The First Time Without Is The Hardest One

Staring down your first sober wedding, birthday, holiday, or night out and thinking, “There’s no way I can do this without alcohol”?

In this episode of The Alcohol Myth Podcast, coaches Jonathan Ball and Ellen Biggs break down “Freaking First Times” (FFTs): the first time you do something alcohol free that has always been paired with drinking. We talk about why these moments feel so big, how exceptions keep you stuck, and how to approach your firsts with curiosity, a plan, and self kindness.

If you keep telling yourself, “I’ll start after this event,” this conversation is for you.

In this video, you’ll learn:
- Why sober firsts matter more than “perfect streaks”
- The exception trap that blocks real momentum
- How to handle birthdays, holidays, dates, and weekends away
- Why the first time can feel awkward, and why it gets easier fast
- How to collect evidence that alcohol is not required for fun
- What to do when you discover you do not even like the thing anymore
- How to choose the right “difficulty level” so you do not get discouraged

Quick takeaway:
Nobody can prove to you that your birthday, holiday, or anniversary is better without alcohol. You have to run the experiment and gather your own evidence.

Tiny FAQ:
Q: What if my first time is not fun?
A: That is still a win. You collected data and built a rep. The next time is easier, and you get to tweak the plan.

Q: What if I mess up?
A: Be kind, learn from it, and come back. Treat it like a data point, not a verdict.

Connect with us:
Email: thealcoholmyth@gmail.com
Jonathan: https://livecreativeaf.com/
Ellen: https://ellenbiggscoaching.com/

Subscribe for more episodes pulling back the curtain on the alcohol myth.

Chapters
0:00 “You have to try it for yourself” (birthday belief)
1:10 What are Freaking First Times (FFTs) and why they matter
2:19 The “special occasion” trap and why we keep exceptions
4:09 “There will always be an excuse” to delay change
5:20 Dry January: helpful, but not the full skill set
6:43 Freedom vs white knuckling: building a life you actually want
8:35 The best mindset for firsts: curiosity and not knowing
9:29 The “evidence buckets” that shape your beliefs
10:11 When you quit and realize you do not like the thing
11:22 Reimagining the holiday instead of suffering through it
13:48 Your first sober hang with a drinking buddy
15:23 Jonathan’s FFT: the Renaissance Festival alcohol math
19:05 First try without alcohol: why it felt miserable
20:48 Second try with the right tools: night and day difference
23:28 The real “lack of inhibition” without alcohol
30:56 Ellen’s cautionary FFT: the oyster bar at the bar top
33:09 Build reps, do not start in the deep end
37:30 Closing advice: commit, stay curious, be kind

#SoberFirsts #AlcoholFree #SoberCurious #QuitDrinking #AlcoholMythPodcast #ThisNakedMind #HabitChange

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Whoever's listening that believes very much that you need to have alcohol on your birthday, because that's when you celebrate and that's how you celebrate. For me to sit here and tell you, you will have so much better time without alcohol. It's like I I can't tell you that. Only you can discover it for yourself. And the only way to discover it for yourself is to try it. It's the only way.

SPEAKER_00 0:22

Why does the world act like alcohol is the answer, even while it is creating problems of its own?

SPEAKER_02 0:26

On the Alcohol Myth podcast, we pull back the curtains so you can see what's really going on with alcohol and what life could be like without it.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

We are coaches trained in this naked mind and effective liminal psychology who fell for the alcohol myth for decades. Now we help people take back control of their lives by changing their relationship with alcohol from the inside out.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

You don't need to wait for a rock bottom. You don't need more willpower. You just need a new way to understand what you are feeling and why you are reaching for that next drink.

SPEAKER_00 0:54

So let's dig in. And today we are talking about the concept of those firsts, those AF firsts, those freaking first times that you go out and you do something that historically would have involved a lot of alcohol, and now it might not. And so let's talk first, Alan. Why are freaking first times or FFTs, why is this such a big deal?

