EP07: Embracing the Unknown | The Courage to Show Up and Reinvent Your Life with Taura Ryan

It's Time to Choose Yourself. ✨ 

In this profound and honest conversation, Taura Ryan and I dive deep into the complexities of personal and professional growth, getting real about the inner struggle of letting go of old habits, expectations, and relationships that no longer serve you. 

We explore the challenges of navigating change simultaneously and the necessity of embracing it—even when it feels scary. This episode is a powerful reminder that your value is non-negotiable and offers wisdom on building confidence from the inside out. 

Whether you’re questioning your job, your relationships, or just seeking true fulfillment, you’ll hear how taking intentional risks and letting go of the past creates space for a new future. Tune in to discover the surprising joys and beautiful freedom that comes with reinventing your life and finally learning to be your own biggest advocate. 

Chapters

• 0:00 Navigating Career Transitions
• 4:26 Finding Fulfillment in Work + the Challenge of Self-Advocacy
• 9:47 Understanding Value and Worth + Balancing Personal and Professional Growth
• 15:26 Overcoming Fear and Embracing Change
• 21:04 Pursuing Creative Passions and Defining Personal Success
• 26:49 Building Confidence and Taking Up Space
• 29:23 Chasing Dreams and Overcoming Barriers
• 37:44 Healing and Self-Reflection While Embracing Change and Growth
• 41:35 Relationships and Expectations + The Impact of Leaving and Returning Home
• 51:18 Grief, Letting Go and Having Faith In the Unknown

Transcript

Netanya (00:57) 

All right, Tara. Yay, we're here. We got on. This has been, so to start this off, I will preface with the fact that we were in a conversation like a week ago and I stopped us in the middle of it and was like, please don't talk anymore. So we can save it for today because I knew that we were going to have a conversation. ⁓ So considering I cut us off in the middle, I'm going to pick back up there. And what we were ironically talking about was 

Taura (00:58) 

Yay! 

Yeah. I love it. 

Netanya (01:23) 

Essentially being in the middle of something right and the context of what we were discussing was work right and finding yourself in a space where You were you were in one job not feeling great about this thing You have some other things going on you have an idea of a vision of where you want to go and sort of being in the middle I'm curious as to Like you obviously wanted that job at one point in time, correct? 

Taura (01:25) 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yes, yeah. It was a... I wouldn't say it was a means to an end, but it was an answer I was looking for in regards to I was in a season of huge hustle of working two to three jobs and I was exhausted and needed something a little more stable because I have had a lot of different personal things going on that when you're hustling like that you really kind of put to the back burner and don't have a chance to address. 

Netanya (02:03) 

Yeah. 

Taura (02:17) 

And when you're hustling like that, it's usually because it's a financial burden. So you can't even financially address the things that you need to address for yourself just because you're trying to stay afloat. And so the job sort of landed in my lap and was through a friend for an organization that I knew was very reputable and was a position I knew that I was like, I've been doing this for almost 20 years and my brain is wired to do these things. And I know I could bring value to them, but it wasn't hard. 

It was an easy thing to step into to give myself kind of a breath to reset and reevaluate and have something a little more stable. And so I was like, I can get behind this organization and what everybody's doing. And if I can be in that support role to give them what they need while also supporting myself in a way that I hadn't been able to in a while, it was a win-win when I took. 

Netanya (03:09) 

And how long ago was that? It was a year. 

Taura (03:11) 

A year. Like a year 

and a couple weeks, yeah, at this point. 

Netanya (03:14) 

Got it. So since that time when you made that decision and where you find yourself today, how has that like changed over time? 

Taura (03:20) 

So it's two-fold. The job itself has provided that stability financially that I needed so that I could start tackling the personal side of things for myself. It was a position that initially allowed me, I'm the type of person who likes to stay busy. And so in the first six months, it was a learning curve of figuring out how they do things, how can I help improve things, bring my twist to stuff, and own my role. 

as well as how much do I want to take on responsibility-wise as far as investing in that role, simply because I also wanted to figure out that balance of how do I take care of myself and not overwork myself because when I do a thing, I do a thing wholeheartedly. And I also knew that I needed to leave 

Netanya (04:10) 

I know the feeling. 

Taura (04:16) 

a breath for me to be able to also do the thing for myself and not just give everything to something else. ⁓ But in that, the needs of what the organization had were changing and a merger, I walked into a merger happening at the organization and then things shifting at the new year and how everybody was in their roles. And so over the last year of being there, I went from being this simple 

Netanya (04:22) 

Yeah. 

Taura (04:46) 

assistant admin to taking on a lot of responsibilities for owner owning different roles from different people's positions that had been let go or had walked away and that just needed some void filled in some way. And so it went from me having one on one side of the coin being fulfilled and having the steadiness that the job brought. 

Netanya (04:57) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (05:12) 

so that I could take care of myself, which has been a huge blessing in a lot of the personal things I've had going on to be able to address. But on the other side of that coin is not finding fulfillment in the work I'm doing anymore because of being undervalued. What I can bring to the table. 

Netanya (05:18) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yes. 

Yes, I want to talk about that for a minute because... 

I don't think it gets talked about enough when I had, it's just happened to me several times over the course of my life where I've been in a position, I'm good at what I do and whatever that job had been. And somehow it's like, I ended up being punished for being good at my job, right? 

Taura (05:34) 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Yep. 

Netanya (05:52) 

And 

so, and it's also, I also care and I'm a giver. And so when you want to help genuinely and you're like, this is falling over here. I'm going to go catch it. You know, and sometimes it's like, I'll just catch it for a minute. And then sometimes a minute turns into weeks and the days or into hours, you know. And, but so I had had this, you know, when I was a server and I used to be in different restaurants, when I was in Colorado, I was a trainer at one point. I got good enough to train everybody else. 

Taura (05:55) 

Yep. Yep. 

yeah. Yep. 

Netanya (06:21) 

that was there and they would... but training people just meant that now I have somebody on my shift with me that's following me around who's brand new so it's slowing me down right? I have to stop and educate them at every moment. The customer is then getting the training experience and not my full experience. I can't hold as many tables because that person is slower and I'm not getting paid anymore you know so it's like it so... 

Taura (06:22) 

Yeah. 

Right, 

Right. 

Right. Yep. 

Netanya (06:50) 

this is costing me something. And so that was one example. And then another one was I was in, I worked for a nonprofit for a couple of years and at one point in time, our marketing, the girl that did our marketing quit and we had different departments and she did marketing and when she quit, they didn't hire someone else and divided marketing among the departments. So then I got to do marketing for our department on top of my regular job. And I was like, hold up. 

Taura (07:03) 

Mm-hmm. 

Right. They're right. Yep. 

Netanya (07:20) 

But so I'm curious of how that has felt to you when that started to happen and 

It's hard, right? Because you don't want to be that person that's complaining about things or whining or not a team player. And also at some times it's like, but hold up, at what point when you're in this gray area, there's not a lot, there's not at what point am I now doing someone else's job and that's not going to change and I'm not getting compensated for it or it's costing me something. 

