced.

SPEAKER_02 21:30

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 21:31

So the program was three years, but since I started to ASUS, graphic design or okay yeah. It was graphic design since community college. So I took like a couple classes in high school, and then I was just like, I don't know, this seems pretty nice. I guess I'll just stick with it forever.

SPEAKER_01 21:46

And then you need to feel the change to change the reason to Yeah, I was like, I don't know, I guess I'm pretty good at this.

SPEAKER_04 21:52

I don't know. As if anybody was saying otherwise. I'm like, I don't know. It seems all right.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

It's a good thing your parents didn't tell you you were good at it because we probably wouldn't be doing that right now.

SPEAKER_04 22:01

Like, you know, I'm good at it? Never mind. I'm out.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

Oh, I don't want to do this. If you think I'm good, I'm done. Yeah, I'm gonna go fight fire.

SPEAKER_04 22:09

That's so true. Wow, we should thank them for that.

SPEAKER_01 22:12

Next time you see them, I just want to thank you for not ever telling me I was good at programming or design. Um so you went to college, design. A few, yeah. A few colleges. Talk me through getting out of college your first job, or did you have a job or did you go straight into your business, or how did that work out?

SPEAKER_04 22:30

Um I did a I think I did like two internships when I was in college, or one was like more of just like a printing job. Like I worked at a print printer. It was like out in Buckeye. And then I worked at Brookline College. I'm not I think it's still around. I'm not really sure. It's like a vocation. I've heard of that, yeah. Yeah, it's for like like nursing type or medical healing type things. So that was like where I did my internship for like three months or something like that. And then I worked at another. Printer, actually, in Chandler. Sir Speedy.

SPEAKER_00 23:00

Oh, I've heard of that, yes.

SPEAKER_04 23:01

I think they're a franchise, but there's one here in Chandler that I worked at. Yeah, I hated. I hated it. It was so boring.

SPEAKER_01 23:08

Were you just like like print copy printing? It was or like were you doing the actual graphic design work?

SPEAKER_04 23:14

Yeah, it was more like pre-pressed stuff. So that's like people will send in files and then you kind of just have to touch them up a little bit, get them ready to print, and send them to the printer. And then yeah, I was doing I was actually printing stuff and like cutting sometimes. There was like a person that did production stuff, but every once in a while it'll just help out and stuff. Yeah, but it was it was so boring.

SPEAKER_01 23:34

That's brutal.

SPEAKER_04 23:35

Yeah. So I think I worked there for maybe like a month and a half.

SPEAKER_01 23:39

Or long-term employee.

SPEAKER_04 23:41

I know, right?

SPEAKER_01 23:42

Take note, everybody.

SPEAKER_04 23:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:44

If you ever want somebody that's gonna stick around for a while, Liz is your gal.

SPEAKER_04 23:48

As long as you don't tell me how good it is.

SPEAKER_01 23:49

Yeah, tell her she sucks constantly.

SPEAKER_04 23:51

And then um and then I interviewed at a refrigerant recovery company, which I was like, I have no idea what this is, but I don't even know. I think it was my boss at my internship knew somebody that was hiring, so then he had reached out to me about the job, something something like that.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

He's like, You suck at graphic design, so you should go to work for this.

SPEAKER_04 24:09

He's like, No, he's like, You shouldn't go there. And I was like, I'm going.

SPEAKER_01 24:13

I will show you.

SPEAKER_04 24:15

Yeah, so I entered I had lived in Tempe at the time, but it was out in Peoria. Oh, yeah, and I was like to the west side. That's a rough drive. Yeah, it is. I was like back and forth about whether I was gonna take the job or not, and then I finally was just like, I guess I'll do it. But yeah, I'm glad I did because that I mean I did so much stuff there. Yeah. There was never one day I was bored. It was the complete opposite. Really?

SPEAKER_01 24:37

Oh yeah. And were you doing design work for them as well?

SPEAKER_04 24:40

Yeah, so I started out just a graphic designer. I don't wanna that's cool if you just are a graphic designer. Don't want to insult anyone. Sure you do. I started out only doing graphic designer.

SPEAKER_01 24:50

She was a goth graphic designer.

SPEAKER_04 24:52

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

And um I can already picture it in my head.

SPEAKER_04 24:58

I hope Riley's I hope O'Reilly's working on it right now. Yeah. Yeah, I did. I and so I started off only doing graphic design there. Um, and then they would just kind of be like, Hey, can you do this? And I would be like, I don't know. I guess we'll see. I'll try it out. Or I was probably just like, Yeah, I can. And then just over there figuring out what it was. So like web development, web design, Salesforce development, Salesforce setup, and yeah, like literally anything you could think of that a company would even need to market.

SPEAKER_01 25:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 25:27

I did.

SPEAKER_01 25:28

So Can I tell you I hate Salesforce?

SPEAKER_04 25:31

Everybody everybody hates Salesforce. Because like it's so customizable that people get a team or somebody who customize it so badly that they're like, the Salesforce sucks.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Well, and it's it I feel like these people trying to think of the best way to say this without offending anybody.

SPEAKER_03 25:55

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 25:55

You just said that.

SPEAKER_03 25:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:57

That you get these people who are tickers and decide, oh, we can do that.

SPEAKER_03 26:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:05

Well, let me do that.

SPEAKER_03 26:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:07

Oh, I can pull those numbers, well, let me do that. What? I can do that. I okay. Now once a week, you need to go in and pull all of these reports. And it's probably gotten better since I use it because I was like 12 years ago.

SPEAKER_04 26:22

I would say like that aspect of it has probably gotten worse with AI because now everybody thinks they're an expert in everything. Yeah. And they're I can just pull these reports and not even realizing, you know, Salesforce is a little bit better because they own all of the AI, so it's looking at your actual data, but you start hooking it up to other things and it's just making making crap up and it's horrible.

SPEAKER_01 26:42

I mean, it's a great program, don't get me wrong. Right, yeah. It's just uh I couldn't I and I was on a sales team when we used it for a year and a half, I think. And they would pull I mean, and and you can do this in other programs too. My experience is just Salesforce, but it was things like how come you only spent 14 seconds on this call? How come you did this and we listened to that call and you said this there, but then over here you it's like I'm like just let me do my job. Let me calm down alone and let me do my job. Don't make me pull these stupid reports and explain them. Anyways, okay. So you became proficient at Salesforce, we'll say.

