The Discomfort You’re Avoiding Was Created (Not Solved) by Alcohol

Do you reach for a drink to avoid discomfort?

In this episode of The Alcohol Myth Podcast, coaches Jonathan Ball and Ellen Biggs unpack a sneaky belief: “Alcohol helps me handle discomfort.” We talk about why that feels true in the moment, how alcohol creates its own discomfort loop (the 5 PM itch, the anxiety before the first sip, the hangover shame), and what changes when you stop using alcohol as your built-in off ramp. :contentReference[oaicite:1]{index=1}

You’ll also hear practical, usable tools: how to get curious about what you’re feeling, how to build trust that you can withstand hard moments, and why discomfort is often the indicator light that growth is happening. :contentReference[oaicite:2]{index=2} 

In this video, you’ll learn:
- Why alcohol “relief” is often solving a problem alcohol created
- What your body is actually doing behind the scenes (even when your mind feels soothed)
- Why quitting does remove alcohol discomfort, but life still has discomfort
- How to reframe discomfort as an invitation instead of an emergency
- The power of emotional literacy (naming the real feeling)
- Why you cannot numb selectively, and what you get back when you stop trying

Quick takeaway:
Discomfort is not proof you’re failing. It’s often proof you’re changing. 

Tiny FAQ:
Q: Why does it feel harder at first when I stop drinking?
A: Because you removed your default tool, and now you have to build new skills. That is uncomfortable, and it is also where growth starts. :contentReference[oaicite:5]{index=5}

Q: What do I do instead of drinking?
A: Start with curiosity. Ask: “What am I feeling?” and “What do I need?” Then run a quick resource audit (food, water, rest, movement, connection, support). :contentReference[oaicite:6]{index=6}

Connect with us:
Email: thealcoholmyth@gmail.com
Jonathan: https://livecreativeaf.com/
Ellen: https://ellenbiggscoaching.com/

Subscribe for more episodes on pulling back the curtain on the alcohol myth.

Chapters
0:00 The myth: alcohol helps me avoid discomfort :contentReference[oaicite:7]{index=7}
0:40 What we’re unpacking today (and what’s on the other side) :contentReference[oaicite:8]{index=8}
1:43 The discomfort we ignore: hangovers, shame, regret, 5 PM anxiety :contentReference[oaicite:9]{index=9}
3:18 The loop: alcohol “solves” the problem it created :contentReference[oaicite:10]{index=10}
5:33 What your body is doing while your mind feels soothed :contentReference[oaicite:11]{index=11}
10:50 The brain basics: seek pleasure, avoid pain, conserve energy :contentReference[oaicite:12]{index=12}
13:44 Quitting removes alcohol discomfort, but life is still uncomfortable :contentReference[oaicite:13]{index=13}
16:39 The shift: discomfort as invitation (not emergency) :contentReference[oaicite:14]{index=14}
18:36 Building self trust: “I can withstand this” :contentReference[oaicite:15]{index=15}
22:36 Emotional literacy: use the feelings wheel, name the real feeling :contentReference[oaicite:16]{index=16}
30:25 You can’t numb selectively (and what you get back) :contentReference[oaicite:17]{index=17}
35:18 Practical tools: curiosity + a resource audit :contentReference[oaicite:18]{index=18}
40:13 Growth requires discomfort (plus the butterfly metaphor) 
42:05 Closing: “What are you here to teach me?” 

#QuitDrinking #SoberCurious #AlcoholFree #AlcoholMythPodcast #SelfCompassion #Anxiety #HabitChange #EmotionalHealth

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Why does the world act like alcohol is the answer, even while it is creating problems of its own?

SPEAKER_00 0:04

On the Alcohol Myth Podcast, we pull back the curtain so you can see what's really going on with alcohol and what life could be like without it.

SPEAKER_02 0:11

We are coaches trained in this naked mind and effective limital psychology who fell for the alcohol myth for decades. Now we help people take back control of their lives by changing their relationship with alcohol from the inside out.

