Ep 10: Delta CEO: Lessons from 30,000 feet

What if the advice that changed your business came from a stranger sitting next to you on a plane? That's exactly what happened to Craig Harvey.

On a random Delta flight, Craig found himself seated next to Richard Anderson, the CEO of Delta Airlines. What followed was a 40-minute masterclass in leadership that Craig has never forgotten.

In this episode of The Drive, Craig and Blair break down the three things Richard Anderson told him at 30,000 feet:

1. Culture drives commerce. Your people are your product. If your employees won't wear the company shirt, that's your report card.
2. Eat your own dog food. Anderson was sitting in economy. On his own airline. That one says everything.
3. Learn from your losses. Anderson once took Delta into a billion-dollar loss and kept his job. Here's why.

Craig and Blair also get into what real loyalty looks like, the CULTURE acronym Craig built his whole company around, why you can't want success more for someone than they want it for themselves, and what it feels like to win a race and still miss the point.

This one's packed. If you build teams, lead people, or just want to get better at what you do, this episode is for you.

Subscribe to The Drive and leave a comment telling us the best business advice a stranger ever gave you.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

All right, it's drive time. Craig Harvey here. How many of you believe in serendipity? I can't spell it, but I know what it means. It's when you have an encounter. It's this uh serendipitous serendipitous, is that it? Uh experience where you weren't expecting, you weren't planning uh to meet someone, but you do, and it changes your life. Guess what? It happened to me on an airplane, a Delta flight of all things. You won't want to miss it. Lean in and listen to this episode of the drive. All right, Blair. We're back in the saddle. Actually, I would say in the vehicle, the drive. Obviously, I'm I'm driving your riding shotgun. Dude, I don't like riding shotgun. You don't? I get scared, bro, of other people's driving.

SPEAKER_01 0:48

Yeah. That's true. I'm I'm a very much a wannabe in control guy when I'm in the car. Can you sleep when someone else is driving?

SPEAKER_02 0:55

I gotta trust you immensely for me to be able to sleep. Yes. Well, we know Christy's uh your wife is is is doesn't make that cut. I'm sure. No, I'll play it around. Blair Ollendorf, Craig Harvey here, as we jump into this story. And you know, a lot of people say, is this story true? Absolutely. 1000%. I don't know if we can get a picture of this guy, but uh hopefully we can. You you remember when I met Mr. Anderson? Richard Anderson. It's crazy. Crazy story. Yeah. So how'd it come to be? I was flying to meet Nick Goitchai, uh a partner of ours, a friend of ours. I believe, I believe it was Nick. Uh I believe my time on that is right. Um, and I, you know, look, God's blessed us. We get to sit up front usually. This was a quick trip, though. And so I was stuck in the exit aisle, which isn't in the end of the world. I'm not sitting up front, but it um it's an exit aisle. The the seat beside me is empty, and then there's uh a person on the right side as well. And I'm thinking, yes, I've got, you know, exit row, middle seat empty. Planes about to, you know, ladies and gentlemen, please, if you would make your way, you know, store your overhead items in the seat back in front of you, whatever it might be, right? Please be sure, yeah, all whatever they say. The flight door's about to uh shut, and this old guy looked like a senator to me, bald, tie. People are like shaking his hand as he's coming down the aisle. And I'm like, so this guy's like this famous something. I don't know what he is. He he looks like a you know, a politician, you know, or some some Baptist preacher or something. Who knows? Right. Uh they're just shaking his hand. He sits down. I'm thinking, no, no, nope, nope, yes. It's like shit, right? That that you thought you had the seat to yourself. I can lounge over, okay, I can just sprawl out. No, dude sits right beside me. And hello, hello, how are you? Yes, good, nice. So I'm just sitting and we're just, you know, whatever. And I remember at this time I'm watching Sports Center. And you know when it cuts off and it goes to the announcement? Right. Okay. It's that guy. It's that guy. He's sitting next to you. Swear to God. And it's hello, this is Richard Anderson, uh, president, chairman, big shit, king shit of turd mountaineer at uh Delta Airlines, whatever it might be. And we're so happy that you've trusted us with your uh transportation travels this afternoon. As you know, Delta prides itself on yada yada yada yada. And so eventually I'm like, that's the guy. And so I'm like, I just kind of nudged him. I'm like, you know, is that you? He's like, yeah, that's me. And so he finishes his little speech. You know, please, you know, trade tables up and seat backs up as we prepare for takeoff. It'll be two hours and 17 minutes from here to wherever. And so I'm like, I'm like, wow, like this, this is God, right? It ain't the devil. You know what I mean? I mean, it's like this has gotta be God, bro. This is me getting paid back for all the good shit I've ever did. I get to sit beside Richard Anderson on a whole flight. And I was excited about it. And so I right about Chattanooga, just kind of leaned over. Mr. Anderson, hi. Craig Harvey, you know, how are you? Something stupid, I'm sure. But I I was very genuine. I said, listen, man, I am a young entrepreneur. I work in the insurance arena, and I would love to pick your brain about where you are and how maybe some things you've learned I could learn as well, uh, to to to maximize wherever it is I could go. Something like that.

