Health Longevity Secrets

The Longevity Mindset

• Robert Lufkin MD • Episode 195

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What if adopting a new mindset could transform not just how long you live, but how well you live? Join us as we explore this possibility with Dr. Nick Engerer, a leading expert on longevity and health optimization. Drawing from his personal journey that started with a wake-up call in his twenties, Dr. Engerer reveals the secrets to embracing a longevity mindset. Through his experiences with cutting-edge technologies at Human Longevity Inc., he shares how early disease detection is revolutionizing healthcare, offering insights that could change how we approach aging and wellness.

We discover the profound impact of living with purpose and maintaining a positive outlook on aging. We’ll share stories of vibrant individuals who defy the expectations of growing older, illustrating that lifestyle choices like quality sleep, exercise, and nutrition are just the beginning. Dr. Engerer emphasizes the critical role of understanding your genetic makeup and family history, empowering you to take control of your health like never before. From Martha Stewart to the Rolling Stones, you'll hear how a sense of purpose can keep you thriving well into your golden years.

This episode is our gateway to the future of health as we discuss exciting longevity technologies and self-experimentation. Dr. Engerer talks about his rebranded blog, "A Longer Life with Nick Engerer," as a treasure trove of resources for those eager to master the art of longevity. Get a sneak peek into our upcoming docuseries filmed in Costa Rica, featuring insights from longevity experts worldwide. Whether you're looking to enhance your lifespan or simply live a more fulfilling life, this conversation is a must-listen for anyone interested in taking charge of their health destiny.

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Speaker 1:

Welcome back to the event. Our guest will be speaking on biohacking longevity. You're going to learn all about the longevity mindset and how important that is, as well as many other secrets, when you stay through to the end. Our presenter for this discussion is Dr Nick Engerer. Nick is a seasoned longevity biohacker and triathlete who's passionate about the oncoming wave of technologies that help us live longer and healthier lives. He thrives as a communicator, sharing his own self-experiments on his longevity blog, which has attracted tens of thousands of readers around the world. Let's go ahead and jump on in. Hey, nick, it's great to see you Welcome.

Speaker 2:

Rob, always an energetic response from you that I love meeting because we're both excited about this long life we get to live. Thank you for the welcome.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I'm excited about what we're going to talk about in this segment, about what I've come to believe is the most important factor in longevity, and that's mindset, and I think you have some feelings about that as well. But before we do, maybe just set the stage a little bit and tell us a little bit about how you came to this place.

Speaker 2:

Look, I had a pretty profound experience in my late 20s. My son was being born. He was being born through a cesarean section and the reason that the doctors had elected to do that is because there was some complications for my wife at the time and turns out 30 minutes after he's born into my arms I figure out she's got a rare form of cancer. So they discover that in the cesarean section room. And it's this life-changing moment where mortality hits me full-on. In my late twenties and not two months after that did I have two additional friends in their late twenties also get cancer diagnoses. One had testicular cancer, the other had colon cancer. So in my late twenties, often the last thing most people in their late twenties are thinking about is their mortality. It hits me full on. 20s are thinking about is their mortality, it hits me full on. And there's then a multi-year journey of surgeries, chemotherapy, recovery and the lovely end of that story is that all three of those people are alive and well today, thanks to the wonders of modern medicine. But that experience really stuck with me and it got me to think why are we in this world where we find cancer at stage three, stage four? Why do we have multimillionaire people with plenty of resources dying of stage four pancreatic cancer. Why is that a common occurrence? It doesn't make sense to me. We live in a world of abundant technology. Surely this problem has been solved.

Speaker 2:

So I went and did some homework and I went down a big rabbit hole, like I like to do on topics I love deep dives on topics to really really understand them and I came across Human Longevity Inc.

Speaker 2:

Which was co-founded by Peter Diamandis and a few other famous people, craig Venter being one of them, and they had created a place called the health nucleus where you could go get a full body MRI, genetic sequencing, blood tests, a whole bunch of other tests, including some heart testing, blood testing and you could have that preventative screening technology that has the capability to find cancer at a very, very early stage.

