the ACT OUT podcast
On the ACT OUT podcast, Adam talks to people about their passions and how they relate to our world today. Expect honest conversations, humor, and a little sarcasm as guests share their stories, perspectives, and lessons. We’re here to challenge narratives, celebrate authenticity, inspire listeners to live unapologetically as themselves, and spark a feeling of connection and hope with the audience.
Episodes usually feature Adam and one guest in a colorful, conversational setting, with new episodes dropping every Thursday. Adam’s humor, empathy, and insightful sarcasm make each conversation engaging, relatable, and thought-provoking.
Want to be a guest on the ACT OUT podcast? Send Adam Tomlin a message on PodMatch, here: PodMatch | the ACT OUT podcast
the ACT OUT podcast
Getting Involved: How Young Leaders Change Politics
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Welcome back to the ACT OUT podcast! In this episode, host Adam Tomlin sits down with Ty Champion, Vice Chairman of the Norfolk Democratic Committee and President of the Black Caucus of the Virginia Young Democrats, for a candid conversation about politics, public service, leadership, and what motivates people to get involved in their communities.
Ty shares his journey from growing up in Norfolk to earning a master’s degree in architecture at Hampton University before finding his passion in political organizing and advocacy. What began as an interest sparked by the 2008 presidential election evolved into a commitment to helping young people become engaged, informed, and empowered participants in the political process.
Adam and Ty dive into the realities of grassroots organizing, campaign work, and political leadership. Ty reflects on volunteering for local campaigns, working his way into leadership positions, and learning firsthand that leadership often finds people before they think they're ready for it. He also shares stories from his experiences with the Hampton Roads Young Democrats, navigating organizational growth, fundraising, and the challenges of building sustainable movements that are bigger than any one person.
The conversation explores the importance of representation in politics, civic engagement, and why local elections matter more than many people realize. Ty discusses the impact of seeing leaders who looked like him, how mentors helped shape his path, and why creating opportunities for future generations remains one of his biggest priorities.
Adam and Ty also tackle difficult topics including political polarization, higher education, student loan debt, media narratives, and the growing divide in American politics. Together, they examine how people form political identities, the role of personal experiences in shaping beliefs, and why meaningful conversations across differences are becoming increasingly important.
Throughout the episode, Ty emphasizes the value of community, mentorship, and staying engaged even when political systems feel frustrating or imperfect. Rather than focusing solely on elections, he encourages listeners to think about how they can make an impact in their neighborhoods, schools, workplaces, and local governments.
If you've ever wondered how someone gets involved in politics, what grassroots organizing actually looks like, or why local leadership matters, this episode offers an honest and insightful look at civic engagement, public service, and building change from the ground up.
Learn more about Ty Champion here.
Tune in every Thursday for episodes that inspire, challenge, and entertain. Whether you’re here for laughs, lived wisdom, or action steps, the ACT OUT podcast is your space to rethink growth, embrace self-awareness, and act out your passions.
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Credits:
Mural: Tara E. @taradiiiise and @tarayakisauce
Welcome to the Act Out Podcast. I'm your host, Adam Toddell. Today's guest is the vice chairman of the Norfolk Dems. He's also the president of the Black Caucus of the Virginia Young Democrats. But the title that I'm sure that he would lead with is my friend. Let's roll the tape. Cy Bud, thank you so much for coming on, man. Absolutely no problem, Adam. It's a pleasure to be here. I had realized uh that whenever like you and I were talking, um, there were so many different uh like groups you were involved in. And so like as so many things just around Norfolk that I was like, I don't know if I'm gonna be able to like get him scheduled to be able to even come in to come in. So um thanks for it.
SPEAKER_00Of course. Absolutely no problem.
SPEAKER_01So uh Ty, can you um kind of give just like a brief background on yourself?
SPEAKER_00My name is Ty Champion. I am 29 years old, turning 30 this August, big three of. And a little bit of background on like who I am, what I do. I am a Norfolk native, born right at Centera, Norfolk, General. I've been educated here, proud Lake Taylor Titan.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_00Um, went to school right across the water at Hampton University, where I earned my master's degree in architecture. And I just kind of I did that for five years. And you know, when you have a passion, you just kind of kind of jump into it. So I jumped right on into it, start worked a campaign, rolling that ball and getting large cohorts of people together and energizing young people specifically to get involved, stay involved, and become their best advocate for themselves.
SPEAKER_01Growing up, were you interested in politics or was it something that you kind of developed over time?
SPEAKER_00Um it was something that more so developed over time. My first so I have to put a lot of background into it. All right. So the first election that I actually concretely remember is Bush V. Carrie in 2004. I was going to school in Virginia Beach at the time. That is the very first election that I voted in.
SPEAKER_01I'm not gonna tell you how old I was. Uh yeah, I I don't want you to, but um, so sorry, you were in Virginia Beach.
SPEAKER_00Yes, I was in Virginia Beach and we had a mock election. So they had us all go to the cafetorium. We were able to click and pick and vote for who we wanted to, and then they announced the results of the vote. And uh Kerry lost by a lot. He he lost the youth vote, he lost the elementary school vote in Virginia Beach at one particular school. So, John Kerry, if you're watching this, I'm I'm so sorry. You you you lost face at elementary. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_01He is a future friend of the podcast. I'm sure he's watching this.
