The Little Yellow Jacket
The Little Yellow Jacket Podcast is hosted by Verran Rose, Spiritual Psychotherapist, Trauma Specialist, Breathwork Coach, and Creator of the Conscious Balance Coaching Program, alongside co-host Surinder Bains, Level 3 Conscious Balance Coach, Workshop and Retreat Creator.
Together, they explore the path of personal transformation—diving into shadow work, trauma, addiction, abuse, and healing. Through honest conversations and lived experience, this podcast supports deeper self-awareness and the power of reconnecting with your authentic self.
✨ New episodes exploring healing, consciousness, and personal growth.
The Little Yellow Jacket
Faith
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Welcome back to the podcast. In today’s episode, we’re going somewhere deep and real—from brokenness and trauma to spirituality, religion, faith, and ultimately, peace.
We’ll talk about the moments that break us, the wounds we carry, the questions we ask when life doesn’t make sense, and the journey of finding something greater than ourselves along the way.
This isn’t about having all the answers. It’s about being honest about the struggles, exploring what we believe, and discovering whether faith can bring light into some of our darkest moments.
So, wherever you are on your journey, take a breath, get comfortable, and join us for a conversation about healing, belief, and finding peace.”
Are you still there? Hello everyone. Good evening and welcome to the Little Yellow Jacket. I'm Sarinda and welcome to my co-host Veren over in Montenegro.
SPEAKER_00Good evening, everyone. Just to let you know I'm melting. Absolutely melting.
unknownGosh.
SPEAKER_00Good evening, everyone.
SPEAKER_02How hot is it for you?
SPEAKER_00Uh today in the garden the thermometer got to 42.
SPEAKER_02Oh, crikey. Well, we've got rain actually, so we're celebrating too, I imagine. I wish.
SPEAKER_00We've got rain forever and have rain since my prayers for it. Oh gosh.
SPEAKER_02All right, so over to you, Serena. Yeah, so I wanted to um talk today um about um a little, I think a little bit about my journey and where I am today. Um I think like as with most people, I think oftentimes you know we are looking to ourselves and we're you know trying to make changes and we don't realise how far we've come. And I certainly that I was exactly, you know, that um always sort of thinking, oh I'm going backwards if something uh didn't work out or if I'd learnt something and hadn't put it into practice. And then last week, um Tinder, I mean, I just really this is this is this is God working. Um I just went to the supermarket nine o'clock at night, which I never ever ever do. And in this aisle was another person, and I was looking at actually bottled water, and then this friend, this girl woman turned around and went, surrender! And we haven't seen each other for seven years. Yeah, literally seven years. Anyway, we met up and uh went for a drink last week and she said, Oh, tell me about your life, you know, because when last time I saw you, the kids were younger and you were doing such and such. And what was amazing is um, and this is this is literally, I say, a gift from God, that she witnessed actually um how far I'd come and what I was doing with my life now. And it was such a big moment for me because I constantly do, like I say, with like most people thinking, oh, you know, I've still got work to do on myself and everything. No, actually, I'm I am actually in a really, really good space and place. You know, I we we're doing this podcast, I'm doing coaching, I do some retreats at home, I'm a single, independent, successful woman. And I just needed the mirror, really, I think, to show me that. And I think I want I I I wanted to talk about that because I think so many people are really struggling with, you know, where they're at or um how far they've come or not be actually not being present and content in their lives. Um, do you know what I mean? And I thought, you know, if we chatted a little bit about that, I might just give people sort of encouragement um really um to understand, well, it's that acceptance, isn't it? To to to yeah, accept what where they where they are and and be happy with it. Um yeah.
SPEAKER_00So it's so it's gorgeous to hear that when there's space in a relationship and you bump into somebody and you really realize you're a totally different person. Right. That's what you're saying. She saw you as a totally different person.
SPEAKER_02Yes, yes, exactly. Actually, thank you for yeah, because she asked me um how the kids were, she knew she knew the boys, and um because the kids are in the same class, and I said and explained, and I said, you know what, they're leading their lives abroad, and actually it's my time now. Oh wow, you know, and I said, I'm not, you know, weeping because they've all gone and everything. I'm actually now is my time, and this is what I want to do with him, and I want to travel, and I want to do these things, and then you know what else am I doing? And it and I think yeah, that it was it it just did something to me, I think. It just shocked me awake, probably, I think.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, brought you into the present moment, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Brought you into the now. I think it was really interesting when you're about something that you said that a lot of people you know don't witness how far they come. I call it the the never enoughness syndrome. And do you do you see that not just in yourself, but when you're out and about, or you're listening to people, are they always so what are they talking about? Are they are they talking about their content? Actually they're proud of themselves, or are they always talking about generally what they're not doing or what they've got to be doing next? What do you find?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, exactly that. I think how I mean how many people actually say, Hey, I'm in a great space, actually. I mean, in fact, I don't even think I put it like that. I I think I just sort of um you know just explained and said and shared, you know, what I was doing. But no, most people are striving for something. Um, but I you know, even people who have everything are striving for something. You know, they might have the car, the house, the wife, the children, husband, um, you know, money, whatever, but they're still also they're still striving, you know, there's still like something's missing. I don't think anybody ever does. It's the is that must that's the human condition, surely.