SPEAKER_00 0:23

You don't need to wait for a rock bottom. You don't need more willpower. You just need a new way to understand what you are feeling and why you are reaching for that next drink.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

So let's dig in. This is something that I certainly leaned on a lot in when I was in my drinking days. And I know Ellen, you know, we were just talking before the podcast that it's kind of a go-to for um, oh, I am experiencing this moment of discomfort. What's the answer to that? I know a nice drink will soothe this over. Um, so today we're going to be talking about where that impulse comes from, the negative impacts of that pattern, that habit, and what's on the other side of discomfort? Like, what do you do when you encounter discomfort and you don't have that kind of go-to built-in solution? So, Ellen is kind of at the top. Um, what is something that comes up for you in this topic?

SPEAKER_01 1:43

Yeah, there's so much about this that I want to kind of go unpack with you. As you were talking, one of the first things I thought about was like when we are drinking regularly, like I was every day, I was experiencing a lot of discomfort from the repercussions of my drinking. You know, hangovers are uncomfortable, feelings of shame, feelings of regret, you know, worrying about my drinking. All of that was very uncomfortable. But I often kind of overlooked that and focused only on the fact that alcohol could alleviate some anxiety, the discomfort that I felt in the moment around five o'clock when I really wanted a drink. So, like my first thought was like, discomfort is an interesting thing to unpack just in itself, and what our brain chooses to focus on when we are thinking about alcohol. Because I think the thing that we so often think about is like alcohol relieves my discomfort. I feel shaky, I feel anxious, I feel whatever, I feel nervous. I have going to an event, I'm shy, I know that. Alcohol helps relieve negative feelings. I want to numb negative feelings. We hear that a lot, right? I just feel so unhappy. So this, so that I want to numb it. So it alleviates that discomfort. And we forget about all the discomfort that happens all the other hours of the waking day and the middle of the night when we wake up in the middle of the night.

SPEAKER_02 3:10

Oh my goodness. The discomfort that you're feeling at around five o'clock because you're looking forward to that next drink was created by the drink in the first place. And that's the thing that is so mind-blowing about the whole um idea that alcohol is, you know, the secret to being able to navigate discomfort is like it is solving the problem. It is quote, air quote, right? Solving the problem that it created in the first place. And guess what goes away when you cut that out of your life? Like not immediately, but that kind of nagging discomfort of you know, looking forward to or you know, seeking out the next um, the next drink just kind of gets quieter and quieter and goes away. And I can't tell you how many times, how many times did I wake up feeling terrible and hung over? And what is the solution to that, right? We turn to the hair of the dog and we drink more to solve again the problem that the drink caused in the first place. It doesn't make sense when you kind of look at it that way.

SPEAKER_01 4:18

I know I was having this like realization today. I don't know why I was thinking about it in these terms, but and I often don't like to talk about alcohol in this way because I think it could, if I were still drinking, I might find it confronting because I wouldn't want to think about alcohol this way. But I was thinking about like alcohol as a liquid beverage that we drink. Like it is the only one that I know of that like can kill you, right? I don't know. We glamorize this beverage as being the thing that's going to alleviate our discomfort. And it's just interesting how we, and myself included, turn a total blind eye to like the immediacy of the discomfort that it can create for our physical bodies, right? It puts our bodies in a state of stress that it needs to work really hard to eliminate. And like I I don't know. I I I you can't see it till you see it, you know, but it's just like it's kind of mind-blowing how we think that this is the thing that is going to alleviate our discomfort when it just is it just creates all these problems.