SPEAKER_00So that and I remember being like, oh man, because you know, when you pick someone and you're like, I want this person to win, and then they call the results out, and it's like George W. Bush, 65%, John Kerry, 35%. And I'm like, oh. Technically, that's the first time I voted. It didn't count. But then after that, not according to Trump. But um the first time that I really got invested in a race was Obama 08. Okay. And that was the first time because I saw a candidate running for president that actually kind of looked like me. And I'm sure that's very familiar for a lot of people in my age cohort were actually seeing a president that kind of looks like us. Now, don't get me wrong, I didn't have any clue what was going on before like Super Tuesday. That was foreign to me. But then once, you know, we started getting closer to the election, I'm like, that this this Barack Obama guy, it's something about him. I'm gonna keep an eye on him. And of course, that kind of got the ball rolling. I actually got one of his books and read it. That was a really good read. The Audacity of Hope? Yes. Then election night, 2008. Oh, okay. I remember it like it was yesterday. I am like wrapped up in my comforter, sitting up on the bed, watching the states come in. I see a projection, and it's like, we're predicting Virginia is going to go for John McCain, and I am like crushed because I'm like, no, no. And then I don't remember who the guy was, but he's like, hold on, wait. We are getting word that Barack Obama has won the Commonwealth of Virginia, and with that, we predict, we project Barack Obama will be the next president. So I literally am ecstatic the rest of the week. So from that, I've just kind of always kept that in the back door, kind of in the back of my mind, like, yeah, that would be kind of cool to do one day. I wanted to, at the time, I think I wanted to be a lawyer. Did I expect me to be doing everything that I do now? No. But I've always had that spark from that point forward. And I've just kind of kept on with it. I first got involved in Hampton Roads Young Dems after I graduated from Ham Dem. Got involved with HRYD kind of at a low level, like I'll just be a member, you know, HRYD, Hampton Roads Young Democrats. Hampton Roads Young Democrats. So I do that in 2019. COVID happens, the organization completely collapses. It's one of the many COVID fatalities because how are we supposed to gather? We don't know if we're gonna gather and I'll die. Everything kind of shutters. I am divested because COVID is happening. So I'm like, I'm gonna worry more about, you know, one, am I going to continue to be employed? And two, am I going to be able to evade this virus? Yeah. So COVID eventually lets up. 2023, I say, you know what, it's time to get involved. And 2023 is when the Virginia elections are for anyone who may be listening. Virginia elections are offset one year from your typical election cycle. So Virginia is what has what we call off-year elections. That's where we like anything at the state level.
SPEAKER_01It makes us inundated with political ads like just all the time, it seems like it's uh it's unfortunate.
SPEAKER_00The election cycle for 2026 really started the day after the elections in 2025. So if you live in Virginia, there's always an election every November. My delegate, who actually used to be my member of City Council, announces that she's going to run for the new state senate seat because the maps were redrawn because we had redistricting in 2020. So for 2023.
SPEAKER_01This is Angela Williams Graves. This is Senator Williams Graves. Uh, she is the best and friend of the podcast as well.
SPEAKER_00Love that. And honestly, if it wasn't for her, I don't think I'd even be here because we had a conversation at the Panera on Military Highway. And I was like, you know, I'm really interested to help you out. I want to learn more. I really want to get involved, you know, all of that sort of thing. And she really just opened up, took me under her wing and was like, you know, this is what I do. This is what I did on council. This is, you know, how the state is working. So I really look up to her, not only as, you know, someone who really is trailblazing, especially in Virginia, the former capital of the Confederacy, to be the dean of the Norfolk delegation now at the General Assembly. That is truly inspiring. Unfortunately, she also went to the wrong high school. She went to Booker Teeth. So I can't really, you know, I I gotta I give her a lot of credit. I I can't I can't really forget that one. But um, really, if it wasn't for her, I honestly don't think I'd be sitting here because she was so warm and open and willing to teach, and I'm sitting here willing to learn. And I'm just very, very thankful for her. So after that meeting in the Panera, I go ahead, I volunteer for her campaign in the primary. So every day after work, I leave my job in Chesapeake, I drive to the HQ in Norfolk, I pick up the literature, and I am on doors all throughout the city. That is generally what I am doing. Six or seven days out of the week, I'm going, I'm hitting doors, I'm spreading the message, I'm working, I'm essentially working as a super ball, super volunteer. Just very consistent, very reliable, making sure that we get the message out. So, you know, with her going up to the state senate, and now I have Delegate Glass, who is my delegate, and just having all of these people that are legitimately good humans, yeah, really helps to make the work that I do really, really easy. 2023, the 2023 cycle happened. My predecessor is like, you're gonna be the next president of H.R. Biden. I say, no. Absolutely not, and you're not gonna make me do it. I tell him straight up, no, find someone else. What about your vice president? Okay, well, we'll need to have a talk. They have a talk, we have a talk. I'm like, you know what? Fine. I will file just purely to say that someone filed. The filing period closes, the very next meeting. Oh, president is uncontested. And I'm like, excuse me? There's supposed to be someone else filing here. I'm supposed to be withdrawing. So I pretty much got hoodwinked into taking up leadership. But very often I tell people leadership, the best leaders often don't want to do it. And I really didn't.
SPEAKER_01But I took the main kind of a uh like backhand compliment there. Or yeah, like b backdoor compliment.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Because I really did not want to do it. I'm like, why me? I don't work in politics. My degree isn't in political science, I have no real name recognition or political capital. So I'm like, okay, look, I'm here, I'm in this space, I'm gonna do the best that I can. And I honestly, once I got my rhythm, the first 90 days was a little rough because I took up leadership and immediately had to start planning the first fundraiser under my tenure. And having to now go from being just a general member where I can just show up and do whatever, to oh, now I'm the guy. Totally different. I had trackers come to my event. Tracker is Oh, yeah, I was about to ask you what a tracker was. So, what a tracker is, it is, for example, let's just say we are of opposing parties. You are teal party, I'm yellow party. If I have someone who is strongly yellow party, I will be like, hey, you look like you could fit in with that teal party crowd. Go to their event and see what you can see and report back. Now, keep in mind, we have not had any trackers at any event now. Right. The only reason I feel like we had a tracker at that event is because we had a congressional candidate who was a sponsor of the event. They went to try to catch her hot mic and whatever, whatever. But who sent the tracker? Uh, the NRCC. So again, it is I am fresh in leadership, and now I'm having trackers come to my event. If that's not, you know, being trial by fired, I don't know what else is. So we have the event, there's a few hiccups, but we wind up raising about, I want to say about $6,500. Keep in mind, when I took over HRYD, I effectively only had $77 to pull this event off. At the start of my second term, I said, unless there is something so urgent, I am not going to run again in 2026. Leaders are only effective for a certain amount of time. Because at a certain point, certain people become complacent.
