Live from London with Andy's Man Club - Too many men die by suicide every day 💔

In the most vulnerable moment of his life, Dan Lawrence takes Definitely Not Therapy beyond the studio and straight into the heart of London — live at Andy’s Man Club’s “Longest Conversation”, a 12-hour event symbolising the 12 men lost to suicide every single day in the UK.

What unfolds is raw, redemptive, and deeply human.
 Before a live audience, Dan opens up about the night everything fell apart — the unbearable thought of losing time with his daughter, the loneliness that followed, and the haunting belief that nobody would ever believe in him again.
 What changed everything? Ten seconds of courage — the moment that saved his life.

Joining Dan on stage is Lucas from Andy’s Man Club (AMC), who opens up about losing three close friends — all young, all successful, all gone too soon. Lucas reveals what really happens behind the doors of AMC: a brew, a biscuit, a circle of men who talk honestly and listen without judgment. It’s not therapy — it’s connection, and it’s saving lives every single week.

Together, Dan and Lucas explore:
 • Why vulnerability is strength, not weakness
• The brutal gap between posting online and being heard in person
• How peer-led support breaks the silence men live in
• Why therapy, even when messy, still heals
• What it really means to move from “man up” to opening up
• Why non-linear recovery is still progress
• And how ten seconds of courage can rewrite your story forever

There’s also a moving cameo from comedian Paul Smith, who opens up about pressure, identity, and finding joy again through honesty — proof that authenticity isn’t just freeing, it’s healing.

If you’ve ever worn a mask, told everyone you were fine, or quietly wondered if you mattered — this episode is for you.
 Because one message, one “Are you okay?”, one moment of honesty could save a life — maybe even yours.

💬 Key Takeaways

• Talking isn’t weakness — it’s survival.
• Peer support saves lives — no judgment, no referral, just men helping men.
• The gap between pretending and healing is community.
• Ten seconds of courage can open the door to hope, help, and healing.

🕊️ About Andy’s Man Club (AMC)

Founded in 2016 after the tragic loss of Andrew Roberts, Andy’s Man Club is a men’s suicide-prevention charity that now runs over 240 free, peer-led groups across the UK every Monday night and online.
Their mission is simple and powerful: It’s Okay To Talk.
Learn more: andysmanclub.co.uk

❤️ If You Need Help

You are not alone. Help is waiting.

📞 Andy’s Man Club — Free, no sign-up, every Monday night nationwide
🌐 andysmanclub.co.uk

📞 Samaritans (UK): 116 123 — Free, 24/7
💬 Shout: Text 85258 (UK Crisis Text Line)

🎧 Where to Listen

Tune in wherever you get your podcasts —
 🎙️ Spotify | 🍎 Apple Podcasts | 🎧 Amazon Music | 🔍 Google Podcasts | ❤️ iHeartRadio

Stream it, save it, and share it with someone who might need a reminder that they’re not alone.

📢 Call to Action

If this episode spoke to you — if it made you think, pause, or feel something real —
 please subscribe, share, and leave a review.

Your words might reach the one person who’s searching for hope tonight.
 Sometimes, your ten seconds of courage is the spark someone else has been waiting for.

🤝 Connect with the Show

Stay connected, join the conversation, and help us keep breaking the silence:
 📸 Instagram:

