How Blind Barrels Turns Blind Tasting Into Discovery With Founder Bobby DeMars

We taste and talk through the Blind Barrels model with Bobby, from sourcing craft whiskey to building a blind lineup that rewards curiosity over hype. We leave with a better way to buy bourbon, rye, and American single malt based on what we actually enjoy, not what the label tells us to enjoy. 
• why blind tasting changes what we think we like 
• how Blind Barrels gamifies guesses with QR codes 
• what makes a whiskey eligible for the lineup 
• the Doc Holliday barrels story and why limits matter 
• how quarterly drops, member pricing, and flat-rate shipping work 
• how the tasting panel selects bottles and sets the order 
• scaling to thousands of members while navigating three-tier rules 
• custom blending trips and the “smallest batch” concept 
• the Best Of The Best tasting and the four reveals 
• why we should share bottles and stop hoarding 
Don’t throw them away. Put something else in there and give it to a friend. Introduce them to blinds. 
vYour palate is smarter than your label loyalty, but most of us never get a fair test. We sit down with Bobby from Blind Barrels to unpack how a blind whiskey tasting kit can change the way you buy bourbon, rye, wheated bourbon, and even American single malt. Instead of debating bottles by brand, we talk about tasting A to D with no names attached, using QR codes for hints and a reveal, and scoring your guesses on age, proof, and whiskey style. It’s part whiskey education, part game night, and it gets brutally honest fast.  

We dig into how Blind Barrels curates each quarterly lineup, why they focus on American craft distilleries, and what “unique” really means when you’re trying to avoid both shelf turkeys and impossible-to-find unicorns. Bobby tells stories from the sourcing trenches, including rare barrels that shock experienced tasters, the hard choices around purchase limits, and the logistics of serving thousands of members while staying inside the three-tier system and state-by-state shipping rules. If you’ve ever wondered why some bottles are hard to ship, why proof matters, or how clubs set pricing, we get specific.  

Then we pour and react, breaking down what stands out, what feels classic, and what gets weird in the best way. Along the way we talk custom blending trips, barrel picks, and why the whiskey community thrives on sharing and discovery. If you want better tasting skills and better buying instincts, hit play, then subscribe, share this with your tasting group, and leave a review with the most surprising note you’ve ever found in a glass.

voice over Whiskey Thief

If You Have Gohsts

Transcript

Sponsor And Ohio River Valley Roots

0:01

Middlewest Spirits was founded in 2008, focusing on elevating the distinct flavors of the Ohio River Valley. Their spirits honor their roots and reflect their originality as makers, their integrity as producers, and their passion for crafting spirits from grain to glass. Their Michelone Reserve line reflects their story from the start and before the outline of your glass with unique wheated and rye bourbon and also rye and wheat whiskeys. The Michelone brand is easy to stick. It might be a grain to glass experience, but I like to think of it as uncut and unfiltered from their family to yours. Thank you for having me on. I love the theme song. Thanks, thanks. That was uh it was kind of it's always cool. That one's not AI. The one at the end's AI, but that one is uh Kenny, Kenny Fuller. And he does a he did a really good job for us. So we were, I always that that one, I've been told that the so I've even been told by somebody who didn't really like the podcast, once I started putting that theme song on, he was like, I can't get it out of my head. Yep. And then we also have CT here. Welcome, CT. Look at I will say that I've been looking forward to this. You guys have done what I respect is a lot of different things, but your marketing of this blind, you know, the blind barrels is has been fantastic, especially on Facebook. And

Theme Song And Guest Welcome

3:04

I wish I would have, as it was all going down and I was talking to CT, I wish I would have had a kit because that's something that's in our future, you know, my future for sure. But it, you know, by the time it all went, there was not enough time to get it. So CT, you've got the kits and you should take it from you should take the lead from here. Well, I I'm not taking the lead. I'm gonna let uh let Bobby take the lead. Well, the the lead interviewer. You're doing the interview. You want me to be, you want me to be Walter Kronkite. General Ford was sensitively shot today. Exactly. So so Bobby, the people in the bourbon world, I'm I'm guessing that most people that watch the podcast that are in the bourbon world, I guess, if you want to say it like that, know of your brand. They know about blind bearables, they've heard about it. They may not have seen it, they may not have had one or had the chance to do it. But as I was telling Jeff earlier, there's a lot of marketing that you guys are doing. So you're seeing it on Facebook, Instagram. So they might have even seen that ad pop up with you, especially here recently, where you've got the stave and you're talking about, hey, if you sign up, you get the glasses, you get the stave. And of course, the the wow factor, the pop socket, you know, that that really sets the tone. So I know all freebies. Well, it's funny, you know, there's certain rules, uh, discus, which is part of like alcohol bylaws. There's certain things that you can't do in advertising, there's certain things you can't say. You know, so one of the things you can't really talk about is like something that's free, right? So you have to say everything's included. So, but it's all the way kind of people compartmentalize value. And look, I hope you know, your your guys' listeners and people that are bourbon fans and Scotch fans or anything have heard of us. You know, it's taken us in a while to kind of saturate the market. You know, I think the the first partnership we do we did with Fred Minnick about two years ago really gave us a nice boost. And then, you know, now we got the one that we recently did with him that I don't know. We're we're always trying to top our lineups, and and sometimes we make a lineup that's so amazing we'll go, we're never gonna tap it, and then we tap it. So we're always trying to find a way to do that. I'd say the bourbon, the people that are out there chasing like the Blands and you know the DH Taylors and and that are that are, you know, and look, I uh if I see a Russell's 13,

Why Blind Tasting Beats Label Bias

5:36

I'm buying it. You know, I just saw prisoner's share, you know, high west for 160, I'm buying it, you know. Then the distributor was like, I can get you six pack for 110 apiece. I was like, why did you send me that to me four days after I bought that? Whatever. So I I'm chasing bourbon too. And so I'd say those are sometimes the harder ones to understand what we're doing, and that we're not putting like maker's mark and mickters, we're not putting stuff that you can really get at any liquor store. And we're not also putting like allocated stuff. You know, uh yes and no. Sometimes we do have things that are allocated. Um, you know, we we've had you know, Ben Halliday, Rich House approved in the lineup. We've had a smith from 13th century, um, we've had barrel picks from Frey Ranch from Southern Star. We had a 15-year ride matured in a wellard barrel from Mammoth. We we had an LTO in the Minute lineup with a special custom blend and and a one-time version of this that they've never done before. And I think there's only like 30 bottles of it left. So we limit that to like one per person. Otherwise, we learned pretty quickly that when people figured out we had something really special, they would buy like six or twelve of them, and then it would be gone in a week, and then everyone would be mad at me. Right. The whole purpose is to have a lot of people do blinds, not somebody buy buy it and and have all the whiskey, right? Totally, exactly. And and you know, so we can't make them all be LTOs, but at the end of the day, it's all about discovering what you like through a blind. Remove the bias of the price and the brand, and and you know, we want to be the first company to do this, and we're still technically the only one that's really doing the way that we're doing it. Um, you know, obviously somebody wants to do this. We didn't invent blinds, but we we did add an extra value about a year and a half ago where you can now guess the age, the proof, the type of whiskey, and the QR code, it's gamified. So you you'll get a score that tells you how accurate your ballot is. So that gamification is really fun. And later this week or early next week, we're gonna have on site, so there's a bottle shop, and you kind of see if you go through our bottle shop, some of the things from past lineups. Uh you won't see some of our LTOs because if we if they're sold out and they don't exist anymore, then we don't keep keep them up there. But we're gonna have a thing called Bobby Stash. And the the idea is you know, we're gonna get some midwinter night's dram up there, and and you're gonna be paying instead of the 180 that you see in the liquor store, you're gonna be paying 130. If you've ever seen Doc Holiday, you know, you guys have probably had some of the Doc Holiday releases, right? Yeah. And Doc Holiday's. We all get it in a bio, but in Kentucky, I pick it up. So yeah, I mean, the so the guys at World Whiskey Society, they're they're out of Georgia, and they're finding really cool barrels, and they're doing some blending, they're doing finishing. I'd say their finishing is really good. And in one case, they sourced and they bottled it, and it was it was so if you get the Doc Holiday tenure, you kind of have to look and see what state it's in to see what the juice is. They're not always transparent about what the juice is. So we had them in the lineup, and it was these barrels that they found in Texas, actually, but it was from a distiller that was in Georgia. And this guy was basically you know a whiskey outlaw his whole life, like five generations of moonshiners. And, you know, this guy was making whiskey since he was seven. And when he was in his 70s, his daughter convinced him to go legit, this guy named Carlos Lavelle. And he started this Ivy Mountain distillery. And he was really mainly making moonshine, he wasn't aging it. And he was such a great distiller that the moonshine, that the the white dog,