SPEAKER_01I Do you think it way the leaders or the uh like people underneath? Or both? It could be a combination of both.
SPEAKER_00I intentionally don't like surrounding myself with yes people because I want people who are we're all going to be pushing each other to be.
SPEAKER_01I think that's a bad idea.
SPEAKER_00Get it? Yeah. So I think that also I don't believe that organizations should develop around one person. They should develop around a philosophy. They should develop around an idea. If it starts feeling like this chapter, this organization is, oh, this is Ty's chapter. I've stayed too long.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So with HRYD, I served my two terms, where in my second term, I became chair of VAYD's Black Caucus. So I have a statewide title now. In addition to a local regional title, I am no longer president of HRYD. I'm still chair of Black Caucus. I decided I'm going to run for one more term. And I helped to build some things into the state constitution to make things more equitable, more just, help to serve more people, get more diversity. And with that, I was able to, I wrote 14 amendments and I was able to get 12 of them passed. Dang, man, that's a pretty good uh success right there. It wasn't anything of, oh, you're going to do this. It's about building connections. And it really comes down to what style of leader you are. I built my brand off of, I'm going to put all my stakeholders at the table. We're going to be inclusive, we're going to be intentional, and we're going to collaborate. That's where we all come at the table. We understand we're not getting everything. But when we're able to collaborate on a solution, there's buy-in from everyone. So it doesn't really feel like as big of a loss. Yeah. So that's generally how I got here with many of my titles. And being a young Dem also really helped because I was able to become vice chair of my local Dem committee. So I'm just here to serve.
SPEAKER_01It's so funny how our uh journeys were so similar yet different. Uh so very first campaign um I ever remember being involved in was elementary school. And it was the 1992 Georgia gubernatorial election. It was Zell Miller versus Guy Milner. That were those were the two candidates.
SPEAKER_00Miller versus Miller? Did you just say Miller versus Miller?
SPEAKER_01Miller versus Milner. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. So it was uh I got to pick which candidate I wanted to be, and then my best friend got to be the other candidate. So I went with the uh name that was the coolest. Zell. Obviously. Zell's so much cooler than Guy. Yeah. I uh saw I remember getting home. I'm like, hey dad, I'm uh I'm I'm one of the candidates for governor. I'm Zell Miller. He was like, you know he's a Democrat, right? And I was like, oh man, what a mmm. I realize I messed up. I grew up in a very uh conservative uh Republican house. Um so the 2004 election, that was the very first one I could vote for vote in. And I remember writing a uh writing a speech, and it being like, if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything. Yeah. And you know what though like that was kind of that attitude that like really put Bush over the finish on a thing in 04. I mean I I I see you seething a little bit.
SPEAKER_00There were some other things. I mean, are we gonna talk about, you know, a possible tasty dessert that we sh probably shouldn't mention out loud that people were accused of having? Um, in 2004?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Uh actually I'm not familiar with this. I grew up in Fox News Bubble. Oh, so you saying that? No, I actually had no idea what you were uh what you were talking about because I had a very like insular um worldview. Yeah, and in 2008, I uh this is the last time I voted uh Republican. I voted uh McCain and Palin. And I was so upset uh with the election results because I thought that it showed that we had such a such a bigger problem with women's rights than we did uh for uh civil rights. Um yeah, no, it was uh it was it it was a dark time for me. Uh it's it's okay.
SPEAKER_00We we forgive and accept.
SPEAKER_01You know what uh like started to um like fiscally change my outlook was the 2008 financial um crisis. Um and like realizing that like oh this like whole thing about like no government, like or government isn't the solution, government is the problem, like yeah, actually government can be a solution here and can really help out. And like and from there, and then also like social issues, Republicans just really shat the bed with that one. So uh I got out as quickly as I could whenever I realized just the how badly how bad it was.
SPEAKER_00You saw the tea brewing, you were like, mmm, I gotta go. Even as a good old Sonderboy, you were like, uh, this is the wrong kind of tea for me.
SPEAKER_01Well, I think what it was, uh, so I uh grew up in basically Appalachia, uh rural town that was under 20,000 people.
SPEAKER_00Oh, like what is in oh, sorry. Like what is now in about Georgia 14?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Okay. Ver yes. Uh Marjorie Taylor Green, like that actually a lot of my relatives are in her uh district now. Uh so I had graduated high school. I moved uh to Atlanta for college. That was the best thing to ever happen to me. Uh just met uh met a lot of different people from a lot of different places. And it was almost it was I think I kind of had this like had a worldview of like different was like scary, you know, like different was bad. That was that was just kind of how I had uh like associated it. But as I started to like spend time with uh with folks and I was I was oh my god. Like it we there's so much that we have in common. Like and uh you know, it's and so like once that happened, I'll like just donate that her. Oh no, like it was just it was one of those things like bigotry can't survive a an honest look at yourself and other people.
