Wives Not Sisters
A playful, unfiltered podcast where a married wlw couple dives into the chaos of modern relationships, pop culture, queer lore, and all the little things most people wouldn’t admit out loud.
Wives Not Sisters is a queer-led podcast where marriage meets humor, honesty, and a little too much sharing but in the best way. We’re here to normalize nuance in relationships -- from romantic, platonic, familial, and everything in between- and to create a space where deep conversations and dumb jokes can coexist. Through real talk, playful debates, and just enough oversharing, we’re building a community that’s reflective, ridiculous, and radically relatable.
Wives Not Sisters
When Queer Love Changes: Trans Partners, Privilege & Progress
This week on Wives Not Sisters, Alix & Kayla dive into your juiciest queer write-in questions—identity shifts, relationship changes, generational LGBTQ+ tensions, age-gap love, and what really counts as “queer representation.” It’s honest, hilarious, vulnerable, and very, very gay. 🌈
We also play Underrated or Overrated (spoiler: baths don’t stand a chance), confront who’s the problem this week, and unpack the Sydney Sweeney “good jeans” chaos.
00:00 – Intro: Married, codependent, and chaotic
00:50 – Write-ins & why reviews matter
02:00 – Naming the listeners: “Sister Wives”?
02:33 – Underrated/Overrated (baths, therapy, matcha, astrology memes + more)
06:21 – Queer Rants: Anonymous #1 – Identity shifts in a transitioning relationship
10:15 – Lesbian identity vs. partner transition
20:05 – Opening the relationship? Boundaries & self-trust
25:56 – Queer Rant #2 – Older gays, younger gays & language policing
30:25 – LGBTQ+ history, AIDS crisis & generational tension
36:37 – Queer Rant #3 – Should only queer actors play queer roles?
41:35 – Queer Rant #4 – Age-gap relationships & community judgment
47:09 – Who’s the Problem? Hair-washing edition
50:28 – Sydney Sweeney “good genes/jeans” debate
54:50 – Outro & call to action
#QueerPodcast #LGBTQPodcast #WivesNotSisters #QueerStories #LesbianPodcast #TransSupport #QueerCommunity #LGBTQHistory #AgeGapRelationship #QueerRepresentation #RelationshipAdvice #PodcastersOfYouTube #BuzzsproutPodcasts
Connect with us on social media: IG: @wivesnotsisterspod | TikTok: @wivesnotsisterspod | Youtube: @wivesnotsisterspod
Follow our hosts on Instagram: @kaylalanielsen @alix_tucker
You can also watch our episodes on Youtube at youtube.com/@wivesnotsisterspod!
Hey guys, it's Alex and Kayla. You forgot your name there for a second, honey. I did. We're married, not related, definitely codependent.
Speaker 1:Moving at a turtle speed. Forget I forget who I am sometimes. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Wow, that was that was rough. That was almost like an episode one throwback.
Speaker 1:Whatever.
Speaker 2:If you haven't listened to episode one, please go back and just listen to the first two minutes of Alex trying to do the intro. Struggle bus. Maybe my favorite thing ever. So hi. Hi. Hi to you. Hi to everyone. Hey, babe. We're here. We're queer. Our dog looks like a deer.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker 2:And I'm really excited because today we have some write-in stories from people.
Speaker 1:Ooh, we love write-ins. We love hearing from people.
Speaker 2:Well, that's what I was gonna say first is that I know it's like, okay, probably everyone listening listens to other podcasts, and all podcasters are like, please rate, review, comment. And the reason that we say that is because it actually really, really helps. It does.
Speaker 1:It also makes us feel like we're not on an island in our living room all alone by ourselves. Yeah. Which we are.
Speaker 2:That too. It helps us feel more connected to you guys, but it also, you know, it's like we're putting out all of this free content, and it's just like a super easy, fast, free way for you to support us, whether it's like sharing with the show or sharing the show with somebody, leaving a review, leaving a comment on Spotify, all that stuff really, really helps. It goes such a long way. We read everything. We do the good, the bad, the ugly. We read it all.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And yeah. We have some really smart listeners out there. We have with that put really thoughtful comments. I really like it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. You guys are geniuses. And we also, I want to name our listeners. Do you?
Speaker 1:I have kind of anti-naming. I have an idea. Ask listeners.
Speaker 2:What? The sister wives. What do you think? I like it. Do you know what I'm saying? It's like funny. Do you guys want to be sister wives? Let's okay, we're gonna vote on it on the Instagram. It's either a yes or a no because I don't have any other options. But also, this is a great way. Contribute. I'm gonna put up a little box on Instagram and you tell me other names if you think there's better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, if you have something better, if you're more creative, then we'd love that.
Speaker 2:Yes. Okay, so it's my turn to lead. It is, and this is gonna be super simple. It's just underrated, overrated. Okay. I'm gonna tell you what the thing is or the activity, and you give me just a gut reaction. Under or over. Baths.
Speaker 1:Over.
Speaker 2:Overrated?
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Okay, couples therapy.
Speaker 1:Over.
Speaker 2:Honey. Well, we've never done couples therapy, so I guess we don't know. Talking to your ex. This is a test. Don't fail.
Speaker 1:Over.
Speaker 2:Yes. Good job. Reality TV villains. Under. Yes. Micro cheating. What is that? My guess is that it's probably, you know, it's like flirting. Maybe there's no physical lines crossed. Or some people even consider porn microcheating.
Speaker 1:Everything that could be cheating is not cool. Overrated.
Speaker 2:It's over. Shouldn't it be? Yeah. Thinking is cheaper. Sorry, I had to think about that. Thinking is cheating. Shout out Tasha on the L word. Yep. Cold plunges.
Speaker 1:Over.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you hate that. Macha lattes.
Speaker 1:Overrated.
Speaker 2:Why are you stroking the chair how intense? I don't know.
Speaker 1:These chairs are actually like they're really cool. Did you take something?