Scarce Bottles And Member Pricing

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the distillant itself, was just exquisite, that people loved it. And then he was aging like six months. Well, three years and he died. And so the barrels that he was gonna age six months sat there for four or five years. The family finally offloaded a bunch of them, Bargetown, put it in their Explorer series or fusion series, charged 130 bucks for that. The rest ended up in Texas for about four years, which is like seven, right? That heat level and the maturation rate. And then the rest ended up, they've they brought all the barrels back to Georgia. And so when they sent me a sample and I put it, because we don't choose whiskey, we choose we don't choose brands, we choose whiskey, right? So we we do everything blind over here. So I get the samples in. In fact, I've got some blind samples in front of me that I'm going through that somebody sent us. And then we choose something that has to be unique, has to be interesting. And our rules are it's gotta be American, it's gotta be craft. If you're not making your own, you have to do something to it. So you have to blend it, you have to finish it, you have to do something. So pure white labeling isn't allowed. But this was the one time that we allowed white labeling because the distiller himself was a craft distiller. And when we put it up line for my guys, they thought I was like, are you fucking with us? Is this William Laru Weller? Like, because it was it was so rich and thick and tasty and nuanced. I mean, it was mind-blowing how good it was. And I'm like, no, we could we could have this in the lineup. So we made sure that the guy's story was on the neck tag. We added that to the bottle. And I told the guys, because this was a bottle they were selling for like, I don't know, 180, 120. Our members were getting it for 125. I said, I'm going to sell this out of existence because we didn't put a limit on it. And we were just, you know, what when we sell bottles, I would say, look, you're supporting the distillery, not us, because we try to, I try to price it to where go try to find that bottle. And can you get that bottle? Number one. And number two, can you pay the price that you pay if you're a member? So a lot of people think for the blinds, but they really stay for the access and the pricing of the full bottles. We don't do what other clubs do, which is, oh, you like something? We're gonna do another 15, 20% mark of normal MSRP. We try to like knock it down. But I told we were selling that out of existence, and I told the guys at World Whiskey Society, I'm like, look, we're just gonna stop selling this because I want you to, there's two barrels left in existence. Can you just hold on to that for a couple of years? And then when they're 12 years old, we'll bottle the rest of it and just do it as a special offer for our members. And they're like, Yeah, cool. And then the guys called me, it's like, well, we don't have a Doc Holiday 12-year label. So can we just put the tenure on it? I went, No. Like, what is the 12-year label? You got it? It's 12 seconds, 12 and a half years. So that arrives tomorrow. Oh, and you know, the Angel shares from being in Texas. I mean, there's only like there's only gonna be 200 bottles. And look, I'm I'm telling you, this is like not only the first stock holiday 12-year, it's the last barrels of this guy's things. I could sell these for over 200, no problem. But our members are gonna get it for 140. So I'm just trying to decide if we're gonna limit it to one, if it's gonna turn into one of these like feeding frenzies, and it was even milling to me, you know. It'd be nice if it's one, at least everybody could get one, and you don't have somebody go in there and buy 20 of them. So yeah, like like I'm thinking what we do initially is we limit it to one per person, and that way that might last us three months. But some people, honestly, like they're never gonna spend over $100 on a bottle. Some people are really in this for the experience, they don't buy a lot of bottles, and we don't tell people how to drink, what to buy, the way to do it. Some people, um my cousin never even looks at the reveal. I'm like, you're doing it wrong. What are you doing? You don't even want to know what it is. She's like, no, just I like tasting the things. And I'm like, okay. Yeah, to each their own. So he tastes he tastes them. Now, uh as far as going further, you're talking about a release. So if you like it, there's then there's actual bottles for members available, like picks, that type of stuff. Okay, so everything in the lineup is for sale. You know, the one time that we didn't was Fred Minnick's first lineup. So what he did was this was not our lineup. So like the March lineup this year was the Fred Minnick lineup. So those two things are one and the same. So you can go buy the Fred Minnick lineup on our site, or you can become a member and obviously pay a lot less, or like the annual member, the bonus that you'll get is the Fred Minnick kit along with the June kit, the tasting stay of the glasses, all the stuff, right? So um so Fred did it the first time. Sorry, go ahead. So so just as far as how it works as the club, and and it's a subscription club. So initially you get the blind kit

How The Subscription Kits Work

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as far as the and that's the then then those are the available bottles for that month that then if you when once you do the reveal, you then can purchase going forward. Is that kind of how how and if you're a member, you're gonna get them reasonable. Yeah, you're gonna get it like like you guys have probably had JT Mellet before, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah, so yeah, our members get the GT Mellet cash trade for 60 bucks. Yeah, because I followed it on the page and being a member, there's three pages of different bottles, and and they're very different from again what we see in Ohio. There's so few of those that are even in Ohio, you know, so it's kind of unique. Yeah, I mean, like right now there's Southern Star, weeded bourbon, cast strength, and it's a barrel pick that our members are getting for 50 bucks. So so if you're at the distillery buying a non-barrel pick, it's 75 bucks. And if it's a barrel pick, it's 8085. So, you know, we we just knew R and D C pulled out of California. There was a bunch of products sitting around. I'm like, give me like 20 cases of the barrel picks, like, you know, and it, I mean, I'm a massive fan of Southern Star. But yeah, so basically every quarter, there they're drops, so mid-March, mid-June, mid-September, mid-December. Everybody gets the same lineup at the same time, and then it never repeats. So, yes, you'll see the bottles in that lineup that you could then purchase. And yeah, we have $20 flat rate shipping. So if you go get three bottles, like, you know, you can you're not gonna get gouged as we you keep buying more and more bottles, even though the shipping does cost more than that. I will say that. But we try to compartment, we try to make really good shipping value for the members as well. But then all those other bottles you see, those are bottles from past lineup. So if there's a skew that still exists, a great example, Vermont number 14. They're at a Quiche Vermont. The only other one out there is whistlepig. And it's the only time we've had a flavored whiskey in the lineup, and it's Vermont maple syrup infused. And most flavored whiskey, if they're infusing maple, it's a 20% infusion. So this is a 5% maple infusion. It's very subtle. It doesn't taste like a flavored whiskey at all. We thought everybody was gonna get pissed at us with like the purist or whatever. It was the opposite. I mean, I could not hold on to this bottle. So that was our lineup a year and a half ago. A lot of times, people will go on and just order a bunch of bottles and they'll go back and order some of their favorites that are still that we still have. Very cool. I love myself so Middle West. We're trying to get watershed. That's that's kind of our next move for Ohio. Yeah, we'll get uh, and like I told you, I I'll get you set up. Ryan has since left watershed, Ryan Benrick, and he has moved over to Middle West. What, what, wait, what did you say? Yeah, where have you been? Um what do you mean? Uh you mean like five seconds after the podcast? It was maybe ten. Who's that? With with the people to get in touch with that watershed, and of course in the Middle Western, you know, they've got all kinds of stuff. Plus, they've got some killer old elk stuff. Uh, if you haven't got anything from Archer and Elon, her Archer Elon stuff is great, and it's all rye stuff that Wendy is doing. So there's there's some

Finding Craft Distillers Worth Spotlighting

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good ones within those two brands. Yeah, I mean, make make intros, please. I mean, we're obviously we're massive Middle West fans. Everything they make, their bourbon cream. I mean, I mean, everything they make is phenomenal. The Ola Rosa finishes like you know, the Gallop. They they sponsor us. They're our sponsor, one of our main sponsors. Yeah, Ryan, Ryan Lang, he's he's got stuff going, that's for sure. That's a pretty cool place. We're helping one of our members do a barrel pick with them right now. Um but and and you can even like you can white label. I mean, you know, there's they source for a ton of brands, and they're one of the few brands where you can you can do your own label with them and only run do a 3,000 bottle run. Most places you gotta do, you know, like multiple pallets to do a white label run. Oh, he's the what he's what he's figured out with that new distillery and the stuff that that's gonna come and how he's thinking about doing stuff, it's it's he's innovative. I mean, you know, he's it's it's crazy what what he's doing. So Bobby, you get to be probably the the I in my opinion, you got one of the coolest jobs in the bourbon world because you get to go and try all these different places that that are not on the radar, so to speak, for for most people. What how long of a process is it for like this kit? When you start that process and trying, how long does it take you and your team to get it down to where okay, that's gonna be the kit? I mean, there's it so I mean there's several factors. There's sometimes we're talking to a brand for three years before they're in the lineup, sometimes it's a day, and I like there's one brand in upstate New York, they send me their bottles, I tasted it. I always let my guys have autonomy. I'm like, no, I'm foisting this in the lineup. It's phenomenal. It's like ridiculously good. It's gonna be in the September lineup. It's not only in the movie, it's in the movie, you know. So there's these times. So I get to the coolest thing that I get to do is I get to talk to all these brands and all of these founders and these master distillers. And, you know, so I talk to everybody first. I kind of tell them how our program works. You know, we don't do any, you know, a lot of these are smaller distilleries. And in some cases, they're bigger ones, right? And you know, if they are bigger, then they have to give us something really unique and special. That's kind of our rule. It just can't be a normal SKU that's distributed in 44 states. So I get to have that conversation. They send samples. So, like yesterday, you know, I picked up, you know, we have 18 bottles that somebody sent us, and then a local distributor dropped off a few samples. So then I make those into smaller samples. My guys go through the blinds. We kind of have a core of like five to ten people that are in the panel. And we don't just have like a bunch of bourbon stops on the panel. We've got, you know, there's a guy that at the printer shop down the way. Sometimes he pops in on a Friday, and I'll be like, hey, try these few things, right? You know, we had some people in town for a friend's party last Friday. I'm like, hey, these bottles just came in. I'm curious on feedback. So we like to listen to people that are, and I don't just listen to like it's not like Finland. We've done this before where everybody gives their voting and then we, you know, decide so that there aren't any outliers that end up there, right? If you know about Finland voting, everybody ranks and then there's a magnitude, it's almost like a matrix, right? So it's not just you vote for one thing and then the one that gets the most votes wins. And the problem with that method is you end up with everybody's second favorite, which is okay. Whereas I don't mind if something's polarizing. There's something in that best of the best kit that is polarizing. Some people love like it's one of their favorites, and some people hate it. But even the ones that hate it love that they got to try it. So within that process, so if somebody's here, like the guy that was at the favorite story is porn at this stuff for still in Old Hammer, and the rum finish, like he had he had 10 bottles in front of me tried them all. I thought this guy was gonna finish the bottle of old hammer rum finish. Like this guy just was like, This is the best thing I've ever. And that magnitude, and I did love it, and it was we hadn't had a rum finish in the lineup yet, so we were looking for one because most rum finishes are just overly rummy, it just tastes like rum instead of just getting some of those really cool vanilla notes. So once that process happens, so the first thing is figuring out what's going to be in the lineup. And and then the skew. So if it's sometimes Sometimes Castillery, we love everything. You know, like we love everything. Middle West, we love everything. Sometimes they just send us just all bangers, and we have to figure out what's going to be in the lineup. Then we have to determine what order they're going to be in. Because that's uh so I I always feel bad there was one time. So that that Vermont number 14 after number they were there was sample A, and sometimes you go up and prove, sometimes you have to put single molds at the end. There's some things that you just have to do, otherwise you'll mess up the lineup. I felt like we screwed over Kings County in that lineup. We didn't mean to, but when you have something that's just sweet, even very though it's subtly sweet, it just doesn't make the next one shine as good. So we try to place them in a way so that everybody really shines and everything can. It's not really a competition. If I got 20 people in a room, 30 people will say A is their favorite. The same would be true for B, the same true for C, the same for D. And there'll be one person that hates A. Well, same for B, C, and D. Like so you can never please everybody. And ultimately, we're not really a whiskey company, we're an experienced company. So my job is to forge these relationships with distillers. You know, these are partners. It's just very symbiotic. You know, we don't take marketing fees, we don't tell them to give us a whiskey for free, we don't tell them to give us deals on the wholesale price. At the end of the day, we want to showcase and uplift these small brands and really kind of work what distribution does, distribution, especially for on-premise, but definitely for on-premise, there's a reason why you see all the usual suspects at bars, restaurants, and liquor stores, right? And in your case, obviously you're you know you're in a more controlled state, so trying to get product to you is is is harder, and those mechanisms get tricky. Um, but you know, we do everything above board. You know, we're not a basement with a funnel, you know. Um no, and what you said there, that's that's exactly what I love about it too, is that you're advocating for these small craft distilleries on a platform that they really don't have. They they probably are good at at being able to have their own market share. You know, the people that know them come into their distilleries are local, but once you get outside of that, it's kind of hard. And we see it in a we have a lot of small craft distilleries in this area, and we focused a lot on that this year. Like that's been one thing with the podcast is that we wanted to bring some light to these brands because there's some really good stuff out there that people see on the shelf, but it's not the brand name that they know, so they pass and they get a bottle of something that they know, you know, like one of the big big brands. And I think that is really cool with what you do is you're bringing them to light and opening opening people's eyes and palettes to what's out there, just like you said with the the one brand that does the rice. I I the first time I tried that, I was like Mellick. Is it Mellick? Is that how you say their name? Yeah, JT Mellick. You would think like if you if you take it's a hundred percent Louisiana rice whiskey, and they're they're really crawfish farmers, they're really seafood people. In fact, the