Taura (07:26) 

Yeah. 

Right, right, right. 

So in the last year, we've had the mergers and we've in the nonprofit world, there's things that ebb and flow and shift all the time because grant money is moved and are taken away or something ends and so on and so forth. And I am new to the nonprofit world on this level of scale. I've helped and volunteered with nonprofits. 

numerous times, but being in the midst of it, especially at this level that's been around for so long, it's, it's been a little bit of a learning curve of, of kind of understanding that realm a little bit, right? And so with that, like part of you is like, they're nonprofits, so you don't want to like ask for more money. But the reality is like, they've been around for 30 years and they still have salaries, like paychecks to pay and they have to honor like the market and the rates and then don't have to sell yourself short for that. 

Netanya (08:28) 

Yeah. 

Taura (08:39) 

It kind of feels like an excuse to not honor somebody's value because you're a non-profit and you're giving of yourself. And it's like, no, like I am giving of myself, but I am not at the sacrifice to this cause in order to, you know, make good in the world kind of a thing. Because I still have to take care of myself in order to give my best self, right? And so it has become kind of one of those things of like, I... 

Netanya (08:52) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (09:08) 

see need and I'm really good at figuring out how to solve that need and I am action oriented. So sitting on my hands and talking about it for forever, I was like, can't we just make a decision and move forward and implement the thing? And so we've had a lot of transitions and one of those transitions have been I have had, I lost my initial supervisor due to one of those grants ending and now have a new supervisor and navigating how does that shorthand work. It went from having a female to a male. 

Netanya (09:18) 

You 

Taura (09:36) 

Having a female who had been with organization for a little bit but knew her stuff to being with someone who's been there for almost 20 years and has done almost all the roles. And then at the same time trying not to bring my own heavy stuff into the things that I'm personally working through and not applying that stuff to the situation and giving the situation a chance to show and shine and all that kind of stuff. 

Netanya (09:44) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (10:00) 

And so with that is trying to be bold in re-evaluating what is my role, how do I ask for this without being sheepish about it, and how do I prove my worth and my value in explaining, this is my background, this is what I'm good at, and explaining this is the need and... 

Netanya (10:11) 

Yeah. 

Taura (10:20) 

Are we making a decision to fill this for just like, what's the max? Am I filling it for three months until someone's hired? Am I filling it for six months until someone's hired? Or do we need to like establish the role a bit more extensively and maybe create a department that is administrative and me be the head of that department in order to then delegate out? Because right now I'm in a role that is a solo island role and ⁓ 

It's hard to know if I need backup who I can actually go to to ask to do the simplest of tasks or making sure when you're by yourself, if you are not on top of your calendar and all the things that you have, all the balls that you're juggling at the same time, I have to look weeks in advance to make sure that I'm getting things done ahead of time that I might be out for like a week so that things don't fall apart. And that's because I don't have a team to like, can you guys make sure this continues to happen while I'm out? 

Netanya (11:10) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (11:17) 

for some sort of reason, right? And so it's been a season of like, I know that I could rock the role if I could get them to sign off on it and see my value. And at the same time, I also took this role knowing for myself that it is not a career defining role, it is a season fulfilling role. And so it's not something I want to be in for forever. 

Netanya (11:17) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (11:45) 

And I'm kind of in that middle spot of like, do I want to defend and fight for the reframing of my role and ask for higher pay because I want to be there, say another year or two, or am I really starting to feel the itch or need to just be in what it is and say goodbye in the new year and start pursuing the things of other desires that I have and other dreams and goals that I have. 

myself. And it's that balance of trying to be like, do I need more time to like situate myself on a personal level because I'm still taking advantage of the steady instability of the role and I need more time to take advantage of the benefits that come with that or has a year been enough to get through all of that and it's okay to then step back into the unknown and take on what that looks like. 

Netanya (12:39) 

Yeah. Are you... like, do you have any lean in a direction right now or are you just right in the middle? 

Taura (12:45) 

right in 

the middle and it's hard sometimes to discern that because some days like I feel like I rocked the work and I'm really bringing value and I'm like okay I could do this and then other days like I get so frustrated with things and I'm like I really don't care and it's trying to find that balance of like I want to do good diligent work of value and I don't like being in that position of feeling like I just want to give up because then I don't want my work to get sloppy like there's just because I might be out 

Netanya (13:01) 

Yeah 

Yes. 

Taura (13:15) 

outgrowing something doesn't mean that I want this to suffer because of my anxiousness to get out of it. And so still feeling that motivation to show up when I need to show up and do a good job, but still setting boundaries of like, so I haven't had that conversation yet of, I think that's something that'll probably happen this week or next week of whether or not, like, are we... 

Netanya (13:25) 

Yeah. 

Got it. 

Yeah. 

Taura (13:42) 

revising my role and if this is the stuff that we're taking on like And I have to ask for higher pay and is that something you can honor and I think for me in my mind I've kind of decided if Not honoring my value in a monetary way is going to happen then for me that's just kind of like the universe's way of saying like you've spent your time here the way you needed to and brought value in that time and it's okay to walk away kind of thing so 

We'll see how that goes, but it's a stretch from a personal level to be bold and be like, this is the stuff you've asked me to do and this is how I see doing it and this is the time it takes and I need to drop other things. And they, for a while, use the excuse, like, we know you want to stay busy. And I've had to stop them and be like, I don't want to stay busy for the sake of busy work because there's this little task that needs to be handled. I want to stay busy for the sake of... 

Netanya (14:16) 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Taura (14:37) 

what my value can bring to the organization in a positive light and the way that I see that it's crumbling. So that these things aren't constantly becoming a growing pain over and over and over again for the rest of the organization, but there can be brought a solution that I can help fulfill and it's not for the sake of keeping me busy. Yeah, it does. 

Netanya (14:59) 

Isn't that funny though how that gets sneaky right because 

it's almost like And the person who ever says that may not even realize that they did it or may not have been on purpose But it's it's a little bit of manipulation right because it's using something that you are good at or gifted at or wanted to give and Sort of giving it back to you as a like. well, here's more work 

Taura (15:06) 

Right. 

Netanya (15:19) 

you see how it's a little bit sneaky, right? Which is so fascinating. And I will say, it is having self-advocacy, being in that seat of voicing for yourself when you know that something feels out of whack, right? Especially financially can be really hard for people, right? And... 

Taura (15:20) 

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Right. 

yeah. 

Netanya (15:40) 

I've been in that seat. There have been many times I've not spoken years and years that I would just be quiet or be like, it's fine or it'll change or I can do it or you know, whatever reason. ⁓ But I'm curious as to how is it, are you comfortable with it or is it pushing your limit a little bit to walk in a room and say that? 

