Shoulder Surgeries Ended His Baseball Dream — Now He Runs a Painting Empire

Jason Bressler was an Arizona high school All-Star pitcher who played at Chase Field on Father's Day, threw in the low 90s, and had his sights set on ASU — until two labrum surgeries ripped the glove off his hand for good. Today, he's the owner of CertaPro Painters of Gilbert-Queen Creek, carrying forward the family business his parents, Randy and Irma, built from scratch after the 2008 recession.

 In this episode, Jason sits down with Jän Simon to talk about growing up on the baseball diamond, the dark period after his career ended, working corporate sales jobs he hated, and the moment his dad said, "Get to work or sell something." He shares the real story of stepping into a family legacy, building the commercial painting division from almost nothing, and why he’d rather lose a job than use a product he can’t stand behind.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:23

Honestly, you know, I was over corporate America years before. Right. They had messed with our pay structure. Because reps once reps make a certain amount, somebody in my level of rep shouldn't be making that type of money. My cohort shouldn't be making that type of money.

SPEAKER_02 0:38

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 0:39

All that. And then it was just like I was hungry to try something on my own.

SPEAKER_02 0:43

Hey there, welcome back to Above and Beyond where Excellence Meets Elevation. I'm your host, Jan Simon. This season we're raising the bar, diving into the passion, purpose, and defining moments of leaders who don't just aim high, they live there. Big ideas. Real stories. Let's get into it. Today on Above and Beyond where Excellence Meets Elevation, we're sitting down with Jason Bressler, the proud owner of Survey Pro Painters, and the next chapter in a family business story that started back in 2011. Jason's parents, Randy and Irma, built the business from the ground up with hard work, dedication, and a commitment to serving the community. Jason officially joined the business in 2014, but like so many second-generation leaders, his story is about more than simply stepping into the family name. It's about earning trust, learning the business from the inside, carrying forward a legacy, and eventually asking the big questions. How do I honor what was built before me while still becoming the leader I meant to be? Before business ownership? Jason was an athlete, a college baseball player, a competitor, someone who understands what it means to show up, practice, fail, adjust, and come back better. And today, that same mindset comes into his role as a business owner, husband to Lydia, father to Brett, sports fan, golfer, traveler, and yes, a proud pug dad. This conversation is about family health, work ethic, pressure, transition, and the real life journey of becoming the person all others are counting on. Jason Bressler, welcome to Above and Beyond. Thank you, Jan. Looking forward to being on. Awesome. Well, hey, a lot to dig into. You have a storied past. I won't say checkered, because that would probably throw out the wrong picture. But let's talk about Jason. Growing up, what was your what was your early childhood like?

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Early childhood was amazing, really and truly. First and foremost, I think I have two of the best parents, and I'd put them up against anybody out there. Growing up was really about sports. You know, I played soccer, basketball, baseball my whole, you know, young life, all the way up through high school and college. Really took baseball on, and that's really like all my memories. My life's centered right around baseball. It's centered around the trips for baseball, it's centered around the practices, the different coaches and everything I had. And you know, it's funny. My dad even just recently reached out to me and was like, you know, did you ever get burnt out because you played so much? Honestly, no, I did not. I really enjoy it. I still enjoy it to this day. I'd love if I could still play it. Yeah, it's what everybody has that little happiness bug in them, and that's what it is for me. Yeah. So that was really truly my childhood, man. I live to play. That's awesome. Now, did you grow up here in Arizona? I did, born and raised. Okay. Actually, one of the few out there. Lived here my whole life. Besides uh one year, I actually traveled to Kansas to play some college baseball. Okay. Kind of an interesting shock a little bit to the to me. Yeah. You know, going from uh Arizona town to a town of about 40,000 people. It was definitely a little weird, but um one heck of an experience for growth and all that. Where in Kansas? It was in Hutchinson, Kansas. I'm not sure. Just outside of Wichita.

SPEAKER_03 4:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:03

Great little town. I ended up following a college coach that had recruited me out of high school out there. Okay. Because the current college I was at just wanted to make me a pitcher and I still wanted to hit and do all that.

SPEAKER_05 4:12

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 4:13

So I followed him out there and was able to do both those and then signed to actually come back and play in Arizona, and that's when I hurt my arm. Two surgeries later, it was time to finish school. Hung up the glove.

SPEAKER_02 4:24

Yeah, unfortunately. That's too bad. My sister lives in Wichita. We actually just moved my parents out there. Oh, really? So I asked, yes. I will actually be going for the first time for my niece's wedding in July. So it's going to be my first experience to uh Kansas. And I've been looking at the weather, it's like 90 degrees and 85% humidity. Yeah, it's pretty brutal.

SPEAKER_00 4:43

And it's gonna be windy. Yeah. That's that's the worst part. It's the humidity and wind, and then you know, even trade-off in the wintertime, man, that wind just on your face just feels like glass.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

That's crazy. Yeah. So grew up playing playing a bunch of sports, but focusing on baseball. You said pitching. Did you have a did you have a specific pitch that you were like known for, or were you just kind of good at all of them?

SPEAKER_00 5:04

Uh I wouldn't say good at all of them. I had an average fastball, wasn't too, you know, too bad. I threw in the low 90s, which was decent at that time. Now nowadays everybody throws 100.

SPEAKER_03 5:13

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 5:13

But I would say my best pitch actually was my changeup. Okay. Mixing speeds, keeping people off balance because I didn't throw hard enough at times to blow good hitters away.

SPEAKER_02 5:21

Yeah. Right-handed or left-handed? Right-handed. Okay. Yeah. Okay. And then other than that, were you more of a utility player or did you have another position you played?

SPEAKER_00 5:29

I pretty much played everywhere besides catcher in first base. Okay. Because at my height, there's not many first basemans out there.

SPEAKER_02 5:35

But catchers, I mean, you'd be a good little pug back there.

SPEAKER_00 5:37

Yeah, right, exactly. If I had a little bit bigger of a target. I was I weighed a little bit less back in the middle. Oh, did you?

SPEAKER_02 5:43

Okay, so you kind of grew up a little. Yeah, unfortunately. Growing up in Arizona, playing sports, now did they have a lot of club sports back then when you were a kid, or was it more It was in the, you know, when you're 12 and below, not really.

SPEAKER_00 5:56

It was just your little leagues and stuff like that. There was a few different travel teams when I got to 14 to 16. And then back in my day was really getting picked up by uh what they called scout teams. Okay. So like I got picked up by the Cubs where they start watching you through high school, maybe have a chance to be drafted or whatever. But I know nowadays it's completely different. There's so many club teams. Coaches are actually being paid to coach, and it's just more of a sounds like a business at this stage, and it's like you have to be on a club team. Back in the day, you just played high school ball. Yeah. That's all it was.

SPEAKER_02 6:28

Yeah. It's it's insane to me. I mean, growing up in Washington, and we had a different season for every sport, and that was basically dictated by the weather, you know, whether you can be outside or not. But and playing baseball, I mean, aside from Babe Ruth and AAU, and then you had, you know, high school ball or whatever. But it there was I don't even like I don't have a recollection of any type of club other than when I was in wrestling, we had they called it the Mat Rats. And when I was younger, they had started this comp this group called the Mat Rats, so young kids would go play. And I think they probably had basketball, but it wasn't it wasn't like a club sport today. It was more hey, we need something for our kids to do while it's freezing cold outside, so we're gonna put them to work. Yeah, exactly. Do something productive. Either you're gonna play basketball or wrestle. So one of the two. Brothers and sisters? No, only child, actually. Oh my god, that that explains a lot right there. Exactly. Oh my god. Um, and then so you went away to Kansas for a short period of time. Yep. Just a year, came back to Arizona, you were gonna play at ASU, and you blew your shoulder out.

SPEAKER_00 7:40

Yep, blew my shoulder out, actually lifting weights, not even on the diamond.

SPEAKER_02 7:43

Well, really, I was gonna say, was it a rotator cuff or what'd you do?