Building A Lineup With Panels

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owner, Mike Fouget, he doesn't even drink whiskey. He knows he's a vodka guy, right? And but somebody convinced them that they could make whiskey out of the rice that they give in crawfish. I hope I hope they weren't in uh Minix pick or his kit, because you know, he he doesn't really like vodka. No, he's no, he his whole thing is vodka sucks, right? Yeah, well no, so it was in uh Randy, so Randy Sullivan from Bourbon Real Talk. We did a partnership with him the March before March of 2025. And and he was like, You guys gotta get Melick, you guys gotta get Ben Halliday. I was like, I want Ben Halliday. We've talked to them. I'd say one in 20 brands will talk to somebody that isn't the decision maker, but they're right below it, and then they they just go, well, we don't white label, we're not white because what we are doing is white labeling, right? Like technically because their brand isn't on the bottle, they don't get to to promote the brain like that, right? But we're not positive like it's our brand, right? We are very much a marking arm for that brain. So some people very rarely just don't get that. And then you had 13th century and he had Rocktown still column in there. So yeah, Randy picked all bangers, and that that JT Mellick is, I mean, at 118 proof, it it's a really smooth cast drink, and it it drinks for for being four or five years old, it drinks like a really deep, rich, well-aged bourbon. It's wild to me. But yeah, that's well, they're crazy. You find those brands, and and like we have one here in Ohio that does 100% corn, and and that's what they really focus on. And people are like, wait a minute, 100% corn? You know, there's no no barley in there, there's no rye, but it's phenomenal. Like it's so good. And is it bourbon or is it corn whiskey? It would be considered bourbon. You know what? Yeah, it's bourbon. Yeah, yeah, the only way it goes to corn whiskey is if it gets stuck in a used barrel right off the bat. But if you age it, I I mean the guy that does the that's doing corn whiskey right now at old, you know, old Carter, Mark Carter, some of his best stuff is 100% corn. You're just like, oh my god, that, you know, there's as you know, it's the people who are taking the time to you, you're dealing with the the craft distillers and and the people that are that really put out, they they take their time to put it out, but then it's also you finding these people and picking them out. And that's something that you're doing to help people understand what's happening at these craft distilleries because a lot of times the craft distilleries have a hard time getting their messages out. They have good whiskey, but nobody's picking them because there's the story's not on the shelf. And when you walk in and you don't know what it is, people whiskey when you have hundreds of choices, we all know how mark uh how people pick stuff. The bottom, yeah. We call it label failure. You know, oh your buddy liked this one, they recommend it, and you drink it and you're like, shit, I don't really like that. And it happens all the time. And there's brands, there's crap brands like Frey Ranch is a great example of somebody that's been really great at. I mean, they're whiskey farmers, they grow their own grain. I mean, that they really were able to push that story through, but their product is so good. Their ries are some of the best ries. Have you had their 100% malted corn before? It's wild how it's it's wild, interesting, and phenomenal all at the same time. And but who's doing that? You know, you're and you and you see bigger brands that are just following all these trends that the craft brewers are doing. And you know, like Alan Bishop, you guys probably had Alan on your show, right? Many times. Um from French Lick. Oh, yeah. Yeah, and Alan. I've been on uh if you have ghosts, you have everything because I've been on his I've been on two of his podcasts us too, me and me and Roxy too. Yeah, I love it. I uh I love Alan. I love but you know, when he put in his mash bill, he puts buckwheat. Yeah, and boom. Buckwheat. Like if you get a bunch of rye, two percent of that's gonna be buckwheat. And so he's like, it's in the mash bill, you know. His four grain, one of the grains is oat. And I gotta tell you, oak. I love it. It's awesome. Yeah, I love it, it's phenomenal. You know, there is a there is a something to those those oats being in there that I can't figure out why other people haven't used it. So this was his this was his Lillian Sinclair, the Lillian, not the the what have you had that? Yeah, the the woman, uh the other guy, the other guy, yeah, who's Lillian was I'm assuming his wife? Um I believe. I want to say sister, Lillian. Yeah. So this one, it is a four-grain, but he flipped, I need my it's been a while. But he flipped the grains from least. Yeah, okay. So this one is corn rye oats and barley. And he switched the, I want to say he switched uh from the the Sinclair. Let me leave you. Yeah, let me see. I got it. I got Lee Sinclair. That is corn, yeah, oats and barley. He this is so this is a rye oats and barley, and uh the the Sinclair was wheat oats and barley. So he did that as a passion project, and then he dropped some French Oaks too, a French oak steak from Stephen Beam in in the barrel for about three months, and then we did that barrel pick. So I've that one was one that I got out of out of there before he left. That was actually the last pick he did before he left French Lick. Oh my god. Do you have any more of that? I gotta try some of that. I have a lot of it. No, it's not. I have a lot. Oh, yeah. I I the barrel, yes, there's I got cases because I knew that that's I I sit I've been sitting on it. Okay, there we might maybe we'd come up with a trend to start. Oh, I yes. No, that would be that would be wonderful. Just wonderful. It could be in the next blind. It'll be the next blind with the uh okay. So so when you do a blind like whatever, how many bottles do you actually have to be able to do a blind for your members and everything? I mean, what is the volume you're talking about to be able to do that? I mean, so like right now, so we've got over 5,000 members, right? So we can't we can't do barrel picks the way that we used to do anymore. So we are doing what what it's interesting, now we've kind of reached a level where we can just do barrel picks for fun, right? And then just like the Doc Holiday, great, we're gonna sell that out. That's not in the lineup, right? But that'll be something that people can get. So we're gonna try to see if we can start doing like a barrel pick every quarter just as a side fun, special release type of a deal. But yeah, we you know, 85 gallons gets you to about 6,500 kits, but 85 per skew. So it's 340 gallons that have to be bottled into 50 mls to create a lineup because I need to have enough for several things. I need we're gonna gain more members between now and the next lineup, so I need to be able to send them a kit and not have to wait for the next one. But

Scaling Kits Through Complex Alcohol Laws

32:34

then at the end of the year, a bunch of people are buying one-off kits and not becoming members, and we have to have that surplus, and then there's corporate gifting and there's all these other things. You kind of have to have a surplus for every single lineup that you do. We almost there was a Christmas where we almost ran out of product and people like that's a nice problem to have uh problem that I want to have. It is an almost is okay if you almost run out. But if you run out, that's a shitty problem to have because that's just leaving money on the table, and that's not you're not it. I can't just pour whiskey into our bottles. Like that's not, you know, there's a three-tier system, and it's really annoying. And I will say, I won't say how we do what we do. I know six ways to do what we do, and we have the most optimal way for the way that we're doing it, but it's it's it's difficult to navigate a lot of these laws, and you know, none no other countries have to do any of this stuff that we do, um, you know, to credit. So what we did was once we reached a threshold about yeah, go ahead. Every state's a different country. I mean, that's the key, that's the thing. They all have different laws. I mean, uh it's some are very similar, there's no doubt, but everyone has its little thing that that can, you know, and it's all designed somehow to screw you. It's right, yeah. No, I would say, like, you know, and there's some really great distributors out there, and then there's some that are like, you know, it's like, you know, the mafia didn't get out of alcohol after prohibition, they got into distribution. Oh, yeah. Like sometimes I'm talking to a distributor, and I feel like I'm talking to like, you know, the guy that raised Anakin Skywalker, you know, that was the the you know, oh don't worry, I'm going to take care of you. It's fine, it's everything's good, right? And uh and and he's just but but he's like trying to talk me into something, and I'm like, can we just talk like humans? Like I talk to distillers all the time, everybody talks like humans, and I'm not saying that because he has an accent or whatever. The guy didn't really have an accent. I mean, but sometimes the the guy will have an accent that sounds like you know, he's gonna be in my backseat with the piano wire and he's gonna murder me, you know. Forget about it. Don't worry about that can you forget about it. Don't worry. Hey, hey, Bobby, you and me tight with tight. I'm not gonna let this go by. I mean, and then he does, and then I was like, I knew we were never tight. I never trusted that we were fucking tight. That's bullshit. But what so we ran out when we stopped doing barrel picks, you know, that were in the lineup. We then we had still Austin in the lineup at the end of 2024. And what was really cool about that is tool and not tool. So still Austin has this total wine deal. Like you can't get still Austin unless it's total wine, at least in California. So I can't buy their bottles, but the loophole is that you can do a barrel pick. The problem is we had too many members, and so I said, Can I pick two barrels and we blend them? So I trademarked the name the smallest batch. So we started doing the smallest batch series. The smallest small batch can be, which is two barrels. And we got into blending as a special LTO. So we've done that. We have our fourth one coming up that we've done that's like that. We just did one with Pinhook. Pinhook was really great because I love Pinhook. Like, if I see Pinhook at Costco, I buy it because I know it's gonna be awesome, and I know it's gonna be Costco always has it this killer price. And with the CEO, he actually reached out to me on LinkedIn. I'm like, I love you guys. I'm like, but you guys are like in every restaurant I've ever been in. Like, can you give us something? And I was trying to talk him into like letting us do like a three-barrel blend of like their 10-year vertical, and we got really close to doing that, and instead we did a custom blend. So they have a true small batch series where you can blend two barrels or two or three barrels together and make your own custom blend, but it's the first time that it was ever double barreled. So they they had these three-year barrels that then they re-barreled at the three-year mark and then got to six-year. And we we flew