Taura (15:43) 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Yeah. 

it's 

totally stretching me for sure. Like it is outside of what I would normally do. And here's the thing too, like I am finally pushing 40 and I'm at that space of like, you're not in your 20 learning the ropes anymore. Like you have 20 years of experience of all of these different things that help fulfill you and being really good at this. 

Netanya (16:00) 

Yeah. 

Taura (16:21) 

and you've earned all of those tools in your tool belt in order to do so. So it's not like you're asking as a 20-something year old for this huge thing, you're asking as a 40-something to be honored for the experience that you can bring to the table and asking them to honor that. It's not a learning thing. It's a learning thing when you're learning how the organization might do it, but not the execution of the ability and trust and responsibility of fulfilling the task, right? 

So it's a mindset for me to realize like, and here's the thing too, like I never finished college. I never, I don't have a formal degree. I'm all self-taught through experience and moving through the workforce and that sort of thing. So there's also having to defend like, I have life experience with this just as valuable as sitting in the classroom as a young adult for four or five years. Like if not more, just because my hands have been in the muck of it. 

Netanya (17:10) 

Yeah. 

Taura (17:19) 

for so long and the reality of it for so long. And it's also not negating, the world is ever evolving and changing, so you have to continue to be growing with that evolution and that change. And if you're so stuck in what you were taught as a 20 year old, you can't continue to grow and shift as things change around you. And that is so valuable as well. So it's reminding myself of like, no, like. 

Netanya (17:21) 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Taura (17:43) 

I have to tell myself that I have that value and worth as much as I have to face expressing that and knowing that I can stand and asking for that. And that's a huge challenge for me because that's not like what I do. 

Netanya (17:53) 

my gosh, yeah. So when, yeah, 

so when that voice comes up, right, the one that's like, ugh, like are you gonna, ⁓ but should you, you know, what does it say to you? The voice that's like, that's like, mm, just go be quiet or don't say the thing. Like what does that sound like in your head? 

Taura (18:09) 

Right. gosh, 

I don't even know if I can put that into words. 

I think it's more fear-based of not being seen and not having them value what I can do and bring. being able to, I've spent so much of my life in survival mode. So right, I'm in this head space now where I can really take better control of the things that I have in my life without being affected by the things coming at my life. And... 

Netanya (18:18) 

Mm. 

Taura (18:41) 

One of those things is growing and being able to work past that fear of asking for the permission to take up space and owning that. being like, constantly reminding myself like, it's okay, you don't have to shrink anymore. Like it's okay to take space up. You can take as much space as the next person, three people behind you or below you or next to you kind of a thing. it's... 

Netanya (18:48) 

Yeah! 

Taura (19:05) 

it's not going to impact taking away from anybody. Like I don't, I'm in that phase of not shrinking to better stand for what I want and understanding what my voice is and can bring and the value that's there. And sometimes that's hard because especially in the last year of being at this organization, I feel like I've been screaming at the top of my lungs of like, we need this and we need this and can we do this? And it's just kind of like. 

lots of roadblocks about it and talking with my new supervisor about it. It's just been like, yeah, like, I'm really tired of us talking in circles. We need to just take action with things. It was like, I'm on board, like, let's move forward. But at the same time, like not losing my sense of worth in that. It like, okay, great. We're going to start making some action steps, but at the same time, reminding myself that's more work for you. That's taking on more responsibility. And that means like, 

Netanya (19:36) 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (20:02) 

You also need to be able to delegate some of the little smaller things to somebody else so that you can take on these bigger weighted things to help that momentum happen. But at the same time realizing like there monetarily should be a change in what you're doing because of the responsibility that's there and the amount of time it takes you to focus on it. 

Netanya (20:26) 

Right, it's so, the concept of value is so interesting, right? Because I remember this, was trying several years ago to sell art, because I paint for fun, I was not doing a lot for work, I was at home, it was just a... 

Taura (20:30) 

Mm-hmm. Yes. 

Yeah. 

Netanya (20:42) 

Quieter time in my life and I was like I'm gonna try to do this and sell things and I thought that that was something I wanted to do and I remember trying to decide What to charge for the the things I was creating right and you know this But I was so of course what did I do is I looked at what other people are charging? What do you people sell on Etsy? What do other local? You know when they have art shows or whatever right and so and I just started finding 

Taura (20:43) 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah, miss so hard. Yeah. ⁓ 

Yep. 

Mm-hmm. What's the market? Yeah. 

Netanya (21:10) 

shit everywhere for a lack of it was messy. was not some like, this is, and Google would just give you numbers based on whatever. And so I did, I just sort of did some introspection into the concept of value. And I was like, so this, this woman over here is charging $30 for a painting this size or whatever. And this other woman is charging a thousand dollars for a painting of the same size. And I'm looking at them and I'm like, they're both using quality product. 

Taura (21:11) 

Yeah. 

Right. 

Netanya (21:37) 

or not, it just didn't seem to matter. so I just, the more I thought about it was more that value and self worth are subjective. Worth of anything, not just self worth, but value and worth are subjective. you know, whenever you're a creator of anything, every person you meet has walked into the door with their own baggage around money or worth or value of their past and what they have learned of that. And what you put in front of them, depending on how 

Taura (21:46) 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Netanya (22:05) 

much they like it or don't or it intrigues them or talks to them or speaks to them will pay X amount of dollars based on things that are from their past that have nothing to do with you you know and so it got to the space where I would just you know I stopped doing that for myself but I would run into other people who would undercharge for things I would be like I'm just gonna tell you I would have paid double for what you're charging for this because I like it that much and someone else yeah 

Taura (22:28) 

Right, right. huge. 

We, so it's so funny that you're bringing this up because as I'm trying to like battle for my value and my worth in my current role working for this organization on the flip side, my dream is to work independently for myself as a photographer. And it's such an interesting, like you want to like get people to pay you to do the thing, but you don't want to undervalue yourself. 

Netanya (22:34) 

And someone, yeah, go ahead. 

Taura (23:00) 

and because you want to go and make money off the thing that you love doing and you know how much time and effort you put into it. You also know that your perspective is going to be different than somebody else's. So you're not just being paid right to snap the photo. You're being paid to like encourage someone and direct someone and inspire someone to come out of their shell and be comfortable enough to shine in their own skin. 

you're doing all the admin stuff on your back end. So you're managing your own website and you're doing your social media and you're doing all the business planning. in addition to that, you're scouting for locations and making sure permits are in place. And so there's so much involved. So when you approach someone, it's like, and they're just like, that's just a little out of my budget. It is so hard to not want to devalue and lower something. 

just to get the gig because you want to know that you're being paid for the thing you love doing. right now it's like that balance for me of being like telling myself then that's not my client and that's okay. That my worth isn't based on them willing to pay me the price in which that I want to give them because I have built my prices around the value of worth that I know that is there and it everything that it encompasses. 

Netanya (23:53) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (24:19) 

Because if you're going to go shopping at a store and you're buying something, you're not just buying the product, you're buying the time it takes to unpackage that product and then for you to be in that store and to shelve that thing and the time it goes into preparing that product for you to buy. it's not simply just an item off a shelf thing. As a consumer, forget. 

