015 The Uplift Podcast: Recalibration, Not Decline: High Performance Through Perimenopause with Kristin Gattins

There's a quiet story a lot of women start telling themselves somewhere in their forties that the most driven, most fired-up version of them is now behind them. The energy shifts, the spark flickers, the drive that used to be automatic suddenly needs manufacturing and they file it under "I've lost my edge."

In this episode I'm joined again by performance psychologist Kristin Gattins to take that story apart. We're not doing toxic positivity here. We name the hard, disorienting parts of perimenopause honestly and then we talk about what you actually do with them. Because this isn't a time to slow down. It's a recalibration, not a decline.

We get into the difference between being tired and losing your drive, why so many women turn this season into a referendum on their worth, how to get out of your own way when the rules really have changed, and the mindset and alignment shifts that help you feel uplifted again clearer, stronger, and more yourself than before.

In this episode:

• What women are really describing when they say "something feels different and I can't name it"
• Tired vs. genuinely losing your drive — and how to tell them apart
• Why this is biology talking, not a character flaw (and how to stop blaming yourself)
• The first story you need to stop telling yourself in this season
• Getting out of your own way when your body is genuinely operating differently
• Cutting the cord on comparison — to who you used to be, and to everyone else's highlight reel
• Spending finite energy on purpose: what gets it, and what you finally get to put down
• What building physical strength does for your mind in this exact stage of life
• Measuring your worth by what you can do, not how you look
• The one shift you can make today not a five-year plan, today

About my guest:

Kristen Gattins is a performance psychologist / coach who helps high-performing women get out of their own way. She returns to The Uplift Podcast with Host Scarlett for this women-focused conversation on the mind and behaviours, especially through perimenopause.

A note: This conversation comes at perimenopause from the mind side mindset, behaviour and identity. For anything medical or physiological, your GP or a menopause specialist is the right person.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

There's a quiet story a lot of women start telling themselves somewhere in their 40s that the most driven, most fired up version of themselves is now behind them. Today we're pulling that story apart with someone who does this for a living. Kristen. Welcome back to the Uplift podcast. For anyone who hasn't been with us since series one, um, go back and listen. Um there we have had Kristen on the show before. It was actually one of our first episodes and one of our most listened episodes as well. Um so welcome back on the show. Um since then, obviously lots of things have changed for you. So if people don't know who you are, um let's yeah, tell the listeners who you are and what you do.

SPEAKER_00 0:49

Thanks, Ann. Thanks for having me back. Um my name's Kristen Gattins, and I'm a master's level therapist, turned coach, and I work with sensitive high achievers who are struggling with some of the symptoms of high functioning anxiety. So things like self-doubt, overthinking, fear of failure, just generally feeling like you're not doing enough or you're not where you should be. What the hell do I want? And like that kind of vibe. So um yeah, and I work in group containers and one-to-one as well. So that's what I'm up to.

SPEAKER_01 1:18

So since we last spoke, what what are the the women especially um bringing into the room right now that maybe they weren't a couple of years ago?

SPEAKER_00 1:28

Um, I would say that the themes are quite similar, but because I work with really like specific clients now, I see the same things over and over. But um I think there's just compared to a couple of years ago, there's a lot more awareness around certain things like perimenopause, hormones, how things affect us. We have a lot more information now that what we used to. So the thing that I do notice is that clients are a little bit more aware of like how they're feeling and maybe what some of the causes to that are, which can be a benefit and a problem. Like, so for example, people consume lots of information through Instagram, which can be helpful. I was diagnosed with, I diagnosed myself through Instagram. So it's like cool. But people be like, I have OCD, I have this. I'm like, just because you saw really hold on, this could be quite like it's quite reductive on that space. But a lot of women are like, oh, I I mean, I when I was younger, I didn't know what the hell perimenopause was, for example. You can't avoid not knowing what it is now. So women, I think, have a lot more of awareness around what might be happening to them and how they're feeling, but they're still not sure. Like, is this perimenopause or I just hate my life? Should I divorce my husband? Should I quit my job, or like, you know, that kind of stuff? So there's still like an increased awareness from a couple of years ago, but still a lot of confusion. Sometimes it makes it more confusing to be honest, because it's like, am I just losing my mind or do I hate my life?

