Divorcing a Business Owner? What You MUST Know Before You Settle

Divorcing a business owner can be one of the most financially complex parts of any separation. 

In this episode, Sara Davison speaks with business valuation expert Richard Brady about how businesses are valued during divorce, common tactics used to reduce a company's apparent value, and the steps you can take to protect your financial future before agreeing to a settlement.

Whether you're a business owner or divorcing one, this episode offers practical insights to help you make informed decisions.

Find Richard Brady:
🌐 https://thevaluationteam.co.uk

If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to like, subscribe, and leave a review.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Welcome to the Heartbreak to Happiness Show with Sarah Davison. If you're struggling with a breakup and you feel shocked, angry, betrayed, devastated, or sad and alone, then this podcast is for you. Best-selling author and award-winning host, Sarah Davidson, shares how you too can get on with your life to heal, grow, and move from heartbreak to happiness.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

So the sooner one could get an independent evaluation, the better. That would be one thing I'd say. I think the other thing is that how can I put this without kind of trashing the accountancy world? A lot of people think, well, I'll let the accountant do it, because the accountant can mathematically calculate it. But you know, the amount of accountants that have got strong relationships with business owners that might do one valuation every year or two and therefore don't really know all the definite methodologies and might just use a multiple of profit, you don't always get the best view from that. And then they don't know how to charge for it because they don't do it regularly, and it can take them hours and hours because they don't do it regularly. So I'd say avoid using the company accountant for sure. Avoid using a friend that's an accountant and go to somebody that just does this. This is really all weed. And you know, if you're doing five a week, you're just naturally going to be quicker and will identify things that maybe somebody that does it every so often wouldn't.

SPEAKER_00 1:26

Here's your host, Sarah Davison.

SPEAKER_02 1:30

Welcome back to the show. Now, today I am super excited to have a guest that I know is going to really open some doors to what happens behind the scenes. This is stuff that you are going to want to know. So Richard Brady is with me today. I'm very, very excited because he's exactly what I needed during my divorce but didn't have access to. So Richard will help you if you're going through a divorce and you want to look into whether you own a business, you own a business jointly with your partner, or maybe they own a business and you don't know much about it. So, Richard, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_01 2:08

Thank you, Sara. Thank you for introduction as well.

SPEAKER_02 2:10

I'm very excited because this, as I said, is a lot of what I wish I needed to know and could have really done with your help back 17 years ago. Well, a bit more than that, because my case took two years, two and a half years, so a bit longer than that, but it was a long-fought battle because we had a joint business together. Um, and that was a real sticking point. But let's go back. Can you introduce yourself, Richard, and explain to our listeners, lots of them who are going through separations or a divorce, you know, what exactly is it that you do?

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Yeah, sure, no problem. We well, my my background is financial services. So I work with uh HSBC, uh, AIG and Zurich for many years. Um, and then for the last 20 odd years, uh, was an entrepreneur, so invested in businesses, uh, advised business owners on buying other companies, so MA they call that, mergers and acquisition. Um, but through the process of that, you need to be able to value a company. Um, and it isn't easy to do that for small companies. There isn't really a textbook for it. There's lots of different methods, but nobody really shows you how to do it. So we built a valuation tool uh and then valued lots of small companies. And over time, I realized actually this is a service that I could offer to other people. And we then found more and more people that were going through divorce were approaching us to see if we could uh do a valuation for their partner's business, for their business, and they're going through divorce. And um, yeah, so that that's where it started. And we've kind of made a niche for that now. We we do more divorce work than virtually anything else.