Speaker 2:

And so I went to San Diego, I put my money on the line, I did it myself, and it changed my entire view of what's possible for longevity and disease prevention, and that was the beginning of my journey. And so since about 2017, I've been full in on this space, following everything, learning all the context, all the people have anything to say about it and come full circle to the point about mindset that's the biggest thing that I've come to learn. It's the passion I have that I want to share with the audience is that it is all about adopting a longevity mindset and cultivating that, because the future ahead is so incredible that it's not just disease prevention that we can take advantage of. It is a whole other series of health optimizations that mean you can live a long, healthy life, and I know you know all about this, rob, and I look forward to chatting through a few of them with you today.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'm looking forward to it as well. So before we get into the longevity mindset, let's back up one step and just talk about longevity. How do you define longevity? What do we mean by that?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so I see it as two components.

Speaker 2:

There's two components to discussing human longevity, and the first is health span so how many healthy years do we have to be alive on this beautiful planet?

Speaker 2:

And the second one is lifespan. So how long can we live? And the place that we are now with longevity is in a solid position to know that we can have five to 10 more years of health span if we make certain lifestyle factor choices and take advantage of the limited amount of technology that's available today. And then I firmly believe that in the next decade and the years following we will continue to see increases in the lifespan component, and the proof is actually out there in the mysterious pudding already, perhaps because it takes a long time to know whether or not we're moving human lifespan up beyond 122 years. That person could be alive right now, and in fact I think that they are so longevity, healthspan, lifespan. And then in that space, I get excited about the umbrella of technologies that I call longevity technologies, which are helping us to detect disease early, to look younger, to feel better and ultimately push the needle in terms of how healthy we can stay for how long and how long we can actually live, and that's getting better every day that we're alive.

Speaker 1:

And yeah, all those technologies get a lot of attention, and deservedly so, because it's just amazing what's happening. So what drew you to mindset as an overarching factor here, instead of maybe one of these technologies that other people are talking about? First of all, what is mindset in this case, and why are you so convinced it's such a significant factor in longevity?

Speaker 2:

I love this question, rob, because it really there's a lot of pieces to unpack in there and I think that the narrative that fits best in describing how I came to it is one that most people go through. So mindset you might think it's just about positive thinking, but it's actually a bit more diverse than that and I'll help define it. But to start, I want to say my experience into coming into the longevity space the technology space like I described back in 2017, 2018, early days is to get really excited about all the talks I can find on YouTube, all the articles I can read in medical journals, all the information that I can find in books, find in books, get really excited about it and then immediately following that is a feeling of overwhelm because there's so much information and it's such a complex scientific substance, this discussion of longevity at its core. I mean just talking about metabolism, for example. Metabolism is incredibly complex. It's one of the key drivers of aging and you start to try to understand it. Good luck to you. We've had scores of scientists working on that problem for decades and we still don't understand it completely. So it's really complex, it's overwhelming, and then you have a limited amount of resource time, energy, money to put into your own longevity efforts, and that disorganization and overwhelm is something that I experienced and I now know is the journey of many people in fact, most people who come in to the longevity space. So this is where the longevity mindset comes in.

Speaker 2:

It's about adopting the mindset that allows you to engage with all this incredible opportunity, and the first part is what I described in terms of realizing what's happening. There's two key components. First, you don't have to get old and sick anymore. Disease is not destiny any longer. We know that that's incredible and technology is playing a role in that, but it's really those major lifestyle factors that we know. If you take advantage of, your chances of getting the diseases of aging drop precipitously to zero in some cases for many people for those decades of life where most people get them 50s, 60s, 70s and that's sleeping well, exercising, getting the right nutrition, managing your mental health. So aging is not destiny, point number one. Point number two the longer you stick around, the more technology is here to help you stick around. It's a positive feedback cycle. Technology is advancing ever more rapidly and the longer you live, the longer that those there's more technologies to help you live longer. So having those two fundamental realizations allows you to start seeing the world very, very differently. If I do a good job with these lifestyle factors, it's no longer just feeling better, looking better, not being fat, being a bit more muscly, it's actually wait a second, I get five to 10 more years of life if I do this. That's huge. That's the basics. Everybody kind of knows them. There's some details in there that we can help people sort through, but that mindset can help you want to do it.