SPEAKER_01 2:48

And I suppose there is like a massive link between the two. Like, if you live like a really, really stressful lifestyle and then you're of that age, like you're gonna be shown the same kind of signs regardless, aren't you?

SPEAKER_00 3:02

100%.

SPEAKER_01 3:03

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:04

So some people will have designed a life that they totally love, and then as Perry Mayna have paused hit, they're start to interact with it differently or think about it or feel about it differently. Other people maybe created more of a life that wasn't aligned but it looked good, or what they thought they should be doing, and that really blows up when we hit a certain age. So um that's part of the work that I do. And I work with men and women, I would say, in equal measure. Um, but this is obviously a very specific niche thing for women of a particular age.

SPEAKER_01 3:33

So yeah. Would you say then then, like because you work with both, that the correlation with females, if they are of like that age, because obviously I suppose you work with people of all ages as well. Yeah, do you notice more within that, especially from like the mindset side of things?

SPEAKER_00 3:53

Yeah, totally. And obviously, men as they get older, their hormones shift, and that affects similar things like mood and energy and you know, libido, that kind of stuff. But for women, because I mean it's crazy. If you map out how many good days a year you're supposed to feel is very small, like you know what I mean? Either if you're in the middle of your cycle, there's other shit going on, like the symptoms and stuff that that that we experience, like most of the time we actually don't feel like ourselves, and of course that gets worse and worse. So, one of the the differences between men and women is women like clockwork, a lot of them I can tell the days that they're gonna hate their partner, I can tell the days that they're gonna be like, I want to abandon my children. Like, there are so many like things that are very more specific to women's cycles than for for guys, but um, you know, obviously men are affected by hormones too, it's just not as much, perhaps.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Yeah. Um, so like when it comes to sort of people having like say if they're really driven towards their career or that the life that they really love, and then they've got like the spark kind of disappears and they don't really feel like that anymore. Is that something that people come to you with? Like, do they like they know something feels different, but they just they just don't really know what it is?

SPEAKER_00 5:14

100% and it causes so much distress, especially for my type of clients, which is who you've just described, because they're people that they really attach their identity and self-worth to things they do. And so when they're like, I'm not interested in doing that anymore, or I'm so tired, or I just feel meh, there's a huge stress that occurs because it's like, what's wrong with me? And that's the question people usually come to me with. It's like, and it can be two things, right? So sometimes when we get to be a certain age, we mature, and then we have this like desire to kind of be more of our true self. So the things that we've constructed within our lifestyle that actually don't fit our true values and authenticity, they will cause a bit of conflict. Um, I went through this myself when I was about 35. I was working like four jobs within psychology. I was playing soccer all the time and I was in a different relationship, and all that kind of stuff that I used to like really like get juiced up. I was like, meh, I don't, and I just thought I was losing my mind, or maybe I'm being lazy or I didn't know. But now, in like as in hindsight, I'm like, those things actually I did based on what I thought I should be doing, and some stuff I used to love, for example, playing soccer. And then as you start to change, your priorities change, your feelings change, your needs change, and then those things don't align. So sometimes it can be an alignment issue that does come when our soul or higher self, what do you want to call it, it's like, dude, there's more stuff to do that is gonna be on brand for you. And then other times it is a hormonal thing, and it could be one or the other or both.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

So, what kind of things would you do with someone to help find if they're out of alignment or in general?

