Effective One-on-One Meetings Follow Up [EP:178]

Maximizing Workplace Efficiency & Emotional Intelligence Through Effective Meetings

In this episode, Todd and Jen discuss a follow-up to their recent meetings, detailing the successes and areas for improvement in their salon's operations.

They share insights on maintaining workplace cleanliness, addressing staff concerns, and the importance of coming from a place of helping others. 

Todd and Jen emphasize the value of regular, productive meetings with structured questions to evaluate and enhance team performance. 

They highlight the significance of understanding and embodying the company's mission, vision, and core values and provide actionable advice on facilitating meaningful and results-driven discussions within the team.

00:00 Welcome and Quick Intro
01:22 Parenting and School Play Experience
03:47 The Power of Helping Others
05:56 Confidence vs. Competence
06:51 Challenging Business Clichés
10:25 Effective Meeting Strategies
27:03 Reflecting on Leadership and Team Support
30:17 Conclusion and Newsletter Sign-Up

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Transcript

Untitled project from SquadCast
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Todd: [00:00:00] All right. What's up, everyone? Welcome back. Happy Monday. How's it going, Jennifer?

Jen: Great.

Todd: Nice. Today we're doing, um, that was the quickest intro ever.

Jen: Let's go.

Todd: Today we're, yeah, let's get this over with. Uh, today we are talking a little bit about, sort of a follow up to the meetings that we ran. And we talked about them. It was last week, right?

Yeah. And then we actually, we talked about what we were going to do. And then we actually had the meetings. Sorry. I'm trying to get this. I still, I need a desk. We haven't been putting out any video content because my head is like off to the side here. Nothing reaches and I need a new setup. I think it's time that people deserve it.

So anyways, we're going to follow up on that, but first we'll start with an opening thought, opening take, what do you got? I have a whole bunch. I started making [00:01:00] a new list.

Jen: right.

Todd: Um, You

Jen: came into our daughter, um, this is her third year doing a play with the school. This year was beauty and the beast. And they kind of went into the weekend. They're just a little underprepared and we knew that. And some of her scenes got missed in a dress rehearsal.

Todd: [00:02:00] Uh,

Jen: I came from a place where I was like, how

Todd: You Okay, so let's go ahead and run this thing for a little bit and see what's going on.

Jen: me in a place that I can help you? And I think first it came from a great, like. I got a response immediately. We are going to make this happen. We were figuring it out. I'm going to meet with you guys tomorrow and I'm going to talk to your daughter and we're going to make sure. when I went for drop off the next day, we met with the director first, understood what was going on, what was changing. And as I go to the group of the 12 girls, there's some other moms in there. Just basically like my daughter came home in tears yesterday. So then I became this facilitator of like, this is how.

We're going to approach this today. This is what we talked through and it became everybody just, we were all on the same page and everyone was so thankful that somebody spoke up because nobody wanted to speak up because everybody was stressed [00:03:00] out. but I, I think there's a place when you're a parent or whatever role you take that sometimes you need to speak up and it doesn't always have to be from a place of frustration.

That can be the, the, the part, the catapult that starts it. But like I said, what Todd taught me is you come from a place of helping and it's received and you get done so much more work so much more effectively. And everybody feels really great about the win at the end. So, uh, proud of myself, proud of my daughter, proud of us as parents and, and what we could help facilitate to get her where she needed to be on stage.

And that she came out of that performance feeling really, really great.

Todd: Yeah, I love that. Excuse me. First of all, sorry that I hit the music button. I don't know if you heard that.

Jen: hurry up, Jen. You're done opening take over.

Todd: We need, we need one of those. But anyway, sorry, people. I hit the wrong button here. Anyways, I agree with everything you said. I had a past business mentor teach me that. Help first. And everything comes from a place of helping others.

And when you do that, good things happen. There's [00:04:00] a book by a past business mentor of mine, Chris Cooper, called Help First. You can pick it up online. I probably have a couple copies. If you're local, let me know and I'll, I'll get you a copy. But, um, yeah, that always works. I always tell the story about the coffee shop when I went in.

Um, there was a new coffee shop that opened in town. I really liked it. I really liked going there. And I noticed they had this big community board and everybody would go in and just put their business cards up. And I thought that's kind of, you know, An old school way of trying to take without giving, you know, and you're not helping anybody.

You're just trying to help yourself when you do that. And I'm not knocking like community boards and stuff. I get it. The business put it up. So, but have you ever thought of how you can help other people? Like I went in and had a meeting with the owner of that place. And I just sat down and said, Hey, you know, I really like coming to your place.

I'd love for you to succeed. So that selfishly, I can still come here forever. As long as I want to, uh, how can I help you? And she was like, what? I'm pretty sure she almost teared up [00:05:00] at one point and I was just like, well, there's so many people trying to get in front of your audience, but like, how can I get you in front of my audience?