SPEAKER_02 5:33

I think this is where a solid understanding of the biology of how your body processes alcohol can be super helpful because you know it we experience like the the mental experience of having a drink is so different than what the body is actually being put through, right? Like we have a drink and things feel a little bit softer or fuzzier, and you know, it does work to um you know slow down our neural processing, and so like we experience that as this like depressant effect where things are just kind of feel a little bit more chill and more relaxed, and simultaneously we get that nice feeling of the dopamine hit as the you know, is as our body's experiencing it. So all of that's happening, and then in the background, your body's working in super overdrive to kind of counteract and cleanse itself of what it sees as a poison, right? That ethanol is harmful to the body, and so the body's like, oh my gosh, right? Like, we gotta we gotta get this, we gotta get this taken care of. This is priority one. Um, and so even while our experience of having to drink might feel like a sense of comfort or ease because things get a little softer, get a little fuzzier if we have enough to drink, our body is not having the same experience, right? And that alcohol is such a weird substance because it's doing so many things in our system kind of simultaneously. Um, you know, like some people get really hyper when they have a lot to drink. And but wait, isn't alcohol a depressant, right? Like it's just is this cascade of different uh processes that it uh initiates in our system, and you know, the actual experience of it can vary from person to person, but uh it's all distressing to your to your system as it as it wants to uh help you and it wants to like give you an experience of being in balance and equilibrium, it wants to give you homeostasis, and when we're inserting this you know foreign substance into that equation, you know, our bodies kind of kick into overdrive to to correct that.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

Yeah, and it and then it also anticipates that that is going to be coming again, so it almost like prepares itself for the incoming, you know, intoxicant that so it it starts releasing things that make us feel, you know, uh like low if we if we what we normally feel is a little bit of buzz when we have alcohol, then we get this feeling of lowness before the buzz comes. Or if like alcohol is something you use to relax you, you get these feelings of anxiety and stress prior to drinking. So it's like the the body prepping to kind of be able to keep you at homeostasis. And yeah, it's just this fascinating sort of biological wonder that's going on under the covers that we, I mean, I didn't know anything about. I I literally knew nothing about that. And so I all I saw was oh, it alleviates the discomfort of my anxiety around five o'clock. And then um, and then I kind of disassociated the discomfort of regret, shame, hangover, you know. I mean, it was like I knew they were the consequences of drinking, but didn't count as well. I don't know. Like at five o'clock, they didn't feel as uncomfortable, and that's again the way alcohol works in our like it just it's our our bodies. We want our bodies are also trained to like want to help us feel better, you know. So when we have trained our brain to believe that alcohol makes us feel better, we are naturally going to reach for the thing that we believe is going to make us feel better.

SPEAKER_02 9:43

I think it's another kind of interesting thing on the biological side is is the length of time that it takes. And so we give alcohol so much credit for what it does in the first 15, 20 minutes of having a drink. And then it's almost like we ignore that it's still that substance that is making us feel terrible 12 hours later, right? But it's that length of time that allows, I think, alcohol to almost ingratiate itself into our psychology, where we're like, oh, positive thing, I'm having a toast, I'm celebrating something, I'm cheersing something, oh, I have a drink, oh, I feel great, right? It gets that credit, and then because it's so far removed, like the cause and effect is almost like removed by hours, it um feels a little bit less like concrete, those connections. Um but I'm interested in this idea too of like the idea of experiencing or avoiding discomfort. One of the one of the things that uh psychologists agree on is our our brains are kind of evolved to do three things really well, right? We're looking to seek pleasure, we're looking to avoid discomfort, and we're looking to conserve energy. So at the very core of us, those three things are very, very, very psychologically motivating. And from an evolutionary standpoint, it makes sense, right? Like we're moving towards the good things, we're moving away from the bad things, and we're trying to not we're trying to conserve our energy. Um but that understanding that as almost like a bio a baked-in biological imperative can make it a little bit easier to have a little bit of compassion for ourselves when we find ourselves doing things that are outside of our expressed goals.