Speaker:What is happening? You're like, this chair is just so soft. I don't know what you call this.
Speaker 1:If it's a if it's bucle, boucle, or if it's chenille.
Speaker 2:This is called an Amazon special.
Speaker 1:So they're super comfortable.
Speaker 2:Okay. Journaling every day.
Speaker 1:Overrated.
Speaker 2:Do you have do you care about anything? That is the question. Taking vitamins you don't understand.
Speaker 1:Overrated.
Speaker 2:You take so many supplements. Okay.
Speaker 1:Well, the thing is, is that I'm a big advocate of making sure that you're getting your blood work done to know which supplements you should be taking, and then taking the ones that your, you know, naturopath or whoever you're working with. She's a wellness prescribes you and not taking fluid. All these other supplements that you don't know if you should be taking them or not. So I only take the ones that my blood work says I should be taking.
Speaker 2:Well, they're from my doctor. Yes. Okay. Meditation apps. Under. Are you saying that just because I have meditations on my app?
Speaker 1:No, no. I like I've used Calm and Headspace and they've been great. Both of the ones I've used.
Speaker 2:And mine.
Speaker 1:And yours, yeah, of course. Obviously.
Speaker 2:Come on. Manifesting.
Speaker 1:I feel like underrated when done properly, but when people are just like, I'm manifesting that, I feel like that's like overrated.
Speaker 2:Yeah. When it's passive. Yeah. Yeah. Hot girl walks. What's a hot girl walk? I was waiting for that. It's literally just going for a walk, but it got rebranded a few summers ago.
Speaker 1:Like going for a walk, but you're wearing like your Lululemon outfit.
Speaker 2:It can be, but it's literally just like going for a walk. Like moving is is hot. And like taking back your health is hot. Underrated. Okay. Um, therapy talk on social media. Overrated. Gross. Clean girl aesthetic.
Speaker 1:You're underrated. We love a clean girl.
Speaker 2:This is connected.
Speaker 1:I love when you wash your hair.
Speaker 2:This is connected to my who's the problem today. So we'll just have a quick little circle back at the end. I love a clean girl aesthetic. Okay. Last one astrology memes. Underrated. Yes, I agree. I like an astrology meme. We are painfully millennial that way, and I don't care. I love it. I don't care.
Speaker 1:What are you gonna do?
Speaker 2:All right, so you're gonna lead us in the F today.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and what did we ask our audience?
Speaker 2:So I had just put it up on Instagram of like, this is a little safe space. Think of it of a queer rant. You can either vent to us, you can ask advice, you can just share a perspective that you have on something, but this is like very in the queer space. So whether it's about your queer relationship, your own identity. And these were some of my top picks. They're super juicy.
Speaker 1:So we love a rant, a queer rant.
Speaker 2:We love a queer rant.
Speaker 1:And you guys delivered.
Speaker 2:You delivered. And this is obviously much longer than could fit in the question box. So these are DMs or emails that we would get.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Okay. So I'm gonna read the first one and then we're gonna respond to this person. They're gonna stay anonymous.
Speaker 2:Yeah, everyone's anonymous. Okay.
Speaker 1:All right. Hey wives. Yes, we are wives. And you're a sister wife. Yes. I've been with my partner for almost seven years. We met in a queer book club. Very cute. Very queer. Yeah. We fell in love fast and built a whole life as a lesbian couple. That label has always been really important to me, not just not just who I love, but how I move through the world. Recently, my partner came out as trans and has started transitioning. I love him deeply and I support him completely, but I'm struggling with what that means for me. If he's no longer a woman, am I still a lesbian? He still identifies as gay, and lately he's been opening up about feeling attracted to men. It's brought up conversations about maybe opening our relationship so he can explore that side of himself. I want to be understanding, but I also feel lost. Like the ground shifted under our love story, and I'm still trying to catch my balance. Has anyone been through something like this? How do you stay true to yourself when the identity you've built your whole world around starts to change? Wow, this is multifaceted.
Speaker 2:This is this is multifaceted. And this, by the way, because I've obviously read them, I run our socials. This was my favorite one because it is so multifaceted, because I know there's gonna be other listeners who can relate to different parts of it, maybe the whole thing. And we've obviously had our episode that we recorded recently, the turf talk one, where we're talking about transness and we were talking more about trans women. This is more geared around trans men. And yeah, like there's just so much to say here. So what do you got right off the bat?
Speaker 1:So if he's no longer a woman, am I still a lesbian?
Speaker 2:Oh my god.
Speaker 1:That's the main question. That's the first part of the question, kind of. This is hard because so for me, I've always identified, well, pretty much always identified as a lesbian. Like once I came out and like went through that journey, I like it.
Speaker 2:Once you came out of the womb, you mean you were just a little lesbian.
Speaker 1:No, like once I like went through my process of coming out, okay, and I settled on lesbian, you know, that I relate that that is like it's a big part of my identity and who I am. And just like taking a step back. Like, if if I was in this person's shoes and going through this, I understand because you want to be respectful and you technically love them.
Speaker 2:It's not even respectful, you love them.
Speaker 1:You love them, you want to support them, and you also want to respect them. And so, like technically, you're in a straight relationship or at minimum a queer relationship. Yeah. But it's like, but your internal identity as a lesbian hasn't changed, you know, even though now like your partner has changed and become a different person. So for me, that would be really hard to accept of like number one, I number one, as a lesbian, I don't want to be in a straight relationship.
Speaker 2:Right. Well, and it's like it's not a good idea.
Speaker 1:And number two, I want to stay being a lesbian. Like that's important to me.