SPEAKER_00I think that's the the human program that we've discussed in the last two podcasts is well actually all the podcasts is we're programmed to think that that we are the lowest version of ourself, whether what we touched upon religiously, spiritually, you know, what we look like, what we earn, our academic scores. Nothing is ever enough.
SPEAKER_02And and we're conditioned uh uh in that right from the beginning. Right from the beginning. You know, everything is so competitive, isn't it? Within families, a school. I mean, school's terrible actually, you know, the education system work, and um I just it's a distraction, isn't it? It's a distraction, just keep us all sort of I I mean I'm I'm you know, that's where I take it, sort of dumbed down so we don't like, you know, become better versions of ourselves or happier or content.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there's this um there's some things going on now with within psychology where I think it's becoming more apparent that people have been trying to self-abandon for a performative version of themselves. And you know, if you want to go back, it surrenders as much as you're comfortable. This is your floor tonight, this is your space. About how you experience yourself when you are highly performative. You know, what was happening to you mentally and spiritually, if if you feel comfortable enough sharing that to where you are now.
SPEAKER_02So I think because I was um programmed by my family at the age of 11 to look after the younger siblings because we didn't have much money, and my mum had to work and you know, wash dishes and clean and you know, in offices and things like that. So that my programming always was to, you know, I don't have any need, so I've got to be there for everyone. So that's performative, isn't it? Um, you know, so I just as everyone knows by now, you know, I've just went through life like that, collecting waves and strays and thinking, you know, it's my need to be needed, really. And um, but you know, and and giving so much. I mean, you know, I'm just constantly giving. Um, if people came to my house, I was just doing the Indian thing, you know, by um, you know, you know, you must eat something while you're here, join me for lunch or join me for a cup of tea or baking. And you know, I'm just I was constantly giving, giving, giving. And but what I didn't realise is that I was dying every day, actually, by doing that. And I didn't think I had any needs. I thought I'd be okay. I mean, like so many mums, and I'm you know, a lot of um men as well, it's not just women. And I thought that was like what I was here for. Um, and it's selfish to think about yourself. And I um and I wasn't happy. I was not, I was I was enjoying, let's say, you know, homemaking, I was enjoying um seeing friends or you know, organising little groups and things like that. But yes, you say they're performative, but I was going to bed. Oh hold your breath, everyone. I was going to bed every night thinking I don't want to wake up tomorrow morning, actually. I think the world would be a better better place without me. That's called suicide ideation, isn't it? And that's part of the condition of um BPD. Um and a lot of people who have ADHD also have BPD, don't they?
SPEAKER_00Um comorbidity.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Um and it just was getting worse and worse and worse. And even, you know, the good things I was doing, and even if somebody came, you know, you know, some of the kids' friends would come and chat, and you know, you'd sort of struggling a bit, and you'd sort of you know give them some advice and you know, can give them a hug, give them some, you know, bit a piece of cake, you know, still it just never really made me happy. And something was missing. And I'd I d and I don't know, you know, I was filling myself up with food, I'm you know, I'd eat, I'd I don't, you know, I I'm I'm I'm I had that's my addiction. It's it's you know, baking and stuff is not alcohol or anything like that, drugs. And so I was just sort of stuffing my emotions down, really. But um, and thinking actually, but also feeling bad for for feeling like that, because outwardly I looked, you know, we're very happy family. I mean, I met somebody the other day who worked at our school and said, Oh yeah, your children are really bright and they're doing this, that, and the other, and what a great family! And I wanted to say to her, if only you knew.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02So yeah, that's how that's what my life was like. Um, but I thought, you know, it's so it's good, it's good enough because actually, you know, I'm providing something and I'm being what I came here to do, which was never to be me or to, you know, transcend anything. It it was, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Something really powerful, so for those that don't know um about yourself or myself, is that borderline personality disorder, which is what BPD is for those that may have not listened to it before. Is something that happens when you're very young before the age of seven, generally can happen older, but generally it's the age of seven. Before that when a child cannot cope with its environment, and it splits between the performative version which you so eloquently described, and it's normally a very easy empathic, gentle part that wants to keep loving people and loving people, but it has split from its authentic self, so it doesn't give love to itself at all. So there's two versions there's the giver, and then there's the one that wants to die. And I think that's kind of what you just you I heard you describe is in the day I'm this, but by night I'm this. There's two versions of me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and actually when we were training, um I remember we had to write about a split, and actually I and that you've just reminded me actually, and so the outward one is what how everybody saw me, you know, happy, successful, lovely kids, you know, sociable, doing this, that, and the other, and um, you know, getting yeah, whatever, helping out at school, everything, everything. But the other one, oh my gosh, was thinking, um, I'm a fraud. Um, if people, this is actually this is the horrible thing, and I'm sure so many people must um feel this. Um, if people really knew me, they wouldn't like me. Oh my gosh, so tragic, you know, and um actually I'm mean because I have mean thoughts, you know, because I want to hurt people. Um, and the hurting isn't because I mean it's because you're malicious, it's because it's a it's an um it's a reactive thing, isn't it? It's people hurt you and you don't know how to respond, so you actually want to hurt them back, isn't it? It's that sort of you know, it's that sort of thing. It doesn't make you a bad person. Yeah, it doesn't make you a bad person, it's that your response sort of thing. Um yeah, absolutely. You're yeah, it that's that's what it was. It was two people and um yeah, and the the the the other one was running the life with the sort of like say, you know, eating too much or um you know overdoing, not sitting down, not whatever, um, you know, letting people, you know, in some ways walk all walk over me and actually, you know, being in a relationship that wasn't actually working for me, but was working for the other person. Yeah, yeah. So that's yeah, that's what my life was like actually, until I then decided I really, really, really need to work on myself and you know, have some therapy and really actually do you know what's come to my mind? It's almost like it's a tangle of you know, sort of wires, knitting wool wires, you name it. You know, sometimes we have drawers full of stuff, don't we? Like, you know, cables and that. It was a real love, slow and beautiful process of untangling everything, and actually, you know, one day saying to myself, gosh, I'm actually not a bad person.