SPEAKER_01 11:55

Yeah, it's so true. I it's making me think like, because okay, I think this is another myth to unpack too, because so I when I quit drinking, or when I was playing around with quitting, one of my primary goals was was to avoid feeling crappy all the time. Like I had connected in my mind that alcohol, the the consequences of drinking alcohol are crappy. Like I felt terrible, I was hungover all the time, I was tired, I wasn't sleeping well. I, you know, I I I wanted to, I did start to see it as I wanted to avoid that discomfort. And so to avoid that discomfort, I played around with stopping drinking. And to my uh, you know, relief, it did, well, I don't know if it was a relief or not. It was kind of like, dang, this is actually true. Like if I stop drinking, I will sleep better, I will have more energy, my mood does improve. I mean, it was almost like the thing I was not wanting to see, but you know, because I didn't want to believe it was true, because I wanted to keep alcohol in my life. But then once I really saw it for what it was, I was like, okay, if I really want to eliminate my discomfort is kind of how I saw it, right? I can, I, okay, so now I know what to do. I won't have, I can stop drinking and then I won't have discomfort. And there is something to that, like it really did eliminate that particular kind of discomfort. Like I don't have hangovers anymore. I don't have regret and shame and you know, the ongoing thoughts about to drink, not to drink. I all of that is gone, which has, you know, opened up so much more opportunity for less discomfort. But what I think I I kind of got confused about was that life will still come with discomfort, right? Like I'm not I'm no longer experiencing the discomfort from alcohol. In fact, I think for so long the discomfort I was experiencing because I was drinking all the time kept me in this pattern of not even seeing the ways I was experiencing discomfort in my regular life. Because if I experienced anything just uncomfortable in my regular life, I would just drink. So I never really experienced a lot of discomfort in my regular life. I would drink over it. And then I would experience the discomfort of the drinking, you know. But lo and behold, when I stopped drinking, it was like, oh my gosh, there's a lot about life that's uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_02 14:37

Yeah. And when you get to that point where you're not constantly reaching for that, you know, here's the solution for how I'm gonna solve life's problems or life's, you know, like uh experiences of discomfort. If you're not going to that, you know, go to, if you're not having that drink, then what do you do? Like, how do you how do you navigate life's discomfort? And that's something that I certainly confronted when I was in my early days of uh sobriety, is just like uh I didn't have the tools, I didn't have the resources to be able to handle life's uh ups and downs. And it took some time for me to upskill in that area because I just didn't know that that was something that I was lacking, too, right? Like you get out there and you realize you don't realize that you don't have something until you reach for it that's not there.

SPEAKER_01 15:35

Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think this is something that when people are ready to really experiment with giving up drinking, I I think you can, you know, I I have clients that, you know, are several months alcohol free and experiencing some real discomfort because of you know, family situations they're encountering, work situations they're encountering. And it's like, okay, my go-to when I would experience this before was have a couple drinks to relax and forget about it. So you take that off the table, and then what? You know, it can feel like God, what what is, you know, what is this I'm doing? This is really uncomfortable and hard, and I have no go-to solution.

SPEAKER_02 16:23

Yeah. And it I think that that um that kind of panic that I felt early on with not having a go-to solution was one of the things that started to actually change my relationship with discomfort in the first place. Because that uh the discomfort of not being able to reach for my you know multi-purpose tool that I've been using for the majority of my adult life. In the absence of that, it created this like space or this invitation to do something different and figure out something new. And that's one of the big shifts that I've experienced is looking at discomfort less as a problem to be solved and more as an invitation to learn or experience something new. Like I I saw the discomfort of not having my go-to solution available as an invitation to figure out new ways to navigate that discomfort. I don't know if that's circular thinking, but it worked.

SPEAKER_01 17:49

Yeah, no, I I I I me too, because the thing that happens is you you remove your handy-dandy tool, which kind of keeps you in a cycle of another kind of discomfort, and then you suddenly you're experiencing life's diffs comfort where there is no easy button to get out of it. And it's like, oh, okay, what now? You know, and honestly, that's where a lot of like coaching would come in, or or therapy for some people, you know, something where you because we are bereft of the tools I was of like, okay, how do I handle this then? Because, you know, if I was drinking to escape these uncomfortable feelings, now I'm not numbing them. They're still there and I don't know what to do about it. And um, and there, you know, this is where a lot of our our relationship with self comes in. You know, you said earlier your relationship to discomfort changed, and I think mine did too, and also my relationship to myself started to change, where I started to build the confidence in myself that I A, I could withstand the discomfort. You know, I think that a lot of times we feel like I just can't take it. I can't stand it. That's why we like, we hit the effort button because we're just like at our wit's end. And so to go through a few of those effort moments and not reach for a drink, maybe reach for chocolate instead, maybe reach for a screen, maybe reach for, you know, if you're, you know, super advanced, go for a walk, right? But to get through something like that without alcohol, you start to be like, okay, I can actually, you know, it didn't kill me. This, but this discomfort that I experienced that I've been really afraid of, that I've been avoiding for decades, by the way, um, it didn't kill me. And do I love feeling it? No. Do I know what to do about it? No. Can I go to bed and wake up the next day and have another day to take a tackle at it? Yes, right. And little by little, those experiences of, you know, not reaching for the drink when we don't even have anything in its place to reach for, really, except maybe some real basic things, like go for a walk, like eat some chocolate, like whatever. You know, like that started for me to build the trust. Like, oh, okay, I might not know how to do this very well, but I can learn to do this better.