Speaker 2:

It also tells you that you need to adopt a strategy for your own unique risk, because what you are likely to develop as a disease of aging is different than most anyone else, except the people in your family. We can look at a family history, we can look at genetics and we can also look to our own self-awareness and self-knowledge to know what diseases are most likely to develop for us as we age, and we can get ahead of the curve on that. A brilliant illustration is I know that there's prostate cancer in my family. There's a history of that. So I'm on the lycopene supplement early, from early days, because I know it's an antioxidant that supports prostate health One simple example. Another example is I used genetic testing and I found that I have a higher than average risk of macular degeneration. So I'm on a supplement stack that supports my eye health, gets me. All those juicy carotenoids, zeaxanthin, medicarotene keep my eyes healthy.

Speaker 2:

And then there's another segment to that, which is all these longevity technologies that we get excited about when we scroll on Instagram supplements, red light therapy, sauna, you name it, but all those things in that far end. Those are a part of what we get excited about, but it's often where we start, instead of all the way back here on the other side of lifestyle factors, managing our risk, getting those things right and then getting into the longevity technology excitement space. So all that falls under the umbrella of the longevity mindset. It's about realizations about what's happening, excitement about what's coming, but starting with the basics and managing your risk and then doing the fancy stuff. So that's the umbrella, that's the framework, rob, and longevity mindset is a very powerful organizing tool for managing all that overwhelm we get into when we try to encounter this huge diaspora of information, this big, voluminous encyclopedia of all the knowledge about longevity and what to do about it. How do we navigate that longevity mindset?

Speaker 1:

So it's about identifying risk factors and understanding that our genetic risk or our family risk, certainly and then understanding about the technology that's available and applying it. What about the? I think you hinted at this at the beginning about mindset, about attitudes about aging and old age. How does that play into it? Just how you think about age?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, Well, this is all the way back at the beginning of adopting that longevity mindset. So that first point of disease is not destiny. You don't have to get old and weak and dependent. You can be capable, independent, strong, healthy. As an older person. You can, in fact, be a chronologically old person that's biologically and mentally young. We see this, there's evidence of this when we look around.

Speaker 2:

Now it's not common, because most people choose to sit on the couch and watch lots of TV and eat poorly as you get old option. Some people choose the I'm going to ride my bike until I die in a cycling accident at 98 years old and show up every day and live my life fully. Some people choose to be an 84 year old woman teaching fitness classes once a week. Some people choose to be a world record-breaking sprinter in their 90s. And the thing that separates those two pathways is your sense of purpose.

Speaker 2:

It's back all the way, at that very top that pyramid I was drawing earlier. It's the mindset. Numero uno point is that if you don't want to be alive, if you don't feel the purpose of being alive and enjoy your life and have a reason to be here each day, why would you want to live longer. Why would you want to do any of what I'm describing? So, yes, the attitude toward life at the very top is the seminal piece of information that informs the rest of your biology. Because if you are loving your life, you're excited to be here, you have purpose, you have a strong social connection, you're going to want to stick around, and then everything else follows.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I mean, I love what we're seeing now, more and more like the 80 year old woman who went on the cover of Sports Illustrated magazine, swims Swimsuit, issues Martha Stewart as a model. Or the two 80 year old guys who now released an album and they're touring around the world filling stadiums with tens of thousands of people in the Rolling Stones. You know Mick and Keith, and then you know I don't have to say our two in the United States our two 80 year old leading, leading or soon to be 80 year old leading presidential candidates and and even 80 year old successful filmmakers like Ridley Scott, who continues to make award winning films. So so the role models are out there for us. The role models are out there for us and it's great to see them and celebrate them and help us build a positive mindset. The thing about purpose you mentioned is so important. What can we do to find that purpose or build that purpose or reinforce that purpose? What do you do or what secrets have you discovered about that?

