Letting the Moment Lead: Coaching Beyond the Agenda with Caroline Souto

In this episode, Georgina is joined by Caroline Souto, a PCC and ACTC-certified coach with over 15 years’ experience in leadership, innovation, and team development across 14 countries. Based in Brazil and a faculty member and global partner with TCS, Caroline brings a rich, global perspective to emergent coaching—grounded in deep presence, observation, and trust.

Together, they explore small moments of emergence that create big impact, where what’s happening in the here and now shapes the direction of the conversation, rather than a predetermined agenda. Caroline shares how her practice has evolved from diagnosing and fixing to being fully present with teams, allowing real needs (like fatigue or unspoken tension) to surface and guide meaningful dialogue.

You’ll discover:

• How emergence shows up in subtle but powerful moments during team coaching. 
• Why letting go of rigid agendas can unlock deeper connection and insight. 
• How to create the conditions - trust, safety, and awareness - for emergence to unfold. 
• The impact of your way of being as a coach, and how presence itself becomes an intervention. 
• Why observation, patience, and inner work are essential to transformational coaching. 

This episode is a compelling invitation for team coaches and leaders to trust the process, work with what’s truly happening, and recognise that even the smallest shifts in awareness can lead to profound change.

Brought to you by Team Coaching Studio - The world’s leading academy for team coaching. To find out more about us visit https://teamcoachingstudio.com/

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Welcome to Teams Transformed, the podcast for people who want to see real team transformation.

SPEAKER_00 0:07

For courageous coaches, curious leaders, and anyone passionate about unlocking the true power of teams.

SPEAKER_01 0:13

We are hosts, Georgina and Alard. Here's a journey with you through transformational insights on how to coach teams with presence, depth, and emergence.

SPEAKER_00 0:23

Let's explore not just the tools but the art of transforming teams.

SPEAKER_01 0:30

Hi, this is Georgina Woodstra. In this episode, I had a wonderful conversation with Caroline Soto, a practitioner in the south of Brazil. Caroline, or Carol as we call her, is an ICF PCC and ACTC coach, and she holds a bachelor's degree in economics and a master's degree in social sciences, both from PUCRS in Brazil. She's got over 15 years experience in people management and innovation, and she holds more than 300 hours in executive and team coaching training, including training with Team Coaching Studio and our diploma in team coaching. She's also an accredited coach supervisor, and her work has already impacted people in 14 countries. She's undertaken professional development in leadership and digital transformation at MIT and strategic design at IDEO, and she serves as the president of ICF RS Brazil. She lectures on postgraduate courses at various universities in southern Brazil, teaching subjects including leadership, team management, strategy, and innovation. Carol is also part of our team coaching studio faculty and works as our partner in Brazil. And she's the founder of Ecosistema Angatu. In this conversation today, we talk about a couple of small moments of emergence that had a big impact. They're significant moments where the field of what was happening in the here and now informed the agenda and where the conversation went to with the team rather than sticking or working with a predetermined agenda. And what you'll hear Carol talk about is how she creates the conditions for emergence and the shifts and the impacts of working in this way. We also talk about how your way of being has an impact. As we say, our presence has an impact. We intervene by being different, and Carol brings that to life. So I hope you enjoy this episode and I hope you enjoy getting to know Caroline Suto. Give us some feedback. We'd love to hear from you in your comments. Hello, Caroline. Welcome. Hello, Georgina. Hello. Thank you for joining us here today. I'm really looking forward to our conversation today and discovering more about moments of emergence with you.

SPEAKER_03 2:59

It's amazing to be here. A real honor. Thank you for inviting me to be here, Georgina.

SPEAKER_01 3:04

You're really welcome. I'm sure the listeners are curious. They probably hear that you have an accent.

SPEAKER_02 3:10

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:11

Yeah. So tell tell us a little bit about yourself. What do you want the listener to know about you, Caroline?