SPEAKER_02 1:41

Oh gosh, where to begin? I I think um I'll just say in my own personal experience, the reason why they were such a big deal is because when I think about FFTs or freaking first times, I often think about kind of the the bigger events in life, you know? And and big is there's a lot of room in there. So big from like date the first time I have a date with my husband without a bottle of wine attached to it, all the way to my first Christmas, you know, my first holiday, my first uh, I don't know, weekend away. All of the the things that in my mind, I was like, oh, there's no way in hell I'm not doing that without alcohol. A, I don't want to do it without alcohol. Like those are the things that I I need alcohol for, I want alcohol for. So I'm gonna save those things. I might get some alcohol free time here or there, but I'm not gonna, you know, those are special somehow, right? And um, and so when I started to tackle those special things and show myself that I could do it without alcohol, like sort of a damn broke loose within me that was like, oh my gosh, like, wait, I can have Thanksgiving without alcohol? Like, I didn't think that was possible. I didn't think I would ever even want to do that. And so it just sort of put a whole question mark and a lot of my belief system around what alcohol is required for, you know? Um, and also because they are these sort of special occasions, but they're not super uh unique. I mean, they happen all the time, right? Like, you know, you get invited to go out with your friends, and that could be a FFT if you've never done it before. And so it also tends to be something that we make exception for when we're trying to get some alcohol free time. And we're like, okay, I can drink Monday, not drink Monday through Thursday, but Friday, I gotta drink because I'm going out with my friends, and it can get in the way of us making any progress because we're always have these exceptions, right? And then we never get the true time away from alcohol that we need to feel a difference.

SPEAKER_00 4:01

Yeah, I definitely um in my alcohol drinking days, I would go through these periods where it was like, okay, Jonathan, it's time to make a change. You've got to do something here differently. And then I would look ahead to what I had on the social calendar and be like, well, I mean, yes, I definitely want to make a change, but next Friday, I've got this game that I'm going to my friends, and then the following Friday is July 4th. So obviously that's out. I can't I can't stop there. And then I just the realization um that there was always going to be an excuse to not start to make a change. Um, and uh then buckling down and saying, okay, like if I'm gonna try out this alcohol-free thing, there is going to be a time where I have to do the uncomfortable thing and actually do something differently.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

Yeah, I um yeah, I I I totally relate to that. And I think that um another thing that can tend to happen is that we take like a we commit to dry January, for example, and we're like, okay, well, in January, I just won't schedule anything, right? I mean, that's why dry January tends to be a thing. We've overdone it at the holidays, and there's not really a major holiday in January, right? Like, okay, this stretch of time, I can do it, and I just won't go out. I'll just be at home and I'll just not drink and I'll get my 30 days. But what we don't do when we do, I mean, that there's nothing wrong with that. And quite quite often we do need to protect ourselves in our early days of not drinking because it's all we can do to not drink. But if we don't put ourselves in some situations that, you know, we are going to be faced with in life, then we don't ever give ourselves the evidence, the um the confidence that we can actually do things that are in life, you know, with with without alcohol. And it's really important to start to show ourselves up.

SPEAKER_00 6:15

Yeah, that that makes me think of um, I mean, there's like the dry drunk or whatever, like somebody who is um not drinking alcohol, but they haven't done any of the other like healing work that they need to do or figuring themselves out. Or I think about people who are not drinking anymore and miserable, and you know, like just really struggling and white knuckling and stuff like that, that still feels like a prison of alcohol to me. And if you're in a situation where you won't let yourself do anything fun and you make your life really small and insular because you can't imagine doing things without alcohol, then you're still beholden to like the alcohol master that you need to break away from. Um, and I think that's one of the really special things about like the methodology that both you and I employ and that we found freedom through, is like it's really focused on that that freedom element. How can it be joyous? How can it be truly free? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:25