Transcript

 SPEAKER_04: 0:00 Welcome to what might be the most special episode of definitely not therapy. And I can't believe that I'm actually saying this. And I and it it was a s very surreal moment. I did a live podcast with Andy's Man Club. Andy's Man Club are a huge suicide prevention charity for men. They hold support groups every single Monday around the country. And I've had several people who go to Andy's Man Club, come on the podcast and share their story. I look tired. Sorry, if you're visually watching this, I look tired. It's been a very exhausting couple of weeks. Summer holidays, you get it. You'll get you'll look at me be like, oh yeah, no, he's a d he must be a dad. He must be a parent. Yes, yes, I am. Now every single story I've heard has been an inspiration. And the common theme for me with Andy's Man Club is my DMs genuinely hand on heart since I posted my first ever video, which was about mental health, or it wasn't, I didn't know it was about mental health, but it was about my marriage ending, it was about my struggles, and it was a broken man. And since that moment, my DMs were full of people telling me to go to Andy's Mann Club. Go to Andy's Man Club. And I didn't, I didn't have the courage. I had the courage to hide behind a camera, and I could post my story and I could think I'm I'm being brave because I'm posting something online, but that's not brave. That's not brave. Being brave is taking 10 seconds of courage of walking into an Andy's Mann club and then immediately having a support network. I am one of the lucky ones who didn't seek help. I didn't go to Andy's Mann Club, I didn't go to any kind of support network, but I still came out the other side. And I guess I'm lucky because I had social media to lean on. unknown: 1:49 It's definitely not therapy. SPEAKER_04: 1:51 But this introduction is because I'm actually gonna share my live podcast with you. I'm gonna share it as an episode, so we're gonna go into it. There's a few it you know, it's a bit emotional. I've also was on immediately before the legendary and the hilarious Paul Smith, who I had the pleasure to meet. He's one of the funniest comedians in the country. His clips go viral, his crowd work is just he is just brilliant, and I had some laughs with him backstage. I'm gonna share a little bit of his as well, but if you want the full video of that, if you want to watch the full video, then go to Andy's Man Club YouTube channel, and the full 12-hour long conversation is there. It was an event in London in Patanosta Square, it was called the Longest Conversation, and it's to represent the 12 men who die by suicide on average every single day, which is 12 too many. And I've said this and I've say this over and over again. But I'm gonna share that episode with you now. So please enjoy. I'm joined by Lucas from Andy's Man Club, who unfortunately lost three friends in a very short period of time, and he's only 26, and I can't even imagine the toll that that would take on someone's mental health. But Lucas, you know, Lucas works for Andy's Man Club and he seeks help and he's doing his bit, he shares his story, he talks to people, and he's an incredible, incredible guy. And like I say, I'm gonna leave a little bit of the Paul Smith chat in there, which was on immediately after. But that, you know, I was a tough act to follow. They had to bring in the big guns, which is Paul Smith, and they did that, and he was brilliant, he was absolutely brilliant. Uh, it was an honour to sit and watch him live and to see him there live. But uh, I'll leave a little bit of his his segment in in this episode. But if you want to watch the full video of Paul Smith or any of the the incredible guests who were on the event yesterday, then go to Andy's Man Club YouTube and hit the live button and the full com the the full 12-hour long conversation is there. If you wanna if you wanna watch the whole thing, incredible, if you want to skip through bits, skip through bits. But if I can ask that you you give Andy's Man Club a follow on Instagram, they do great work. And if you can give them a share, if you can leave a comment, just show some support, it really, really does go a long way. And I and I and hand on heart, this was a huge moment for me. I was so nervous because there were so many people there, it was being live streamed, there was a live audience. I'm normally in my comfort zone, genuinely, of my my little studio, which is not a studio, is it it's a garage. We all know it's a garage, but it was incredible, and I'm really proud of myself for doing it. So please enjoy it, and yeah. Just I'm nervous. I'm nervous that I'm sharing this, but but let's go, let's just go. Enjoy. This is definitely not therapy. It's definitely not therapy. SPEAKER_00: 5:21 Who are we all? Hello, hello madam. SPEAKER_05: 5:23 Is everyone okay? Are you all right? SPEAKER_00: 5:26 Hello, people at home. Yes! We've got one fan, yes, Luke. Uh we're Marlo and Rosie. Oh, yeah. Uh, we are here as part of the longest conversation on behalf of Andy's Man Club, which we love. I mean, just even going off stage there, we've been getting messages from people who have been that we didn't even realise that use Andy's Man Club that have been involved in Andy's Man Club. I mean, we just got a message from Phil who said, I'm in that film, I'm in the film. And on behalf of Andy's Man Club, it's amazing. It's just it's wonderful to see how many people that these guys have touched. SPEAKER_05: 6:00 Well, we've been online since 9 a.m. this morning. We're going to nine o'clock tonight. And if you've just put us on the reason, is we are here um for that 12 hours to represent the average of the 12 men that we lose each day in the UK due to suicide. So um, we've got experts that we've had on. We've had I keep going back to him, but I just love him so much. And he even did a message for my mum, but we had Mr. Motivator on stage earlier on. We did. Um, and still to come, the amazing, the legendary comedian Paul Smith. Yes, what a guy, he's on soon. SPEAKER_00: 6:33 And something really exciting right now uh is Dan Lawrence. He is well-known comedian and podcast host, and he's going to be joining us right now for a live episode of his new podcast, Definitely Not Therapy, all on this very stage. Ladies and gentlemen, everyone at home is Dan Lawrence. SPEAKER_04: 6:53 Thank you, thank you. Hello, everyone. Hello. I'm Dan Lawrence, as as they said, and I host my own podcast, which is Definitely Not Therapy, which is really about spreading awareness around men's mental health. Which my normally my podcast looks a little bit different to this, I must admit. Normally, I'm shut away in a garage with a little light and a camera. So this is a little bit different. But this is what it's about. It's about spreading awareness and having conversations. And today I'm joined by Lucas from Andy's Man Club. SPEAKER_01: 7:24 Hello, thank you for having me. SPEAKER_04: 7:26 Yeah, here he