Train. Eat. Think. Episode 1 - Beginning

Welcome to the Train. Eat. Think. Podcast.

In episode 1 we start from the start, introduce ourselves and what you can expect over the coming years. Yes YEARS. We think long term and we start from the very beginning. Looking to help problem solve, knowledge share and improve the understanding of our listeners. 

Ready? Let's dive in. 

For online 121 coaching enquiries/information

Please contact Francis on X/Instagram @coachfhm or email fmeliacoaching@gmail.com 

Contact Ben on X/Instagram @benjaminyeezus or email ben@yeezuscrew.com  

Thanks for listening. See you next week :D 

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:01

Right, here we go. Train Eat Thing podcast. We're inmates after uh three months of uh doing it on on X. We pulled the trigger. So excited to get stuck inmates.

SPEAKER_01 0:14

Absolutely. And I I I remember when you said on one of the spaces one night you were like, maybe do a podcast. I was like, I've been thinking about this for like two months. I was just still to clear it.

SPEAKER_00 0:28

It's making that initial jump, isn't it? That's what we've been doing, been sorting out over the the last couple of weeks. Because we want uh our aim up front, and we'll say this to everybody. We we want to try and have a couple of years' worth of podcasts. Yeah, we want to be getting an episode out every Monday, Tuesday, and uh, we want to make this a weekly thing. Um, so if we don't do that, which we will, you can come back to us and hold us accountable on episode one. Uh we want to be uh we want to have a good under podcast also over the next couple of years. And uh yeah, again, if if you're coming to us from X or Twitter, you know, you'll know that we've we've both been on the space uh for a long time, putting out good fitness training, old things, uh nutrition content. And we just wanted to basically have have a space where we could have more long-form content because that's what we miss with Twitter. As much as we love Twitter and X, it's quite sure form and punchy content. So we just wanted to get into the deep dives and get into the weeds of things, which we uh which we love to do, don't we?

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Yeah, I mean, some of the things we can get into as we've been doing on The Spacey's, it lets us explore that nuance and just give a little bit more context for things which I feel some can sometimes can be missing, as much as you're trying to be as succinct as possible and and give away, you know, as as as much as possible to try and help people out there and understand a little bit about you know, in this social media space, there's a lot of of um polarisation, yeah. There's a lot of claims about this, that, and the next thing. And I think one of the things that that that binds us and and draws us together is Francis, there's no BS, there's no fluff, we're not gonna sugarcoat things, or not gonna make things up to try and bring people in. We're just gonna talk and we're gonna talk straight, and we're gonna talk factual that we believe in. You know, obviously, there's things over time that we we learn new information, and again, I think that's another great thing. We we've got both open minds that we're willing to say what we believe in and and what we know and understand at this point in time, but we also know knowledge is is coming down all the time, and a lot of even studies, you know, we're not gonna frown on the studies, but we've got that balance that we've got um you know the the the the the terrible word the science-based or the science back stuff, the science-led, but we've got that understanding that there's a there's nuance to that, there's application again that we've both got from more than 10 years each and and training mistakes made, myths believed. I've I've fallen for it all. I I know I have at some point.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

Yeah, and and that's that's what we're trying to bring across to people is we're learning off both of our own experiences and then what we've seen with a lot of clients because we've we've been we've been in the in the census for many years doing this stuff, and I I know myself, I've learned a lot from podcasts over the years, so I know how valuable they are, like this long-form content. You know, even if you're out getting your cargoing or you know, you're getting your walks in, sticking a good podcast on for an hour and learn and listening to things. It's one of the best ways to again fill your head with this content and gather that understanding and grasp new information. So that's what I want to do for people is is have our podcast as you know, this is a means of education. Stick this on on your cardio. You've got a spare hour and you want to learn, you know. Here you go, this is what we want for you. And it's coming from people who we're not gonna give you any nonsense, no bullshit. It's it's it genuinely is trying to help you out. No clickbait and trying to you know stir the pot. Because there's a if you want that, you'll find that on on a lot of places on X or Instagram, we want to deep dive into stuff that's actually going to help you out. And again, with the experience that we've had, uh we're in a good place to do that. So, you know, I think it probably I'll flip it over to you now. Let's have a little just a little bit of a background on the both of us, just in case anybody is new here and unfamiliar with us from you know Twitter. Um, so yes, just again, just give a little bit of a background about yourself.

SPEAKER_01 4:39

Uh I started off from a space and in terms of I mentioned the mistakes and the myths, and one of the game changers for me was changing my environment, the gym that I trained in. Um, it led me to um finding Jordan Peters. We'll probably talk a lot about Jordan and our journey. Um, he was my coach for the best part of six, nearly seven years. Um, learned a lot from him. It's right as well, what you're saying about podcasts. You know, I'm I'm listening to one of them a day and have done for the past 11, 12 years, and that's where you were honing the knowledge from. So, you know, I was walking the walk at that point in time. I didn't really have any, you know, it wasn't a burning desire of mine to be an online coach. Um, but I started to get to a spot where I was like, I think I can help people, and and it got to a point where I was like, I know I can help people. Um, I'll just share my very first client journey. I was at um a game of football one night, soccer for anyone in the States, and this gent had said to me, I've tried every diet under the sun. I've had a bodybuilder create me a diet, I've had this guy do me a diet. Uh they tell me I need to eat eggs, I don't like eggs. I was going on holiday the next day. So I said to him, you know, do a food diary. I'm not gonna judge you, so don't hide anything. Um, and what we'll do is we'll work something through when I come back and and we'll see how we go. Um, my favourite day was I think it was East Thursday. He had a rolling pie, a KFC, a Snickers, and a uh a Mars bar, and that was like his food for the day. So we had a little conversation, you know, about what what we can do to help him move forward. He wanted to move away from this life. He also had a long-standing um condition called non-alcoholic fatty liver disease. So we we we we set something up, something that he could follow. Long story short, he dropped five stone over a course of about I want to say about two years. But one of the good things is he got uh I got a letter. I think it was at 12 started in September, I'm sure the letter was around about Christmas, maybe just before. Um congratulations, his name was Mr. Smith. This condition you've had for 18 years, you get blood tested every three or four months. It's in remission. Yeah, absolutely, mate. He wasn't doing anything special, Francis. He he came round to eating rice in steak thinking about what he was eating, and and fair plateum, he even put a microwave in his van, travelled for work, put a microwave in his van, which is testament to how much he wanted the change. As I say, five stone and body fat down, non-alcoholic fatty liver disease into remission, and that was my first client. So I I was hooked, you know, and I was like, I I I can make a difference here, I can really help. Um this was before I was certified as a nutritionist, so I went on to do M and U. By that point, I was already six or seven years into my own fitness journey. I came from a place where I was tensed on soaking wet. Um and my my journey, I I wanted to grow. Again, I'd fallen for about four or five years for all of the myths, trying to get bigger at the same time, trying to cut, don't spike your instantly, don't eat after six hours. You could rhyme them all off. Um and and that gave me as the same introduction into coaching, and it sort of just just went from there as I I knew I could help people, and and that was my aim. Through my career, I've always wanted to get some um certification so that I I've got things there, uh basically credentials that you can stand on. I'd already lived a life for seven years, and I knew my own mind makes me question things why am I doing that? As much as we love them. There's your meal plan, that's what you eat. If you go to McDonald's, don't bother checking in. So you don't even get calories or macros what you didn't at the time. I love that personally, I love that. It's not how I coach, but I loved that, it was fine for me. Um, fast forward 70 pounds of muscle tissue later, you know. In my sort of kind of normal, semi-normal state, I probably sit around about 215 pounds, 220 or take. Um and yeah, that's that's pretty much, you know, kind of my journey. Started at the start, made all the mistakes and and come all the way through. And I honestly have a passion. Um, I wake up every day, I feel very lucky to to do what I do to get to help the people that I help. And I I've said it to you before, Francis, on the space, and I'll continue to say it. Meeting people like yourself before we even spoke. I was inspired by your content, the no fluff, the the and again I say this and I say this to you offline. I mean that with the utmost of respect because it's straight to the point. You're not pulling things, trying to pull the wool out over people's eyes. It's it's no no bollocks as we wanted to call the podcast, but couldn't. Um and and you know, that's what's I think led us to to having that sort of crossover, if you like.