Speaker 2:I know that trans people kind of identify differently. Like some trans people are like, no, I'm not queer. Like I'm still I'm fully straight, you know? And and other trans people are like, well, I'm almost like intrinsically queer because I'm gender queer in this way, or you know, so it's like no matter what, even if my relationship is with a man and a woman and one of them is trans, and it's you know, at the surface looking straight, they still identify it as a queer relationship. So I don't know about this couple if they still feel queer together, or if the if their partner is more like, no, I I'm a man and I feel like this is more a straight relationship now. But this is a conversation. Do you remember that we had when we first got together in 2020? No. Shocker. Shocker, you better remember. Yeah, so we had this conversation because we had watched a show or something. Something had kind of like sparked that. And I had asked you, I was like, you know, do you think you would ever transition? And we talked about it of it, because it was more, I feel like you're more of the gender bender between the two of us. Okay. You would it between the two of us. Yes, definitely between the two of us. Yes, you would be more likely to transition than me. So it wasn't really ever a conversation of, like, oh, Kayla, if you transition, you know, are we still gonna be together? So we had this conversation, and I remember telling one of my good friends at the time who is one of those people that I literally think is 100% straight, which is crazy. Obviously, you know how I feel about that, but she is somebody that really might be. And I just remember telling her how we had this conversation, and she's like, Whoa, like that's I've never even me and my boy her boyfriend at the time, she's like, we would never even obviously have to have these conversations. That's so just out of my awareness. And I don't know, I think like right off the bat, that was something that stood out to me only because you know that coming out, it's like your life changes, and there are parts of it that can be harder. Other people I told that we had this conversation too, they're like, Oh, it's so hard. It's just like another thing you guys have to deal with. And I was like, I don't really see it as a hardship. Like, I kind of see it as like a blessing or a gift in a way, where it's like we get to have these conversations around our identity, like these deep parts of ourselves, six months into dating, that a lot of couples don't have decades into marriage. For sure. You know what I mean? And it's like because we are in this queer community and in this we are queer. So it's like I feel like we go deeper into our identities in some ways, then straight people are almost like you you're not required to as much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like you get the opportunity to explore yourself in ways that almost like at straight people and and cis people like they don't ever even allow their brain to go there. Yeah, you you don't have to, not in that safe to, and like as queer people, it's like we just we delve into everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I don't know if that is part of what this person is saying at all, but even just kind of reframing that of like, oh, this is actually a gift that you even get to have this conversation because so many people won't ever have this conversation. And then the other thing was when when you and I had it, you know, and because I'm someone who's by, I like any all all the things I you know, both all genders, whatever, however many there are, I don't care.
Speaker 1:You're all inclusive.
Speaker 2:I'm all in. Cause it's for me, it's like the physical part is so secondary. It's like I really fall in love with the person. And obviously the physical part isn't the only part of being trans, though. That you know, so for me, I was like, I because I'm not a lesbian, so that doesn't bother me as much at that point, too. I had only been in straight relationships. I think now in some ways it would be harder to go back to being in a straight relationship just because I'm so used to how fucking gay we are. You know what I mean? But I was, you know, I was like, it wouldn't in that regard, it wouldn't matter to me. Whereas I can understand how and why it would matter to, I don't know if it's most lesbians, some lesbians, all lesbians, I don't know, you know, but I would venture many lesbians have the same feeling as this person. And whereas I was like the part that would matter to me because this happens too with when people transition, they do their personality can kind of change, you know? It's like because hormones are literally the puppet masters of our personality. So it's like it it does the same way that it reminds me of when we were talking about just coming out in general and how we kind of transitioned out of the friend groups that we had been in for a long time, and then we came out. Even if nothing bad happened in those friend groups, we're like, but I'm different now.
unknown:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But at the same time, you're like, but I'm still me and I'm still the same in so many ways, but now I'm like even more myself. And I think that happens when people come out as trans as well, where they're like still them at their core, but they're also different. They're this like more expressed version of themselves.
Speaker 1:They're different, and also like the way they're being perceived and received by the world is different. That's gonna like shift the way they show up in the world, like everything. It's just a whole different experience.
Speaker 2:So that's that was more my answer was like it kind of depends on how your personality changes, you know, and then how our relationship dynamic would change versus it do like that doesn't actually change my identity.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So it's like as a lesbian, I think I know that there's some lesbians that are like, yeah, you know, I'm a lesbian, but my partner's trans and it doesn't bother them. I think it's so individual, you know, and it depends how kind of important that label is.
Speaker 1:I've had friends who've been through this. I've I haven't been through this, but like I've had friends who've who've been through this who the the lesbian label was really important and their partner who was trans, like that felt deeply upsetting to them that they wanted to still identify as a lesbian because they felt like that inherently invalidates their identity, their like manlyhood. So yeah, I I think that's really hard, you know, if that's the case, because if if like you believe that that invalidates your your experience as a trans person and therefore like as a man, uh because changing your identity to go from lesbian to like straight or queer can be real a big shift for somebody to make on top of like the experience of their partner changing and transitioning.
Speaker 2:I also think there's such a fine line between compromising in a relationship and then sacrificing or losing yours. And I'm actually somebody that is like, I'm not anti-sacrifice. I don't think it's bad to sacrifice in a relationship, but I think that sacrifice should also be reciprocated and feel balanced overall.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But it's like when you're talking about your identity, if it it's really something only you will know, where you ask yourself, like, is this right for me? And if on that physical level, whether it's your gut, your heart, wherever you feel that like clear yes and no on a physical level in your body, if it's a no, that doesn't mean that you I mean, we talked about this so much in our turf talk episode, but it's like that doesn't mean that you're transphobic. That doesn't mean you don't support this person or even still love this person, but I think you have to choose yourself first because otherwise you could build resentment in this relationship.
Speaker 1:Definitely.
Speaker 2:And definitely.