is. Here he is. So this is a really special episode of well, definitely not therapy for me, because it's with Andy's Mann Club, and it it I would say Andy's Mann Club is one of the main reasons I started this podcast in the first place. So I I'll be the first to admit, you know, I I I had lots of struggles, I had some mental health struggles, and I hit some lows, but I didn't have that courage to reach out and to go to an Andy's Mann club. But I what I did is instead, which is probably a silly idea, is I posted a video on the internet, which millions of people saw, which is me then, you know, a broken man. But what came from that was hundreds and thousands of messages from people basically showing support and also telling me basically to go and see Andy's Man Club. And and and at the time, and I never had the courage, but I for me I used social media as my outlet. And what that kind of done for me was I then spent so many hours of my day talking to people on social media, talking to people through my DMs who were telling me all these stories about how how bad things had got. And I just thought, if I'm if I'm just talking to this one person, then I'm only helping that one person, and as much as it was helping me, because it was a therapy for me, it was only helping that person. And and over time, and a good friend of mine, Al, was like, Look, you should do something with this, and I ended up coming up with the podcast, which is definitely not therapy. And the reason for it is I wanted to spread as much awareness as possible. Like I said, if I'm just sat there talking to one person, then that's just one person that I'm helping. But if I can actually talk to someone, sit down, have a face-to-face conversation, and really hear that person's story, then that story can relate to hopefully hundreds and you know thousands of people that are maybe sat there at the moment thinking, I don't know where to turn, or I'm I'm really alone. So that was really why I started the podcast. But I'd love to hear why you got into Andy's Man Club and and what that what it means to you. SPEAKER_01: 9:29 I'll be honest, it sounds slightly contrived, but it's because it were a job at the time. So, you know, I know that sounds bad, but at the time I were at a bit of a crossroads. I'd been a rugby fan, I'd been a football fan, I wanted to get back into working in sport, and I saw this job come up with Andy's Man Club, and when I got the job, it just opened up another side of my brain. I grew up with two parents who had addiction issues. Okay, grew up with crippling anxiety as well, which is probably hard to believe for some people. Grew up not really acknowledging my mental health and my struggles and my problems, and you know, I'll say it openly, thinking that things like Andy's man club were a load of rubbish. I were that guy, I was a guy telling people to man up, you know, telling people that they were using mental health as their excuse. But until I actually, you know, went sort of behind the curtain and saw what were going on, got a feel for it for myself, you know, it it just really opened up my eyes and made me feel comfortable with myself. And I think to my mind, the job that I do now, I do it for a few reasons. I do it for myself, I do it to make my grandparents proud as well. My grandparents who've raised me have been absolutely fantastic people, but I also do it because of the friends that have lost to suicide. One of those friends, Nick, you were on before, before us, Nikki Helen's son Connor, he took his own life last year. Another friend of mine, Saul Lee, took his own life three, three, four years ago. Both, you know, big characters, one a musician, one a footballer, both had funerals where people were piling out of the door, and this is too big a problem, you know, for people to ignore. SPEAKER_04: 11:12 So, did you talk about was this part of the reason that you then decided I'm gonna open up about my mental health and I'm gonna start talking about it? Because, you know, it you you've hit the nail on the head there. And I was the same, not necessarily man up, but I wouldn't talk about it. I would I wouldn't talk about my problems, I would keep them to myself, and it it was only when you start seeing other people starting to do things and other people that are going through similar things, and you're like, oh okay, well, maybe I can start talking about this. Because for for me, and I our stories are are obviously very different, but I just I I felt selfish in a way. I felt selfish because I thought I'm the only person in the world that's going through this, no one else can understand, no one else can know the pain that I'm going through. Whereas actually, when you start reaching out and you start talking to someone and you start saying, Oh, well, this has happened and that's happened, you start to appreciate actually other people go through the same thing every single day. So that's why we do need to talk more, we do need to keep that conversation going. So was that was that what it was like for you? You you were the guy that was man up, but was it a case of I think it were a case of peeling away a number of layers, really. SPEAKER_01: 12:14 I think that you know, for me it it started off with me having this sort of hard front against it and sort of an acceptance that life was shit and sometimes it would deal you a shit hand, like you know, that's that's where I was, but I think you know, getting the job, opening up helped me, but didn't help me straight away. You know, some of my colleagues would tell you for the first six months I was lucky to keep my job, to be honest. Really clear who will do, yeah, genuinely, you know, I had a tough time of it. I sort of, you know, had a bit of a still a bit of a probably, you know, laxadaisical attitude, I thought, at that time. And then I think that little things happened, you know, little moments of acceptance, other circumstances that meant that I looked inwardly and I found things to resonate with, and I also found hope. But then I think when I had those friends, you know, ultimately take that decision, that spurred me on further and thought, look, you know, I want to bear all because ultimately, to put it bluntly, one funeral's too many, two funerals were too many, and you know, I there's there's an awful statistic I always look back at, and I, you know, I always go back to which is the fact that 75% of men who take their own lives in the UK don't engage with the support service before they do so. Yeah, that tells you that there's this massive problem, this burning problem that needs solving. And if I can play a very, very small part in that, you know, which I can confidently say that I do in sort of eradicating that problem, then then fantastic. SPEAKER_04: 13:41 Yeah. I think the fact that yeah, you you're talking about it is a great step. I mean, for yeah, for me, it was kind of I was I was not talking to anyone, I was I was keeping myself locked away. I