SPEAKER_04 27:19

Yeah. Yeah, I still we still have clients that we do Salesforce development admining for, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 27:25

Yeah, I mean, we really do it all. So yeah, that job, I mean, I did everything, even like events. I didn't like run the event, but we did all event graphics and everything like that for for it was a franchise network, so like once a year all the franchise owners would come here and then we would have like a big conference where we had to do everything for and that was Freon recovery? Um, refrigerant, yeah. Refrigerant recovery. It's like Freon's just like uh like a type of uh brand.

SPEAKER_02 27:51

Oh, okay. Huh. So same thing.

SPEAKER_01 27:54

Interesting.

SPEAKER_04 27:55

Yeah. Yeah, it's a an like an odd company to think like there's so much to do, but right.

SPEAKER_01 28:02

That's what I'm thinking, is like how how much is there actually to do on the back end of that?

SPEAKER_04 28:08

Right? Yeah, a lot. Yeah. We did websites, obviously our website, landing pages, postcards, flyers, um emails, Salesforce, anything, and yeah, ads, like digital ads and everything. I would say like our the CEO of that company is like very what's the best way to put it? Like he's like super into technology and like marketing. Okay. And like our IT team. So it's like we innovated, I guess, is the best way to put it. So he was like always looking for kind of like that edge. Yeah. So it kind of like pushed all of us forward to make sense.

SPEAKER_01 28:46

It's funny because I think about that, like and we were talking about this before we came on the podcast. I'm I'm tinkering with some stuff with the agency as far as some AI stuff and you know, Zapier and some different things. How can I make things work together? And I almost feel like if I could afford to hire a somebody who understood technology full-time to just do that. So, okay, this is what I want this to do.

SPEAKER_04 29:07

Then they just do it. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

Because I probably spend a hundred percent more time doing that than what it really takes to do. Yeah. But you know, it's my thing too, though, is I'm so scattered all over the place most of the time, where like I'll have this great idea and I plug it in there and I'm like, oh, this is really kind of cool. Let's tweak, tweak this, do this, test this, and oh, oh, it's cool, it's working. And then I walk away from it. Yeah. And by the time I come back, I'm like, where was I?

SPEAKER_08 29:34

Yeah, trying to play catch up with it.

SPEAKER_01 29:36

Yeah, and I don't want to go back and watch the whole thing. So it's like, hey, give me an overview of what we were thinking here. Yeah, that's too cool. Uh, it's funny. So you you you work for a few different companies. Um at what point did you start thinking you wanted to potentially branch out on your own and do your own thing?

SPEAKER_04 29:53

Yeah. So I I mean I freelanced for forever since high school. It was always something I did on the side. And then I think so. After I left Rapid, that was the refrigerant recovery company, I started at an agency because we ended up getting bought out at Rapid and I didn't love like the direction it was going. So I was like and I was so busy that I was like, I don't this isn't really worth it to me anymore.

SPEAKER_02 30:15

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 30:16

So I left to go to an agency as a graphic designer, and it was okay for a little bit, but uh then I got super bored again. And so I met my wife at the agency, and during COVID we were just kind of, I don't know, like everybody else, I think a little bored. Um and we're like, let's just like try to do this on our own. Like we had always talked about it, and I think during COVID it was like, I mean, we don't have anything else to do, we don't really have anywhere to go, so I guess we might as well start it. And yeah, it just kind of worked out.

SPEAKER_01 30:45

Never stopped from there. Have you ever explored because like you see you see all this stuff where it's like hit it big on the internet, whatever, you know, make these bots and stuff. Have you ever explored any of that stuff where you're like, okay, we can create a marketing agency to do this stuff kind of automated? Do the agency portion of it? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:05

A little bit, yeah. I think that's kind of I wouldn't really say super automated because I I still personally like to leave design stuff to to me. I mean, selfishly.

SPEAKER_02 31:15

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:16

I suck at writing, so I'm gonna use it every day for for that unless somebody sends me copy.

SPEAKER_01 31:21

I'm a horrible original content, is that what it's called? Uh original thought. I don't know what the what the terminology is, like coming up with ideas. Yeah. Like I I was the kid where they're like, give you, you know, pencil and piece of paper and say, write a story about what you did yesterday.

SPEAKER_04 31:35

And I'd be like, You're like, what did I do yesterday? No idea. Completely blank.

SPEAKER_00 31:42

What did I do?

SPEAKER_04 31:43

Yeah, that's that's me with writing. I like I I don't know where to start, so I'll always use AI, like I said, unless somebody sends me something. Um but design I've always kind of kept for me. Um selfishly, yeah. Most of the stuff I'm like, I think I could do that better.

SPEAKER_02 31:58

So gotcha.

SPEAKER_04 32:00

But I would I would say with Early Bird, like we had intended for some of that, not not necessarily to be AI run, but maybe like contractor run. So that's kind of our gonna be our goal with that one.

SPEAKER_02 32:09

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 32:10

Because there's only so many hours in the day and have toddlers now.

SPEAKER_01 32:14

So how old are your kids?

SPEAKER_04 32:16

Two, a little over two and a half.

SPEAKER_01 32:18

Two and a half. And they're twins, right?

SPEAKER_04 32:19

They are, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

Oh, you're in a terrible. Are they in the terrible twos?

SPEAKER_04 32:22

Oh yeah. I would say they're they're closer to like the three major stuff. Because they're they're just like very they're very opinionated. They're they're spicy.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

The boys boys or girls? One of each. One of each, okay. Yeah. That's so long ago I almost can't even remember it. But my daughter sent me a picture today and it totally warmed my heart. So when she was a baby, just learning to pull herself up to walk.

SPEAKER_03 32:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

I would hold both feet in one hand and hold her, standing up.

SPEAKER_03 32:53

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

Well, I did the same thing with my grandson, who's about I think he's nine months old now. But I last time I saw him, I did that. And she took a picture of me doing it. So she sent me the two pictures spliced together. It was so cool. But it's I love kids. But yeah, they're a blast. It goes so it goes so fast.

SPEAKER_04 33:09

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 33:11

When you're in the moment, you're like, could it go quicker?

SPEAKER_04 33:13

Some days it it feels like it could go quicker. But yeah, it's a lot of fun. There's literally never a dull moment, you know, there's always something going on.