Speaker 1:I think the other question is like, I don't know, over time, I felt like when I first came out, I really held on so tightly to lesbian as the identity. And like through the years and as things have changed, kind of in culture, I I more call myself queer than more than anything else. I still will say lesbian sometimes, but I will say I'm I feel like just queer. And I just, I don't know, for me, it just feels like a great term. And so I think the question is like, could you get behind feeling queer? Like, or do you feel like a lesbian is your your identity? I don't know. For me, it's like I think as well, like you know, it encapsulates maybe you know, gender fluidity and obviously sexual fluidity. So for me, it just felt like okay, I I definitely relate a lot to the word queer. I still love the word lesbian and I feel like I still am, but like I will, I don't know, could be something to explore as well as like, is queer a good fit for you?
Speaker 2:And something that I heard people say when I was coming out that then I found really helpful and I did as well. It's like trying on the different labels and seeing how they feel, you know, how they work. It's like practice saying queer and see how does that feel true? It's like you're wearing, it reminds me of the like a rent the runway or like the rental bags where it's like you rent the different designer bags and you're like testing them out before you make this big investment. Try it out. Yeah. So it's like try it on and see how it feels. So we start there, you know. It's like all I'm gonna say is I do think you should choose yourself. So if that answer is no, I want to be a lesbian, I think you need to go with that. And that is for the sake of your relationship because otherwise you will build resentment. That relationship won't end well in the future.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:So you can do that in a loving way without disrespecting your partner, you know. I think that goes without saying.
Speaker 1:But then the other part of there's a whole other part of it around opening, potentially opening up the relationship because he is now attracted to men, which he previously wasn't attracted to men. And that's a whole different bag of worms.
unknown:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But okay, this is interesting too with the identity piece because it's like, okay, then he and I'm not saying maybe he does understand. I'm not trying to villainize this person as you know, not understanding or anything, but you would assume that he understands more than anyone because if he's like, yeah, no, I'm still gay, like I still am homosexual internally, but I am now like fully in my full self as a man. Therefore, if I'm homosexual, I like men.
Speaker 1:But where does that leave you?
Speaker 2:I know, but I'm saying then it's like you that person should be able to understand if you're like, but I am a lesbian, you know?
Speaker 1:So Yes, I agree. But also, where does that leave you?
Speaker 2:Right. So it's like, does that mean that you want to be in a committed relationship with you, but kind of like fulfilling this need for men on the side? Uh you know, primary, secondary relationship, partnership, everything that comes with being polyamorous, there's so much to kind of uncover there.
Speaker 1:I think what's hard for me on this one is just like would you, if this person wasn't transitioning, would you have wanted to be in a polyamorous relationship with them?
Speaker 2:That's a good idea.
Speaker 1:Are you just feeling like you because they're going through this transition that they should be allowed to explore because this is like a whole new world for them, and you're having empathy and want to support them through that process and therefore like allow them to explore, but you wouldn't have wanted to do that otherwise? Like, are you putting yourself in this situation that you don't actually want to be in?
Speaker 2:Yeah. I think that's a really good point. To where it's like, again, there's two people in the relationship, they are having their moment that is, I'm sure, very confusing, hard, all you know, they're going through this whole coming out process, this transition process. And it's amazing that you want to be so supportive for them, but you cannot lose yourself in the meantime. If you're excited by it, if you're like, ooh, I never thought it would be in an open relationship, okay. You know, if you feel that again in your body, wherever that is, where you're like, oh, that feels actually kind of exciting. I'm kind of down to explore and let's set some boundaries and ground rules and stuff. Cool, then follow that. But if you're like, oh God, now this is this whole other thing I have to get used to, and I have zero interest in it, but I don't want to be perceived as unsupportive. Yeah, that's a red flag. You know, like you don't have to. We talked about this in the turf.
Speaker 1:If you're if it's like should energy, you shouldn't do it.
Speaker 2:You just should on them again. Yes. Well, that, yes, the should energy, but it's also just like you don't have to prove your allyship to the trans community and to your partner through your relationship dynamic, through your sexual experiences. Like, you don't have to do that. You can be so loving, so supportive, everything for them, and also honor yourself. I think that's the most important thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's my biggest thing is like, what is it that you really want? And are you doing this for the other person? Are you doing it for yourself? And like just make sure you're taking care of yourself through the experience.
Speaker 2:And we don't have any experience in open relationships. No, but what I do know is that communicate, people say you know, like you think lesbians talk a lot, you should be in a polyamorous relationship or a polyamorous lesbian relationship.
Speaker 1:It's just so if you're excited talking all the time about everything with everyone, then that could be really fun. That sounds really exhausting to me though.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you also don't like to share.
Speaker 1:No, I don't want to share it.
Speaker 2:You don't even want to share your sweet potatoes in the fridge with me. You got mad at me for eating them the other day.
Speaker 1:Those are my sweet potatoes.
Speaker 2:Oh my god. Married for five years and still, these are mine, these are yours. But but yeah, so I would just say make sure you have a lot of conversations. Maybe it's something you can go to therapy and kind of like get some guidance because we are obviously not the ultimate guidance. It's a lot of change to navigate, a lot of change. And so the most important thing you need is to feel safe, which which are those boundaries. It's like the structure of it. So just make sure you're on the same page before things start happening, like before the action starts happening, you know? I hope that helped.
Speaker:I hope that helped.
Speaker 2:Did it? It's a hard one. But let us know. I want to know the follow-up. Me too. Because that's a lot. You know, we want to know what you all landed on and everything.
Speaker 1:Okay. So our next one is from another caller. I wish they were here on a phone call. I know. We need to get one of those phone.
Speaker:I want to ask follow-ups.
Speaker 1:Yes. Okay. I was at a dinner party with mostly gay men, think wine, gossip, and a little too much shade when a 20-something guest called out one of the older guys for using language he thought was outdated. It got tense fast. The older man basically said, You kids have no idea what we went through to even have the freedom to argue about language. He talked about losing friends during the AIDS crisis, about how survival shaped his humor and his words. The room went quiet. I've been thinking about it ever since. Who gets to decide what's appropriate when trauma and history collide with progress?
Speaker 2:Oof.