didn't want to I didn't want to talk to anyone, I didn't want to even acknowledge that there was a a problem, probably, and I was putting myself at the bottom of of the pile. But in terms of your mental health, so did that take uh a downturn seeing what had happened to your friends, or was that the moment you were like, okay, maybe I just you know need to need to start talking and I want to do something to change this because like you say, one funeral's too many, and obviously with we you know the the the longest conversation today is 12 hours for the 12 men that that die by suicide on average every day, and it's and it is 12 too many, isn't it? SPEAKER_01: 14:22 It is, it's 12 too many, and I think it's it's a bit of both because I think it made me sort of you know hit rock bottom, but it also spared me on at the same time, and I think that it's strange because like I say, it's been a bumpy ride, and I think that you know in this space there's a lot of people who I think sometimes can give an impression that you go from that low point to that high point fairly quickly. You know, the journey, it's it's like anything, it's up and down, it's completely up and down. And I think there's been moments in my life where I've you know I've still made mistakes, but I think that now I feel like I'm in a strong place, and you know, the Andy's man club has helped me get to that position, it's helped me look inwardly, it's helped me, you know, I access therapy now, and you know, biggest advocate of therapy going, probably you know, the wrong title of podcast to say that on definitely not therapy, but I love therapy, you know, and I think that those sort of rock bottom moments sometimes it's like I always use footballing analogies, and I heard Sam Allardyce of all people say something on a podcast, which was that teams need to hit that rock bottom, they need to have that 5-0 loss. Or if you're my team, you need to be beaten by Sheffield Wednesdays on the under 21s in the Carabao Cup before you can build on, and before you can hit those heights again. You need to taste, you know, those lows, I think, sometimes before you can you can reach the heights. And I think for my mental health, that's definitely been similar. I need, you know, I got to those positions where I felt like there were no hope and I had nowhere to turn, yeah. And that gave me a bit of a foundation to build from. SPEAKER_04: 15:50 Yeah. Well, I mean, that's inspiring anyway. That is inspiring. I think I can certainly relate to you know, being being the person that I I guess when I was I was at my lowest, and maybe social media plays a part in this because you know that that's a big part of my life. But probably what people saw and what my friends saw and what what people online watching my my video saw was oh, Dan's in a better place, Dan's happy. But actually, that was probably the point I was at my lowest, and where I talk about the selfishness earlier, it was it's a case of I was at a point where I was pretending I was getting better at pretending I was okay, but actually, you know, I was I was convincing myself that everyone would be better off without me, and that's the truth of it, you know. And I and that was the lowest that I'd got, and it was, you know, friends and family that pulled me out of that, but they didn't really even know, you know, I've got a little girl, and and to convince myself that she's better off without a dad is is is just it's hard, but uh but and I'm not saying that this is right or wrong, but I can understand because I've been there, I can understand how you can convince yourself because you just you feel like a burden. SPEAKER_01: 17:00 Yeah, but I'll jump, I'll jump in there. I just think that when you're you know when you're in the limelight, when you're a public figure, you know, when you've when you've had that profile and you've had that that exposure, and all obviously it's your job as well as to put yourself out there to keep putting yourself out there and put that mask on every day is is horrendous. Like, you know, it's it's an awful thing to have to do. And you know, for me, I know that when when I'm feeling lone, you know, people who who are listening will probably know this. I start putting things on my Instagram story more. I start, you know, building up this facade, this mask of I'm okay, I'm doing well, I'm going to the gym, I'm looking after myself, you know, when in reality I'm not. And I think that for you, obviously, being being a public figure, being in the limelight, that being your job as well, for you to take that actual brave decision eventually to think enough's enough, and to put out content that were so, you know, so raw, so real and so emotional. We we spoke off camera, there might have been some detractors who commented on it who thought, you know, negative things about it, but realistically, you know, the people that you help and the people that are going to relate to that and resonate with that, it makes it worthwhile. And that's what you've got to do, you know. If put yourself out there as much as you can, even if you feel as though you can't, whether that's going to an Andy's man club session, whether that's having a conversation with a loved one, whether that's going to therapy, whether it's, you know, putting social media posts out there, put yourself out there, and you know, eventually something will click for you, something will fall into place, and you'll be able to start putting those building blocks in place to get him better. I think. SPEAKER_04: 18:32 I agree. I could yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think when I when I posted, and I'll talk about the social media side of it because when I posted my the video that I initially posted, it it wasn't for social media. I I had recorded a video at a point where the worst thing that could happen, my wife left me in it was I didn't know what was what my life looked like. It was it was it was I just didn't know what the future looked like. I didn't want a future, but my head was uh so like clouded and so I just didn't know what to think. So I was googling what do I do, how do I get through this, how do I survive this? And I ended up I ended up making like a video pod a video diary, I guess. And I sat there and I had the security of I was I mean I was on my own and I I could just talk to this phone with the hope that I could look at that in a year's time, and I and I think a lot of the reasoning behind it was okay, I'll still be here in a year's time to be able to look back. So it's kind of a positive to be able to think, okay, I'm gonna be here in a year, that's fine, I can then look back on that. But then because of social media, it I was no one knew what was going on in my in my life, and you have to put this mask on, you have to put this facade on of okay, Dan's this funny guy, he's putting funny videos, and then there was nothing to post because I couldn't make funny content anymore. So I I