The Health Huns
The Messy Side of Health and Fitness!
Your favourite amateur athletes keeping it real, discussing the messy side of health and fitness
The Health Huns
EP.27 Is it ok to have 'body goals'?
What if the most important progress you make never shows up on a scale? We open the door to a frank, funny, and nuanced conversation about body goals, identity, and the everyday wins that actually change how life feels. From airplane seatbelts and clothing fit to TRX rows and clearer skin, we map the victories that prove health is bigger than a number.
We share lived experiences of weight loss that improved pain, energy, and confidence, without pretending the world treats every body the same. One of us reframes body goals through gender expression—building a strong back and broader upper body to align how we feel inside with how we’re seen—while the other unpacks the relief of moving more freely, sleeping better, and caring less about a target weight. Together, we draw a clean line between healthy ambition and harmful extremes, calling out the traps of underfueling, obsessive tracking, and quick fixes that sabotage wellbeing.
The conversation widens to society’s role: fat stigma, inaccessible spaces, the male gaze, and the double standard that calls men “distinguished” as they age while urging women to stay forever young. We talk about judgement from all sides, why the loudest critics are often the least content, and how therapy, patience, and perspective can help you choose what you’ll be judged for—and care a lot less about it. If you want to lose weight, we talk safe, sustainable approaches. If you don’t, we offer strength, performance, sleep, mood, and energy goals that deliver real momentum without obsessing over scales.
Come for the candour, stay for the practical wins and mindset shifts that make training feel purposeful again. If this resonates, tap follow, share it with someone who needs a kinder lens on progress, and leave a review to help more people find the show. What non-scale victory are you chasing this week?
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Maybe I could make a living in doing um reading erotic fiction.
SPEAKER_00:Hello and welcome to the Health Huns, the pod where we discuss the messy side of health and fitness.
SPEAKER_01:From gym fails to newfound communities.
SPEAKER_00:We're here to help you feel like less of a failure and find your place in the messy world of health and fitness.
SPEAKER_01:Hello and welcome to this week's episode of The Health Huns with me, Ree. And me, Amber. Two amateur athletes talking about the messy side of health and fitness. Just like we do every week. I thought I'd add that in for anyone new so they can get to know us a bit better.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I liked it. I think that is gonna draw people in. Yeah, hopefully that comes out nice on the audio. Let's hope so. Let's hope so.
SPEAKER_01:That was your best sexy voice. Maybe I could make a living in doing um reading erotic fiction. I reckon there probably is a market for that. With a slight Norfolk twang. That could be on our Patreon.
SPEAKER_00:Or us reading erotica.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. That's so funny because there's some really shit erotica out there.
SPEAKER_00:I wonder if there's any like uh like fitness-based erotic erotica.
SPEAKER_01:I don't know, but I really want to write a f like erotic novel about personal trainers.
SPEAKER_00:Well, get on it and we will read it out on our Patreon because I reckon people would pay for that.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, okay. I'll get what we're putting that on. Right. How have you been this week? How's your week been?
SPEAKER_00:My week has been pretty good, you know. Um I've been busy. It's been a a solid seven out of ten. Nothing. Well, I've had a couple of good runs. Yeah, it's been alright. It's just nothing of note, but alright. Well, that's good. Yeah. Yeah. How's yours?
SPEAKER_01:Morick's been good. I got a new fringe. Yes, you have a whole new haircut. A whole new haircut. I mean, it's not that drastically different. I've had like it's my yearly fringe, and you know, it's gotta be done. Um I did a run today, been to the gym, I'm feeling strong. Um, I feel very much in my this is who I am era. As in, I just feel good about everything. Yeah. So it's exciting. Um, anything else, anything else, anything else that springs to mind this week? No. We've had quite dull weeks, haven't we?
SPEAKER_00:I mean, we had a good Sunday.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, we had a productive Sunday, didn't we?
SPEAKER_00:Very productive. We can't tell anybody about it yet, but things pipe.
SPEAKER_01:I've been telling everyone. Have you? Oh, not publicly, but like face to face. Okay. Are they excited about it? Yeah. Good. That's good. Uh stay tuned to find out at some point in the near future. Yes. Okay, this week we don't really have a set topic. We were discussing like non-scale victories, weren't we? Yeah. Then we started talking about body goals and are they okay? Are they negative? Are they toxic? And just talking about things within that area. So a little bit of a trigger warning, content warning. We will be talking about weight, we will be probably talking about stuff to do with your body and how it looks throughout this episode. So if you're not into that, this episode probably isn't going to be for you. But we're going to try and keep it nice, neutral, all sides of the arguments. Um discussion, really.