SPEAKER_03 3:18

So I'm I'm Caroline, but uh everyone calls me Carol. Uh TCS has a loss lots of Carol, so this might be a confusion. So I'm Carol Soto. Uh I'm based in Brazil, uh in the south of Brazil, so English is my second language. I've been connected to TCS for almost five years now, six years maybe. Can you imagine time flies? Yeah, I know. Incredible. Incredible. And I've been working as a coach for many years now, exploring different philosophies. Um, and I think I I've been evolving over time to really embrace emergency into my work and into my way of being with my client. So yeah, so so I think that's a good starting point. Let's see what else I watch.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

Yes, fantastic. So so, Carol, um, you know, I'm really interested in moments of emergence, and wonder if you can recall a moment that stood out that was significant for you in your work. You know, a moment when something shifted.

SPEAKER_03 4:30

Yeah. So so that's a very great question, Georgina. It makes me think about uh how do I connect with my clients. And I think I can I can remember a moment last week where I was with uh uh leaders in an organization here in the south of Brazil, and I had an intention, a clear objective with with everyone that was present in the room. And somehow my my intuition was saying something else. Uh there it it was saying that they were really tired and doing or uh creating and and following what I my intention, my my intention since the beginning was not going to be helpful. Uh and then I checked with the HR that was in the room, check with the leaders, and then that changed the whole day. So so how do you have a conversation with a team about high performance, high performance leadership, high performance teams, that was what we were doing that when uh in that in that company when they are tired. And the conversation was not what is high performance, but is what is high performance when you're tired. And that shifted the day. And I mean and I'm telling you, and remember the conversation that we had. It was a it was a group, a big group. And it was for me, it was an amazing opportunity to hold space so people could understand what is high performance, because this is a big word, even in English, I can I can sense that it's like it can mean many things. What is high performance when you're tired? And that was beautiful to to see they get in contact with each other and and helping each other, supporting each other on how to rest, how strategies, so something else emerges um to that that conversation that was certainly more helpful than what I had planned before.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

Yeah, I love that because what is high performance kind of takes my mind to something I don't know, textbooky or theoretical. It takes me out of myself and out of the context that I'm in. Um, so you really brought the field.

SPEAKER_02 7:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

And what was in the field was tiredness. You brought that into the conversation, and something more profound came out of that. Yeah. And and um um what what what do you think shifted for them?

SPEAKER_03 7:18

Well, when you ask that question, the first thing that comes to my mind is the ability to name, to create common grounds, uh to to get out of the imagination, yeah, and to really deal with the reality. Uh so and I think that's really powerful when you get in contact with the reality, with what is. What is in the room, what is in what is in inside myself, and and creating, I think, creating the safe space so people can get in contact with the reality, yeah. Uh with what is, is I think that that's uh that's a major shift. Yeah, that was a major shift, and I think that is a major shift. Sometimes our clients like they love to go and and to talk about other things and not what is in the room.

SPEAKER_01 8:14

Yes, yeah, yes. Instead of talking about our performance, I want to talk about performance in the organization or performance of our teams, or to say talk about it in an abstracted way, um, but bringing it into the here and now, yeah. And what's here between us, yeah, what is high performing in the in the for us in this moment, yeah, is a fascinating conversation and very rich, yeah. Um how do you how do you create the conditions for that kind of conversation? What made it possible? Because I imagine it's probably not the you know the first moment, the opening moment of your work with the team, or was it no it this this organization I've been working with then them, Jr.

SPEAKER_03 9:06

for like eight years. Can you imagine?

SPEAKER_01 9:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:11

Uh we were having a conversation, and I said to them, I think my first contact with you was in 18, 2018. Different roles. So I was a professor, then a consultant, then a facilitator, then a coach, and then a coach again. So different ways of connecting with uh with them, and and trust was built over time. So I know everyone's name, I can call them, and I say I can and and something that I was uh doing all the time last time we were together. I said, I see you. I see you. So I call I was calling people by name, and I I can see what you're doing, I can see your funny faces in in something in so I I know them for a long time. So that's I think create conditions for the team to be brave enough that there was a lot of courage in the room. Yeah, um, so that's one thing. The other thing is like sponsorship. The chairman talks a lot about my way of helping them, so he he sort of validate my contribution. So the chairman, the executive director, the the um HR manager, so they they validate and divide not only validate, but I think they value my contribution. Yeah, so so I think that's another thing. Uh and and and somehow being being honest when I said to them, sorry, something shifted on me, and I need to check that with you. And I said to them, please don't find me weird, and they laugh a lot. So we make a little bit of humor to embrace to embrace something else. And and they laugh and they say, We are used to funny, funny things. And so I said to them, my intuition is saying something else.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

Uh, that container, you know, the the the conditions where you can intervene and bring in your use of self and take them into greater contact and deepen the conversation. Uh in this instance, the conditions built over time, over eight years, and you've got a lot of support of the sponsors in the organization. Um, out of curiosity, Cow, um how would you create the conditions within a new client?