SPEAKER_02 20:15

And right now, Reese's peanut butter cups are my friend, you know, like I love what you're saying about how it started to shift your relationship with yourself, right? Like for so many people, and I'll just keep speaking for myself. Like, my I didn't have the confidence that I could withstand discomfort, right? I'd never been tested before. I'd always had uh kind of an off-ramp or a way out of experiencing those difficult emotions or circumstances or whatever. And the narrative about myself, my identity had to change to being and it and it's the slow change, too, right? It's not immediately like, oh, now I see discomfort as an invitation to self-exploration, right? Maybe that's that's the destination, it's where on my best days today, that's where I am, but it took time, and it started with I might not be able to do this gracefully or well, but I know that it's not going to destroy me, and I can learn to figure it out, right? It started there, and then it was like uh, oh, I'm someone who can confront hard things and learn from them, and then it turned into right, it's this whole identity shift that almost is uh taking that idea of like ladder thinking, right? Like, what's one step in the direction that I'm trying to go? Um, and it uh evolved over time. And I like I said, on my best days, I'm like, oh, I'm experiencing discomfort. What's going on there? What can I learn from this? I have Bad days too, right? Where I'm like, oh F, right? Like I've got to, I've got a chocolate, right? But like, um, so much better resource. And it really, the the thing that makes that uh a lasting transformation is how you think about yourself. How do you, how are you bringing that into your identity? How are you self-conceptualizing your own relationship with alcohol or your own relationship with discomfort?

SPEAKER_01 22:29

Yeah, I think that's so important. And and and I what it is making me remember, um, it was around this stage that uh a coach brought to me the idea of the feelings wheel. I mean, the feelings wheel is something you can get off of Google, Google it, and there's like a wheel and it has all these different emotions or feelings because I think I was so unfamiliar. Like I just knew I was I was uncomfortable. And I had probably five words like angry, anxious, sad, lonely, tired, you know, the basics. And I would feel one of those things. I wouldn't like feeling it, so I would drink. But when you're not drinking over it, you have the opportunity to be like, okay, what actually am I feeling right now? Like, am I feeling, you know, disconnected? Am I like there's so there's so much nuance to my feeling unseen? Am I feeling resentful? Am I feeling, you know, me like there's no meaning? Am I am I feeling like I screwed up? Like I have regret. Like there are a lot of different, there's a lot of nuance to a lot of different feelings. And they're all like for me, I I was like, I was illiterate, really, you know, as someone who considers themselves a feeling person too, right? But I I had not, and and it can be very unfamiliar to feel anger and not for, especially for a woman, I think, to feel anger and be comfortable feeling angry. Like I would often drink and angry drink, which would like settle me down, or you know, to feel to recognize that what I'm feeling is resentment. That's a hard thing to feel. Like when you feel resentment towards someone you love, it's uncomfortable, you know. But it is that like ding-ding-ding indicator, like, okay, why am I feeling resentful? What's in my control about this? What can I do about it? And it's where all the growth happens, of course, but it's also like, I don't know, it's it's this, I think there's this multi-step thing where we first become kind of aware of how we're feeling, and then we need so much compassion for ourselves for because I wasn't used to feeling these things. So I would beat myself up and be like, what's wrong with you, Ellen? You have such a good life. Why are you feeling sad or angry or resentful? And it's like, no, just because my life is good, I'm I'm still human. I'm still a human being, just like every other human being on this planet, and I will have the full range of emotions and experience as every other human, no matter their situation, and and just allowing ourselves that, you know, like giving ourselves that full grace and inviting it, actually, like inviting the emotion, which was so foreign to me.