Speaker 1:Another big I can picture this happening.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Where it's like, you know, well, in general, when there's like older people, gay, straight, whatever, you might be more likely to hear offensive things around a table.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're less likely to be politically correct. They're from a totally different generation.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. So it doesn't make it okay, you know, but it is. I'm like, I can pick that's just basically any Thanksgiving that you go to. At least that's how it is for me. When it's like there's much older people, you hear stuff and you're like, you can't say that anymore. Oh my God. Okay. So I've never been at a gay man g dinner party like this, but I can I can picture it being sassy and inappropriate. Yeah. Especially. Yeah. The more alcohol that's flowing. And yeah. So I'm kind of curious what he said. Do you know what I mean? Like what what how inappropriate are we talking? I don't know. Because to me, that feels kind of important.
Speaker 1:I'm sure it's like queer language that we don't use anymore. Queer terms that we don't use anymore. Yeah, that's true. I mean, I even just think about stuff from 20 years ago when I was coming down, it's like there were a lot of terms that you couldn't that people don't say now. Like you know, people would, you know, if you had a if you're a gay guy and you had a a best girlfriend who was straight, we would call them faghs. Like you're you can't really say that anymore. There's all sorts of like terms that you know we used to say 20 years ago that's a good thing.
Speaker 2:It's like even the word dike now is people are kind of like, oh yeah, you know, yeah, I used to be like, oh yeah, my friend's a bull dike, or she's butch, or she's well not even that, like on the L word, you know, they're like, Oh yeah, we're a bunch of it's like kind of that reclaiming of the word. Or when we met our friend's mom the other month who was a lesbian, and she's like, Yeah, I'm just an old dike. Like, yeah, it's kind of just like a almost self-deprecating, but like reclaiming word, whereas our generation is like, What? We don't say that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I mean, the reality is like they're not trying to be offensive. These are terms that they use in their generation, you know?
Speaker 2:It's like well, that's what I was saying. I was wondering what it was because I think it is different if it's like about yourself or your kind of community versus using like a racial slur. Do you know what I mean? Like that's in my opinion, different. Totally different.
Speaker 1:Um my guess is the it's queer terms, yeah. That they used to use 20, 30 years ago.
Speaker 2:So so what happens? So then he one of the so the older guy got really mad at the younger guy and was kind of like you can't talk about it.
Speaker 1:Well, the younger guy like called them out for saying, you know, let's say you said fag hack or whatever. Okay. And called him out and said, like, you know, you can't use that language. And you know, the older guy was like, you have no idea like what what we went through to even have the freedom for you to even argue about language, which I get in a way. It's like, I do think that um people coming out now or kind of in the last few years don't even realize the level of privilege that they have, and they kind of like show up to the queer spaces of like they're perfectly politically correct and you know, super progressive and liberal, and they have no concept of what our elder queers even went through that has even allowed them to show up in that way.
Speaker 2:I think that a lot of young people might have a con like they might have an understanding, but it's like, how can we really know when we haven't experienced it? Even I say this all the time of just me in comparison to you. I came out in 2020. You came out in 2009, right? You came out in a time where you didn't think you you just had accepted, I'm never gonna be able to be legally married. That's what it means to come out. Coming out in 2020 is so different in that regard, you know, and that's just about marriage. Now, if we're talking too about gay men, and this is somebody who lived through the AIDS crisis and who is watching probably. A lot of their friends die during like that was such a horrific, horrific thing that happened and that has been so still stigmatized, kind of swept under the rug. The way that our society and world treated gay men at that time was so dehumanizing, like so beyond anything that we can understand, really.
unknown:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think if you were coming out in the 80s or nine eighties, let's say, and you're a gay man, you didn't even know if you would live till you were 40 years old. Like when I came out in 2009, it was like I didn't know if I was gonna be able to get married. That's totally different than like living, not even know if you were going to live. Like, and it's same thing coming out in 2009, I could have a job in corporate America. Like 80s and 90s, maybe you couldn't have a job in corporate America. Like you had a totally different life than what people have now.
Speaker 2:Not only that, it's just like you if you did get HIV or like whatever, it's like you, the medical system didn't even really want to help people. Like they were so scared of what was happening and didn't understand what was happening, that the way people were treated, even in institutions like hospitals, where people are supposed to be cared for and helping them survive, it's like they were even then just kind of like isolated off, like, oh, we can't deal literal lepers of society.
Speaker 1:They really just get quarantined and people wouldn't even give them care.
Speaker 2:And that's why it's like the people's princess, princess die hugging AIDS patients. It makes me want to cry.
Speaker 1:All the lesbians taking care of their gay guy friends.
Speaker 2:Fun fact that's why Elle is at the beginning of LGBTQ because of the lesbians taking care of all the gay guys during the AIDS crisis. Amazing. But it's like when people, if you don't, I mean, think about we all lived through the pandemic. Anyone listening to this podcast lived through the pandemic. Remember when COVID first happened and everyone's like, what is this? Are we gonna die? You know, and like that initial panic, like, what is this thing that's killing all these healthy young people because of the way it was kind of like being broadcasted on the news? And there was so much fear in the beginning. That was happening with AIDS, but for a much longer period of time. And when it's like, remember in the pandemic, people would cross the street if someone was walking near them and everyone's massive, like everyone is so separated, and it's like that times 10. If somebody was HIV positive or had AIDS, to where it's just like, oh, we can't even touch them. We can't be around them. So to have people come in and like give them love with physical affection was so huge. But regardless, like going through all of that in that era, and then sitting at a dinner party with a younger person being like, you can't say that. I can imagine the older person is like being so annoyed. Are you serious? You're really getting it.
