How TV Producers Can Actually Make Money in Digital

The TV industry is changing fast, and traditional production models are no longer enough. In this episode of TellyCast, recorded live at How to Make Money in Digital, Anjdy Fry digs into what the digital-first production economy really looks like in 2026.

From YouTube and social video to new studio models, monetisation strategies and creator-led IP, this conversation explores how TV producers, executives and indie founders can build sustainable digital businesses alongside – or beyond – broadcast.

If you work in TV and want to understand where the growth is coming from, how successful digital studios are operating, and what skills and mindsets are now essential, this episode is a practical guide to navigating the shift to social video and platform-native content.

TellyCast is the podcast for people working at the sharp end of digital-first video, bringing together producers, platforms and creators shaping the future of the production economy.

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Transcript

Justin Crosby: [00:00:00] Hi, I am Justin Crosby and welcome to TellyCast. This episode was recorded live at How to Make Money in Digital in London. Last year, a room full of producers, founders, and commissioners grappling with the same question. How do you actually build sustainable businesses? In the digital first world across the day, the Drop Editor, Andy Fry, spoke to people who aren't theorizing about this shift.

They're already doing it From Sam Barcroft on building Digital Companies with an exit in mind to Spirit Studios, Matt Campion on why treating digital as a side hustle is the biggest mistake producers can make. You'll also hear from Quinta Studio's, Garrett Ming, on scaling documentary audiences globally.

Hearst, Sam Pearson on Commissioning Digital First True Crime and History. MTV's Amy Parker Williams on brand-led social originals and Ben Doyle from After Party Studios. And why Talent First [00:01:00] Thinking changes everything. What links all of these conversations is a very clear message. Digital isn't a bolt-on anymore.

It's where the audiences are, where businesses are being built, and where producers have to get much sharper about IP monetization. An ownership if you're trying to work out how to make that transition or how to do it better. This episode is a really good place to start. Hope you enjoy the show. 

Andy Fry: Hi, my name's Andy Fry here at the Telecast How to Make Money in Digital Event with Sam Barcroft, uh, founder of Creative I.

And prior to that barcroft tv. Uh, Sam, lovely to see you. Um, you kicked off the day for us with a really interesting session about your experiences. Can you kind of summarize the key messages you were trying to get across in that? 

Sam Barcroft: So thanks. Nice to see you Andy. Um, I suppose the key message I was trying to get across was that if you're an entrepreneur in the digital video space, you've really gotta think about your end game, right?

The way through building your business. So if you don't [00:02:00] know where you want to get to, you're gonna end up going down lots of different dead ends and, uh, bad places. So it's really about focusing on the outcome that you want to build from your endeavors in the digital video space. And so my talk was about how to sell your company because.

In the end, I think most digital video entrepreneurs get so, uh, long in the tooth quickly, um, that often they want to sell their business. And so it was really trying to help people to understand how that, the five steps towards selling your digital business. 

Andy Fry: Yeah. Your five steps were really interesting 'cause they kind of broke into some creative messaging and some commercial messaging.

And this idea of your, your superpower and, and, and the importance of going after a niche, which I guess that's kind of a slightly different story to what it would've been when you started out, wouldn't it? But tell us about why it's important to go after a niche. 

Sam Barcroft: Well, basically, the digital video ecosystem has exploded to the point that there's 500 hours of TV put up onto YouTube every minute of the day.

And so to find audiences, you can't try and compete [00:03:00] with the incumbent big entertainment brand. You really have to build a community now, and actually it's much easier to build a small, highly engaged community right now across these platforms than it's to reach millions of people every day, especially when you're starting and you actually build a better community because they're willing to spend money with you rather than just to watch the video.

So I think it makes much more sense for people to narrow down to one thing that they think is an unmet need on a platform, and to really try and explode into an unmet need to actually solve a real problem online. 

Andy Fry: And it sounded like that unmet need, if it's a passion, if it's your fairy tale as you put it, that's even stronger, isn't it?

Because that, I guess you come across as more authentic. 

Sam Barcroft: Yeah, you, you're definitely gonna shine if you're talking about something you love. You are also gonna have much deeper knowledge, which means your video aren't gonna run out of steam. And thirdly, people can just tell if they, you are trying to build a community, they'll know whether you are one of them or not.