Creating The Smallest Batch Blends

36:45

out to New Orleans, Rashawn Joseph lives. And so, me, my guys, we flew out there, he had a bunch of samples on there from different barrels, and we spent a couple hours blending, figuring out what three-barrel blend we were gonna come up with. Learned a lot. I mean, that guy is one of the best blenders in the game, there's no question. We went to this unbelievable restaurant, we went down to Bourbon Street and got Slurkanes, we golfed with Sean the next day. He's gonna be in town action two weeks. We're gonna be golfing him again. And I was telling my guys it was a 25-hour trip to New Orleans, and I'm like, you know that if you were like a make-a-wish foundation fundraiser, somebody would pay $25,000 to do what we just got to do. To go out making a custom blend with the guy that founded the master blender from Pinhook, golf with them. Like, I'm just saying, like, it was you know, it's there, there's some tough things about our job, but there's some badass things about our jobs. So there Pinhook's brand is very, very, what would you say? I call it corporate. It's very corporate. It's like they're at a lot of they're in a lot of different, they're in high-end bars. So when we when I was in New Orleans for a New Orleans Bourbon Festival, did were you did you go there this year? No? Maybe I didn't. Okay. No. I had never been to New Orleans actually until that trip. Okay, because we that just in March, we were we were there and there was a panel, and he was sitting next to Macaulay Minton from uh Dark Arts. Yeah, from Dark Arts. And and if you want to talk about the Macaulay and mushrooms? Macaulay was on uh he he got married, uh, which was crazy. I mean, the whole thing. I actually got to live stream his mare his wedding, and he let me mic him. I mic him. That was that was nuts. But the two of them together sitting next to each other was about the biggest contrast of bourbon people I've ever seen in my life, and they were sitting next to each other on a panel. You know what I mean? It's just like that that one end, one guy is just like taking it and going off on just like unbelievable tangents, and then he's there and he makes pin hook, and he's you know, and they were talking about things so different of how they go about it, but it's the coolest thing about whiskey, right? There's so many different ways to do it. And they've both been in our lineup. So, yeah, we had the the dark arts uh Julupier, you know, I think uh about a year, December of 2024, we had them, or December, yeah, 2024, we had them in the lineup. And yeah, McCauley, great character, awesome, love that guy, one of the best palettes in the game. There's no question. And and then you look at Sean Josephs, who comes from this really, I mean, if you you know, we were in the car, he's telling us this story for uh, you know, an hour throughout the day. And, you know, I mean, he was a ski bum, and then he works his way up in a restaurant and he works his way through the wine thing, and and really kind of like some of the ways that he looks at the tannins and the wines and the different things that he's doing, and even the way that he blends, it's really fascinating because we learned a lot that it wasn't just trying to oh take that one and that one because of those notes, that they're gonna work well together, that some things don't play well together. But yeah, two totally completely different personalities. And and I didn't look at like pinhook as it's like, well, they're corporate, it's more of like you said, yeah, they're in all the nice restaurants, they're everywhere. So I said, look, if we're going to have a pinhook, it needs to be something that nobody else can get, that only our members can get. So it was a three-barrel blend? Is that what you or how what'd you end up doing with it? It was a three-barrel blend. And so some of it went to the samples, the rest got barreled, and it's a black lamb. It's on your wax. Yeah, and with the black wax, it's in one of the kits that's on your table right now. It's got the black wax, it says blended by blind barrels, and and yeah, it was a and it's interesting because you would think we did this at Still Austin where we had we went into the the the they they they call it a rack house, and it's in Lockhart. It's not even in Austin, it's like 40 miles outside. And most people pick barrels, they bring the samples into the distillery in Austin, and they pick from there. But we went into the rack house, we're drinking sherry, we're drinking everything there, and then we pulled 20 barrels, and then we picked what we thought were five outliers that were unique and interesting. We pulled that back, and then you know, if you if you think about the combination five choose two, you have I think it's it's 10 different things that you could have. So we're like, oh, let's make all 10 of these things. And there was one that the front end was like off the charts, and there's one that the back end was really good. And you think that those together might play well together, and it just turned out that they did. I mean, but you could take a world-class athlete and wrote scholar, and you might end up with a really dumb non-athlete. You know, you could end up, you know, somehow like you'll get this thing that you can't mute the bad thing with this other thing. But that bottle, I only have one of it left, and uh, it's I'm looking at it, I want to drink it with my kids one day. I do have one of each of these special barrels. The only thing we do with Southern Star, so it was a barrel. So there was a barrel that won the New York Spirits competition outright. And there was a sister barrel. There was only two of these barrels that were experimental that I later found out that existed. So he sent me the samples and he's like, put them in non-transducent glasses, don't look at the color, don't be swayed by the color. And I did, but sure enough, this one was like, Oh my god, this is a four-year-old whiskey. Are you sure? I mean, it's and it was still to this day the darkest whiskey I've ever seen in my entire life. It is the darkest whiskey, and we put it in the lineup, and sure enough, it crushed. And what it was an experimental barrel that had the inside was groved out, and it created all this surface area on the inside. Is that what they do? I don't know.

Live Blind Tasting Of Four Samples

42:56

And is it really dark too? I mean, I just didn't know why it was so dark and it was rich and it was phenomenal. That's a ton of wood contact, if you think about it. Like all that shading is still in there, plus the wood that it's getting into like normal. Yeah, I think that's why it gets so dark. And then I mean, it but then it the thing is though, when you get something that like that though, the char, it'll settle. And then you'll do this, and the plume will come up. This barrel is just dark. This bottle has been sitting over there for a year untouched. It's still dark throughout the whole thing. So there's no like little fine dusty things. Like they, in fact, it was already bottled when they sent it to us, which is usually, you know, they're they're they're sending different drums and vessels and things like that. But no, this in this case, it was already bottled because he wanted to give it away as like special gifts throughout the whole year, and so he had to send us those bottles and then turn those bottles into candles, you know, because I don't want to just throw away that glass, you know. Yeah. So CT. So that's the Indians we just use all. You've got it in front of you. What what did you pour? This is this is crazy. I mean, I I if you probably haven't been watching my facial expressions, but so one is is definitely and it's on my right. So this is one, two, three, four. And I and I can see what you mean, Bobby, about the progression and not trying to fight because wow, four is way different. And if four had been in the front, the notes that it has would have kind of messed with one for sure. One is is more to me the ovary, the fruit definitely uh has that lighter note to me. Is this the best of the best box of the minute? Yeah, best of the best. So to me, this one was the more poppery, but it has you know, the more you drink it, there's some nuances that come in there. There's a cereal note that I get that I like a lot. It's just very different. But two follows me more like a traditional bourbon. I don't and I'm probably way off, but it just has that nice. Uh I don't want to say, you know, it's just like but it does, it's just got the caramels, the vanillax. It's just this has a lot of those good flavors. Three and four, there's something going on there. That's those are different. Yeah, those are wildly different. And there is, and there is, yeah, you're right. There's a progression where it's funny, the sample A, the number one on your right, was it's probably still one of the most popular ones in the lineup. People keep ordering that. I have to keep ordering that again and again from the distributor. The second one, you know, these are all ones that have been in the lineup. Um, is a smaller distiller, it's a Kentucky distillery, it's probably one that you've been familiar with that just got sold to somebody else. The third one is something we've already mentioned, the fourth one is something we've already mentioned. The fourth one, and if I'm wrong on that first time I drank it, it it this was the wow glass for me because there was a barbecue note on there. And I thought I was like, yeah, it's just different. Oh man. Yeah, it's different. So that's not the Miniq one, that's the first quarter. That's the 2026 first quarter. Oh my god, yeah, there is a it's a barbecue. It is so unique. It's isn't it funny what happens to number 14 whiskey in the world? That's what so after they were in the lineup, two weeks after we had bottled and everything, right as it was coming out, it got named number 14 whiskey in the world. But it was heat. It's full. I mean, it definitely leaves you a hug, but it is by far, to me, one of the most unique flavors of a bourbon. Like, and I it's not flavored, obviously, but uh you don't get barbecue or I don't get barbecue on a lot. But that's that's fun. So we we all right. So Bobby, Bobby, tell us let's let's let's go through this over real quick. So we'll see this at home. So when you or when you get the kit, whether you buy a quarterly kit or you buy the subscription for the year, I'm gonna tell you for the for the money, buy the yearly because you get the glasses, you get the extra kit, that's a better deal. But you always get a card in there that's gonna tell you about it, tell you that, hey, this is release number 16 and it's the best of the best, tells you about um, you know, what you're getting ready to get into. The other thing that I thought was really cool before you tell us what's in these is the bottles themselves, which we talked about 50 milliliters, they are labeled ABCD. But if I happen to accidentally get these mixed up, which could happen, I'm good at that. On the back is a QR code, so you can scan this if I'm not mistaken, and then you can find out exactly what this one was, and you can order that if you wanted that bottle. Yeah, no, we that's not stuff we did early on. We changed over about a couple years ago. We started putting honestly the little label that we had on the back that was like, the women can't drink it, and some of the things it was such a small label that it was hard for our label applicator. And so by making the front and the back the same size, it actually solved a little bit of that problem in general. But yeah, putting the QR code on each bottle. And then with each one, there's also a separate letter that we give hints to different things about the lineup. And there's also on the back of it, there is a unique cocktail. We my my my guy creates a unique custom cocktail and and a whiskey meal, a recipe. So, yeah, this one is uh whiskey fudge. Do you have a brick and mortar place? That's unbelievable. Do you actually have a place? Yeah, we're here right now. Okay. So where where you can come into the and and you can everything's available and you can do blind tastings and stuff like that. Where where's that located? Uh yes and no. So we're in Westlake Village, we're just north of LA. We're kind of like uh we're like Calabasas adjacent, you know. We don't have the Kardashians, but we got Josh Brown, okay? We got Josh Brolin over here. Although, although we we got we got Ribby Spears does live over here, she just got arrested down the street. Was she at your place? We got Wayne. No, no. We got Wayne Gretzky, you know, we got a lot of people that Lake Sherwood, which is where like Tiger Woods is golf tournament every year. Lake Sherwood is one of the best country clubs in the country. So we're in Westlake, we're just north of LA. We don't have a tasting license, so we can't pour samples here. We're working on that actually. You can have the two licenses that we have concurrently. We can do that. So we're in the process of getting approved for that. But yeah, local members come in here all the time and get to, you know, buy things without paying for shipping, or a lot of times local members, I like I like to I like to give them the price of the bottle for really, really, really close to wholesale, just so we don't lose money on the transaction with the credit card fees or whatever. So anybody that's locally that's here, or we've had people that have been in town and have visited. In fact, we do a whiskey trip every year. The first year, there was a year where picking up all the whiskey ourselves was cheaper than freighting it, and everything was from like Washington all the way to Oregon and down the California coast. So we just made a whiskey trip out of it. And then the next year we did and we did Iowa to Indiana to Kentucky to Tennessee. It was that was a long trip in Illinois. We we hit five states and 1700 miles, and then we did it, we did Texas the year after that. We crossed all the way across Texas and visited distilleries, some that had been in the lineup and some that we were scouting. And then last this last October, we went from Atlanta