SPEAKER_00Yes, absolutely, and there's no need to consent to these lower thoughts or these lower relationships, you know, and to and to bring it back just a bit if we can to BPD, it's a huge part of the work that we do. Um and for anyone that's listening, if this is striking a chord, I think to a certain degree most people have a form of BPD where they are something to the world and something to themselves. I really do believe that as we become more disconnected in a very, very narcissistic world. But what we're actually talking about, something we both experience is deeply and profoundly is the the internal self-hatred and shame that is so easily triggered. You know, if someone doesn't turn up on time or somebody doesn't message back or you know, you you feel left out or you don't feel good enough or you can pay yourself, you you can really, really spiral to some quite scary places. Very, very scary places, and uh you know, I know if it's okay to you know, I've seen you in those places. Yeah, I've so I get you in those places. And it's very distressing when you hear somebody that's got so much life to live that's not being lived, and it's just a belief system that you had and the distress that you used to be in. I mean, it's horrific to watch people go through this and it it's just belief systems.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, actually for you, you know, you uh you the amount of clients you you know see every day and um well every week, you know, and all the the lifetime that you've been doing it, I mean you must I mean it must be heartbreaking actually. It must be absolutely heartbreaking.
SPEAKER_00It is, it is because it was you know with with yourself and you know, later on that compassion for myself, but it is terrific when people come into a therapeutic space. There's a they're already performing in the space because they don't want to be rejected by the therapist, that it ruins me every time. And to hear the way they talk about themselves, then it's so difficult for them to say, you know, I did well, or I'm proud of myself, or you know, I I tried this, you know, even if it's something simple, like some people can't sit in a coffee shop and have a coffee by themselves. And that one time they try and do it, it's like to be proud of that. Yeah, yeah. You know, I find it so up to that. I mean, you know, I do, I find it horrific when I listen to people, and there's no real connection to a good internal mirror, all the validation that comes from other people, and when you don't have discernment and you consent to lower relationships, as you've described in previous podcasts and and tonight, those mirrors aren't good.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. Actually, I remember you saying, you know, you have to be really careful who you have in your life, because if especially with somebody someone like with ADHD, they don't have that internal mirror, do they? So they are actually depending on people around them. And actually, if people haven't got your best interest at heart, and I'm sorry, but I had really now, you know, in all these decades, I'm beginning to wonder how many people do have your best interest at heart. And actually, people aren't, you know, if they're mirroring well, they're you know, showing you that actually, oh, you did that, and actually that doesn't make you a nice person, or you didn't this do this well enough, or you know, you've done this, or you haven't supported me enough, even though you've kind of, you know, as you said, donated a kidney, and then you just take it from that, you just take it, don't you? That that's you, that's what you build up. Um it's almost like you're yeah, I suppose what you're doing is it's all you're you're you're just collecting, gosh, it's horrible. You are collecting other people's versions of you to understand yourself or to make yourself, aren't you? Until you stop.
SPEAKER_00That's brilliant. Yeah, that's excellent.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So what does that analogy actually isn't it? You're collect you're collecting like that that data, that information to form your own identity. Love that. I'm gonna use that in sessions and pretend it's mine.
SPEAKER_02You're very welcome. I'm honored.
SPEAKER_00I really like that.
SPEAKER_02No, I'm honored. Oh, thank no, but absolutely, you know, right from the beginning, you are collecting it, and and then people say, throw away things to you, you know, or people, oh my gosh, it's just wicked. It's just so, I'm gonna swear, it's fucking awful. And I think I said many, many podcasts ago on my healing journey, and maybe this was about three years ago after I'd separated, um, I just said to about five or six people, please will you just tell me something about me, you know, what is what what you know what you like about me or something. And um, I mean, I had to read it a number of times to kind of let it sink in. Oh, you're like this and you're like that. And actually, I love the way you listen. You always, you know, 100% listen. And when you, you know, you know, you're never rushing in with advice or you're kind and you've done this for me and you've done that for me. And you kind of go, oh, but but you really have to that's you know, change the narrative, don't you? Totally.