So true. And I think, you know, honestly, this is something that kept me stuck for a really long time, years even, because I was like, I'm gonna have to choose between, you know, giving up all the fun, you know, giving up all holidays are gonna suck, you know, birthdays, no champagne, oh, I don't what's the point? You know, like that's how it felt that that had to make that choice or continue drinking. And so to start to um get to experience some of those milestone events and and experience them alcohol-free. And I think it's important for us to talk about too, that the first time we do something, it might feel uncomfortable, you know, the first time we do something alcohol-free and we've never done it before, or we can't remember the last time we did it before, we've never done it before, and as an adult, of course it's gonna feel uncomfortable and it and it may not be great. And so, like, if we go into it thinking, you know, this is I'm gonna do it and I'm gonna show myself and it's gonna be so great. Or we also might go into it like, this is gonna suck, I'm gonna do this, but it's gonna suck, you know. I mean, either one is is a recipe for disaster. I think what we really need to do is go into it with like complete not knowing mind. Let me just see what happens, let me be curious, and let me be okay if it does suck. Because the science shows that if you do something one time, when you do it again the next time, it's not just 10% easier or 20% easier, it's actually 70% easier. And so, like, we just have to get through that one time and show ourselves that we can do it. And even though maybe it wasn't great, we're gonna have that pride of okay, we did it, and then we do it again, and it's gonna be 70% easier, and we're gonna be more likely to enjoy it, and then the next time even more, and the next time even more. So it's a process, it's not like an overnight switch, but until we start and do those very first uncomfortable FFTs, we don't have a chance to get to the second and the third and the fourth.

SPEAKER_00 9:29

Yeah, it reminds me that like we've been collecting evidence for our whole drinking life that you have to have alcohol around for XYZ thing to be fun. And you know, the times that it's been fun and alcohol's been involved, we're like, this is in the alcohol makes this fun bucket. And that bucket might have gotten really full and really big over the course of our entire drinking career. And so it makes perfect sense what you're saying about it, it might take a little bit of time to fill the counter bucket to make things seem palatable. And like you might even start, you might even go and do things that you used to do drinking and not drink, and then realize I don't even like that thing anymore. I was just using it as an excuse to drink. Like, um, I for me, like go into a baseball game, right? I used to I used to really enjoy that uh when it was Thirsty Thursday game and you know, like the five dollar pitchers or whatever. Um turns out not as much fun, Stone Cold Sober for me. People love baseball. I I love you, but I don't love baseball. And realizing that and like kind of like I had to let myself kind of mourn that realization, like, oh, you know, like this is something that used to be part of my life, and now that it's gone, something else can take that spot, right? Like I'm getting I'm giving up some things that don't actually bring me joy and opening up all kinds of space for new things that do.

SPEAKER_02 11:15

Yeah, I think that's such a good point. And I think that this can come in all layers, right? It's making me think about like Thanksgiving, like okay, Thanksgiving is a beautiful holiday, but if you have always hosted your entire family and had 20 people and you have been the one that was doing all the work and doing all the prep and doing because you believe that you needed to host this beautiful Thanksgiving meal, and then you try and do that without alcohol, you might be like, I hate Thanksgiving. But it actually might be that you hate the way you've been doing it. Like, no wonder you've been drinking because you've been doing all the things, you know. Like Thanksgiving the next year might look like, okay, everybody brings something. Or you know what? I've hosted the last 10 years. Somebody else host, I'll bring a side dish. You know, like we don't have to stick with the narrative of, I love this, I hate this, now what, you know, like we also get to reimagine what we um are willing to, you know, to do once we take away the booze and find out if we really like it or we don't.

SPEAKER_00 12:19

I think that connects perfectly with what she was saying about staying curious in those moments, right? Like if we pre-decide the outcome, like, oh, this is going to be terrible, or oh, this is gonna be great. And it isn't terrible, it doesn't meet our expectations, blah, blah, blah. Like, if we don't really say curious in the moment, in the present moment, and just like take in the information and the feelings with that spirit of an experimenter, you know, like think about it as like doing your own study of you in this environment. You have like the control, which is like with alcohol, and then now you have this like, here's the experiment, what's going on? How am I feeling about this? Um, it can it can kind of depressurize it, and like you're gonna learn so much from that experience.