SPEAKER_01 4:22

Yeah. It's crazy. Yeah, I mean, it's crazy. Most people will get into that scenario. They'll be sitting next to somebody they know they can learn something from, and they do nothing. So I don't want to bother that guy. I don't want to intrude. You know, he's on his flight. I don't want to interrupt his, you know, relaxation in between these destinations. And you have the uh fortuitous ability to say, I don't really care if I'm gonna bother him.

SPEAKER_02 4:48

I'm gonna ask him. My my my son Caden, he uh recently was showing me something, Kevin Hart, those those uh ice plunge, you know, whatever. So Lord have mercy. And Kevin was saying how he met uh uh Bezil's Bezos. Yeah, did you see that? Yeah, and he's like, he wasn't gonna say anything, wasn't gonna say anything. Hell no, I said I'm going up and saying something. He's like, Why wouldn't I? I may never get to see this guy again. I'm gonna uh plant a seed, favorable introduction. Yeah, uh respected you a long time. No, of course I'm gonna say something. You kidding me?

SPEAKER_01 5:16

And so what'd you ask him?

SPEAKER_02 5:18

You know, I so I didn't know he was in health insurance. Oh, really? Yeah. Before he got into Delta, before he came, I believe the CEO of Delta, somebody fact-checked me on that, on the team. But uh he was in health insurance, said he, you know, made a tremendous living, but that that season had ended. And um this position with Delta came about, and he felt like it was it was time for him to transition. And um I don't know. I mean, at this point, maybe we're Channel, we're you know, over Lexington, which if my geography's right, I just said, hey, uh, you know, I I opened a final expense organization. We serve. He said, I know what final expense is. I'm like, okay, I'm just making short. So I said we serve seniors, but you know, between the ages of you know, 58 uh to maybe 85, uh, with with uh prepping for end-of-life decisions. And while everybody else shows up with a bill, sir, we show up with a check. And he says, Well, how y'all doing? I'm like, Well, you know, we're doing good. We were doing we were young back then. I guess it was 2015, 2016, I don't know, 17, somewhere in there. Um, long time ago, man. Yeah. And um I said, you know, we're doing good, but I'd love to kind of pick the brain and talk to someone that is of at your level and caliber. And I said, What's some advice you could give me? Man, that sounds good, doesn't it? That's not bad. Intro, right? What are we supposed to know? I don't know. And he's like, Yeah, I'll I'll I'll tell you. And so it was almost like you only wanted to tell me one thing, but I picked three things. You remember this? So the first thing I I you know asked him, hey, what what when you when you acquired Delta or when you came in as a leader with Delta, what was one of the first things you did to kind of position you guys uh on the trajectory you're on? And he was very, he was very honest. He said, Hey, listen, Delta wasn't then who she is now. Right. And by the way, this is the CEO sitting at the on a in an exit row, which I didn't I still don't know how people knew who the guy was.

SPEAKER_01 7:18

Well, what I know is CEOs don't change very often. When things are going right, CEOs tend to stick around. Sure. Unless they, you know, right off into the sunset. But what I know about him is he had to have had a winning record to get the position. And you usually have a change of you know leadership regime during hard times. And I've from what I understand about Delta is they have been on the up for the last decade under his leadership, and so he's somebody worth asking the questions for. I'm sure he's probably written a book by now. We should we should shout that out by the end of this day.

SPEAKER_02 7:52

I think it's one thing to make a Super Bowl, it's another thing to win a Super Bowl. And I think what he was saying was look, Delta was on the cusp of what some might define as greatness, but he said there was more in them. And the first point he gave me, and dude, I just this is this this point is I don't want to say revolutionary. It's it's a word that I wasn't expecting him to say, but I'm just gonna put it out there. He said, culture drives commerce. He said it really fast. Culture drives commerce. I'm like, yes, sir, I believe that. Do you mind expanding, expounding, right? And so he began to tell me how he really dove deep into the ground crew, into the individuals, the young ladies that are working, uh, not just uh when you're you're you're you're checking in, right? Uh, but from stewardesses to stewards to every individual that that that has interaction, I'll never forget what I'm saying, has interaction with our product. And he said, Do you know what our product is? And I said, Flying? Exactly. I'm dumbass. Flying? He said, No, our product is of our flying, our product is people. You know, give it to me, you know, let leave it to me to miss the first question. You know what our product is, yeah, man? Airplanes flying. He's like, no, man, that's not our product. He's like, that's our solution. Product is people. And so he said, culture drives commerce. Now we know commerce to be cash flow, right? Right? We know commerce to be um, you know, seasons and years and months and quarters of of profits and not loss, things going up and not down. But it's so interesting what he said controls commerce, controls growth, controls uh a business moving forward. And it again, it's culture.