ended up and I spoke to some some friends and some family, and I'd said, look, I've been making this video diary, and I ended up posting that video, that video diary, and I didn't tell anyone I was going to do it. I'd had some advice, but I just did it, and I just turned my phone off and I just went to bed. And then the following day, uh I mean the video reached millions, which comes with good and it comes with bad, because you you you do have that positive kind of that support, those messages of support, but you also get man up, you know. Why are you putting this on the internet? And I think it's sad because we're all told as men we can talk, or you need to talk, you need to talk up more, you need to talk about your mental health, and then as soon as we do, we're sort of told, Oh, hang on a minute, we don't want it here, we don't want you talking about it here. But I think you're you're right in what you say. The reason I sort of carried on with it was because even if one person saw that, and I and you know it got millions of views, but it was positive and negative feedback, but but even if one person saw that and thought, okay, I'm not on my own now, I'm not the only person to do it, and that's the kind of message that the message that I try and drive is okay, look, if I can post a video and millions of people can see it, and and it's a man completely bare in his soul, then you can talk to just one person. If I can do it to millions, you can do it to just one. Just tell your friend if you are struggling, tell your friend or go to an Andy's man club. It takes, and I think you know, I've to my I've had several people from Andy's Man Club come on to the podcast that that that are here today, even and the the common theme that I hear is it just takes 10 seconds of courage, 10 seconds of courage, go through that door, and and and that's the same. If I can do it, then I think anyone can. SPEAKER_01: 21:38 Yeah, I'd agree. I think you put it beautifully, and I just I just want to say as well, you know, people with a platform are people too, and those, you know, those negative people, they they might have their own stuff going on, but realistically there's no place for it. And I think, you know, you see it again, I again I always go back to football as an analogy, but you know, I mean, last night, again, I go back to Leeds, you've got Dominic Calvert Lewin who's had a tough time of late, his sky is a penalty, and then you have a look on Twitter, or X, as it's now known, and there's people just giving him stick, you know, or if there's somebody who shows a bit of vulnerability, somebody who puts something out there, you know, the fact that people are seeking confrontation and the fact that people are wanting to put that negativity out in into the world, not only is it negatively affecting the person who's putting it out there, other people who are scrolling through those comments who are maybe looking for messages of hope, looking for messages of reassurance, they're just seeing those blocks constantly. You know, they're just seeing the, you know, they're seeing a lot of rubbish basically. SPEAKER_04: 22:38 It's negativity, and it's I mean, there's no need for it. I think it's you know, we're we're we're in a world where social media is huge now, it's it's massive, and I think a lot of people will go to social media to kind of look at okay, how do I deal with this situation or look at look at what they're doing? And I think if people are just seeing negativity and hate comments and people being horrible, it's like it's gonna discourage them from one, you know, not that everyone should go and post a video on Facebook of, you know, or or on social media of bearing their soul, but if that's where people are going to see what other people are doing, and I think if I like I say, if I can do it and if I can put myself out there, and that comes with you know lots of lots of views sometimes, but it can help one person, then it's worth it's worth doing, and and and that's that's the message, that's the the sort of main reason I wanted to do the podcast, is because I can sit and talk to people in my DMs and I can try and help people and I can say go and talk to Andy's Man Club, but actually there's still a disconnect when it's through texting, and that's why I and I've learned so much even from people from Andy's Man Club, and I've got friends now, and in our friends group, we we sort of I've got friends that say, Are you okay? and I'll say yeah, I'm okay. And then they'll say, Right, that's the sort of man answer. Now, what's the real answer? And then we end up having a chat. And I think it's a shame that we have to do that, but at least we're doing it, at least we're doing something. SPEAKER_01: 24:04 Yeah, agree completely. But it's uh it's been it's been a fantastic conversation, it I think you know the the message that we can just put out there, you know, more than anything is it's an old like playground saying, isn't it? But if you've got nothing to nice to say, then don't say it. Yeah, you know, that's the thing, you know, just there's enough negativity in the world, so you know, people should continue to try and put positivity into the world. You know, people when they share stories, they should be sort of heralded for it. I think I think they should be sort of you know shown love, they should be amplified those stories as well. And I think, you know, realistically, if they're amplified and they're treated correctly, then it's going to lead to more people coming forward because more people are gonna resonate to you know to those individual stories and and hopefully improve themselves. I think so. SPEAKER_04: 24:51 And I think if there's if there's more, if there's more support, if there's more talking, if we're keeping the conversation going, then can only help, and even if it just helps one person. But but I think it's if you're sat there now and and and I'm sure there's lots of people that are sat there now and they're thinking, I just I don't I don't know where to turn. It's funny enough, my my friend Al, again, he was a a big part of of my sort of mental mental health journey, and he was the one that was phoning me up every single day when when he found out what had happened. He told me I think it was an old like Chinese proverb, and it was kind of it was something like the best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago, but the second best time to plant a tree is right now. So it's kind of what you take from that, or what I took from that was just do something now, like okay, you might have missed the chance. I I would have loved to have got help and got some therapy when I really needed it, but I didn't. So the next best time is just to do it now. So if you're sat there now thinking, well, it's too late for me, I've got no one to talk to, and his man club are there, and it just like I say, 10 seconds of courage, and you're there. SPEAKER_01: 25:50 Yeah, cool. Are we out of