SPEAKER_00Because sorry, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, I'm just saying, because you've just had the wrong lens the wrong things, you know, that you're yeah, you're delving into that basket.
SPEAKER_00Well, it so if we look at the the timeline that you're talking about, when we talk about timelines, we're we're we're talking about seasons of life, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Is if you think from if you you're not diagnosed from a young age, so this, you know, ADHD can also look like complex trauma, okay, 'cause they both affect the prefrontal cortex. So they both affect deep trauma and ADHD. Not so much autism, but but definitely ADHD. Affect your ability to see yourself from the inside, you see yourself from the outside in. So you're already vulnerable. You know, people with complex trauma, people that have been raised in abuse, neglect, emotionally unavailable, uh you know, very interesting, darker personalities, they they already don't have a true narrative of themselves because they've been raised by somebody who's who's disturbed and cruel. So that they're already raised to self-abandon because if you think about it from a child's perspective, if the very people that created you don't make you feel safe or you feel they don't want you or they don't love you, you have to leave yourself and become something else to be accepted in the world.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And that's automatic with ADHD. So anyone who has your children with it, they automatically cannot see themselves properly. And if they've been, you know, in negative environment or they can't assess consequences, they can't really risk assess, they are more likely to be in lower vibrational, cruel relationships, and then they build a story on that, you see, and they keep consenting consistently to terrible things. And then we see BPD occur where it's so chronic that you are literally trying to kill your true self and it become you know passive suicide. Your your behavior is all passive suicide, or suicidal rather. Do you think that? It's something that you really have experienced deeply.
SPEAKER_02Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And then actually, the wickedest thing about all this is actually not seeing being able to see my true self, but other people could see it. Right. Yeah. Then they take advantage of that. And I think again, we mentioned it before, you know, oh well, you know, you don't have any needs, that's fine. Well, then you can just keep giving to me, or you, you know, this, you know, how you present yourself. And and actually that then that's kind of sort of self-perpetuated. I mean, that's just a nightmare if you get into those sorts of relationships, whoever they are with, you know, with a close friends or, you know, um romantic relationships and whatever. I mean, that's just that that's just going to finish you off, really, isn't it? Because there's just the whole thing just keeps perpetuating, then it's almost like you keep you're almost like running up a running up an escalator that's coming down or something. Do you know what I mean? You just, yeah, yeah. So I I mean, I've yeah, everything you've talked about is everything, you know, that I've I have experienced. And um, and I think occasionally, you know, I do have moments and just think like literally about casting my pulse before swine. Yeah, right, okay. I have, you know, I did have these abilities, I did have this kindness and big heart, and I did like, you know, want the best for people, and they are in really good spaces, you know, because of me. And and then that you kind of go think, you know, you realise, well, actually, they didn't really invest in me. They were just like taking, you know, and I thought that was fine. I I I thought that was love.
SPEAKER_00I'm just curious that what was the deal breaker then? So given all of that, because that's uphill from the start, right? Then that's an uphill escalator. That that's a big reach to get to where you are now. And I know that you know, we'd have to do so many podcasts and kind of unpacking all the different layers because that that's been quite a journey. But what would you say was that defining moment where you you decided you didn't want to keep taking your value external? You wanted to build your internal value system.
SPEAKER_02I think I got to a point where I was just, you know, doing things um and you know, say, you know, outwardly happy with it. And then um kids all left home, you know, to go off to university. And then I think that year my mum passed away as well, and then suddenly, um, and and I knew I actually I mean, always I'd always been sort of seeking and reading self-help books or you know, in the new age and whatnot, and actually thinking, you know, I didn't have a great childhood, maybe I need to look at it and and and try and sort of work through books, you know, myself. Then I thought, right, okay, now who am I? Because I'm not a mum anymore, a full-time mum, and I'm not a daughter anymore, because my dad had died um already. And I thought, right, I really, really it's like in the cartoon. I've said this before, you know, you're you know the cartoon characters running and then they career, don't they? And everything behind them, they stop, and everything behind them sort of stop, crashes into them. And I think that's what happened to my life. So that was um 2018, and then in 2019, and I think this is this is partly to do with it. Um so I don't I I'd know for a long time that I wasn't happy. Um, but you know, again, with what's that thing we always talk about, the lost um, you know, um, oh I can't remember, when people stay in marriages, you know, sunk cost fallacy, whatever it's called. You think, oh come on, you know, we're not that unhappy. We, you know, we we amble along. I mean, I've so many people have said this to me, actually. A couple of men have said it to me. Oh, she lets me do my thing and she does her thing and we've got one day together, and I'm gonna break up the family, and that's happiness, right? And I just know there's got to be something more, you know, there's got to be something more. Really? Am I gonna see my days out and look back and go, wow, I really settled for a bit of a you know mediocre life? And then I came to faith in 2019, and that's a real that that I think was did something to me because I've been brought up um in an in Indian religion and but it never spoke to me. And I've always thought there's something more, you know, but like everyone called it, the universe universe. I'd go to church and sing hymns and be quite happy. And then it was then actually I picked up the Bible and started reading it, and I couldn't put it down, and I and I fasted as well, just spontaneously. And that's when all thoughts of wanting to end this life just completely disappeared. I haven't had a thought like that once, even then, even then, you know, I was still you know married. And I think I just kind of it was a supernatural thing, I think. I just thought, no, enough, enough, like what am I doing with my life, you know? Outwardly presenting like this and inwardly, you know, it was dying every day. And I almost like kind of sort of saw myself through I'm trying to remember because now it's you know seven, seven years ago, but just seeing myself through, you know, Jesus' eyes, and actually I'm I'm I'm worth it, you know, I'm worth something. I'm I'm I mean something, I'm important, you know. I need to, yeah, I've got something to offer, I suppose. But then it was a bit of a long haul, you know, after that. It wasn't it wasn't one of these divine things that happens to people, you know. Um instantaneous enlightenment or whatever, which is good because it needed to be a slow journey. But I think it's it was it was then, wasn't it? It was about 2019.