SPEAKER_01 9:34

Yeah. So what I know about culture, what's a great indication of do you have a good culture or a bad culture? I learned this. Uh, my wife's uncle worked for Nabisco for years.

SPEAKER_03 9:48

Really.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

And he was in sales, yeah. Oreos, Triskets, the whole deal. And uh, I remember he gave me like a pro uh like a Trisket shirt. He said, You want this? I don't want it. And I I I remember thinking like, if you get a free shirt from your company and the culture is strong, you're gonna wear that shirt.

SPEAKER_03 10:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:09

And so if you're giving your work, your employees, your sales force, your whoever they are, you're giving them swag, you're giving them brand, you're giving them a delta sweatshirt to wear to wear, and they don't want to wear it, that is a great indication your culture is lacking. You're somebody that built a company with an amazing culture that really took this lesson to heart. What are some ways that you focused on how to develop a really strong culture?

SPEAKER_02 10:37

Dude, I look, I won't I won't pat myself on the back for a lot of things, but I will, I will for this because it was right when right when Chad and I started. I mean, we're talking 2012 is when we started the company. I got fired in 2011 from my other organization. And the I guess because of the lack of culture that I saw at that three-letter organization, right? I said no to so many people here at NESB when we first started. Talented sons of bitches that could have made me money quick. Now, this is important. I remember my business partner, Chad said, Why why don't you want to hire these guys? You're wrong. I'm like, no, sir, I'm not wrong. Well, why why why don't we go that no? We're not going, not in that direction. We're not going with that individual. Because when I hire somebody, I'm I'm hiring who they are. I'm hiring the habits they have. I'm hiring whether or not they're a we guy or a me guy. That's good. I say this a lot. An I guy or an us guy. And look, I'm the one that's got to work with them every week, every day, sometimes every hour. And that's not who I want to be in business with. So culture to me was I wanted uh young men or women that would take pride in the organization, that would do it the right way, that had never really popped at a at a at a at a place that they they could they could they could take ownership of something, right?

SPEAKER_03 12:00

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:01

You ever uh rent a car? Yeah, sure. You you you came down from New Jersey. I know you stopped and saw some family. I think you guys rented the vehicle. Yeah. Are you gonna wash that vehicle before you send it back? No. Why, dude? What are you talking about? Why, Blair? You're such an asshole. Wait a minute, wait a minute. Listen to me. Sarah, bro, you're live here. Why would you not wash a car that you have driven some, you know, thousand plus miles, whatever it might be? Why wouldn't you do that?

SPEAKER_01 12:26

It ain't mine.

SPEAKER_02 12:28

Did you look at my notes? Did you look at my notes, you punk? All right. That's the point. It's gotta be yours. Right. So, okay. Again, I would I would correct myself and say it's gotta be ours. That's good. Because when you hire guys or partner with guys or get into business with guys that it's me, me, me, me, me. It's mine, mine, mine, mine, mine, mine. It's burned me. And so one of the initial components to building the culture with our organization was I want them to take pride. I I want it to matter to them. I want them to be long term, but I want them to wash the vehicle. How can they do it? It's gotta, it's gotta be a little theirs. That's why we started the partnership program.

SPEAKER_01 13:09

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 13:10

Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 13:11

Absolutely. The quality of the people you choose to partner with will dictate your culture. But then I think where a lot of people get it wrong is they can't give up control. And culture is a wee thing. And you can't dictate culture, it creates itself. It's like it's almost like a fungus, it's like a mold that grows on your business is your culture. And so you have to give them not just ownership of their position.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

Can I say lend? Can I interrupt you to say and I don't want to give them shit. No, no, no. I'll lend them. Yeah. Does that make sense? And then if you can pay it back, or I'll lend this to you if I see it works, fine. But to just totally establish you as the author, the finisher, the captain, the chief, you know, the the the you know, no. I giving something is different than lending something. In the beginning, when I'm working with somebody that's new, until I see how many games we're winning, what's what's the margin of victory that we've had, how do the players respond, or the the team, right, around you. Uh, I was quick to lend trust, but to give trust, which means it's yours now, you had to earn that.