SPEAKER_02 13:13

Yeah, so true. And you know, something that can be helpful in those moments too is to get really curious about other people's drinking because that's can be kind of fun to observe and interesting, right? And then it's like, oh, maybe I really love my family for the first couple of hours, and then when everybody starts to get really drunk and sloppy, that's when I kind of want to leave. So, you know what I mean? Like we can learn these things for sure, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:37

Um, and we've talked about this before, but connecting this idea with um, I mean, this idea of like freaking first times or like doing things for the first time, there are even like those people that you are going to need to hang out with. And like historically, you all have been that's what you did together is drink very heavily. If you hang out with them and you're not drinking and they are drinking, that's gonna be one of those FFTs, and you're gonna have to be very aware of like what is this like to be around this person for this experience in this new clear mindset.

SPEAKER_02 14:18

Yeah, it can be very trying, you know.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

Like, I mean, I've definitely hung out with friends that I mean I'll be seeing less of because we just without that alcohol connection, don't actually have that deep of a connection.

SPEAKER_02 14:37

Yeah, and I've I've had both experiences. I've had the experience where, yeah, this person was clearly just a drinking buddy for me, and I don't really actually even enjoy them. And then I've had the experience of I really like this person, but after they've had a few drinks, they're not as much fun. So, you know, instead I'm gonna invite them on a walk or I'm gonna see if they want to meet me for coffee in the morning, and you just kind of your your relationship can, you know, needs to evolve for you to be able to continue to to enjoy it. And that's totally okay too, right? I mean, they're probably not gonna want to keep drinking with you when you're not drinking. That's not gonna be fun for them either, right? Like, yeah. And so getting back to the FFTs, I'm curious if you, you know, what is one that comes to mind for you, like an important one in your journey that made an impact on you?

SPEAKER_00 15:23

Um one that immediately springs to mind, and especially because I had a couple of different experiences with it, uh, my wife and I are big time nerds, um, and we love to go to the Renaissance Festival. It's we plan kind of our year around uh to say that it might be too much, but kind of like we we always go to the one in our state in the fall, and we always go to one in Georgia in the summer. And the Georgia one's a big trip, you know. Like we don't do a lot of traveling right now, we want to do more of it, but you know, it's this it's this whole event. Um, and so the Renaissance Festival is always historically has been this place where you I would go and it's one where I'm you know having a little bit to drink on the walk-in from my uh fun flask that's in my in one of my mini pouches. And um then throughout the day, like mostly most of the day in my drinking days would have been going from one beer line to another beer line, to another beer line to the ATM to get more money to another beer line, and just like um realizing how much time I spent standing in line, waiting for my next drink, and then like, oh, the thrill of finding a vendor that didn't have a huge long line, you know, like maybe it's like an underutilized little tent or pavilion, that's like gold. And then throughout the day, like progressively getting more and more inebriated, and you know, like just I don't know, kind of losing losing little chunks of time until ultimately it's time to have a scary drive home. And like that is that is not something that I'm proud of, but something that happened on more than one occasion. It would also it would also like my wife isn't a very heavy drinker at all. She doesn't drink anymore, but like even at the time, she wasn't a very heavy drinker. But at Renaissance Festival, right? That would be her time to like really turn up and her things like the champagne, and you know, like we'd find just the right champagne guy, and you know, I'm then I'm also doing this constant all-day calculus of you know, where's my next drink gonna come from? I'm you know, planning our route through the festival based on where I think I can get the shortest line and the fastest drink. And you know, oh, I'm I'm at half, so it's time to start making our way over here to get in line for the next one, right? Um, but then you know, she would overconsume and feel terrible. And so the whole next day of our big vacation we've been so excited about and this big, like happy, joyous day, we feel absolutely awful. Um, and if you know we leave it at that, then like that's it. But if it's like a two-day thing, right, then you start up first thing in the morning and you know, kind of push off feeling terrible until the next time. Anyway, so Renaissance Festival was definitely a big thing. And um, when I decided that I was going to first make a change in my drinking, I knew that I had to do something differently. We had a Renaissance festival coming up. Um, my wife was still drinking at the time, so she's like, I'm gonna have my champagne. I'm like, I'm going to not drink at the Renaissance festival. It's going to be my first time. I didn't have a language around freaking first times, or else I should have I would have gone into it more cautiously. Um but I made it. I went to the Renaissance Festival and I was present. I was there, but I was so bummed out. I felt like everybody else was having so much more fun than I was. It was kind of hot. I was ready to go at like 1 p.m., whereas usually it's like a gates open to gates closed kind of experience. Um, I was just kind of grumpy and done, and I didn't have a good time. And my kind of batitude also, of course, impacted my wife's experience, which was a bummer. And I just I was so distressed that something that had historically I thought brought me so much joy and so much happiness now was just going to be something that was fine, right? Like it's it's better than a day at work, I guess. Right? Like, but is that the bar, right? Is that the bar for me now? And so that was before I had discovered this methodology and done the work to actually experience freedom because I was still kind of like I was alluding to earlier, um, entrapped by the idea that alcohol is the thing that makes the thing fun. And so without alcohol, you're not having fun.