SPEAKER_03 11:54

Yeah. Well, in my experience, I think when the work starts when you say hi to a client, that before the works really start with the team or the group you're going to be uh uh creating the work. So so for me, trust is like, hey, I'm Caroline. So the way I engage with the client from moment one, and I embrace all the information that is there, I I don't I don't confront the information. So I said, this is what my my way is like every it's like a mantra, as we say, it's like everything is part of the conversation. Yes. So so that from the moment one, when I say hi, everything is part of the conversation. And then when we get when I get in front of the team or the group, the leader, uh uh, I think like uh not holding my my my presence, hold holding the space and just being there with them. Uh I think that's that's really important. And I I know this might be a little bit subjective, but it but I I understand that I can uh when I receive feedback from my clients, they say you're you're different. And I think Georgina is like, it's because we've we've done so much inner work. That when I get to work with some someone, they say, Oh, you're very calm, you're very quiet, you're and and I'm they are holding the space. It's like, and and I think creating emergency in a new team, new client, in in in different roles we may have with the client. It's something it is like being being there for you first, listen to you yourself, role modeling that, doing your inner work. Yes, and and helping them to understand that everything is part of the conversation, like not taking sides, and and respect the time of the client. So so if they need a little bit of structure in the beginning, uh go with that. No, and by when when you have a bridge, when you have when the door opens, you take that, and then you start being in working emerging like 10% of the conversation, 1% of the conversation. And then over time they'll say, I want to do that. How do I do that? Okay, so let's experiment. So I would say like like taking them taking every moment you can to show and to experiment, respect the time of the client. If they need more time to work emergently, I think that's that's okay. It takes I for me takes time, Georgina. I'm not sure if you see the same, but sometimes it can take time.

SPEAKER_01 14:51

Oh yes, I I certainly find that. I mean, what I what I heard you say, Carol, was that um you've done a lot of inner work on yourself, and I know you have, and that enables you to show up in a way um which has an impact from the start. You want to show up in a way of being that uh that demonstrates how the experience of being with you is going to be. Yeah, and you you you say it's all information, I say it's all data. Whatever happens in the room, this is the content that we work with rather than some external construct as what's here in the room. And there's always so much data here. Any one moment, there's is rich, fertile ground. You want to give them an experience of you and how you are deepening contact. Then one of the things I loved is you said when a door opens, take it. So you're you're waiting, you're waiting, Gistarth. Sometimes say you're waiting with soft eyes, waiting for something to become figural, for something to stand out, or for an opportunity to deepen the contact and give them different different quality of experience than they may get elsewhere. I think that's very important for this kind of work and it's in it in its signals the um the need to be energetically available for each other. Yeah. Carol, do you have another another moment of emergence you'd like to talk about to take this a bit further, a bit deeper? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:33

Yeah. Another example would be when I was with a team and they were like the request was to get to know each other. They this was a new team. And and I promptly said, okay, so let's let's try an exercise. And then they said, Well, we've we've done that. And then I was like, Oh. So I I I challenged them to experiment something, and then they said, No, but we we did that last uh in our last meeting. And I said, Okay, so what else? What would you like to do then if you already, if you feel this that's finished? And then a member of the team asked the question. She said, She said, How we how about we explore what the question was, what are we willing to let go in order to success to be uh in order for us to be successful? And I was and I was like, okay. And then I I I remember sitting back on my chat, this was an online event. And then I was like, I'm I'm okay, so I'm I'm sitting back and I'm uh observing you. What what would you like me to observe? And they said, no, we just want to have a conversation now and and then we can and then that's it. And then I was like, oh god, they were like connecting to each other based on a question that a team member brought in. And I was there just observing the the moments of contact between each other and and how they built rapport together. And and when he finished, I I they said they they asked me what I've seen and how was my experience, and then I I I gave a little bit of insights, but there was no no the you you see, the work was different. It was not like let's solve a problem. It's like it's and and in my client that's a bit different. It's like they were they are functioning quite well at that moment. They were functioning quite well and they want to take it further.