SPEAKER_00 9:51

Yeah. Absolutely, Mathan. I think we're talking about your own journey there. There's a uh there's a lot, it's it's not just the 70 vans of muscle tissue that you've built, there's a lot of wisdom that's been that you've developed through that journey, and that's what makes you a um an even better coach as well, because you've been through it. It's one of the most important things of it. So, you know, and that's that's where I'll I'll start my sort of own background story myself, is that you know, I'm coming up to 16 years of training experience. I started when I was 15. Uh, I was just I just turned 31 in November, just gone. So, you know, it's I've trained over half half my adult life as being inside the gym, you know, consistently training, um, consistently watching food. Uh, ever since I started, I was just hooked on it. So, as you can imagine, 15, 16-year-old kids just just just training for the love of it, just got hooked onto it all, done all the the level one, level two, level three personal training qualifications. Not that they mean much, but I'd done them all. I was trying to seek out what do I need to do to make a living off this? Because what can I do to make a living off the gym? Because I knew I was gonna do it. Everyone always used to say to me, everyone used to say, you can't make money doing that in the gym. Like, and and I didn't know the way the online stuff was uh the way it was all gonna plan out that I didn't know what was possible, but I said to myself, I'm gonna find a way to because I love this. I don't care about nothing else. I am not interested in anything else, it's just training the gym and be food. I love it. So, you know, you do all the the qualifications, um, and then the next step was was going to university. So I I thought I'd go down the sort of you know, the the educational, the science-based path. You know, I was only 21 here when I did go to university. Spent three years, got a um got a got a first class, a good degree in um sports science in Liverpool, John Moore's University. So I spent three years there. Um, so I got myself a good degree, and I was I was ready to go and do a master's in stenting editioning, right? So this is this was like a big sort of uh crossover in me sort of like career. So I was I was all signed up, application done, everything all sorted to go and do a master's in stenting editioning, and then a job uh opportunity sort of opened up in a local gym to be a coach. And it was one of those moments when I first when I when I seen the advertisement because I knew the fella who owned the gym, and it just hit me and I went, you know what? I I don't want to go and spend another year in a classroom. I want to I want to get in the centers yet, I want to be helping people. I want to I I want to get out into the real world. I'm sick of being in a classroom and all this stuff, and I was thinking, is a master's really gonna help me out? Should I just need to get out there and get into the real world and start getting hands-on experience with people? So that's that's what I've done. I uh cancelled going for the masters and just went right in. Um working in a in a local gym in Liverpool, just um and just just working with people hands-on. Uh spent a couple of years in there just just working with all walks of all walks of life, like women who are like 40, 50 with lots of kids, and you know, young lads myself, like 17, 18, 25, just everybody. Work with you know yourself, me, the working with the general population, just work with a lot of people in person, seeing lots of things and just gained a lot of experience doing that. Um, and then obviously all all through this time of coaching, I've I've been involved in powerlifting. I was involved in competitive powerlifting, but it's been powerlifting for just on four years, competing in four competitions. Um, I was you know, I was heavily into that. And then over the last couple of years, we've I've made the transition into um basically bodybuilding. And I will be there, we go come back over to the right side. But uh yeah, made the transition over to bodybuilding, and I'm gonna be uh stepping on stage this year. We've got three shows lined up, and we're in the middle of prep right now. We are basically four weeks in. So there's been a been a lot of experience there from competing in powerlifting, working with top powerlifting coaches, uh transitioning over to bodybuilding, you know, which I think um we'll we'll talk in another podcast as well. But the move to Venezuela, I've basically left uh the UK to live in Venezuela. I've been here for four years, got a wife and a son, just being again focusing on my bodybuilding journey, knowing that I'm gonna be getting ready to come back and uh step on stage. And all within this time, business on Twitter has just been growing, online business helping tons and tons of clients, posting content, you know, meeting people like yourself. And uh we're here, mate, just just ready just to keep getting better. Uh wanna wanna taking this next step, stepping on stage. That's gonna be the uh you know the first step in the competitive bodybuilding journey, and then just hoping to go on from there, mate, because uh the uh the sky is the limit for us. There's just so much more to to do and be positive about, and that's that's gonna be a big theme of our of our podcast is the mindset and the approach to you know, life is there to be lived. There's a lot of good stuff out there for you to go and get. It's gonna be hard, it's gonna be difficult, it's gonna take a lot of graft, but you can do it if you if you have your your attitude and your application, everything in the right spot, and that's what we're gonna we're gonna talk about a lot. We're gonna we're also gonna show you as well. So, yeah, that's uh that's a little bit on me, mate. Hopefully I got everything in there.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