Netanya (24:26) 

Mm-hmm. 

Right, and 

yes, and I wrote this down while you were talking because I didn't want to forget it, but it was like, what I wrote was like someone not valuing you, and this can be in a work- 

This can be in a personal relationship aspect right that you can take this anywhere. But someone not valuing you Doesn't mean that you're not worth it, right? And someone I heard this somewhere and I loved it so much that I still remember it you might be the right package at the wrong address You know But that concept of what especially when you're running into see multiple people that are like no, I don't think so or You know, this is really not whatever it is 

Taura (25:08) 

Yeah, totally. Yeah. ⁓ 

Netanya (25:20) 

It's a lot of no or people, you know repeatedly saying something is too high and you know What you've put into something and I will give you I agree and understand when you are very very new to something doing discounted packages or something to start building a portfolio is very normal and understandable on both ends it's like I've seen people go to get massages and they'll go to a massage school because they're learned it's like 30 bucks for a massage because they're all 

Taura (25:21) 

Right. 

Right. yeah. Sure. 

Yeah. Right. 

Netanya (25:47) 

learning right 

Taura (25:48) 

Right. 

Netanya (25:48) 

and so that's I get that and also at some point you've built some of that portfolio you've gotten some of that done you've gotten this under your belt a little bit and there's no one person that's gonna be like okay it's time you have to kind of be like okay it's time for yourself 

Taura (25:55) 

Right. 

Right, exactly. Yeah, yeah. And it can be 

discouraging too because when you just had so many no's you're like, this what I should be doing? Is there value in worth here? And I can tell you, as I've, my last 20 years of experience, I have been working since high school, right out of high school through college that I attempted to do and didn't finish and so on and so forth. It has become one of those things of like, I am doing the job that I know. 

I can do because I've been hired to do that, but at the same time trying to grow as a creative on the side as a photographer because that's where my heart and passion is. with both of that, trying to understand what my value and my worth is while trying to just survive in life, I am at that stage now where it's like I have got to start using my voice a bit more and be bolder in utilizing that and not being worried about 

shape shifting into a role that somebody needs me to fulfill for a job, but understand like there are things on my heart and in my mind that I should, not should, but want to be able to better express confidently because I'm starting to better understand my value and worth in that. with that tandem relationship comes, you're not everybody's cup of tea and that's okay. 

Some people like boba and some people just wanna go for a hot steamy glass. Like, they're very different and that's okay. Like, you're not gonna be everybody's favorite person to go to for this thing. like reconciling that and being okay with that is kind of where I'm at in understanding of like, okay, I'm gonna be bold in my job and I'm gonna ask for this because I see my value and worth and it's worth doing to get a solidified answer of how much longer I'm gonna be here for. 

Netanya (27:28) 

Yeah. 

Taura (27:53) 

And I shouldn't just bide my time until I'm ready to walk away. Like I should, I should be compensated for that, that while I am there. but at the same time, taking that and applying it to like, have a voice and I need to be able to grow. And, and the way in which to grow is not to cut myself short and shortchanging my sessions and my gigs, but it's getting comfortable and sharing my voice and talking about people's stories and sharing my own and getting comfortable with. 

⁓ just sharing outside of, it's a shorthand of like, I can provide the service, do you want the service? But being on a more personal level with people, taking up space, right? So being comfortable with that. 

Netanya (28:34) 

Mm-hmm. 

How do you feel like that has been like the response has been to you showing up that way? 

Taura (28:42) 

I think it's been interesting because I had put photography down for so long and I recently, in the last two years got excited about it again and was kind of talking about it and, was able to kind of like share some of my own work and through relationships had opportunities to just randomly shoot. 

people who were needing things who wanted to utilize it. And I think what's been helpful is allowing myself to ask for that and accept that and run with it at the same time and be reminded that I do have a skill set to be able to do that and share in a way that I haven't experienced in a while. So that's been really encouraging and it's given me... 

It's kind of like a step to be able to continue to step forward and pushing into, are a really good photographer. You really do have an eye and it's unique and we love it. It's amazing what an encouraging word and the excitement from others can really help provide momentum in doing. Like, I have family and they're like, we love you, you're so good. But when it's outside people, it hits different. Your person or your family is always going to be like, yeah, you're great. 

Netanya (29:55) 

Yeah. You're like, thanks, Mom. 

Yeah. 

Taura (30:00) 

Yeah, thanks husband! Like, 

I know that you believe in me, but when it comes to... 

Netanya (30:07) 

Well, does, yeah. 

And like that matters too, right? Having people that surround you, that support you is such a big deal. And also, I think you're right, getting, I think we all need validation to some extent, right? And I have to try to be mindful of. 

Taura (30:10) 

Yeah, it does. 

Yeah, also, 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Netanya (30:24) 

where that validation is coming from, when I'm leaning on it too much and not trusting myself, right? But also sometimes just hearing something in the most interesting of places or a corner of the room that I didn't think it was going to come from is really, sort of hits me in a place of, it reminds me of my why, this is why I'm here. And yes, obviously, your family and friends is so wonderful. And there's something about someone that doesn't know me at all that I just affected them, or I was able to 

Taura (30:27) 

Yep. Totally. 

Right. 

Yeah, totally. 

Yes. 

Netanya (30:53) 

I gave to them and it meant something gives me hope to keep going, you 

Taura (30:55) 

Totally. Mm-hmm. 100%. 

Netanya (31:00) 

What are you the most afraid of? And yeah, I'll just let you take that wherever you want to go. 

Taura (31:02) 

gosh. 

I think the biggest thing for me right now is I have always had such big dreams, but I don't know if it's so much fear as it is being overwhelmed of how to get there gets in the way of that. And understanding I've been so independent and just on my own a lot of life that it really does take support systems encouraging of people and 

Netanya (31:27) 

Mmm. 

Taura (31:40) 

people showing up for you in a way of hope that drives you to be able to attain certain things, right? And so for me, I think my biggest fear is like, we hit that stage in life where like, I don't have all the things. Like I've chosen not to be a mom and we don't have a house and I really want a homestead and I really want to like not be struggling from paycheck to paycheck and like there's... 

these barriers and expectations of the world around us that I think can really get in the way of understanding what it means to obtain a fruitful and fulfilling life for yourself without getting bogged down by everybody, all the other noise in your life, right? And I think my fear right now is never being able to fulfill the thing that I dream about because I'm bogged down by all of that all the time and 

Netanya (32:29) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (32:32) 

I then shrink to fulfill the needs that people want to put me in versus stepping out of that and stretching my legs and running my own path instead of just the standard one. Like I have never been a corporate, like I have no desire to climb the ladder in any means. Like it brings me no joy to have that sort of accomplishment. 