SPEAKER_00Oh, 100%. There is a guy who he states himself, I used to be a racist, I used to be a bad person, I went to prison. Is this Danny Collins? This is not Danny Collins. Oh, oh, okay. Went to prison, started interacting with the people I was told to hate, and realized everything I was taught was a lie. And now he's very prominent on social media. I've I've lost count of how many he's gone to, but he travels. Keep in mind, white dude sticks out like a bright sore thumb on these campuses. He travels all across the US to go to the different HBCUs and provides education on them. And now also provides a platform to really bring people together and kind of push out and help to eradicate racism. Um his name is George Sedberry Jr. His at is The White George with no E on the white on I think it's generally most platforms.
SPEAKER_01Oh, I yeah, okay. I've I'm actually familiar with his work. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've seen him on threads, actually. He's really good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he actually came to Hampton Homecoming. Oh, okay. And got a got a picture with him, got to talk to him a little bit. Really nice guy. And that's kind of, you know, when you said your story, I'm like, I see parallels. The only difference was, you know, you can't go to the call. I did I was about to say, I didn't get caught. It's the only uh difference. But yeah, I think that um in general, when you're able to live multiculturally and you're open to be able to talk to other people, and it's changed those ideas. That's really where I think you're able to see that there are commonalities and you're able to really build those networks with people, which again, like you said, you moved to Atlanta and your whole worldview changed. You're like, you probably didn't even do a 180, a 360, or a 740. You probably did a 1440 going around in circles like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
SPEAKER_01But yeah. Less than a week um uh from the uh Supreme Court's decision to uh basically gut the uh Voting Rights Act. And I have seen a um a lot of a lot of you know content creators uh on the uh on the left in particular, not necessarily seeing this a lost cause, but they're like, look, you're not gonna be able to get these um southern like white guys, essentially, uh, on a democratic message with just an economic populism thing if you're talking about uh you know any kind of um you know like civil rights, uh, you know, like civil justice. Um where where do you stand on that?
SPEAKER_00So really big disclaimer speaking in my personal capacity. In my personal capacity, I feel like the decision was wrong, but now it's how do we move on from here? There are people who are more concerned with power than doing the right thing. Yeah. But in Florida, how is it that within hours of this decision coming down, there is a new map? Right. We're seeing this where the I believe it is the lieutenant governor of Alabama. Alabama is a bright red state, therefore we should have a fully red. Delegation. We're seeing this in Louisiana, the very same state where the very same court ordered Louisiana to put a second majority black district in the state. And granted, Louisiana gerrymandered it to high hell. But in Louisiana, they were ordered to draw the district. Then this very same Supreme Court told the very same state your districts are illegal. And now the governor of Louisiana is doing something wholly unprecedented in suspending an election while they redo the map. There is a concerted effort that has been in this country easily since the Reagan era. And for some people, they will argue it back to April of 1865 with the defeat of the Confederacy that some people will argue that we didn't go far enough in punishing the Confederacy. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And what we're seeing now is a result of political choices that were made way back before you or I or our grandparents or our great grandparents for that matter were born. We're reaping the consequences of that almost 200 years later. So what I think is going to have to happen, and again, personal capacity. We're seeing it now in that a lot of people are seeing the Republican Party as a party for what it is. I'm not going to blame some people because some people, this is the party I was raised in. We're not racist, we're not this, we're not that. I just care about my faith. Or I care about my traditional values. Or Democrats don't care about me. Now that last one I will fundamentally disagree with. I will fundamentally disagree with that eight days of the week, 367 days of the year. But for some people, they simply cannot see a world where they do not vote for the Republican ticket. Yeah. Yeah. And with that, we some that's some people, but there's some marginal voters. Like I believe the last time I looked at the statistics, our electorate is split up into thirds, and we have a third of the electorate that is considered independent. Before we go and take a hard pivot to the right, why don't we focus on the things that we have done as Democrats and talk about, yes, we passed the CHIPS Act, we passed the Inflation Reduction Act. That stimulus that you got during COVID, that was because of Nancy Pelosi, a speaker of the House. We honestly need to get our messaging together and we need to start acting like it and telling people what we've done. Now, places where we shoot ourselves in the foot, a lot of the times because our tent is easily about the size of three city blocks, we have so many, yeah, we have so many moderate dooms who are like, I will not vote for this if it's not means tested. When things become means tested, they're often slow to roll out. The effects take a while to come down. Like we're starting to see some effects from Biden era policy, but based off of everything else, they've taken so long to roll out that they've kind of been mitigated by other extenuating circumstances. For as much as I pay in taxes, if I help some people who don't need it, I'm not that upset. Right. I would much rather have my tax money going to helping more people that may not necessarily need it in some circumstances than my tax money. I'm still paying the same amount of taxes, but now more people are getting less. Yeah. Unfortunately, it is an economic message. I know that in 2024, I saw the signs Kamala high taxes, Trump low taxes, Kamala crime, Trump safety. Yeah. I saw those signs everywhere. Especially Virginia Beach. Uh where um I saw those signs everywhere. A lot of the times, as Democrats, we are defensive on messaging. Yeah. Like we are waiting to respond and we're allowing other people to tell the story for us instead of us setting the tone and delivering a message of this is what we're going to do. This is what we've done. And here's how it has benefited you. Now, I'm not saying we need Instagram posts about this long, because I remember in 2025, the party was putting out statements that were easily able to fill this entire wall right here. No one's gonna read that. Right. We need short, simple, to the point. What did Democrats do today? Or what did Democrats do this week? What did Democrats do this month? Give me three big points. Because you know messaging, we're not dealing with the messaging market that I think the party is still stuck in. Yeah. We don't have the luxury of the general messaging apparatus that the Republicans do. Because I mean, look at how big the Joe Rogan podcast is.
SPEAKER_01Right. Why do you think that there's such a like a like a heavy emphasis, especially on the right, with like the podcasts and like, you know, like really amplifying those voices, whereas on the left, it seems like there is absolutely nothing. The threshold.