SPEAKER_00:And it's something that you know we're very experienced in because we have bodies.
SPEAKER_01:Well, yeah, exactly. We do have bodies that have over the years between the two of us, each of our bodies, not our one body together. We care about they have changed, and our opinions on our bodies have changed, and how we approach things like that have changed. So, and I think especially like people within our I say our generation, like we're the same age, but like we are. I feel like our you know, we all have very similar opinions and thoughts when it comes to how we approach weight loss these days, or how we talk about our bodies and what people actually want from their bodies, yeah. Despite the noise of like weight loss drugs and stuff, I do still believe, I hold in my heart, that the attitudes have changed for the better. Yes. But we will talk about that in this episode. So, what do you think? Non-scale victories, losing weight, you know, what's more important to you, or what do you think had a more of a uh feeling of satisfaction and achievement when you're on your weight loss journey?
SPEAKER_00:Well, losing weight for me was good on many different levels. Um it was good because it reversed some health issues I had, which made me feel better. Um, and it it was good because like I could wear the clothes I wanted to wear. Yeah. Um, and it was also good because it meant that I actually joined the gym and started doing exercise. And as much as I hate to admit it, exercising does make you feel better. It's so annoying. It's so annoying, it's so annoying. Like when people say, Oh, have you tried exercise? No, but actually, it does make you feel better, and you know, it does for me, it gives me a bit of a purpose, and yeah, so I mean, I'm not gonna lie and say like, you know, as somebody who was in a much bigger body, like the world is a bit shit when you are bigger, and people treat you differently, so life has been easier, like, and you know, I can't lie and say that losing, you know, losing weight and being smaller doesn't make me feel better in those kind of ways because it does, because of, you know, I don't know, it's it's a tough one because almost I can't all I can't even really remember how I was now because it has been a while. Um, and I'm I'm once things have happened or been and gone, it's almost like they're wiped from my memory in some respects.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Like, unless something is with me in the moment, I have a weird kind of work in memory. Um, but you know, the best honestly, the best thing to come to me from weight loss really is the fact that I go to the gym now and I really enjoy it.
SPEAKER_01:I think everything you say is obviously completely valid, it's yours your experience. Um I think it's a shame about society and how inherently fat phobic it is. Because would people feel like we have to accept and acknowledge, I think, that some people are naturally smaller, some people are naturally bigger, right? And I believe that everyone should have a choice and a right to live in the body that they choose to live in, no matter what that looks like. And I think would people in larger bodies feel so bad about themselves if society was just more accommodating for the average size? Because I'm not, I think things like you know, going to a restaurant and not being able to fit in the tiny little booths, like even I I struggle to get in those booths sometimes, and you know, I'm probably pretty average in as it goes, you know, aeroplane seats, bus seats, cinema seats, um, just our people's opinions on people who live in bigger bodies are so awful, and I think that makes it so hard because even if you had someone who was in a bigger body, they got their if we're talking about it from a health stance, their health is actually in a good state and they feel good, they can do all the things they want to do, but it's the stigma and the anti-fat bias that society has which is causing them to feel shit, like that's the issue, I think.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and that's not okay, no, but I think for me, it's a bit of a I don't know if double-edged sword is the right thing, but I when I was bigger, I was it came from I wasn't okay in myself, and I was binge eating, and you know, as much as I didn't want to go anywhere because I really struggled to walk anywhere because walking gave me a backache, and so as much as it was people's opinions and like the way the world was, like there was a kind of deeper level for me on why I was that way, yeah. I think through somehow managing to tackle why I was doing what I was doing, and then I had, I mean, I'd had therapy before, but then I had some therapy last year that was amazing, and for me, it's kind of been this like weird, it's been not just a journey of weight loss, it's been a journey of like you know mental health, physical health, like so, and everybody's so different that I think one person's story cannot kind of really define anybody else's story, yeah. No, it's how people feel, isn't it? Like, you know, like you said, if people if somebody is in a bigger body and they're happy and they are, you know, all of these things, then society, you know, I mean, so even if you're not happy, society should cater for you. And it's interesting because on the flip side of people that are bigger, I've got a client who is very small naturally, and there's been a big thing recently, well, you know, over the years about like cloth people should make clothes in bigger sizes. My client struggles to get clothes in her size, yeah, like extra small, and she has written to a few, because she really likes to buy sustainable, like spend a bit more money, buy sustainable, like ethically made clothes, and they she can't get anything in her size, and she's like, I'm not saying they shouldn't make them for bigger people, but also if they're making them for bigger people, the flip side is they should also make them for smaller people.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So yeah, I agree. I think yeah, it's just what falls outside the average, isn't it? It's like, are they gonna waste money making clothes for people that there's not like a big percentage of the population that's ever gonna buy them? Um which isn't right, but it is an issue, anyone who falls outside those that box.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that like size 10 to 16, 18. Yeah, and it's they are the average sizes.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, which is yeah, are they there? I think they're bigger now. I think the average sizes are bigger than that. Well, yeah, but I'm talking about like commercial.