SPEAKER_02 3:45

I think this is really needed. I mean, I don't know anyone else that specialises like you do, and apart from being a thoroughly nice guy as well, it's it's good to have someone that really gets what you're going through and understands um and doesn't sort of use the big words that confuse us and overwhelm us. Like I I was a business owner joint with my ex-husband, but you know, we had to get a valuation of the business to sort of work out what the settlement was going to be at the end, and I just remember it being one of the most horrific conflict-inspiring situations because his guy was coming on saying it was worth absolutely nothing and was over, and my guy was coming in, and I thought he was being quite reasonable and sort of saying, Well, this is where probably to the higher end, but not ridiculous as far as I was concerned. But you know, the judge sort of comes along and sort of usually rules down the middle in a lot of these cases because he says, Well, if he's saying that and she's saying that, well, then it must be in the middle, which actually in high conflict cases is just not true. It's just a tactic to sway what the judge might think. So, what what sort of well, first of all, let's look at why do you think there is a need for your services out there for people that might be listening?

SPEAKER_01 4:50

Yeah, I well, it's difficult to know what a small company is worth. And I think the vast majority of work is small companies, not private, uh, sorry, public companies. So, you know, it's the corner shop, it's the hairdressers, it's the engineering firm. Uh, and because there isn't really an easy way of doing it, then there's an immediate conflict of interest. Because if it's your business that you don't really want to give a great value to, then there are ways that you could suggest that it's worth less than it probably is. Uh, and similarly, if you're the person that would like to know what the value is, uh, you know, and and inflate, I'll say inflate, but get the the best value possible, um, then you know it's important that we get that identified. So we either work as uh a single joint expert, so we're the one expert working on behalf of both parties and try to take a very balanced view of that, or we could be a party appointed expert. And and we get more of those, which is where one party has said, look, my very typically, it's my husband's business has been valued by his accountant at X, but I really think it's worth more than that. Can you have a look at it and help? So that that's where we tend to get more of our work, probably 70% of our work, is when we're working for one party to try and establish what the value is, because oftentimes the accountant uh takes a very um how can I say conservative, that's probably the best way, a conservative view, particularly if they've got you know a long relationship with the business owner.

SPEAKER_02 6:16

Yeah, I think you know my my listeners will know that I have a real problem with the injustices and the conflicts of interest in the system. And sometimes when you are dealing with certain experts, especially around children, but also in these kinds of situations, you find that someone may have a bias. And you know, when you get experts that go, Oh, yeah, they're pro-dads, or oh yeah, they're pro-mums, or pro him, or pro her, you know, you kind of get that feedback, just like when you walk into court and they go, Oh no, it's Judge So and so, oh, he's not gonna be on your side, oh gosh. You're like, What? I thought I was going to court, not casino, but hey, yeah, that's another topic. Um, so what are the biggest issues that you see? Can you share some of the stories maybe you've seen? Because I think having spoken to you before, there's some really interesting situations that you come across, which I think a lot of people can relate to.

SPEAKER_01 7:03

Yeah. Well, it it happens more often than I would like it to happen, really. I it one would hope that you know both parties go into it in good faith and they get an independent valuation and and you know, hey, presto. But I guess when you're dealing with the sort of numbers that we can potentially be talking about, there's a there's a big incentive not to get it independently valued. So that that's you know, it starts from the wrong place very often.

SPEAKER_02 7:28

Um just to explain that for people that may not be clear on that, why might there be an incentive? So you make it appear that it's worth less so that in the settlement, then the other half gets less than what they're at what it's actually due. And then they're left with it, so therefore it's worth more at the end of the day. So it's basically cheating them out of what's rightfully theirs.