Netanya (32:50) 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Taura (32:57) 

I think the fear is letting myself fall into that because it's safe and I know and honor the seasons of steadiness that I get from a standard job versus being bold and stepping out and figuring out what is that grind to actually chase the thing instead of just survive. 

Netanya (33:17) 

Yeah. How do you feel about your own belief system in terms of, you have dreams, obviously, right, that are big. 

Taura (33:24) 

Yeah. 

Netanya (33:26) 

Sometimes the way you erase your past or the things that that you were taught Can get in the way of believing that you can fully get there Do you feel like you can fully get there all the time or is there any part of you that has doubts in there of like? Maybe other people can do that, but that's I don't I don't know you know 

Taura (33:29) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah. 

think 

it's, yeah, I don't, I have a big enough drive to want things differently for myself than what I was raised in. Huge, huge. And I look at my family and I don't want that. I do not want the same cycle of craziness that I grew up in and I can see for generations prior to that. I don't want that for myself. 

Netanya (33:56) 

Yes, that's awesome. 

Taura (34:14) 

that has caused me to make decisions in life to separate from that, but I was still honoring my parents are my parents and my sister's my sister. I think I love them, but there's also a distance there just to protect myself to continue to do different and breaking those things away. And so for me, it's getting, it's straining my brain and my heart and my coping. 

that got me through those seasons to no longer function in that and be able to take steps to what it, telling myself what does it look like to thrive and comfortably and not comfortably in a financial sense, but comfortable of this doesn't make me uncomfortable. Like it makes me excited and joyful and eager to go out and do it again the next day. And I think 

Netanya (34:43) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah 

Taura (35:09) 

It's that transition in the middle right now that I'm at, not just work wise, but in my life. Like I'm coming up on 40. Like that's kind of like the middle of a standard lifespan, right? Like the first half of my life was all of this. And now I want to figure out what this is going to look like moving forward. How did those things look different? And, and what do I need to do for myself to feel like I can obtain that? And so. 

Netanya (35:20) 

Yeah. 

Taura (35:37) 

It's a lot of times, like, for me, my faith is huge and being able to sustain me and getting through that kind of stuff. But it's also a lot of self-reflection of like, what do I need to let go? What do I need to let fall away? How do I need to retrain myself to remind myself that like my value and my worth are there? And reminding myself of your expected timetable from the world around you is not 

realistic in that it doesn't have to align with the Joneses, so to speak, right? And that my journey is my own and the way in which I get there is my own and it's not right, it's not wrong, it's just mine. And it doesn't have to be specific to anything. But at the end of the day, I have to remind myself, if you want to get to that, you still have to take steps. And if I'm not taking steps, then I'm just sitting in the mud in the middle and not getting anywhere. 

Netanya (36:11) 

Mm-hmm, yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (36:36) 

So some days it's harder than others to do that, but I'm also reminding myself not to take, to minimize the little steps that I'm doing. Like I am not where I want to be, where I'm at my stage of life, but I'm also at a place in my life where I've not been able to tackle a lot of things until this year on a personal level. So I am reworking my foundation in order to move forward and propel myself into something more that I want for myself. 

Netanya (36:46) 

Mm-hmm. 

And that's a really big deal, right? That's a really big deal. Because you, yeah, and I have, you know, I've had my own seasons of things, you know, but 

Taura (37:06) 

Yes, it's huge, yeah. It's huge. 

Netanya (37:15) 

just sort of, I think, having awareness that ⁓ this is a thing that's sort of up for me right now that I need to work on that foundation. Because if the foundation is rocky, or as a former friend of mine used to say, it's like putting whipped cream on garbage. You didn't deal with the problem. Yeah. But to be able to sit and really look at. 

Taura (37:17) 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

With the car. Yeah. 

Netanya (37:38) 

You know some of this stuff that maybe you've been carrying for many years and kind of trudging through with and be like, okay We're gonna look at this and deal with this talk about things work through things heal from things Right to give yourself that it's really a gift to give yourself that foundation so that when you do, you know, take that leap of faith or Step a little maybe it's not a leap. Maybe it's just a bigger step than you stepped before that you have a better base to do it from 

Taura (37:39) 

Yeah. 

Right, right. 

Right. Yeah. 

Yeah, it's just remind and to like as you were saying through all of that I was thinking like this stuff that I'm processing and and retraining my body and my brain and my heart and if the things that I'm trying to shed don't serve in what I need to do in order to complete the thing that I wanted to go for. So it's it's that point in which you get to in any stage of your life wherever you're at on your journey. It's different for everybody, but it's 

Netanya (38:24) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (38:36) 

Finally sitting down and asking yourself, how is this serving me? Is it serving me in the season? Is it serving me in the past? Is it gonna be something that can serve me well in the future? And if it's not, then figuring out, do I have the courage to address that and let it go? Or am I gonna let it drive the rest of where I'm going? And I think because of my upbringing, I don't want that thing to be in the driver's seat. And I need to figure out. 

It served me for getting me through my first 40 years of life and now I don't need it to serve me in that way anymore and I need to find other things that better serve me in building a new foundation so I can build something different moving forward. 

Netanya (39:20) 

Well, 

and what you said, though, is so beautiful on that we change. And that sounds so simple and basic, but I just I think. 

when you grow up, at least the way I grew up, was very you checked off boxes, there was like a castle in the sky, that was the goal, and then you're killing it as an adult, like great, I made it as an adult, you know? And I got to somewhere in that climb and lifted my head up and was like, this isn't what I thought it was. I'm not who I thought I was. Or something that was true for me once, right? The job that I wanted when I was 18, the person that I married. 

Taura (39:32) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah. 

Right. Right. 

Yeah. No! 

Netanya (39:58) 

when I was 25, I changed, quite a great deal. And he also went through some stuff, you know? And so ⁓ some of those were dark nights of the soul kind of thing. Some of those were just my dream shifted and who I, my own beliefs about who I could become. I started to ask bigger questions and I was like, maybe I could do this. know, and so leaving space for the change as I grow and sort of 

Taura (40:06) 

You're right. 

yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Netanya (40:26) 

giving yourself permission that I reserve the right to change my mind. 

Taura (40:30) 

Yes. 

And that's it, right? When we're in high school, the definitive answer question is growing up through school, like, do want to be when you grow up? And you're needing to have a definitive answer for that. What are you going to college for? And being okay with not having that answer needs to be have, like, is a bigger conversation of allowing young adults to have because who hasn't figured out by 18? Because most adults you talk to have no clue what they're doing in their 20s, 30s, and 40s. 

Netanya (40:37) 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

No! 

Taura (40:59) 

and trying to ask an 18 year old to have that figured out and have that answer and not having a conversation to remind like there's that grace and the compassion and empathy to be like it's okay to change your mind. Like if you could do one thing for 10 years but you don't like it anymore you can change your mind and that's okay. And I think the biggest thing especially in I would say probably the last eight to 10 years that I have really been driving home especially with people who 

Netanya (41:10) 

Yeah. 