SPEAKER_00 7:46

Yeah, I tore my labrum. Oh, wow. Yep, had surgery, and then oh gosh, about six months later I retore my labrum again, had surgery again, and even to this day I can't even throw a ball anymore. Really? Did you try to come back too fast? Is that no? I did everything to spec and all that kind of stuff. I took time, I took two years off of school actually, went back and volunteered coach at my uh old high school mount point in Awatuke, and it just never healed right, man. It was just one of those things where it was luck of the draw, and then you know, it was time to grow up and figure out what the heck I was gonna do with my life. Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 8:19

So talk to me about that, because that's gotta be quite a blow. I mean, you've been playing baseball, we'll say, your whole life. You move away to play baseball, you come back to play baseball, you're gonna get a shot in we'll say the big leagues as far as college. Yeah, right. And then you you blow out your shoulder, you blow out your labrum. I mean, that has to be a pretty heavy defeat hit.

SPEAKER_00 8:40

How did you work yourself through that? It was definitely very tough because that's what I knew, you know, and again, going back to my parents, you know, my parents took care of me. I never held a job, they always paid my rent, my tuition if needed, all that. And then it was just stripped at me one day and like, you know, you're done. So it was definitely not a fun time in my life. A little bit of a dark period. Not saying I ever would have made it or done anything like that, but it would have been nice to have to hang the cleats up on my own terms.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

Yeah, yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 9:10

I I can only imagine. I mean, you know, when you hear so many stories of I'm gonna say guys, but guys and girls that that you know they put their heart and soul in that and something happens, right? And then and then that dream is dead. To to kind of have the door slammed in your face versus okay, ran my course, right? Yeah, it's just it's just gotta be tough. That that I don't know, my my words are stuck.

SPEAKER_00 9:37

Yeah, I get you. It was it was real tough, you know. I mean, obviously, when you're getting to that age and you played your whole life, you do see some writing on the wall, you know, from that standpoint. Did I think I could possibly compete at the next level? Absolutely, but I didn't even know what that looked like if I would have that opportunity. So you are forecasting yourself, being like, okay, well, I'm gonna get my education paid for, I'm gonna get an education, so I have that's my fallback plan, right? But then when it's stripped of you, your fallback plan becomes complete reality. Yeah, and you're like, oh, okay, that was a big shock. Yeah. Now two, three years earlier than expected.

SPEAKER_05 10:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:10

And then, like anything else in business nowadays, you got it adjust, right? That's what I had to do is look in the mirror and be like, hey, I gave it all I had, I gave it a good run. Unfortunately, I didn't quit on my terms. But you know, that's that's my story. Did you ever think about teaching yourself to throw the ball left-handed? Ironically, I did. Did you really? Oh, yeah, absolutely. I did, but I'm like, uh I don't know, I'm 19 or 20 now. You know what I mean? It's it's you just should have started earlier. Yeah, you're done you're done, Jason. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 10:36

You're done. That's funny. That's funny. So it's it's interesting. I mean, uh, dumb little story that literally just popped into my head when I was a kid. I had a friend, his name was Brian. It's funny, I have a lot of friends whose name were Brian. But we used to play what would probably be considered wiffle ball today. We've called it cork ball. So we had a softball that we took the the strings and the leather and everything off. And so we had a cork ball that would tape. In fact, I think I still have it in the garage. And we used to play in his backyard because there was a power line across the street.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 11:10

And if you hit it over the power line, there was a home run. So it was like we used to do that all the time. But did you ever have anything like that as a kid, like neighbor kids or baseball buddies that you're like you get together and just do crazy stuff together?

SPEAKER_00 11:23

Oh, yeah. We we lived in uh growing up in my you know middle school, high school era, we had uh lived in a cul-de-sac. So we would always uh use tennis balls to hit in the cul-de-sac. Yeah, and then our house was all the way at the end. So if we hit our house on the fly, that was a home run, nice, you know, type thing. And you know, all the all the other people loved it, you know, in the neighborhood. They would actually come out and watch us from time to time to us and try and strike us out. Yeah, they loved us minus uh one guy did not like us at all. There's always the one guy. Yeah, he would call the he ironically, he would call the police on us all the time, keep our tennis balls as evidence, and come to find out this guy was a detective at the Phoenix PD. No kidding. Yeah, he was weird. He would like my mom, I remember many times my mom getting home from the grocery store, and he'd be like hiding behind his little mesquite tree with binoculars like looking at us and stuff. He was that's creepy, yeah. It was creepy even for me when I was in what eighth grade or whatever it was.

SPEAKER_01 12:17

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 12:18

Nowadays I'm like, wow.

SPEAKER_01 12:19

That's that's messed up, man.

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:22

Did uh high school in in that in that time frame? I mean, you said your parents were very influential in your life. Was there anybody in school that you look back on now that really kind of had a a pivotal role in your development and and helping you guide through what you wanted to do?

SPEAKER_00 12:41

Absolutely. I mean, definitely my high school baseball coach, Coach LeBlanc, he was always an advocate for us, making sure that we were getting what we needed to get to the next level, all that. You know, he taught us discipline, he taught us, you know, what wins and losses are, the successes, the failures, how you motivate that to become a success next time. And then most importantly, my pitching coach, uh Coach Kipper. You know, I did lessons with him almost every Saturday, ex-Major League pitcher, just a top-notch individual that taught me really and truly partially how to become a man when I was still in high school.

SPEAKER_01 13:16

That's cool.

SPEAKER_00 13:17

He just really explained it for me and just said, look, you gotta you gotta transfer this that I'm teaching you here on the ball field to your real life because this ball field game's gonna run out at one time. Yeah. Things that when you're a freshman sophomore in high school, it's never gonna run out. No, right? Ten year ten years from now, it's 16 is a freaking long time.

SPEAKER_02 13:36

100% old. Yeah, yes. And 99% of the people that try by 26, done. Yeah, you're done. You're yeah, you're completely done. That's that's insane. Um, I had another question that I totally was gonna ask you, and it just just jumped out of my head. You said you didn't hold any jobs through through school, into college. Did you in the summer I'm assuming it was all about playing ball? Okay.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

So you just pretty much always played ball, man. I mean, you know, growing up in Arizona and all that, you can play 24-7, right? A lot different than Washington. Yeah, oh, for sure. So, you know, nowadays I'm thinking like, okay, normally I'd play a game at five o'clock at 110 degrees. I'm like, nowadays, no way. Yeah, you know, yeah, I'm over that heat.

SPEAKER_02 14:19

We had we had wooden pitching mounds that they put in the gym, and we had squishy balls, I don't know what they were, like a sponge ball. Yeah. That that we used to play with.

SPEAKER_00 14:31

We had the same concept in Kansas because obviously the weather in Kansas is just awesome at times. Yeah. So yeah, we'd have an indoor practice facility and same thing, wooden mounds that we'd wheel out. You know, it was it was weird for a city boy from Arizona.

SPEAKER_02 14:43

Then you're used to it's like what we're playing inside, yeah. Yeah, I was like, how do I throw off this thing? Yeah, you know, like Yeah. Do you do you have one memory that sticks out? Like, like if you could go back and relive that memory today, do you have do you have one of those? As far as we talking, baseball? Yeah, baseball in the in that in that time frame.

SPEAKER_00 15:00

Yeah. I would say my biggest memory would be lucky enough to had a really good senior year from a stats perspective and be selected to play in the AZ All-Star game and then the Super 50 game, meaning that we got to go out and play at Chase Field. Oh wow. Which used to be Banquin Ballpark at the time, but I got to play a game there. Oh, that's which was unreal at that age. Yeah. Senior in high school running around where the pros play. You know, 2002 is when I graduated. Okay. Right, you know, year after we won the World Series, you know, think of the celebration that was there, and now I'm actually here on the ball field. That'd be cool. Which made which actually what made it even more special, that game was on Father's Day.

SPEAKER_01 15:37

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00 15:38

Yeah. So my dad was loving it. Yeah. It was really neat. That's cool. That would be awesome. Yeah, that's a memory that I think I'll obviously have forever.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

I actually I man. I I had moved down here. I moved down here in '99, but I remember the Dinebacks one in the series. Oh yeah. I mean, we were we were partying in in our street. We there were several of us. We get together all the time, do fire pits in the driveway and stuff like that. But we're all out there, we got TV set up, and it's awesome. Oh, it was it was so because none of us could afford to go to the baseball game. Oh, not at all. So we're watching it, and yeah, that was that was uh it was awesome. That was that was that was a phenomenal series. Oh yeah. Great way to win it.