SPEAKER_01 14:24

I agree with that.

SPEAKER_02 14:25

That's good.

SPEAKER_01 14:26

That's that's smart. But they they have to feel like they have some sort of control over where the company is going. They have to have skin in the game, but not just in matters, not just in exactly. They have to feel like their voice matters. And so, man, what is the I know you have a little thing about what is culture defined as?

SPEAKER_02 14:46

I wrote this because I was thinking about this. And I I really spent some time on this. Uh, you know, I you know, I love my acronyms because it makes it easy. And we'll put this up on the on the uh screen for you to see, but but to me, and I've had a lot of people say, Craig, you built a great culture or or tried to. What does that mean? Just like you just asked. So I just look, character, I want high character guys. Okay. I'm not talking about shits and dams. I'm not talking about what you pour into your coffee. Okay. I I'm not necessarily talking about people go through things in life and look, I want great people, but you know, you go through seasons. What I'm saying, character to me, more than anything else, because this is a for-profit organization, comes down to honestly the money. And I'm not, I'm not, I don't want to demean it, but but we could, we could, you know, get into you're in the south, you're in the north, you're, you know, this religion, that religion. When I say character, when you have to pay, when you are, when we when you were up to give a promotion, when you were up to pay a bonus, when you were up to part with monies that are someone else's that you now control, are you a person of character to keep your word? Are you a person of character to do what you say you will do? And so for me, I had to have that unity. I wanted guys that were they're again unified. That was that was big to me. Loyal. Loyalty is used. Can I tell you something about loyalty real quick? Quick tip. You do not know you're loyal until you have a reason not to be.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

That's very good. Why is it good?

SPEAKER_01 16:15

Man, it's it's something that you gotta test.

SPEAKER_02 16:18

Hey, my boy, look at you. That's what I'm talking about. You okay, you passed. But look, I'm not I'm not being a butthole to you here, although I am. Why though? Because people say loyalty, oh, I'm just loyal, Blair. That's loyal. Are you? Yeah. Until you go through shit, until you have a fight, until you have a problem, until until I have a reason to get even, until I have a reason to get mad, until I have a reason to maybe tell the truth. Loyalty to me is a choice that despite, again, people say I'm loyal and you've never gone through anything. You don't know you're loyal, son. Loyalty is when, okay, dude, I stumped my toe. I I I effed up here. I I I should not have done this, or maybe you should not have done this, right? But loyalty steps up and says, you know, I love where we're gonna go more than the little tiny stumbling block that that we just experienced now.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

Yeah. It's it's like a good marriage, you know, it's going to be tested. You're gonna go anywhere of significance, your loyalty to who you're working with is going to be tested. And I think it's a blessing when it's when you fail that test. Because like we talked about before, man, it's where people show you their colors, you gotta believe them.

SPEAKER_02 17:35

I just think it's shit when people say I'm loyal that haven't been through any shit. Yeah. Yeah. It's like like Chad Miller and I have been through a lot of stuff. You can only imagine, as as type A as he is, and I am, as control freaks as both of us are, we've both had not reasons to leave, but you just have reasons to be like, what the hell was that? But loyalty is like, listen, in spite of anything that wasn't, or how we wished it could have been a little better, we have we have been committed to this organization, to this company loyal to one another, uh, not to a fault, but to a win. Character, unity, loyalty. Teachability. Uh teachability is next. Teachability is when you think you know it all, but you still are willing to learn. Like, think about that. Teachability. When you think you know it all, but you're still willing to learn. I became the most teachable when I thought I knew. Gosh, I know this, I know this, I know this. But teachability says there's more to know than what I do. And I think that so plays into the culture of an organization. Because if you come in, you're like, oh, I've worked at these places before, I've done these, I've sold insurance before. How many meetings have we done where people have said, man, you know, I've I've I've learned, I've sold, I've uh, you know, been places young boy, you've never been. When you start, you know, as young as as you and I did. Um, but but but teachable is what you want in your culture. Unselfish was huge for me. Uh putting others first, right? I mean, I I I do understand that it it at some point we we've all at we've all got to protect our own, right? Yeah. But not at the expense of others. Not at the expense of others. And it is true that when you do help other people get what they want, it's an amazing boomerang that doesn't hit you in the face, it hits you in the bank.