And so if you go deep into those spaces, also building on YouTube and digital takes time these days, so you have to be able to [00:04:00] stick with it. That's literally the number one rule is stick with it. And if you love something, you're much more likely to stick with it than if it's something that you're not that bothered about.

Andy Fry: Um, another your interesting point is about firing yourself. And I suppose that that got into the, into the, the, the thorny issue of, of selling the company. You've built it, it's time to sell it. So explain the far yourself concept. 

Sam Barcroft: So I think if you are building a business. That is, uh, fit to sell. You can't be a bottleneck within that business as an individual within that team or within that process.

So I always encourage people to figure out how they can build long lasting systems and processes so that if you pull them out of it, pull the founder out of the business, the business still does really well. So after a certain amount of time you need a succession plan, you need to build a business around systems and procedures and ways of doing things rather than just an individual bit of talent or hard work.

Andy Fry: Okay, so now Creator V. Tell us a little bit about what Creator V is for people who don't know. 

Sam Barcroft: So creator v's. A small business that is run by me, that [00:05:00] exists to help business leaders in the media space figure out their unique strategy. So I work one-on-one with business leaders and their sometimes their leadership teams to figure out exactly how they can get fantastic success in the digital world.

And it's really fascinating. I find it brilliant. I work really well with people who are. Trying to figure out some really tricky problems. It keeps me excited because no problem, no two companies are the same, and problems can feel very big, but when you share them, they can then feel quite manageable. So I love to help people transform from being bogged down by 1,000,001 different challenges into having a really clear plan about how they're gonna achieve their own objectives, and coaching people through that over a number of sessions is something that I love.

And that often brings really fantastic results for those people. 

Andy Fry: So, so finally, I know you had to run away for some of the day to deliver a module. Um, did you manage to come back and see some stuff towards the end of the day and, and if so, [00:06:00] any particular highlights for you? 

Sam Barcroft: So, massive highlight for me was watching Tom Govan from Strong Watch Studios.

Um, big fan of Tom's. His decks are something to behold, you know, I can see why they win a lot of business because his sales. The presentation was off the charts. Um, but also he's a brilliant thinker, Tom. He really understands models and he understands how to articulate these different ways of working and his work on whether we need development producers anymore.

Just was fascinating to me the way that strong watch give one person responsibility for the idea for a show, developing it, pitching it, and then making it and delivering it, and even directing it on the day and then worrying about the distribution. Yeah, that is a really, really brilliant new. Kind of fully verticalized model that I think is, uh, something we all need to think about.

You know, is that an optimum way of making premium shows for YouTube in a really sensible, scalable model? I thought that was genius. Yeah. 

Andy Fry: Yeah. And I loved what you had to say that iteration about some of the things they learned during the course of that process, [00:07:00] the way they changed their content. 

Sam Barcroft: Yeah, I mean, like that is the classic test and learn methodology.

You know, you're getting all this data within seconds of uploading a video, you can see what's working and what isn't. And their producer. Actually having the responsibility of not just coming up with the idea for the show, but actually having to do those tweaks in the distribution and delivery. I think that's something that a lot of people could scale from and learn from.

It might be a model that's adopted, I would imagine, by another set of studios as well as strong watch. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant, Sam, lovely to talk to you and thanks for your time. 

Sam Barcroft: Thanks Andy. Take care. 

Andy Fry: I'm with Garrett Ming, uh, of, uh, well, the founder and managing director of Quinta Studios. Who's been to a lot of our events, been very supportive of the events over the years.

Um, tell us a bit about Quintus. Tell us why, uh, your company, which started out in more traditional media, is interested in this digital first space. 

Gerrit Kemming: Well, I mean, we are mean, we are one of the biggest independent documentary channel networks on YouTube, Facebook, and Snapchat. And this is [00:08:00] just our home turf, I would say.

Meanwhile, after, uh, tv we did a very successful, you know, career as a company in tv. But then we saw the opportunity to pivot into digital at a very early stage and we, we saw a market that was nascent, but that where we could grow with the market. That was very interesting. And actually events like today, and actually the market today shows us that we did the right move.

Andy Fry: I was gonna ask you that. Is it your sense that the market is now catching up with your vision, that you're beginning to see that hybridization that we've talked, talked about for years? 

Gerrit Kemming: Absolutely. I mean, when we started, people and content owners were laughing at us when we asked them for content. But, uh, today, I mean, we saw that YouTube is the biggest TV platform in the world, right?

Yeah. As I said, so we're a TV broadcaster on YouTube, so to say. 