No, I was I was good. Um even I learned a few wee bits there. Um I was smiling in particular when you got to the couldn't be bothered doing the masters. Yeah we are so aligned there. I had spent five years at university, um two years at college, yeah, yeah, uni, third year, fourth year, and I didn't get a job until I was in fifth year in uni. Um, so I I I left exactly as you said. I wanted to be in the trenches, I was fed up in in academia, and I wanted to sort of go and learn. So, again, some some similarities there that we before the conversation that I didn't even know. But yeah, you're absolutely right, mate. One of the things we're gonna focus on is how mindset drives everything that we do. So there'll be little sprinklings of that. You know, we're gonna talk about training collectively. You know, we've got an excess of two decades of training, maybe closer to three even. Yeah, I did have a little play with the gym. I wouldn't say I I done anything of any note until probably around about 2013 was when I really started to, you know, this is I knew that I wanted to sort of drive on on that um on that road. Um, so we're gonna talk that, and then obviously um nutrition, we're gonna get across how how we can simplify it for people, how we can again cut through some of this um analysis paralysis that we see, you know, the more information that's out there. Um again, I've I've been a victim of it myself. I used to read Men's Health that told me I could get a six-pack in 28 days. Um, so yeah, there'll be none of that nonsense here, you know. And and and unfortunately, you know, and it's one of the things as well that that I loved about your content. You never spoke about weeks, you never really spoke about months either. We always talked about the long haul, you know, and and one of the things we spoke offline yesterday was it was a good influence for me about how you need to get your mind right and start to think. We've already said at the start of the podcast, we're gonna commit to this to at least two years, yeah, at least. And I don't see anything changing. We've done three or four months pretty much every Monday on X and the Spaces. Um and every Monday I look forward to them. So I again I don't really see see that changing at all at any point.

SPEAKER_00 17:50

Well uh as we said on the spaces, mate. I think this is a good educational tool for us as well, talking about things and getting uh things that we're dealing with with clients and we're dealing with ourselves, you know, because we're always trying to get better. We don't, we we don't, we and we never say that we know everything, we're always open to learning and get better, and talking through this, um going off our own experience and what we see in the real world with clients, you know, it's it's a lot of problem solving, a lot of troubleshooting, and we've done a lot of that. We've done we've done a hell of a lot of troubleshooting and problem solving with people. So it's good to uh it's good to just discuss that and we have these back and forth. So I think it'd be good to throw it back right to right to the beginning. You know, if it if a client comes to you, um, you know, fresh, you want to start the gym, um, they they haven't got much training experience, or if they have it's very limited. What are we what are we looking at? What are we looking at to take someone you know like yourself when you first walked in the gym? You know, you've you've gained 70 pounds of muscle tissue over the last decade plus. What would you go back and what would you tell yourself, you know, walking in the gym the first week? What would you what would what would we be looking at now? Taking a beginner, what are the fundamentals? What are we what are we looking to do now over the next couple of years as a beginner who walks walks into your hands? And let's take it back there.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

Yeah, I mean the the the first thing first is we we want to instill as much confidence in in the the person as we can. You know, we're gonna meet them where they're at and assume that when I say they don't know anything, I mean that in a positive sense because you're gonna try and give people an education from the bottom. There's no point in us having 30 years between us saying, Oh, well, why can't you do X advanced lift? You know, you're gonna find how how much can they can they train in a week? Have they got any experience at all? Maybe they are like brand new, maybe they've had a 10-year layoff because they were looking after the kids, and this is them coming back to it, and it's all different now because maybe back then there was less machines. Now there's a lot of big balance between um free weights and machines. It's maybe tilted a bit more to machines in a lot of gyms, so they're gonna come in, and and it's just about trying to get across the ways that you can um build your skill set up when you're coming into the gym. You know, how we're gonna look to get people um fluent and machines. One of the best ways I always try and describe it as almost being like a like like a toddler trying to learn how to how to walk. So we need to, as I say, meet that person where they're at, find out if there's things that they can do, things that they can't do, maybe they're carrying some injuries or something like that. Yeah, try and build up their knowledge of what they can do as well as our knowledge in terms of what we're gonna ask of them. I I think that's a pretty decent starting spot.

SPEAKER_00 20:48

Yeah, I I agree with you, mate. And I think we I think what we what we what we should probably do is maybe break it down and talk about maybe exercise selection, um, maybe a little bit on like sort of volume and intensity, frequency, if we can go on that. But I think the exercise, um, the exercise tweet that that that causes a lot of debate these days. You see it all over X. You know, there's a lot of um whether it's rage bait content or uh there's just there's people on both sides of the fence, and I like to sit on the middle of the fence with that. I don't think there is a you have to be barbells only and you have to come in and it's the starting strength approach where you have to come in, it has to be squat bench, deadlift press. If you do anything else than that, it's a waste of time. I don't agree with that approach. I also don't agree with you have to come in and it's anything that's unstable, you can't do it, it has to be just machines only, machine stability, this stability, that both of those for me that are the end of the spectrum, and I don't think that's a healthy place to program from. I think you need a blend of what fits a person, meeting the client where they're at. And if you've got a beginner who comes to you, I think the most important thing up front is how can we get a beginner consistently in the Gym lifting some weights. What are they going to enjoy? What do they feel safe with? What is their attitude and mentality like around training? Have you got a young fella coming in who's 21 who he wants to get after it with some deadlifts and squats? He feels safe doing that. Okay, let's go with it. You've got a 48-year-old fella who might be a little bit overweight and he's just scared shitless of deadlifts and squats. I'm not going to put him on that right away. We might go in with a leg press lunge variations or whatever. But the main thing is you're meeting a new client when they come to you, the beginner, where they're at. And you know, you know yourself, mate, when it comes to picking exercises, you'll probably end up anyway using a blend of everything. You probably use a blend of machines and a blend of free weights. It does never ever have to be either or. And I think that's important. And I want to get that out from episode one. That's my fundamental viewpoint on exercise selection is that it's not either or, it's fitted to the individual and what they need and what they're going to be able to progress with long term, pain free, and what they enjoy. So, you know, that can be you might enjoy barbells in a couple of machines. Great. You might train in a home gym setup and you don't have a lot of equipment. So you have to use a lot of barbells spot on. But you also might be someone who has a lot of machine work in there and does little bits of free weights for things that feel safe for you. Spot on. Both work, and it's you've you've just got to meet the client where they're at. So I think it's very important to get that uh out of the rip. And I I know we we have the same sort of sentiment with that as well.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

I I mean, I'll be honest, mate, I I couldn't echo it any better. I I totally agree with with everything that you've said, though, like word for word.