SPEAKER_01 19:18

How do you acquire loyalty? It's through being unselfish. That's right. And and letting people into that is, I think these all kind of go together so well. It's how and that's the thing of a culture, yeah, is it has to kind of meld everything together. Um, I love that. Unselfish R is.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

Uh resilient. You gotta be resilient, bro. I mean, I don't I don't know when it's happening, but it is. I don't know how, but but that uh that storm is coming. And and the ability to take a licking and keep ticking is what that old, I think, Timex commercial said. But, you know, dating myself there, right? Rolex Timex, they all tell time, don't they? You know, it's amazing. You know, one's more expensive, but they all tell time. But resiliency is is um is the ability to not quit. It is to have something in you that continues to get up off the mat and come back and come back and come back. And I say it all the time: sooner or later you gotta quit quitting. Sooner or later you gotta quit quitting. Because every time you quit, you go to the back of the line of whatever new line you're about to get in. That's good. And so however bad it is where I'm at, at least I'm not having a start over at the back of the damn line. Right. And so I want fighters, I want guys in the foxhole. I get it. We're all gonna have shrapnel uh around us, and things are not going to be as perfect as we thought they were. But uh the resilient end up winning. Uh last point, enthusiastic. Enthusiasm's free. But enthusiasm comes from a place internally that that believes I'm in the right place. You believe you're making a difference, you believe that your culture is going to create commerce. As Mr. Anderson said, I like enthusiastic people.

SPEAKER_01 20:57

Me as well. And enthusiasm comes from understanding the mission of the company. That's right. You know, being on board, being on the bus, as uh Jim Collinsman said. And yeah, so culture drives commerce. That's the first thing he told you. And so I mean, just that. I mean, it's like if that was it, that'd be great.

SPEAKER_02 21:18

Listen, my dumb ass, then I'm like offered to buy him a drink. Because I, you know, I had a little you know, fire water. You know, beside me. Nothing wrong with that.

SPEAKER_00 21:26

You know what I mean? Nothing wrong with that.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

A little communion, you know, it might have been a Sunday. We're flying up there, who knows? You know, might have said some Hail Mary's somewhere. So now we're not above Kentucky. We're we're continuing to make our climb. You know, we're we're uh, you know, you know, northern maybe Cincinnati. Yeah. Head heading towards wherever we're going. And I said, uh, can I buy you a drink? And I swear to God, he kind of looked at me. He's like, I'm the CEO, son. You know, just kind of like you dumbass. Like, hey, I'm just saying. I'm just saying. But um, he ordered uh one and he bought me one actually. Bought me a drink. So I'm very kind, very nice of this gentleman. Right. No, thank you. And I said, Can I ask you one more? He said, Of course. So you know, I'm like, well, first one went good. Maybe I'll maybe I'll get a little extra insight here. Insight, and I'll never forget what he said. He said, Eat your own dog food. That's the last thing I thought would come out of his mouth. And can I be honest with you? He said, eat your own dog food, and then he goes to the bathroom. He gave you some time. Which that to me is is that weird? Is that not weird? Like what a what a what an what a mistimed or untimely bathroom visit. Right, right. Eat your own dog food. Excuse me. Yes. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. And some just like, you know, wow, eat my own dog food.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

Did he expound on it? Like, what did he mean by that?

SPEAKER_02 22:42

I went to go to the bathroom, Blair. How could he expound on it? He's expounding on something. Something, you know, he relieves himself, whatever, you know, potties. Babies, potty, you know, you say potty, but yeah, babies. Comes back, sits down, and says, great insight there. Great insight. I'm just gonna mess it with you. I'm like, Mr. Anderson, I'm not trying to bother you, but what the hell does that mean? And so he said it was weird. It was, it was like this guy was poised to really, really have a mentoring session with me because he remembered what I did. He said, You're an insurance, right? I said, Yes, sir. He said, Do you have life insurance? I said, Yes, sir, I do. He said, You better. Because if you're not, you're not eating your own dog food. And then he went off on a does like this dissertation. He's like, son, I'm the CEO of Delta. He said, Do you know I own a private jet? I said, No, sir, I did not. He said, I own a private jet, son. And I said, Well, sir, why aren't you using your private jet to go to Michigan of all places? And he said, I use it for family. I don't use it for business. And he said, Do you notice where I'm sitting? I said, Yes, sir, I do, because I had this exit seat all to myself. Okay. Uh I didn't say it like that, but I'm thinking it. And he said, I'm flying economy. I'll never forget this, bro. Listen, so I'm flying economy at a company that I'm the CEO of. And here's what he said. He said, What kind of example do you think that sets? Blair Freaking Ollendorf. Right. I'm telling you right now, somewhere in the air, okay, between Atlanta, Georgia, and Detroit, Michigan, I got some chicken skin, as we call it back in the day, right? Some, some, some, some cold chills, because I'm like, wow, wow. The fact that from the top down, you're living what you're selling. It's not just something verbally, it's something, again, in the natural, but but in the literal, so to speak. And he said, I think it makes a big statement that I'm eating my own dog food. I'm I'm I'm you know talking Delta. I'm talking about fly the friendly skies. I'm talking about the places that we can go and the things that we can do. And here I am as the CEO doing the very thing that I am trying to convince others to do. Right.