SPEAKER_00It was, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that thing things really, really changed. And then actually we we had like a bit of um decided, you know, I don't didn't call it a day, just said, look, we need to work on our relationship, let's have you know couples counselling, and then we were recommended just to spend a bit of time apart. And I think it was then actually when I came into the house for the first time um by myself and shut the door, and I went, ah my gosh, this is so beautiful. I don't have to be anyone's wife or mother, I can just be in this space and be by myself and be be me, be me. I didn't even know who me was. I've got to find myself first. Um so then, yeah, slowly, but but even then, you know, I think in the last couple of years, actually, since I've been on my own, has been the bit. So that that was the thing, that was the catalyst, I reckon. And then really being by myself and just actually thinking, wow, you know, looking at at everything, I sort of don't agree with that anymore. I'm not gonna consent to having relationships where actually I'm just you know, everyone's therapist or I'm this or I'm that or somebody's bank or whatever, and lit, you know, literally just letting go of those things. I don't need to do those anymore.
SPEAKER_00There's no Yeah, we're also came to faith at the same time when my dad died. I don't know if you experienced it. Remember the Bible terrifying taking up the Bible reading and realizing anymore because to me that is really curious. I mean that I belong to something and it wasn't I wasn't made to suffer. That was not the design, was not to suffer. The New Testament really is a love letter. It's not a religious it's not a religious book. It's about energy and vibration and kindness and women and marriage, you know, it's so beautiful the way it talks about marriage and friendships, and I thought that world's in my heart. That's what I've always been looking for, and I've been so disturbed and alone that I've not experienced it, but I knew it, like I knew the words. Does do you resonate with that?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, I do. And I think for me it was it was it was also that actually uh I belong to someone, you know, and and then this is what I was telling my friend last week in the pub, and um she said, So what do you do? Like, you know, do you how do you pray or you know and and and do what do you ask for? I said I don't talk about Jesus in a pub. But it was such a beautiful conversation because I said actually literally, I have I I this is how I explained it. I said I belong to him, I've given my life to him, and since I've done that, my life has just worked out just beautifully, you know, everything has worked out beautifully because he's got me, you know, and you know, I'm I I I'm in the right place at the right time and meet the right people, or I, you know, I'm able to stay in my home. Um, I'm you know, uh, you know, I don't even know how to explain it. I don't, you know, so my praying, I mean, I pray every day. I'm constantly, constantly praying. You know, I meet people and I pray, you know, before for them and for the interaction we're going to have. I ask, I always sort of, you know, is there, you know, um anything, you know, God wants me to say to them, Jesus wants me to say to them, all sorts of things. We pray before our um our podcast. It's it's I belong to someone, and now I can stop running around and looking because I'm home. Do you know what I mean? I don't I'm describing it really rather clumsily, actually, but I'm I'm I'm I'm home. I'm um describing it rather passionately. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. No, I'm I'm home. I belong to someone, and um he loves me. He loves me so much that actually he's rescued me um from the let's call it the bit of hell or something, you know, because I wasn't happy. I I I didn't, you know, no, no, um and um yeah, my life was just completely changed, completely changed.
SPEAKER_00I find this a lot, Sarinda, and it's so gorgeous. It wasn't clumsy, it's passionate, is that it takes a lot of courage to declare these things in a world that rejects faith.