SPEAKER_01 7:48

Yes. I I had a case a couple of weeks ago. Uh two professionals both had their own businesses. Um, one was a consultancy business, with it was really just uh a kind of lifestyle business. There wasn't any tangible asset value, and that was the wife. And the husband had uh quite a decent sized business, but his accountant had valued it at what is called the net asset value. So it's a number on the accounts, it does appear on there, but effectively that means if you were trashing everything now, closing it all down, selling it in a fire sale, that's what it's worth. But it was still a trading business with money in the bank and customers. So that figure came to 172,000. And the the wife said to me, I think that's reasonable enough. I said, Well, without knowing, you know, without seeing the accounts, it's difficult to say. So we managed to get one year's worth of abridged accounts. So we didn't have the usual information that we would get, and we only had to give an opinion, we weren't writing a full report. And we valued that because it was only an opinion, we couldn't see all the detail, but we valued it between six and seven hundred thousand. So there was a massive difference there, you know, £70,000 or £80,000 paid if it was 50-50 versus £300,000 paid. So that is a situation we come across more often than we we would like. But then it it got compounded because we then said, well, if we had the full accounts, we could give a very accurate number. Um the other party with you know that the husband wasn't willing to give us the full accounts. And so now we're going through a process to go to court to get a court order to insist that we get the information. So th that situation happens, you know, I I would say one in five times. But if the wife had accepted the 172, there's an enormous loss there, and you know, it makes a big impact, as you will know better than most.

SPEAKER_02 9:42

Yeah. So I mean that's interesting, isn't it? I mean, some people might be listening thinking, well, you know, you obviously he doesn't want to share the information because that's going to reveal maybe it's worth even more than what you said if he's resistant to it, because why else wouldn't he want to share it if it was less? Um, but then some other people might be thinking, Richard, well, are you then very much pro-wife? So what would you say to that?

SPEAKER_01 10:06

I'm pro-the truth, really. I I I mean, is in situations I I I'd be lying if I didn't say that you can get sympathy for the person that you're talking to, because I I always understand there's going to be two sides to every story. And if we're not working as a joint expert, you know, we're working for one party, you get one party's version of events. But it is important to understand. So, you know, the the flip side of that is that um I got approached by a firm of accountants that were acting on behalf of uh a woman whose husband ran a subway franchise, and I think she'd assumed that because there was lots of people going in and out of the subway franchise every day, that it was worth a lot of money. Um, their accountants had valued it at £50,000. We went through and I was trying to see if we could find more than £50,000, but I actually got the same figure. And I didn't know the number beforehand, but both of us came up with the same figure. And and so in that situation she was quite disappointed, but had assumed just because it was so busy that it really w must be worth more. But ultimately, you know, business is worth what one party would pay for it and the other party would would sell it for. But you do link that then to the accounts, you know, and the historic information, and then what we estimate would be the uh the future information. So, you know, it is it is part science and part art.

SPEAKER_02 11:24

I mean, if if I mean I guess you must have come across some really unusual situations with what you do. Is there anything that stands out for my listeners?

SPEAKER_01 11:33

Um yes, there was there was one where um we we were approached by it was two business partners that were separating and the there were one was 70% owning and the other was 30. Uh and they'd kind of agreed a deal, broadly speaking, but said, well, it's probably sensible to get an independent valuation. So we value the business at 1.65 million, and the party that had the 30% said, Well, I'm happy to take 30% of that. But the other party said, Oh no, no, we've had a bad year this year, and we haven't yet done the books, so can we have it revalued in a few months' time when the books have been completed? And in the meantime, he went to get his own valuation, uh, and that valuation came out at 750,000. Now, it's unusual to get such a big difference between 1.6 million and 750,000. So we asked for the up-to-date accounts, and there was an enormous drop-off in profits. So profits have been 600,000 a year and had dropped down to 200,000. So then we started asking for additional information, bank statements and further info. And then did line item checks on what was going out of the company, and there was I I've I may have mentioned this to you before, but there were Oasis tickets for £2,000. There was a box at Manchester City for £20,000. No, this is a painting and decorating firm. It's not, you know, the the the reason for entertaining is is not the same as maybe in a PR firm. Um he'd been to seven different countries, all on the expense account, and bought sunglasses, three three suits, different pairs of trainers. So managed to spend £400,000 between when we first valued it and then when the accounts came out. And and the the kind of really big red flag was that he paid his accountant £7,000 more than any other year. So we'd assume that what he did was said to his accounting, how can we squirrel away as much money as possible? Anyway, that that case is now concluded. We then revalued the business by putting back all this money that he'd misappropriated, and it became to 2.2 million. But then it went to court and the judge could see what had happened, and so then the value went up again. The judge effectively said, right, the 30% was now worth $850,000. So had he paid the 30% of the 1.6 at the beginning, it would have saved him three or four hundred thousand pounds, but he he didn't. And uh yeah. So so that is probably quite an extreme case, but I suppose it it does show that it is possible to start changing the profits and therefore the value. And that's something that we really keep an eye on. You know, if the trend suddenly drops off at the point when we're asked to value a business, then we start digging into why that might be.