SPEAKER_02 23:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:42

I think that reflects kind of me and life in general. You never need to be on this side or you never need to be on that side. The truth always lies somewhere in the middle. As you say, somebody might be I I did deadlifts. Maybe it's a 30-year-old gent. I did deadlifts in my 20s and I really enjoyed them. I like the challenge of them. Again, I'm coming back from having a break because I was more kind of focused on my career, had some kids. One thing leads to another, I was out. But I'd like to bring that up. But the rest of it, maybe I I want to do machines this and machines that. Again, absolutely fine. You've touched on it there, it's about the individual. And one of the things that I've really found is home gyms are very, very, very popular. And I have programmed for a lot of people that have their own gyms now. And that is I as I I think when you were talking earlier about why we're doing this, as for our our education as well to become better people, better coaches, to be open-minded, to listen to things. Doing that level of programming helps because you need to get people sending you the video of their gym to say, This is what I've got, and then you've got to put the thinking hat on because well, they don't have a leg press, for example, because it's obviously it's a big bit of kit that you then need hundreds of pounds or hundreds of kilos of of plates to load. So you're trying to find exercises that might suit, let's say, uh uh a Boflex, I think it's Boflex 1080s, you know, the the up to 40 pounds on the yeah, on the on the dumbbell rack. And and again, as another challenge, I've only got dumbbells, or they may have one barbell, but they might not have a squat rack. There's so many variations that we could go through, but again, we we're talking about the um somewhere down the line. And and what one of the things that you said earlier as well is we're problem solvers. That I've always maintained, I've always maintained that since since I started. We are just prop we're problem solving for people because we've been through it either ourselves with clients or people aren't as let's just be honest, into it as we are. But that's what we do. You know, we like to talk about exercises, we like to talk about different mechanics, we like to talk about things for fat loss and whatever. We're talking about that however many hours in our day for however many years. It's nothing to us. If we've got busy individuals, I'm sure you've got clients like that, two kids, maybe a directory, a company, maybe an owner of multiple businesses, maybe they work three jobs. There's there's obviously loads of different um connotations, but it's then up to us to problem solve for that person and say, This is what I think will fit. And sometimes, I mean, that's never set in stone because you're then going through that communication either weekly, every few days, depending on the cadence of of how that person either communicates or checks in. And again, there's no right or wrong answer there, but together you arrive on a pathway.

SPEAKER_00 26:48

And what you're saying there about problem solving, that that's spot on. That's the right way to look at it. Because you know, imagine imagine a client comes to you as you say there, busy dad, got three kids, has an hour to train in the morning a couple of times a week. He's got a home gym, he's just got his barbells and some dumbbells. Imagine he comes to you and you say, You can't do that, mate. It's not it's it's too unstable. You can't do that. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 27:16

Nail on the head.

SPEAKER_02 27:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

You remember the the Mabona tweet when I said there's a protein shake for a pound. No, just eat steak and eggs.

SPEAKER_02 27:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:25

And that this that we don't want to decry other coaches. I'm we're not gonna go down that road, but it was another coach that said it, so I'm I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna say it. It shows his inability to deal with people because if that's his response, if someone can't get up 15 minutes earlier, he's already doing a 12-hour day. As you say, multiple kids could be multiple businesses. There's so many different things. Nothing wrong with me having a protein shake. I have I have a protein shake and a bar of a day. And and this is where you know you that common sense goes out the window in this industry, and I've never seen an industry like it, you know.

SPEAKER_00 28:07

Yeah, but I think with culture, mate, uh, it's it's like piecing a jigsaw together for someone to try and make the fit that the pieces fit for the jigsaw that you're wearing with, and everyone has got a different playing field. So you you have to again, you'd have to meet the client where they're at. Now, when it comes to exercise selection, I could be very biased and dogmatic because I I I I've done powerlifting. I I I competed multiple times. I was big on squat bench deadlift, done it for years, absolutely loved it. I know the great exercises. I could be very, very dogmatic on that. Right now, I don't do as many barbell lifts as I once did, but I still don't shit on the barbell lifts. I might use a little bit more machines, you know. You know I love a good deadlift and no man in deadlift, and I've got to go to the end of everything in my program. But I could be in the perfect situation to shit on the barbell lifts, but I don't because I know how effective they can be. I could also just sing the praises of machines, and machines are the best things and sliced bread and all this stuff. You can use everything, everything is there as a tool to again supply intention to the muscle, which we're we're obviously going to get into in a minute as well. But yeah, exercise selection. I actually do think like I think a lot of people make a song and dance over it when I think that the the most important thing is its effort and intensity over a long period of time done consistently. And I think whether you're using barbells, dumbbells, machines, you know, if you'd say for 20 years consistently, I think you're gonna build a very good physique anyway. And I think it's just a lot of nuances that you know, I think a lot of people get lost in it when they probably don't need to. So I know we uh we we we we share the same sentiment where don't get lost in the nuances, don't think about the uh don't think about the icing or the cherry on the cake before you you've even built the cake in the first place. You've we've got to get that the fundamentals are, and for a lot of people it's uh it's consistently training hard enough for years on years on end. People can't even get past six weeks. So talking about optimal resistance profiles and all this stuff for the majority of people, it just doesn't matter for them.

SPEAKER_01 30:09

So I I I I totally agree, and I'm I'm walking proof of that. I don't I don't deadlift. Yeah, I've I tried I tried to bench for many years, not just a few months. I tried all of the different grips suicide grip, roll the bar, don't push the bar. All I I looked it up, I've read it to to to death. I just never I just all I really got was so front belts from it. I never really got anything. So I gave it, and that's another thing as well. You know, sometimes you give things the relevant time that they do. Um I unfortunately can't squat anymore because my SI joint just errors out, but again, I've managed to build my physique. So again, from walking that walk, you know you've got those little things that you carry that you can make alternatives. There are no must-do exercises, and if somebody tells you that it's a must-do, then they're maybe less missing out a little bit or misrepresenting, I would say.