Road Trips And Hidden Distillery Finds

51:02

all the way to DC. And I gotta tell you, we found a diamond in the rough that was like the wildest. You know, you think you've heard of things in crap. There was this guy in the name is I think Broad Slab in North Carolina. And it's basically a town that like had figured out there's a part of the tree that nobody figured out how to use it, and it's the broad slab of the tree, and they started using it to help pave roads, and that's the name of this town. Well, this guy learned from his stepdad of the farm, the generational farm. He grew it, he started making whiskey. And what he did was when he would make a bird, when it would reach two years old, he would put it under a tobacco flu, and a tobacco flu gets to like 170 degrees. And so these barrels that he put under there for like three days, well, two percent of them just explode, okay, but they all come out like warped and wild and crazy, and and and basically these two-year-old barrels are insanely dark and rich tobacco notes, and I don't know anybody's doing, but he's only got like 600, but I don't know if he's gonna let us have some to put him in the lineup, but that was one of those ones where we were just completely in the middle of nowhere. He puts us in a tractor, and we go through the woods, and I'm like, and and you know, and he talks like you know, he talks like he's got a first grade education, and when you start talking to him, you go, This is one of the most brilliant people I've ever been around. I mean, he built his Rick House. I've seen a lot of hillbilly steels in my day. This was the most premium self-made still and mint shirt that I've ever seen, and and it was and it was mind-blowing. You can't judge a book by its cover or a man by his accent, I'll tell you that. And so we are going to work really hard to get this guy in the lineup. So, yeah, we we go visit people we love and we get to go scout out ones, and and it's great because you know, as you guys know, when you're picking barrels and you get to hang out with the owner and you're popping barrels, and there's nothing better than that experience. Well, there's nothing wrong with the normal tour where you have the white dog control in the room and you do the stuff, right? But well, if you have the right people with you, members come with us too. You know, you have Harlan Harlan Wheatley, or you got Brent Elliott giving you the tour, or you're and then you're in the Rick House thieving with them. Yeah, I always say that bourbon, you it's uh especially with you doing what what what you're doing blind, because you're there when you're having the experience, it always makes the especially straight out of the barrel, it makes the bourbon taste so much better. It's like when it gets you where where you really taste it back at the at the office out of the thing, and that's where you got to really judge it because I I swear your your your sensory just goes so much higher when you're when you're hanging out with the people with people that and having a good time. It's just it's just that's what it's totally like have you guys been to to Three Boys or Whiskey Team sponsor. Oh, they're our other sponsor. Walter, Walter's like my best, like in the industry, Walter's probably my best friend in the industry. I mean, he did he's uh we're having a bus tour this year. He it's we're going to the we went last year to the tasting room. He put us out, he gave us lunch in the pendent's club. Now this year we're going out to the three the farm, and so he's sponsoring the whole thing, gonna set up a big thing in the in the Rick House, and you know, no, well, the they're they're fantastic. I mean, that was my first time when we were starting the company before we went out. We were in Kentucky for the American Spirits Craft Association, and I've never done the whiskey bell and all the things, and we ended up at the you know, well no, the you know, whiskey thief, right? But was three boys at the time. And just that Friday, it's sunset, the barn doors open, you're thieving barrel out of like literally you're thieving it to make your own bottle out of it. And it's still maybe one of the best whiskeys I've had, and because I drank it after the fact when I wasn't in the environment, and I wish I bought one of these 375 mls, but like that's a great example of somebody that will probably never be able to get in the lineup because they operate. And but oh, there you go. Yeah, they're there, yeah. Yeah, they yeah, they do, yeah. And honestly, you probably you should. I can hook, I'll get you to hooked up with Walter. You probably could they they at this point you probably could get them in the lineup. Their single barrel program is rolling now, which probably back then it wasn't doing much, you know, but now they're doing a bigger out, you know, they do a lot of also, also just know. Well, but but they hired Lisa Roper Wicker. And I don't think you hire, uh and we've we've discussed this on the podcast with Lisa and Walter. You don't hire Lisa if you're not gonna do, I mean, it's all been single barrels to this point, but I mean, what you're just you're leaving stuff on the table if you don't let her do blends. I mean, it's just you know, uh they they got the still and whatever, but he's Walter's very good at securing some damn good whiskey when he goes out there. And if they start blending, uh they gotta. Lisa does the youngest distiller in Kentucky, and uh up there by the the the fermentation things, and I mean this this is just like five inches off of the thing, and he's and he's inebriated. Hunter? That was Hunter, and he's like, Yeah, yeah, he's like, you know, he's got one strap on he's like, You guys in California, he's a goddamn liberal, right? You got liberals, and I was like, We're a very diverse state. So it was just one of those classic, like, you know, the the distillers up there, he's been drinking, he's been sampling, we're down there. But I just the the I had never done something like that before. And yeah, we pop all sorts of barrels and we've had all sorts of fun doing that now, but I still kind of look back at that moment as a special moment. And and we when people we we probably have, you know, 50 of our members reach out all the time. Hey, we're going to the trail, where should we go? Or go to this day, where should we go? And that's always on the list. I said, you have to go there because once you've done one distillery, once you've done, you know, the heaven hill done that, like you've done it all. Like I always say, go to places where you can get a store pick. You have to go to Willet and get the egg salad sandwich. But when I was at Willet, they were pouring three different 15, 16, 17 year purple tops for a total of $25. And I was like, Yeah, we want some lucky day. And I and they wouldn't let us do it twice, obviously, but it was just one of those, like, oh my God, like we're just finding little bits of gold everywhere. And that's kind of what we're doing with these other distilleries. That there are these little, you know, come on, broad slab. Like, who's ever heard of broad slab? Nobody. I guarantee you, nobody's ever heard of that. I'm telling you, try to get them in the lineup. Every day now, it's like I I'm on a list that I get. It's, but I have to, I get tequila and vodka people contacting me to come on the podcast, you know, and it's always like, well, we just listened to this podcast, and you should really have, and I'm like, it's a whiskey podcast. That's where I draw the line, you know. And I'll do anything as far as cocktails and you know, that type of thing, or flavored whiskey. Fine. It just has to do anything to do with whiskey. I mean, that's a pretty broad scale, right? You're talking Scotch, you're talking Japanese. You know, we just had our first um Cinco de Mana Mexican distiller, Sierra Norte. They came on, and so I actually had a, you know, that was our first international podcast. But what I what I'm saying is, but every day there's this, there's a distillery I never heard of in Virginia, or there's a dis and they want to send me samples. And my only thing is, is

Tequila Plans And Restaurant Expansion

59:25

send me the samples. If I, if I if I can recognize the whiskey as good, like well-made whiskey, they're on. You know, I'm you know, I understand my palette of what I want, but it has, you know, I also understand that every single distillery makes, you know, the large distilleries, they're making it for everybody, right? Even yourself. There's, like you said, there's people, there's, there's some people that you might not like that whiskey on on the end, but you know it's really good. But then the fourth one you love, and then when you put it out there to everybody, it's equal straight across the board. That's just palettes, right? It's like you're serving steak and lobster. That's what you do when you're blind, right? You got steak and lobster. There's some people who love lobster, don't like steak, and then you know, vice versa. But pretty much most people like it all. They like both steak and lobster. So that's what that's the goal, right? Yeah, you want people that are trying everything. We we are gonna get into tequila you know, probably next year. We're just smart. The laws are a little bit different in how you can do it. So we're gonna have a tequila, mascal, agave box, you know, even throwing some soda, like some some really cool, like even I'm thinking like Pachuda, you know. I mean, there's some really cool things that you could do with that category. And we're in the process of raising money right now, so we're about midway through that because we're expanding it to a restaurant model that's totally different than this model, and then trying to get our kids in hotel rooms. Nice. So up, do you want to go through the line? We we didn't get back to it. Yeah, go through it. No, another one. Yeah, I'll tell you, yeah, I'll tell you what each of uh each of these are. So that first one is uh from Traverse City, Michigan. And that is it's not Traverse City. I mean, it's funny, there's a few distilleries in Traverse City. My my son lives there. So tell your son to go to Mammoth the selling because well, I'm going now. It is such a everything that they have, and and look, they do source a lot of uh Canadian rye from Alberta, but then they've got this island where they're doing all these yeast experiments, and they are true craftsmen, you know, longtime friends. I first met them when I was in Kentucky at the convention, and Phil Addy, who was their head distill at the time, I mean, he was doing amateur chiropractic on me at two in the morning while we were drinking like some asthmat stuff, and you know, so it's just you know, great people, great whiskey. I'll tell you that 15-year ride that we had mature in a well-a barrel from them. They were in our second