SPEAKER_02 14:25

I hear that a lot actually, that things are getting moved, things are, you know, things aren't, you know, or they're positioning it like, oh, I might have, you know, this we work's dried up, or I might have to close this business. And so for people listening that might be in that situation, what what's your advice? Because it can be really scary when you don't know much about your partner's business and they're sort of saying, Oh, look, we're hitting on bad tur bad times. Um, and part of you may think, well, yeah, maybe we are, because given where we're at right now in the economy, but also it's very convenient that usually happens with my clients around the point where they're trying to get to the divorce settlement, and suddenly afterwards the businesses tend to take off again or phoenix up into something else quite quickly. So, yeah, what are top tips to sort people panicking right now?

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Yeah, it's it's a really good question. I it it is quite interesting to us that if a business is being sold, commercially sold, um, and we talk to the business owner about next year's profits, the profits are always going to be phenomenal next year. You know, it's incredible. Even just before you sell it, that's when the profits seem to be going up. But whenever it's a divorce, the business seems to be tanking the following year. So, you know, I I think that I think that's more than coincidental. Um yeah, that I think really the the the best bet is to get an independent valuation sooner rather than later. When you go through the for me and all the nonsense that goes with the information you've got to you've got to provide, oftentimes solicitors, because they don't always have somebody like us, you know, they they often just talk to accountants, we're we're at the end of the process very often. I'd suggest if we can get in there sooner, it means that you know, two or three months earlier, we'd be able to identify things that might have been moved later on. Because once they've been moved, it does get difficult to tell. So the sooner one could get uh an independent valuation, the better. That would be one thing I'd say. I think the other thing is that how can I put this without kind of trashing the accountancy world? It a lot of people think, well, I'll let the accountant do it, because the accountant can mathematically calculate it. But you know, the amount of accountants that have got strong relationships with business owners that might do one valuation every year or two and therefore don't really know all the definite methodologies and might just use a multiple of profit, you don't always get the best view from that. And then they don't know how to charge for it because they don't do it regularly, and it can take them hours and hours because they don't do it regularly. So I I'd say avoid using the company accountant for sure. Avoid using a friend that's an accountant and go to somebody that just does this. This is really all we do. Um, and you know, if you're doing five a week, you're just naturally gonna be quicker and will identify things that maybe somebody that does it every so often wouldn't.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

Yeah, you're gonna be tuned into the to what to look out for and some of the pitfalls for sure. So is that I I mean the term forensic accounting gets thrown around a lot when you're going through a divorce, but it's potentially by, well, I know my solicitors were talking about that you need a forensic accountant rather than an accountant. Is that how you would class yourself, or what's the difference?

SPEAKER_01 17:42

Uh no, a forensic accountant, that's a particular qualification. And I'm not sure that you necessarily need a forensic accountant. What would happen is we'd value the company, and if there were things in there that just didn't look right, didn't feel right, we potentially could invite a forensic accountant to go through. So they go through receipts, they'll go through bank statements, they'll um go back into the history of uh relationships with clients, they'll look at contracts with clients. I mean, they really do go down to you know the forensic level. Um, what we tend to do is to look at the history, and if there are things that just don't feel right, we ask the questions. If we're not happy with the answers, that's when we then dig a bit further. Whereas the the forensic accountant kind of starts from that position. It it takes longer and is quite quite a specialist skill. Um, but a good valuer will do 90% of what you would need them to do. And and for the majority of businesses, that's really all you need. It's only if there are some quirks with the business or if there's been some uh you know manipulation of the accounts, that's when you'd need a forensic accountant.