SPEAKER_00:In general with clothes and stuff, yeah. Yeah, like you know, you do get a lot of people who are a size 10, 12, 14, and then I think 16 is like the average size, isn't it, in the UK?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so weight loss aside, because I think one of the issues is people because of what we've been programmed to believe and taught, the first port of call when it comes to being healthier or uh you know improving yourself is weight loss, rightly or wrongly. But a lot of people get stuck in that watching the scales, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Well, the scales are like the scales are difficult to read. So as a woman who was a teenager in the 90s, I mean there's just always been this like you should be 10, 10 and a half stone. Yeah, and it really has been kind of over the past, I'd say, like, five years or so, that I've really and I just assumed everybody that was thin weighed ten and a half stone. Yeah, that number's been thrown around so much, it's so fair. Like 10 and if you are not in the 10 stone range, you're fat. Um, and I never really sort of had much thought on height, people's body shape, whether they had muscles, like just all of these things, like and that unlearning that I don't have to weigh ten and a half stone has been monumental. Freeing, freeing, yeah, and actually now, like I'm talking about body goals, like I wouldn't say I have body goals, but and you know, I've said to you before, I feel quite disproportionate in my body because I have one area of fat that is left that if I wear anything that is tight, I feel like it's really emphasized. So I am still actively trying to lose weight because I want that area to be smaller, yeah. And you know, I get lots of comments like, oh, maybe it's just loose skin, maybe it's that, and I'm like, it's I see my body all day, every day, and I can feel it, and it's not just loose skin, and I appreciate that I am 43 years old, and you know, as you get older your body changes, and I'm not gonna have washboard abs because I have lost 10 and a half stones, so of course I am gonna have loose skin, but I do want to lose a bit more because I want that even if it just goes down a bit, like I'm alright with having a bit of fat there, like I just want it to go down a little bit so I feel more in proportion, but I don't care what the scales say now. Like, if it if I lost another seven pounds and I was happy with how I looked in a pair of like you know, gym leggings and a top that didn't cover that area, then fine. So for me now it is uh more of a of how I feel I look about within my body, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it makes sense.
SPEAKER_00:Whereas before I was really focused on I need to weigh this much.
SPEAKER_01:I think it's a really I think there's lots of ways you can look at this. Um so one is it why does that area bother you? Is it because it's uncomfortable? Is it because you just don't like the look of it? Is it because and this is like just anyone with a problem area, they they think it's a problem area. Is it because we've been told by society that's undesirable? It's probably a combination of everything, right? I was gonna say it's it's all of those things, and it's how you want to be perceived by the world and how you want to present yourself, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And like I said to you earlier, like I went for a run last night, and because I have lost a few pounds recently, I did actually feel more comfortable running, yeah. Like, because it wasn't wobbling so much.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and I don't think that's why I think it's really tricky. I come from a very weight neutral, body neutral standpoint. Well, I try it's my cat, two seconds. Um so over the last couple of years I've had some difficult thoughts about body goals. And are they right? Are they wrong? Should I have them? Should I not? Does it mean I'm not body neutral if I have body goals? I'm out of breath running up the stairs. Maybe I should have some cardio goals. For me personally, at the point I am now, having body goals directly links to how I feel about like gender and how I want to be perceived. And so since doing more exploring with like my gender identity and how I feel about myself and how I want to be perceived by the world and how I want to present and what matches how I feel on the inside. For me, building parts of my body are super important. So, like having a big upper body and having a strong back, not carrying as much weight around my midsection because to me, I don't think it's wrong, I don't think it's bad or ugly or anything like that. It's just too feminine for me. So the body girls I have aren't because I don't think I'm good enough as I am now, or that I'm ugly or not deserving or unworthy, it's because they just don't match how I feel on the inside, right? Yeah. So that's another way to look at body girls. Like, are they always inherently bad, or actually are they really needed for some people to feel good about their body? Yeah, if you have the other point, is like at what point maybe then the question is do body goals become unhealthy?