Speaker 2:

The main thing I would say that I've discovered is that purpose is an incredibly intimate thing, and it is going to be different for each person how they discover that, because it's informed by their culture, it's informed by their family values and structure, it's informed by their life experience and it's formed by their own unique interests. Now, the main thing that seems to be available to most everyone is a sense of wanting to contribute, a wanting to help others, wanting to have a positive impact in the world, and so I like to join those two spheres together that what is your unique experience and gift that's developed in your own life, your skills, your life experience? And then there's the purpose, big part of purpose, where you want to have a positive impact. Where could that end up being? And then I like to join that in a Venn diagram up with curiosity, because curiosity is a very youthful characteristic. It is one that we have a lot of when we're biologically young, chronologically young, that I think we need to hold on to.

Speaker 2:

What are you curious about? What do you want to learn more about? Combine those things together and see what pops out of that space for you creatively, because the overlap of those things is how you find purpose or one of the ways that you can find purpose, and purpose can also change over time. I use myself as a great example. I mean, my PhD is in solar radiation science. What am I doing, sitting here talking about longevity? Well, I see the world. Thank you.

Speaker 1:

That was a little interruption coming from Australia. We had some uh, the electrons got bothered by the weather. But yeah, so continue that, thought I. I love that about purpose and going on. It's almost like purpose in some ways is a lens through which we see the world. Kind of like we were speaking with one of our other guests about stress and how stress is really not what's in the world but the meaning that we give to what's in the world and what you know.

Speaker 1:

One thing could be very stressful to one person and the same experience can be a joy to another, like walking in the rain. One person will think I'm getting wet, I'm going to be sick, I'm tired, it's cold, my clothes are ruined. The other person can be wow, this is beautiful, I love the rain, it feels so good on my body. Running down like that and it's almost like purpose is similar, at least in a lens, that we see the world as having meaning and something that we're doing is valuable and makes a difference, and you could see how that propagates all the way down to longevity and throughout everything there.

Speaker 2:

It does, rob, and you've given us a brilliant illustration with the rain. So when we think about the longevity mindset and identifying purpose, this is what we view the world through and that purpose is so important for wanting to be here. And what we find when we explore ourselves and our subconscious beliefs and our conscious limiting beliefs in the aging space is a whole lot of I don't want to be here anymore. I'm tired, I'm not happy. This isn't what I feel like my life should have been like. These subconscious and conscious beliefs are what then drive us away from feeling a life of purpose and wanting to be here, and I believe that that is incredibly aging, and the evidence is, in part, of what you just described. We know that one of the most important lifestyle factors for biological age, for longevity, is stress and anxiety, and we also know that one of the biggest things that allows people to live longer is strong social connection. These are psycho-emotional characteristics. These are things are happening in our mind that are reflected in our body, our sense of belonging, feelings of being loved, of giving love. These are fundamental to human existence. They're wired into our biology. They're wired into the parts of us that feel like our spirituality, or many people believe, is our spirituality, and having those elements be healthy and vibrant in your life are actually, I believe, far more important than even what you eat, even how much you exercise. It is the mind that governs all the rest, and I will say the reason why I say that is because if you are fulfilling purpose and you are wanting to be here and you have a healthy mental health status, you're going to want to exercise more, you're going to want to eat healthier, you're going to want to go to sleep and take care of yourself. It's the trickle down effect of having the right mindset in your life, having that sense of purpose and clear direction that then makes everything else flow much better in terms of looking after and taking care of yourself, and none of this is actually incredibly surprising.

Speaker 2:

We know a lot of this already, but the thing that's different is that now you get five to 10 more years of healthy living, which those five to 10 more years of healthy living are likely to turn into a multiple of that with the longevity technologies we have coming down the pipeline, and so you can get excited about that and you can say hell, I'm 60 years old. I've thought I was going to retire in five years, but I'm going to reinvent myself. I'm going to go back to school, get a PhD and I'm going to write a book because I'm going to live for 20 more years. I'm going to live for 30 more years. That mindset changes everything and it allows you to find and fulfill that purpose which keeps you going.

Speaker 2:

And we have brilliant data in retirement statistics that show us that people who retire, particularly men. They lose their social connection, they lose their sense of purpose, and then it's the deadliest five years of their life. They're the most likely to die of any other five-year period in the rest of their life is the five years after they've retired. And so there it is. Case in point, you need purpose, you need connection, you need that positive mental framework in order to even want to be here.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, the retirement is such a great example. I mean, today people retire at well. In the US it's like typically 65. But then these people go on to live another 30 years. You know potentially or even more, but on average at least, it's a huge amount of time. And to spend that on the golf course no judgment about golf, but you know who knows it's fascinating. Well, you talk about purpose and some other things too, and mindset, not only just purpose, but also in making decisions and choices about your life. What have you found about choices in, say, your lifestyle that are significant and matter for longevity?