SPEAKER_02 18:47

Okay, so I think I think it's really good advice to get uh evaluation done early. Sometimes you're restricted though, aren't you, by the process? And it's like, well, we've got we've just made the application, then we've got to do this, then we've got to do that, and then that's when you can do this, and that's the solicitor talking, you know. So with the timeline that could go on for literally years, and it doesn't take long to move money, spend money, get rid of money. So is there anything you can do in the interim if you're being frustrated in that process?

SPEAKER_01 19:17

I I think get it on the table early. Uh what I've noticed is if it comes late in the day, then the other party gets irritated because it it is, it feels like a big piece of work. I mean, it's don't think it's that big, but then we do it all the time. But you know, accounts do have to be produced. So I I'd say if your partner's got a business, get into the conversation very early on that we should get this independently valued. And the key word is independent, yeah, so not just valued by the accountant. And then at least that way, if it does come in further down the line, it's not going to be a shock, and therefore you're less likely to get into any kind of conflict. You you know it's about managing expectations. And if somebody expected the process to be finished next week and then you you're now seen to be putting hurdles up or asking for additional information, that can antagonize. So I think if your partner's got a business, say right at the beginning, I think we get this independently audited. Well, sorry, independently valued. And uh if you get any resistance to that, that would be a red flag to me. Because there shouldn't be any reason to not do the same as you would get your property valued. Why wouldn't you get the business? You know, oftentimes businesses are worth more than the property in the transaction.

SPEAKER_02 20:31

Well, I would say that's precisely why most people listening are thinking my partner's never going to say yes because. Uh, and that's just gonna anger them because we I mean, most, I mean, a lot of people following me will have toxic exes that are difficult, abusive, and narcissistic. So one of the traits through the divorce is that post-separation abuse will be played out through these exact kinds of scenarios. How do I confuse? How do I make things as difficult as possible? How can I create as much fear? How can I literally cause total annihilation if possible through this process? And obviously, you know, when I went through this process, I remember, you know, spreadsheets were sent not on time, but they were sent, but then they weren't formatted. So we like, you know, it didn't make any sense to anyone. And then you're like, okay, well, how do we understand this and how do we get access to that? And a lot of things, oh, we don't have that, or we can't. So that process isn't always straightforward. And I think some people listening might think, well, I I don't know anything about that, and I know my ex is going to be difficult. I guess there isn't really any extra help you can get other than you've just got to follow the process with them, or is there something else we can be doing?

SPEAKER_01 21:39

Yeah, I ultimately that you you can get a court order to insist that the information is provided. Um what what we tend to do is we sit in between the two parties to try and take some of the tension out. I mean, not as you know, not all divorces are antagonistic, but if they are, that's where it's good to have somebody that's a buffer. And go quite quickly ask if we can deal with the uh the other party's accountants. So we it's kind of the professionals talking to each other as opposed to trying to get the the two parties account. Um but yeah, I I think really that there's not a lot that you can do directly if you've got that kind of antagonistic relationship. But I I would say use somebody like us as a third party, they're less likely to be difficult with us, although generally they you know I know that people will be and can be difficult.

SPEAKER_02 22:30

Yeah. And it's even more reason to have someone like you in your corner because you know, you've got somebody that you know is going to be looking for the truth and asking for the right information, it does take that pressure off you. You're trying to do it on your own or trying to set a model through, it is never the way forward. And I think you're right, having someone that's independent from both of you, very often I see toxic exes trying to manipulate, oh well, we use this person because we've always used them and they know us, and it's gonna cost so much money to go to somebody else. When in reality, that's smokescreen for I can manipulate this person a lot more easily than I can anyone else that might come in that says they're independent. And so, so would you agree with that?