SPEAKER_01 18:44

Yes. Sometimes people say from good to great. Yeah, from good to great.

SPEAKER_03 18:50

Yeah. And I was like, okay. So and for me it's like a uh a new, it's somehow a new experience because when we get in contact, uh when someone asks me to be there, it's often because there is something that needs to be built, not fixed, but but changed, something needs to be different and good to great, and it was it was uh a moment of emotion for them and for me as well. And I was like, oh that's that's interesting. Who am I when when a client needs to go from wants to go from good to great? And and that uh for me it took me to a different way of relating to this team. And I changed my language, helped I change and I adapt my language to work with them where they were at. And I just observed it. It was beautiful, beautiful to see.

SPEAKER_01 19:50

And I could imagine the listener perhaps thinking, well, what value are you adding, Carol? You know, you're it's the the client brought the question and then they had the conversation whilst you're sitting on the outside, like on the outside of a bowl looking in.

SPEAKER_02 20:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:08

And then you're sharing some observations on the the quality of their contact with each other. What was the value of that? What shifted?

SPEAKER_03 20:20

So so again, creating the space, create being there is it's funny because we say being there is not doing something, but for us, being there it is to do to it has to do with something that we do. So being is is some sort of doing, being intervention, yeah, yeah, it is a being intervention. So so uh yeah, that's that's uh very profound, but we can do something just by being uh different. So we intervene when we have a when we offer a different energy, a different language, uh a different stance, even if it's virtual and we get closer to the camera and we step back on the camera, we have our presence has an impact. And and even uh when I offer some observations, Georgina, when I when I told them what was happening in the room, they sound really surprised. They didn't know they were doing well, that this was uh functioning and this was the work that needs to be happening. So sometimes reinforcing what is the good to get to the great, it is a valued contribution, and it's often taken for granted. I I certainly uh got to think that I took for granted the power of uh not not helping change something that needs to be different, but the good to great, embracing the good to great with applying.

SPEAKER_01 22:00

So you've had this kind of awakening for yourself. If we wind the clock back, I don't know how many years. Tell me about how you would have been different before.

SPEAKER_03 22:12

Oh yeah. Yeah. So so very interesting. Um, yeah, that's a very interesting question. I think paying attention to the to the uh what is already functioning. So it's like shifting the the eye the the eyes, the way of looking to things. What am I searching with the client? What am I uh what is my flow of attention as you say, and maybe change a little bit the flow of attention to help them work. And we in we can say strength base, but we do that, but it's it's not the content, it's like shift the the the my awareness, the flow of my attention to embrace something else as well. Uh and that was it, that was uh a moment, and I think and I'm I I think that our clients always teach us something as well, so it's not only that. So and I'm really grateful for my for these both experiences because it they both taught me so much.

SPEAKER_01 23:21

Yeah. Yeah. It's um from many people start out, I think, feeling they've got to diagnose a client from some kind of um proven lens or framework. And that can have the the intervener in their heads and in theory and out of contact with the team and what's happening in the room. And uh so not open, not energetically available, bringing ourselves into the fullest of our presence and it and and allowing ourselves to be impacted by the team so that we come into connection and a felt sense and experience of what it's like being with this team, being open-hearted around that. Yeah, um, that that field of data um is is what informs the interventions, I believe. Um I know that you have a strong interest in um in developing and in in in in and in your in your philosophy and stance as a coach. So how you uh what what your beliefs are around your role and how you what what mantras you tell yourself to stay true to that, to show up in in in the here and now in a way that supports what you believe in. Um would you be willing to talk a little bit about that, Carol, about your philosophy and stance in your own words?