SPEAKER_00 16:18

Yeah, one of the one of the best out there in my opinion. Oh yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

Not being biased, but yeah. Um what was the difference between playing baseball in high school and and your exposure to college? Was there a difference? I mean, is it is is there a development difference in there?

SPEAKER_00 16:34

There's a huge difference. I mean, from just a competitive factor all the way to how good people are, really and truly. I mean, you take, you know, your average high school team, and there might be two or three kids that are hitting, you know, three, four that are moving on to the next level. Well, in college, it's all three, four hitters, it's all ace pitchers. You know, it's just a completely different level of competition that was very eye-opening, yeah, to be honest. Because in high school, there's certain kids when you're on the mound, you know you can just throw fastballs. You keep doing that at the college level, you're gonna get rocked.

SPEAKER_02 17:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:09

Throw me another one right over the top. I'm gonna take you out. It doesn't matter how hard you throw or anything like that, they're still gonna hit you. Did you in baseball?

SPEAKER_02 17:18

I never got up into the baseball stuff. I played baseball. I didn't get into high school and whatnot. Do you spend a lot of time researching the players that you're going to be playing against? So, like when you go up, you're your starting pitcher, you know the who's coming up and what they're doing?

SPEAKER_00 17:35

Uh, definitely in more the college level.

SPEAKER_03 17:37

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 17:37

High school level again, you knew a couple of the guys that were good or whatnot just from playing with them in the scout league ball, or you just know through the years, right? In college, yeah. I mean, you know, your recruiting coordinators, your assistant coaches are going to other games to scout them, their people are there to scout you. So, yeah, you have a little bit more of a setup, you know, it's pretty much an entry level into what I can only imagine they do now in the big leagues. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:00

I I can't I it the the amount of data points that they now are tracking and can figure things out is just absolutely insane. It's crazy. So talk to me about your parents, Randy and Irma. They supported you through it. Was it was it the classic mom in the stands screaming and yelling, and dad standing at the fence with his hands on the fence, yelling at the umpire? Was your mom more the yeller? I mean, what what was that dynamic like?

SPEAKER_00 18:29

Mom was definitely more the yeller, okay. I would say in general. Dad was always more supportive. Dad was the one that's watching, taking notes, and is gonna get with me after the game. Let me know, you know, hey, what I did bad, what I did good, or if I, you know, did something in the field that probably wasn't really cool or something, yeah, then he'd let me know. You know, that's straight up more in private. He wouldn't really call me out in the game or anything. But they were just they were your typical fans. That's awesome. You know, it was fantastic. I don't think they missed more than I can count on one hand games. That's good, you know, and it's probably because they were sick or something. But looking back on it, man, everything their schedules revolved around my schedule, yeah, really and truly.

SPEAKER_02 19:39

That's really cool. After baseball ended, what happened?

SPEAKER_00 19:44

What'd you do? So I picked up a job at CVS pharmacy because I knew I had to make some money. Okay. Right. And that ended up being my college job for the rest of the way.

SPEAKER_05 19:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 19:55

And just I went back to school and finished school in a year and a half, basically went full time, uh, went over did summer school, did uh over winter break, and just wanted to get done at that point. Because also, too, you know, looking back on it, I think it was a little bit of a focus and a mindset for me that that part of my life was done. So I needed to fill my void and I didn't want to have downtime.

SPEAKER_05 20:18

That makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 20:19

So I went from you know taking a ton of credit hours a year and a half to get done, along with working, and then getting ready to start my life in the professional spectrum.

SPEAKER_02 20:29

After college, did you continue at CVS or what did you do then?

SPEAKER_00 20:33

So I stayed there for a little bit and I was looking for my uh next real professional opportunity. I ended up actually age myself here, taking a job at the Arizona Republic selling newspaper advertising. Oh my dad might have helped me do get that job. He had been with uh Arizona Republic uh about 24 years at that time.

SPEAKER_05 20:53

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00 20:53

And he had uh did advertising sales himself, started out as a little peon like I was, worked his way up and was running the whole Scot style office. Oh wow. So obviously had some connections and such. And my first boss, Jim, his sons and I obviously, because my parent my dad and him were friends. Uh we played a lot of baseball and kind of grew up together and stuff like that. So I knew him. So I had I think I had a little bit of an in to start with. Well, and I think everybody everybody kind of needs that when you're getting started, right? Absolutely. So I didn't know what I was doing. I was just like, oh, I'll sell newspapers. I don't even know if I'm a salesman, you know what I mean? Type thing, but I'll figure it out. Yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_02 21:31

And and you said you you said when baseball was over, I mean you can't even throw a baseball anymore.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

Not without my shoulder popping out of socket.

SPEAKER_07 21:38

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 21:39

Yeah, I'm kidding. Can can it now not be repaired at all? I think it's just gone. Okay. You know, two surgeries on that labrum area. It's just gone. Yeah, and I got a slight slight uh rotator cuff tear. Gotcha. So yeah, I think it's just done until possibly later in life, if I start having issues from it or something, then maybe I gotta go get a scope or something. Yeah, I don't know. Deal with it then. Play golf. Yep. Does it impact that at all? It does not. Okay. It doesn't impact golf. I can bowl, you know, all that stuff. When I do bowl, my arm gets a little sore the next day. But that's probably just because I'm out of shape.

SPEAKER_05 22:11

Gotcha. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:12

Aren't we all? Aren't we all? Right? I try to hide my stomach from the crowd. Oh yeah, it's not happening. Uh yeah, no. Um talk to me about SurtiPro. So it sounds like at the point where you started at the Republic, your dad was still there. Yep. When did Surtopro enter the picture? And how the how did that come to come to be?

SPEAKER_00 22:34

Yeah, so quick cliff notes on that. You know, my dad was still at the Republic, and then the good old oh eight oh eight hit here in Arizona. And then by 09, the Republic decided to shut down their Scottsdale office, their Mace office where I was at, Deer Valley, and a couple other satellite offices, and move everybody to downtown. So and do Doing that, they had no need for middle management, which is my father. So about six, eight months before he gets his severance, he gets his walk-in papers. Right. That's brutal. And all that, or I'm sorry, the not severance, but retirement or yeah, whatever. I forget the word off the top of my head. But so he got his walk-in papers, and he just said, He's like, you know, I've wanted to get out of corporate forever, and this is my time to do it now because it's forced upon me. So come hell or high water, I'm gonna start a business. That's crazy. So he took about two years to figure out what he's doing and researched a ton of different companies, resales, other different franchises, and then just settled on paint ironically. So no no prior experience to it, just nothing. His big deal was he thought that in the painting trade in his lifetime and unbeknownst to me at the time, he wanted me to join. I didn't know that. But in our lifetimes, that technology was not gonna take over painting.

SPEAKER_02 23:50

Yeah, well, it's I I mean, I I think that is could not be any more true. That's right. I don't know. Yeah, it works. But you know, it's one of those things where it's like, yeah, I mean, AI can do a lot of stuff. And could it paint? Sure. Right. But but limited, right? I mean, in in a controlled environment and whatnot.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:11

When you guys do, I don't think so.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

No, you still need that hired help, man. Yeah. To furnish your jobs and make them done.

SPEAKER_05 24:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:18

Back into the business, AI might help a little bit here and there, but as far as actually getting projects done, you know, there's no robots or anything doing those in my lifetime at least.

SPEAKER_02 24:26

Well, and the beauty of when he started it, 2011, right? Yep. First year. So yeah, 2011, you're already about five to ten years into a lot of the front edge of the boom out into this area. And a lot of the homes at that point had been through that 08-09 crash. Right. Which then you've got a need for coming in and fix up painting, that sort of thing. So it's kind of a seems like a great time as far as theoretically to start that business.

SPEAKER_00 24:59

100%. And you know, you had a couple years of learning curve, I'm sure, for him. I mean, I had it when I joined the business with him as well. So it was definitely a good time, and there's a lot of opportunities, you know. I don't think the painting trade is as big as it is now because there's a ton of competition out there now. Yeah. And it it didn't feel like it was like that before. But also, you know, you gotta think of the growth of the valley. Yeah. And you know, 14, 15 years has been tremendous. So that's you know, more people coming.