SPEAKER_01 23:09

Yeah, absolutely the case. And I, you know, the the price uh side of it is is less of an issue. When you look at you know the potential value of getting, I gave you the examples before if there's hundreds of thousands of pounds, it's absolutely worth getting somebody in that might cost a couple of thousand pounds to get that job done. Um when I see correspondence that have gone between the two parties, usually there there isn't just a request for information, there's a request for information, and then it will have a tagline like, you know, I asked you this when we met last week. And that that's what ramps up the pressure was we write as you know, accountants and solicitors do, and it's very matter-of-fact. So it it means that there's less.

SPEAKER_02 23:53

I've seen some pretty nice emails coming from a many, many solicitors. So yeah, but anyway, yeah, maybe accountants follow more guidelines. Some solicitors do for sure, but definitely not all of them.

SPEAKER_01 24:04

No, so we we try and take all the emotion out because it's just it, we just need the facts, you know. And then it's difficult for the other party not to provide that because then they have to give you a reason. And the reason isn't, well, you told me this and you've got the kids, and you that that's an irrelevance to us. You know, what we're looking for is just trying to find a you know one source of the truth. So uh using somebody like us just can take some of the steam out of all that. And if we're in there early, um, again, it it it saves the aggravation of it's all last minute and then it feels rushed and and hassled.

SPEAKER_02 24:36

Yeah. I think that's really good advice. And I think having someone like you just gives you that. I mean, everyone wants to have someone that they can trust in their team because uh at this point you don't know, you know, everyone's fighting for what's best for them. Even in an amicable divorce where there's compromise on the table, you still want the most favourable outcome. So to have someone trusted in the middle can be really, really helpful emotionally as well as financially. It's not just all about what you get out of it, it's how that process goes. And the trauma caused by high conflict in a financial negotiation can be huge. And I spend a lot of my time helping clients get back up off the floor because it's not just the money that's at stake, it's also the emotional trauma of having to talk about money and the fear of what they might not have going forward and how that may impact their lifestyle. So, do you see a lot of that? Because it is emotional, isn't it? And and tensions are heightened.

SPEAKER_01 25:27

It it's the it's the hardest bit of the job, really, because um if if you're an analytical thinker and if you can't compartmentalize things, it's easier, but that isn't usually the case. And when I speak to people, you know, the the two things are merged together: the relationships there, the stress of what you're going through, the fact that there's money involved, and you know, the fear of not having enough and the worry about the kids. If there is any way that you can try and put those in boxes, separate boxes, uh, and I know it's easier to say than it is to do, but it's about you getting to sleep at night, being able to think, well, look, that I can't do anything about that problem now, and I put that in that box. And that one around the evaluation, I'm putting it in this box. You know, that each one of those boxes, even before you go to bed at night, if you can put them there, lock them up, and keep the keys safe, that definitely will help. Because I think otherwise it it is a it is it's a complicated thing. You know, there's a lot of things happening at the same time, and this one extra part of it is um, you know, certainly if you don't know a lot about business, is just another issue. So my advice would be if you could, and I know it's hard, but try and put them in boxes. Uh it not even metaphorical, you know, before you go to bed at night, think right, that problem's going in that box, I'll lock it, put the key to the side and do it with all the others. And it is just then a psychological process to try and uh uh make it easier until the following day, then you can open them all again and start, you know, working through them.

SPEAKER_02 26:55

Go through it again, yeah. So is there anything else that you think my listeners should know if they are looking at this? Maybe they they've got a joint business, or maybe they've got their own business. Do they want to be rushing into evaluation if they've got their own business, or is it better just to try and find something outside of getting it value potentially?