SPEAKER_00:Well, that's the thing, isn't it? Because I do think that having body goals is okay. I generally do. It's when they become toxic and people go to you know unsafe ways to achieve them, whether that is by you know taking steroids, taking weight loss drugs when they don't need to take them, um, becoming like going to the gym all the time, underfueling, not eating, all of those things. That's when it becomes toxic and they're not okay, and you have to think, what's going on here?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and I think that's the important line and death, um yeah, the important line to have in mind if you're maybe someone who has body goals who maybe is leaning into that more unhealthy side of things. Because don't get me wrong, seven years ago, all I cared about was being thin, yeah, and I did not do that in a healthy way, and I was obsessed with my calories and how I looked in the mirror, and like I did not like my body, so I'm I've done lots and lots and lots of work to kind of learn a new mindset, appreciate my body and stuff, but that still hasn't removed the want to look a certain way, yeah. But I'm not gonna sacrifice things now to get there. I'm much more at peace than I ever was, despite still having goals. Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_00:Is that how you feel? Yeah, and I mean I think like with my body, if I never lost another pound, it would not it would be fine. I would not be unhappy. However, I just don't feel like my journey has finished yet. And I don't know how we got down here. Hey Maurice. Okay. Um yeah, so I mean, I just think I think it's absolutely it's absolutely fine, but you just have to realize that maybe your maybe your goals aren't achievable if you have to go to such extreme lengths, maybe you're not giving yourself enough time, maybe all these different things, but yeah, just being more I don't know, at peace with who you are in the present and enjoying yourself at every stage.
SPEAKER_01:Which brings us nicely on to the importance of non-weight slash scale related victories. Because we know that the scales are unreliable to actually show you progress. So let's go through some of our own personal favourite non-weight related maybe yeah, non-weight related scale-related victories. You go first, give me some.
SPEAKER_00:Uh going on an aeroplane, and I mean, I wouldn't have said I was comfortable in the seat, but there was loads of room on the aeroplane seat belt. Because the time before I had to have an extender. Oh. There we go.
SPEAKER_01:Just being more comfortable in society. Yeah. Yeah. One of mine is just like well, more so when I talk to clients, but it's it's being stronger, being able to do more in the gym is a really nice feeling. And that can happen regardless of how much you weigh, whether your body's changed or not. And I think having a strength goal or even a performance goal is a really nice place to start if you're if you have a difficult relationship with how your body looks or how you wet much away or whatever.
SPEAKER_00:Another one of mine is having some muscles that I can see. Yeah. I am so excited by this. And actually, that because I think when I've lost when I lose the weight that I want to lose, hopefully, maybe, and I feel happy, then there's a chance if I build muscle, I may put weight on. Because I quite you quite often see these things on. I mean, I don't get me wrong, I'm not gonna be like a bodybuilder or anything, but you do see pictures where people look smaller, but they're heavier because I guess they've got more muscle.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And like actually the thought of weighing more doesn't really bother me because I'll know that I'm stronger, and I do feel really strong at the minute. Yeah, you're really strong today. Doing those TRX rows, like I was like, I would have really struggled with these before, and don't get me wrong, at the end of it, they were harder, but I felt so strong.
SPEAKER_01:So yeah, strong is a thing. Strong is a thing. I think having more energy is always nice if you're like on a health journey of some description, sleeping better, your mood feels better, and this can happen regardless of the scales changing or not. Like all these things can happen outside of weight loss. If you don't want that to be a goal because it fucks with you too much, or you just you're not bothered. There are so many things you can still aim for and achieve, and like tangible things that are gonna improve your quality of life and improve you in whatever way you want to do that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, one for me was like my skin really cleared up. So, I mean, you didn't know me before, um, and my skin was really bad, like it wasn't particularly I did have I didn't really have spots, but it was really dry and like flaky, and I mean I went to have Botox once, and the woman was like, You don't need Botox, but um she was like, Your skin is quite scaly. Oh, that's so nice of her, yeah. So, and what I found is when I actually started to eat more vegetables and drink more water, that really improved my skin, and despite whatever side, I mean that was a that was actually quite a quick win, so I was still in a bigger body, but just having clearer skin made me feel better. Yeah, and I think it's another no, sorry, go on. I don't know. I mean, I guess that it's not a weight thing, but it is still like appearance related. But I mean, you know, I I do feel that we are allowed to want to feel good about how we look.