Speaker 1:I also think like older gays, like they have snarkier, darker, sassier senses of humor because they have been through a lot. Yeah, you know, and that's like a coping mechanism, and that's part of the reason why they're so freaking funny.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I would definitely imagine them being like, okay, you gotta be fucking kidding me. Really? Like, you're gonna try to police me over my word choice. Like, you don't even understand what we've been through and what we've done for you. You don't get to police my language, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is how it's like I tend to usually kind of am into elders. You know what I mean? Like, I tend to err on that side, and also I do believe that it's like you can continue to. I don't think just because you're getting old, it's like, well, I know everything I've experienced. Like you can improve and evolve and be a better person. But I think in this case, it really, I mean, I would love to have heard what you know what I mean. What did you say? What did the other guy say? Because it maybe it's one of those things where it's like you say it more in private. Maybe he also felt embarrassed because you put him on the spot in front of everyone, or I don't know. But I think it is something that just like in general, queer people could think about is the privilege that we have now. But it comes from a very long period of time of being like really, really oppressed, dehumanized, treated horribly in society. Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I also just think about it as like my dad's 84 and he says stuff all the time that's like not necessarily appropriate in today's world, and I'm like, I don't really feel the need to correct him. Do you know what I mean? It's kind of like he's not doing it to be offensive, it's not intentional. It's also just like he's from a different generation, they speak differently. I don't feel the need to like force him to speak in 2025 terms. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:I am somewhere in the middle. It depends on what they say. It definitely depends what they say. It's like if it's something that Yeah, if it's something so horrible, of course you're gonna say something, but if it's like if it's something that it's like, oh, this kind of like recently changed and now we say this. I don't know. For me, it really depends on what they say.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Anything else you want to add?
Speaker 2:I don't know if we really answered. What was the question? Or was it a question that's a good idea? I think it's individual, you know, like anything. So yeah, I mean I think everyone will have a different definition of appropriate too. Yeah. But I think it is so important for younger people coming out now, like our generation and younger, to really learn the history of queerness and in a way that gives you more appreciation and gives you like if you are somebody that considers yourself an activist and is like fighting for our rights and other people's rights and all this stuff, it's like we'll learn how we even got to the place that we have being able to fight for rights is a privilege in and of itself. Like, learn how we even got there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure. Okay, um, let's see. Okay, here's another one. Okay, I'm torn on this. I'm queer and I love seeing more queer stories on screen, but lately it feels like everyone's policing who's allowed to play queer. I get wanting authentic representation, but does being an actor mean pretending to be someone else, or is it about lived experience? Am I a bad queer for thinking it's okay if a straight actor nails a queer role, or should these opportunities only go to us?
Speaker 2:Ooh, bad queer. I'm just kidding. Well, they said, am I a bad queer? Yes. Um be a bad queer. I don't know. I'm just like, speak your truth. You know what I mean?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't know. Like, I personally, when I watch a show, um, like for example, when L word came out with Generation Q, all the queer roles are given to queer actors. I personally really liked it. It was like the first thing that we did is like, oh, is this person queer? Is this person queer? Like, are they bi or they you know, whatever?
Speaker 2:Because I'm sorry, Bet Porter, you are a lesbian. Oh shit. Stop. Stop pretending to be straight. Just come out. We will embrace you with open arms. Like, what? You are an amazing actress. We need you to be gay. I know. You're just breaking the hearts of women everywhere, everywhere.
Speaker 1:And so there's there's something that's like really exciting about like when you see a role and you know they're queer in the role, and then you Google them and they're also queer in real life. There's something that's like really exciting about that. I don't know why. It's just representation, I guess. It's just like it's so exciting. And so for me, like I I'm not gonna say that every queer role should be played by a queer person. I don't, I'm not gonna be that strict about it, but because then I then you would also say, well, like queer people can't play a straight role or something.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:But there is something that feels so comforting when it is played by a queer person, and I think that should be like the majority of the time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I would say it's almost like prioritizing giving it to a queer person, but let's say no queer person nails the audition, you know, then you expand. Because ultimately you want it to be the most successful movie, show, whatever it is, and that means you want to have good performances. So it's like if if a queer person isn't nailing it, then I guess that's that's a different story. Yeah. But I do understand this idea of kind of like, well, the best person should win, you know. But it's like, what if we start with the queers? And then if they don't deliver what you need, then we can expand the search, you know?
Speaker 1:I just think there's not that many queer roles out there in general. So I would be surprised.
Speaker 2:There's not that many queer roles queer actors, and I feel like everyone in Hollywood is queer. I'm sorry, that's like super gay town.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the majority are like definitely bi.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they're like theater kids and perfor. It's like, come on, like you are everyone's I mean, everyone's a little fluid, but that's I would I think that's the other reason it's exciting when you Google it and you're like, oh, they really are queer. It's also because it's like not just the representation, but them being out. Because think about in the past, like we were saying, it's like so many people probably were queer, but they were closeted and playing straight roles. If you Googled it, or this is probably pre-Google, anyways, but if you looked into it, you wouldn't know they were queer regardless, you know? Or like what's the guy in the wicked movie, The Prince?
Speaker 1:Jonathan Bailey?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:He's in Bridgerton as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and he's like all the everyone's like, he's so hot. And he is, he's a babe. And I love that he's gay. I know. You know what I mean?
Speaker 1:It's just like And he plays a straight character in Bridgerton as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But it's amazing that it's like he's this heart throat. It's like that, even that wouldn't have happened. I don't even know about like 10 years ago in Hollywood, where it's like if you are gay and you're a man, then his relationship with Scarlett Johansson is so cute, by the way.
Speaker 1:They like kiss all the time, it's really cute.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, that's whatever. But but yeah, so I don't know. It's like I do I I like that people are able to be out and be queer, but we were saying this the other day because we had watched something and the character, it was an older person and they were trans. And I was like, Do you think they're really trans in real life? And I was like, probably not, because this person is like 75. And that's just the fact that being able to be trans back then was not as there's not a lot of 75-year-old trans actors out there. Exactly. So I was like, in that case, I can understand why they weren't able to fill this role with a trans actor, you know, versus a younger trans person in the same movie or whatever it was, you know? Yeah, they could be trans because there's more there are actually people to pull from. So yeah, I think it kind of also depends on the kind of queer we're talking about.