SPEAKER_00Enter act out. The um Honestly, I think it's because we as a party are looking for credentials, whereas other groups are not necessarily requiring that same level of credentialing. I mean, if they did, there wouldn't be anybody. Like for me, arguably, I should not be on this podcast by way of my education. I don't have a degree in politics or law. So for some, I'm not a reliable source. He doesn't mean that. But, you know, for people on the other side, I am engaged, I'm energetic, I generally sound like I know what I'm talking about. I do. People who present well poll well for certain audiences, while certain other audiences are like, what do you know and how accurate is it? And you need to show me the facts. Yeah. That is true. And like the legitimate facts, not you know, your facts that you just conveniently came up with to justify your point.
SPEAKER_01So that kind of goes back to the Democrats being the uh the ten of three city blocks. Yes. I didn't think about it like that before, but you're right.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And I don't mean like little small blocks, I mean like three New York City blocks, like the big one. Yeah. And that's where a lot of it kind of comes down to. And there was something that I know you and I had a conversation about. When dealing with messaging, you have activators and validators. Like for me, in certain instances, I'm an activator. I can put that seed in four people of, you know, I never thought about it that way. That makes sense. I should probably consider doing XYZ. But you have those people, I can activate you. And you might be like, yeah, I think I want to do something. But when you get a validator who says, yes, that message is correct, that gets people way more involved because it comes from a trusted source. Like for me, I am a larger activator because of the positions that I hold and the experiences that I have. And in my immediate network, I am a very strong validator because these people know me. So they'll frequently ask me, what are your thoughts on X? What are your thoughts on, for example, the news broke today. The Supreme Court put a stay on a lower courts ruling allowing Miffer Prestone to go through mail. So I had people that were like, Is this true? Is this real? And I'm like, yes, it's real. You only have a week, though. Yeah. So, you know, that's where, and I think everyone has the ability to be a validator. Do you have to like know the people in order to be a validator? I would say validators really are people that you know. Okay. Because, again, your circle knows you. They know Adam. I could say one thing to them and they'll be like, okay, yeah, that sounds fine. But if you're like, no, he has a point and here's how, because X, Y, Z, blah, blah, blah, then you're able to validate the message that I'm given, which then spreads it and confirms it with your friends because we all have confirmation bias to people we know. Yeah. We all have confirmation bias to people we know. And you will be much more effective to the people that you know versus me. I, going back to 2023 when I was canvassing people, I actually wound up knocking on the door of one of my mom's friends. And she stopped and she was like, okay, explain to me what's going on in this particular election. I was like, Well, I'm volunteering for delegate Angela Williams Graves, who is running to be your next state senator. She is in a primary with city councilwoman Andrea McClellan. So we had that whole name thing going on too, where it was like Angela versus Andrea. And we were like, so like, I had some people ask some really crass questions like, uh, are you working for the black lady? And I'm like, yeah, I'm working for the black lady. Okay, okay, yeah, I got you. Okay, thank you. So she was a little tuned out, but because she knew me, I was able to validate a lot of what was going on. I told her, okay, this is what's going on. I'm gonna tell you, not in my volunteer capacity first. I'm gonna give you the unvarnished, here are the bare bones facts. There is an election going on. The election day is going to be the third Tuesday in June. I think it was June 17th that year, but don't quote me. You can vote now. We have early vote. Now, this primary is determining who your delegate is going to be. So she was like, I had no idea an election was even going on. And because the maps have been redrawn, a lot of times that was the first time many people had even been canvassed. It was like, you know, I'm gonna look into her. If you're working for her, I feel like she is the right choice. Yeah. But when it comes to messaging, it's more about, hey, yeah, this person is saying things that I also agree are correct. And especially if you have the facts to back it up, confirmation bias doesn't even really matter when you're looking at something in a factual manner. I would tell people delegate Angela Williams Graves is already working with DLS to get legislation done on your behalf. She's already in Richmond, she's built the connections, and it will be a very seamless transition for her to serve. And I would hope you would vote for her in the primary and again in November. It is simply when I was looking at both of them on paper, now Senator Williams Graves, one resonated more with me as a voter, and two, I felt had a better grasp on a lot of the issues. And you know, living in Hampton Roads, gun violence has been a really big thing. It it still is kind of a thing. And with that, like the messaging was good. The people, again, those other validators, like for example, Bobby Scott is a validator for generally this entire region. He really is, man.
SPEAKER_01I everyone, even like the senator, like uh uh Senator Kane, Senator Warner, I speak with like almost in reverence of uh of Bobby Scott. It's uh it's it's unreal.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah, he's the dean of the Virginia congressional delegation. He's been serving in Virginia politics. When we abolished the death penalty, he said, I did not think I would be alive when we did this. And that's not a sighted Bobby Scott at all, but it's just a matter of how much this man has worked and given of himself. Not to mention I secretly feel like he has clones because he's everywhere.
SPEAKER_01I I I've only been involved in Norfolk uh Democratic politics for uh maybe a like month and a half or something. I have seen him more than I think anybody else. It's Unreal, man, just about every event he's there.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yes. The the running joke is Bobby Scott secretly is able to teleport. Because how does he get from Newport News to Norfolk, to Portsmouth, to Hampton, to somewhere else in Chesapeake? How do you do this? Because, and I know again, I sound like I'm contradicting myself from earlier. He's effective. He's not a complacent leader, he's effective, he's committed, and he does the actual work.
SPEAKER_01Very unassuming personality. He's not gonna go in and try to like dominate the room or anything.