Like, how can I help you grow so that I can again, continue to come here, you know? Um, and since then, uh, we've had a great relationship every time we bump into each other. It's nice to catch up and whatever, but it just, it's more effective. And I'm not saying you don't go through the anger phase and all the, like, I'm going to tell this person where to go and all that you still are going to work through that stuff.

But. Because we did, we spoke for like, probably 90 minutes about it, because we were both frustrated, our daughter is in tears, and all we could keep thinking about is these other parents and these other children, and who's going to step up, and you were like, I'm going to step up, and I was like, okay, and that immediately made me feel better about the situation.

Uh, so try it out next time you're frustrated, try helping somebody, and see how you feel. So I have two, I have two quick, quick ones here.

Jen: Okay. Mm-hmm

Todd: My first one is that confidence isn't competence. [00:06:00] Especially when we're looking at things like through social media, you see a lot of people with large followings and they have tons of confidence, right?

Because they have a ton of followers, but that doesn't necessarily mean they know what they're talking about.

Jen: Mm-hmm

Todd: They could have absolutely no clue. I've seen so much bad business advice out there. I've seen so much bad life advice, general advice. When we had the pandemic, we saw a shit ton of really bad, Advice for businesses, but it was done by these big companies and these gurus and people that are sort of like self appointed in charge of industries.

You know, they don't really have any governing say over anything, but for some odd reason, people listen to them. And a lot of businesses were hurt to be honest. So

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: confidence isn't competence. My second one is that we need to stop. I said this to you the other day, Jen, it's happened in our salon. It's happened in probably everywhere.[00:07:00] 

We need to stop buying into these random sort of cliche sayings and things, you know, when people are like, Oh, it's January. So it's just slow. I don't know who you're talking about. It's not slow. Uh, if you're slow, that's great, but it doesn't mean the whole world is slow. It doesn't mean the whole industry is slow.

It doesn't even mean the whole business is slow. So I heard, I overheard somebody last week say. You know, it's, it's just slow because it's January or it's just a slow time of the year and I was like, is it because when I looked at the numbers, we were up over 43 percent from last January and then I meant to compare month to month, but we had a big, a big period of growth

Jen: Mm-hmm

Todd: did way more services, uh, services and retail dollars in January than we've ever done.

So I, I,

Jen: take on that, right?

Todd: yeah, go ahead though.

Jen: I think so. I think what happens is and December are such busy times. No matter what you're doing, there's [00:08:00] holidays. If your life is already busy, there's lots of extra things you have to do because of Thanksgiving and Christmas and whatever else you've got going on. So November and December. Most people extremely busier than other times of the year. So I think what happens is you come into January and yes, it's slower because you're not doing so many other things, but I don't necessarily know if it's as slow as you think it is. Um, and I think as, If you're talking in the hair world, if you didn't do a lot to make sure you weren't slow in January, in November, December, which would be talking about other services, rebooking, whatever it needs to be the next year, you should make some mental notes or write down notes so that you are proactive during your busiest time so that those flood into what feels like slower because you don't have so much going on. Um, I know for some, it truly is slower, but I think for some, it's just. have less going on, but it's still probably as busy as you might've been in like June or something, but it feels different coming off of a busy time.

Todd: Yeah, I agree with all of that. I think my thought was that [00:09:00] you should get out of that mindset because if you're going to sit around and say that it's slow, then every January is going to seem slow

Jen: And then you're not going to

Todd: and it's short. You're just

Jen: slow.

Todd: right. You're just perpetuating it. It's almost like, well, what are we going to do?

You know, January is always slow. What are we going to do about it? We can't do anything about it. And it's like, you could do a lot about it. The people in our. Salon that were, that had a great month would disagree with the other people in our salon that said it was slow because they were really busy. So it's either you can get busy or no pun intended, either you can get to work trying to get yourself busier.

You can approach in our salon, for example, where the leaders, so you can approach your leadership, whether that's a salon manager, a business manager, restaurant manager, wherever you work and say like, Hey, how can I, I I'd like to make more money. I'm not feeling as busy. First of all, I would say If somebody came to me with that, I would say, all right, let's look at the numbers because I want to compare, like, what are we actually looking at?

Because again, when I looked at our numbers, we were up by a lot. So maybe you're having an off [00:10:00] month. Why is that? Like, maybe you were sick for two weeks, like, or whatever. And you can take that out and you're like, so you weren't slow. You just weren't here for half the month. Like it, you really, it's different for everyone.

And I, I just wanted to point that out as an opening take, because. I think it's dangerous to get into those mindsets of like, well, what can we do about it? It's just slow,

Jen: Right.

Todd: know, or well, the holidays will be busy. What if something happens where they're not busy? Don't bank on just that, you know what I mean?

So either way, all right, let's, um, jump into meetings real quick. I don't even have, yeah,

Jen: Um, well let me

Todd: meeting.

Jen: I have something that I think a lot of people might resonate with.

Todd: Well, first let's, first, let's set up what we're talking about.

Jen: Yeah. Okay.