Revealing The Four Whiskey Identities

1:02:05

lineup ever. So to have them back in the lineup, and this is a store pick. You can only get this if you're at the store. This is a Mammoth Northern Rive Durban. And yes, this is a really, really popular bottle on its members. People order this like crazy. Um, that second one is Casey Jones. Okay, makes sense. Which I think that they're out of what, Pembroke, Kentucky? They're over on the West, the west side of the. I think it's I think it's the grandson that's that's doing the distilling now, right? Uh I mean AJ was the main guy, but they just they just sold the company. I forget to who, but this was like three months ago. So, but no, there's there's a family operation, and so we had them in the lineup a long time ago. It was their white label. I gotta say, for the quality of their product and for the pricing of their product, so we sell that bottle of sample B for 45 bucks, because that's what it is if you're at the distillery. We have their single barrel white label, cash strength, and they do little rare movies, so you're getting these cash drinks that are like anywhere from 105 to 112. We sell that for 50 bucks, you know, on our site, and that rushes. Um, that third one. So, what did you think of the third one? Be honest. Hang, let me go back. There was a there was a a funky note on this that I wasn't sure. Tell me what type of whiskey this is. Oh boy, that's that's okay, hang on. And so the choices, well, you know, you got you got bourbon, right, wheat, single malt. Those are kind of your four main, right? Although we've had a milligram, yep, 100% Louisiana rice whiskey. We've had things that are in those four and other lineups, but this one of the four was the funkiest. There's a funk to this that if I had to say it would it wouldn't surprise me if it's a single malt that has some weird, you know, a single malt will do that, but it doesn't remind me of a single malt at the same time. But whatever it is, it's heavy on one green. It's how I feel. Yeah, this is and this is a single malt. I'd say probably only about 15% of people can pick up on this. I had a buddy, we we do a show called Four Whiskeys with the local radio guy every Thursday, and somebody put this in the blind like three months ago, and none of us get single malt because it was it's not, you know, what happened to people who make single malts, they do all these old world methods, right? They copy all the old world methods. Whereas Southern Distilling, when they made this, they said, we're gonna make this like a bourbon. Yeah. And it's it's not the uh the fruit notes, like we just did a we just did a podcast with Town Branch, and uh J Bob brought in some really killer single malts, and one of them had this crazy raspberry note that was just oh but it was butter, butter icing raspberry. I mean the rasp, it was more I never tasted anything like it in a whiskey. So this is kind of this has a little darker side of it for a single malt, though. Like this this goes more to a dark side, not as fruity, which like you're saying, if they they do a different process, that makes sense. Yeah, people either love it or they hate it, it's kind of like one of the it's polarizing. And yeah, uh, this is only a 375 milliliter bottle. You can only buy this if you are at the distillery or if you're a member. We're the only retailer that has both sample A and C. Like unless you're at the distillery yourself. Yeah. Um but yeah, Pete Barger, you know, he's a you know, Bruisel did Bruisel Fest or something at on his location. And yeah, they all went nuts for this. Now that can very much be inception where somebody says it doesn't serve about any stuff, but we don't tell people what to love. You know, we you know, I always equated when we started this, we we figured out quickly, like that Southern Star dark barrel that everybody went nuts for. I got an angry email about it that was like, I've had seven barrel picks from Southern Star. This didn't taste anything like any of them. And I'm like, well, fuck yeah, dude. We're just trying to we're trying to do shit that people aren't doing. That's the whole point. Isn't that why you do barrel picks and different things? You're right. That's why. Exactly. Something different, right? Wanted to be different. Well, we we picked a barrel with uh Frey Ranch, and we were with Colby and Ashley and with Russell that had distiller. And I mean, we spent all day with them. It was so much fun and trying all these things right on the tractor. He's got, you know, all this. We're having fun all day. But we're in the room picking the samples, and I had never at that point picked a barrel before. And so my guy, you know, who had done it before, he's like, well, let's you decide. There was there was five there, there was one that was very bright and very much on brand for Frey, and very much their flavor profile. But there's this one that had this like vegetable forced floor thing, and I couldn't stop drinking it. It was so unique and interesting to me. And but I didn't want to like, you know, and and I could tell they were nudging me, I could tell they had the still was nudging me towards their their standard thing, right? But my guy being my guy, my chief, you know, my chief case, my my spirits guides, my whiskey wizards. He he listens to everybody. He doesn't foist, he's he's the best listener. And there was this older woman in the corner of the room who'd been sitting there the whole time. And he looks over her and she's like, he says, Well, what about you? Which one do you like? And she's holding this this glass like it's the cup of Christ, and she she keeps sipping from. She's like, I think this one's the best one I've ever had since I've been here. And and it was the it was the weird one, and it turned out it was a it was a cooperage that they've never used before, which is why the profile was different. And and the distiller looked at her with this stink eye because it was the distiller's wife. And so, and it's the one that ended up in the mana, right? And that's the one that I'm like, look, we mean uh, and and we got to go back to Frey because we need to do a barrel pick of rye from them because I do think their rye is just so the charts, phenomenal. When they when they sell a barrel pick on their site and whatever, I I ordered, I paid 105 bucks or 110 bucks or whatever it is for their cast strength rye, is I think as good as it gets, you know. I that's uh that's a southern store. The fourth one is something that uh we talked about that you guys should be very familiar with. Yes, I've been drinking that, dude. Yeah, there's the guessing that it's the pump for pickle. Nope. Or is it the cast drink wheat? So this is this it's their cast drink wheat. That's where the that's where that different taste you're tasting that toasted wheat. That that is that wheat whiskey uh at cast strength, I agree. Uh that is a phenomenal and their wheated bourbon that they put out at cast strength is freaking phenomenal, too. I mean, what a what a what a I mean what do you guys pay? If you're at the liquor store, what are you paying for a cast strength of the of of the uh of the wheat? $59.99. I think it's it's $59, yeah. $59. $59. Yeah, $59.99 because all day every sell it for. That's what our members get it for. Yeah. I mean, it's just but I'll tell you, if you get that outside of the state, it's nowhere near that. Like, you know, in fact, the the the cast drink pumper nickel ride, that used to wholesale for like a hundred bucks. Oh wow, you know, that that I'm just saying, so there we we didn't get some of their stuff in the lineup. So when I'm like, oh my god, we can sell Castrink wheat whiskey that's like six years old, that's phenomenal and exquisite. And yeah, I mean, after that we had chosen them to be the lineup, like right as we're sending our December kits out last year, it was damned number 14 whiskey in the world. Um so you know, that was that was Providence in its own way. But yeah, we're we love Middle West. Everything they make. No, that's that's a great it's a great lineup because you've got so much variety there. I I think the single mulch stuff is fun. I it definitely is something that I've I've enjoyed more and more the last probably year of trying different ones and picking up different nuances. So I yeah, I mean you like that you got to try it. And yeah, you know, and I got a bunch of it because I didn't know when I'd be able to get more of it. And I was like, you know, I want to make sure that I have this for the people that are gonna come and circle back to it and let people know that because you can't get it. Go try to buy it, it's impossible, it's not a thing, right? Um, and that's and that's the goal. So we have in our upcoming June lineup, we have one that isn't distributed anywhere. There's like it's a brand that stopped distributing, that you can only get any of their products, any product they make if you are there. Oh wow. Kind of like middle, kind of like whiskey thief, right? I mean whiskey thief you can't pretty much. Yeah. Yeah, well, and and and the thing is, like, uh is it still true whiskey thief? You can only get a bottle if you thieve it yourself. They have they have well, they have bottles at the gift shop, and they will like there's barrels that that when it's they they they will finish the barrel and then bottle it in so but overall pretty much Well they've done that that Mayday rye is probably the one that's they've done a little bit more marketing with, and that's a hazmat proof rye

Proof Limits And Hazmat Barrel Stories

1:12:09

that they've been doing. Right. If you bottle your own, I think the 750 is like 140. Yeah, because when when I bottled the 375, it was 65. Yeah, and I think those are 79. Yeah, they're 80 now. Yeah, you know, but it was but they're all 7, 8, 9 year, right? Oh, and oh the ries are the ryes are unbelievable. I don't know, I don't know how they get the ryes to taste the way they get them to taste. They get they get some chocolate into those ryes. It's crazy. I'm just mad I don't have more because you know it's like when you get a bottle that is so unique and interesting, and come on, I've I've never thieved into a bottle before, and all of that. And I had this bottle, I'm like, I'm gonna make this last. I think it made it a year and a half, but because I wouldn't do a heavy pour of it, I would just be like, I want to just rem have that memory, I want to perk that memory back into my class for a little bit, but I kept revisiting it too often, and I'm like, and then once it was gone, it was gone. And yeah, I picked that it was an eight-year ride. It was like eight years, nine months, and it was phenomenal. You know, they got they got nine and nine recipes, but a bit won't hit me. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I always wonder if they have the amount of product, but also it's like, okay, if they're retailing stuff for 140, that's hard. You know, the we don't, I mean, so we had cat's eye, we had uh 153 proof, it was 151 proof, 26 here in our lineup from cat's eye. And that was a 250 dollar bottle. I think our members got it for 130. And man, I gotta tell you, that thing drank like it was about 115. It was so like like you had two sips and it felt like God was pulling on your cheeks. You're like, what's happening to me? And uh, you know, like that we it was actually 159 proof, but I had to have him proof it down to 151 because there's 13 states that you can't ship to if it's over 153. Yeah, I get it. Well, it was just weird micro long. Sorry, folks, you don't get this one. I I had that we can't the the exceptional character, which was one I want to say one six. And I don't know, drinking 160, it was delicious, but I basically it took me two and a half hours just to do a half ounce, and I basically was dipping my tongue. I just dip my tongue in there and just take my time. I'm like thinking, 160, my liver is gonna tell me to F off. We were visiting World With Meet Society. I mean, they were popping all sorts of crazy barrels. Like there was there was um what was the oh my god, the what's the the buff turkey? They had like there was buff turkey, there was some 23-year-old Buffalo Trace barrels, and then they popped this one at the end and they called it the Nightcap, and it was like a 164-proof barrel from Charbet, and it was also one of the darkest things I've ever seen in my entire life. And I could only I could keep in mind, like this was 10 in the morning, and we still had another place that we had to go to. Oh, and guys, and and of course, that place was ASW was popping barrels, like I don't know if you ever met Wit from ASW. I mean, they're popping, you know, the like maybe 20 barrels, and you know, that you you splash it back onto the barrel. If you drank all those, you'd be dead, you know. Uh and that first day, I looked at my guys, I'm like, if every single day and our eight-day trip is like this, we're gonna be dead by day four. Luckily it wasn't. But you know, we've had a couple of those days, man, where you're in the back, and especially these craft guys, they'll have uh they'll have 50 different mash bill barrels where they're like, You want to try a red, white, blue barrel? I'm like, What's that? They're like, Is red corn, blue corn, or white corn? And it's all three. Usually, usually if we were with Bishop, if we ended up with Bishop, somehow we all ended up naked uh uh in a stream by the end of the night. It's just yeah, he's like, What's your sign? Well, we're gonna have to pick some, we're gonna have to take these and we're gonna go over that stream. And is that right? We're all familiar with each other. Yeah. I mean, uh, but yeah, he always had he always had a lot of extra stuff going on. And once once we were done, you know, you do a barrel pick, and once you were done, all of a sudden it was just like whiskey heaven of just every single thing, and they had so much different stuff. It was phenomenal. And we I could tell when we were visiting French Lick that that he wasn't gonna stay there. So French Lick was supposed to be in our lineup, and and they pulled out two weeks before we were supposed to bottle it. Who pulled out? Was Alan there at the time? It was not Alan. Alan, this was not an Allen decision. This was one of the many straws that broke the camel's back. You can probably guess who it was. Yeah, I did. But it was such a bullshit, it was such a selfish thing to do. And luckily, and we've what I looked at what what I had I just happened to do is I had one of our distilleries that were set up for the next quarter already cleared and ready to go, and we slotted them in there, and it was Leapers Fork, and we love Leapers Fork. Um, and they but but if I had not had all the legal stuff done