SPEAKER_00No, he's very relaxed. Here's what I'm working on in Washington, here's what's going on in Washington, here's what I'm doing for you. Does anyone have any questions? And he'll sit and speak and answer as many questions as his schedule will allow before he winds up needing to actually leave to get somewhere else, which I forever will have respect for Congressman Bobby Scott, 100%.
SPEAKER_01So it seems like with your theory of activators and validators, anybody can be a validator. If you all you need to have is a network and a cause that you're committed to, essentially.
SPEAKER_00You can be a validator for hey, should we have an HOA? No. Oh speaking as someone with an architect degree, no. Do HOAs are yeah, bad experience. But um, or you know, you could be a validator for a civic matter, which to go on to a further point, people say that, oh, I don't do politics. That means I vote Republican. I didn't say that. But um politics is the wider sphere and one subset of the general policy making process. So you may not do politics, but you do policy. I enjoy having good quality schools, even though I do not have children. I enjoy when we have good quality public education because education is a right, and everyone deserves the to be able to receive an education. Yeah. A thorough quality education.
SPEAKER_01The community benefits from public education. I'm to me that should be like just accepted on its face.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. I also thoroughly believe certain utilities are 100% right. Water is a right, electricity in today's modern age has to kind of be a right.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Now, do we have the political capital to necessarily make it a right? Uh I wouldn't necessarily go that far. If anyone from a certain company that has a blue and white logo that covers the service area, I promise I'm not coming for you. But we are gonna have to have a talk about your friends that are using a lot of power because our bills are high. But, you know, if if we have to share in the bill, we should like share in the profits. Oh, yeah. And you know, we're still having debates at the state level over the budget, of which one of the issues of debate is should data centers continue to get that $1.6 billion tax credit? That money has to come from somewhere. Because why are they able to get a tax credit and they're using all of this electricity and all of the potable water? And what benefit are we reaping of that? Everyday Virginians are bearing the cost of decisions that we really did not have any say in because this tax credit is a holdover from the Yuncan administration. Now, I'm not saying I'm anti-business, I'm pro-smart business growth. That's a good message. I I you you practice that one. Oh, no. No, that's just who I am as a person. I am very strongly anti-racist. I don't believe that anyone is better than anybody based off of the color of their skin, but I also still believe that black lives matter because there's an implicit to it there. Right. And that's also one of those things that gets lost in the messaging. I am not, you know, anti-life. I am pro-choice. And I find it absolutely hilarious that the people chanting for small government are trying to be involved in the uterus of every woman in America. Yeah. That to me is absolutely hilarious. Because it's not about government. Oh no, it's never about government. It's completely about control. Let's look at Norfolk. Have you looked at Norfolk's map on Zillow at all, especially around the downtown area? Um, not lightly. At one point in time, you could look at the Zillow map at the 264 Fish Bowl Interchange, the 264-464 interchange, you could actually see the plots of where people's houses used to be, that when the freeway was installed, they eminent domain the land, will those the houses and put the freeway through. It is a policy decision that, in my opinion, has had a very a detrimental effect to the fabric of my city. But I do not know a Norfolk where that doesn't exist. Right. Honestly, probably look at the demographics of how Willoughby Smith looked in the 60s and look at who owned property there.
SPEAKER_01It it always boils down to race.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah. Like in and this is one of those things because certain things are policy decisions that aren't political. And certain things are political decisions that are not policy.
SPEAKER_01But how can anything involved in politics not be political? You know, like I I feel like every even policy that should not be political inevitably has politics attached to it.
SPEAKER_00Because realistically, I'm sure you and I, we both vote the same way. Do we necessarily have an agreement on what we think the personal property tax rate should be in Norfolk? That's why I'm like political decisions, very shallow. A policy decision. Okay, the policy is voting overall. How much easier do we want to make it for people to vote? In Virginia, we went from being one of the hardest states to vote in to one of the easiest states to vote in. The overarching message that some people that are neither you or I nor would they agree with us very much is the Democrats have made it too easy to vote in Virginia. When turnout is low, who wins? Usually the uh Republican. When the weather is bad, who wins? Republican. If Hurricane Isabel could come back outside, a Republican voter is going to stand in that line and make sure they voted. Probably live stream the whole thing. Exactly. They're gonna call Jim Cantorian. But for Dems, I will say this black people do not go outside in bad weather. Like if the weather is bad, it's very much I'm not going. You know, there's weather elements. Sometimes our base is fractured. Again, our tent is so huge.
SPEAKER_01The redistricting uh referendum is actually a pretty good example of that. Oh.
SPEAKER_00I have done so much data on that. Okay. Adam, I could make your head spin with the data that I pulled, the numbers that I pulled, and just like looking at where things are. The I actually did write a report up for N C D Cm. Turnout in the referendum election was 38%. Turnout in 2025 for the gubernatorial was 44% in Norfolk. Okay. So only down six percent. So it was a two-point shift to the right, but a shift nonetheless. Of those six precincts that we lost on election day, we only wound up losing two once they counted mail in and early out.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. But I I don't know how much you can take from that point of like saying that uh we've like moved to the right. I don't I I wouldn't necessarily take that as like the electorate is as shifted to the right. I think that's very like an issue-specific.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, because there were some Dems who said, no, I'm not voting for this. And I get it. Like I 100% do. When I got in the voting booth, I I was like, okay, I'm gonna go vote yes. And then I got in the booth and I'm like, under normal circumstances. Because I voted for the amendment in 2020 to reduce the gerrymandering. So I'm like I'm really voting against myself here, but this is one of those break glass moments of look, there's a tool here and this is an emergency. I'm going to use it at this point. So I get it. But also to your point, on its surface, if you only look at just purely what the numbers are, yes, on paper the electorate shifted two points to the right. However, when we look at turnout, the turnout drop-off, about one in five Dems in Norfolk who voted in 2025 did not vote in the referendum, versus about one in 20 Republicans. So the turnout drop-off for each party was different. So that's what makes it give the appearance of, yeah, the elector shifted two points to the right. In general, you see that based on a demographic level, communities that are less diverse tend to be more conservative.