SPEAKER_02 25:24

Yeah, for sure, for sure. Um, but you didn't join until 2014. Correct. So what were you doing at that point?

SPEAKER_00 25:31

So obviously, when that happened to my dad at the Arizona Republic, I was like, I'm out. You know, I started looking around and things like that, and ironically, had a coworker at the Arizona Republic that had moved over to a company called Arizona Office Technologies in the copier IT software arena. He had been trying to get me for a while, but I was just happy where I was at. So when that happened, I called him the next day. He had me an interview that week, and I was hired within a week. Oh wow. So I took off, went over there for a few years until I joined my parents basically. Great industry. Yeah, did real well with it, had some awesome accounts, D BACs were my account. You know, it was same, it was sales. Yeah, straight sales, yeah. Pretty much from base salary was nothing. It was all about you know how much money you can make in commission. And you know, in your 20s, that's what it was about, right? It was about like, oh, what's my bank account? How much can I do? This and that. It's funny now in your 40s how life changes, where it's not all your bank account, it's all about your family, your friends, you know, the experiences you can do.

SPEAKER_04 26:28

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:29

Getting my time back. For sure.

SPEAKER_02 26:30

You know, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 26:31

And all that.

SPEAKER_02 26:32

What um w what was the big difference, obviously, between being at the Republic and being at the copy company? Was there a difference in how those organizations were run, or what what did being in those teach you about how eventually you might want to run your own business?

SPEAKER_00 26:49

Really and truly, what it really taught me is that I was learning that I did not want to be in corporate America. It just for me, it was not me. You know, I've always been a salesman, I always do my job, I hang my numbers, and they still don't leave you alone. Yeah, it's like you need report after report of what you're doing that minute and why you're doing your report that minute. They want to know why. Yeah, and it just that's what I was realizing. But it's like, you know, as a kid in your 20s, how do you take that next step? Yeah, right, to do that. And thankfully my father had, and again, I didn't realize that he was thinking about me in the business. Yeah. And then when he approached me by it, I was like, okay, yeah, let's talk.

SPEAKER_02 27:28

Yeah, yeah. That's cool. You know, it's it's funny because I think about some of the corporate sales jobs I've had, and that's everybody's managing to the numbers. It's like we've so forgotten about building relationships. Oh, 100%. It's just like, uh, which I get it. I mean, yeah, you got you know, especially if you're answering to a board of directors or whatever, it's like it all trickles down.

SPEAKER_00 28:22

Yeah, it just trickles right down to you, and if you're doing your job, it's like, okay, that's cool. What'd you do for me today? Right.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

Exactly. Oh, you landed a huge account? Awesome. What else you got in the pipeline? Exactly. You're exactly right. It's like, wow, thanks. You know, it's like just leave me alone. I'm doing my thing. Exactly. I promise. Yep, exactly. Talk to me, talk to me about when your parents started the the franchise with CertaPro, and and you're kind of on the outskirts watching them, I'm assuming relationship-wise, because you guys seem to have a very close relationship and and you did a lot of or do a lot of travel with baseball and things like that. What do you remember looking back now that you admired about what they were trying to build before you knew you were stepping into the legacy?

SPEAKER_00 29:11

Just simply their work ethic. You know, growing up, obviously I knew they worked hard, right? But when you see it firsthand and you see them struggling to start with, right? Yeah, you know, they went from corporate America with I would imagine halfway decent incomes, good life, to really nothing.

SPEAKER_05 29:27

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00 29:28

You know, that's what everybody says, you know, about the business. Oh, you take a salary, this or that. It's like, no, it's it's you know, our job essentially is commission-based, right? So I couldn't imagine starting this business with no knowledge, no customer base, essentially nothing to go on besides the backing of a franchise. So I just admired strictly their work ethic, the time they put in. You know, I would obviously not talk to them too much during the day, but we talked four or five times a week. Call them in the evening, dad's grinding in the office, yeah, 7 30, 8 o'clock, figuring out what's going on. And I'm like, man, that's just it's admirable. Yeah. And I'm like, he's gonna make it. He's gonna right size the ship, and this thing's gonna be damn successful.

SPEAKER_02 30:11

That's awesome. That's awesome. And and you guys have basically almost all of the East Valley at this point. Yeah, pretty much almost. Yeah. So yeah, kind of, kind of everywhere. When they started it, before you were approached by your dad to say, Hey, think about this. Was there ever anything that crossed your mind?

SPEAKER_00 30:31

Definitely.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:32

You know, I saw where he's going. I made a couple comments here and there, like, hey, when you need some help and you're ready to grow, let me know. You know, type thing. Because, you know, we're again, we had very open dialogue, open book between all of us. And, you know, I told him where I was at in the careers and stuff. And, you know, he said he's just like, Well, if you want to make a change, make a change. But if not, get to work. Yeah. Really and truly, you know, get to work. Totally hear him saying that. Keep hanging your numbers. It's like, yeah, yeah. Sit here, either do it or don't. Yeah. Just right. And my mom's just like, oh, yeah, you know, it's supportive, you know, real nicer. And my dad's just like, just get to work or sell something.

SPEAKER_02 31:07

When you decided to make the move, a couple three years after they started the business. Was there something that happened within your corporate world where you were just like, I'm done with this, I'm moving, I'm I can't do this anymore, I'm going this direction? Or was it more, it just kind of felt like timing was right. The business was at a point where you could step in and maybe from a sales perspective help them grow it?

SPEAKER_00 31:32

I think it was just perfect timing. Honestly, you know, I was over corporate America years before, right? They had messed with our pay structure because reps, once reps make a certain amount, somebody in my level of rep shouldn't be making that type of money. My cohort shouldn't be making that type of money. Yep. All that. And then it was just like I was hungry to try something on my own. I was still young enough. I knew if I tried something on my own and I did not succeed with that, that I could come back either to this industry or get any other sales job.

SPEAKER_05 32:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:04

At some point, whatever it is. I don't know, sell RVs, I don't know.

SPEAKER_05 32:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:07

From that. So that was just like a it was really just perfect timing. Gotcha. I was I I felt like I had a foot out the door, but I had nowhere to go with that.

SPEAKER_02 32:17

And and when you stepped into the business, what what was it that you did with the business?

SPEAKER_00 32:21

Commercial. My focus strictly was commercial. Sales? Yep, commercial sales. Okay. So my dad handled basically all of residential. Um, we didn't have really any footprint in commercial. Oh, okay. I mean, we did maybe $10,000 to $15,000 a year in commercial. It was just because it came through the door. Like, hey, can you do this? Yeah, yeah, we can do it, of course. But my job was to build that type of our business and get it from really ground level all the way up to the top.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

How how how did that how was that process? I mean, was that hard to get in there and really make endroads in it? Or did you find it easier because you found other contractors weren't as morally upstanding?

SPEAKER_00 33:01

I shouldn't probably shouldn't say that. No, no, it's true. It's true. This is this is a trade business. Everybody knows trade businesses at times, unfortunately. I would say it was it was tough in the get-go. One, because I had zero product knowledge, right? I knew nothing besides the random person that goes to the Home Depot and buys a gallon of paint like myself because I got to paint my house. Yeah. Heck, I don't know if I'm painting my house with interior or exterior paint, to be honest with you. So I had no clue with that. So I mean, there was a great, just basic knowledge of six months of a learning curve. There's so much that goes into paint for you know whatever the product is needed. So that was definitely a big ramp up period, and then really just trying to understand how then I get in with these type of either contractors or customers, right? Because they've had JB's painting company that does all their painting for 10 years now. Yeah. So how do I break into that? Right? And which I get. Yeah, you know, I would be this that's that's how that's what I want to get to with that customer, where somebody's calling them and they're like, no, I use Jason with CertiPro.

SPEAKER_05 34:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:05

So that that took some time on its own there. And it's just it's what we do now. It's networking. Really and truly. I joined some organizations, I made some contacts, I did some lunches, some happy hours, really got to know people, got some shots finally on jobs, and we performed and slowly and surely climbed their ladder to be their guy.

SPEAKER_02 34:25

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 34:26

Is really what happened with that.