Andy Fry: Yeah. Yeah. Uh, just briefly give us a sense of the kind of programming you do. So if people wanted to know what sort of content you are, you are focusing on, what would you pick out? 

Gerrit Kemming: Well, everything that is unscripted content is our home turf from.[00:09:00] 

Business related to nature, to history, to ancient history, uh, to broad science and engineering. Everything that is informative content, uh, that comes from tv or is a, uh, uh, targeting a very, let's say, digital audience is what we are doing. Uh, 

Andy Fry: uh, one question I've been thinking about during the course of the day, how, how, um, how much have you been able to take your content out into different languages?

Are there opportunities now for it to be more than English speaking for you to use maybe AI tools or other kinds of tools to, to make it bespoke for different markets? 

Gerrit Kemming: Yeah. We are working four languages mainly, which is English, German, French, and Spanish. Um, our problem was that our, our content is like on a very high quality, and our audience was expecting very high quality.

Uh, dubbings or languages. So we couldn't turn into AI for a long time, but for the last, let's say 12 months, let's say 18 months, a hybrid model of, you know, AI with, [00:10:00] with humans behind it, that works meanwhile makes it a lot more, uh, a lot more easy. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant. Okay, so you've been here all day. Any particular highlights, any sessions that you particularly enjoyed or, or any messages that came through that you thought were interesting?

Gerrit Kemming: Ah, good. Good question. I mean. There, there was a lot of education. Uh, it felt like there was a lot of education for people that want to get into that business, and we are in this business, so there was not so much new stuff. But I mean, being out there with all these creative people in the industry is always amazing because you always get back with five, 10 great ideas and, and inspirations of what, how you can pivot your, or projects that you can do or how you can pivot your, your business.

Uh, well, I mean. Five of them. Five of them always turn out to be bullshit after you sleep a night over it. 

Andy Fry: Yeah. 

Gerrit Kemming: But a lot of them are really good and it's always good to connect. 

Andy Fry: I think one really interesting theme is this idea of revenue diversification. So we've had people today selling their photos, launching auction platforms, [00:11:00] all kinds of different ways of taking your community and and making revenue.

Is that something that from your perspective, from your business model, that you might be able to do as well? I mean, can you see yourself. You doing that, going into different kind of areas that maybe are non-traditional? 

Gerrit Kemming: Yeah, uh, definitely we're working on this very much because, so, you know, uh, working with TV content mainly, uh, and, and especially because we work in on a global, uh, territory or let's say in global territories, uh, many of them are, uh, non, uh, host driven.

So that means we don't have a face attached to that. So that means it's a very much a, a TV business. So content first, and that makes the money, uh, when it comes to brand partnerships, products behind this that is very reliant on having a face attached to it, uh, which we don't have, but we pivot into this to diversify our revenue streams.

That is a very important thing in digitally. Definitely. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant Garrett. Well, lovely to talk to you and, uh, [00:12:00] hopefully see you at, uh, the digital content forum later in the year. 

Gerrit Kemming: Will certainly. Brilliant. Thanks a lot. 

Andy Fry: I'm here with Matt Campion, co-founder of Spirit Studios. Matt, lovely to be with you.

You've just come off the stage, given us a really interesting presentation. Can you distill it for us? Tell us what you're attempting to get across in that piece. 

Matt Campion: Yeah, well, um, what I was trying to do was get across the fact that I think it's time that people need to move quickly and move into digital.

Um, they need to be able to create a multi-platform business, um, if they're gonna survive. You know, I think we can only see the trends, things like the BBC this week announcing that they've, they're killing off 150 million of their budget. We're only gonna see that times get more and more difficult. And, and I think, you know, whilst we all want to continue creating commissioned content, uh, 'cause that's how, that's what we sort of, we've been, we've been brought up to do actually, we've gotta move into a new world where we become the commissioner of the broadcast of the producer ourselves, um, and find this new way of working.

Andy Fry: You guys at Spirit, you've been doing that for 10 years. It's very much been part of [00:13:00] your modus operandi. If you had to give advice to people who are a bit nervous about it or haven't really started the journey, what is the key to being able to make that transition? 

Matt Campion: Do you know, I get asked this question so many times.

Um, you've gotta treat it like a side hustle. I think the way you've gotta think like a creator, I think we've always been like that. You know, right from the get go, you've gotta be entrepreneurial and you've got to, you've got to just get going. Um, you can't, you know, whether it's money, whatever's holding you back, stop it.