SPEAKER_01So I'll so I uh uh I worked with at uh the Maury precinct uh on election day. And so I wanted to look at the numbers. And uh I think that there was a I looked at Kamala's uh performance and at Maury versus the uh yes vote. And I think that uh I think that it had shifted. Like I I think we had uh like Kamala was like plus seven, you know, like was 73, 28, something like that. Yeah. And then uh the uh for voting same day, you know, voting day, it was like 70% voted yes to like 29% or whatever voting no. So there was, I think there was like a three or four point drop at uh at Mori.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01I mean you're gonna see not due to lack of effort.
SPEAKER_00Oh, trust no, no. And trust me, as as Vice Chairman for Times, I thank you for your service. To put it in perspective, it is not a presidential, it is not a federal midterm, it is not a gubernatorial, and it was not a state midterm. Yeah. So it is an off, off, off, off-cycle election put at a time when many people were like, I didn't even know that we were voting. And I'm like, You haven't noticed a very gray Barack Obama on TV telling you to vote yes by April 21st.
SPEAKER_01He is in his Silver Fox era though.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he is like, look, we defrosted Barack Obama to tell you to go vote. That man is supposed to be living his best life. I don't know whether he's in Chicago or Hawaii. The point is he is a private citizen minding his business, enjoying life.
SPEAKER_01I think he uh also is running a podcasting network. Uh, shout out higher grounds. Um, I love to be on higher ground. Hey, just to let you know.
SPEAKER_00So, hey, if he is running a podcasting network, great. If you listen to A Promised Land, then listen to Nancy Pelosi's book, and then also listen to Becoming, you'll hear the same story told in several different perspectives. And I will tell you. Some people did some very not good things that come out in the Pelosi book. I'm not gonna name names, you have to listen to us, but somebody decided they were going to be on their own page and they were not in formation with what everyone wanted. So that was definitely pretty interesting.
SPEAKER_01She uh she got me one time with uh the first time I'd ever heard it, but she's like, well, yeah, uh, you know, someone had like given a story about, you know, well, my niece was a victim of DI or whatever. She's like, well, the plural of anecdote is data, so blah, blah, blah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I um see it because also a lot of people just look at Nancy Pelosi and see, you know, a woman in her 80s.
SPEAKER_01She was vilified so like she was the villain of my like political formative years, essentially.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah, because here's the thing. She was a woman who was a Democrat from Deep Blue, California.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Who told it like it was, and like you said, took no prisoners.
SPEAKER_01So you had the three uh like the three stories of uh Barack Obama and uh Nancy Pelosi. Yeah, Michelle. Yeah. And they like it was told the same story, but just in three different ways.
SPEAKER_00Yes. So with that, to tie it back in general, that's how I think a lot of people view their politics. Their politics are very personal. I know some things about you that may have a weight on your politics. I'm not gonna disclose them because, again, I don't know what you've told these people. Oh man, I'm an open book, man. You can say whatever. So, okay, you are you are married, you have a child, you have chosen to live in a city where it floods with when the sun shines. Yes. But and there, it's one of those like stereotypically, I'm taking a stab in the dark here, and I'm going to say that growing up in the South, you may be Baptist.
SPEAKER_01I was actually a um a Pentecostal. Yeah, fundamentalist Pentecostal. Uh yeah, where you're like you would uh be like uh like slain in the spirit, uh speaking in tongues, uh and uh it was very much like uh rapture-oriented where you know, like Jesus could come back before the end of this sermon. Are you uh are you ready to go to heaven? Um so yeah, it was uh super hardcore.
SPEAKER_00It's taking a lot of therapy. So if you would like a talkspace account, I'm kidding, I'm kidding, I'm kidding. But um I would say just based off of like some of the quick demographic reads, you and I should not be having the conversation in the manner that we're having. But again, that shift in perspective, like when you moved to Atlanta, when George Sedberry spent some time with people he would not have normally associated with under different circumstances. Like those are things that fundamentally shift a lot of your perspective and have influence on your politics. For me, when I was getting ready to graduate from high school, I wanted to go as far away from home as possible. I applied to six colleges. I only applied to Hampton because the application was free. Because I was like, I'm ready to get out of this area. And when I was telling people, oh, I want to major in architecture, oh well, what about Fam U? Mm-mm-mm. What about um what about Howard? Mm-mm-mm. I'm like, I would rather want to be in I will I want to be in a student body that is more reflective of America. Granted, my politics were I was still I was still a dim. I was more moderate of a dim, but I was still a dim. And I'm like, and I'll I'll admit this, 17-year-old me was like, why would I want to go to an HBCU? I had been influenced by many other people to believe that those schools were less than. And that my talents would be better utilized and engaged at a PWI. PWI is kind of predominantly white institutions. Ah, okay. So in, and I'm also a little bit of an education policy nerd. Ask me more about my student loans, and I will tell you how much I know about that outside of a 20. But um, there's HBCUs, there's PWIs, and there's MSI and already servicing institutions. ODU is an example of an MSI. So is I believe it's Towson. So I applied to six schools. I applied to Hampton because it was free. And my homegirl said, Oh, come over, we're just gonna watch a movie, you know, get some snacks, whatever. She brings me in the house, she shuts, locks the door, puts a laptop in front of me, and stands in front of the door and says, You're not leaving until you finish this application. So technically, I was kidnapped and held against my will, but it's fine. I applied to Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech, um, Washington University, St. Louis.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Dude, I applied to Georgia Tech and Washington University in St. Louis too.