SPEAKER_02 34:27

Were there were there any aha moments in that where you kind of thought you had it figured out, and you got smack with a two by four that woke you up to go, oh yeah, I didn't know what I thought I knew.

SPEAKER_00 34:41

110%. And the easiest way to say that is by misbidding jobs. Uh-huh. Misbidding jobs where you're like, I'm dialed in, I know what goes into that, what the costs are gonna be, what our profit margin should be, and then you get done with the job, you know, call it a you know, you do a $20,000 job and you realize your raw expenses are $23,000. It's like, whoa, I don't have it all figured out. Quick learning curve. Yeah. Well, that's what I always say, man. If you're if you ain't trying, you ain't messing up. Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 35:12

For sure. That's crazy. As you watched your dad, so so basically you guys you guys worked together, if my math serves me correctly, around uh what, 11, 12 years? About 12 years. So hand in foot. Having having watched him over that 11 or 12 years, were there times where you felt like things could have or should have gone one way, but he was pulling it another way, and you guys and and not to say that it was a bad thing, but to say that the direction of the business just didn't go where you felt it should go because maybe you guys were at odds with each other.

SPEAKER_00 35:50

You know, definitely at times, I mean you're gonna butt heads with regardless if it's your father, mother, friend, random person, just in business in general, right? On different things you say. But I could honestly say that in our line of business and what we were trying to achieve, which was obviously growth, and we had two verticals, right? I'm handling commercial, my dad's handling residential. Gotcha. So we have two different verticals that are trying to get to the common goal at the end of it. So we didn't have too, too much crossover. If we had problems on one side or the other, it was normally us going to each other and finding what the proper solution would be. And then the biggest part of it is we never undermined each other. If I made a call or he made a call, we had each other's back. If we didn't like the call, we would talk about it in private on why you made that call. Gotcha. Maybe you should have done this or that. You know, just looking at it almost a check and balance.

SPEAKER_05 36:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:44

So I mean, we were very lucky to have very minimal times where we kind of butted heads, so to speak.

SPEAKER_02 36:50

That's that's cool. I think I think it's cool that and and I heard you reference this a little bit earlier with regards to baseball, and now your dad kind of was the watcher taking notes, and then you guys would talk about it afterwards. And I and I and I think I heard at that point you said kind of talk in private, not not calling you out in front of people. Having somebody that can correct you in a way that doesn't demean you, I think is so wildly important. And it sounds to me like your dad was able to do that.

SPEAKER_00 37:23

Definitely was, and you know, both of us for that matter, being in sales and being in business your whole life, you learn to take constructive criticism the right way. Some people out there can't take it. Yeah, they think you're physically attacking them. Yeah, and that's not the case whatsoever. You're just trying to get better so you don't make those mistakes, time in and time out.

SPEAKER_02 37:42

Yeah. Talk to me about leadership. High school baseball, college baseball. After college, you go to CBS, then you go to corporate America. Now you're running and operating a business. Has your vision of what leadership is and how a leader should act changed over time?

SPEAKER_00 37:59

Absolutely. I mean, at any different level or any different job that you have, being a leader is different. And I don't even think the true definition of leadership that you can really look that up in the dictionary and say this is what it is. I think it's all tailored to what your job is, what you do for your crews, your people that are under you. And sorry. And the biggest thing about leadership to me is adjusting. I think that's the most important part of it. I mean, you can learn different characteristics on how you gotta lead your team or what you should do. You can read a book, listen to a podcast, whatever you think, maybe get some key points, but you gotta morph that into your own style. And really and truly what I think being a leader is is being there for your team, having adaptability, and making sure that all your bases are rounded.

SPEAKER_02 38:50

How do you correct behavior that isn't necessarily the direction that sort of pro wants?

SPEAKER_00 38:59

Unfortunately, you gotta get rid of people at times. Is really what it comes down to. You know, you can try and you know let them know what our standards are, our SOPs and all that kind of stuff, and that this is their last shot to do it, and if they don't adhere to it, then they're gone. We just got rid of a crew today because of it. They're not living up to the what our expectations are set. Yeah. So they're fortunately gone. That's that's rough.

SPEAKER_02 39:24

It's rough because I feel like work ethic and in in a lot of ways, not necessarily in the trade so much, although it is there, especially in the younger generation. This work ethic of entitlement, I feel like, has crept in and nobody's gonna know type of thing. You know, yeah. It's like you pull once over. Yeah, if we cut this corner, no one's gonna know. You know, no one will come back and check our work or whatever it is. So I I think that that that's yeah, anyways. You've taken over the family business. We'll we'll say that Randy left you a legacy to protect. Yep. What's the most important thing aside from making sure the business succeeds, right? Because that's an obvious given, I think. You're not here to drive it in the ground. Right. What about the legacy is the probably the most important thing for you to protect?

SPEAKER_00 40:15

A couple different things. Really and truly, one being is that my parents left me one heck of a foundation, right? So I feel that I need to get this to the next level, not for myself, but for what they did. Yeah, they laid the foundation out, they put the time in, they put their own money in to get it where it's at, and I came on just to prosper, yeah, right, is really what it comes to. So that's the huge part to me that I want to keep that legacy going with the growth aspect for it.

SPEAKER_05 40:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:48

But I also am extremely cognizant of our people that work from us. You know, the people that are on the boots on the ground every day going out there. If I can help them succeed, I can grow this business and make their personal quality of life better, man, we have succeeded all around, right? Everywhere from the top for me, all the way down to the people that are producing the work. If they're happy making money, doing well, because that's what it's about, right? Nobody does anything for free. Yeah. When it comes to that. But if we can make them happy and just simply improve their quality of life, man, I've done my job.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:28

That's awesome. That's powerful too. I think uh I think I think I'm gonna say a statement which is uh probably in a a wild assumption, but but I believe I've witnessed this enough over the years that I can make this assertion. In that I believe a lot of people who don't own and operate a business think that the owners of the business are only focused on money. Right. And and I think that at least what I'm hearing you say, what I know in my heart, like I want what what fills me more than anything is to feel like the people around me are successful. Like feel like I can contribute to helping them be the fullest person that they can be, watch watching them experience success. Obviously, I want it for myself, but it's for whatever weird reason so much more fulfilling to be able to give it to somebody else.

SPEAKER_00 42:24

It it absolutely is, John. I mean, it comes back to where at our ages, money isn't about everything anymore. Yeah, you know, it's about watching a good friend of mine, JD, and a good friend of mine, Greg, that work with me, right? It's watching them be successful and being able to go do things with their family and enjoying showing up every day. I mean, that's way more self-rewarding to myself than collecting my paycheck with that. And again, like you said, everybody always thinks business owners just make this and make that and all that, and that's what they're focused on, is all this money, and it's not what it's about, at least for me.

SPEAKER_02 43:02

Yeah, well, I th I think for the small business owner, it is definitely not about that, right? You know, it's like right, you want to grow the business, and the and there's a point at which the business becomes scaled where the operation is I'll say wildly profitable, and that can be whatever your definition of wildly profitable is. Sure. But but there's a point at which it's like, okay, you realize that profitability, right? And then there's the point at which it's like, okay, now we're gonna manage to the numbers, to how many calls did you make today? How come you we're only on the phone 30 seconds at this point? How come that you know, and those asinine questions, you know, it's like you you only did three appointments today. Why'd you only do three appointments? You're supposed to do eight. It's like, yeah, okay, but the quality doesn't matter. The fact that I spent two and a half hours in an office and I got a deal or something.

SPEAKER_00 44:06

It's just like come on now, like leave me alone.