SPEAKER_01 27:14

Yeah, I think if you've got your own business, it's the same in reverse, really. I i I don't see any reason why you wouldn't want to get it. And again, the earlier the better, because then you know what you're dealing with. You know, most people will have an idea of what the house is worth, but most people don't know what their business is worth. You know, we have a kind of saying that a business is worth the number of directors multiplied by a million pounds because all the directors think the company's worth a million pounds, you know, but very often it's it's it's worth less. And I think the other thing I would say is you know, what price do you put on peace of mind and happiness? Um going back to the lady that has whose husband had a subway business, she kept writing and then trying to get a third opinion and a fourth opinion. And and I I thought, well, let's say it's worth 60 then, not 50,000. You're gonna get half of the extra 10, that's 5,000, but you spent months and months writing letters and getting irritated and believing that you've been misled. And at some point or other, you know, you're gonna have to put a price on peace of mind and happiness and say, Well, that last five percent I'm prepared to walk away from. But don't walk away from 50%. You know, it does seem strange that people would accept some of the first offers that are made, certainly around a business, without knowing really what the facts are. And I would get that done by.

SPEAKER_02 28:33

I'm glad I didn't accept the first offer my ex-husband threw at me across the room. Uh, for a girl like me, it was a decent it was a very good offer, apparently. It turned out not even to be half. So anyway. But yeah, I mean, I think some of the people that um are listening will resonate with that, and other people, you know, be having healthier relationships and uh trying to work it through amicably and doing the right thing, which is obviously the best way if we can do that. Um, but I think I think from talking to you now, I think it you know it's pretty clear that whether it is a healthy breakup and you can have some sort of negotiation with your ex, or whether it's toxic, you still need somebody that can do the work and do it honestly and sort of maintain that balance, but be you know professional at what they do. So that I think that's quite key.

SPEAKER_01 29:20

I think Ronald Reagan said trust but verify. And and that's what I'd say. You know, it it's great if you can go in with the right, and you know, I don't want to make it sound like all of them might that we have many, many uh times where both parties are desperately trying to just find the right way forward, just want to move on.

SPEAKER_02 29:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:37

And so, but then I think in that situation as well, just using somebody where neither party I I can't imagine being anything worse than after you've agreed, you know, the valuation of the company, and then always thinking, I wonder if it was actually accurate, because that was only as it counted that said that. I think just get it done, you know, knowing the fact getting it done independently has got to be good for a peace of mind point of view.

SPEAKER_02 30:03

And also I think better for the longer-term relationship if you're gonna have one with that ex, because suddenly if the business did take off, you'd be thinking, oh, hang on a second, you know, or if it didn't, if it sort of crashed, you're like, oh, hang on, then you know, and you might be the person left holding the business, then you think we should have got it valued and we should have done the right thing. At least then you know, and you know there's no doubt or blame further down the line, which I've seen as well between couples, which can be really difficult when you've got the best of intentions, but things you know work differently.

SPEAKER_01 30:32

Um there's always an expert, isn't there, after the event that says, Oh no, I'm sure it's worth a lot more than that. That that's just you know, it's just not good for you. Whereas if you know that you've been through a process and that somebody else has said independently without without an axe to grind, well, this is what we believe it to be, then you it gives you that well, there's no issue after the event, you've got the peace of mind.

SPEAKER_02 30:55

Absolutely. So good advice. So where can people find you? What's the name of your business? Where can they find you? If people want to reach out, how does that work? Can they book an initial call with you? Tell us what happens, Richard.

SPEAKER_01 31:06

Yeah, sure. So the business is called the valuation team. Um thank you. Uh and you can find us at www.thevaluation team.co.uk. Uh you can find me on LinkedIn under Richard Brady. And we've got a Facebook page as well, the valuation team. Um, the normal process, I've got a small team of five people. So normal processes we'd have an inquiry through the website or somebody phone us to say they've been recommended, and we'll have a chat. Um obviously it's all confidential and there's no obligation. It doesn't cost anything to have a chat. If you then said, look, we'd like you to uh to do the valuation, we send you the various paperwork that's needed. It's as painless as possible. We try to make it as painless as possible. It takes about 10 minutes to fill the form in that we send over, and then we ask for the various uh accounts or the bits and pieces. Um and we priced it because we know this is a horrible time where there's bills piling up on top of bills. So we try to price it at a at a point where it covers our time because it takes 20 or 30 hours on average to do the valuation and write report. So the the pricing is dependent on the size of the company, between 2,000 and 3,500 pounds. So in that kind of world.