SPEAKER_02Oh, absolutely. No, no, no, absolutely. I've been sneered at, and you know, by people close to me. Oh, haven't you haven't you got over that? Isn't it one of your things? You know, oh you're still into no seriously. Are you still oh you're still into Christianity? Oh, you're still a Christian. No, I tried that last year, actually, it didn't work, and now I'm doing something else, or it was great, and I thought I'd try, you know, it's ridiculous. Um it's been a great journey, though. It's been, yeah, yeah. So yeah, you're right, you're right. You be you know, saying to people, the trouble is you know what? I think people um mix it up with religion, and you know, we're not talking about religion. Um, man has ruined you know, faith. Religion has ruined man. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, and I've been to um, you know, at the beginning, you know, I wanted to meet people and I wanted to actually um you know listen to sermons and listen to you know vicar's pastors or whatever, explaining things. And I went to some amazing things, you know, like you know, one sermon, I think I think um the pastor was talking about the prodigal son and explaining it, and you go, Oh my gosh, that's what it means. It relates so much to our lives, you know. And then you go to places where they talk for 10 minutes, and oh, I can tell you some horrible stories. You go, what are you doing? I'm gonna shoot you. Um, so I'll stop going to church. It wasn't about going to church anyway.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, I think I think this is a really beautiful conversation piece. So, if I may, so I I was raised a Catholic, Irish Catholic, and went to school in a convent, and I found no love there. I found only cruelty from that environment, and I saw the absence of God, and I was already in a horrific home environment, and was so, so lost, but I had some spiritual gifts, if you want to call it that. You know, I used to know when my teachers were having affairs, and I used to know when people were lying and hallucinate a lot as as a child, and you know, was in hospital a lot through visions and my mum was always uh dabbling in kind of the new age, so I thought I'd try that and I was appalled by the hypocrisy in the new age where it was all about people being self-gods and their own importance drinking the Kool-Aid. And I know you've had similar experiences, and I was so disappointed in that community. Um, especially when I was working as a mediumless psychic, please know I don't do those things anymore, but I saw they didn't care about people. There wasn't a real connection and my my dad was really anti-religion and he was anti new age, but he had a profound love of God and I never really understood it. I thought how can well where is the what is that then? And like, you know, my father came from terrible, terrible, terrible cruelty, but he never lost faith and he had a different energy to him. It was a humility and a a gratitude for basic things, just inherently kind. When he was dying and our parents died, you know, your mother died, uh my father died a week apart. Oh, they did, didn't they? The same yeah, yeah, yeah. And we were both coming to faith and I remember my dad praying for me ten days before he died, and it was the last time he spoke to me, and he just said, Who we which is my nickname. Don't walk with godless people. And after he died, that I couldn't stop thinking what is God's people? I mean we've had so many conversations, uh blessed, actually, blessed to be on this path together and have I think the most incredible deep real conversations, really quite extraordinary. Um, and I just want to bring this in when we met. It's gone over a decade now, right? It's gone over a decade left. And I remember thinking this woman has the most extraordinary depth for pain, and it fascinated me. Because I thought she has that depth for pain, she must really be able to feel. There must be real deep love there. If you if you can feel that brokenness, it's because it's in contrast to the love that's within you. Oh gosh, yeah, yeah. So when we were coming to faith and I I kept thinking, what is God's people? What is God's people? And you pick up that Bible, the New Testament, again, I'm I'm not you know, I don't go to church, I'm not interested in crowd control um or prosperity or any of that weird stuff. But I found God's people. And then when you no longer consent to people that don't have those values, because it's a book of values, right? Yeah, yeah. Romans proverbs, it's a book of values, and you start to cultivate those values, you start to line up with people that have the same values, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's really what I have seen in you on your journey is you developed God value in yourself, which stopped you devaluing yourself and being around people that were also devaluing you.
SPEAKER_02Mm-hmm. Exactly. Because people have really fallen away. I mean, you must have had that as well, and and lots of people say, don't they? I mean, and then it's back to you know, sort of Lord of One that we were talking about as well. But um people have just naturally fallen away, and it's my body telling me, you know, you're talking about being offended and and and actually repulsed. I mean, sometimes I do think about people before, and I just kind of, you know, I'm sure I've gone out of off their radar as well, and I just my body won't let me, you know, just something inside me went, no, no, no, no. And and because I mean, I'm not saying they're you know they're horrific or whatever, it's just that I don't know, I just I just don't do that stuff anymore, you know, the the the the way a lot of people function in the world. And then the other people who you were very, very kind of let's say close to, and we just said I don't know if you actually said the word godless, I don't know if I misheard, but I I realize that when people are you know, we've talked about narcissism, haven't we? You know, when people are really godless, and actually they mean you they mean you harm. They really mean you harm.
SPEAKER_00They're not working from a standard, you see. I think what God's love does, and you know, when I when I talk about Christianity, I I talk about Christ and and being conscious of Christ's teachings. Is look you never find God when you're being God.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so a lot of people in this world are self-gods, aren't they?
SPEAKER_00So there's not room for two. Yeah, yeah. And you're gonna live life your way based on your entitlement, your worldview, your narrative. And I think we can safely say it it it's not going well here. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it's very primal and it's based on your desires, your wounds, your judgment. But I think if we all had a standard, and the standard is pretty beautiful. God's standard is, you know, take the log out of your own eye, you know, love one another as you love yourself. You know, the men lay down your life for your wife and women, you know, be grateful for everything you have and you know, don't look for your love in other people, look for yourself, you know, to yourself or your love or God's love within you. And when you actually sit and you think, wow, that is so why would I def why why would I rely upon myself and and live life from you know, this this kind of traumatized broken people pleasing. Why wouldn't I live it like this?