SPEAKER_01 33:21

Yeah, yeah, for sure. So you've got, I'm gonna say two successful marketing companies, because you've got laser marketing and you've got early bird strategies.

SPEAKER_04 33:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:29

Talk to me about what the difference between the two is.

SPEAKER_04 33:31

So laser is was our original one that we started. And I think originally it was just kind of like a it's a marketing agency, you know, we're just doing everything. We're do we're doing paid ads, we're doing social media. I don't know, like literally, you want a postcard like it's 1976? Sure, we'll make you a postcard.

SPEAKER_01 33:49

Do you even remember 1976?

SPEAKER_04 33:50

I haven't maybe I was born, maybe not. I will say postcards are coming back around though. Print print media is coming back around because people are getting tired. They're getting tired of AI and stuff. But yeah, so like I I always say like literally everything that marketing is in the word, we're we'll do it.

SPEAKER_02 34:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 34:08

And a lot of times that like the same thing with Rapid, if somebody asked me something, and I'm like, yeah, sure, I could probably do it. That was kind of how it originally started. Um, and then we got to the point where, like I was saying, there's you know, so many hours in the day, we want to try to grow more. How are we gonna be able to do that? Maybe on the same brand or maybe not, and then we kind of came to the decision that we were gonna separate them. So laser was gonna stay for like a white label agency. Not white label, what's the term I'm thinking of? White glove, thank you.

SPEAKER_00 34:37

White glove, okay.

SPEAKER_04 34:38

I mean, we do like white label too, but that's not what I was talking about.

SPEAKER_01 34:41

So more, so more concierge type services. Exactly.

SPEAKER_04 34:44

Yeah, so I always like half-joke that like if a client calls me like right now and they're like my website went down, and I'm like, okay, I gotta stop this podcast and get this website back up, kind of thing. So you know, it allows us to have less clients there that we're maybe a little bit more focused on. We have that ability to be like a fractional CMO. So any type of marketing thing we're gonna do for them. So we're essentially like an in-house team.

SPEAKER_02 35:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 35:07

That's a contractor. And then EarlyBird is kind of intended for smaller companies with smaller budgets. So we thought of Early Bird because it's like like those kind of business owners that are getting up at you know 5 a.m. to start working on their business. Yeah. Um, maybe they're just starting out, or maybe they're at the point where they're like, okay, this is finally too much stuff for me. I need to pass something off. And then, you know, we're hoping that that something's gonna be marketing.

SPEAKER_02 36:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:05

So there are a lot more packages. So laser is just kind of like anything, and we basically will well the majority of the time there's just a retainer. It's like anything you want us to do under that retainer, we'll do. Early words like this, we have this package for social media or this package for paid media, and then yeah, we just kind of take it from there.

SPEAKER_01 36:24

Was there a point after starting it? And we'll say starting laser because that was first, right? Yeah. After starting, was there a point at which you felt like all of a sudden it there was some success behind you, there's some momentum behind you where you're like, hey, we actually might be able to pull this off?

SPEAKER_04 36:40

Yeah, I think so. I think like our s our first client was probably somebody I got off of Fiverr or something like that, because we were just I don't know, where do we find clients? We just gotta go to those gig websites. Um, our second one was the CEO and my old boss from Rapid Recovery. They had left and started their own business. Um, and that one was like our first big client, you know. They were paying us like a full retainer and everything like that. I think we were at when we started, we were probably at like 60 hours a month or something crazy. And we were like, Yeah, this is it. Like we're finally doing it. We were still working at the agency at that time, and I think probably like a week later, the agency found out that we had started our doing our own thing. We probably had like two posts out on our social media, and they were like, Yeah, you can't do that. Oh, really? Yeah, so they fired us.

SPEAKER_01 37:27

Was that because of a compete comp competing or conflict of interest?

SPEAKER_04 37:30

Or yeah, I don't know. They they brought us in one day, it was during COVID, so we weren't in the office. So they brought us in saying that they had some meetings. We went in there and they were like, Hey, we heard that you guys started this thing, and we're like, I don't even know how you heard about it, first of all. And they were basically like, you can't do that because of, I don't know, working on company time or something like that. And so after that, they didn't have us sign anything. So I was like, we're kind of like a little bit confused about what we can and can't do. So I had emailed them back to be like, Hey, can you kind of answer some questions for us? Like, what do you do you want us to work on this on separate times? Are there certain things that we can't do, certain types of clients or whatever, because the agency was only doing education? So we're like, We're not going for education because we're kind of burnt out with it. And then they were like, Oh, it would be better for you to come in so we can answer these questions, and then they brought us in and fired us. And they were like, We think that you're not gonna be able to keep up with I don't know, whatever standards or something. So I don't know. I don't know exactly what it was.

SPEAKER_01 38:33

What was that like when when they when they let you go?

SPEAKER_04 38:36

Getting fired?

SPEAKER_01 38:37

I mean, I've been there, so I know kind of how I felt.

SPEAKER_04 38:40

But were you like I think was was there some relief in that where you're like, I wasn't even I don't even know if it was relief. I mean I thought it was a little funny, honestly. Because I don't know, I was just like, all right, I guess. I don't I don't know. Yeah. I don't know what you want what he had expected of us. I don't think I was like super scared or anything. Like most people would probably here we go. Yeah, I'm like, okay, I guess I guess this is our kind of push to go all in with it.

SPEAKER_01 39:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 39:07

I didn't the only thing got sucked is we didn't have health insurance, you know.

SPEAKER_01 39:10

Uh that which is huge.

SPEAKER_04 39:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:12

I mean, i anymore that's i i it's crazy because I was just talking to somebody the other I don't remember what anyway, side note. It it's so expensive as an individual or you know, individual partners, however you want to look at that, right to pick up insurance. And then and then it's like on top of the monthly cost, now you've got the deductible and the co-pays and all the other stuff. Right, yeah. It's almost like, can I just do cash pay?

SPEAKER_03 39:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:38

And then if something really bad happens, I just want something to cover me.

SPEAKER_03 39:42

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:43

Which you can't get to those. It's changed a little bit, but you can't really get to the high deductible plans unless you're in a group.

SPEAKER_04 39:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:51

It's like, but I can't get a group because it's whatever.

SPEAKER_04 39:54

So it's a crazy system.

SPEAKER_01 39:56

Yeah, it's screwed up.