SPEAKER_02 25:19

Yeah, 100%. That um emotional literacy that you're talking about, and uh inviting the big feelings is as a guy super freaking hard. I mean, it is um, you know, I don't I didn't have in all of the guys that I work with. I asked them all, do you have a great model of a masculine role model who is super in touch with their emotions and feelings? And none of them have ever said, Oh, yeah, totally, right? Like, I can, you know, here's three, right? It's just not um, we're not very enculturated for that. And so this was like exploring the the far frontiers, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:07

Like just getting in touch with this stuff, galaxy far, far away, emotional literacy.

SPEAKER_02 26:13

Yeah, it really is. Um, but one of the ways that I talk to my clients about it, who are mostly guys, um, is especially around the idea of discomfort and like confronting these more difficult emotions and feelings. Like, how do we relate to or understand those people who go out and do the hard thing, who are resilient in the face of discomfort, who you know can experience it and weather the storm, right? We think of those people as heroes, like we we venerate those people, and um you know, so if you are experiencing this intense discomfort around getting in touch with your emotions or getting to know your feelings and things like that, don't shy away from that. Be like those people that we honor and respect who are able to um do hard things and uh and see what you learn, right? Like be the be the person that you admire. And you know, maybe in the stories, right? Like they're at the battle of thermopylae or whatever, right? But like you're dealing with your own battle of thermopylae, you know, right here, um, with being able to confront big feelings and to grow an emotional intelligence, right? Like don't shy away from the discomfort.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

Yeah, if it could somehow be reframed for men and women, but particularly men, that um, you know, being able to feel and experience and you know, I don't know, just have the full human experience of all the emotions, that that was like the Uber model of you know, being a good man, being a strong man, right? Being a masculine man. Courageous. How courageous, exactly. Like, how different would society look, right? And instead, the messaging that men get are don't cry, you're you know, don't be a baby, don't be a I mean, we're way worse words than that, right? Um and you know, man up and you know what's the result then?

SPEAKER_02 28:30

Like, don't feel your feelings, bottle them down, push them down, and then we like are surprised when men have these like explosive reactions, you know. Like, what's available? What what what emotion is available for me to experience as a guy? I can be happy or I can be angry. That's it, right? How limiting is that?

SPEAKER_01 28:54

Yeah. Wow. It's so true. And I think for women, we're allowed a few more, but we're not allowed anger. And you know, I think what is so remarkable about the journey to becoming alcohol-free is you gain so much more than just life without alcohol, right? Like, it's not that you're just like going through life not feeling hung over and getting to sleep at night. Like, you actually like can reclaim the for the your full humanity. And it's the full human experience is not all like sunshine and roses. I mean, like everything in life, you know, what is there for there to be light, there has to be dark, for there to be, you know, pleasure, there has to be pain. For there, it's the dichotomy of like this human earth experience that you, you know, you experience it all. And we're we're limiting ourselves so much when we try and just, I don't know, grasp for or reach for the very few things that we feel like are okay or the ones that make us feel comfortable, right?

SPEAKER_02 30:02

Yeah, 100%. Um, it's really an exercise in experiencing the full breadth of humanity, right? Like it's just it's it's really um it's rewarding. And if that's what's on the other side of uh feeling this discomfort, right, it's so worth the cost of admission.

SPEAKER_01 30:25

Yeah, because I mean we've talked about this before, but when you're numbing your discomfort with alcohol, you can't numb selectively. So you're also numbing whatever positive experience you could be having. And so, yes, when we remove alcohol, you are going to feel the full level of whatever discomfort you're experiencing. You're not going to be able to numb it. And you also get to feel the full experience of whatever positive feelings you may have. So it's like we we move from this, like, you know, this very narrow gauge of what we what's acceptable in discomfort, but it only allows us this little thing of what's acceptable in what our bodies will then allow us to feel on the pleasure side. So, you know, the more you're willing to expand your discomfort uh angle, the greater the disc, the comfort angle also gets to go. You know, that's just like the the laws of physics. It just it's the way our bodies work, it's the way, and I'm not saying it very eloquently. And I there are studies that back this stuff up. I'm not just saying this out of, you know, I don't have any of them with me right now because I'm not that kind of a person, but I've listened to them and I've heard them, and I know. I mean, I'm uh you can back me up here that you have also heard these similar um studies.