SPEAKER_02Well so yeah, why would I live with the world's standards and actually we know who the world's ruled by? And yeah, why wouldn't I live like that?
SPEAKER_00And then we uh and it's so lovely that you brought you brought us on this journey tonight from programming to consent to BPD to ADHD to faith to being at home with yourself. The whole way through this spirit of love was calling you to itself. Come home. Don't don't don't submit to self-gods. Don't be a slave. Don't kill yourself. I got a life for you and I you're loved.
unknownYeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00And and live with people that work from the same standard. Yeah, yeah. Beautiful, beautiful way to put it. Well, they're your this is the story you've told us tonight, a very brave story from an Indian woman to a person who who follows Christ in faith is is is quite a story.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, I guess, I guess, yeah, absolutely. No, my um no, my my um and I'm you know, and I you know, I've I see the work that I do now, I'm in service, you know, to God's people. It's um yeah, it's a an unbelievable kind of uh I don't know, transformation, I suppose. Um Do you feel more peaceful now? Oh, much, much, much more peaceful. Do you know my um I've had high blood pressure um for uh quite a number of years. I don't know how many because I probably wouldn't go to the doctor and have it checked. Um, but so many things have happened, you know. I've I I used to be very, very angry as well, so my blood pressure's lowered, but I'm I'm still on meds, but you know, I've cut the not as much as I was before. Um I used to be my siblings always say to me, You used to be so angry. Oh yeah, I don't get angry now. Um I'm I'm much, much more peaceful, I'm content with my own company. Um, and you know, some time some weeks I don't see that many people, and it's absolutely fine. Some weeks I do. But yeah, I am. I'm I'm I'm at peace. I've I've kind of um I've I've kind of yeah, it's literally like yeah, I've come just I've come home. I've come home and it's beautiful.
SPEAKER_00And those negative thoughts, those kind of suicidal thoughts. those shaming thoughts. How loud is is that voice now if it's there at all?
SPEAKER_02No, um so the the the you know wanting to not wake up in the morning that went went straight away actually went straight away. And um and I realised I had that you know as a child actually from when I was a child imagining my funeral and what people might say about me and crying you know sad. It's so sad isn't it because all you're what you're doing is actually you know wanting to hear people say oh she was so lovely it's tragic. It's deep yeah it is absolutely tragic. No no that went straight away and um can't open off on one now so no no no no no voices I don't I don't I mean you know I don't I was always criticizing myself I mean good lord I'd have a conversation with somebody and then afterwards I'd go through the whole conversation in my head and I've worked with people who say they do that exactly that. Actually go did I talk too much did I not say enough or should have did I butt in or did I did I shame them oh my gosh it was awful absolutely bloody relentless don't do that anymore and I go you know my intention was not to offend anyone if I you know did you know and I don't I never do overstep the mark anyway you know oh gosh that awful voice so yeah so much has gone um and um yeah I might even say I love myself crying steady on steady on love so I think it'd be really nice to acknowledge the gift of the passing of my father your mother because I think it was at that time very very timely was through losing then that that heartbreak that creeps in I think it opened a door to something else. Yeah yeah absolutely absolutely and and there have been sort of subsequent things actually that have happened um you know which we can go into in the future or not which have actually really helped me to understand my mum story and you know you know when you're a when you're in an immigrant family you know oftentimes you're so embarrassed about your parents I mean you're embarrassed about your parents anyway it doesn't matter what colour or room you know they come in through partition didn't they? Yeah yeah my parents came from partition they didn't speak English you know there we were in the 60s you know I used to have to go to my little brother's parents' evening which was so embarrassing you know as a teenager and I was just always you know oh um and I just I just just you know just didn't like them did not like them um you know my mum was depressed I think she probably had BPD as well but I just look back now and go wow what you two went through and you know you've you've lived here do you know um I was saying this to somebody the other day and she thought it was tragic. My dad to his dying day and he was nearly 90 died in 2012 I think he also used to say um Srinda and when they kick us out where will we go? But it was it was because of Enoch Powell speech in the 60s Enoch Powell's rivers of blood speech I think that's what it's called and and my my friend who's English he was she was so upset by that she's I can't believe it your dad who worked in a foundry shoveling sand into a furnace helping to build Britain in the 50s you know and and and you know yeah um was still constantly worried yeah felt and safe yeah felt and safe yeah I mean my story you know my mine was different you know I'm I feel very British and whatnot but yeah you just think about them you go you know what thank you very much that you came here and you actually thankfully I had a life here not in India and I was able to be this independent woman and um thank you I've I you know I've learned a lot from them that's that's the power as well isn't it is that we carry so much baggage and we're ungrateful and we're traumatized and we don't we're not able to honor some of the struggles of those that have gone before us.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah and I think when you heal you see it's just generation passing it down after generation after generation and at at some point somebody has to stop the cycle.