time? SPEAKER_04: 25:52 We're out of time, Lucas. But thank you so much for for joining me and for anyone that wants to listen to uh my my podcast, definitely not therapy, it's available on all uh all platforms. So thank you very much, everyone. SPEAKER_01: 26:03 Thank you. Thank you. Just um one more round of applause just for everyone who has organised this today. It's been fantastic. So just another round of applause for the organisers, specifically Emma. Well done, Emma. Thank you. SPEAKER_02: 26:22 Thank you. SPEAKER_00: 26:25 Cheers, guys. Now, uh hello, by the way, we're Milo and Rosie. What you can't see is like back in the green room, there's a big screen as to what's going on down here on stage, and everyone there was gathered around. SPEAKER_05: 26:37 Gathered round watching everything up there. It's like a like a premiere of a new movie. It was good, but it's so good to see everybody invested and just absorbing everything that's going on today because you know we're we're we're we're approaching 80% now. SPEAKER_00: 26:50 Uh I think people realise that they're here today at part of something that is quite, I'm gonna say magical, but you know what I mean, something quite special. We are here, we are Andy's Man Club, we're part of the longest conversation, and when we say long, we mean long because today we're here for 12 hours. Uh, those 12 hours to represent the average of 12 men we lose every day in the UK to suicide. SPEAKER_05: 27:16 Um, if you feel that you need support, if you want to come down to any of Andy's man clubs, then all you need to do is have a look online for where your nearest meeting will be. And is manclub.co.uk for that. But obviously, follow us on Instagram. If you're watching, if you've just found us because we've been streaming literally all day, then make sure you follow, and we would love a share from you as well, because we're just trying to get that message out there that it indeed is okay to talk. SPEAKER_00: 27:40 If today helps just one guy, then then we've done our job today. Now, I've seen many strange things from working with Milo over the past 11 to 12 years. I saw him fangirl Mr. Motivator earlier on and get a little bit too close to his lycra. But I don't think I've ever seen you fangirl someone as much as our next guest. SPEAKER_05: 28:04 You're gonna have to take the lead on this because what I'm gonna do is I'm just gonna I'm just gonna sit back and go. He's great, honestly, he's it he's he's phenomenal, right? And I'm I'm aghast that we've managed to get him here today. So he's one of the UK's best comedians, and we've got him here right now. SPEAKER_00: 28:24 He he's gonna be here on stage opening up, hopefully, about his own mental health journey. Like Milo said, in all seriousness, it is a bit of an honour to have him. Ladies and gentlemen, people are home. This is Mr. Paul Smith. Hi, Paul Smith. Paul Smith. Paul Smith, deep Paul Smith. Oh, I do like what we've done with the place. SPEAKER_02: 28:50 Looks beautiful, yeah, everyone looks very comfortable. It's nice, isn't it? Very chilled our crowd. SPEAKER_00: 28:54 I mean, I think that the sort of viewing the live streams have just shot up now. Straight up now that you're because me and you came on stage. No, let's just put it that way. SPEAKER_03: 29:04 Hi, everyone at home. SPEAKER_05: 29:05 Give them away for up there. Hello. Is there as well, who've been with us, some of us. I think I've got numbums by now. SPEAKER_03: 29:12 Yeah, my looks so comfy. SPEAKER_00: 29:14 Um start from the beginning. Like, you know, you've been selling out arenas. How did this all start? SPEAKER_03: 29:21 I've got no idea. I still I still think it's a dream to be honest. I still I still think of a I'm gonna wake up tomorrow and everyone's gonna tell me it was a joke. It just yeah, I I've been doing comedy about 20 years, and for most of that, I was just hosting a club in Liverpool, just used to MC. And yeah, I travelled around a little bit doing it, and then wasn't really I mean, I was happy doing that. I I really like the job. It's a look, it's a good job, but I wasn't I wasn't getting on the telly or anything, and then social media came along and Facebook, then Instagram, and now TikTok, and yeah, it's just uh kind of snowballed. It's a it's yeah, as I said, it's it's a it's a strange thing. I've got a uh my my good Me Paul, who uh he called Paul as well, who uh who owns Hot Water Comedy Club. I've got him to thank because he kind of filmed it and put on the internet and did all that kind of technical stuff that I would never have done. So yeah. SPEAKER_00: 30:12 How did you and this is a really stupid thing to ask a comedian, but how did you find your style of of what you do? Or is this or is this you? SPEAKER_03: 30:21 And you know, you know what I think it was like I wasn't like this for the first maybe ten years I did stand up. Uh maybe not, maybe five, six years anyway. I used to be I used to be terrified of speaking to anyone in the audience, or I was I was I used to avoid it like the plague. And then uh I stopped doing comedy. I I I had I just fell out of love with it, I wasn't doing very well, travelling around on my own, and yet going into like mental health stuff, it's it's not the best job for for you when you're getting a bit low. And uh spending like coming down to London on a mega bus and doing 10 minutes and not doing well, and then getting the mega bus back is can can get depressing. And I kind of fell out of love with it and thought it wasn't gonna go my way, and then stopped for about nine months a year, and then hot water came along, and I just I went down and I'd booked the gig in and I didn't really want to do it, and I was half drunk to be honest. I'd been at a barbecue, turned up and just couldn't remember any of my jokes, so I had to just on stage, but I thought at that at that point I wasn't gonna do stand-up anymore, so there was no real pressure on it, and I just uh I just started messing with the card and then it went well, and then he asked the guy, Paul he asked me to come back the next week and end up hosting one and the host and I just stayed hosting, and it was just like a low pressure, and it just let me find the love of it again, and it just not having that pressure on it to do it. You just feel more comfortable then you know when you're picking people the bouncing back between you Yeah, it was just because I was the resident host of the club and we used to have regular audiences in because it was just it started on a Sunday night, then it was Friday and Sunday, and it wasn't like it was like 30 people maybe, and it used to be the same people every week, so I couldn't really just go on and do the same joke, so I had to kind of just make it say what had happened that week. Just it just became me going on and just chatting about my week, and I had to make that funny somehow, and it just yeah, it really sharpened those skills over over the space of a few years. So