SPEAKER_02 20:27

Yeah. So what did you do after that experience? Like, what was your takeaway then?

SPEAKER_00 20:33

I determined that alcohol was the key to having fun. I wasn't having alcohol, so I wasn't having fun. Um, and then so I I ended up drinking more, you know, like from that point. Um then when I actually discovered, you know, this naked mind and um actually did some of the the healing work that's involved, um I was nervous coming into another Renaissance festival season. I knew I wasn't gonna drink, um but I didn't know if it was gonna be fun. And this time around, uh it was I don't know, it was night and day for my first experience because I was able to enjoy all the people. Like, I mean, that's one of the best things about a Renaissance festival is like a bunch of us weirdos or looking at us weirdos, right? And um I so I was I was able to enjoy um all the people that were there. I was not standing in line for you know most of the time. I was interested in attending shows. Like before, I didn't have time to go to any of the shows or see any of the performances or anything because I was so busy plotting out where my next drink was coming from and standing at a beer line. This time I saw, you know, pretty much something every hour. That was totally different and new and a wonderful like experience. And um, I mean, laughing more than ever before, and you know, cheering more than ever before. And it wasn't and it was really me getting to enjoy those things as opposed to like checked out me. That was I got to experience a because the Renaissance Festival is a special place where you can like be yourself, right? Like it's kind of, I think that's one of the things that really attracts us to it. Um, is you can kind of be yourself by exploring a different facet of yourself and just, you know, like at the Renaissance Festival, I'm a I'm a warrior, I'm a you know, I'm a those are parts of me, and I get to be that. And so I got to I got to have this like great experience at the Renaissance Festival, cheering and jeering at the shows, and experience that lack of inhibition that wasn't like chemically induced. It was just because I was getting to be myself and not worry about if other people would think I was weird, right? It was like a a natural loss of inhibition. And um, we think about like inhibition is this thing that like kind of keeps you not all inhibition is bad, first off, asterisk. But one of the things that people love about alcohol is that it can reduce your inhibitions. And when we're in the grip of an inhibition, we're kind of hiding our shine a little bit or like covering, like you know, protecting ourselves a little bit, like we're we're playing small. And so taking that off, like chemically with alcohol, that's one way to do it. But to experience that lack of inhibition without the dulling experience of the alcohol was just like this really kind of connective experience um at the Renaissance Festival. I know it's a renaissance festival, it's not this like you know metaphysical event, but it kind of was, you know, to feel that um experience of just like being in my own um self and my own body and my own mind, amongst you know, a bunch of other people and just like connecting and vibing, and it was just a great time.

SPEAKER_02 24:25

Um I I love the the comparison of the story so much. You know, it struck me as someone who doesn't know really anything about a Renaissance festival and has never been to one. In your first story, when you were talking about being at the Renaissance festival and going basically from beer tent to beer tent to beer tent, in my in my mind, I'm thinking like, this could be any event, right? This could be a music festival, this could be a county fair, this could be Disneyland, this could be like, I had no idea like what kind of event you were you were at, and because the focus, which I think is is probably true even in the moment, maybe not to quite the extent, but the way you're you know, like you're not even really you're there for the beer, you know, as much as you are for anything else. And then when you fast forward to the last way you described it, it was like, oh, I okay, now I can imagine it. Now I see because you're like, I actually participated in it. I went to the shows, I was there. This is why I love it. This is, you know, I mean, just a totally different focus of what it's all about. And I think that is just so true with so many things that we do when we're focused on the beer, we miss the entire experience.