Just do it. Screw it. Let's do it. It's my motto. 

Andy Fry: Yeah. Um, it was interesting, you showed us a really interesting example of a mistake you made. You know, the 20 question thing. Everyone today has talked about mistakes, but mistakes shouldn't be seen as mistakes. Should they? They should be seen as test and learn 

Matt Campion: a hundred percent.

I, um, you know, I'm, I mean, I'm, I suppose I love self-development, um, but it's just, you're failing forwards. I know that's a cliche, but you really are. I don't, you know, the word fail. We use it to create drama in what we're talking about, but really it's a learning [00:14:00] curve. It's the next notch on your way up, and it's a hurdle.

Once you've got over that hurdle, you know you'll, you'll get over it. I think going back to your last question, people give up too easily. You can't give up. This is something that once you start, you've gotta keep the machine. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant la last question. You talked, um, about the Lime Whisperer. Um, give us a sense of why the Lime Whisperer has worked.

What is it the core of that that's really, uh, you know, in interested audiences? 

Matt Campion: The Lime Whisperer does two things that I think work for, for, for the brand. Um, one is its mission and purpose. I think it connects with people. Um, it's on a mission to save the plight of lions. When we first started this, there was only 20,000 lions left in the world.

That's now, um, increased population's increased. The numbers are going either way, but again, climate change is now, um, something that we weren't facing 10 years ago on the channel. And, and now there's, there's, um, you know, there's stats out there that say that lions could be extinct by 2050. Um, the other thing [00:15:00] I would say is that we're delivering natural history in a way that you don't see anywhere else.

We're doing it up close and personal. We're even putting line, uh, GoPros and things on the line. Um, and, and doing things like, um, allowing the viewer to go on a, on a hunt, on a kill with them, you know, it's, it's, we we're getting, we're using technology and kit to, to get to places that have never been seen before.

Andy Fry: Actually, just to extrapolate from that, um, your session was about building a multi-platform powerhouse, and I guess that that notion of purpose is something you've taken into your other work, isn't it? 

Matt Campion: Absolutely. Um, uh, uh. Tagline at Spirit is that we don't just create content, we create content with Spirit.

You know, we're about impacting lives for the better, inspiring, entertaining. Um, we also have our own side hustle, which is a mental health platform called I Am Whole. And I'm whole is about using pop culture in a digital world [00:16:00] to challenge the stigma surrounding mental health and to make a difference in the world.

But we do it through comedy, we do it through music concerts, um, we do it through documentary, you know, I think. As a business, we're an entertainment business, so let's entertain people, but also I think you, I think it's more powerful when you've got, um, entertainment with purpose. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant. Matt Campion, spirit Studios, thank you for your time.

Matt Campion: Thank you mate. 

Andy Fry: I'm here with Sam P I'm from Hearst Networks emea. Um, Sam, tell us a little bit more about your role at Hearst. 

Sam Pearson: So my role at Hearst Networks is quite multifaceted, so, um, I am the head of short form commissioning within the programming team, but I also sit within the, uh, kind of marketing team per like, uh, from a, from a, uh, a little bit, kinda looking at the, uh, creative, uh, production paid media, the organic social media production, basically anything that, uh, Hearst Networks does that is production focused or commissioning from a digital first perspective.

Social media [00:17:00] first has my, uh, fingerprints on it. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant. So you've just come off a really interesting session with a bunch of digital commissioners. If you had to provide a bit more color in terms of shows you've commissioned, projects you've worked on, could you pick out a couple of examples for us?

Sam Pearson: Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, so one that isn't out yet, but it's coming up called History Crush, I'm really excited about. So that is with a, uh, TikTok, an Instagram creator called Katie Kennedy. She's called, uh, um, the history gossip, uh, on online. She has a really kind of fresh, uh, exciting. Um, uh, new take on history, communication, um, very, very, very different.

I'm not gonna try and imitate it because I'll do it very, very poor justice. Um, I can only kinda recommend that you go and find her and look at it yourself. But she's, uh, she's got this, uh, she comes at it from a historical perspective. She's got all of the academic qualifications, but it's, um, you know, it's coming at it, you know, from a comedic perspective, entertainment focused, but it gives you that real kind of like historical insight at the same time.[00:18:00] 

Um, I'm really excited about that one that's coming out at the end of May one that we've just done, that we've come out of, uh, the end of last year called Unbreakable, um, um, survivor stories. Real kind of like, uh, value proposition for me in terms of kinda getting unheard, marginalized, um, um, misunderstood, um, stories out to a, uh, true crime audience.