SPEAKER_02 44:08

At some point, that has to matter, which I've been in that situation where I I I mean, I worked for a company and I had to go to Colorado to release a product, and we still had the five and a quarter inch floppy disks. That's how long ago it was. Oh, yeah. And if the if the office didn't have a certain speed of dial-up internet, I had to load it with the floppy disks. Well, I went into an office. I take this back. I left Arizona, my left house at four o'clock in the morning to fly to Colorado, to rent a car, to drive to northern Colorado. So by the time I got to northern Colorado, it's always like 10 or 11 o'clock in the morning, right? Yeah. Go into the first office, which is cold calls. I'm not even going into where they're warm calls. I'm literally walking in and saying, Hey, I've got this product, would love for you to try it. Just sell it, whatever it doesn't cost you anything. Let me install it on your computer. First guy agrees to let me do it, but he's in northern Colorado. It's like 14k modem. And so it's just dead slow. But but I started the download before I realized that it was a slower modem. Okay. So you can't pull. So I can't pull. I just gotta let it go. So it's like, okay, it's gonna be like two hours. So I'm like, hey, you want to go grab lunch? So I take this guy to lunch, we go grab lunch, we come back. Things still downloading. Get through the whole thing, go. Go to a second appointment, and by that time it's close to the end of the day, and I've got to make we're we're supposed to have a phone call at the end of the day to see how many calls I did and what the success rate, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 45:40

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:41

I'm like, they're like, How many calls have you made? And calls being stop-ins. Yep. And I'm like, Well, two, and it's like silence. And they're like, Okay, well, how many installs did you get? I said, Well, I got one, which is that one office, which was multiple computers, but the one office. Sure. And like, okay. So we go through the rest of it. They go kind of around the room. There were a couple other people that were not around the room, but around the phone. A couple other people in in in Colorado doing installs in other areas, and they're like, Oh, at five, had this, whatever. Get off the phone. I get a call from my boss. He's like, Hey, my boss is pissed off because you only had two meetings. Wow. We got to figure out what we're gonna do. I'm like, what do you mean we gotta figure out what we're gonna do? He goes, Well, you only had two meetings. I mean, yeah, but I got an install.

SPEAKER_00 46:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:26

And this is the reason why I only had two. I mean, and I literally walked him through it. I said, I'm not up here jerking around.

SPEAKER_00 46:33

Yeah, I'm not playing golf like I want to be.

SPEAKER_02 46:35

Yeah, I'm working. So we kind of go through this whole thing, and I'm like, if if you feel like you need to cover my ass, I'm done. Right. I literally will go home right now, I'm done. Because that's not how I'm gonna, you know, but it's that whole thing, right? It's that it is there's nobody taking into consideration that there are all these variables in the field that come into play, anyways. I don't remember why I brought that up.

SPEAKER_00 46:58

No, it's relative, it's relative to the corporate lifestyle. And I'm not saying it's a bad lifestyle because it's no, I mean I mean, it's a I had great jobs, great bosses, great people that I still keep in contact with. Yeah, a lot better than what I got now.

SPEAKER_02 47:12

Yeah, oh, for sure. For sure. And and I I mean, honestly, I I enjoyed it. I enjoyed working corporate. I just realized quite early on in my in my employment history that I wasn't a yes, sir person. Sure. Somebody asked me, well, what do you think about this? My mouth doesn't stay shut. Right. It doesn't say, it's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 47:37

Yeah, you don't play the corporate game, you tell them how you feel. Exactly. Right. And disagree.

SPEAKER_02 47:42

I was told very early on that that's not the way you're supposed to behave, and I just couldn't change it.

SPEAKER_00 47:46

No, that was not me. I was never gonna be a C level executive or anything like that. I didn't have that in me. You can't do that.

SPEAKER_02 47:52

So anyway, so I yeah, but it took me 20. Well, I had started a couple, but this agency, my agency, 23 years before I finally said, I'm just done. Right. I'm done. And it and because it was always, I'm just not ready. I'm just not ready. I'm just not ready, you know. And and it, I mean, similar to your dad's and mom's situation where it's like, okay, somebody makes that decision for you. Right. It's like, okay, I could go get another corporate job, but do I really want that? Right? Yeah, right. Or I could start this in probably in their mind, they were thinking, yeah, legacy. I mean, Jason's here, we'll get this thing started, we'll we'll struggle through the not that you don't have struggles, but struggle through the crap piece of it first couple years, get it on its feet, figure some of the things out, and then draw you in. What would you say is one of the hardest lessons you've had to learn or unlearn in business so far?

SPEAKER_00 49:22

Quite a few, I'm sure. But if I had to pick one, of course. I think the hardest lessons to learn, especially when you're working for yourself, is failure. And in my line of work, failure essentially is you know, not not winning a job, a job going south. Because you put it's like, you know, I'm sure for you too, Jan. You know, we put all this work into customer acquisition, yeah, and then they decided to go another route. And it's like, you know, you respect their decision, of course, but you're like, well, what did I do that didn't get me? Was it price? Yeah, was it how I presented myself? Did they not feel that I had a good backing of a company to get their job done? Whatever it is, right? So it's just that's the hardest thing to struggle with, I think, is failure. But going back to the baseball days, baseball is one of the sports where you fail more than you win, right? I mean, multi-million dollar contract in baseball is somebody that gets hit three out of every ten times. Yeah, which is insane. Right. So you fail theoretically, you fail 70% of the time. Yeah, it's like, yeah. So you yeah, you're failing all the time. Right. So you learn. So, how do you take those failures and make them into a winning attitude? Because I've known you for years now, and I know you're a winner, right? And you want to win, and we all want to win, especially as small business guys. That's why we're doing it.

SPEAKER_04 50:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:43

So what can we take from failures and convert that into wins for the next time around?

SPEAKER_02 50:49

And and always trying to, and I and I really appreciate that. I I feel like there's a there's a propensity, and I think probably in your in your line of work as well, where it you get to this point where you feel like, okay, we got this in the bag. We're good. And then all of a sudden you get that call and they're like, Yeah, we decided to go a different direction. And then you're like, Can you share why? Yep. And they're like, Oh, just we just decided it's like You're not the right fit. Yeah, it's like, but why? Yeah. Can you get because I can't get better if you don't tell me specifically what it is that we did wrong. And and if it's and I and I've had conversations with clients in the past where it's like, look, if the carrier pisses you off because they didn't respond to a claim the way you feel they should have, let me know because we'll move you away from that company. Right. Right. They may be the cheapest thing on the block and that's what's important to you, but you know, when you get a claim and all of a sudden they don't pay you for six months because they're trying to figure something out, and now you can't work a vehicle because you're waiting six months to get a payout on that vehicle. Well, well, that just costs you way more than a little bit more premium, you know. So it's like if you're pissed off at the carrier, great. Tell me, we'll fix it. Right. If you're pissed off at me, tell me. I may not be able to fix it with you, but I can at least be cognizant of it of the next time it comes up. Yeah, I'll learn. I won't do that again in the next guy. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 52:14

Whatever the case may be.

SPEAKER_02 52:15

It's it's so it's crazy, and and it's hard today, I think, in our society, and and I would assume obviously making assumptions throw them all over the room right now, but I would assume that you are fighting price every single day on every single job. 100% that people don't care. Oh, we're gonna cut this line perfect. Yep. We're gonna make sure that you've got a red wall, it really needs an it really needs a like a primer. A primer, yeah. Yep. We gotta get the primer on first to make sure it seals out from bleeding through the blue that you want on there now, or the yellow or whatever. And and you're just thinking about, oh, this guy charges me a thousand dollars less. Right. Well, let's let's see why. Let's talk about why, because there's usually a reason.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:04

But anyways, you got me started down a rabbit hole. I didn't know but it's just it's that thing, right?

SPEAKER_00 53:10

Yeah, and I'm I'm just as sensitive to price as everybody else. 100%. But you know, when it comes to like the painting business, right? Yeah, price is definitely a factor. I mean, who's it who's price not a factor to even even your people that are extremely more wealthy than the greater people, it's still a factor to them. Yeah, so but it's it's all about how you present yourself and what value you bring to the table as well. For for sure. You know, that's what I always say. If we're losing jobs for price, I'm always checking to make sure that we brought the correct value to it. And that's just unfortunately for our business and our model, that's just not our customer. Yeah. But that's a customer for somebody else out there.

SPEAKER_02 53:46

And and I'm the same way. I actually literally was just having a conversation with a guy yesterday about the insurance industry, and he he had asked me about a specific carrier and a coverage that the carrier had. And I said, if somebody wants that carrier specifically, they're not a client for me. And he goes, How can you say that? I said, Because that company, in my opinion, doesn't have a quality product, and it's not worth my reputation to put something there and have to deal with that in the event something happens to the client. You know, it's like this whole it's just not worth it. He said, Well, but they're I'm like, I I I don't care if they're thousands of dollars less than everybody else. Let them write the business because eventually those clients are gonna get pissed off and want to go someplace else.