SPEAKER_04 39:57

Yeah. Yeah. Luckily, luckily at that time I didn't have kids or anything. It was just me. So I was like, oh, I guess we'll figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 40:03

Yeah. Has your has there been anything from from that transition point? Um, and we'll call the transition point your previous employer giving you the opportunity to be wildly successful.

SPEAKER_04 40:15

What a nice spin. You should work in marketing. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 40:18

I think somebody said that to me once. I was stealing it. But has there has there been a point at which you kind of had to unlearn everything up to that point to be able to go, okay, now in order to do this as a as a entrepreneur or as a business owner, I need to to kind of put some of that stuff in the Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:37

Interesting. I don't I don't really think so. I think honestly the biggest learning curve was trying to figure out like, what do what do we do about taxes? What do we do about this money in our account? Like, how do we take it out with Are we gonna get in trouble if I take this money out of my account?

SPEAKER_01 40:52

I've been there.

SPEAKER_04 40:52

I've actually thought, God, how do I even get it out of my account?

SPEAKER_01 40:56

Write myself a check?

SPEAKER_04 40:58

Because I set it we set up like a credit union and I was like, how do how do we even get it out? I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 41:02

That's funny. That's funny.

SPEAKER_04 41:04

I think I had to like call them and be like, do I I literally like, do I write myself a check? I don't So we did that for a few months. We had to we actually did have to go into the bank and like write ourselves checks to deposit money every time we wanted. And then I was like, I was you know, I was trying to go to a credit union, yeah, not a big bank, and then after a couple months, I was like, we're just gonna go to Chase and set up an account because this is ridiculous.

SPEAKER_01 41:25

You get access to it everywhere.

SPEAKER_04 41:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

Yeah, no, I've been there. It's like it's like that I'm gonna go do this, right? Yeah, and then all the things you don't think about, like, okay, well, I need bank accounts, I got bank accounts, I got I oh, I've got to have what how many bank accounts do I need? Oh my god, I've got okay, well, how do I get the money from this account to that account? Ah so with your business and and what you what you do with the marketing and and we'll say on your path to growth, what is what is something that you think people don't see or don't understand about what it is that you do?

SPEAKER_04 42:00

About marketing in general?

SPEAKER_01 42:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 42:02

That's a good question. I think like the honestly, the biggest one that we talk about with our clients is like the time, time for results. People are like, oh, we're gonna start running ads or social media, and they're like, How how long until I get a client? I'm like, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 42:19

Great question.

SPEAKER_04 42:20

There's a lot of agencies out there that will guarantee results. Um yeah, of like I don't know how you could do that. I don't know either.

SPEAKER_01 42:27

No, we're we're very intentional about like call up their cousin and say, hey, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_04 42:31

I'm like, are they real results or how are we doing this? So we're very intentional about like, I don't know, we're just like very honest people, you know. Of like, yeah, like if you have this idea for a campaign, I might be like, I wouldn't do that. That kind of that's not a good idea. But I think yeah, that like time factor, because everybody wants results fast, you know. When we start a campaign for ourselves, we want results fast. Right. And I'm I'm probably even asking Riley, I'm like, why don't we have any leads yet? She's like, She's like, are you kidding me?

SPEAKER_01 42:58

It's been a day.

SPEAKER_04 43:00

So that's the toughest one to get around. But but I also think like knowing which platforms to use or like which avenues of marketing to use on which things, you know. Like social media, for example, I I think it's changed a little bit. Like people are probably getting some leads through it now with like the influencer community and stuff like that. But like the majority of the time it's just for like brand awareness, you know, making sure that your brand's out there, people are seeing you on your feed. But like, I don't know, personally, like when I'm on social media, I'm not like looking for a contractor or something like that. Or if I find one, I'm not gonna reach out to them on Instagram. I'm still gonna go through their website or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 43:39

Well, and I kind of feel like, and and not that I don't want people to still post me because I enjoy it when people post, hey, call Yana Foundation or whatever. But I almost feel like the people who are on social media asking Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 43:53

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 43:54

It's not necessarily the right client for me. Now, that's not to say they're not all the right client. There could be one or two in there that are potentially, yeah. But most of the time, the ones that I see, it you know, they're like, oh, my rates went up fifty dollars and I'm so pissed off. And it's like, yeah, okay, so what? So did coffee and milk and eggs.

SPEAKER_04 44:15

Yeah, so did everything.

SPEAKER_01 44:16

Like, you know, it's like if you're upset about 50 bucks, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_04 44:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:20

But so Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 44:21

I feel that way about like like Facebook, like Living Chandler or I think Gilbert Living or whatever. Like when we first started out, we were constantly trying to post in there. And now I'm at a point where I mean, every once in a while somebody will mention us, but like you're saying, the majority of them they're never gonna reach out or they're just looking for the lowest cost, and that's not us.

SPEAKER_01 44:40

So and they yeah, they would they just tell me what the price is. It's like there's a whole thing to this, you know. And same thing with insurance. People are like, Well, can you save me money? It's like more than likely, yes.

unknown 44:54

Right.

SPEAKER_01 44:54

But is is that all you're concerned with? Because you've got to spend this money.

SPEAKER_03 44:59

Right.

SPEAKER_01 45:00

Let's make sure you're covered. Yeah. Right. Let's at least make sure it's gonna do what it's supposed to do. Yeah. Not just save you money because and I get it. I mean, I hate paying my premiums, right? Yeah. But it's a necessary evil. If I get in an accident, I'd be damn sure I'll be happy that it's there. You know, so exactly. Um as life progresses. Well, actually, let's stop. Go back. With regards to the business, uh huh, where where do you hope to go? You've now diverted. Diversified. So you've got laser for the rich people. I'm just kidding. I love it. That's what we're gonna do. If you're rich, call laser. No, it you've got more of the concierge service with laser, and then you've got the stars, which I think is brilliant, honestly. And you guys are a client of or I'm a client of yours. You're not a client of me. I'm a client of yours. So I love it because I'm in that space where it's like a full-blown marketing organization, marketing be rather expensive.

SPEAKER_03 46:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:38

It is time consuming. I get it, because I've tried to do it myself. So I understand it's time consuming. But at the same time, it's like you know, just to spend that kind of money is tough sometimes.

SPEAKER_04 46:48

Oh, yeah. It's a lot. And not every business needs it.

SPEAKER_01 46:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 46:50

Some people are like honestly, our business is 98% word of mouth. Like we've marketed very rarely.