French Lick Fallout And Alan Bishop

1:18:04

at that time, it would have fucked us so hard. And and it was such a selfish, thoughtless thing that so I will not support and buy anything that French does. I don't care who the distiller is. Oh, they're no, they're they they don't they don't have a distiller. They don't they don't they they they stayed through sponsorship after Alan left for us, and they don't they have not distilled since he's left. They tried to do it, the you know, the the family brought somebody in and there's a whole article and there's a PR push for it, but no, they Alan Alan trained you broke it in two Alan trained him, and they fired him within like what was it, four months of of it, and then they tried to do it themselves. But that those they didn't they didn't put anything, they they didn't get anything in the barrel since he left. I mean that doesn't surprise me, and and it's just like yeah, if they have any of the stuff left that he's made, I mean they have lots, uh, but I can't support no they the reality is is that that's gonna go on the market at one point. You could maybe pick that up when Alan picks when Alan picks up his own stuff. He might just go in there. He's got no place now. Yeah, I mean, what's going on with with what happened with Homes? Old Home said I was I I just notes all stuff. I mean, is that made public about what happened over there? He left. Uh there there's there he he I mean he le it wasn't he he it was a he didn't put it this way, he didn't see it coming, but whatever it is, he's working through it, and then he's looking. There's other other opportunities that are gonna present. But right now he just took a general job with the cordial company and he's just working, but you know, that's just you know, him at a cordial company, I don't know. That's a waste of talent to in my opinion. If you got like him and the like if you got like a side project of like him and the oh, he has a really good side project going right now with Stolen Wolf with Eric Wolf. They've got they did a bunch of stuff. They've got, I got to taste it. It's it's called Colonial Rye. And it is, it was damn good. It was it was up like it reminded me so much of Whiskey Thief's rye, that carmie, and it's only two years, and it's gonna be coming out, and they did 13 barrels of it. So it's I think it's called Wolf and Williams, something like that, but it's gonna be coming out. He's got a couple of things uh you know on the burner and everything, but he has to end up someplace. So I'm waiting. Yeah, I mean, I was hoping everything was gonna turn out there because I just, hey, when you're ready, you're like, you know, there's not a lot of brands where we say, hey, when you're ready to be in the lineup, just let us know. You know, we want you in the lineup. And you know, we had that with Ben Halliday, and we've had that with a few that we just said, hey, when so did have you guys tell us what the timing is? And have you guys done been by Ironfish since you're up in Traver City? No, I've so I've never so we're doing a Michigan trip in October. I'm going in, I I'm going up there and you're gonna you let me know if it's not the first week when bourbon on the banks, but after that, I'll meet you on the weekend. Uh, because my son lives in Thompsonville, which is seven minutes from the Ironfish distillery. And I, you know, it's a craft distillery, and you always go into a craft distillery wondering where they're at, right? Because even when I met Alan and he was putting out the two-year stuff, and it was there's a lot of grain on younger whiskey. And so you you a lot of times you like that. But when that's when that quality younger whiskey starts to get into those mature barrels, like Bishop's stuff is now 10, going on 11, that stuff, the barrel starts to influence that quality whiskey off that pot still. And it's amazing. Old Stubborn with Ed Blay or Bly, I think it's Blay. Yes, Ed Blade that does Old Stubborn. He picked up the pot still from what's the place in West Virginia? Come on, it's the West they they basically we were pot stilling, and then they went to what it's the Smooth Ambler. I was thinking of Virginia, not West Virginia. West Virginia. Smooth Ambler went from pot still to column still, and he pulled all their pot still that they had left and started his old thing called Old Stubborn. And that is some amazing, amazing whiskey that he blended. But but what Ironfish is doing up there, I went in there and they have a they're mad angler and they've got some stuff they're doing, and went in and they're they're at the point where they're they're they're not putting out young whiskey. It's five, six years, and it's it's pretty good. If you're going to Michigan, you should stop in. I I can I can I could we're going from Pittsburgh to Michigan. I think we're passing through Columbus. I mean, did that route make sense? Columbus to Michigan, stopping at Columbus. And then go north, yeah. Yeah, because I mean I think that's our plan. Columbus. I think the trip is gonna be a thousand miles by what we were doing. And and yeah, so you know, we average driving like 120 miles, you know, per day, depending on what we're doing. But yeah, we're gonna start in Pittsburgh, we're gonna fly out of Detroit, and you know, we usually we figure it out along the way, but yeah, if you want to help us figure that out, if you guys wanna, even if it's just you guys meet us when we're at Middle West, so we can press the flash and hang out, you know, or you know, watershed or whatever. Yeah. There's that have you heard about Black Diamond? I have. I don't, I've never tried Black Diamond. Well, I mean, they they do a good job. They're they're mixing, they're blending MGP with Middle West. And and

Ohio Route Planning And Sourcing Talk

1:24:34

they're using the same blender from MGP that Penelope used initially. So they basically have him take the Middle West and the and the MGP and have a bunch of fun. But it's it's good. What's his name at Old Elk? You know, the they you know, they took MGP master distiller and what Greg Metz. Greg Metz. Yeah, Greg Metz. He had his name was on every bottle. And I think that surprised me. I mean, I don't think it wasn't the situation where the they went bankrupt. It was kind of like they got bought out, and then I mean, I love I liked Old Elk, and you know, I like a lot of their product. They're they're selling a bunch of the old elk uh single barrels. It's it's become oh yeah. Oh, I know. I just got the list of it, and I'm like, fuck, should we just get a 10-year-old? I mean, that was uh thinking about it. I mean, when you think about it, it was a Middle West power play. I mean, it's a hostile takeover to buy the brand because MGP the where where old elk was getting it, it wasn't being produced, it was never produced at in in at Old Elk. It's all was uh that it was stocked in Indiana. And then they were, you know, because that Greg laid that down an awful lot of that before he went out there. So that was his in, you know, that was his stock. And I don't know exactly what he was doing when he was out there. I mean, he probably was doing something similar to, you know, the difference between Yellowstone and Limestone Branch. You know, Stephen Beam's home is Limestone Branch, but you know, Yellowstone is being made in Louisville. It's just that simple. You can't, you can't do, you know, a couple barrels a day, you know, 12 barrels a day and supply a national brand. It just doesn't work that way, right? No. Well, I mean, we were at one in South Carolina on our last trip, and I was like, I think they've they gotta be laundering money through this fucking place because it was it was the biggest fermentation. Like they had these 40,000 gallon tanks, and maybe one of the biggest stills I've ever seen. And I'm like, how much are you guys producing? They're like, we're doing about three barrels a month, and I'm like, Oh yeah, there's some shit going on here. Like, I don't know what the fuck. Three barrels a month in a giant style, but just like yeah, the owner kept trying to do, like, let's just get out some jet skis. You guys want to play some pickleball and jet ski? And I'm like, All right, maybe, I don't know. I wouldn't I don't want to get I don't want to get indicted because I hung out with you for too long. I don't know what the fuck's happening over here, but it's just one of those weird situations, and and yeah, we meet all sorts of characters and and we and and you know, we we we kiss a lot of frogs. I say we kiss way less frogs than we did in the beginning because you know now we reach out to people that get back to us, and we have a ton of people that reach out to us. And and yeah, there's there's still a lot of just really young, you know, some people, you know, people that come from brewing backgrounds or wine backgrounds, or they you know, they they just apprentice for the right people. They generally get the ground running pretty quickly. Some some places just never really find their foot in. Some places just never scale up because they're just they're just drinking all they're wanting to your stuff. Yeah. And then you have like like Valentines who like we'd love to get them in the lineup, but they just don't have enough product in the way that they've scaled because they didn't want to dig into the older stuff. They're just they're being strategic and smart about it. And we have a lot of respect for that. So, you know, when I see American Green tenure something, like I just buy it. You know what I mean? Because I know I'm gonna love it. I know it's gonna be good. And and so those are the ones that we hope at some point we'll sync up with them. We can't get everybody we want in the lineup, but but so far, you know, we're we're checking off a lot of people from our wish list. So that's pretty dope. Well, you know, you you know as well as I know, when you walk in, like the first time I ever walked into Middle West Spirits, walked into the craft distillery, he had a column, he's got the column still. It was a Saturday morning, and it was just running full out. I mean, he he he was running that 24-7. You walk into so many places, and if it's not the right time of year, there's no distilling going on. And then it's really concerning when you walk in to Bargetown Bourbon Company and they're not running. You know, that's a that's when you start to like go, whoa, but then you'll walk into a craft distillery and they're just going. I mean, you know, if they're if they're going now, you can tell. You can tell who's really doing it 100%, and they're there, you know, it's it's gotta keep going. You gotta keep running those stills if there's a demand. And most craft distilleries, with how much of their their little pot still will make, should always be running that because of the fact of that the the demand for it, it you can locally can support it. You know what I mean? That's the whole thing. So if they're supporting locally, if they're doing it right, yeah. Yeah, all these there's a bunch of brands that went out of business because they scaled up, they they were just like this. We're never gonna stop hockey hockey sticking. And then, you know, these tariffs really changed everything. The dynamic, yeah. Because what happened is and the dynamic and and even the narrative because when all these big brands stopped producing what they were doing because they're not exporting anymore, right? Like Canada drank a lot of American whiskey, and so all of a sudden you look at the industries in this downturn, but the reality is there's a ton of crap brands that they're not hurting at all. In fact, they're still exploding, they're still doing good, but then there's a few that bought and scaled out this massive operation that they never could fit into as the industry took the turn it did. But but even if you look at what Middle West, what what Ryan's trying to do, you're talking about distilling base product here and then shipping it over there and having them finish the distilling process. I mean, he's being so creative to work around