SPEAKER_00 31:09

Yeah, definitely, definitely no must-do exercises. We we will all have personal preferences, absolutely, we will. As I say, I love to deadlift, and and I couldn't imagine me programme without a deadlift. But that might not be for everyone, as yourself, as you just said yourself, you don't deadlift. Yeah, that doesn't mean that you that I'm superior in your inferior because I deadlift, you know, it's it's it's tension on the muscle tissue, which is uh the main thing when we're when we're when we're after hyperity, which we all know. So I think what so once you've got your exercise selection, we've got that boxed off. I think that your next big fundamental, mate, and I'm sure you'd agree, would be uh would be training intensity and how hard do we actually train them because this is something that you know and this is not to be rude to people inside the gym, but if you if you look around the gym, most people don't know how to train hard. And you know, we see a lot of stuff where people talk about volume as the main driver of hypertrophy and all this stuff. Well, I always say if volume was the main driver, well, everybody would be jacked because everyone does lots of volume, everybody is smashing lots of sets. But what's the kicker? It's the intensity and the accuracy of these sets. Where is the tension going? What what what are these sets that we are doing? Where's the stimulus going? Where's that mechanical tension going, which we know mechanical tension, prime driver of hypertrophy? So it's those sets where you're working hard enough, you're really pushing towards failure or getting as close to it as you possibly can, safety with good form. They're the reps that count, and they're the sets that we want. And again, I would much rather see someone doing two really all-out sets with the movements versus four or five sets of shit, because you know, that four or five sets of shit is just it's probably a waste of time. So, again, as we know, intensity uh a big one that we we share that similar um sentiments on again. So, yeah, what's what's your thoughts on intensity?

SPEAKER_01 33:04

100%, mate. And and if I had a pound for every time, one of the good things is when when people come to you and and obviously they're coachable, they're listening because they see the receipts, they see the transformations in people that come from like as you say, they're the training intensity, following your nutrition recovery as well, which which we'll probably touch on, if not in this episode, you know, but we'll touch on all of these things.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:29

But when they come down, a perfect example, there's a gent that comes to my head and he shared with me, you know, I'm in the gym roughly two and a half hours. I don't really mind being in the gym, I enjoy being in the gym. But I took his gym time down by half, maybe even a third when when we took him over to try this and see how you got on. Even within, honestly, Francis, within like two weeks, he's like, I already feel the difference, I already see the errors I was making. And he was doing four sets of 15 to 20 reps. Yeah, so he's like, I can already see how I was swimming in junk volume. Yeah, the the gent that I'm actually thinking and talking about, I actually messaged I can't remember if it was the day or yesterday. He was talking about the humbler, I got seven reps on a weight I've never lifted before. Um and you know, I felt good for it. His words were I was shitting myself getting into the second set, and I think I said to him, perfect spot where you want to be. You know, you've got that little air of I'm in a set here, I need to work, and as well as you hone that um accuracy, a great word you use, Frank, uh Francis. The accuracy and your sets and reps. If you've only got two to do, your accuracy needs to be spot on. But the the sort of uh the other side of that is you're not doing in his case 80 reps. So if you're doing 80 reps, 60 of them, yeah, probably a waste of time, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:08

And then that just accumulates a a lot of uh I'm not to use the word that everyone it's a buzzword, isn't it? Fatigue. Everyone's scared of the boogeyman fatigue. But in in this sort of case, if someone is doing four sets of 20, you know, those really stimulative reps are probably gonna be the 17th, 18th, 19th. So as I say, out out of 80 reps that you're doing across four sets, if you're lucky, 10 of those are gonna give you the stimulus that you want. So you're getting 10 stimulative reps over four sets and then 70 lots of shite, basically. So that's where we try and get into with people is you want to we want we want to try and trim off the fat. You want to make every set that you do stimulative. You don't want to waste no sets. Uh, a wasted set is just it's digging your recovery hole deeper. And as we're going to talk about now, is that if there's one thing you take away from this intro podcast here, is that your ability to progress inside the gym, it it spins on your ability to be able to recover and then come back again a couple of days later and go again, and we get on a run of progression. It's it's our favourite words: stimulus recovery, adaptation. You have to be able to get on a run of progress, and it's not just what you can do in one session because we know we could come in and we could obliterate ourselves today. Tuesday, you come in, it's a leg day, you could obliterate yourself with 20 sets of quads and just go to town. But if you're if you've got another leg session that's uh fired up for Friday, Saturday, you're not going to be able to do anything on that on that session that's going to be productive. So you've you've cooked your volume too much, it's too much work, it's the it's the beating a dead horse, so to speak. So we've got to find the set numbers that is it's just enough to give us max stimulus in a session, but then be able to recover from and adapt and come back stronger again next time. And it's it's getting on that run over months and months and months, and it all ties in together. It's you know, your decent exercise selection that you like to you like to do, you get if it fits your structure, you enjoy again your intensity of your sets, which then make sure that your volume is not too high and you're not just doing endless junk volume. So it all trickles down your exercise selection, yeah. Again, your intensity of effort, your volume numbers, it all trickles down. So, yeah, uh what would you say to that?

SPEAKER_01 37:30

I mean, what one of the things for me, you know, we're talking about people out there in in the space that have got multiple jobs or whatever. Time is of the essence. Yeah, so I think one of the things that as well stops people from from even getting started is they think they need to sink three hours a day into the gym six days a week. When obviously we know, and if we could have that conversation with them, you can get a good chest, sorry, a good push session, chest, triceps, shoulders, probably somewhere like 12, 14 working sets. Yeah, you know, and one of the things as well with that when when we're saying rather than obliterating yourself, you should have a uh a muscle part ready, uh sorry, uh part of the part of your muscles ready, yeah. Go ahead and and you know, some some body parts are like 72 hours of recovery ready to go again. Yeah, you've not pushed that boundary because one of the things you miss in terms of frequency, if you've done those 20 quad sets that you mentioned, that's just quads. If you've done hamstrings in the same session, if you've done 40 sets for legs, you're costing yourself frequency, you know. And as we've spoken there about the the the benefits of frequency and training, you could have 104 potential sessions. If you do two a week, you touch our body part twice a week or twice every seven days. It's 104 attempts a year. Okay, you might get sick, you've been holiday, whatever. Call it call it an even hundred, call it 98 if you want to call it. Yeah, it's no better than 52.