SPEAKER_00 6:53

Good question. So alignment to me is like so authenticity is like who you are, alignment is like, are you behaving like that? So, for example, I had a client the other day, she's like, nobody ever helps me. And then someone offered her help and she's like, No, I felt bad, so I said no. Like, you feel you want help, then it's offered to you, and you say no. So that's an alignment issue. So we have to look at first of all the authenticity piece, which is like, do these people know who they are? Like your identity is around what you value, what matters to you, and then therefore your priorities will be attached to it. So, for example, things I did back home conflicted with lots of my values, especially around how people are helped, but for my own values around, let's say, freedom. So I had no time, barely any sleep. I worked myself like crazy. And what emerged eventually is like, I don't want people telling me what my shifts are and what I do. Like, I want to just do whatever I want to do. And most people tell me that's like cuckoo, you can't do that. And I was like, hold my beer, watch this. So for me, a lot of the contrast is around this lifestyle I crazy is way too busy and I had too much obligation and people bossing me around versus I value is so important to me, so I need to create a life around that freedom. Um, so finding out what matters to you is probably the most important thing, which is a values work, which is not that hard to do. It just takes a bit of time to sit with that. Um, I had someone do this with me the other day, and they're like, I've never sat and thought about what actually matters to me. Um so if anyone that's listening is interested, they could just send me a DM on Instagram, I'll send you a free worksheet that I have, like just to be able to like put language to what matters to me the most. And if your lifestyle is not reflected by those values, if there's a mismatch, that's gonna be a huge part to resolve. If everything is ticking the boxes where everything you're doing in your life totally does reflect what matters to you, then we would consider there's probably something else going on there.

SPEAKER_01 8:43

Do you think there's like a huge sort of fear attached to that though as well? Because like if you've if you get to like 35 and you've been doing the same thing or the same sort of career path since you were 18 or whatever, like a lot of people do. Yeah. And then all of a sudden you're like, I hate this or it's not right for me. Like that fear to change is so heavy.

SPEAKER_00 9:09

Totally. Yeah, you're right. And that's why people mostly stay stuck, they just settle. And that's like people like, oh, everyone hates their jobs. I'm like, no, but it takes so much courage and self-trust to be able to go, I actually don't like this. I want to recalibrate and start again. So I would say the careers I see this mostly with, definitely doctors and lawyers. Why? Because in a lot of families, that's the thing that mommy and daddy would say are the good jobs to have. And so they get to mid-30s and they're like, I hate this. Yeah. Hate this so much. And especially doctors are like, okay, I'll try emergency, I'll try orthopedics, I will try like they'll start bopping around different departments to try to fix the issue when really it's maybe a misalignment. And then when you just say, like, what's the stuff you just love? And a lot of people be like, I don't know, I just like to like walk dogs, or like, you know, so if if their desire or passion is something that would on paper look worse by somebody else's metric, then it's like, oh my god, but I can't do that, or I have this mortgage, or it just looks like a fail. Do you know what I mean? So there's so much like fear wrapped in not even just making the change, but what does this mean about me?

SPEAKER_01 10:14

Yeah. I did like a similar thing actually when I first started working in um I used to work for JD Sports in merchandising when I first graduated, and I hated it, like absolutely hated it. You know, and you just know it's not for you, but you've obviously got a degree in it, so you're like, oh, I need to kind of do this. Yeah. Um, and then one day I was like, I'm just gonna leave and be a dog walker.

SPEAKER_00 10:39

You really I love that.

SPEAKER_01 10:41

And I just I just left and did it. And I remember saying to my dad, like, I'm I've got this idea, like, can you just like potentially back me up if it goes tits up? And he was like, What the hell are you doing? You're leaving your dog to what like job to what dogs? Yeah, and I was like, Yeah, just trust me, I can't do it. Yeah, and that was like my first ever like business. Um but yeah, it's just like people just don't do that, do they? Like at the time I thought it was mental, but so glad it did now.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

100%. And people were like, I wasted so much time and money on school, and now I've done this thing, or I've told people I'm doing this thing, and now I do this, and they're gonna think I'm losing my mind and it doesn't make as much money, or whatever. Like, there's so much like perception of other people's opinion that matters to us, rather than because like if it was not that deep, imagine like we didn't no one gave a shit what anyone did. You just be like, Yeah, I'm not doing that now. I walk dogs. People like cool, I love dogs. Who doesn't love dogs?

SPEAKER_01 11:33

Right, like but it's like it's deemed like well, that's not a real job, right? It's like, well, I get paid money and uh well, dogs, it's the job.

SPEAKER_00 11:41

My dog worker gets paid a lot of money, so I'm like okay. Doing all right, you could hang out with dogs all day, it's fine. But yeah, it's like this fear of like the sunk cost fallacy, like, oh, I've already wasted so build this relationships too. I've been with this person already this many years, or we already have this. It's like if you don't like the thing, don't make it so complicated. Like, I don't want to do that anymore. Or I tried it out, I thought I'd like it. How do we find out a lot of shit we don't like by doing it and going, that's actually not for me? And you pivot.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

Yeah. Do you think that there's like a sort of when it comes to like drive then and sort of having knowing what you want to do? Like, do you think that there's like a difference between just being tired of the thing or losing your drive for the thing, if that makes sense?