SPEAKER_01:Definitely, because let like let's be realistic, let's be honest here. Our world is based on how we look, our appearances, you know, we do judge books by their cover, no matter you know, if you say you do or not. I think it's an inbuilt thing within us, like a some sort of survival mechanism to have a quick judgment of someone.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Rightly or wrongly. People still people will judge you no matter what size you are, or anything. So I know that people will judge me because I have a lot of tattoos. So if you are someone that associates tattoos with somebody that is unemployed, a criminal, all of these things. You've got me right. You are correct. Like, you know, people will judge me for that and be like, think think that, you know, I'm sure there's lots of people that will think I'm a terrible person because I've got tattoos, especially because I've got them on my face. When so if I'm bigger, I'm being judged for being big. If I'm smaller, somebody's gonna judge me for having tattoos on my face. Or people might judge me because I'm a 43-year-old woman that has got a hair in plaits and doesn't dress how they would expect a 43-year-old woman to dress. Like, you're always gonna be judged for something. Yeah. I guess it's just managing, choosing what you're judged for. Choosing what you're judged for. So now, rather than people think, I mean, I guess some people would still probably look at me and think I'm, you know, because I am not a size 10 or anything, some people would probably still judge me and think I'm fat. I just think I'm normal. But other people will now judge me because they think I'm a criminal and unemployed. Yeah, you can't really win in this life. You can't, you can't, and this is why it is about you just have to somehow feel good about yourself and kind of have some kind of inner confidence in who you are.
SPEAKER_01:Top tips are gaining inner confidence, Amber Gay.
SPEAKER_00:Um God, I don't know. Like I don't know. I think I think part of it just comes with age, and like you don't give a fuck anymore. Like part of it is the fact that I've had quite a lot of therapy um and I'm very aware of thoughts in my head. So if I so like for instance, with I've got I've got this new dress for my work's Christmas party with roof tape, and it's really nice. It is slightly tight still, so I've got a I've got like a month until I have to wear it, but I'm gonna get some spanks, and then I was looking at myself in it the other day, and it was like, do you know what? I am the only person that is really looking at that area that I don't like. No, nobody else is just gonna be transfixed on that area. That is in my head. So I think it's about having some self-awareness on what is your reality and what is the actual reality.
SPEAKER_01:Well, the actual reality doesn't exist because everyone's got their own individual realities if we're gonna get deep. Yeah, yeah. Everyone's probably out What's your reality?
SPEAKER_00:What's everyone else's reality? Because actually, not that many people really care about what you're doing or what you're wearing, and I say that now as somebody who is a more regular sized person, because actually, as a bigger person, I did not feel that way, and I do think it is harder, yeah, because of society. So I feel like that's quite a privileged thing for me to say now because unfortunately, people not. Not everybody feels out. No.
SPEAKER_01:I think one clear thing to say that in this episode is if you are someone in a bigger body, you are not the problem, it is society. So I think to take the blame and the shame and the um you know I don't know all the other words away is like you are not the issue. Your body is not the issue because your body doesn't bother, like doesn't harm anyone else, doesn't take away from anyone else. Society and the beliefs that are ingrained are the problem.
SPEAKER_00:Because you're just a person with a body, everybody else. You could be, do you know what would be more offensive to me is if I was next to somebody regardless of their size and they were breathing really heavily on me. Or they were do you know what I mean? Like somebody that actually is like doing you. Yeah, you know, like if you're standing in a queue and people get too close to you, I'm like, fuck off. Like that's gonna bother me more than somebody that is just existing. Um I had something to say then, but it's gone. I felt like it was very profound as well. Oh, hopefully it comes back. Hopefully, I'll try and remember.