SPEAKER_02 31:44

Oh, I I was talking to a client last night um who he's like a month and a half into being alcohol free, and he was talking about experiencing kind of or noticing that he was more present and plugged in and feeling more joy, uh like just being with his kids than he had in the past, because in the past it had been like a you know, like, yeah, I'm physically here, but I'm thinking about my next drink or getting through this next beating, or like, you know, allowing himself to like check in, be present, be around, and and experience the joy of connection with his kids. Like that's a result of I think like dopamine receptors coming back online and giving him this like kind of natural hit that was impeded when all those receptors were turned off because they were constantly being flooded by uh flooded with uh the result of drinking alcohol. So um, yeah, it does get better, and you do feel the further breadth of uh you know experience. And um, I mean, there are times I there are countless one of the one of the greatest benefits of figuring out this whole alcohol thing is in the mundane and in the day-to-day, there are these moments of just like pure wonder, joy, or amazement, or the experience of awe that would absolutely, I know I would have missed if alcohol was still a part of my life.

SPEAKER_01 33:26

Oh my gosh, I've experienced that. I was thinking about this the other day because we've recently gone back up to our home in northern Michigan, and um, it is in this tiny little town where there is very little um light pollution. So when it is dark at night, it is dark. And the sunset and then the resulting sky in the evening is there, they're just beautiful. And I remember, I mean, every sunset or sky up until I stopped drinking, like, yeah, they I noticed them that, you know, it was like, oh yeah, that's pretty. Um, but yeah, but it was kind of a ah, you know, yeah, of course, that's that's nice. Or yeah, let's look at it and while I sip this drink, you know, like the the event of watching the sun go down at the beach was much more about sitting and having cocktails with my partner or with friends than it was about the actual beauty of the sun setting. In fact, I was probably distracted by uh do I have time to go run back up and get another drink before I'm gonna miss the pretty part of the, you know, it was all tied up in this stuff. And when I'm not distracted by all that stuff and my dopamine levels are back to like a natural state, something like uh seeing the stars at night or seeing the sunset. I remember hearing a podcast about this and being like, oh my God, what is she smoking? Like it just sounded like a little bit ridiculous. But now on the other side of it, I'm like, yeah, like you experience awe, you know, which is a very different feeling than experiencing a buzzed sunset. There it just and until you experience it, it's almost like I don't know if I can describe it, but having those moments of like just unaltered, we're not altered in any way. It's just like the there's nothing between me and the experience. There's something really magical about that.

SPEAKER_02 35:18

Yeah. Well, Ellen, you know, we've been talking about discomfort, we've been talking about what's on the other side of discomfort. If somebody's made it this far, you know, we like to bring things in and make it practical. Um if somebody's thinking about like, well, how do I deal with discomfort with if I'm not reaching for a drink, then what practical advice do you have for them?

SPEAKER_01 35:40

And what I was about to say, I don't know if this is gonna come out right, but it it's almost like if you if your outlook is around avoiding discomfort, the avoidance or the uh if you have an aversion towards discomfort, if you just are avoiding it at all costs, which I was, so that that was my experience. I just want to invite the tiniest bit of curiosity about like what what is this discomfort here to teach me? What what is what is there in the experience of discomfort that might not be so bad? You know, like I I think I just on autopilot rejected it, turned from it. And it was like it was indoctrinated in me that discomfort was bad. Avoid and there it like we talked about, there's this biological preference to avoid discomfort. And so it takes it it takes uh uh an a little bit of effort to be like, okay, what what's in discomfort that actually might be beneficial, that might be something useful for me? And just kind of play around with, I don't know what the right wording might work for you, but like I don't know. Am I making any sense?