Really, really challenging. Uh, watch and listen it when I was a mid formm series and as a audio podcast. Uh, that one for me is incredibly powerful because. It's, um, doing a job, which really represents to me why true crime is important as a genre. It's, uh, not just about entertainment, which is obviously what the TV industry is kind of like at its heart from a base perspective is what it's all about.

Unbreakable does the value proposition as well and really kind of demonstrates why we should be doing things like true crime and why we should be commissioning and producing in this space to really make sure that, uh, the contributors that we got in on that series can really kinda make sure they're sharing their, uh, sharing their stories.

I mean in there we had [00:19:00] a, uh, female gen, genital mutilation, survivor talking about their experiences and their roads to, uh, to recovery Afterwards, we had a survivor of, of, uh, of, uh, domestic abuse, um, survivor of, um, of uh, um, gangland violence. Real, kind of like hard hitting, challenging, uh, con conversations.

Andy Fry: And, and that kind of feeds in, you were talking about your, your approach to true crime. It's about victim centric, victim support kind of stories, isn't it? 

Sam Pearson: For sure. I mean, as a, as a brand. Linear space, digital focused. We are very, um, victim, uh, centric. Uh, we're very sensitive in our approach. Um, we always get, uh, incredibly rewarding feedback from the contributors and the people that we work with, the production companies we work with about how we demonstrate and represent our stories.

And that is kind of fundamental and at the heart of our brand and how we want to kinda position ourselves across all frontiers that we kinda go into. And that is exactly the same in the digital space as well. What we have as an opportunity within the social [00:20:00] media space is a community focused opportunity where we can think about like, what are TikTok creators, uh, podcasters doing in from a community perspective.

And that is, you know, tonally, thematically challenging, uh, um, you know, norms of like how you can be funny alongside talking about some really kinda sensitive and challenging cases. Um, how you can kind of be lighthearted, have different styles of conversations. For us, that's a really interesting, uh, opportunity and a really interesting challenge in terms of how we can kind of go into those, some of those kind of conversations and create some, uh, productions and commissions that sit within that space.

For us, what we don't wanna be doing is creating stuff that goes too far, pushes too far beyond the borders, uh, but what we wanna do is really kind of test the areas and the Venn diagram of what traditional true crime looks like from a TV broadcaster, but stays true to our kind of prince. 

Andy Fry: So, so outside history and true crime.

Um, are there any other sweet spots, particular genres you're interested in? 

Sam Pearson: Um, well, I mean, they are [00:21:00] our sweet spots. They are our genres. I would say true crime is a little bit harder to kinda get beyond in terms of a, in terms of a genre because it is, we are essentially a little bit more kind of traditional in terms of our mindset.

Although the approach and the storytelling approach can be a little bit more, kind of thematically different to our kind of standard approach and linear, I think history is the one that we can be a little more playful with because. Essentially every story has an element of history, has the past in like ingrained within it.

And I think for us it's much more interesting to kinda look at how we can tell interesting historical stories or stories about the past in a very different way than we maybe normally would do on I say, a, um, more mainstream history broadcaster or mainstream history channel. And so for us that might be thinking about how like a comedy s uh, broadcaster or channel would do, do it or looking at like, um.

Uh, shiny floor or panel show formats, or it might be more investigative documentary style approaches or reality approaches. And so for [00:22:00] us it's kind of really testing the, the, the boundaries from a genre perspective, how you can tell historical stories. Yeah. Um, that to me is really, really interesting because it can be so much more playful.

Andy Fry: Brilliant. Uh, Sam, final question. Um. Well, in terms of how a producer approaches you, what, what do you want them to do when they come to you? 

Sam Pearson: Um, I want them to come with, uh, very top line. I don't want like loads of, you know, reams of documentation. I don't want like, you know, multi-page treatments. Uh, I don't want anyone to feel like they're wasting their time if, you know, we get to a quick no.

Um, I really want like, you know, straight to the, kind of the core of the idea. Could be a paragraph, could be a one pager. Um, I want the hook first. Uh, that's to me is the kind of core principle we've gotta start with that it's not a contract that we're signing on that we don't need to necessarily deliver that.