actually, when you found yourself, that's when it shot Yeah, when when I became comfortable and uh in who I was on stage and just allowed myself to be a bit more free with it, just took the pressure off because sometimes you can just most of the time you can just talk yourself out of stuff, can't you? You can really get in your head. I used to I used to be really bad. I when I used to come down and in comedy there's things called open spots, and that's kind of a try-out spot, and they're quite a big deal. And I used to really just talk myself out of it, even though I knew my stuff would work, I'd go on and I'd just start like kind of I'd say something completely different, or I'd talk myself into just making a reference that was unnecessary and just derail myself. You overthink everything. Overthink after as well afterwards, yeah. And then yeah, and then you sat on a again, sat on a bus for six hours. SPEAKER_04: 32:54 Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. No more Paul Smith. Listen, if you want the rest of that, Paul Smith chat, if you want the rest of that, you're gonna have to go and watch it on the Andes Man Club channels. Go to their YouTube channel, click live, and it will be there. It's called the longest conversation. Please give them a like, give them a share, give them a follow. unknown: 33:12 It's definitely not therapy. SPEAKER_04: 33:13 And I just wanted to sort of round this episode up by talking about a couple of the points. I said in there that I felt selfish, and I think a lot of people will genuinely relate to this. I do, you know, I did feel selfish. I felt really selfish in the sense that I honestly thought I'm the only person in the world that can go through this, and I still have days like it now where I think no one no one can understand what I'm going through because every single person is different, every single situation is different. But there's no need to be selfish about it. I was selfish in in a sense of no one can understand me, so no one can help me, but that's not true, that's not true, and actually I did learn over time that there's so many other people who they have much much bigger struggles than I've had, and they deal with it so much better. I've also spoken to people that have had much less struggles than me, but they deal with it so much worse, and the point is pain is pain, struggle is a struggle. It doesn't matter what it is, we all deal with things differently, we all handle things differently. So I'll come, I'll just want to re-reiterate one of the the old Chinese proverb. My friend Al Casey, who was on episode one of this this podcast, and the reason I'm bringing him up, and I bring him up constantly throughout, because as well as my best friends, I've got my best friend John O and I've got my best friend Ricky who were there for me. They were there for me, and they're probably sick and tired of me talking to them about my problems. But they would never show that to Ricky Mike, because Ricky's a bit more direct, he would tell me straight, but they would never, they would never really, they would just take it. I would just keep talking and talking and talking and moaning and sharing and crying and screaming and whatever, and they would just take it. And Al was one that he would phone me up because he's had his mental health struggles, he's been he's had his low point, which which actually we haven't spoken about on a podcast, and I'm gonna try and get him back on. But he was the one that was phoning me up every single day. He was phoning me every single day when he knew my wife had left me, and he knew that I was struggling, because he knew how much I loved her, he knew how how much that family unit meant to me, he knew he knew what that support and having that person that believed in me, he knew what that gave me. So losing it, he knew what I was losing. So he phoned me every single day. He phoned me every single day when I was at my lowest, and he would not leave me alone. He would it was irritating to a point, but it was a good irritating because I needed it, because he would phone and he would check in. And he was checking in to see if I was to make sure I didn't do anything silly, to make sure that I didn't cause, I guess, a a permanent a permanent solution for a temporary problem. I think that's the phrase. And he did tell me this old Chinese proverb, and it does it it's really sat with me, and and O's a funny character, he's got this brilliant mind. And you never really know what he's thinking, but he's very comedically is very, very funny, he's brilliant. And but he said so when he says things like this, it's it's difficult because he's very, very wise, as much as he's he's funny. I don't know how to describe him, he's a bit weird, but lovable. And I wouldn't say that to his face, but he said this old Chinese proverb, which was the best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago. The second best time to plant a tree is right now, and the point is, yeah, 20 years ago, you plant a tree, it would have grown, it would have, you know, you'd be getting fruit off that tree now. You'd be sustained, but you didn't do it, so you don't have a tree. So the second best time is right now, and the point is just do do do something right now. I should have got help for my mental health, I should have gone and got help, but I put myself bottom of the pile, and I've said this time and time again. For me, it was financial. I probably knew that I needed help, you know. I I I I was struggling because I was trying to run a business, I was trying to come up with ideas, content, two, three, four, five videos every single week. I was trying to plan those videos, I was trying to be a dad, I was trying to be a partner, be a fiance. I was trying to live. I was trying to work, I was trying to run a business, you got bills to pay. It's social media is ever changing. It's not like plumbing, where a boiler's a boiler, a boiler's always gonna break at some point, and you're always gonna need a plumber, and that's a career, and you know what you're doing. Social media, we no one knows because it's ever changing. They can continuously move the goalposts. One minute you're popular and you're getting paid. The next minute you're not popular, you're not getting paid. One minute you're getting paid for videos, one, the next you're getting paid for photos, the next you're getting paid for stories. It's and I'm 41, I'm not young, I'm not 20, I'm not sitting there scrolling my phone, I'm not figuring all this stuff out. I'm just I'm literally, I don't know how to describe it, but I'm like, it's like I'm I'm I'm up this steep hill and I'm constantly climbing up this steep hill, and my and I'm tired from it, I'm exhausted from it, and then I get to do a little video and it's fine and I enjoy it, and then I've got to carry on, and I'm just I'm so near the top, and then I'll slip down again, and then you've got to it's like that, it's constant. But