SPEAKER_00 12:26

For sure. So if you're not really like let's say the thing you're doing is not totally aligned with your values and passions and talents, that drive will be compromised for sure. If you just lose interest in something, let's say, which is fine because if you trust that feeling, which is just stuff that you like, it's not that complicated, it will lead you to the next thing. Being tired, or which is either just like a lack of sleep or emotionally exhausted, or it could be hormonal, that's very different. So I could be feeling, let's say, really tired on a day. I jump on a call with a client and I'm not sitting there yawning. I'm totally juiced up because I love the conversation so much that even though I'm still feeling tired, I'm so excited about the content and the person that you can do the thing and you want to do the thing if that makes sense. Um, but for people that are struggling with the drive, there's just like a few things to tease out around like what's causing what. Um and hormones play like a massive part in it. There's several days a month, and I'll say this to my husband, I'll go, I don't want to do nothing today, but I don't want to do anything, but I don't know what I want to do. Like help me help you. Um, you know, those days where you just like want to lay on the couch and do nothing. I'm like, I'm not feeling that. I don't want to be a vegetable, but I don't want to do anything, and I don't know why. Like that's more of a digest, like, oh, I know that my hormones are being funky when I'm in that state. And then I have to just try to make the next moment as small as possible. She's like, okay, in this next moment, what would you like to do?

unknown 13:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:50

I'm gonna go for a walk. I'll have a cup of tea. I'm gonna tidy the kitchen, like just making it so, so, so small because otherwise it's just so easy to get overwhelmed. But you know, drive is essentially dopamine, right? So on Instagram, it's like reward chasing. It's like dopamine is a bit more complicated than that. It's about what motivates us. And oftentimes it doesn't come in the idea of doing a thing, it comes as you do the thing, right? Exercise is a classic one when it's pissing rain, like it always is here. Who wants to like go for a run? But as you're doing the thing, you're like, now I'm feeling good and motivated to do it. Same with tidying up your house or whatever tasks you need to do. Usually the feeling comes as you're doing it, so it's often the initiation that comes. Um, and that's what people struggle with.

SPEAKER_01 14:32

Yeah. Like I do a lot sort of within like the the coaching that I do where I'll get women to sort of mark down like where they're at on the cycle or how they feel or their like desire to do things. Um, because I think a lot of the time you get them feelings unless you're actually sort of aware of it, like you get them feelings and you're like, well, why do I feel like this now? Like, why am I crying?

SPEAKER_00 14:57

Totally. Totally. Yeah, and that's such an important thing to do. And honestly, like when I was younger, like none of like what we didn't have the internet, that's how old I am. Um, it's like none of this information was available. And a lot of us were like I was just chucked on the pillow when you're 17. It's like, oh, you have some issues physically, just try this. And so it just masks everything. So I had no clue about energy, I had no clue about any of this stuff. And now I'm like, oh my god, so much of my life makes sense in hindsight. And I think people are with information, like way more attuned to these things. Um, but it's so important to be able to track these things and go, okay, on these days, don't expect as much from yourself. Don't be a dick to yourself. The expectation or energy should be the exact same all the time.

SPEAKER_01 15:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:40

And it makes people feel inadequate and insecure and paranoid. And especially with women like um in relationships, there will be a couple days a month when you're like the person that you love and you want to spend your life, you're like, if you breathe again near me, I'm gonna literally stab your face. Like, he's my bad person, like why do I hate him? Like, it'll be gone in two days. Just try to be called like Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:02

Do you think do you think that there's like a lot of like how much of that do you think is actual sort of the the the biology talking? Um, and then and not just women thinking that they're not trying hard enough.

SPEAKER_00 16:18

Yeah, and I think that's why tracking it is important. So if you're seeing a pattern where there's a couple days a month or patterns or weeks even where something feels like it's like that makes more sense.