SPEAKER_00 54:33

You know, absolutely, and that happens in our in our industry all the time, too. You know, we have obviously different paint manufacturers and different grades of paint, right? Yeah that affects longevity of the product and all that. And there's certain products out there, certain manufacturers out there that we will just will not use. If a customer's hell bent on it, we'll say, Hey, try the other guy. Yeah, maybe he'll use it. I have to warranty your project, yeah. I have to look at your project for years. If it's an exterior, when I'm in the neighborhood, I know where our jobs are. I might go by and make sure it's looking good. Yeah, and I don't want to, I'm not gonna do that at your house because I know it's gonna fail. Yeah, I'd rather you go with somebody else and not tarnish our reputation.

SPEAKER_02 55:13

Weird streaks of watered down paint or something. Communication. How important is communication to you and what has the switched from being an employee to being an owner taught you about communication?

SPEAKER_00 55:30

Simply, communication is the key to success. Whether it's good, indifferent, bad, whatever it may be, is you just gotta be up front with everybody, whether it's your employees, your painters, your customers, communication is the key. Everybody wants to know what's going on. And if you don't communicate with them, whether it's to the customer, the end user, they're gonna be lost, right? I mean, think about if we're painting your house and we're there four or five days and we haven't even touched base with you once, you're gonna be like, what's going on with my project? Where are we at? Yeah. No, yeah, I get it. You can go out and look at your house and see paint, but it's like, when am I wrapping up? What's going on? But I I simply believe communication is the key to success.

SPEAKER_05 56:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 56:15

And open communication, that is. We at our company, there's a complete open door. Anyone in the company can call me at whenever I talk to employees at eight o'clock, nine o'clock at night if they need something. I just think it's very, very important. And as I've got into the being a business owner, I don't think I ever realized that as much. Yeah. Right? Because when I was just doing either my sales job for my dad or my sales jobs over here, it was all about just bringing jobs in and then going away.

SPEAKER_02 56:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 56:49

For the most part. Right.

SPEAKER_02 56:50

Onto the next. Because you didn't have to worry about the servicing aspect or the repercussions of whatever it is that happened.

SPEAKER_00 56:57

And now it's like everybody looks at me for different things. Yeah. And if I don't have that, I got nothing.

SPEAKER_02 57:02

Absolutely. Well, and and it's funny because if you cross a line, we'll say ethically, that that you everybody's got that line where they're like, and it's like, uh, you know, I'm struggling for jobs right now or struggling for work, so I'll just take this one and we'll squeeze it, whatever. It doesn't take very long for news of how bad you did to travel. 100%. So it's like it's so much better. I mean, what do they say? Like a bad review will, you know, hit a thousand eyes, whereas a good review will hit none. Go unnoticed. Yeah. Yeah, 100%. So it's that whole thing where it's like, uh, you know, or most people these days, I think, at least I do, you know, you because you look at stuff at Amazon, it's got 500,000 reviews and they're all five stars. Yeah, right. You know, and it's like, okay, these are bots doing these you know reviews. So I think people are starting to get densived desensitized to the reviews, right, online. So then they reach out to people that they know or or community or or what have you. So did baseball I shouldn't say did baseball at this point in your life, in your career, in the business, has your and I'll say team aspect of playing baseball helped you at all with where you're at today and running, we'll call it the team of Certa Pro?

SPEAKER_00 58:25

I would say absolutely. Team equals structure to me, right? You can't be successful in the ball field with one or two guys. Maybe in basketball, you could, right? But in baseball to be successful, you gotta have a team of one to nine, right? And you gotta have structure. With structure, people have different roles. And as long as everybody's completing their roles to where they should be, it's gonna roll up to you have one heck of a team. And example, our team, I'll go to bat with our team any day of the week.

SPEAKER_01 58:58

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 58:59

That's awesome. Talk to me about Certer Pro. We know you do commercial residential, exterior, interior. Correct. Is there a good time of year or a bad time of year to paint the outside of a house in Arizona?

SPEAKER_00 59:13

You can paint year-round. Yeah. Obviously, the huge conception is that in our summer months that we're in now is you can't paint in the summer.

SPEAKER_04 59:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:20

Right? All that becomes is there's a certain temperature for different products that you can apply them. So that means that you know in the winter time, we're starting at 8 a.m., right? And we're getting that eight-hour work day in. In the summertime, we're probably starting at 5, 5, 30 a.m. and we're working till, you know, maybe 10 30, 11.

SPEAKER_01 59:38

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 59:38

So really and truly you can do it. You know, we're chasing shade, whatever it may be. But it comes down to is that having that communication with the customer as well of saying, hey, typically your job would be a three-day job, right? Now it's maybe a four or five-day job because our working hours are shorter.

SPEAKER_01 59:55

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 59:56

With that. So you can paint year-round, and obviously at certain temperatures, certain times of the day, it's not beneficial for us to be throwing paint on a house because it's just not adhering properly, has proper dry times, all that. But most importantly, it's just not safe for our people.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:14

It's really what heat exhaustion is struggling. Heat exhaustion.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:17

You don't think I mean I couldn't imagine climbing a ladder at 120 degrees outside. It's true. Aluminum ladder.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:26

Right. I've I've put on Christmas lights in December with an aluminum ladder, and those things get hot. They do, and you're probably out of breath like me. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Let's let's uh shift gears for a little bit. Let's talk about you personally. Lydia. Yep. Your wife. Beautiful wife, yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:45

How long have you guys been together? Gosh, we've been together since February of 2012. Okay. So been a little while. So we got married in October of 17. Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:57

And you you have a son.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:58

Yep. But it's Lydia's son?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:00

It's Lydia's son, my stepson Brett. Okay. And is he in the business too? He's not. He um actually lives in Boise, Idaho.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:07

Oh, wow. Okay. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:08

He's doing um RV sales now up there.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:11

Doing very well with it. Hopefully he listens to that and knows that I would love to have him in the business at some point.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:16

Someday. Yeah. We could use a great sale first. We could. Absolutely. You're hired, buddy. And and I'll say, if you can sell RVs, yeah. You can sell paint jobs here in there, man. For sure. For sure. When you're carrying the weight of the the the business, the ownership of the business, how do you how do you balance your personal time and your personal life, protect the marriage, protect your relationship with your son, and all that while dealing with the stress of the business?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:45

You know, I've learned that and I've and I've learned from experiences, right? That you know, the stresses of the businesses and everything that you have normally hits your significant other, unfortunately. That's just the reality, right? That's the person that you can vent to, this or that. And I've learned through the years that I need to channel that differently, right? And I need to keep that with myself, and I need to teach basically have a teaching moment for myself. Take that stress, repurpose it. And for me to repurpose is just to grind and figure out why I'm having that stress and go fix that and make a solution.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:20

Gotcha. Do you do any like personal development stuff? Do you are you into reading a lot? I mean, how do you self-develop? I mean, you seem quite wise. I don't know if you're just fake faking it till you make it type of thing. But I mean, do you do you do anything like that where you take time out of your day to to to try to develop yourself and and hone in on those relationships?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:47