Taura (41:29) 

come out of trauma or really hardship relationship stuff or you know they're just better self-realization is the biggest thing is it's just because something was doesn't mean it should have been and doesn't mean it needs to continue to be and giving yourself permission to let that go like just because it was just because that's how you grew up doesn't mean that's how you have to stay just because that's the way your parents did it doesn't mean that's the way you have to do it like 

Netanya (41:41) 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

you 

Taura (41:56) 

and asking yourself or reminding yourself just because that's the way it was done, was that right? Or are we falling back on that just because we don't know anything different? And can we be brave enough and bold enough to seek something different because it's the right thing to do even though it's the hard thing to do? 

Netanya (42:16) 

Yeah, no, valid. when you, especially family, your tribe of origin, whatever that looked like for you growing up, you learn things. You grow up in a system of some kind and there are people usually, know, people are older than you or next to you that are, this is the way they do things or this is the way the world works. And... 

Taura (42:19) 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Netanya (42:34) 

to be able to get to a point where one of the best gifts I ever gave myself for me personally was moving out of state. I did not at all know when I made that choice how much I was gonna change from it. And sort of getting away from that family of origin who I love and I'm very blessed with. I have a lot of wonderful humans in my life. But just to get outside of a box and sort of look around at like, ⁓ there's other boxes over here. Like, what's up? 

Taura (42:40) 

Oh yes, 100%. Yes. 

yeah. 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Yeah, 100%. 

Netanya (43:04) 

and sort of try things 

on and be like, oh, well, I don't like this so much, but that looks cool, you know, and get far enough away from. 

Taura (43:09) 

Yeah. 

Netanya (43:12) 

all of the stories about the way the world works and who you're capable of becoming to start asking other questions without some noise in my head telling me. And one thing I will say again for my own is that I've had people who adore me and love me sort of put their fear on me in different points. So it's not even mean or bad intended. I don't even mean direct like you can't do that or you shouldn't, but people will be like, are you sure? Because yeah. 

Taura (43:15) 

Yes. 

Mm-hmm. 

Yes. Yeah. 

Right. Oh, and like, yeah, questioning. Like, and then 

you start to question when you felt so certain about something. I can wholeheartedly say one of the best things I've done for myself was leaving the state in which I grew up in. growing up in Colorado. Yeah, yes. But it's okay. So growing up, everybody's like, why would you leave? And I was like, why did you go? that's one of those things of like... 

Netanya (43:49) 

Where did you grow up? did I do that? Did we talk about that? I don't know. I talk to too many people. Okay. Yeah. 

He 

Taura (44:05) 

because I needed to see something different, I needed to see something more. I've lived in a couple different states at this point and met a variety of different people and I've traveled to several countries and I've traveled to really nice countries and it's one of those things that I can wholeheartedly, if I were going to tell a young person to do, is do not be afraid to leave the nest. Yes, you're going off to college, but how far away is college and how involved are mom and dad in what you're doing day to day? 

Netanya (44:23) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (44:31) 

Family is important and family's not going anywhere. Home is home and they'll always be there. And to not take the step outside of that to experience for yourself what you need to figure out for yourself, I think is one of the biggest sacrifices young folks don't know that they're making. Like it's the biggest gift you could give yourself at a younger age and reminding people like you don't have to have things figured out and it's okay to make mistakes. 

still know that you can come back home. And I say that with a caveat knowing that not everybody has that luxury 100%. Like I totally understand that the life's hardships don't allow everybody to do that. But for those who are given that opportunity, I can tell you it's going to make you a better human being to be able to show up for those people who don't have that luxury and be able to meet them with empathy and compassion at the end of the day. 

Netanya (45:27) 

Yeah. 

Well, and like when you, I'm curious of your experience of this. Like when you've left and in your leaving you have grown and changed and seen other things and learned other things and you've sort of shifted who you are in the world. And then you go back, right? What has that been like for you? 

Taura (45:33) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah. Back. 

⁓ I would say I probably had the biggest shift of that this year. This at the beginning of this year, I lost my grandfather and, in that loss, it, it asked me to step up in a way with my family in a way that you don't expect to have to do with as a granddaughter. but it, it had me step into like experiences. I, was a huge shift of me realizing like, I'm not a kid. I'm an 

And so I'm an adult with my adult like my parents and an adult with my adult aunt and aunts and uncles like and I'm not this little kid who needs to shrink and be told to go in the other room anymore and there was that shift of realizing like What you have in your head as a kid in your upbringing Changes when you become when you yourself realize like you're not that little kid anymore 

because you've grown and seen and you've experienced on your own. And there was that shift this year with my family, whether they realized it or not, it was huge for me to realize like, this is not the ideal thing that I had in my head. Like it used to be as a kid and it's messier and it's more complicated and it's how I show up in it is different now and how I want to show up in it. 

is different now and realizing where you're rolling. The way you see things is when you go away and come back, they just remember that version of you that left. They weren't with you on that journey and so coming back can like ruffle feathers sometimes because you're not that same person you were and that naive kid that you were when you left but you are showing up in a different way that can cause some tension and complication but it doesn't 

Netanya (47:20) 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Taura (47:39) 

Tension and complication, I realize, don't make it bad. It's just different. And realizing how you navigate that for yourself will impact how you show up. And I think that's something I'm still working through, like, that confrontation and that shift is something I'm still trying to figure out. How do I move forward in those relationships without like, just tossing them aside? Because it wasn't a, it was an impactful thing, but it wasn't. 

Netanya (47:44) 

Mm-hmm. 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (48:08) 

a detrimental thing where I need to close off those relationships by any means. It's just choosing how do I show up in them moving forward now, understanding who I am and how I am in that role that I now have versus what I myself were acting out of previously. 

Netanya (48:21) 

Mm-hmm. 

Well, and that like, there's an expectation, right? In that thing of whoever. 

Taura (48:27) 

yeah. 

Netanya (48:30) 

Expecting you to show up as the way you've always shown up, know We call it doing the dance like you've been doing the Mambo for 30, you know 35 years and then you show up on year 36 and you're doing the salsa and they're still doing the Mambo and they're like, what do you mean? You're not gonna and I've seen it literally in conversations where someone will be like they ask the thing and they're waiting for you to engage in the same way that you used to join in the harping of the negative and I won't speak and the 

Taura (48:34) 

Yep. ⁓ yeah. Yes. 

Yes, the Mambo. Yeah. 

Yes. 

Yeah. 

Netanya (48:57) 

discomfort that will ensue is phenomenal. 

Taura (48:58) 

yeah. 

Yes. So much so. 

Netanya (49:03) 

But 

that space of expectation, right? That they think that you are, and there have been, you know, I think everybody has different experiences and I've had, there's been a couple relationships that I have let go of. You know, and... 

Taura (49:06) 

Yep. 

yeah. 