SPEAKER_01 24:52

Bro. It reminds me of the now new CEO of Starbucks. His first name, pretty sure it's Brian. Fact-check me here. But he came from Chipotle. Really? And he would eat Chipotle like every single day. He would go to a different location. And now he does the same thing. There's a big stink about how many miles he's putting on his private jet, going to all the different Starbucks locations to get a cup of coffee, to sit in the in the cafe and eat the dog food that he represents. And it does a few things. One, it tests your processes, your products, it's quality control, right? It's it's a way to get your hands on the thing that your clientele is experiencing, but it also then eliminates excuses within your culture that there's some someone on high that's telling me to do something they're not willing to do. And that's one thing that I've learned from you for the 13 years that I've worked for you is you've never asked somebody to do something you weren't willing to do yourself.

SPEAKER_02 25:52

You know what's funny when you know we're in the business of protecting lives and it's all fun and games, right? Until the fit hits the shan and somebody dies. Yes. And then, you know, you you you're you're responsible for for delivering that death check. And dude, I remember I've delivered them, brother. I've delivered death checks to people that it was difficult. It was so my grandfather, Guy Grady Farmer, died with a Colombian life policy. That's how we buried him. Opal Ruth Farmer died with a, I'm just gonna say it, a unity policy. Right. Right? Former company eating my dog food. You you you're from New Jersey. You like Bon Jovi? Yeah. Did you know? I saw a recent interview with with Mr Bond, huge fan, as you know I am of his, where when when he was writing about the songs that hit number one and when he wrote them and how they spoke to him and and and some of those he and his wife were going through a tough time. He said when he you know hit stardom, and he wrote the song, you know, I'll be there for you.

SPEAKER_03 26:57

These five words I swear to you when you breathe, wanna be the air for you. You know that I'll be, you know that there, you don't know that.

SPEAKER_02 27:07

Yes, I know. I I thought you wanted to sing, but hole. I thought we had a moment here, okay?

SPEAKER_03 27:12

For you, I live and I die for anyway.

SPEAKER_02 27:16

Um he so he tells the story, bro starts tearing up. And he said, I wrote that for my wife. And when he says, I hate to miss your birthday, baby. You know what he says? He said, I miss the birthday. And what to me, what he's doing, when I say he's eating his own dog food, he's living, he's being authentic to what it is that he's selling. He's out here selling music, he's not just making records, right? He's not here, you know, singing shit that doesn't matter to him. And to me, it is hard to make millions. It's hard to make hundreds of thousands selling dog food you don't eat. You got to believe in what you're doing. And I think one of the things that helped me succeed, and I think has helped you and helped others, is that, you know, while whatever it is that that that you're offering, whatever it is that you're trading time for money for, if you can believe in it, bro, it makes it easier for that transaction not just to be natural, not just to be, you know, authentic or simple, but but but but but they s they sense it. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 28:19

Right. Yeah. Brian Nickel is the the CEO I was talking about, Brian Nickel. Is he a he's not a singer? Okay. Uh me and Bon Jovi, believe it or not, we share a landscape work.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

I heard that.

SPEAKER_01 28:28

Yeah. I heard that.

SPEAKER_02 28:29

You told me this.

SPEAKER_01 28:29

Talent talented, talented man. Yeah. Um the last thing about eating your own dog food, especially in in sales, and when you're leading teams, it's not so much about you know, enjoying the end product or even being willing to use it. It's more about habits. It's more about doing what you say you will do and what you're asking them to do. If you're not doing it yourself, we always talk about people pick up about 70% of the good things you do and they do about 125% of the bad things you do. It's caught versus taught.

SPEAKER_02 29:02

I mean, we're I've heard people say, dude, you your actions are speaking so loudly. I can't hear what the hell you're saying. Like, like I'm deaf to your words because I'm watching so much of what you do. That's what he was talking about, eat your own dog food. He's like, I'm I'm sitting here telling the world fly Delta, fly delta, fly delta, fly delta, and you're flying a private jet.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

Right.

SPEAKER_02 29:25

I don't think he was on the left.

SPEAKER_01 29:26

Don't sit there and and eat a eat a nice steak and then tell me eat a can of alpha, right? Yeah. Is the point.