SPEAKER_01:I know, I know, it's a curse. Wow, I feel like we've talked a lot about a lot today. We're only 13 minutes in.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Well, this is because it's such a big topic, isn't it? Like, and you know, I as somebody who has lived both sides of the coin, and I'm you know, I'm not by any means like small small now, but I you know, I know I know what it's like. Like I was 24 stone, so I do really know what it's like to live in that body, and you know, because that is I know there are that that is quite a big size, so I've really experienced some horrible things then, you know, from external people, but also how I used to talk to myself, yeah. And I I mean, I am always in awe of people who are bigger and are happy with themselves and have managed to kind of bypass that what society thinks of you and taken it on because it's so hard.
SPEAKER_01:I think those who judge the most when it comes to people's size and what they look like are probably the most unhappy with themselves.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, I think that in general, if somebody is a mean person, they are probably very unhappy with themselves. And I would say when I was unhappier with myself, I probably was a meaner person. Because I think it's easy to put people down to try and feel better about yourself, yeah. And not that I was going around being horrible to people, bullying people, brilliant people, but I probably wasn't because because I probably wasn't such a nice person because I probably was more judgy because I hated my hate myself, but I didn't like myself so much, and now I am more at peace with myself. I am I can I'm nicer because I just think there's no need for this. People are just people existing. What I remembered what I was gonna say, I like with this whole people judging bigger bodies. What is interesting to me is also sometimes when you are bigger and you lose weight, people who maybe are close to you, and I don't know about I don't know, people have an issue with you getting smaller as well because I think some people do like having the fat friend, or it makes them feel better about themselves, whether it's a subconscious thing or not, but there is also on the flip side, people don't want you to get smaller, yeah. It's just coming at you from all angles.
SPEAKER_01:I think in conclusion, we can't win. No, we can't stop trying to win and just like live your own life.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, be your own winner. And if you wanna if you want to lose weight, if you're doing it in a self, self, safe, balanced way, that's absolutely fine. Um, if you don't want to lose weight, fine. Fine. Uh do what you want to do. Like it just doesn't matter. It's I find the male-female split quite interesting because most women I know kind of like a man who is a bit bigger, and I there's not many, I mean, maybe this is just the sort of women that I know because maybe if you are the sort of person that's doing like CrossFit and Hyrux and all of those sort of things, maybe you like those really muscly kind of men, but most women I know prefer a softer looking man, and there was um there was an article, and it was Ollie Mers. I don't know if we've ever spoken about this before, because Ollie Mers obviously used to have a dad bod, and um which is in I mean that it's hard, I don't know, it's interesting, isn't it? Um, but he started working out because he wanted to, and he got quite muscular and fit, hench lean, all of those things, and um, I think lots of women commented on it saying we preferred you how you were, and then um the the person that I saw speak out about this was James Smith. And he was like, Oh, well, if that was a woman, you you know, we could you couldn't say that about a woman that we preferred you how you were before. But I think the the nuance there is that men are not judged on their appearance like women are judged on their appearance and size, like men like men think that they have to be bigger, but women don't really care about that.
SPEAKER_01:Like, and men as a rule, I mean that is one of the few cases where women are really commenting on a man's body, and not even in a negative way, like they're just like you looked fine before, and I'm sorry, James Smith. Men comment on women's bodies every single day, 247, 365.
SPEAKER_00:Are men walking down the road worried about a van driving past and like cat calling them? And it's not even just the comments, because actually, for a woman, that feels quite dangerous. Walking down the road at night, and or you know, even on your own whenever, and a van drives past you and does that, you're like, it is it's not nice, and it could be dangerous. Whereas this is just some women saying, We like you a bit fluffier, we like you a bit fluffier, yeah. But then if he, you know, if he feels better now and he's happier, fine, whatever. It's it's interesting, isn't it? Like how as soon as men experience this tiny little thing that women have been experiencing their whole life, they're like, Oh, but you can't say that, and they take it and twist it around onto them. Isn't that just the patriarchy? It is the patriarchy, and people like James Smith, he is a key example of toxic masculinity.
SPEAKER_01:I've got a lot of opinions on how he's changed over the years, his content and his whole thing, and uh I won't get into it now. But maybe that's another episode.
SPEAKER_00:Probably not probably cancel us.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I don't know if he's worried about what we're saying, but you know. Is what it is.