Speaker 1:But agree. Agree. Do we have time for one more? I don't know what time it is. So I think we do. Okay. Okay. So I'm dating someone 15 years older, and while it's incredible in some ways, stable, grounded, sexy in that grown-ass person way, the queer community can be harsh about it. People assume there's some weird power imbalance or that I'm being parented.
unknown:Yeah.
Speaker 1:We talk about age gaps so differently in straight culture versus queer culture. I don't know. Is it possible to just love who you love without it becoming a discourse?
Speaker 2:I guess I didn't know it was different in queer culture versus straight culture. I definitely think so.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like if a if a if a 50-year-old guy or a 45-year-old guy is dating a 30-year-old girl, no one cares.
Speaker 2:I care. People care. People don't care. People do care. People will still say.
Speaker 1:I think if the girl is over 30, nobody cares. I think if the girl is in her young 20s, people care.
Speaker 2:People have comments to say about it still. Whether it's like she's a gold digger, he's a creep, whatever it is, people have comments to be able to do it. Ultimately it's terrible.
Speaker 1:It's very accepted and it's normal. Like there's so many men dating women 15 years younger than them.
Speaker 2:But so in queer culture, you're saying it's not as accepted from queers or from the streets.
Speaker 1:Uh from the both from the queer community. I people assume there's some weird power imbalance or that I'm being parented.
Speaker 2:Well, maybe I don't know. Maybe it's because so many queer people are that kind of as we were talking about, it's like want things to be perfect and like to there can be a lot of policing that happens in the queer world. Yes. So it's like I do think a lot of it comes from a good place of wanting fairness and equality and things to be as good as possible, but sometimes it gets taken to an extreme that is not actually healthy or helpful. So I could in that regard, I can understand why the queer community might be like, no, that's not okay. Are you safe? You know, this is the power imbalance. The but all I'm saying is I've heard straight people say this about straight relationships as well, where they're like, that's weird. There's a power imbalance.
Speaker 1:That's I've only heard that when the girl's in her young 20s. I think when a when a girl or woman is like over 30 or in her 40s or 50s, and there's a 15-year age gap, nobody says anything. It's only when she's in her early 20s.
Speaker 2:Which is fair enough because her brain isn't formed yet.
Speaker 1:But like if a 50-year-old woman dates a 65-year-old guy, nobody cares. Nobody's gonna say anything.
Speaker 2:15 years is also not, I mean, I've seen way bigger age gaps and straight relationships on TV. If we're talking about TV, you know, it's like there's housewives who have had husbands that are decades older than them, and it's just kind of known like weird. Oh, she likes that's weird, you know, likes other guys, or she's doing it for money, or whatever it is. People talk about that with Nick Vile and his wife. She's 25 or 6 or something, and he's in his 40s. I want to say he's like 20 years older than her. So yeah, people talk about it, is all I'm saying. I've heard, and these are just like big straight couples, and I've heard people talk about it negatively as well. I um I was just saying I didn't know it was different in the queer world, but if it is, it's probably coming from that place of like just wanting things to be so correct. I think it's hard for me to relate and understand. I've never really liked someone who's way older than me or way younger than me. I think for me, it would feel harder to relate to them. But if you if this person feels good about it and it feels healthy and reciprocal and there isn't a power and battle, it's like only you will really know that.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know?
Speaker 1:I think people just love to have opinions. So like I think that's normal. And when they see something that is different, they're gonna have an opinion. Um but I think ultimately if you guys are grounded in your relationship and you got a good balance, like you know, doesn't matter if people think that there's a some power imbalance.
Speaker 2:That's what I was gonna say. It's like who cares what people think? Yeah, but yeah, I think it just it depends on the quality of your relationship. So well, do they have a specific question?
Speaker 1:You keep asking this.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:Is it possible to just love who you love without it become discourse? Becoming discourse.
Speaker 2:Well, isn't that like the question of queerness? You know what I mean? Like I think we just love who we love. And especially because of the internet, because we share our lives online, and obviously we don't have to do that. No one's forcing us to. We are opting in to do that, but then that comes with getting a lot of opinions back, definitely, which can feel overwhelming. So maybe that's something you protect from what I don't know what this person's work is or anything, but it's like maybe you don't share your thing online if you don't, if you can't, because I would assume it's probably online. Like most people in person don't say the same things they would say online.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like, is there a power imbalance? Are you if it's one of your friends, it's like, hey, you good? You really happy in this relationship, you know, like that's a different, a different conversation versus like a lot of commentary on a viral video or something.
Speaker 1:No, I mean, I think it's like if you're happy in the relationship and you've got some daddy on your arm, like good for you. Yeah. Zaddy. Zaddy. It's exciting. Okay, honey. Who's the problem this week? Oh no, I already know what it is. You alluded to it at the beginning. Daddy. No.
Speaker 2:And I told you this when we went on one of our walks this week. I said, I'm gonna put that on my who's the problem list because I just have a running list in my phone. Whatever. So you're in the hot seat today.
Speaker 1:Whatever.
Speaker 2:Every I wash my hair once a week, okay? I'm just gonna put it out there. I wash it once a week. Every single time, without fail, when I wash my hair, and this happened a few days ago on the day I washed it. You're like, oh my God, you just look so beautiful today. You said it so many times, which on its face, you're like, well, that's a nice thing to say. Why are you complaining? I'm not complaining. That is a nice thing to say. The thing is, you only say it once a week. And you say it only on the day I wash my hair.
Speaker 1:And I don't, this is sub, this is subconscious. I don't even realize.
Speaker:You have zero clue that I've washed my hair. You just there's some days you just look amazing. You're like, you just look so good.
Speaker 1:Like you always look good. Like your baseline level is you always look good.