Sure, absolutely. I mean, been very lucky in my business ownership career to you know really meet some really great other business owners that I'll call friends now, trusted advisors. You know, it's great to just pick their brain on things, see what their pitfalls were, what their highs were. I can bring different things I have to them and really learn from them and where they're at now in business. So I don't have to make those same mistakes. Right. So a lot of that, you know, just connecting with people, hearing different stories really helps. And then, you know, I've read some different books and things like that. That's normally kind of reflection, is my Sunday chore. Gotcha. Sundays are typically the days that I like to keep to myself. That's my one day a week, right? Where you can do the self-reflection, really think about how the week went, what you could have done differently, what you could have done better, and honestly, kind of beat myself up a little bit at times with it because that's how I get better. Gotcha. Not everybody gets better that way, but but I do personally. Travel. Love travel. Where's your favorite place you've ever been? Ooh, favorite place I've ever been. That's a tough one. I've been lucky to go to a lot of places more domestically. We're trying to mix in the international stuff here soon. I mean, I've been to Mexico and stuff like that, but that doesn't really count to me. Yeah. Favorite place I've been, yeah, that's a tough one. Tempe. Yeah, right? Mill Avenue back in the city. Buckeye. College. Yeah. Well, Buckeyes is out there, or Buckey's is out there now, so I got a reason to go there, I guess. Excuse me. I would say favorite place I've probably been. That's tough. I got a couple. I'm gonna go with two. Okay. I'm gonna go with my first trip. So big baseball guys, you know, right? My goal's to see every major league baseball stadium. That'd be so cool. So I got two, only two left. So we're chipping away at him. Yep, 28 or 30 done. Wow. Excuse me. So we're chipping away at him. So I would say one of the favorite memories I have, and one of the favorite places I went was with my dad to Yankee Stadium to watch Derek Jeter's last home game. Oh wow. We flew out, took the red eye, watched the game, flew out that night. No kidding. Absolutely amazing. Atmosphere, everything. It was just a kid's dream. That is. You know, all that to go with your dad. We did a huge trip with my parents back there to the Hall of Fame. Yeah. A lot, a lot of fun. Now I would say one of the favorite trips I had was we went to Lake Tahoe for my wife's 40th. We had about 20 people with us. Really? And we just had it was one of the most beautiful places I've ever seen. And we just had one heck of a great time. The water in Tahoe is so clear. It's unreal. Amazing.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:31

It is unreal. I would go back tomorrow. Yeah. Like I've I've never been in it, so I don't know how cold it is, but it's a little chilly. It's freaking clear.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:39

It is amazing. It's so beautiful there. And that was just one of my favorite trips and one of the coolest places that I've ever been. That I never thought I'd go to, obviously. Favorite food? Pizza. Yeah. Yeah. Chicago, New York. New York thin crust. 100%. Yeah. I could eat pizza every day. Pizza and pop. No kidding. No kidding. 100%.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:59

That's funny. Clearly I do. Well, I think we both have that same issue. But how involved, because I don't know. I'm going to ask a question and a little bit on the personal level. How involved in Brett's life were you as he was growing up?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:13

So I met Brett when he was, gosh, he had to be so what, about 12 years old? Okay. 11, 12 years old. So I was very lucky to be involved in a lot of his life growing up. I would say obviously as he got older and things like that, it's been easier to connect and get involved a little bit more. Um, you know, we try and get up to Boise to see him as much as humanly possible. Yeah. Obviously, we got we both have responsibilities here, different things like that. And we try and bring him down here, you know, as much as we can. Yeah. So I would say definitely now in life, and you know, when he's in sales now, that's what I've done. We've definitely connected, you know, a lot more on that level now. Yeah. Speak a little bit of the same language from time to time.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:54

Does Lydia work in the business with you?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:56

She does not. Okay. She's a uh loan processor at a mortgage company. By choice, you don't want her in the business or I would never be adverse to that. It's it's always been I like the two different streams of income from that aspect of it. Make sense. And I don't want to ruin what we have, right? And we have the separation of that. And I don't want to bogger up with that, but growth is always there, and it could at some point maybe twist my hand. Yeah. So I would not be adverse to it.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:27

We talked about the legacy that your mom and dad left for you. What do you hope your legacy is on those in your life right now?

SPEAKER_00 1:07:35

Good question. You know, I would say, again, the most important part about legacy is not really the material things of what you did, it's how you're remembered, how you treated people. That to me is way more self suffilling than anything on earth. I would just love to be remembered as a very respectable individual, individual that did things that were right, and they can call me a friend. a win for me.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:07

I like that.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:08

That's cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:09

Oh I would I would say you are a very lack of better words coming out of my mouth right now, real person. I appreciate that. And I I have I've obviously come to know you a little bit over the years, but I I feel like you are very down-to-earth, real. Say it like it is. And I appreciate that about you. So well thank you. Appreciate it. That's the idea. Have there been recently, and we'll start wrapping up here, but have there been seasons within the business that have really tested your mettle and made you feel like is this the right thing? Am I am I am I doing this right? Should I change something?

SPEAKER_00 1:08:47

I think that's weekly if not daily at times. Okay. Right? I mean this is a business that you try and stay in your own lane as much as you can but you just gotta cross over so much and be adaptable.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:01

It's almost impossible to just be in your own lane 24-7. It's it's actually impossible with that.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:09

What what do you hope your mission or your message is to your clients when you're when you're dealing with your clients and you've got your communication and everything's clicking on all cylinders and it's and it's great.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:23

Obviously you're selling a paint job right is there something else is there is there is there more to that obviously we're in sales right to sell point paint jobs and all that but I don't think it's really us selling the job. I want to be a trusted advisor, a trusted consultant for them and really understand what they want out of the project. Right? Exterior you're gonna live here for a long time okay well we should do this that oh no I'm selling it okay this is how we should treat the project I want that type of feeling we're not out there trying to be the use car salesman type mentality and shove paint jobs down people's throat. It's really just putting yourself out there as being an advocate for them and coaching them to what they need actually for their project. Somebody might call you and say I need a whole interior done well go out there do you really I'm not here I'm not trying to give my work away from our business right but I also want to do the right thing. So I want people to remember our business because there's a whole bunch of people in our business that these guys were extremely trustworthy. They're not trying to take advantage of the situation and I actually like them. Have you had a situation I mean SirtaPro is obviously a very large franchise right and you're just a small piece in that large pond we'll say have you had situations where you've had to overcome a misconception or misperception of SurtaPro because of something somebody experienced somewhere else absolutely how do you overcome it uh doesn't happen too much on the residential side because we have our own turf territories that we kind of hone our marketing into for the most part yeah we can go out of turf if you had a referral for me you know your house was in Tempe I could go do that because we're you know acquaintances and all that but not too much in the res spectrum but it's happened a lot unfortunately in the commercial spectrum you know I've literally when I went into the business was trying to make some relationships and open some clients up and all that you know I would get oh I'll never use certipro again I use you guys and it's like well hold on a second if you give me five minutes let me first of all explain that we're all completely different businesses. Under the umbrella all the businesses do have certain SOPs that we should adhere to so relatively you should get the same experience if you work with them in Michigan and you work with me out here but everybody runs their business differently so nine out of ten times I've only had one customer that when I told them were completely individual businesses you have me you have our production manager whoever that may be has said no only one customer in my lifetime of doing this business was like nope you're certipro, you're done to us. Yeah and that that's not good. Right. Not good at all for the brand I mean if you're you know if you're not gonna be a brand and team player then there's no reason that you're buying you should be buying a franchise. Yeah totally totally makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:31

How do people find your sorta pro? Ours directly yeah I mean like like if I just go on and search sorta pro is it gonna give me you?

SPEAKER_00 1:12:41

Depends. Okay. If you're searching from our zip codes on Google then it will route you to our personal SurtoPro website. Okay. My home sorta pro is called SertaPro Painters of Gilbert dash Queen Creek.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:54

So if you were to Google that you're gonna find that obviously you can always call us 480 272 6770. Okay. Those are the best ways to do that. If you're in the Southeast Valley typically you are in our turf so if you did go to just sirtipro.com put in like 85295 for Gilbert zip code you're gonna get rerouted to my website okay okay and does it cost anything to get a bid to have painting done? Not at all. 100% free estimates. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:24

Cool I feel like I should ask you more questions. Is there anything I haven't asked you that you would love to share with our audience I can't think of too much.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:31

I just really appreciate being on your podcast and it's been a great experience.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:36

Well I appreciate you coming on everybody who comes on the show gets a gift. Okay. You're no different. All right I've got a couple things here for you. I've got a challenge coin okay um because you went above and beyond love it thank you and uh you've been having a cocktail out of this nice same thing yeah but it's personalized.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:57

Oh that's cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:59

Yeah so uh now you can go above and beyond love it I appreciate you coming on I appreciate you I would I would consider you a friend so I appreciate your friendship absolutely and uh thank you for supporting the podcast and uh spending time with us tonight thanks for having me really appreciate it great experience awesome thank you thank you y'all this is Jason Brussel and I went above and beyond what did I do for it to death be all the way away to watch it roll is network we truly thrive