SPEAKER_00 39:06

Yep. It's basically double the amount of stimulus when you look at it, and it's not only that, if let's let's just let's let's stick with the same example. If you take 20 sets of quads, which is it's but that's a lot for one session, let's just take those same 20 sets, and instead of having that in one session, we just split those across two. So let's say someone did do again. I I still think 10 sets in a quad session is far too much, but let's say you did. If someone does 10 sets for quads on Monday, and then you come back again, 10 sets on Friday, not only you are you getting that increased frequency of um the skill exposure of going through squatting patterns, leg pressing patterns, leg extension patterns, the skill of you getting better at these movements, you're getting to do some of these lifts twice a week. Again, you know yourself, like when it comes to learning a skill, even if it was a language, something new that your brain needs to learn, doing a lift once a week versus twice, you're only gonna step forward better neurologically and technically twice a week. And the big the other big kicker is the set quality of splitting that volume into two sessions. So having 10 sets on Monday for quads, then 10 sets again Friday, they're gonna be better quality sets instead of hammering 20 in one session. Because let's be honest, once you've done seven, eight, nine sets of quads, what are those next 10 in that same session? They that they are just redundant. There isn't you're not getting anything from them, you're just driving the fatigue into the grounds, you're not getting a lot out of that, and that's what that's what people are missing. So many people are coming in the gym and they're going past that point of no return, and they haven't got that one eye on what's to come three or four days later. And when you do grasp that and you have that penny drop moment and you start training in your sessions to get the max stimulus for the session, but then you've got one eye on okay, well, what can we go through stimulus recovery adaptation for to be back in three or four days later? And that's the key. If you can get that and understand that early on, again, that's why we have to get this in episode one. If you can understand this and you can implement it, that is the holy grail of training and getting on a run of adaptations, not just again, not just in for two, three weeks, not just for two, three months, two, three years, five years, ten years. That's the aim, that's what we're after.

SPEAKER_01 41:18

I mean, one of the things that that I I really like is to get rewarded for my training, you know, to think, and especially, you know, I'm I'm I'm 45, I'm not old, old, but I'm obviously getting older. And it just for me, it just drives it home even more. I I want to get rewards for the time I'm I'm in the gym. I I've got a lot to do in terms of life and and everything else as well. Yeah, I don't I I love the gym. See, this is the thing as well. Love the gym, love training, I love doing it multiple times per week. All of the things that go with it, still don't want to be in the gym for two and a half hours at a time.

SPEAKER_00 41:57

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_01 41:58

Just just don't. Yeah, you know, granted, leg day a little bit extra because you need a little bit more rest because those sets that we're going for, the intensity of them. But we're working, we're working smart rather than just one of the things again is the assumption is more is more. And in your training, that's not always the case. You know, as we've touched on, if you're missing those stimulating reps, if the the weight that you're lifting isn't slowing down gradually towards the end of your set, you know, if you just drop the cable and you maybe had another five, seven, nine in the tank before it was starting to get really, really difficult, yeah. You're missing out on that reward. And again, that's where the having the frequency and the accuracy comes in because the more that you're honing that, the more that you're doing it, you get to understand for all of your different lifts across all your different patterns, be that chest, uh back sessions, leg sessions, you get to learn where your true sort of failure point again safely, but you you want to push as close to failure as you can because again, those are the stimulating reps, these are the things that are giving you the rewards for being in the gym, but that doesn't need to be three hours a day for sure.

SPEAKER_00 43:16

Yeah, and I uh if we bring it back to a beginner or someone who is you know a novice, they haven't got a lot of experience. Yeah, these sorts of people, they're not going to need many sets to drive the adaptive response and get the stimulus that they need because everything is uh such a novel stimulus, you're quite untrained, you know, you're not as strong at this point. So, this is where when we're talking about leveraging training frequency, beginners really do want to leverage training frequency because not only do you get frequent bouts of stimulus, but you get the frequent skill exposure of doing lifts. You know, the beginners they they they can drive a ton of stimulus from maybe two to four half. Hard sets for a muscle group and then they can come back in again. If someone is running a full body split, it's pretty common for people to maybe for the first year or so of training, full body splits work really well because they can they can hit everything you know every 40 to 72 hours. So they're hitting every muscle group three times a week. And then again, your volume will be reflective of that. If you're training a muscle group three times a week, your volume will be on the lower ends, maybe two, three, four uh sets per session for the muscle group because your frequency is that high. Leverage that for the first year or so. It's very, very smart to do that, and then you might need to tinker into something where okay, frequency is going to drop a touch, maybe from three times a week, and it drops to two. Again, it's still good frequency. But then now, maybe because we're dropping our frequency a touch, the session volume can come up just a touch. So instead of having two to three sets for a muscle group, you might get away with four to six. So you can see how it's like it's like turning dials as you go through your training career and meeting you where you're at in your terms of level of advancement, muscularity, and just your skill at a lot of these movements. So I do think a lot of uh a lot of people do miss and miss out on the train of frequency elements. I do think uh it's it's it's it's especially important.

SPEAKER_01 45:10

I think one of the the common mistakes that I see is especially when it's new people coming into the gym, it does it does happen with a lot of other people as well, but the weight lifted, and I think this is a good one to get right off the bat, and and something but you know, again, I've I've made this mistake probably many times. It's too heavy, you know. Don't worry about how many plates are on the bar or saying things like, Oh, I can only lift five kilos, even if five kilos is your starting point. I I use myself as an example. I remember one of the gyms I used to train in just before I I took it serious, around about 2006 is when I first went to the gym, and from then kind of onwards, again, as I said, like I wasted a lot of time because of chasing multiple goals, reading men's health. But right at the start there, I remember getting in and I could do 20 kilogram incline press dumbbells, and I remember looking at 28 kilos and thinking one day, one day I really want to lift them. In that time when I was training, I managed to get to the 32 kilogram dumbbells. They weren't great reps, they were too heavy, the the weight I lifted was too much. But what I'm saying is, over a period of time I went from the 20s to the 28s, and I think that's an important message to get out there. It's not about the weight of where you start. Yes, you wanted uh progressively overload, but you always want to do that, as we've mentioned, the mechanical tension, focus on the muscle that you're training. There's no point in doing if we're using the inclined dumbbell press as an example, there's no point in bringing the shoulder in, you know, when you start to get tired. Number one, it's a wasted rep, it's wasted effort. And when we're talking about training smart, these are the things that we really wanted when we're talking about accuracy and stuff like that. These are the things that we want to dial in. So don't be too concerned about the weight that's lifted. Again, as you've touched on, Francis, people that are new or people that are returning maybe from a long time off, are going to see rapid, rapid, rapid progressions. Muscle memory for those returning and and and those scenarios and the muscle and and the adaptation that and somebody that's brand new to the gym. I mean, how good would it be to be a newbie again and just have a just prime of that coming? And I think if you hone that at that time, it just sets you up for it's one of the things that if you know those questions that come out, what what's the one thing you would do if you could go back to the start? I I honestly hand on heart would say that's the biggest thing for me that I could ever give to someone, or if I ever was given the opportunity to go back. That's something that I've learned myself. Just don't don't miss a rep in terms of find your weight and make sure that you're in control of what you're lifting. Don't worry about everybody else, don't worry about the pros. The pros will go. You know, Phil Heath will put on five pounds of muscle thinking about doing a bicep role. Ignore these people, don't not be inspired. Of course, be inspired. But what I'm saying is we're not them, you know. They're they are we're mortals to them, you know, they're superhuman that live amongst us. But if again, there's a that's one thing that I'd love to drive through to somebody when they're coming in the door. Don't don't worry about the weight that you're lifting now, because it's gonna it's gonna come, you're gonna progress, you're gonna make those strength adaptations, you're gonna get better at lifting again. Much like a toddler, toddler learns to walk. What's the next thing toddler does? Tries to run.