Speaker:You see she's recovered. And then some days you just look unbelievable. It's called clean.
Speaker 1:I'm like, clean white is a 10 today.
Speaker:Today.
Speaker 1:Okay. If I if I said you were a 10 every day, you wouldn't believe me. No. But if once a week I'm like, wow, you are a 10.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Do you believe me?
Speaker 2:No. You don't believe you're a 10. But no, it's more just like, okay. And this is actually something that I said a long time ago. I was like, this is the trick. You need to set the bar so low that when you do small things like washing your hair, people are like, oh my God, you look so good. Or if you put mascara on. You know what I mean? Like something so small. Those used to be givens.
Speaker 1:Something looked different about you today.
Speaker 2:Yeah. When those used to be givens in my just like getting ready young woman life when I was like so glam all the time. And now it's like the bar is so low that all I have to do is wash my hair, and I go up so many notches. But my point is, who's the problem? Should I wash my hair more? Or should you just find me beautiful all the time?
Speaker 1:First of all, I do find you beautiful all the time, and you know that. But you don't believe me when I tell you that you're beautiful. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:That's a separate problem.
Speaker 1:Okay. And then once a week, when I tell you that, oh my God, you're like a stunner, you shame me for telling you how beautiful you are.
Speaker 2:No, I don't shame you. I'm just like, really? And you'll be like, Did you wash your hair today?
Speaker 1:I just think it's a funny thing.
Speaker 2:And what you said this last week was, well, maybe you need to wash your hair more. Yeah, maybe you do. Maybe. Maybe you do. We'll let the pod. What do you guys think? The sister wives. They'll vote.
Speaker 1:Whatever.
Speaker 2:Who's your problem?
Speaker 1:Okay. I was thinking about like pop culture things recently. And do you remember? I think this was like a month ago. Maybe it was two months ago. I don't know. But it was recent. Um when Sydney Sweeney did that American Eagle jeans ad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're like five months late to the conversation. Yeah.
Speaker 1:But I was just thinking about it recently because I just saw something about it.
Speaker 2:Because she's dating Scooter Braun. Did you know that? Oh God.
Speaker:Why is she you?
unknown:Bro.
Speaker 2:Like that's not gonna help your image.
Speaker 1:Okay, so Sydney Sweeney did this American Eagle genes advertisement. It was like, I've got good genes, you know?
Speaker 2:Good jeans. You know how to do it. And it was like, yeah.
Speaker 1:How do you do that? You can't impersonate it. But it's like implying that she has like good genetics, right? Yeah. But also good jeans that she's wearing. Play on words. Okay. And the internet like lost, lost their mind.
Speaker 2:Eugenics. Yeah. Lost their mind.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Who's the problem? Is it the ad or is it the internet?
Speaker 2:I don't, I mean, I think it's more specifically at Sydney Sweeney, whereas the ad is about the brand. I feel like the brand knew that they were gonna get a reaction. They succeeded.
Speaker 1:Is it Sydney Sweeney's problem or is it the internet's problem?
Speaker 2:The reason that people say that about Sydney Sweeney is because she is kind of like a known but unknown Trump supporter. And so people were relating it to being racist and this like white supremacy. Just because she's a Republican? I don't even think she's a Nazi. I don't think that even she has come out and said that. There was something about like she was at a party.
Speaker 1:It was her voter registration came out that she re registered as a lot of people.
Speaker 2:No, but she was also like at a party for her someone in her family. And they were all the theme was something like redneck, country, I don't know. And so they were wearing like MAGA stuff, and then she was like, No, that was the theme. It was something like that. Um, so that's why people were like, oh my gosh, now you're basically saying your jeans are good because you're white. That's why people were so upset because you're like blonde.
Speaker 1:Not because like not because they wrote an advertisement and just had her had it had her in it because she's gorgeous.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I think that the brand, I don't know if the brand said it or if she did or whoever, but it was supposed to be a play on like some old Calvin Kleinat or something from with like Denise Richards, I want to say. I don't know, like old from the 90s or 80s or something. So it was supposed to be a play on like an old ad, actually. And then it just got extrapolated into this bigger thing. So this is the problem. I think the internet's always the problem. Always. The fancy is always the internet. But it's funny because it's like five months later, we're still talking about so the ad worked. So the ad was amazing. The ad worked, like we're all talking about it. It is true. The bad press is all press is good press. Like that is true. So it's funny when it's like there's so much noise about something, it is actually just doing exactly what they wanted. Because it's not like American Eagle lost money from that.
Speaker 1:Well, their stock went way up after the ad.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I'm like, it seems like they lucked out. Whether that was their real underlying message or not, I can't I don't fully buy into that. No, I think that especially for a major brand like American Eagle, that would be really stupid if you had this like underlying white supremacist ad, that would be crazy. But Sydney Sweeney, whatever.
Speaker 1:I don't she's a babe. I mean, come on. She has good genes.
Speaker 2:Okay. Yeah, she's super hot, but she's just been kind of like shoved down our throats, is how I feel. I'm like Sydney Sweeney Dad a little. You know what I mean? I'm not relaxed. Relax. So she's underrated.
Speaker 1:She's underrated. Yeah.
Speaker 2:All right. Well, you guys let us know. You let us know. And next time we do a write-in, please write in your stories. You can also tell us if you're like, hey, I don't want you to read this on air, then we won't. That's totally fine too. Totally. We love hearing from you guys. So that's a wrap. See you next week. Bye. Thank you so much for listening to the show. We're so happy to have you here. Make sure to subscribe, rate, and review wherever you're listening to podcasts. We love getting commentary from you on Spotify and on YouTube. And as always, if you love this episode or any of our episodes, make sure to share it with a friend or somebody who will appreciate the conversation.
Speaker 1:And make sure to follow us on all their socials at Wives Not Sisters Pod on Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube. Thanks, guys. See you next week.