SPEAKER_01 16:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:29

You know how like if you're feeling off and then you get your period, you're like, I'm not insane, oh I knew it. Like, great. It's like it helps when we have an understanding about why something's happening. And mostly rather than just because we judge our feelings so much. So people feel tired, they feel sick, or they feel shitty, they're like, what's wrong with me? That's the first thing they ask themselves. I'm like, well, that's already off to a bad start. Rather than just observing, it's like, okay, I'm feeling tired right now. What do I need? And not making a big story about it. Um, so being able to track these things to your point, like that's really helpful for people to do because it gives more information about what's probably at play. And we can't cure it, there's no magic wand, but it's like, okay, during days when I anticipate a struggle, how can I help myself just through that phase?

SPEAKER_01 17:12

So, like in you know, in your own personal experience, and because obviously I know you mentioned at the start of this episode that you self-diagnosed with through Instagram, um running your own business and doing what you do from like you know, psychology standpoint, like noticing the changes in yourself, like how have you approached sort of perimenopause and things like that within your role?

SPEAKER_00 17:37

Well, I've worked on a lot of things that I didn't actually consider much before. So um diet, like things like inflammation, like these things I never considered. I just was like a past to girl. And I had to be so much more conscious of the things I put in my body because I could be I could start to feel the difference. Yeah, I can actually feel physical inflammation, like it feels like your body's expanding from certain phase. I had no clue what that feeling was. Um, and so I've had to start to pay attention to these things and then make lots of adjustments, prioritizing certain things, um, stuff that I could get away with before, Scarlet. That now I'm like, no, you cannot. Like, so I've had to be more disciplined in that way, but I actually don't mind it because although I should have appreciated it more when I could just do whatever. But it's like it, the the the consequences of not doing these things is just too much. So I'm very considerate about what I put in my body. I'm very considerate, like I do not hang out with time wasters. If I don't want to hang out with someone or someone is like not adding value to my life, goodbye. Like I'm very picky about a lot of things. I don't do shit I don't want to do. I prioritize myself, rest, sleep. Oh my god, so important. Um, so that kind of stuff where I just like care, like it doesn't matter. It's like now I'm seeing why it does matter.

SPEAKER_01 18:53

Yeah. And like it's it's worth the the extra effort because I think a lot of people just don't they they think cost they've never had to do it, then you know it's it's gonna take far too much of their time. But yeah, the quality of your life improves, so it's worth it.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

100%. And you know, as we go through some of these changes, like our identity does shift. Like I was talking to a girlfriend the other day, she went to this party, she's like, babe, no boys were looking at me. She's like, Am I the old one now? I'm like, I don't know. Like, so the things that you used to experience will change. And so a lot of people when they get to that, they they have this total identity crisis, and a lot of people to be honest, just give up. How many people are like, Well, I'm 40 now, so I'm like, you could live another 50 years. That's you done, like you're throwing in the you're just gonna atrophy and like waste away. It's like, no. So it's being able to figure out how to recalibrate and then shift because your identity will change, and what you can and cannot do will change, but it can still be awesome. Yeah, but you have to put in the effort and recognize it's worth it. I get it's frustrating. Speak to any woman perimenopause, they're all women bonkers, like because there's no easy solution, even things like HRT. So many of my friends are on it, or clients are like, oh my god, it's magical. I have not started it yet. I'm trying to postpone it. Everyone's on a different journey with it. There's no like easy answer. Um, and so there's so many things to factor in of what you can't even leave your house without a hormone disruptor now. It's like this perfume, this candle, this deodorant, it's like you can't breathe air now without getting fucking nuked in some way. So it literally does feel like an entirely full-time job compared to all the other things that women are trying to do.

SPEAKER_01 20:27

Yeah. I know. Um I mean, I had a client recently who, well, she's someone who I worked with for a long time. Um, and when you've worked with someone for a while, like you notice things that change. Like she's someone who's just like on it all the time. Um and recently it was just like so tired, like couldn't sort of function. Um, like body image was like changing a little bit, like holding a bit more in a midsection when she was just sort of doing everything. So we're like changed loads a bit with chain training, the nutrition. And then she went back to the doctors because she'd been like twice before and they were just like, Yeah, yeah, you're fine. And she was like, No, something like isn't right, and they were like, Oh yeah, it's it is that. And I'm like, so many people just don't actually even know that that's what it is either.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