SPEAKER_01 46:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 46:58

And so not everybody needs it.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

Well, and that's I mean, the the insurance agency is I would say nearly a hundred percent.

SPEAKER_04 47:06

I mean, maybe it's to the point where you're like, I can't even take any more clients.

SPEAKER_01 47:09

Yeah, I kind of well, I don't know that that's the case. I had to always take more clients.

SPEAKER_04 47:13

Yes, unless you just hide them.

SPEAKER_01 47:14

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But with the podcast, it it's but I'm going after kind of a different market, and it's more like branding and building, and you've got to do it online and that sort of thing. I think I had a question somewhere in there and I lost it. Oh, diversifying with the two businesses. What do you hope to accomplish and where where do you see the business in 10 years from now?

SPEAKER_04 47:35

I hope to accomplish. I I think honestly, just like growing both of them. Hopefully, maybe at some point I'll lose not lose, let a little of the control go and we'll actually hire more people. That's definitely been our hardest thing because I'm just like very nitpicky with everything. So I would say like design and web development is probably the one thing that we have the most of from our clients. Okay. Like the most work. And I we've tried to hire designers off of, I don't know, fiber and stuff like that, or people that we've known and none of them have really stuck. Um like some have been okay, but I'm just so nitpicky that I'm like, no, that's not right. Like you used the wrong color, like it wasn't even in this brand's color palette, and then I'm just like, I can't even I can't even deal with it anymore.

SPEAKER_01 48:25

I had somebody speaking of color, when I first started the agency, I had some shirts embroidered, and I sent them the images and I sent them the color files.

SPEAKER_03 48:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:38

Exactly what they were. The person took the color off of the computer screen, and I got the logos back, and they were like completely the wrong colors.

SPEAKER_04 48:46

Oh my god. Like, yeah, and you're like, what are you you're like, this person doesn't know what they're doing.

SPEAKER_01 48:51

What is this? Anyways. It was a couple iterations later, I finally got what I needed. But so so at some point, you Yeah, and I don't want to make that sound bad, because I'm kind of the same way. Like it's tough for me. And and part of it is, I think, and I'll I'm talking the agency now, part of it is because what we're selling not only is a product of a carrier, but we're really truly selling ourselves, right? Yeah, the only thing that makes me different or our agency different than any other insurance agency out there, yeah, truly, is me, my morals, my ethics, my ability to do what I do. And I would assume it's probably very similar in your world that it's like, yeah, there's a deliverable, but at the end of the day, you're truly selling yourself. So if what you're selling isn't working, yeah, then it's like, okay, well.

SPEAKER_04 49:46

Yeah. It's like every everything feels like it's a direct reflection of me or or us as an agency. But yeah, so I'm I'm like so crazy about that stuff. Even like if a client asks me to like, oh, can you put this QR code or something, even if it's something that they think is so small, I'm like, no, you should send that to me first. Like, I'll make sure it looks okay.

SPEAKER_01 50:07

Like, yeah. Yeah. It's interesting because now that I'm about two years down the road of having actual employees, not just somebody who kind of works for me, but actual employees. I can tell you the more control I've given up, better it's gotten. Absolutely. Yeah. 100%. And and it's hard. I mean, I'm it has been very difficult. And and we talked a little bit, I'm thinking about bringing on either a marketing person or a producer or something like that. And it's like I'm just like it because this person's out selling my brand.

SPEAKER_04 50:43

Right. Yeah. They're like, are they gonna say the right thing?

SPEAKER_01 50:45

Exactly. Are they gonna say what they need to say? Are they gonna present us correctly? Are they gonna show up? I mean, I've got jeans and a t-shirt on. That's how I show up every day. But, you know.

SPEAKER_04 50:55

But what are they gonna do? Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 50:58

So, anyways, I I totally get it. And and it's tough, you know, but it's crazy because I feel like, yes, as soon as you do that, and I think it was do you know Eric Reaver? He owns Speed Pro Imaging.

SPEAKER_04 51:08

Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:09

Or Speed Pro Gilbert or whatever they call it now. I think it was he and I having a conversation one day about hiring somebody, and he's like, You just gotta do it. Yeah, he says just you just gotta do it because it's not gonna be easy. There's no silver bullet to make it feel good, you know. Like you just gotta do it. And then, you know, trust little bits at a time. Give the pieces away that you can double check and triple check and you know, make sure it's okay.

SPEAKER_03 51:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:34

And it's not a hundred percent, it never will be, but anyways, with the kids, what do you hope to show them with regards to where the business is as moms and and as you help them develop into pain in the ass teenagers and then someday hopefully good adults? What what do you what are you hoping that that you can show them through the business aspect of things?

SPEAKER_04 52:01

Yeah. I think I mean hopefully they don't get any of the defiance portion of it. That would be great. But I think I don't know, just like hard work and really more so like I less of hard work. I mean, they should work hard, but more of just like following those passions that you have. I think like a lot of probably most generations, like parents in general want their kids to make money, you know? So I think a lot of people probably get straight away of like, oh, you shouldn't do that because it's not gonna make you money. We hear that a lot, like one of our clients is still in the refrigerant industry, so like like trades, you know. Those are all great industries to get into and people are like, You're not gonna make money there, but like I mean, really you are gonna make it. Or like you're they had just recorded a podcast with like an influencer in the their industry that was like a lot of people told her, like, you're too smart to to be in the trades, you know. So really just about following whatever they're passionate about.

SPEAKER_02 52:56

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:57

I mean, money is great for most people. It's not everybody wants it though. So if you want to live in uh, you know, travel the country in a van or something instead, like go for it.

SPEAKER_01 53:08

Which which I think is becoming more and more tangible from from the way technology is allowing society to do some of those things. But I think it's so important. I I mean, I stepped into insurance 30 years ago because I needed to make some money to to raise a family. And I've I will say been stuck in it ever since. It's been a good life for me for the most part. Yeah. But it's not what I've ever really been passionate about. But I've been in it for so long, I feel like, okay, I need to stick with this. Right.

SPEAKER_04 53:36

Yeah, like what what else? What else?

SPEAKER_01 53:39

I don't know anything else. But then it's like when you do things, I think that you're passionate about, you don't realize the amount of work that it takes to do it because it's just innate in some form or fashion.