SPEAKER_00 25:41

It's alcohol is this like great leveler where it takes something that is that could be amazing and just makes it about itself. And to be fair, like it takes something that's kind of crappy and then just makes it about itself. But we're talking about like this is crappy, this is alcohol, this is amazing. I don't want to sacrifice this little bump, right? Like, I'd rather just go ahead and experience that to blunt this experience, right? Like this this wondrous, um, I don't know, elevated experience. So yeah, like beautifully said, and like and that's kind of how I thought about the Renaissance Festival. Like it was fun to be there, but just the burden of always trying to figure out where my next drink was coming from took away, took so much mental um energy and anxiety and so much like uh brain power. And then to like have that kind of alleviated to be set aside and to experience like, oh, I just get to go and have fun and do whatever I want, like this is incredible.

SPEAKER_02 26:52

Yeah, and I appreciate you sharing too, like the kind of the middle, the middle story too, because that's also so you know, if we go into it thinking it's gonna suck, it's it's gonna suck. And yeah, there's just so much in there, so many different I you know, I was just thinking about how these FFTs, right? Like the Renaissance, this is something that you you get to go to twice a year. It's like something you plan your schedule around. And then when you go and you're drinking, it's like you think that the drinking is gonna elevate the experience, right? This is what I we tell ourselves that it's gonna elevate it, it's gonna make it better. And instead, it just completely distracts. And how much is that true about all the other special things we put off not drinking for? Because, oh, because that thing I need to drink at? Like, what if like the act what the way you were describing, being present and being yourself and having your like you're naturally uninhibited because you feel so comfortable in your body, like what you know, like wouldn't that be a nice way to spend an anniversary? Or, you know, or your first time to Spain, you know, to be so excited and open and present and clear and energized. Like, why do we want to pour alcohol on that to make it special? It just makes, you know, like being on this side in the at the time it made perfect sense to me, but it now I'm just like, God, what was I thinking? Like, you know, just drank the Kool-Aid because that's what all the, you know, that's what society tells us. You know, I mean, nobody's fault here. Like, we all drink the same Kool-Aid since we're basically non-verbal, you know.

SPEAKER_00 28:39

Yeah, uh it makes me think about how um how many of those experiences that could have been just like amazing. I'm thinking about like um different concerts that I've been to, or different um weddings or you know, like social events or parties or whatever, like they could have been really special and unique and instead just kind of blend together in this haze of making sure that I had enough to drink at any given time.

SPEAKER_02 29:13

Yeah. And I think something else that we is important to say about FFTs is that you really do have to experience them for yourself, you know? Like because we have been socialized since forever ago, you know, to believe that of course the anniversary is going to be better with champagne. Like, don't tell me it's not. Yeah, like this was me talking to a coach in early days. I'm like, I how how can it not be better with champagne? Like nice champagne, I'm talking, you know, like and I mean, I was so defiant and so resistant. And it was like, okay, but just try, just try, you know, and try, try, you know, you might have to try it more than once, but give yourself the chance to see because nobody can tell you. Like, I can't sit here and whoever's listening that believes very much that you need to have alcohol on your birthday because that's when you celebrate and that's how you celebrate. For me to sit here and tell you, you will have so much better time without alcohol. It's like I I can't tell you that. Only you can discover it for yourself, and the only way to discover it for yourself is to try it. It's the only way.

SPEAKER_00 30:24

Yeah, absolutely. Proof is in the pudding, right? Like do you have any um FFTs that are standing out to you, Alan? Any firsts that were just like, whoa.