SPEAKER_02 29:33

That's right. That's right. Dude, let me give you number three. Uh, because somewhere right before landing. I didn't get a lot from him on this one, but he told me this story that was unreal. And you can Google, fact check me on this. I'm telling you, God's honest truth. Uh, shout out to you, Mr. Anderson, if you're watching this. Um, and I and by the way, he told me at the end of our talk, he's like, you are going to be hyperly successful. And I said, Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. I hope, who knows? And define success, right? You know, LeBron's not rich. Jeannie Buss is rich. Right. She's she's the wealthy one, right? Um, he said, learn from your losses. You gotta remember, bro, shit gets viral. People start talking the same language. And I hate it when people just, you know, it's almost like a clap phrase. Learn from your losses. Oh, yes, yes, learn from your losses. That's wonderful. Well, what did you learn? Or what loss did you experience? He tells me the story where he lost upwards, he said upwards of a billion. Listen, B, billion dollars overall investment. It was with an Asian organization or country, let me say. And he goes before the board and he's like, I know they're firing me. He's like, Craig, it was a massive loss that we experienced at Delta trying to expand, trying to do some things at this area or era. Didn't work. We got to ask it. And he's like, I get called on the board, I know I'm getting fired. And he says, they asked, and they look, he opened up the guy giving freaking massive credit because he he really was trying to help a young entrepreneur, which he did. And um he said, We didn't, we didn't win. Doesn't matter why. Doesn't matter whose fault it is, doesn't matter that the left tackle didn't block, doesn't matter that we got a pass interference penalty, right? You know, that would have sealed the game. He's like, you know, when when when when you're looking to win, excuses or reasons do not get you out of a press conference. Here's what he said. What does his ownership? And he just said, learn from your loss, learn from your loss. So he goes in front of the board, explains his side of the story, expecting to be fired. And they said, Well, we expect uh better next quarter. And it was like, we're better next quarter. And he's kind of set me up and he's helping me. By the way, he's a great communicator. And he said, Yeah, we've just invested somewhat. What was this investment? You said upwards of of maybe a B million dollars in you learning that we don't do this again. That's right. That's right. Let's go out, do better next time. You have the support of the board. Something to that effect. And I was just like, damn. I wish every time I screwed up, you know. It's me like that. That's initially what I was thinking, right? Right, right. But as as I marinated on it, he owned it. He didn't go in and blame anybody else. Right. He didn't go in and say it was distribution or it was fabrication or it was uh something that we were promised that we didn't get. And he just said, brother, learn from your losses, own your losses, and then and then be better next time.

SPEAKER_01 32:35

So he said. I mean, if you don't learn from them, you're bound to repeat them. Yeah, right. And I I think that that's the biggest takeaway is you're either winning or you're learning.

unknown 32:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:46

There's truly never should be a real loss. Maybe financially, right? But if you learn enough from it and don't repeat it, and you actually force change, that's where I think most people lose the ball, is they they know the lesson, they've taken the loss, but then they don't force change. That's okay, what am I gonna put into action from this lesson to make sure that I've never experienced this pain again?

SPEAKER_02 33:12

So I know we've uh we're supposed to, according to our producer, we're supposed to share a couple of losses that we've learned from in the time we've got left. You know, I don't I don't I don't think I should have got fired from my first company, but I can see a little bit maybe why they did, because I needed to be humbled. Um you know, I mean, if if if I if I think I'm cocky, I'm probably a dick, right? Like I don't think I am, but maybe I don't I don't know. I'm trying, I'm trying to go back and think. Like, wow, maybe maybe I maybe I I was I was too brash, you know. Maybe maybe I was too bold. Maybe maybe I did believe too more in me versus we. But that's why that second go around when I got a chance to captain the ship myself, it was we, not me. Right. Okay. Um so one of the losses I've learned is is to stay humble. Bro, stay and can I tell you a way to do that? Is listen to your critics. So, you know, everybody's not gonna like you. Look, I'm not everybody's cup of tea, but I'm authentic and I'm honest. And if you get to know me, I don't lie. I don't lie. And if if it if what I said winds up being wrong, that's not a lie. That's the the the story of the truth changing. Does that make sense? But I'm super, super, super just direct and and have a heart to genuinely help people. But what what what I learned from that that firing was humility. Pride comes before the loss, my father would say from up there. And so it's like, damn, I don't want to lose. So if the less pride I have, maybe dad's right, the less losses I experience. How about you?

SPEAKER_01 34:50

Man, for me, it's a big lesson I learned. Like the biggest hit I took in in business to date, hopefully, nothing ever hits me this hard again, was listen to actions, don't listen to words. And have the courage to let go of fast, easy money for the long-term health of your business. And man, there's some lessons, man, where it doesn't matter who tells you. You just have to learn them yourself. Like I I I got guys on my team where I I just stopped teaching the lesson. Yeah. I just stay, I would say, but when they when they get it to themselves, I say, hey, this is one of those things you just had to learn yourself. That's why I didn't warn you about it.