SPEAKER_00 48:56

Well, uh we we've seen that first hand, haven't we?

SPEAKER_01 48:58

Um absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 49:01

I think when I have someone come to me, I I always try and drive this point home. Is that the you have to build your technique first because that that makes your ceiling bigger? Your potential to climb higher with good technique, it's so much higher. If you spend so much time just focusing on the weight and with no focus at all on technique, movement quality, accuracy, if you've spent no time on that and you just shift on weight, at some point you'll you you limit your ceiling. Yes, your ceiling will be here. Whereas if you focus on okay, good execution, good accuracy, good form here, your ceiling is only so much bigger. Number one, just because you your technique will be a hell of a lot better, but number two, you're you're gonna avoid any sort of injuries, injuries or connective issues and joint issues. That that will be the bottleneck for a lot of people. If you're just focusing on weight and shift and weight, you will get snapped up at some point. And that's that's the bottleneck for so many people. And again, what happens with a lot of beginners? They come in, they start training. I hurt my shoulder, I hurt my back, I hurt my elbow, I couldn't train. I had to stop going to the gym. That's not the gym's fault. That's that's user error. That's that's you probably your fault. That is probably because you've gone too aggressive with with poor form, adding 10 kilo on each week, and again trying to become the world's strongest man in the first year, and that's the problem. Where you've got to just stay in your lane, keep your blinkers on, and not be worried about what other people with 10 years of experience are lifting, you know, other people in the gym looking over and having a side eye at what he's lifting on the dumbbell bench, that that means that no odds to you, you've got to lift within and stay within your capabilities right now to drive your own stimulus and your your own adaptation process. Uh you need to drive that home. That's what matters. And you just stay in your lean, you keep crafting for years on end. And if you're looking over there and you're seeing some fella and he's blasting out the 50 kilo dumbbells on chest press, and you're only you're on the 25s, you will get there to the 50s one day. But you need you need to learn your stripes, you need to go through the work. Takes a couple of years to do that. Just accept that. Don't be trying to do that in three months because that's what will get you hurt, and you'll never reach that if you have that sort of I've got to do it fast, got to do it here. Take your time. You can only grow muscle tissue at a certain rate. We've all got a genetic sort of ceiling for that, and you've just got to go with the flow with it and embrace the process of it. But build your technique first and the weights follow every single time.

SPEAKER_01 51:28

But what I what I would add to that, I think you made some some fantastic points. Um don't chase reps in terms of you know, if the sets, let's say 12 reps in the set, don't chase the 12. Get get your weight again, as we're saying, on the target muscle, the accuracy, and learn how to learn how to fatigue a muscle, not anything else that's coming in to support it. One of the things you said, Francis, was years. You want to look, even when you're starting, and I think this is another thing, maybe this comes with age. You want people to be lifting. I certainly want to be lifting in my 80s.

SPEAKER_02 52:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 52:08

You want people to realize here and now when when you're doing that, if it's a chest press or a dumbbell curl, it's coming through the the bicep. It's not coming through like the shoulder. You know, and and I I think again, you make a great point. It doesn't matter what that guy, Branch Warren's doing beside you when he's doing the the bicep curl, he's he's gonna grow anyway, he's doing his thing. Yeah, one of the things, again, for anybody that's sort of coming into the space, you need to realize where where your limitations are. And that that's not necessarily a negative because when you realise those limitations and the things that you need to get then get better on, it'll keep you in the game for a long time. I don't know if you want to touch on like the psychology of being injured, something maybe we could do another podcast. But you're not you're no good sitting on the couch for three weeks, three months, six months. You know, worst case scenario, uh torn rotator cuff. One of the worst was you can't push, you can't pull, you can't do legs because you can't set anything on your shoulders, so no hack squat, no pension. Yes, you could do leg extensions, hamstring curls, probably pretty soon thereafter. Yeah, these are these are not trying to be like a scaremonger or anything, but you you're you're trying to set people off from the best possible starting block where it's train hard, absolutely, train with intensity, absolutely, but be smart about it and think where am I going to be in. There's no point in 30 years if you've got busted shoulders because you wanted to see what the 50 kilogram dumbbell looked like before somebody in what lifted it, or you saw a video on the internet. You know, you you want to stay in the game, and and that's what I'm saying as well about your own limitations. I personally am not the strongest pusher in the world. My chest and shoulders have got more developed, I would say, because I now focus, like I mentioned earlier. Don't miss the rep. You know, if I if I lose a bit of tension on my chest, I get upset at myself because it's like I've missed a rep.