We've gotta leave room for surprise when we get to production and that kind of thing. But, um, for me it's really about that hook. Like how are we gonna be doing something that's like new, interesting, innovative, from a format perspective, gonna be new and interesting in terms of the talent that we work with and how we develop new [00:23:00] talent.

But it's gotta start with our hook. Like what is that kind of new and interesting kind of route in for us? 

Andy Fry: Brilliant. Sam Pearson. Lovely to speak to you and thanks for coming to the event 

Sam Pearson: as well. Lovely to speak to you guys. Cheer. 

Andy Fry: I'm here with Amy Parker Williams from MTV. Amy. Lovely to meet you. Can you tell us a little bit about what you do at MTV?

Amie Parker-Williams: Yes, so I am the director of commissioning, so I guess it's my job to curate and create compelling original content and build fantastic experiences across all of our social platforms. I also manage our in-house production team, made up, made up of talented super. Super talented producers, editors, production staff, and some of our originals over the last couple of years have been made by them.

Andy Fry: Brilliant. So, so color the story for us a little bit. Tell us, tell us what kind of stuff you've commissioned. 

Amie Parker-Williams: Yes, so a couple of things. MTV Faces, which is our mental health podcast series, which tackles timely topical taboo issues. The first series we explored Brief with Ashley Kane second series, which came out last year was on A DHD with Jordan Stevens as the host, and [00:24:00] we've got a new one coming out fairly soon.

Andy Fry: Brilliant. So, so expand a little bit for us. You did a really good job in the session of telling us what you are looking for. What, what, what is your sweet spot? 

Amie Parker-Williams: Sweet spot is brand Helen at the helm of societal issues. So what, you know, important conversations need to be discussed that aren't being discussed enough in the mainstream media.

That's what we want to do. And how do you merge that with Paramount's iconic ip? 

Andy Fry: So if you had to, uh, give a little bit of guidance to producers about how to approach you the way to get to you, what would you suggest? 

Amie Parker-Williams: Uh, drop me a line and, uh, bring me on at the earlier stage. I would say, just to make sure that it has MTV and Comedy Central in mind from inception.

Andy Fry: I'm here with Ben Doyle, AKA rubber duck. Uh, and you've just finished a session, uh, talking about your experiences in the business. Tell us a little bit about the themes, the key themes that you're talking about. 

Ben Doyle: Yeah. Uh, so after my studios, I founded with a YouTuber. So all of my work I've done over the last decade has featured talent in some way, shape, or form.

And so it's just [00:25:00] a conversation really about how that completely changes the dynamic of how you approach creative. Because you have to write the creative with the talent in mind. It's not a come up with the idea, drop some talent in. It has to be come up with an idea around the talent. So, uh, the conversation really was about how do we approach that?

How do we write ideas? How do we make our shoots? Perfect for what the talent are used to receiving and make content that sits really well on the platform and doesn't feel like coming onto a platform that we don't belong on. 

Andy Fry: Do you, do you think sometimes traditional producers make a mistake of trying to impose ideas on the talent rather than letting the talent flow a little bit?

Ben Doyle: I think that, uh, I think, I think that basically the, the model has never changed on YouTube really since day one. We are just having to grow around it. It's always been about someone having some fun and that being recorded. And it feeling too structured, suffocates it. And that's always been the truth since back in the day, like the beauty of YouTube is that it has to be free flow and it has to be whatever's going on, ideas reacting to it constantly.

And that's why the brain of a YouTubers mad because they are [00:26:00] constantly just reacting to what's going on in front of them. And I think the job of a traditional broadcaster come into the space is to be like, how do we make that scenario possible? How do we make it so that it's not, here's a auto queue and a script.

But here's the beats. Here's what we're trying to hit, here's what we're trying to get across, and be yourself. 'cause ultimately, that's what the audience are buying into 

Andy Fry: after, after party's been around probably around 10 years, but you've had a particularly good two or three years. You've really kind of grown in stature and, and, and recognition.

Tell us about what you've been doing recently as a, as a studio to push yourselves forward. 

Ben Doyle: Yeah, I think that, um, so we've been going, we've been going since 2016, and I think that is. Interesting seeing the industry grow up through that time. Like in the early days that we were going into meetings, people didn't really understand this space.