SPEAKER_04 53:52

It doesn't feel as much like work or yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:54

And so then it's like if you build your life around that and not so much focusing on more money, more money, more money, more money. Yeah. I mean, of course, we need money to live. Right. Yeah. I mean, society's built that way, right? And at some point we're gonna retire. And I was just reading today that Medicare's got like 10 years left and it's default, you know. So it's like, okay, well, finally it's going out. Yeah. But so you know, we we need to we need to be able to do those things. But I think with our kids, and and I say our kids, now it's my grandkids, but you know, with the generation coming up, it's really truly there's so many opportunities to do well for yourself.

SPEAKER_03 54:33

Right.

SPEAKER_01 54:33

If you just stay focused on what makes you happy.

SPEAKER_04 54:38

Yeah, yeah. So exactly. And I I I feel like even that passion can come from not necessarily careers, you know, if you're passionate about rock climbing, then just find uh whatever job you have to get to to feed that passion, you know, or to make you able to do that.

SPEAKER_01 54:55

I think about and I've talked about this a couple times on the podcast. So I fought forest fires for six years, but one of the one of the forests that I was on, there were two guys that were in charge of cleaning the trails. So they would, they were I don't I don't know what their department was, trails, I don't know. But but uh they had horseback and mule, they had fat-tired motorcycles, they had snowmobiles. Yeah. And depending on what time of year it was, they literally would hit the trail for a week or two at a time to go make sure the you know the trees were out of the trails. And I think back, and I I loved fighting force, man. I absolutely really, really loved it. But I think back now, and I think I I think about that, and I think that would be so cool.

SPEAKER_03 55:41

Like that would be cool.

SPEAKER_01 55:44

Take taking the horses out back up in the mountains to go cut the branches off the trail. I mean, it's like, you know, and I'm sure that they were s scouting the forest to make sure nothing was nefarious was going on or things like that as well. But but those types of things, when I think back on my younger youth and think, yeah, you know, those are things that I probably kind of passed up.

SPEAKER_03 56:06

Right.

SPEAKER_01 56:07

You know, but yeah. What uh what types of things if if you could go back to your younger self and say, Here's a piece of advice, or pluck it in your brain. What what advice would you give yourself?

SPEAKER_04 56:22

Oh god. I mean, I think I did pretty good.

unknown 56:24

I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_01 56:25

You are not narcissistic at all.

SPEAKER_04 56:28

Like, no, I got it down. I'm good. Um Wow.

SPEAKER_00 56:32

That's a first.

SPEAKER_04 56:33

I I wasn't always this confident, so maybe just be confident earlier.

SPEAKER_00 56:36

There you go. I think don't be shy.

SPEAKER_04 56:39

Yeah, I don't I don't I I've never really I mean, of course, things are hard. Really got like turned off from something because it was too hard though. Um but I think maybe just trying things earlier because sometimes it does like OCRs, for example. I had wanted to do one for so long and then I finally did, and I was like, actually the first one, I was like, this sucks. I hate it, but it was also like it sucks so bad that I was like, I want to do more of it. So I think probably just going into those situations more, you know, same with like owning a business. I think I definitely needed that experience prior.

SPEAKER_02 57:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:14

But it's always great to to be able to have to be able to start those things that you're pat so passionate about now. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:22

Thousand percent. Thousand percent. Yeah. I mean, if if I could not that you've asked me the question, but I'm gonna give you my answer. If I could go back, I would tell myself, is it don't wait till you're ready.

SPEAKER_03 57:33

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 57:35

Because you're never ready in your mind. Yeah, right. You just gotta do.

SPEAKER_03 57:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:41

Take the step, just do it. Because there's there's a million reasons why you shouldn't do something.

SPEAKER_03 57:46

Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:47

And and and don't ask people, don't ask people around you.

SPEAKER_03 57:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:51

And I shouldn't say that because I'm bad at that. But in and it's if you feel drawn heavily in a direction, I feel like it obviously you don't want to leave the people that are in your life behind and you don't want to make catastrophic decisions without their knowledge of you sinking the ship. However, I I feel like if if you sit around waiting for the timing to be perfect, right, it will never show up.

SPEAKER_04 58:16

Yeah. I also think like like even if you ask your family, I feel like a lot of times your family or your like close friends are kind of like risk management for you. So if you tell them something that's pretty risky, they're gonna be like, no, I don't think that's a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 58:29

Yeah, exactly. But I I think it's ingrained in us when somebody asks our opinion about something to protect them.

SPEAKER_04 58:38

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 58:38

Whatever that looks like.

SPEAKER_04 58:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 58:40

Hey.

SPEAKER_04 58:41

Yeah, because you don't want to be the one that's like, no, that's a great idea, and then they're like bankrupt.

SPEAKER_01 58:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 58:47

Maybe I should I should have said, don't do it. Did I say that? Are you sure?

SPEAKER_01 58:52

No, you shouldn't go goth. Don't do it.

SPEAKER_04 58:55

Too late.

SPEAKER_01 58:57

With regards to clients, do you have in your mind, is there a perfect client? Or somebody like you, if you if if you had to say, hey, this is who I would love to work with.

SPEAKER_04 59:10

Yeah. Like a a specific brand or a type?

SPEAKER_01 59:13

Well, just just type. I mean, not somebody's like, oh, somebody's got millions of dollars to spend on marketing.

SPEAKER_04 59:18

Yeah, whoever's just gonna give me millions of dollars, that's the one. I would say like somebody who it's it's like a little bit of a unicorn, but I think that we have really good clients. We've we've had to fire some at some point, so we kind of make sure that the ones that we keep close, especially with laser, because we are so focused on them that kind of like mesh with us. But like ones that are interested in marketing to a point where they have like some sort of idea about it, you know? Because it's really hard if they don't know anything about it. I would say that's great for the early bird side because that is a little more structured, but for the laser side, like they should have like some sort of idea of even like small ideas of what they want to do. I think a lot of times we'll still develop our own from the ground up, but also are allowing us to like take the reins. Um, because that's really the point of of laser is like you don't have to think about it, you don't have to be like as involved unless you know it's like a super tricky industry, like one of our clients in the refriger refrigeration industry. It's just things are just constantly changing with EPA laws and stuff like that. So we do have to be in close contact with them to to get all those changes. But for the majority of the time, they really do like let us do our own thing, like come up with our own ideas, I think, from the ground up.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:38