SPEAKER_02 30:41

I have uh uh oh god, I mean, so all of them have been you know, woe on the other side of it because I'm like, what, that too? It's a matter of what? No. But I I I have a caution, like a little bit of a cautionary tale about an FFT. I can remember deciding that I was going to, I had a friend that I saw every few months, and she was kind of like um on my alcohol-free journey, I would see her every few months, and I would like be like, okay, I'm gonna try something new this time with her, alcohol-free. Because I wasn't 100% alcohol free yet. I was experimenting, right? And um, so you know, the first time I went, I'm like, I'm not gonna drink the first night with her. Okay, but then the second night I could drink, or you know, so I kept doing these little mini experiments along the way. And so I got to a point where I was like, okay, we're gonna go out to a nice dinner and I'm not gonna drink. And um, and so that was in my mind. We even talked about it, she and I, because she also was like trying to cut back on drinking. And then she was like, Oh my god, there's this place I've been really wanting to go to, and her husband didn't really care about this because he doesn't really like oysters, and she's like, It's this oyster bar in downtown Fort Wayne, and um, it was new, or I don't know, she just discovered it or something. And um, so we get there, and I'm thinking, okay, I'm gonna do this. This is and then we get there and they they sat us at the bar. Like there were no tables, so they sat us at the bar. And we sit down and we order our stuff and we both look at each other and we're like, all right, we're getting line, you know, we and we did, and we had wine. And and then it was like we we do, you know, we deconstructed it the next day, like, okay, what went wrong here? Right. And it was just like that, that was, I wasn't ready for that yet, you know? Like if we had gone out to a really nice burger joint or a really nice, I don't know, even Italian meal or something, but sitting at the bar with oysters, like my brain wasn't there yet. And so, you know, so I had to backtrack a little bit, okay, like what kind of experience, like, you know, stretch myself enough that I can have a new experience, but not like put myself in the totally deep end of the pool without any practice, you know. So that's one thing I would say about it. And, you know, now we go to that oyster bar all the time. And and and it's no problem at all because you know, I've built up to it and and now I much prefer it. I get to actually taste the oysters and they make fabulous mocktails there, and it's a great time. So um I I guess that was just one thing I want to I was thinking about. That's like, you know, if you've never done a holiday alcohol-free, maybe don't like have your first one be a 10-day all-inclusive, you know, maybe first go to, you know, a weekend away or something and build up some reps. Um, because you also don't want to get discouraged.

SPEAKER_00 33:30

Yeah. I mean, it's it's kind of what we're talking about at the beginning, right? Of like kind of building your basket of evidence that alcohol doesn't actually make this thing better, um, to counter that lifetime or that drinking lifetime of of evidence that maybe it does, right? We've kind of got to give be patient with ourselves while we build up that that basket of evidence. I think it's such an interesting wrinkle in your story about um like you all having been kind of on the same page and then kind of simultaneously letting each other off the hook for like trying to cut back, you know? And I think that that's such a common experience and so relatable of the intention. There's this there's this thing that happens when you haven't made a full decision to cut alcohol out of your life, where you're kind of in this like back and forth time or you're experimenting or whatever. And like I think every single step on the journey to being alcohol free is is important and valuable, but I can so relate to that experience of like, well, I'm trying to cut back, and and then you're like you're resisting and you're fighting and you're like you know, white knuckling, and oh, you know, I'm gonna do this, and then when you let go and just like you, you both kind of gave each other permission to have that drink together, that release is probably even more intoxicating than the alcohol, right? Like, because we like get ourselves into such a state about what we're gonna do. Um, and it you know, becomes this kind of like uh this this monolithic thing, this like thing that we're just like solely fixated on. Um and like that's the our joy of our methodology, where it it isn't we take it off of the pedestal and it becomes not this giant monolithic thing that we have to obsess over. It's just like huh, that's a substance in a glass that doesn't make me feel good. Okay, why would I drink that? Right, like it just it bec it becomes so much easier and so much lighter.

SPEAKER_02 35:48

It's so true, it's so true. And you know, like when I think about that story, when we looked at each other and it was like we both still had a very strong belief that alcohol was required in that moment, you know, like that it would make it better. I mean, that was the reason why we were like, oh yeah, no, we're we're drinking tonight. It was because it was like we we both still really believed that alcohol would enhance that experience. And that's why we made that choice. And and you know, when I look at it now and I think about having alcohol at a situation like that, I I know in my heart, I have no doubt that alcohol will not make that experience better. It will actually steal from that experience, it'll steal my presence, it'll steal my ability to taste the food, it will steal my connection with my friend. And I firmly believe these things now that I did not fully believe then. And that's part of the work of becoming, you know, fully free from alcohol. It's not refraining from drinking. That's not that's not the game. Like the game is really fully embodying the idea that alcohol has nothing to offer me. And when you can when you experience that, that's true freedom.