Um, and I think, so we've grown with everyone and I think that the industry has, has turned a, uh, its attention onto the space that we are in. For us, the focus is always how do we make the best content that the audience wanna watch? Like that is the thing that goes for our mind has always been that, is how do we make something that the platform's gonna receive?

Well, the audience is gonna receive well and keep iterating. And I think it's fine to make a mistake, go [00:27:00] and make something can be like, oh, that episode didn't do as well as the last one. The beauty of digital is that we can go and change it. We can go and take a sudden right turn and something can be like, let's bring in some new talent.

Let's change the format slightly. Um, and so I guess. I've just seen the industry ac accept it. More and more money's come into that part of the, the world and therefore better and bigger stuff is getting made and people are more focused on it. It's not an afterthought anymore. It's not like, let's make this TV show and then make some support in whatever.

The social team, it's very much like how do we make something that serve in this audience where they are and with what they want to receive? 'cause the audience are hungry for content. Like they're, they're watching this stuff for hours and hours and hours. So it would be criminal to like miss the opportunity of not feeding that desire from, from them.

Yeah, I, 

Andy Fry: the, I think one of the key themes of today's event, this kind of idea of how to make money in digital is of people who've perhaps been working at massive TV budgets or, or bigger TV budgets, working out how to be cost effective and work in this world. If you had to kind of give some advice on how you still create premium content, [00:28:00] compelling content at a different budget level and be successful, what would you say to people?

Ben Doyle: Uh, I say that the, if you wanna make premium content, but not. I completely missed the mark on it, is that you have to, uh, think about what the audience are looking for, which is to be entertained and not make crazy set designs that they don't care about. They don't wanna see what we see on Saturday night TV level sets because they're like, oh, this is structured, this is fabricated.

So it's playing within that. It's being like, okay, I don't need to do a crazy set design. I actually need to focus more on my money and time and effort on these certain things that are about the research upfront and making sure that the episode's great, or that interview series is great or. That the entertainment value is there and that we're understanding, you'll get so much more value out of understanding the law around it and the memes and the culture.

That's where the value is. They don't care about whether it's shot on a big shiny floor studio or crazy cinematic production. They care about am I watching something that feels like that person that is on the screen has made it or been a part of it. And so I think when it comes to [00:29:00] budgets, like we've never, we've never seen those TV budgets, right?

We've never been dealing in the millions. It's always hundreds of thousands. And so. It's about looking at what we've got and being like, let's not shoot for Saturday night TV shiny floor and completely miss it. And also we're not, we're missing the UGC side. We're kind of, neither is it. You need to find the sweet spot and then become known for it and just double down and be like, this is our style and this is, and keep doing the same thing.

I think audiences are super sensitive as well to complete changes. So if you've got a channel that one minute is putting out super glossy stuff and then suddenly goes like. Really homemade that, and then back to glossy. That's confusing for the audience. I think you need to pick, this is the world we're in and, and run with it.

Andy Fry: Final question, so, so if you are able to talk about it, what are you working on right now? What's sort your day, what's happening for you day to day right now? 

Ben Doyle: So, uh, exciting projects. Right now we're in the middle of season two of Skyport scenes, a series we do for them. Uh, and we're talking to lots of different commissioners and brands about brand entertainment stuff.

Like lots of the work is definitely going in that direction. Lots of people being like, how do we go and interpret our [00:30:00] brand or our platform in a different way and space and use talent to make content that's gonna cut through with the audience. Uh, and so lots of the projects are kind of more in that space and not tons that I could talk about.

Well, my PR isn't here, so I dunno. Um, but yeah, I think like for me, the most exciting thing is that I've seen lots more appetite for like this type of content that the audience really wanna see. I think for years I would get briefs in and be like, oh, like they don't want, no one wants that. Yeah. And then it would be like trying to turn that around, but.

Now I'm seeing lots of briefs where I'm like, the audience do want that, that's, that's catering into it. So I think that's the encouraging thing. I'm seeing more and more, uh, stuff that I think the audience are gonna love. 

Andy Fry: Brilliant. Uh, Ben Doyle, after Party Studios. Thanks for your time. 

Ben Doyle: Thank you very much.

Justin Crosby: You've been listening to highlights from How to Make Money in Digital Recorded Live in London in 2025, and if what you've heard here resonates, the good news is we're doing it all again. How to Make Money in Digital Returns on April 21st at 30 Houston Square in London, bringing together producers, [00:31:00] platforms, studios, creators, and people from right across.

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