Tariffs, Demand, And Why Growth Continues

1:31:08

all the stuff that's happening. He's you know, it's it's like that's where it's kind of, you know, that part of it is you gotta be innovative, and people and you see the people in the industry doing that. You know, yeah, it just seems and that's why it's like people have always said, like, why are you guys still growing? And I'm like, there's several reasons. Number one, we're an experienced company, we're a whiskey company, as I've said, right? But also, we haven't scratched the surface for the amount of whiskey drinkers that are out there, you know. Like we're still a pretty small company in comparison. Like, we have more visibility now, and and the the economy's gonna ebb and flow. There's always gonna be that. But we're we're trying to now give our model the which is I think what's really made us grow is the FOMO. We're we're people don't want to miss out on the next lineup. And and I'm telling you, the June lineup, you're not gonna want to miss out on it. It's like every single lineup, there is an anticipation of what is that mystery. People still want that excitement. And so now that we're gonna be able to give that to restaurants, and it'll be more of a brand extension than our kits at restaurants, you know, we want to get people back into restaurants because you know, consumer behavior changed during COVID and people are door dashing and postmates, and what happens is you don't get the foot traffic, which means your server turnarounds higher because you're not keeping them happy with the tips. So we're trying to help do what we've done from the beginning, which is to uplift small businesses. Well, and you think about it, it's like, yes, the tariffs have affected a lot of the industry and everything, but from the standpoint of American whiskey drinkers, yeah, you don't see a slowdown in the in the allocated or the people who are drinking whiskey in in what our world is. They're probably spending more money. They might not be buying as many bottles at this point, but they're buying bottles that cost more. I mean, I just I it's almost like it's the the allocated people have matured. You know what I mean? It's uh it's a higher level. But the amount of money being spent, like you said, and and and just to do what you're doing isn't something that anybody's they're not doing it because it's too much money. They they have it and they're doing it because they want the experience that thrive for experience and camaraderie that you're supplying, and that what the whiskey industry supplies has not died off at all. You know, it hasn't. It's just that simple. Yeah, the whiskey community, and we love that about this industry that you know, we're traveling through Texas and they're like, oh, where are you guys going? We're going here. Oh, we love those guys. They're competitors, right? But they're rooting for Texas whiskey. It's one of these, you know, when Heaven Hills distillery burns down, no one's pissing on the flames. They're saying, Hey, do you need product? You know, can we help out when the flooding happened at Buffalo Trace? Everybody steps up, and that doesn't exist in most industries. And so we we love this aspect of it. We love all the people we've met. You know, we're gonna continue to make friends along the way. And that's the thing. We've had, you know, we got our 18th release coming out. So we've other than the repeat distilleries, so we've had almost 70 distilleries in our lineup, and we have 70 friends. That's the cool thing. You know, and we still call them, we check in, you know. I'm gonna call Alan and check in on him, you know, and we just we call people, we say what's going on, and and we love it, and we love that we get to meet these people and we get to support them. So, CT. The cellar age that makers mark, because remember when that was coming out, it was like five, six hundred dollars or whatever the fuck it was. And I just got a bottle for like 140, and everybody's like, it's overhyped, you know. I gotta tell you, it's fucking amazing. Oh, no. That was that that bottle phenomenal. Yep. So 2020 event was amazing. Yeah, I was like, yeah, I just got the 2025. I was like, Oh, yeah, I don't know what everybody was shitting on, but this this ball is not gonna take off completely. Yeah, I was like, it's not so you think some of those people though are just are saying that because they didn't get it, and it wasn't what do you call them? So it's like, oh well that's is that Star Hill? Yeah, that was Star Hill's great their wheat whiskey. I've never never heard of Star Hill. Star Hill Farm is this one actually was given to us by Rob Samuels. So we did it with whatever, but this is the they produce

Share Your Bottles And Reuse Kits

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this, and this is all what what is it the the the the kind of farming they're doing uh regenerative farming and you know that that whole thing. And that wheat whiskey on that that's right up there. I love this bottle. I mean, and that once again, wheat whiskies, a lot of times you gotta open them and let them sit, just like that cellar age, the first time I had it off of a fresh crack. I wasn't but that 2025 after sitting for a oh, it's just so caramely. That that starhill that Stargill Farm bottle has, and I think it's just the grain takes a uh trip back a little more to a dusty type grain. Like when you drink a bottle from the early 80s and it has that nuance to it, that bottle kind of has that it's so good. Chocolate and car chocolate. I love it. I know I love a dusty nose, but yeah, I love it when it's uh we call it the the everlaster job stuff for, you know, like where it's like the schnellsberries taste like schnellsberry. But that there's you know, I love it when the nose, the the taste, and the finish are completely three different layers, and then 15 minutes later your whiskey is totally different. And so we we kind of judge it based upon all these different factors, but at the end of the day, good whiskey is uh what what I have written on the wall over here, great whiskey is meant to be shared. That's what this is all about. I don't have closed bottles at my house. Uh everything's open. Anybody who will appreciate it can drink anything they want. And and that's what we love. That a lot of people, when we have a lineup, they'll buy three of every bottle one to drink, one to share, and one to save to again eventually drink and share down the road. Right. That's awesome. Well, what you're doing is great. You're you're bringing an awareness to these distilleries that uh is very welcomed. I'm sure they appreciate the heck out of it. But you know, us as bourbons people, you know, I guess if you want to categorize this as bourbon aficionados, whatever you want to say, you know, it's it's fun to be able to sample from different areas and taste these different things. And so what you do is it's great. I love it. I think it's it's fun to go through a blind. You know, I did this blind and I still have three quarters of a bottle left of each one. So the cool thing is, is there's enough there to do it once and enjoy it. But then if I had a friend over and I wanted to say, hey, do the same thing, you could you can do this. There's enough there to do it three or four times, and and you get some on those kits, on those kits, don't throw them away. Make your own blind. The whole point of like everything, first of all, we made the the that we need that that's custom glass. It took a year to make that. Those are custom caps. Obviously, they the packaging is really high-end, soft touch quality. That's a magnet with a ribbon pole, right? And the thing is that that is not so that you can just throw away. People say all the time, I feel bad about throwing it away. I'm like, why are you throwing it away? Put something else in there and give it to a friend. Introduce them to blinds. You don't have to recruit them with blind barrels. The whole point is go have the fun of making a blind for somebody else. That's what you need to do with your kits. Yeah, great idea. Yeah. So, I mean, it's but we had a contest of like, hey, what do you do with your kits? Like, you know, like winter got to help pick a lineup with us. And yeah, somebody like made a Zen garden, somebody forfeited the phone and put their gun in there. I was like, oh and one dude built a whole wooden thing that had places to put the bottles and a thing that held the tasting notes and places to put the vases. And the guy was a wood craftsman that was off the charts, and he made one for me and each of my three guys. And um, but yeah, don't yeah, recycle the kits, like literally make a blind for somebody, introduce somebody to whiskey, use the kit to do that. Yeah, all right. So, what was your favorite CT, real quick out of the four? What was what won the blind? For me, it would be the the uniqueness of number three, being that I I just liked how it was just totally off the wall. Two second place would have been number four, third place would have been number one for unique again, and then the two is great, it's just more of that traditional kind of bourbon taste. So I love that you picked the lineup based upon uniqueness. I honestly wish that most people looked at it that way because that yeah, that Southern Star single malt isn't gonna be everybody's jam. And it's interesting because there's we say it's like the bourbon lover single malt because of the way that it's made and it's unique and it's approachable. Um, and I'm not a massive single malt fan. We've had a lot of single malts in the lineup, and I like them all. And there's some that I'm like, oh my god, this is good. But I really like that particular one, and I can't point to a bottle on any shelf that I have that's anything like that. Correct. But or two probably lacks for me the most because it's it's it's fine. I I can put something together that's gonna be somewhat like it. So yeah, but what a great, what a great road to go down. I mean, what a lot of fun you could have with with those bottles with friends, and then like you said, to be able to repurpose it to somebody who's maybe not into bourbon as much, and you're like, hey, here you go, try it and see what you think, and then I'll tell you what they are after you do it. Exactly. Exactly. No, that's the whole point. Discovered on your own terms, right? You want to put a cube in there, great. My pet peeve is crushed ice. So, you know, I it I have a brother-in-law who puts all of his stuff on crushed ice. Oh, no. One time. It dilutes it too fast. 100%. And the thing is, like, we're not taking shots here because that's the only way you can kind of enjoy that, but you're also you're also numbing the whiskey. You're not getting mouth. There's a lot of things that it strips out of the experience. But I have a brother-in-law that that's the way he drinks all of his stuff, and I know he really likes that that honey gym beam, so I just keep a bottle of that at my house at all times, right? But like one time I went, I took a shower, and they showed up early, and sure enough, Arnie's got a fucking full glass of crushed ice and and filled to the top. And I called my wife, I'm like, what the fuck did he pour? She's like, and I looked, and as a sleuth, I looked, and he had poured the widow Jane 15 year. The worst part about that was I didn't even fucking open that bottle yet. I just got it. It's like he broke every cardinal fucking rule, which is like, first of all, I don't go to anyone's house and just pouring fucking whiskey. I don't definitely don't put a fucking bottle, and I definitely don't pour it on fucking crushed ice, you know. Oh, and that and it's like this easy. The same rule, like when you're when you're like you're like being with uh owner of a distillery or whatever, and they're like all of a sudden there's a lot of stuff happening, and they're like, anything you want. It's not like I go and pick the 500, the the the hundred dollar pour. It's like, yeah, sure, knob creek, I'll have a knob creek neat, you know, that's usually kind of how I go. But at the same time, you were talking about the crushed ice. What? I said, yeah, give me the 2500 knob creek. You said anything, yeah. Yeah, yeah. But the but I will tell you that like every once in a while I will put knob creek 9 year on crushed ice just if I don't even want to think about whiskey at all. And I want something refreshing and it's hot out. I will I don't mind that every once in a while, but never that's like maybe once a year. If it's crushed, it better be crushed enough to be called a slushing. Well, and look, it kind of gets fucked up. Hey, I got stuff that'll get you fucked up. You know, that's there's nothing wrong with that. In fact, like if I have a really high-proof whiskey, I will oftentimes put one nice ball in there because the water will open it up, it's gonna evolve in the glass. There's a lot of I like to know what the different stages and the nuances of the proof are, you know, but I always start with it neat and then I'll put a cube in, and that way I'm kind of experiencing all the aspects of it. I mean, Castrink was never meant to just let's just drink a cast drink. Well, no, prove it down to what you like. Yeah, yeah. You're supposed to pick pick and choose where you want to drink it. And then bourbon snobs decided uh we're gonna drink it that way. That's that's great. Yeah. We're gonna burn our tongues right out of our mouths. What happened to Ricky? Well, he also got a suffer cancer. All right. So let's so I want to finish this up because we've we've done this. Now, we do invite a couple people. There's some of the people watching, we invite them to come on and ask any questions if you want to stay. But if you have to go, or you know, that's fine. Either way, just that that's up to you. Or if you or yeah, and if you stay, anytime this gets whatever, just say, hey, I gotta go. That's kind of how it works. So we're not trying to there's no pressure to stay. That's what I'm trying to okay. Yeah, no, I got I got I got 15 minutes off to tuck my kids in at some point. Okay. All right. So I will