SPEAKER_00:Body positivity is for what I don't not I don't like body positivity, but like body neutrality, just being happy in yourself is for men and women. And I don't think there's anything wrong with women saying you looked fine before. No. And it's interesting to me how offended some men got by that when women live that experience of being scrutinized for their size and how they look all the time. God, I could get on a total rant now because now I'm like, it's like how people say men age better than women and they become more distinguished. So actually, an older man is like more respected. But as a woman, as you get older, you're expected to look younger.
SPEAKER_01:I'll tell you why, it's because I think in the eyes of men and the patriarchy, women lose their value as they get older. And men, if you're gonna even look at it as primal, as like fertility. Yeah. Whereas men can reproduce and do all that for as long as possible. I think because we are society is is geared up for the male gaze and for women to look good for men. And I think the overarching kind of theme is that that's all they're good for is to look good and to be sex objects. Yeah. That, you know, when they lose that value. Yeah. What what's the point? You know, a lot of people, a lot of women who go through the menopause and get to a certain age say they f feel like they become invisible. And there's that's not just because they're older, that's because society is making them invisible. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And actually, I think old men are gross.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Especially uh old men that date young girls, women.
SPEAKER_01:I also think that's such a like uh it's a red flag, but they're just so shallow. Because what the fuck are you talking? What's a six-year-old man talking to a 20-year-old about? They're not they're shagging, that's it.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:That's and that is a gross fall within it.
SPEAKER_00:There it is.
SPEAKER_01:But this is a whole different topic. We've completely gone off non-scale victory.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, sorry, I've just I've just got annoyed by men basically. And you know, it's not all men, but it is always a man. Or it's not always a man, it's the patriarchy. That's what it is.
SPEAKER_01:But I do think it is behind a lot of what we've spoken about before. Yeah. And what we've spoken about today. Or do you think a lot of that is if that wasn't what our society was built upon, I don't think half these things would even be a problem or exist.
SPEAKER_00:No, I don't. Because even when, you know, you do a lot of the time. I mean, I look, I follow some people online, I can't think of anybody's names particularly, but like, you know, kind of people that either were bigger and have lost weight but are still losing weight, or people that are bigger, and um like the some of the troll comments, they're often from women, and it's like, what are you doing? Like, not that it's acceptable from a man, but I guess it's um to be expensive.
SPEAKER_02:They tear each other down.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, like just don't pick me girls, but they're well, they're usually like 55-year-old Karen style women who like put men on a pedestal.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Oh my god, we can't get into this now because it's a whole nother. Long story short, you're perfect just how you are.
SPEAKER_00:You are a sweet baby angel, however you are, and we love you.
SPEAKER_01:And we hope we've shared some insightful thoughts.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, we could I we could do another 10 episodes on this, couldn't we? Because like this is it's just such a big thing, but you know, I I'm I could ramble forever and go on and change the topic seven times.
SPEAKER_01:We would love to hear your opinion on the stuff we've spoken about today because I'm sure there's opinions we haven't even considered or thought about, because believe it or not, we aren't all knowing.
SPEAKER_00:Um you know, it's just our opinions based on our experiences and you know, other people's experiences uh will show something totally different. So, I mean, it would be interesting to hear from people um because then we could maybe do another episode. You know, we would obviously keep it confidential, whoever has got in touch with us, but to have other people's experience and to talk about that just gets it out there more on what people are going through and what they think and what they would like, they'd like things to be different. Amen.
SPEAKER_01:All right then. There we go. Thank you for listening to today's episode. We hope you managed to follow along. Well done if you made it till the end.
SPEAKER_00:I'm sorry, I have rambled.
SPEAKER_01:No, it's good, I think is important topics, and as always, review, subscribe slash follow, share with a friend. It means a lot to us. We've actually had a few more reviews on Spotify, so that's good. Winner winner.
SPEAKER_00:You can email us at the healthhandspod at gmail.com.
SPEAKER_01:You can follow us on Instagram at the HealthHandspod. That's it. And that's it because oh we have got a TikTok. But we've got because we're old women. Yeah. But and you can follow both of us on our own social medias. Uh yours is reluctantly running with a few underscores dotted around.
SPEAKER_00:Underscore reluctantly running underscore.
SPEAKER_01:And yours is R-R-T underscore coaching. For all your thirst traps. Yeah, and stay tuned for my Patreon erotica series coming out soon. I am waiting with baited breath. I think this is gonna be the moneymaker. I think it probably is, you know. Anyway, peace and love home slices, and we'll see you next week. Bye. Bye.
unknown:I'm waiting.