SPEAKER_00 54:16

Yeah. And I think I think it it's it's important to drive on the point what you're saying here as well. That what we're what we're not we're not telling people to train like a fanny and tickle of big dumbbells. We're not saying that. That is far from our messaging. Our messaging is again, it's intense training, hard training. You're really pushing yourself, you're putting yourself through the ringer, but you're doing it smartly. We're not coming in doing daft shit, just trying to move weight and touching weights that you have no business with. We we stress the importance of getting stronger over time, your performance metrics and seeing your lifts come up with the same standardised good form. That is key. If you want to have muscle tissue, you have to get stronger with good form. There is no other way around that. If you take your hack squat from one plate to side for 10 reps, and over the course of the next five years, that goes from one plate to side to four plates to side for 10 reps with the same form, again, no deviation here, same form. If you do that over five years, your quads, you're gonna have so much more size cross-sectional area down there that's able to produce more force because you've done that properly. We are not telling someone to just keep one plate aside on a hack squat and sit there chasing the pump and chase the feel and chase the burn, because you know, to put it quite frankly, that will that will do sweet for ho in terms of uh building muscle tissue. So we have to get progressively stronger over time, but those time frames you need to be thinking in months, years, not necessarily session to session. You're not gonna add five, ten kilos on a hack squat every session, and you're not gonna add you're not gonna have I wish we could. I wish I could add 10 kilos to the pendulum every week. Uh you you'll find out pretty fast you can't do that, but you know, it's it's it's looking and taking these small wins and going, right, I've got I've got my hack squat here, I've added 2.5 to maybe 5 kilo on this over the last month. Okay, well, what can I do over the year? If I can add 20 kilo to my hack squat over a year with the same form, fantastic. There we go. You move in the right direction. But again, trying to come in and add two plates aside in a year, and then it's it's it's going up 80 kilo. This is where you you have to start looking at that and going, hmm, this person is probably changing technique to allow that to happen. Your form is probably getting worse, you joints are going to be unhappy, they're gonna be screaming at you at some point. So it's just being patient and taking your progressions, it's basically as fast as your body is adapting and being just being smart with it, and that's the key.

SPEAKER_01 56:54

And and and understand as well that there's a difference between and you're very well placed to talk about this, Francis. You know, from your powerlifting days, is about lifting uh uh uh a weight from A to B. Just move it. It's not doesn't matter how you get it there for powerlifting, but when you're talking about hypertrophy, when we're talking about muscle building, and we're talking about um stimulating muscle to to grow, it needs to be stimulated, it can't be half arsed, and it's got to be taken through you know a full range of motion with control on the eccentric as well as the concentric, you know. These are the things that really, you know, people go on about them because they're important, you know, they really do matter. There's no point doing half a rep. There's no point looking like you're trying to, I don't know, row row a boat down down uh down some sort of river where you're like yeah, yeah, I know. Um one of the things as well I was gonna touch on, I I personally don't lift under six reps. I know that there are there are some some spots out there, you know. Um I think it's Brad Schoenfeld, you know, from four to twenty uh as as is hypertrophy territory. I I like six because I then know that my um the part that's gonna fail is is is not gonna be you know my weakest point. So for example, um I don't know, I don't know why the deadlifts come into my head, you know. Deadlift, uh I'm gonna deadlift 250 kilos. Well, I'm probably gonna fail at my forearm or my wrist before I'll fail on the back muscle as a as an example there. Um and it's about you know building up rather than doing well, what's your one ret max? Me personally, I I don't lift under six, and again, it's it's for a lot of the reasons we touched on earlier. I'm trying to keep the tissues healthy, the joints, the tendons, the ligaments. I don't want a stretch muscle or a torn muscle, god forbid. Um, so that you're staying in the game. And and I think that's a big thing. You you touched on patience, Francis. You know, we need that patience to help drive us to look down the road of where we're going, rather than just you know wanting to complete the gym basically in in like 12 months.

SPEAKER_02 59:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:09

You made a good a very good point there on on rep ranges. I think this this is well suited for beginners because what's what's very uh what's very popular for a beginner is they'd like to come in and test one rep maxes. Wait, let's let's let's let's see where I'm at today, bro. That's the uh that's the classic. And you know, we we've got to have a look at this and think now, even if you are a power lifter and that is your aim, powerlifters won't test one rep maxes randomly in the gym. It's all training is again, I can speak from experience with this, like stepping on the platform. I never tested a one rep max inside the gym. Never. It was all safe for the platform. So if that is the route you're gonna go down, you wouldn't be doing random one rep max testing anyway. It would all be peaked, you would go through certain blocks of training, uh, it would all be built up to the competition date. So, as a beginner, if you're coming in, and again, I know you might have the temptation to be testing your one rep max bench every every couple of weeks, that is gonna serve you no purpose and building muscle tissue and actually getting stronger. Once we really do start dipping below you know sets of four, sets of five, you know, are getting into that more sort of uh neural and strength adaptations. Now, again, if if that's what you want to do and that's your main aim, well, again, we're not really talking about powerlifting programming and strength training with that. That's not what we're really talking about. We are more focused here on we're talking about sort of hypertrophy style training and getting stronger in that fashion. You want to be more concerned with you know where is your six to twelve rep max versus your one rep max? Where is that moving over time? Again, we go back to uh our our hack squat example. Where's your 10 rep max on your hack squat this year versus your 10 rep max next year? And you want that to be uh you know a decent bit higher with the same form. That's what's going to lay down new muscle tissue. Just testing uh random one rep maxes on a whim is uh again, not only is it not productive training, injury risk goes up. You know, I've seen and heard of so many people just being snapped up and being out the gym just from doing random one rep max bench presses, um random deadlifts off the floor where the back is folded up folded over like a banana or like a shitting dog. It makes no sense. You know, you want to avoid all this stuff, and we want again, it's it comes down to the longevity, longevity aspect of it. We want to be in the gym for as long as we can and not getting snapped up doing uh crazy shit.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:31

That's it. 100%. I um I think we've crammed a fair bit there into what could be our opening salvage. I think there's some really good points on there. Um will we wind up, Francis, just by saying how people can get in contact?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:48

Yep. So if you want to get in contact with us, um probably better just to direct uh a message on Twitter. I'm um I'm at coach coach fm. Um but your handle is uh again, I don't want to butcher it. What you what you uses at Benjamin Uses yet. So again, if if anybody is interested in uh one-to-one coaching and working directly with me or Ben, just drop us a message and uh again we can we can have a chat and we'll send you over some information. But uh yeah, first episode, mate, in the bag, enjoyed it. And uh just it's just like the space with the with the video on it.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:24

You know, we could probably do another 30-40 minutes, but easy.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:28

I think we could we could we could go another hour easy, but we'll we'll save that for the uh for the next one. But uh nope. Enjoyed it as always, mate. So pleasure, uh, appreciate your time and yours, absolutely. And um looking forward to the next one. Eat, train, think. Absolutely. It's a good one, isn't it? Yeah, all right, everyone. Well, we we will uh we'll see you in the next one. Catch you soon. Cheers.