SPEAKER_00I applied to Renslayer Polytechnic, Pratt Institute, and there is oh yeah, that's six. So yeah. I applied to those six. Five of those said no, including Washington University in St. Louis, even though they had been sending me mail since my junior year. Like they were like, oh my God. They blew me up too. That's the only reason why I went to go visit Virginia Tech. They're having like an engineering day, and I'm still kind of making my mind up of do I want to be an engineer or do I want to go into architecture? So I go to the engineering day, I meet someone, and I'm like, hey, I know I'm here for the engineering day, but I am interested in the architecture program. And she's like, Okay, well, tell me, you know, a little bit more about yourself. Like, what's your GPA? What are you doing? So I say, you know, I currently have, as of my last GPA calc, my GPA was 3.25. And she looked at me straight up and said, Oh, honey, you're not getting in. Like, point blank. I immediately stop talking. My whole group is surprised. And apparently, again, this is told to me in retelling. My mother sees this other student, this other prospective student. He immediately looks at his parents and says, I don't want to go here because I don't like how she said that to him. I don't like how she dismissed him. And needless to say, we got out of Dodge after that because there was no real point. And I'm like, I kind of don't want to go here either, but I still kept my application open out of spite. They said no. So she wasn't wrong. But it was she could have said a little better. Yeah, like, I mean, hey, I'm I'm 17. I think the world is my oyster. You're just like, no. But um, to circle back to George Tech, George Tech not only told me no, they told me no twice because I asked for them to reconsider my their decision because they're like, my GPA went up. I went from a 3.25 to a 3.35. And they were like, you're applying with a 1660 SAT, a 27 on your ACT, and four AP courses. While this does show academic strength, our average applicant for your class has a 2200 on the SAT. A like 33 on the ACT, 33 or 34 on the ACT, and nine AP courses scored four or five. Unfortunately, we don't believe that the academic rigor that we provided, Georgia Tech, is suitable for you to be successful. And I'm just like, did you just call me stupid?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Did you become more liberal uh your time at Hampton? Or would you say that you're uh because you said that you were kind of like a centrist Democrat whenever you got it?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I was a more moderate before I went to college. And now my pol my politics have shifted, and I'm I would consider myself a pragmatic progressive. Being at Hampton, my politics definitely shifted because I thought I had it rough growing up. But hearing the stories of the people that I made friends with and I was acquainted with in all that they did and how they were able to overcome a lot of what they went through, I'm like, oh my God, no one should have to go through anything like that. Yeah. And then, furthermore, just generically as a college student, yeah, I have student loans. I walked across the stage and walked into like $49,000 worth of debt. So that was the one thing that really had me fired up because you went to school. Did you do you still have loans or are you a special?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, man. So I funny enough, um, for my undergrad, uh, first time in my life I ever got on a plane. I flew to uh to Oregon for a wedding. I uh sat down and I talked to this uh woman, she was like 94, 95 at the time. And she was like, What do you want to do? And I, you know, I told her, Oh, I, you know, I want to get into politics and I, you know, I want to go to like law school. And she's like, you know what? I want to help you out. I was like, thank you very much. That is so kind of you. Uh and then whenever I got home, my mom was like, Did you meet somebody named Barbara? Um, and I was like, uh yeah. She's like, you know, she's paying for your college, right? And uh I was like, wait, where is she at? She passed, uh, unfortunately. But uh she paid for all four years of my undergrad at a private university. So, like, probably paid over $120,000 for me.
SPEAKER_00Oh, you do not have to say anything about a private university. Hampton is private, I know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Ooh. But I did go to law school and she didn't pay for law school. So I am heavily in debt, but not because of under.
SPEAKER_00Okay, well, still, thank you, Barbara, for what you were able to do for this man right here. My focus has shift shifted a lot because I mean, I didn't think that in my lifetime I would see major portions of my friends lose their rights. Yeah. I'm still remembering what I was doing in June of 2022 when the Dobbs decision broke and calling my female friends, and some of them were in tears. Yeah. That is something that should get you fired up. And then you have Texas with SB8 that says, even if you leave the state, we'll prosecute you and the doctor who did it out of state. In general, we're hearing from the right, certain crimes do not matter if certain people commit them.
SPEAKER_01Right, yeah, yeah. It is very interesting whenever uh like you will talk to a uh a Trump supporter and you will, you know, like say the things that they've done. And at first they uh there'll be a denial. There's no way he did that. Uh and then from there it kind of gets into a minimalization. Well, it's not that bad. Right. It's not that bad. And then like other side, and like, well, what about you know the Democrats and the pizza gate or what, you know, like it just and so you can see like it's your br the your brain doesn't like to have that like cognitive dissonance. Oh, no. And the hoops that they jump through to make to make it seem like this guy is legit is uh crazy. There's a difference between confirming what the facts are and confirming what your worldview is.
SPEAKER_00Correct. There is a huge difference between the two. Everyone has a bias, and they all are terrible. Because I had a project, and this is where, funnily enough, my first year professor said architecture is like politics. It's full of sex and death. And I looked at him like he was stupid. Now, as someone who has worked in and still actively spends time in the political space, he's not really wrong. I I really feel like a lot of people would respect a lot of our elected officials more if they were able to sit and confidently be like, yeah, I was wrong. Yeah. You have to be willing to give people some levels. People who are humans. Exactly. The only person I would expect to be a 100% field expert on is the person who invented the field.
SPEAKER_01And even then, not for much longer. Yeah. You have made Camden really mad, man. Oh, yeah. Actually, I think we're going up on a couple hours. Oh, yeah. But the conversation was just so good. I've I've enjoyed this, man. You're going to have to come back on sometime. It was great to be here. Uh, but thank you very much for acting out with me. Absolutely no problem.