Um and the issue with women's health is we have to advocate for ourselves, we have to do the research and information and bring it to the doctor, and then they don't just go, thank you for this, I'll take this seriously. You have to actually fight with them to be heard, right? So I diagnosed myself with lip edema from watching an Instagram reel. I'd been to the doctor probably 10 times in my life, probably started when I was 24, and I had no, and everyone's just like, Oh, um, you play too many sports, oh, you work too much, oh, you need to go pee more. I'm like, I couldn't possibly pee more. Like just bullshit answers for like the pain and swelling I was getting. And then I saw this chick in the gym and she's like, Do you train all the time? And this is your I'm like, oh my god, that's me. But I had to like fight these. Doctors to actually be taken seriously, and then I had to pay privately to get any treatment because the you know the doctors don't know anything. So, it with anything to do with women's health, unfortunately, that's the vibe. So, my main thing is like trust yourself if you're feeling different, it's not because you're inadequate, you're doing something wrong, or you're lazy. Most people think they're just being lazy. Trust that, and you're gonna have to fight for it, which is very difficult to do when you have no energy. But yeah, one of the main things I see with women going through this shift is mental health issues that didn't surface before. And I don't mean like clinically, I just mean like people feeling overwhelmed by doing basic tasks. That you know, if you're like this email, and you're like, dude, I could write 500 emails a day. It's not like why am I feeling so stressed about something so basic? And then that starts that self-talk loop of like, what's wrong with me? I am incapable, I'm just not that good, da-da-da. Low mood, apathy, just feeling tired. When we're tired, we don't want to do anything, we just feel like disconnected from the world. So anything to do with mood stuff is probably hormonal because it's affecting things like our serotonin and that which regulates mood, and you know, so trust yourself if you're feeling different. If a lot of people say I don't feel like myself, yeah, that's like the number one k there's something funky going on here.

SPEAKER_01 23:11

So with with that, if people start to feel like they're not themselves, like um what what would what would be something that would be a highlight in terms of like the comparison with like who you were to like what you are now? Because I like I even I know personally, like through doing the same sort of training for such a long time, like I'm not as strong and don't recover as quick as what I used to, and I've really got to just be like meet myself where I'm at. Yeah. Um but I know for a lot of people who are especially probably the people you work with who are like really high performing, like they, you know, they they get shit done in their opinion, don't they? Um how how would you help them with like not comparing with themselves?

SPEAKER_00 23:56

Yeah. I think you have to be able to find the parts of this that are good. And that's the difficulty. Because when you look at like you just said, you will never maybe be as strong as you once were, you will never recover as quickly just because you cannot go into a time machine. But that doesn't mean you cannot grow and be strong and do loads of cool shit, and you might be interested or capable of things you never were at that age, you just haven't found them yet. So most people just go, oh, like it's an identity loss, right? And there's a huge grief attached to that. But it's about being able to tune into like, what do I actually enjoy now? What does that look like at this phase? Like when I used to work like four jobs and I was doing, I mean, it was so, so, so much. I enjoy my easy life now. Like, I actually enjoy, like, I would not even have time for a coffee at home, in a shower, out the door, gone for like 18 hours a day, sometimes even longer, like not even sleeping. And now I'm like, I wake up in the morning, I snuggle my dog, I have a coffee. It's like I enjoy that slow like integration into the morning, and it's one of my favorite things, is like basic as that sounds. So you have to be able to find the things like at this stage, what do I love? What does growth feel like to me? And getting yourself actually excited about that, otherwise, it's just like the tendency to give up is just gonna be too strong.

SPEAKER_01 25:11

Yeah. Um so in in terms of like the the belief system then in in like how peak how women could change from just picking maybe one thing that they could then implement into just understanding themselves a bit more when they slow down.