Speaker 2:

I think again, this is going to become an individual thing, but we can take certain characteristics from it and apply it to ourselves when we hear another person like me talking about it. So one of the things that I have realized about us as humans is that our entire reason for existing biologically is the same as any other biological organism, even the two plants you see behind me. The purpose is to reproduce. That's the biological purpose that you have. All of your DNA is programmed to do that. Your epigenetic expression is, in part, of aging itself, in fact, is about the biological imperative to reproduce.

Speaker 2:

So I find that when I really own that, when I really own my role as a father for example, to spend time with my 10 year old son and carve out the chance to do that and really lean into that experience that it's one of the more meaningful things in my entire life, because it's not only biologically what I'm here to do, but I also. It's the biggest source of love and he's my favorite person in the whole world, and so I spend that time with him. It gives me meaning, a new area of meaning that I know to prioritize. I know when he comes home, gets off the bus at three in the afternoon, everything else turns off. It's time to be together, it's time to go to the pool, it's time to take him to his sport event, it's time to have fun and enjoy our time together.

Speaker 2:

So you find those elements in your life that reflect your personal values and you learn to prioritize alignment with those values in your lifestyle and that feeds back into purpose. So I think that the takeaway from that is to know what your values are and to respect your biology and reason for being here. And even if you don't have children, that's fine. I'm not saying you need to have children to have purpose just because that's biologically what's going on. That biology and knowing that you're here to reproduce biologically just tells you how you should live your life. You should keep those youthful characteristics going for yourself. Keep moving, stay bouncy, stay strong. Think about optimizing your hormones, think about everything through the lens of biology as you add your own personal values into the mix and have fun doing it.

Speaker 1:

It's a great, great point.

Speaker 2:

Well, as a self-described biohacker, what technologies have you found particularly exciting in the longevity space? Not everybody loves them, but I think biological age tests are so cool I really do because the ability that's behind them now is really maturing. So there's two ones that I really like there's the epigenetic testing framework and then there's that glycan age testing framework, and both of those are in a stage of moving beyond just giving us a biological age value, and so, for anyone who's listening and doesn't know what that is, effectively we're able to look inside, at signals in the body and express an age of what you look like biologically compared to a given cohort of people similar to you, or to your disease risk or risk of developing the diseases of aging. So when we look at some of these tests, I'm getting really excited because behind them is unpacking the entire epigenome, which is the layer on top of your genetics that determines how your genes are expressed, which those lifestyle factors I mentioned before influence. And this biological age analysis that we've begun to be able to compute is now getting the layer added onto it of why are you that age, why are you older or younger, and here are the knobs you can start to turn to change that result. Same sort of things happening with the glycan age, which is looking at glycans, these signaling molecules that are built up of complex sugar molecules or polysaccharides that inform the entire inflammatory system in your body, the immune system in your body. They're signaling molecules and we can look at them and create a biological age estimate or a glycan age estimate. But now we're getting the layer on top of.

Speaker 2:

Okay. Well, not only can we give you your age estimate, but we can tell you that you are more likely to start developing these diseases of aging, based on the signal that we see Rheumatoid arthritis, for example. That's just one example, and then you could start to do something about that. You can have a proactive stance on that. It's again informing almost. Instead of that just genetic risk I talked about earlier, we're getting close to understanding the epigenetic risk that you're seeing in your body, that glycan age driven risk in your body to say, hey, now that you're 55, 65 years old, these are the diseases that you're the closest to developing and you can be proactive about that. So I am very optimistic about how these technologies are panning out. They're starting off fairly basic, just giving you a bio age, but they're quickly moving into being analytical tools that are dynamic and responsive to intervention, which has a lot of opportunity for us to then go into the longevity technology space and know what to pick off the shelf.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and you have a great blog that I enjoy a lot that you talk about this. You've recently rebranded it. What's the new branding and can you talk about that for a little bit?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, fantastic, rob, thank you. So we are now A Longer Life with Nick Engerer, formerly known as Longevity Blog, and that rebrand is really about taking this early stage work I did on self-experimenting on myself, trying to help others learn how to do that, and expanding it to really be comprehensively approached as that longevity mindset piece. How can we use a longevity mindset to then know what to do with this entire longevity revolution for lack of a better term this entire longevity technology future that's emerging before us? So providing that longevity mindset as that organizing framework. And then where do you go from there? Helping people sort that out, to get through the overwhelm, to cut through marketing messages, to know where to put their limited resource being their time, energy and budget so that they can have the greatest impact on their own health, and ultimately not taking any authority away from people.