SPEAKER_02Yeah exactly and that's what I actually that that's what you know when we've sort of looked deeper into our stories and that's the thing actually if I think about generations of Indian women and what they've had to endure and what they've put up with it go no it stops with me stops with me.
SPEAKER_00My daughter's not going to be like that you know and her children or my boys you know no it's it stops with me and and I kind of actually did an exercise where I kind of almost turned round and looked back at them I didn't know grandparents um at all um and I just no it's stopped it stopped I've done it I've done it for all of us you know and they're all going yeah they're all cheering on in the spirit cheering on in the spirit so shall we wind down yes yeah yeah thank you for sharing what a journey I mean that's just a snippy I've had the privilege of I know you know seeing the journey at deeper layers and I just want to acknowledge your confidence and in yourself being able to speak tonight because you know it's a big it's a big deal to find your voice and want to share it on a platform where we have you know sometimes thousands of listeners now and I it's a big deal to find your voice. Yeah yeah yeah so I hope you are proud of yourself and enjoyed sharing much more deeper who you are from a real vulnerable place.
SPEAKER_02Yeah yeah thank you and also do you know what I just want to say actually I couldn't have done it without you I really really couldn't have done it without you you've been through you know honestly it's been a long long time it could have been 12 years 13 who knows but you've been with me through thick and thin and I think what kept me going actually um was the fact that and I think you know just you saw something in me and helped me to bring it out you know what I mean um yeah I loved you from day one even though you was a royal pain in the arse I was like oh that's it well I remember coming to therapy and saying yeah I'm the problem in the in the marriage actually I'm like this and I'm like that you don't think your eyebrows must have eyelashes must have fallen off.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I thought is that so well we'll probably should investigate this one. But um no there was a there was a rawness there was an authenticity and I just wanted you to live your life I wanted you to be happy I wanted you to be free whatever decision you made and you've made some cracking decisions with massive amount of opposition and pretty much done it by yourself and that's why you know I would encourage you as well as encouraging you because people don't understand what it takes and what sometimes you have to go through sometimes you have to walk that path alone but God is God is with us and for us and there is a higher love. And on punishing judgmental cruel love there is a higher love that wants us all to love each other like that. So just thank you for being an ambassador of that and sharing that tonight.
SPEAKER_02Oh you're welcome no it's been really really good because I think people just sort of look at you and think you know oftentimes oh you've just arrived there or that's you know that's you know it didn't take much but actually it's it is only new yeah for me yeah quite yeah absolutely how many times you've been on the on your knees you know and um um do you know I d I just feel on my spirit just to share two books that I read that really really helped me if you don't mind. Of course yeah um pilgrim's progress is one of them and it's so beautiful about our journey that actually this um chap Christian he wants to take his family with him but they don't I don't people don't know the story but you know they they he he feels like he needs to go to the celestial city as he calls it he tries to persuade his wife and children they go no you're you're off your you know you crackers you've come no we're not coming with you and it's this journey and it and it's all and it's exactly what happens to us greed and sloth sloth sloth sloth I don't know how you say it you know all envy all these things take us off our path and he constantly slips off the path and he falls in the slab despond and then evangelist comes along picks him up and puts him back on the path it's such a beautiful story it is absolutely beautiful so I I remember reading that and thinking wow this is life's journey and then the other one that has always really touched me and that we did this in Divinity at school in RE at school that's about the only thing I remember actually for all these years is a story about um uh Nikki Cruz he was a violent um in the in the late 50s and 60s New books yeah New York was absolutely especially this area bed sty uh Bedford Stuyvesant I think it is apparently the amount of murders by young people I mean it was just real den of iniquity and it's the story um of um um just about these kids actually I mean there were eight nine year olds I mean you know in the the pastor David Wilkinson um he wrote the book and he describes it I mean he's he was a country pastor and I think he didn't even know some of these lewd acts you know happened especially between you know eight nine year olds and they're carrying knives and just you know happy to slice each other you know and deaths and whatnot and it's just the just just just the movement of the the saving of actually these people and it just makes me cry every time every time it's just so so beautiful you know lives oh yeah and the is is it the cross and the switchblade yeah yeah yeah yeah it's a fantastic book oh fantastic book yeah it really you do you feel the power of God that's what I'm saying you really feel the power of the Holy Spirit in that book you just think wow if he can do that to them he can do it to us you know amazing amazing recommendations and again I'll always recommend the New Testament as well yeah absolutely always recommending so thank you thank you to everyone for being with us tonight hope you've really enjoyed a different kind of topic and a and a a you know very brave representation of faith in a world well I think most people are questioning what is real what is not real you know where they invest more in their iPhones than they do in their prayer life but prayers are real I think we're a testimony of that aren't we both of us I mean I certainly am absolutely yeah I'm a praying woman I am a praying woman and a woman of great faith as you are so our prayer for you is that you find your peace and don't look to others anymore.
SPEAKER_00Don't consent to cruelty don't consent to disrespect and self-harm and and don't consent to harming others you know never let people rob you of your own divine nature and our prayer is that you find your way home.
SPEAKER_02Good night everyone everyone thank you for listening and have a blessed evening