SPEAKER_02 35:34

Remember earlier we were talking, and you're like, you know, I I would say things and say things and say things and they say say things, and you'd be like, Harvey, you've continued to mention this. I'm like, yeah, dumbass, because y'all don't ever start doing it. So I would I would stop saying it if you start doing it. Yeah. So I again, when you when you see something someone is doing, and and you continue to highlight that behavior, that attitude, um, that that that tendency, what you're trying to do is be that beacon of light. Ultimately, people are responsible for their own choices. What we're responsible for is the information that will create change in them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

One of the reasons that that hit me so hard was because I was judging the actions, judging the outcomes and everything that was happening in this scenario based on incorrect information. My reporting, my data was actually off. And I kind of knew it. But it was like I saw the math, and the math that was incorrect was looking okay. And so I just chose to believe in the incorrect data. And if I had taken the time to really dive into the find the right information, make sure that I'm reporting and making business decisions on the absolute Bible of what is happening in the math of the business, I would have taken a different action earlier. And so that's a second lesson that I had to learn is validate and make sure that your reporting is the true math. That's good. True numbers. So that you can make real decisions. That's good. Should we give them one more?

SPEAKER_02 37:04

Wait on the next podcast.

SPEAKER_00 37:05

What do you want to do?

SPEAKER_02 37:06

I'm good, man. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you got one more lesson. I think this has been great. I think we've nailed it. I can I can give them one more. Or we can wait and you know, give them some. You know, I lessons, I mean shit. I I um I got one.

SPEAKER_00 37:18

No, I got one. You got one? Yeah. Go ahead.

unknown 37:20

Go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 37:22

I mean, it's uh uh time and time again. You can't want it more for the person you want it for.

SPEAKER_00 37:29

Yeah, than they want it for themselves, yeah. Yeah. That sucks. That's you know what I mean? That wasn't lethal.

SPEAKER_02 37:34

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. That was that was lethal, dumbass. What I'm saying is it sucks when you want it more for them than they want it for themselves, but then every time you meet with them, yeah, they talk about how bad they want it. It sucks when you're like, hey, Blair, if you could just make these changes. Blair, I'm noticing you take off every Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Damn, I'd love to have a three-day weekend. I haven't had a three-day weekend since, you know, when I can remember. Yeah. And you keep talking about a destination, but you're not putting forth the effort.

SPEAKER_03 38:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:05

So who the hell can you know accomplish those kinds of you're talking about you've got a filet mignon uh, you know, appetite, right? But but your habit budget is like sirloin or spam at best.

SPEAKER_01 38:19

And it goes back to the the first lesson, which is believe people's actions, not their words. And that's been my the biggest heartbreaks have been wanting it for very, very talented guys and girls more than they wanted it for themselves, and spending so much energy trying to pull people. And so identifying and reading the actions that lead you to where you want them to ultimately go. Sure.

SPEAKER_02 38:46

That's that's key there. I'll give you this to we'll get out of here. Uh, I read a book years ago, Adventures and Missing the Point. Um forgive me because the author's name escapes me right now, but you know, there have been times in my life, Blair, I've missed the point. But what sucks is that I won the race that I thought would give me what I wanted. That's the whole point of missing the point. Does that make sense? Yeah. And so, you know, you chase something, you get it. You fight for something, you win it. You climb a hill, you ring the bell. Damn, shouldn't I get what it was that that I was at? No, you missed the point, dumbass. Like, like what it was wasn't what you should have been chasing. Now, I'm not gonna take the time to tell you what my point was, but everybody I'm sure watching it right now, you have a point. And and I'd write it down. I'd write down this is what I want, this is what I'm after, this is what I'm fighting for. And then every decision you make has to reflect moving you in that direction. And here's the thing about success success will move you sometimes away from the initial outcome and direction that you wanted to go. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_03 39:55

Right.

SPEAKER_02 39:55

And so I missed that point. I wished I hadn't. I had, but the good news is I'm only 50. A lot of time left, a lot of opportunity left. And you know what? A lot of drive left.

SPEAKER_01 40:05

What do you got before we get out of here? Man, you just have such a knack for running into people. I'm excited to hear about the next person you run into. Uh I mean, it just seems to happen to you once a month that you run into somebody fancy. So, man, this one was good though. I'll give you that.

SPEAKER_02 40:18

Yep. Richard, thank you. Thank you for tuning in to the drive. We will see you in 167 hours. Thank you for watching.