SPEAKER_03 25:07

Yeah. Yeah, I think I I I evolved over time. In the beginning, I was like trying to diagnose and and maybe fix I'm a I'm a one of my talents is to organize things, you know, you know, that I can build.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

And it's a superpower.

SPEAKER_03 25:32

It is, but but sometimes it's not it's not that helpful because I uh uh being an organizer, uh or this being part of my philosophy stance, it can be really good in some cases. And I'm learning to diam down this a little bit uh when I'm working and embracing emergence as a as a different uh way of relating to my client. So it's not that I'm going to not be an organizer because this is a superpower, I can do that. And I'm embracing that. I'm not I'm not uh in conflict with that part of myself anymore. Uh and that's helping me to embrace also the emergence and say, let's let's see what else is here. So so I think one of when I say when I say everything is part of the conversation, so it is, I think that's also something that I told myself. So that's why I think inner work is so important. So inner work is is fundamental for us to be there and not to be afraid uh of what can emerge because I've I've seen it all. I've seen I and I I've seen it all. Uh and um very early in my career someone told me that I can see and sense what is outside of me at the same proportion that I can see and sense inside of me. And I took that very seriously, and then I said, that's really interesting. I want to try that. So when I say I've seen it, I was because I look, I look at myself from different perspectives, and I can see how do I relate with fear, with conflict, with joy, with um happiness. So being an observer of myself, it helps me to become an observer and to relate with my clients in a different way. Looking at with some sort of distance to listen and to sense the field as well. Does that make sense, Regina? It sounds like one of those weird conversations, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:57

Well, what I'm hearing is you have a real strong belief that um in in inner work and the work that you've done on yourself, and that enables you to be with what is and to notice what is being generated in you by the situations that you find yourself in without being triggered. Yeah, so you're able to notice and stay centered, and that's powerful because that gives you choices in the moment about how to intervene. So it's a kind of inside out approach. And yeah, um, you know, a dear colleague of ours who you know you know well as uh uh uh Carol Peter Blackert, he he talked about transformed people, transform people. Yeah, I think that's such a memorable and important mantra. That unless we do the work on themselves, we can't just become great team coaches by learning a set of tools that we process a team through. So much of the work is on ourselves and our capacity to be present to the what is, to what's really here, um, both what's charming and heartwarming and inspiring, and what's painful and difficult and uncomfortable to be with it all. Because only when we can be with it and hold that space, you sit in the fire, hold the space, be with the tensions, uh, can can can it can then the dynamic and energy transform. I think this is our work. This is our work, and you embrace and role model that with immense grace. Yeah. Carol, as we close off today, is there anything else you'd like to say as we kind of check out with each other here?

SPEAKER_03 30:07

Uh I just want to say thank you. It's it's uh an honor to be here, and I think that the invitation to be here prompted me to think more about how emergence is is a core part of my philosophy and sense, and how it evolved over time. And it will continue to evolve. I'm sure I'm not completely ready yet, because I think there is so much more to be done, and that's that's okay. Embrace the my own way of developing myself and relating to my clients uh in an emergent way. It was a gift for me to think about. So thank you, Chujin.

SPEAKER_01 30:57

So that you can deepen contact with others. And um, and it's always a joy being with you. Uh, I also want to, whilst we whilst we're here, um in case anyone would like to meet Carol, um, we're running a retreat together in Brazil in August this year. So uh if if listening or listening to this after August this year, we're afraid that moment will have passed. But do reach out and get in contact. You'll see the details in the in the podcast information. But if you'd like to join us for four days in August, really exploring contact and emergence and inner development for outer transformation, then uh then we'd be delighted to have you with us.

SPEAKER_02 31:47

Yeah, so sure.

SPEAKER_01 31:49

Thank you, Carol. Thank you. Bye now.

SPEAKER_00 32:01

Thanks for joining today's Journey of Teams Transformed.

SPEAKER_01 32:04

If this sparked a new insight or a deeper question, we invite you to sit with it, not to solve it, but to let it unfold.

SPEAKER_00 32:13

For resources, community, and reflection prompts, visit teamcoachingstudio.com.

SPEAKER_01 32:19

Until the next time, stay present, stay curious, and keep leaning into the art of emergence.