Netanya (49:17) 

You know, sometimes people may agree or not agree with that and I I I did that with a lot of thought I didn't just like peace out See you later. Good luck. I don't want to deal with this anymore You know, those were not comfortable decisions and then there's others that I've had hard conversations with people and like the best ones, you know my mom and my sister are the best examples because They are so willing to show up in a hard conversation and it doesn't matter what it is. We'll sit down and be like hey 

Taura (49:21) 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm, exactly. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Netanya (49:47) 

Like this kind of made me feel this way and I don't think you meant it that way but and it's just such a beautiful place because they'll sit within it and they have the they have what I found to be like the potential to grow with me and grow on their own like they're growing too in other ways and I have to be like ⁓ I just did a thing you know so but all of those dynamics if there's some that I've left there are some that have left me and I let them go you know or yeah 

Taura (49:59) 

Yes. Yes. 

Yes. Yes. 

Yep. Yep. Yep. And asking yourself like, 

it's coming back to that question of does this serve me well? And that applies to relationships too. Does this friendship serve me well? How did this friendship serve me in the past? If it continues as it is, it's gonna serve me well in the future. Can there be a conversation to see that I'm growing? Is this person wanna grow as well? 

Netanya (50:19) 

Yeah. 

Taura (50:35) 

And if not really like mourning that loss of that relationship and letting like it and acknowledging it's okay. It was just a season. It doesn't have to be a lifetime. But if it's not serving me in the best of ways, then why am I holding on to it and really reconciling whether it's something you keep or let go or in turn, like you said, like I've had friends who let me go like in the same way and it 

Netanya (50:38) 

Yeah. 

Taura (51:01) 

And it sometimes isn't, it's circumstantial just because I've moved to a different state or, you know, keeping in touch long distance is really hard or, you know, we just moved in to shifting into different phases of life and those friendships are different. Or letting go of family or really, you know, reconciling like what kind of level of front of relationship can I have with my parents or my siblings or my aunts and my uncles and that my grandparents even or. 

co-workers for that. Relationships in general are all facets of everything we do and how they impact us. have to ask ourselves, they serving me well or are they part of a season? And if there's someone I just have to walk alongside with because of what I happen to be doing, I can evaluate how well I'm, I can show up with integrity but I don't have to show up all of me in vulnerability with them at the same time. 

Netanya (51:53) 

Mm-hmm and there's like a There's a grief right? It's it there's a death that comes along with that and I will say one of the hardest things that I've gone through multiple times has been like having to end something and I knew that I was hurting the other person and I knew that they wouldn't understand or wouldn't like me or that I was gonna become the villain in their story and yet 

Taura (51:56) 

Yes, total agree. 

Mm-hmm. 

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. Mm-hmm. 

Absolutely. 

Netanya (52:17) 

If I didn't do that thing, I was hurting me. 

Taura (52:20) 

Yeah, 100%. Yeah, I've had those too. And it's hard. It's a real hard thing because I think we're similar in that we want to show up for the people that are people in our lives. And when that starts becoming detrimental to us and we're exhausted or worn out and it's not reciprocated in the same manner, you have to evaluate, am I showing up for this person because they expect me to or is there a real 

Netanya (52:23) 

you 

Taura (52:48) 

true and care in a season that they need more from me than I need from them right now? Or is it like, is this just run its course and it's time to like walk away kind of a thing? It's so hard, such a grief. And I still have some of those friendships that I still grieve on regular basis because here I thought we would be like lifetime friends, you know? 

Netanya (52:59) 

Mm-hmm. 

Well, and you're grieving. I mean, there's grief of the past and what was and what is no longer the nostalgia of the good times or the memories that you hold. And then there's also something I I was in therapy one day and we started talking about something and I realized I had completely bypassed my grief of the life that I wasn't going to have or the experience with that person that was not going to be that I had been a hope of mine. 

Taura (53:14) 

Mm hmm. Yes. 

Yes, have. Yeah. 

100%. Yes, I've had that too. I think that's harder. Harder than the grief of what was is the grief of how you thought you guys were going to be intertwined in life moving forward and showing up for each other and being part of that day to day with one another. That for me is the harder grief when you've shown up so many different times in so many ways for these people, this person mutually and then something just shifted and it just disintegrated. 

Netanya (53:44) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (54:01) 

and it wasn't going to be what you thought it was going to be for the next 20 years. 

Netanya (54:05) 

Yeah. 

Yeah, and also on the other hand, I've also been surprised delightfully at some times of like when I made room for something or when I really let go of something that no longer serves me, you make room for other things to come in. And so there are the there just are certain people or experiences or situations that have come in that you couldn't have paid me to guess that this was ever going to if you would have asked 20 year old me would you ever do this or would this ever happen? I just wouldn't have 

Taura (54:11) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah. 

Yes. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Netanya (54:35) 

ever considered it. But 

Taura (54:36) 

Yeah. 

Netanya (54:37) 

I think sometimes when you let go of the things that you have outgrown or have outgrown you or whatever, just don't aren't part of the person you want to become. That you make room for the most surprising of things. What has surprised you the most about when you left and moving and leaving and changing? 

Taura (54:42) 

Mm-hmm. 

Mm-hmm. Yes. 

⁓ 

What I'm capable of. What I'm actually capable of. of, yeah, filling and fitting into the expectations of those around me. If I'm truly letting go of something and switching states or moving somewhere else or exploring something, what I come across, like in exploration and adventure of it all, what surprised me in that and how 

Netanya (54:59) 

Hmm... Mm-hmm? ⁓ 

Taura (55:27) 

much joy it brought me or what something has happened and how I handled it and was capable of handling it and showing it for myself. I think one of those biggest things that I did was in my late 20s, I moved from Colorado to San Diego. I had a friend from Colorado who moved there a year before and I was just, I hated my 20s, they were rough. I was like, I... 

Netanya (55:51) 

Mmm. 

Taura (55:53) 

I'm gonna do the dream. I wanna move to California. That's what I wanted to do. Like you said earlier, you had people in your life, like, but what about this? My mom was so fierce, she's like, California's gonna fall into the ocean, 

Netanya (55:55) 

huh. 

Taura (56:08) 

was always like, well that's how the Lord wants to take me and that's how the Lord's gonna take me but I'm not gonna live my life worrying about what could happen and I'm just like, I need to start living because I don't wanna be stuck in fear. And so I moved and I had worked at a summer camp all summer. I had saved up that money in order to make the move happen. I had a month's worth of finances in my bank to survive. Went out there with no job, no plan, no car. 

Netanya (56:11) 

That's hilarious. 

Yeah. 