SPEAKER_00 25:33

Yeah, yeah. I think we gotta as basic as it sounds, cover the essentials, which are like clients will be like, I have anxiety and I have this, and I'm like, and then they're like, Oh, I don't eat food and I just drink coffee or like Red Bulls all. I'm like, okay, we have to just do some basic self-care to be able to find an effective baseline. Because if you're not sleeping, if you're not giving yourself nutrition, if you're not getting sunlight, if you're not exercising, it's all shit we know. And it's like, but but literally, if you're not doing those things, I don't know how you're supposed to be feeling and functioning. So, how can I do any assessment on our person if they're not taking care of their most basic needs? So, my suggestion to people, which is something that you would be very good at, is just like help them figure, okay, what are the things you're not doing that your body actually needs to function? And then we check oh, how you're feeling. So a lot of people are like, oh my God, I started eating breakfast and like having protein and now I don't feel like an anxious mess. I'm like weird. Like, but these are things that we just know, but we just think, what's the benefit of it? Like, until you experience it, you go, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever. Like, I don't have time for that. So making the time to do that, and from then that space, it's like, okay, who are you at that at this phase? There'll be some values maybe in our life that will always be so important to us. And sometimes they shift and change depending on how old we are or what matters. I noticed with myself, like physical activity, like even though I miss soccer so much, I had to quit 10 years ago because it did my knee. But I remember still that last year, I'd wake up and I'm like, it's not what I'm gonna be doing. It's like, or like, oh my god, it's freezing. Like sometimes I was like, fuck yeah, let's do this. And other, but most of the times I was like dragging myself to go. I was struggling with the aggression aspect, the physicality, like my nervous system was just becoming more sensitive, where I'm like, hmm, that's not really the mood. Um, so my body started to even change around my experience as something that I loved for like 20-something years. Now I've been like trying to do new stuff because I'm I'm not gonna be able to do that or replace that. Um, and some things I've tried are boring and I don't like it. And then I'm like, okay, well, you can't just stop. I started with a personal trainer and I just thought maybe I just don't like the gym. I got a different personal trainer. I'm like, I freaking love this. You have to keep trying new stuff and adding novelty into your routine is the only way to figure out what those next thing. If you sit around on your couch eating chips, like you're not gonna know what your next thing is gonna be. And it's so easy for people to slip into that.

SPEAKER_01 27:50

Yeah. I think as well, like with that the mindset of like when people get well, well, when women get to a certain age and they start to feel a bit tired more tired, then they drop into that like, oh well, it's time to sort of wind down now. Um, but it's actually the opposite, isn't it? Like this is the time where you can then start to get into new things and and tr and try new things without that comparison. Like, like you said, there's like if you went in and did soccer again, like you're never gonna be the same as what you were, but doing something completely new and different, like that's your chance then to grow in that regard, like, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 28:30

Yeah, 100%. And the mindset matters, right? So like I used to do like lots of like beast workout, you're just dripping with sweat, and then my body was just like like and I had too many injuries, and I started doing like things like reformer Pilates, and it's like not a sweat fest, but it's like, no, that actually I actually am enjoying that, and still is hard, but it's a different vibe. And then when I was looking at research around like why that actually is more aligned for women of a certain age, it's like, okay, that actually makes sense. I was in tune with my body rather than forcing yourself to do stuff, it's actually gonna be causing more problems, affecting your cortisol in negative ways, which messes with everything else, which is the point of working out to make you feel worse. Do you know what I mean? So we have to be really tuned in and listening to ourselves. And for a lot of us, um, especially where we're taught our worth is conditional or it's attached to what we do. So many clients will say to me, Scarlet, like, I don't know what I want. Is that weird? I don't know what I like. I'm like, that's not weird at all. Because you just did a bunch of shit you thought looked good and you would have enjoyed parts of it. But truly, what do you want? Truly what matters to you. Most of us were not raised to consider that, or which is why your dog walking example, you're like, rather than if you just didn't think you'd be judged, I'd be like, Oh, like you'd be excited, tell people rather than anticipating or bracing for some kind of judgment, which most of us have. So most of us don't really know what as we want, we don't feel permission to want what do you want. So this is where we have to start, which is being like, I need to start doing stuff for myself.

unknown 29:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:55

And I think as well, uh off the back of that is like when people feel like that, they kind of stop themselves from ear trying new things because you know, people just don't like social situations, do they when it's new? Yeah. But like meeting other people as well and and being in sort of group environments where it's similar people. Like I've noticed like this past sort of year, like talking more about perimenopause and and all of that stuff, like the amount of women who are like in their mid-40s to like late forties, who still think that it's like a real old lady thing. And I'm like, it it's fine for you to have these changes, it's gonna happen to every female, right? So you know, don't be afraid to go in meet other people that are the same age as you and you know, do group training or you know, hobbies that involve other people of the same, you know, age as well. Like, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:53