SPEAKER_02 32:20

That's very reasonable, isn't it? If you're getting that peace of mind in the room.

SPEAKER_01 32:24

There are a lot of lawyers that say, you know, what's the catch? But I I don't want to be in a position where I'm arguing with people over the price, really. You know, at my age, you don't you don't need that hassle. So so we priced it so we can make a profit, we priced it so we can turn them around relatively quickly. Uh, you know, within a week or so we can get a valuation report out. Wow and then we we can change them up to three times. So sometimes you know there might be a typo on there, or you know, what one of the parties might say, actually, we forgot to tell you about this information. So that can be changed up to three times, it's all within a price. And and then we email a PDF and you can have hard copies as well if you need them for call.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

Wow. So it's a fixed fee up front then, is it?

SPEAKER_01 33:06

Yes. So it rather than get into oh, well, this is a bit more complicated, so we want to charge more, we've got fixed fees based on the turnover. Uh, and so sometimes it it's uh a bit painful for us because it does take longer, but you know, that that's the the idea. But I again I didn't want to get into having to debate with people the price or you know, start trying to do special offers and things. It is just is what it is, you know. We're we're quite happy.

SPEAKER_02 33:32

I love it because that's the time where people are very stressed about money and they're trying to look at what my future looks like. So every penny counts. And to have you, Richard, on the team who I I mean you've been amazing with me and my team, and you know, we know you, and I know you were introduced to me by someone else that I really respect in the industry who also found you very helpful. So, I mean, I think that's incredible. So, thank you so much, and thank you for sharing your wisdom and your tips and your stories because I think for some people out there, this is really going to resonate, and I think maybe this is on the back burner, hasn't really been thought about. You know, maybe thought the easy option was just to avoid the hassle of it and go and um and just go with whatever's suggested, but maybe this has planted a seed. So hopefully people will reach out to you, Richard Brady, at the valuation team and get that initial conversation going. Um, Richard, my final question for you that I ask all my guests. My podcast is called Heartbreak to Happiness. So, what is happiness for you, Richard?

SPEAKER_01 34:31

It's it's a great question, isn't it? And I'm sure I'm gonna say what many other people have said. But um when I thought about this, and you mentioned it before we we organized the podcast, I thought spending time with friends and family it's it's free, you know, it doesn't cost anything. Uh, and that's you know, that coupled with being your authentic self. So, you know, just just being who you really are. It's taken me a long time to get to that. If you'd asked me in my 30s, I might have given you a different set of answers to that. But certainly time with good friends and family and and you know being true to yourself, that that would be for me what real happiness is.

SPEAKER_02 35:07

I love that. I love it. Well, thank you so much, Richard, for coming on and for being such a fabulous guest.

SPEAKER_01 35:13

Thank you for inviting me.

SPEAKER_02 35:16

That's it for today's episode. Do head on over to the valuation team.co.uk, check out Richard and his team, and get in touch if you need some help. Well worth it. I hope you enjoyed today's episode. Do like, subscribe, follow, and all that good stuff. And I very much look forward to seeing you on our next episode.

SPEAKER_00 35:41

That's it for today's episode of Heartbreak to Happiness. Don't forget to subscribe and leave a review to win a free ticket to Sara's virtual Heartbreak to Happiness retreat. This is a transformative combination of live webinars with Sara herself, coupled with her empowering online video program designed to help you cope better with your breakup and start feeling happy again. Thank you and join us again on the next episode for another dose of Heartbreak to Happiness.