Taura (56:37) 

was sharing a room with her on this tiny little twin and she had another roommate at the time and the thought was that that roommate would move out at the end like when that time went out and I would take over the second room and so I go out there no car. I have to walk everywhere, I have to take the bus everywhere if I'm not relying on not knowing anybody but her for a ride right and my great-grandmother passed away and I had made it my job to 

Netanya (56:57) 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (57:04) 

job hunt every day from like nine to three. Like it was the thing I needed in order to stay. My whole family thought I was going to fail. Like my dad admitted to me, he goes, I thought I was going to have to drive out there and bring you back home. And so I flew home from my great grandmother's funeral and literally as I walked into my grandparents' house, I got a phone call from a guy that I had interviewed with earlier that week. And I stepped out of the room, took the call. 

who was offered the job, was able to walk back into the room with like aunts and uncles, my grandparents and my dad and be like, and then starting to let me know, so how's that California life going? Like what's going on? I was like, well, I just accepted a job and start Monday. I was just like, able to walk in the room and be like, I don't know how I just pulled this off, but you know, you do want, want to go home after you're trying to like. 

Netanya (57:36) 

Ha! 

Yeah. 

That's crazy. 

Mm-hmm 

Taura (58:01) 

step out and see what the world can do for you just to come home and fail and everybody like rub it in your nose, right? Like, how's that going? So to be able to come back three weeks later and literally step out for a phone call, walk back into the room just to be flooded with all those how's that going for you and confidently be like, well, I don't have the car, but I have a place to live and I can feed myself and I start a job. 

Netanya (58:07) 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah. And like, yeah. Go ahead. 

Taura (58:27) 

It did so 

much for me to be able to just grow. There's so much growing. Yes. Yeah. 

Netanya (58:34) 

Mm-hmm Well, and there's so much faith required like I talk about faith walks a lot because it's like 

it's 

You it's not like you don't have all the answers. You don't necessarily know where you're gonna land You don't know what the next move is you're in the the arena of the unknown Right and when you're in that space You have to kind of close one eye and like hold on for do like like I'm gonna do it, you know And like every time I've done that Oh so rarely have things gone the way that I thought they should Or the way that I you know if you would have asked me that I would have told you that I wanted them to go but literally 

Taura (58:47) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yep. 

Yep 

How many? Yes. Right. 

Yeah. 

Netanya (59:13) 

always have things worked out for me and and I think I started to ask Whether you pray or talk to the universe or whatever you do I started to ask at one I used to ask for the bare minimum like if I can just get this thing, know, whatever and then someone I heard at some point was like 

Taura (59:15) 

Yes, no, and I agree. 

Yeah. 

Netanya (59:30) 

The universe is not a budget. You don't have to ask for the bare minimum. And I was like, ⁓ And so I started asking bigger. And so one of my favorite prayers that I ever will say out loud about anything is always this or something better. 

Taura (59:31) 

Yeah, right, like why, yeah. Yes. 

Netanya (59:44) 

this is the thing I think I want or something better if you have it. Yeah. And it might not be anything like I thought it was. And so I have to sort of detach a little bit to what that's going to look like because a lot of times I've gotten to something better and it was surprising or unexpected. And I was like, ⁓ okay. You know, we're going to do this instead or not how I thought that was going to go, but that there's a, yeah. 

Taura (59:47) 

show me the better. ⁓ 

100%. Yep. 

Right. Yeah. Yeah. You have to surrender that expectation of 

what you have in your head or what you think that bare minimum is and be bold enough to ask for it. And I'm like, it's the same for me. the times that I just let it go and be asked in the boldness of that prayer of like, I want better. 

comfortable is fine and this I can be content and this is why shouldn't I be living what I'm dreaming like and if that isn't suited for me then I want the whatever the better is right and so to kind of like circle back around to where we started talking you're I'm in that middle again and I have to remind myself of like you can did it in your 20s you can do it again like it's a day almost just over a decade later you can still do that again I'm just like 

Netanya (1:00:32) 

Mm-hmm. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Mm-hmm. 

Taura (1:01:00) 

have this and I'm just gonna take this leap and see what happens and trust it. Yeah, yeah. 

Netanya (1:01:02) 

Yeah, it's a reinvention. Yeah 

And I had a and no one's gonna ask for you So you might as well ask go big or go home And I had a it reminded me when you said that about your story about leaving in California when I came here So when I moved to Tennessee, I did not know another person in the state of Tennessee at all. I didn't have a job I didn't have anything I did have a job, but it was it was a very part-time job and and so ⁓ 

Taura (1:01:10) 

Exactly. 

Netanya (1:01:29) 

Was at the grocery store one day and I ran into a friend on the parking lot and we were talking about this and she hadn't known that I was leaving and we were just I started to talk about that and her She had known someone else that had left recently and so she was talking about that experience and she said to me Well, I mean you could really not like it and she wasn't trying to be mean She was just sort of contemplating what if you don't like you don't know anybody you don't know and it wasn't even fear-based It was just sort of a comment like you could really you know what if you don't like it and I 

Taura (1:01:48) 

yeah. 

Netanya (1:01:56) 

I just thought about it and I was like, I could. I could not like it at all. And, but having that thing of I could come back here, I could go back to Colorado, I can go back to Chicago, or I could try a different place. And either way, I trust myself enough to handle it, even if I don't like it. But I'm gonna try. 

Taura (1:02:04) 

Yeah, that's the thing. Yeah? 

Yeah. Yeah. if I don't, not 

liking it doesn't equal failing and it doesn't equal fear and it doesn't equal, you know, the negative. You just, when you go to an ice cream shop and you ask for the little spoons of ice cream, you gonna like, yeah, are you not gonna like, you're looking at the flavors, you're gonna be like, might not like it, so I'm not gonna try it. Like, no, you're gonna be like, that seems interesting. I wanna try that. 

Netanya (1:02:20) 

No. 

That was a good metaphor. I like that. 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Taura (1:02:41) 

If you don't, then okay. So you tried something that tasted bad and you move forward. It's a bigger scale, yes, to move out of state and somewhere brand new and you don't know anybody. I get that, but at the same time, it could be a really bold flavor that you're just wowed by and you're missing out on it if you just are afraid you're not gonna like it. 

Netanya (1:02:48) 

Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Yeah, but 

I love that you brought it back to where we started, which was that. 

Taura (1:03:08) 

Yes. 

Netanya (1:03:10) 

This doesn't just happen once. You're here again. And you're here again. It's that spiral staircase. You come back around again to the same spot, but you're at a higher level. You're at a different place. You're a different you. And so you get to sit there, but those questions that you once asked in your 20s, maybe the question is similar, but it might have changed some. Or you think bigger about it. well, I did that, and I'm so curious. What else you got for me? You can ask bigger, because you're bigger. ⁓ 

Taura (1:03:11) 

No. Yeah. 

Yes. Yeah. Exactly. 

See ya. 

Right. 

Netanya (1:03:39) 

you've 

become more of a woman than you were at 21, you know? Well, this is beautiful. I'm so glad we got on today. Thank you so much for taking the time to talk with me. And we end up in these heart to hearts periodically in real life. And I was like, this is gonna be good. So I appreciate that so much. And yeah, I'm just so glad you were here. 

Taura (1:03:41) 

Yep, right, 100%. 

Me too! 

Absolutely. Yeah. 

Anytime. I loved it. Thanks for asking.