anyway, the point of the old proverb is now's the best time, and when it comes to something like Andy's man club, 10 seconds of courage. Now's the best time. You didn't do it before, you're still struggling. The stress on the NHS, the mental health system. The last episode, I think someone said there was an eight-month waiting list. Well, do you know what? If you're in there and you've got the courage and you've phoned them and you've said I need help, some people aren't gonna make it eight months, they're not gonna make it eight months, so why not go to an Andy's man club? Okay, eight months, you get down eight months down the road. And I heard a really inspiring story yesterday from a guy from Andy's Man Club, which I won't mention him because I haven't asked his permission, but he was struggling. He had his had his wife, but he was he was struggling, he could feel that he was on the decline. So he went to an Andy's man club. Nine months later, he's doing incredible, he's doing really, really well, he's happy. But then his wife says, I'm not happy, I'm gonna leave. And they have a break for six months. But he he had openly admitted if he hadn't had that support from Andy's Man Club, he might not have made it through that six months. And they had a break, and they're back together, and they're as happy as ever. And and this is one thing I've I've said, and I probably handled things and probably continue to handle things in the worst possible way. If I'd have maybe handled things differently from the moment my marriage broke down, there may have been a chance. There may have been a chance. I think the problem the thing I didn't get was hope. A lot of men get hope because when you love someone and and and you're two people and you love each other, and there's a marriage and there's a child. If there's a breakdown, there's hope. I was given no hope. It was slammed shut and there was no that was it. There was no hope. And that's what threw me. There was no I had nothing to fight for. Obviously, my little girl, and that sounds silly to say that, but I was always gonna be a dad. Regardless, she's always gonna be my little girl, and I would never ever let anyone take that from me. She's she's my world. But I didn't I wasn't given any hope that that marriage could come back. There was no there's not even a not even a 0.01% it was done. And to go from someone who you just married six weeks ago to done no hope, no chance ever is soul destroying. And that is part of the reason that I've struggled and I handled things differently. And you know what? If I'd have just probably if I'd have left and I'd have walked away from from my home that I spent my whole life wanting, and that I put every single last penny in. And I know it's my daughter's home as well, I get and I understand that. But if I'd have just walked away and gone and lived in a bed sit, my marriage might have there may have been some hope. There may have been some comeback. If I'd have gone away and got some some therapy. There may have been some hope, but I don't know what that would have looked like for me. Leaving everything, my little girl seeing daddy packing his suitcases and going, Well, I didn't want any of it. I just I don't or my little girl coming home and why does Daddy not live here anymore? I couldn't I wasn't strong enough. I wasn't gonna leave. I couldn't do that. I couldn't do that to my little girl. Rightly or wrongly, people will agree, people will disagree. It's just one of those. But you know, and then before you know it, there's new people, there's new people in, you know, uh in my daughter's life, and then you go from zero hope to minus minus zero hope. So I had nothing, I had nothing to fight for. I'd know so I handled things probably the worst that I could have. So I'm a great example of what not to do, is what I'm saying. But yeah, this is what I want to finish on is Andy's Man Club. Look, they are great. I I listened to so many inspiring stories yesterday. I spent the whole afternoon there, everyone is just so lovely, so friendly. I met Elaine, who was Andy's mum. I met Luke Ambler, who's the founder, I think he he he founded it or co-founded it, but just an incredible guy, an incredible public speaker as well. If you watch any of the segments, he was on. If you're gonna go back to the YouTube, the live stream, he was the first one on, I think he closed off as well. I had to leave before the angle to get my train home. And as you can see, hearing my voice, I'm a little bit hoarse. But thank you for tuning into this. This for me genuinely, Hand on Heart, was such a special episode. I'm so proud of myself. And and just to quickly jump in, the the the the way this episode actually came about was I just announced, I just announced I'm gonna do this podcast, definitely not therapy. And the following day, I was in a Zoom meeting with the lovely Emma and the lovely Tanya from Andy's Man Club. They wanted me to be part of this the longest conversation, and I hadn't even launched an episode yet, and I was like, wow, it it blew me away that they even knew who I was. But apparently, there's there were loads and loads of the guys from Andy's Man Club who follow me, and they follow because one, they like to keep up with my story, some of them enjoy it for the comedy because comedy I think is one of the best therapies, isn't it? Comedy is the therapy for me, and it's the same for for a lot of people. So I was so so so proud of myself that I I did it and went through with it because doing a live that's the first time I've really done anything live in front of a big audience. And if you watch the video which I'll post on the Spotify, I was maybe a little bit nervous, but I think I've watched it back and I I think it went okay. But I'd love to get your feedback on it, so please put you put a comment, put a review on the Spotify. But yeah, thank you for listening. Honestly, and thank you for watching. It was a real pleasure, and it was definitely a highlight of of my career. So thank you very much, and I look forward to seeing you on the next episode. That's it for this episode of Definitely Not Therapy. And if you cried, laughed, smiled, or just felt slightly uncomfortable, then we've done our job. Make sure to follow, subscribe, leave a review if you can, and perhaps share this with someone who feels alone right now because that might make them just feel less alone. There's someone else going through the same thing as them. Whatever your story might be, whether it's co-parenting issues, divorce, breakups, heartbreak, anything, anything that goes unspoken, things that you feel like you can't talk about, come and talk to me about them. Let's help to spread some awareness. All you need to do is email me at only danlawrence at gmail.com or DM me on any of my social media platforms, Dan Lawrence on Facebook, Dan Lawrence Comedy on Instagram, or definitely not therapy pod on Instagram. I'm Dan Lawrence and I'll see you next time.