But I think there's still such a label and stigma to all these things, and it's just like, okay, well, it's a signal that we are getting old, right? So it's about like your ability to conceive essentially. And so, you know, and like my friend going to the party being like, how come no boys look to me? I'm like, because they're men now and we're like, you know what I mean? It's like the things that you're used to, that is gonna shift and change your relationship with how you feel in your body because you're not fertile anymore. Um, I mean, and I don't remember the numbers, but it's like some people have perimenopause for like 10 to 15 years. Yeah, you can start in your 30s, and you might not even like go into full menopause until 50s, but these changes start happening. Um, and a lot of times, like you know, like what I said when I was going through NS35, I had no idea that that's what this was. I just thought, maybe I'm just getting tired, like I did no idea. Um, or we judge ourselves, right? So we just think, oh, I must be doing something wrong, I must be lazy. So the judgment is the main issue. And I think if you can just be able to observe it and lean in with curiosity, which is like, what's my body trying to tell me? Um, and being able to take small little actions to meet those needs, like that's just the best way to start.

SPEAKER_01 31:57

Yeah, and uh there was a thing as well that I um was learning about with women who have been more stressed throughout their like early like life and through to like even like 20s and things like that, um they do tend to go through it earlier as well because they're just their bodies are more stressed.

SPEAKER_00 32:21

100%, yeah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 32:25

Um so with the the sort of the women who felt um have felt a little bit of like this is this is a bit of me, um what what shift what one shift would you want to give them today um that they can start to implement today? That could be like from a way that they think or something that they can do in general. I know you mentioned about your guidebook as well, which we can link into the the notes here. But like if people are listening and they're thinking like, oh god, that that is me, yeah. Um what one thing would you want to say to them?

SPEAKER_00 33:03

So the the main things I would cover is like what I said earlier about making sure the basic self-care is done, because that's gonna make you wonky if you're not doing any of that. Secondly, begin it's like going on a date. Like get curious with your like, what do you like now? What are you into? And when people go, I don't know, it's like, well, then you start need to start doing some new stuff. And that will require courage and bravery, it will feel uncomfortable, but otherwise you atrophy. So whenever we are anticipating pain or discomfort, humans tend to avoid it. So we numb it or we just don't do the thing. And I don't know if you've seen this with people, you know, the more we avoid, the worse the fear gets, and then the the less likely it is that we're gonna engage in life. So we need to start pushing that comfort zone again with just the smallest things to build up that muscle again and start to have new experiences to figure out what you're interested in. And the other thing that I would suggest is people to start being able to pay attention to their physical body and their energy. So our bodies are always giving us signals about what it wants and what it needs, but the brain interferes with these signals all the time through like, you know, the ping pong of information or judgment or things like that. So if you think about, I don't know, if you were around someone that you found was really attractive, your body and energy be like kind of gravitating to that person. It doesn't have to be like a sexy vibe, you know, someone that's just like so funny, or like you feel like you're leaning into it or a food you really like. And if you're repulsed by something or you don't want something, your body's kind of like just noticing like the leanings of your body, um, your body's never wrong. So if it wants to do something or something's good for it, it's like even if it's a 51% kind of lean, doesn't have to be 100% but just pay attention to what your body's doing, not what you think you should be doing, but what actually feels good to you.

SPEAKER_01 34:45

Yeah. Um so where can people find you and if they want to work with you, what's what's new within your within your work at the moment?

SPEAKER_00 34:53

Well, she's a bit dry on Instagram, but you can find me on there. Um, and I'm gonna be doing, I haven't a website, but I'm gonna be doing it a totally different one by the end of summer. Um, so people want to shoot me a DM, ask me a question, whatever, they're they're welcome to do that, which is just Kristen Gatton's.

SPEAKER_01 35:09

Awesome. Thank you for coming back onto the podcast, Kristen.

SPEAKER_00 35:13

Oh, it's a pleasure. Can't wait to see you again.

SPEAKER_01 35:16

Bye guys.

SPEAKER_00 35:17

See you soon.