Okay. Do you have specific industries that you focus on? I mean, I've obviously talked about a little bit the refrigerant stuff.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:45

Yeah. Um we intentionally don't. Um when we were at the agency that Riley and I met at, we were only doing schools and it was just it was so boring just constantly like re-changing colors or changing logos on ads and then running the exact same thing, even for websites and stuff like that. So when we started Laser, we were intentionally like, we're not gonna have any niche. We've had a lot of people tell us that that's not a good idea. Um, I feel like every like business book you read and stuff like that is always like, you need to have this one specific thing you're working on.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:18

And back to the defiance, I guess that's one thing, or I'm just like, I can't, I can't do it.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:23

I could see too. I mean, if if you're if you're solely focused on, we'll say one or two silos, I could see after time, it's like everything you're pumping out looks identical.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:34

Exactly. Yeah. Right?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:36

Where it and and I'm obviously making wild assumptions in my brain, but I feel like if you're not laser focused, you know, if you if you don't if you don't have a silo, then it allows for for creativity to enter in.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:51

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Because if if we have only plumbers that we're working at, for example, like we're our tendency is gonna be to fall back on, well, this thing worked for this plumber, even though they're completely different. And it might not even work at all.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:04

And this stock picture of a pipe is the only stock picture of a pipe. And so now I go to 15 plumbers' websites and it's the same picture. You know, it's like, okay, great.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:15

Let's talk legacy for a second. When you're gone, what do you hope people say about you?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:21

Oh god, I hope that they say that I was a good person that I cared about people.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:28

She was defiant.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:29

And they're like, wow, those logos for those companies are so cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:32

This logo is awesome. This early bird, just so y'all know. If you can't see, let's get close. Right there.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:39

Zoom in, zoom in.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:40

Yeah, zoom in, zoom in. Early bird. Yeah. That's cool. This is a roadrunner.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:44

Uh-huh. And mountain. Yeah, we chose a roadrunner because I think it's like one of the craziest birds. A little uh not mischievous, but like um, I don't know, they're just like crazy, you know. And they're just like they're just doing their own thing and they don't care what anybody else is doing.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:58

I don't know anybody like that.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:00

Just two runners running two businesses.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:03

Uh, that's too funny. It's a cool logo though.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:06

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:07

No, I I love it. I think it's really awesome. Early bird strategies.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:11

Yeah, I think that's probably the longest, longest logo we've worked on, honestly.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:14

Really?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:15

Uh yeah, we actually don't really do I I say we do everything in marketing. I we rarely do logos because people are really they always come in with like a specific idea. Um and a lot of times it's really hard to translate that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:30

I could see that.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:31

Yeah. Especially now with like AI. Well, they're just like, well, I just built this thing in AI. I'm like, well, I don't want to just outline it and give it to you. Yeah. Like I don't feel like I'm doing anything.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:42

So that makes sense.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:43

So we've done a few, but it isn't it certainly isn't something I love doing.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:48

Yeah. But every every once in a while I do one where I'm like, wow, this like the early bird one, you know, I I guess that's different because we're our own clients.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:55

Well, yeah, but when you can explain it, when you can look at it and go, I mean, it's funny because I I actually came up with my logo, but I had somebody build it for me.

SPEAKER_08 1:04:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:03

But it was one of those things where for the foundation, and it's got the the bricks and stuff like that. And for the longest people, people look at it and they're like, what is that?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:12

Oh, really? I get it right away.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:13

Yeah, and I'm like, well, it's an F in bricks and you know, whatever. But anyways, I just had this idea. I'm like the foundation, you got the foundation block and whatever. But um now I kind of look at it, I'm like, okay, is it bad? I don't know. You know, it's like I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:28

Oh, I like it.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:28

But but I think that if you can build something that you're passionate about and and and you love it over time, I mean that's that's the thing, right?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:36

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:37

Every year you've got to rebrand because you're like, never mind, I don't like it. God, I can't stand this stupid roadrunner anymore.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:45

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:45

So where do you go from here?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:48

Where do I go?

SPEAKER_01 1:04:49

I mean, not like to the store or something like that.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:52

I think honestly, I you know, at some point soon, hopefully, maybe, you know, we gotta really start thinking about hiring people.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:59

That's gonna be hard on you.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:00

That is gonna be hard on me. I think, you know, I think Riley's really like why we were like, oh, we're gonna do two separate companies. You know, because I mean, now st still people know that Early Bird is part of us.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:15

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:16

But I think we've also kind of said from the get-go, like, the goal of that one is to be contractor run. So I think that's probably a better place for us to start, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:24

Well, then you can allow people to dip their toe in it and see how they perform.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:30

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:30

And then if they do well, you can say, hey, come play with the rich kids.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:34

Yeah. The 18. Just kidding. This is where the rich clients are.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:38

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:39

You know what? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:40

We'll let you on this side of the tracks.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:42

Yeah. Yeah. So that is honestly that's where I'm going to be.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:44

I mean, that I mean, it's it just it makes sense, like to be able to say, okay, hey, we're gonna vet you through this process because not that we think less of those clients that are paying less, yeah, or whatever, using less of our services. It's just, you know, we have a standard that we need to uphold with this clientele as well as the other clientele, but we can work through some stuff and they're not as and I'm going from my perspective, readily engaged. It's like I just turn you guys on autopilot and say, hey.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:14

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:16

Do what you do because you're good at it.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:17

Um I think that that's honestly been like our kind of prompt for every designer we bring in. That's like, I want it to look like there wasn't a change in the designer.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:26

And nobody has passed that test yet, honestly. So if you're a designer, please reach out. But I think it's also hard because a all of our clients right now know us personally, so that also makes it a little bit harder to be like I'm passing, I'm passing you off to this random, you know, but it's a designer.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:43

I feel the same way, right? I mean, I've got an account manager and a CSR. And when people call me, I'm not passing them off because I don't care.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:50

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:51

I'm actually passing them off because I do care.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:53

You're like, I know I'm not gonna get I know this needs to get done, so I'm gonna give you to David or Fior Vellas, they're gonna take care of it.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:59

Not that you're not important to me. I will always take your call. I will I'll always be here for you. Understand, I'm out running around.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:07

Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:08

And you know, if you expect an answer within an hour, it's not coming from me. You know. So I think that I think that people understand that to an extent. Obviously, you have your core clients that that have been there forever and you kind of maintain that relationship and slowly drip them, you know, into somebody else's plate. But yeah, no, I mean I and and yes, with the with the uh early bird clients, I was gonna say something. With the early bird clients, I I think that that's smart that that you work that in there. Um I had another question, I just forgot it. Oh well.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:47

That's all right.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:48

Do you have a website?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:49

We do. We have lasermarketing.com.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:52

We we technically have earlybirdlife.com too. Um when we first first started doing things for it, we had a very specific interior designer client that we were going after. So if you go to Early Bird Life right now, looks a little weird because it's only about getting websites done in five days or something like that for interior designers. So if you're an interior designer it would be perfect for you. Um but the rest of it we're still building out.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:17

Okay. Yeah. Okay. So the best way to find you then probably be laser marketing. And it's lmarketing.com.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:25

Are you looking for new clients?