SPEAKER_02 37:05

Yeah, totally. Um, getting curious and being like, okay, I know this and I'm experiencing discomfort. What is this discomfort here to teach me? That is a huge shift. Um, and to kind of develop on that idea when you're encountering discomfort, especially in the early days, I think it's helpful to think about it through the lens of like a maybe a resource audit, right? Like what resources do I have at my disposal to navigate this discomfort? And you might find that you have more resources than you realize, right? Like you can you can think of um your story of yourself to yourself as a resource. What's my identity say? When I hit discomfort, I am the kind of person that insert something here, right? Um, if you're not drinking, then a resource that you have available to you when you are faced with discomfort is clarity of mind, right? Like uh is presence, right? So um do a quick resource audit and ask, like, you know, what do I need to bring to bear of my resources to navigate this discomfort and get to the question, okay, what's on the other side of it? What's it, what's this discomfort here to teach me?

SPEAKER_01 38:24

Yeah, because I just think it's important to note that when we're in the cycle of discomfort around drinking, it is a groundhog day of the same experience of discomfort. And the thing that happens when you get off that, you know, that pattern and you move to the discomfort that you will experience when you let go of alcohol, that is a different pattern. It's it's you don't stay stuck. So when you're uncomfortable and then you you have the opportunity to use the resources, learn new skills, tackle what is underlying the discomfort, get familiar and comfortable with the discomfort, like learn about it, embrace it. There's all these different things that can be done, but they really can only start to be done when you're out of the that's not true. You can do it alongside when you're still drinking, but you know, they're there, it's harder. It's harder because the discomfort of the hangover and the the itchy scratchy feeling at five o'clock tend to take over, you know, those are our biological needs that are needing to be met at that point. So it's just it's just more challenging.

SPEAKER_02 39:36

Yeah. Well, what you're talking about is like breaking out of autopilot, like breaking out of the groundhog day, stopping the loop, um, is is so huge. And then you have this whole trajectory that's different, you know, it's like you've been spinning around in one circle, not going anywhere. You're spending tons of energy, but you're not going anywhere. And then all of a sudden, you know, you make a different choice, and you can actually like that energy will actually take you somewhere. Um, and it's really it's really exciting because like you know, who where is that energy gonna take you, right? Like, there's there's so much hope on the other side of dealing with discomfort. Um, and another kind of maxim that I uh live my life by now is that growth requires discomfort. If we are changing, if we are growing, if we're doing something new that we haven't done before, discomfort is the is the indicator light that that's you know what's happening. And that really kind of changes your relationship with discomfort because it's like, oh, we're like, oh, oh no, discomfort. Oh, good discomfort, right? Because now I know that I'm in the right direction. I'm going, I'm growing somewhere, something's happening. Um, yeah, yeah, it's just unnecessary.

SPEAKER_01 40:56

Totally. I was just just as a last final thought, I was having this image, and I maybe we've talked about this before, but like of the butterfly, you know, like when when the butterfly is in the cocoon and it's making all of that like trying to get out and break out, and you know, I'm sure it's uncomfortable for that little butterfly, like they're having to crack the thing. And and if you were someone, a well-meaning someone, and you went in and you were like, Oh, that poor butterfly, I don't want it to have that discomfort. Let me just pick apart that cocoon so that it can be free. The butterfly doesn't end up like getting the strength. And that's a whole biological process that is required for it to happen so that it can have its beautiful wings and fly. And so it's like when we get in there and we have a drink to stop that discomfort from experience from experience that discomfort, we're missing out on what we need to be able to fly, you know? Um it's just it's a well-intentioned instinct, but it just it's so like harmful actually towards our growth and our ability to like live our best life.

SPEAKER_02 41:59

So yeah. So, folks, if you've made it this far, next time something comes up and you're experiencing that discomfort, look at it and be like, I see you. What are you here to teach me what's on the other side of you? Um, we hope that this episode has given you some resources to be able to do that. Uh, and until next time, I've been Jonathan.

SPEAKER_01 42:20

This is Ellen. Thanks for sticking with us.

SPEAKER_02 42:23

Have a beautiful day. Thanks for listening to the Alcohol Myth Podcast.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

If this episode sparked something for you, we'd love to hear about it.

SPEAKER_02 42:31

Send your questions, stories, or ideas for future episodes to thealcoholmyth at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_00 42:37

We read every message. We really do.

SPEAKER_02 42:40

Take good care of yourself. We'll see you next time.