Speaker 2:

I'm not looking to build an analytical platform that tells you what to do. No, no, no, no. I'm aiming to change your mind into one that is proactive and learning how to do this for yourself, because no one out there is ever going to build a platform that is going to be as powerful as your own mind for changing your life and your own authority for knowing what things to implement in your life. You can get lots of advice from every direction. Many of those things will be useful. I love having HRV on my wrist. I love knowing my resting heart rate, but it's more important for me to assess how I feel in my body and that data together. So helping people develop those skills so that they can be mature people in this longevity technology space and know how to navigate it and also be excited about it so that they tell more people about it. So there's more of us longevity junkies out there, and that means more money and investment in space. The faster all this moves, the more exciting it gets.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I love your approach with the self-experimentation, where you basically in one experiment you did a bunch of DNA methylation, epigenetic biological clocks on yourself and compared them and then related that on the blog. So I think that approach is really valuable, because sharing that information with everybody, it's just so fascinating. It's so fascinating. Maybe you could tell people how they can reach you on social media and also the best way to get to the new blog. Also, we'll put it in the show notes, but if you tell them now, if people are listening to this, then they can get it down.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, you can find me on Instagram and Twitter at Nick Engerer, so N-I-C-K-E-N-G-E-R-E-R, nick Engerer, so N-I-C-K-E-N-G-E-R-E-R. And we're putting a lot of time into digesting information from the website and making it really accessible in smaller chunks on the social channels. And then you can go to alongerlifecom and you can find the new website and you can look at it through the framework of the longevity mindset and have fun exploring some of those things you were mentioning, rob. So the self-experiments I've done, which increasingly I'm trying to frame as how others can do the same and how to use that principle in their own life to figure out what works for them, so that they know if they're going to spend $100 a month on a supplement, it's worth it. Because do the math, rob, $100 a month, $1,200 a year, $12,000 a decade If you're choosing a longevity supplement, you want to know it works. We can give you a framework for doing that through self-experimentation, biological age tests, and that allows us to then use our resources wisely, because we've only got a certain amount of them.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's such a great point. Also, Nick and I just came back from Costa Rica with Charles Maddox where we filmed a wonderful longevity docuseries that'll be, I think, out on PBS and Discovery Channel coming soon and we'll all have that in our social media and you'll see that. But that was a lot of fun talking to the experts down there as well, meeting other experts and our guests. But, Nick, thanks so much for taking the time to talk with us today and thanks so much for all the great work you're doing in this space.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, rob, I'm so glad you mentioned the docuseries. I'm very excited about that, having been the host and discussing all those topics with you great people. The longevity mindset really organized it all, so I'm looking forward to seeing how that lands for people and it is my absolute pleasure to be a part of this movement, to work with you, all those wonderful folks out there, and to contribute to this wider movement, to all the viewers out there and helping them know how to master their longevity mindset and live healthfully for as long as possible.

Speaker 1:

Wow. We just learned about the importance of mindset and longevity and a sense of purpose, and then we got into biohacking and all the fascinating things that are available there. So I want to thank Dr Nick Engerer for joining us today and sharing his amazing knowledge. Remember that Nick is giving us a bonus to our VIP Pass members, so if you haven't claimed your VIP Pass to access the recordings, transcripts, mp3s and our must-have bonus package, you can get it now by clicking the button on this page to upgrade before it's too late. Remember that when the event's over, the recordings and all the bonuses go away. So make sure that you claim your VIP pass before it's too late.