SPEAKER_04 1:08:27

Oh we're always looking for new clients. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:28

I just want to make sure.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:30

I mean it's not like you got a control problem.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:33

There's always more hours in the day, isn't that what the saying says?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:36

Yeah. Yeah. Who needs to pay attention to family or that other stuff.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:40

They're self-sufficient. They're two and a half. They got it figured out, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:44

They know where the food is at this point.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:46

Yeah. You might get home and then you can get a accident on the floor or something.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:51

They can be cleaned up.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:53

Okay. When you're doing the obstacle races, what's your favorite pre-game meal?

SPEAKER_04 1:09:00

Pre- See. When I was running OCRs, I was like very I won't say very fit. But I was like very dedicated.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:10

So I would even like not eat bad food two weeks leading up to the race. So I think Yeah, so I think before a race I would probably just eat banana and oatmeal I think. I think that was the only thing I ever ate. Very boring.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:24

No like carb loads or anything like that.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:27

I mean those are both carbs aren't they?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:29

Probably I don't know. One's a fiber.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:31

No, I wasn't like a spaghetti the night before said no. No.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:35

What do we need to know about Liz that we don't know?

SPEAKER_04 1:09:37

I feel like we got it all. I don't know. What else is there? Riley, what else is there?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:42

One of these days.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:43

If you have a Ragnar team, reach out, Riley, and you want to run it.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:46

I do not please don't contact me.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:48

I actually was just told I so I go to uh TI Fitness which is over on Valvista. But uh one of the guys that I work out in with the morning, one of the guys I work out with in the morning, his wife comes every now and then and he just I don't know if they did a Ragnar, something he signed them up for something. They were you were they were talking about it she's like oh yeah we should do that. He literally went on and signed them up right there.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:11

And she's like I was really more just joking with you. I think I used to do that with Spartan races. I had a Riley I made her run one like two let's see we ran it in February.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:22

What's the difference between a Spartan and a Regno four months postpartum she ran it. Oh my God.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:27

Yeah. I was like I'm sure you'll be fine by then right it's only twins. I cried I would have too distracted since I ran a Spartan race before that one and it was it was rough honestly. It's like you don't realize how out of shape you know because I did like CrossFit I did rock climbing and then I ran Spartan races so I was always doing something. And then once you kind of like get out of that rhythm of it you don't really realize until you go back to do something like that. I think it was at a different location but it's essentially a very similar race every time and I'm like wow I'm so out of shape then compared to how I used to run these Yeah I would probably throw up and cry.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:08

And cry I didn't throw up and go home and say I'm never doing that again.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:13

I did that is that's exact were you there?

SPEAKER_01 1:11:16

What is one challenge that you still want to conquer in your life?

SPEAKER_04 1:11:20

Ooh challenge You know I'm not sure if I still want it all I mean I would be interested in doing it but I think it would take a lot to get there. When I was running OCRs I was always trying to figure out new races to do. That's why I ran so many because I was like this one looks cool or I want to try this one out even like flying back to Chicago to run races that maybe were only over there, not over here. But Red Bull I think they still have this Red Bull 400 which is you run 400 meters up a ski slope.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:49

So that one I would still be that's like one As as a person who used to hike mountains for a job I can't imagine running miserable right up a 400.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:00

But I think that was like the one race where I was like I really want to do this one and I never ended up doing it. So I'd have to come out of retirement.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:07

Because not only are you running up a hill you're at elevation.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:11

Yeah yeah because they're at ski slopes or ski runs. Every time it comes up I'm like oh I missed it again.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:16

But yeah that would take a that would take a lot to get there I think absolutely oh my god that would be brutal that would be brutal I yeah I don't I don't think I could do that. What's your favorite meal? Definitely carne asada no kidding where's the best carne asada in in to your here? Yeah don't say buckeye in Arizona?

SPEAKER_04 1:12:36

Yeah probably ghost ranch where's that it's in Tempe it's on Ghost Ranch Rulin El Warner Warner Ghost Ranch. Never heard of it it's good it's like a small place there's probably only like 15 tables or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:51

Okay. That's good little hole in the wall?

SPEAKER_04 1:12:53

Not really.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:54

No?

SPEAKER_04 1:12:54

It's just small ghost ranch.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:58

I'm gonna say that one more time just ghost ranch just so I get it on recording. I'm gonna have to go back ghost ranch they also have like the best tortillas ever I think I've probably ever had the best carne asada I've ever had there was a guy when we first moved to Arizona there was a guy that lived a couple houses down from us that was Puerto Rican maybe but he would make carne asada and he would marinate the beef for like a week I think it was so freaking good yeah I mean it was so good. But yeah anyways well hey appreciate you coming on yeah thank you I yeah thank you I appreciate it and I love your logo I love the the new stuff you've got thank you show up get the worm show up early get the worm that's awesome thanks and you picked really good colors I approve of the colors just appealing to the Seahawks fan that's right that's all it is there's a lot of us out here so you should appeal to us um I do have a gift for you because everybody gets a gift when they come on the show nice I have a challenge coin because you went above and beyond and I have a glass now and you can match with Riley that she's probably drank her orange juice out of never. She probably forgot she even got one when she came on the show at this point.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:12

Okay I know where it's out I'll put it right next to her I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:15

So hey I appreciate you coming on everybody go to lzrmarketing.com if you need marketing of any kind whether you're big or small I can tell you they work wonderfully with small companies which a lot of marketing companies do not so uh if you're looking for we'll get definitely awesome thank you thank you this is what and I went above and beyond working through the