SPEAKER_00 37:08

Yeah, that belief level, I think that's what makes this um approach so unique, is that it's really getting at the root cause of the pain of drinking or not drinking, right? It's the it's at that belief level. Um, so Ellen, in closing, if you if somebody was listening to this and they are staring down the barrel of a freaking first time, they've got a wedding over the weekend, they've got a major holiday coming up. What advice, given everything that we've talked about, what advice would you give them as they're trying to think about this alcohol-free experience?

SPEAKER_02 37:52

I a couple of things come to mind. One is like, what when you decide that you want to try this thing alcohol free, I get excited because it's like you're gonna find out something new. You're gonna have a new experience. You've done this kind of thing before with alcohol. How many times? Like, you can do it with your eyes closed, right? But this is something new. You're gonna discover something new about yourself, you're gonna discover something new about the experience. And um, if you embrace it with that level of like curiosity and wonder, it's it's gonna serve you so much better than if you approach it with, you know, I gotta do this thing, alcohol free, or I'll never, you know, like really try to embrace the mindset of I'm really curious about what I'm gonna discover here. And I would also, like to your point, make a firm commitment because there will be moments probably where you're gonna be looking at the friend or your partner or yourself in the mirror and being like, I don't, I'm not gonna, you know, this maybe this isn't the time. And just be like, no, you know what? No matter what happens, come or hell or high water, I'm gonna get through this experience alcohol-free. And if I decide that it's terrible and I never want to do it again, like, okay, you know, but give yourself the gift of experiencing it without alcohol and just see what you discover. And what's your best tip?

SPEAKER_00 39:21

Uh well, I love everything that you said. Let me think. Uh anything that I would I think the only thing that I would add is I think the only thing that I would add is to be kind to yourself on the journey. Like it's it's a marathon, not a sprint type of situation. And um don't uh we never uh make ourselves stronger or more able to uh deal with adversity if we're kicking ourselves. And so if you find yourself in the freaking first time and you're like, this freaking sucks, um, I'm I can't do this, I'm you know, like, or or if you even decide to like, even if you do end up giving in or whatever, like just be kind to yourself, come back to the table, take it as a um a learning experience. Um, we call experiences like that data points because it's it's data, it's information that you can use to inform how you act in the future. Like your story, Alan, with your friend, right? Like you were like, I'm not gonna do this, and then you ended up doing it, and then afterwards you learned from it and were stronger and more able to move forward in your alcohol-free journey because of it. Um, yeah, don't don't lose the war fight and the battle kind of thing, right? Like, just um just be just be kind to yourself, just be kind to yourself, I guess is the main thing. That's like always the main thing. Like, be curious and be kind to yourself, and that's the secret, right?

SPEAKER_02 41:06

Like, yeah, and just keep going and just keep experimenting and just keep gathering evidence, you know.

SPEAKER_00 41:14

Yeah, for sure. Well, um, thank you so much for joining us for this discussion of discussion of freaking first times. Um, we are probably gonna talk more about first times because there are like some special first times that are that deserve their own consideration. I'm thinking about weddings, I'm thinking about the holidays will certainly be something that we'll be talking about. Um, but if you enjoyed this, please let us know by liking or leaving a comment. And if this episode made you think of anybody, um, we would love for you to share this work with them and to kind of get the word out.

SPEAKER_02 41:55

Thanks, everybody. Bye-bye.

SPEAKER_00 41:57

Thanks for listening to the Alcohol Myth Podcast.

SPEAKER_02 42:00

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SPEAKER_00 42:03

Send your questions, stories, or ideas for future episodes to thealcoholmyth at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_02 42:10

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SPEAKER_00 42:12

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