Todd: So just real quick, we, we ran our beginning of the year. One on ones. They're really two on ones because Jen and I meetings last week and we had some successes and some failures and [00:11:00] we're always learning, right? So either way and we want to share now So we talked about what our plan was and how you can make meetings more effective last week on the podcast So this week we want to follow up We've actually run through them now and put them into practice and gone through and got everything So now we can jump into some of that stuff.

All right, go sorry Okay. You

Jen: any salon you're in, I'm sure you can all relate. Cleaning is always going to be something that's talked about, but I don't think it needs to be something that takes away time often than not. [00:12:00] how do you get people to think about cleaning?

Cause it'd be easy for. People come in and they're just like, no one cleans, no one does this. So you have to then figure out how do you get them to take responsibility for what no one does? Cause they're part of the problem. Everybody is. And how do you get them to be like kind of self aware and reflect on the things that they may not be good at every day either without hurting their feelings or making them feel defeated and making them not feel part of the team. So I think. You know, you just listen in your salon. You'll know what things are your issues. It's very apparent. And there's always maybe pop ups, which I welcome that too, because there's no way for us to make a better business in 2025. If we don't even have a clue what's going on. And it does require us asking certain questions and asking for constructive criticism on what Todd and I are doing as well. Um, maybe you talked about this in the last one, but so Todd had come up with after realizing kind of, we weren't Constructive in the first two meetings, um, a slew of questions and ratings that they could, our staff, each person could, and it was the same questions for everybody. So we truly could have like a metric [00:13:00] system on now.

What do we want to do with this? What are we out of these meetings going to do rather than everyone just sit there and tell us nobody does any of this X, Y, and Z stuff. And I will say for me personally, going into, we had one date with seven hours of meetings, going into them with these questions, I, I in with a much better attitude and I looked forward to it because I was curious to see how they were going to answer it, where they were coming from.

And I knew we had a constructive that

Todd: Silence. Thanks. So, we, I had come up with a list of questions and different, like. Things and I'll describe what it looks like in a second for people listening, but what I did. So what I did was during [00:14:00] our first meetings, I was a little too relaxed and I let, I thought everything would just sort of come up at some point and we would just like check it off as we went and it didn't.

And I realized we need to, and I'm admittedly out of practice with meetings. I actually think that meetings can be a great positive experience, but I also think that they can be a negative if people don't feel like they're accomplishing much. And so I tend to stay away from meetings. I would rather you just tell me what you need and I'll get back to you when I can.

And which is usually like within the day and then we'll figure it out and move forward. I come from places where I've had to have lots of meetings or people would be like, can we have a meeting about this? And I'm like, why, why can't we just talk right now? We're both here. Like, you know, cause not everything needs to be this big deal.

So. Um, the second round of meetings was excellent, and I will say we got it was far more effective, and we wrapped them up pretty much within an hour. We had a couple that ran [00:15:00] over because we were talking about some different things and education and some stuff that we have. We're putting people into more leadership roles in our business.

Um, we maybe should have Broken it up a little bit because I think when they go long, they can, you tend to like burn out. Right? Like how long can I listen to this? But, um, and I will say like you had mentioned people bitching. We don't have a lot of issues really in our business. We don't have people that are fighting.

We don't have people that are arguing. So what do people look for? They look, they have to have something to complain about because, and I'm not talking about just our staff. This is, I think, human nature. Yeah.

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: But you want to deflect you go into a meeting you're anxious and you're like, what are they gonna say about me?

That's bad. I have to say something about someone else to deflect and get everything off of me So every single person is like this person doesn't clean or whatever, you know, not not one It's funny because this person thinks this person doesn't help out and this person thinks [00:16:00] this person doesn't help out and it's funny because they're all crossing and What it does, what it showed us is that people just aren't really aware of their level.

Like, like you said, some people think that their level of like cleanliness or cleaning, for example, is high, is like a 10, but it's not. It's like a two.

Jen: Right.

Todd: but they don't know if you don't show them. So one of our questions was literally, do you understand each item looks like, like, do you understand when we say clean a mirror, what a clean mirror should look like?

Because you can't have common sense. There's no such thing as common sense. So if you write down, this is my closing list, clean your chair, put your blow dryer away, whatever, clean your mirror, put your products away, but you don't give them a standard of this is what putting a blow dryer away looks like, this is what putting products away looks like, then they don't know.

You can't blame them for that, that's on you. So what we did [00:17:00] to, I'm not going to give my whole list of questions because it might not relate at all to your salon, but what we did is we touched on first our mission, vision and core values to make sure that, excuse me, make sure people are aware of those things.

And then we got into some rating questions where they had to rate themselves 1 through 10, and it might be like, rate yourself 1 through 10 on cleaning, cleanliness, customer service, um, the effort you put into your appearance. Blah, blah, blah. Uh, and then we had a bunch of yes or no questions. And we explained to them that we didn't care at all where they rate themselves.

You are like, you know what? I'm a three. I have not been putting any effort into my appearance and how I present myself to clients at all. Great. How do we get you to the 3. 5? How do we get you to a four? How do we get to two or five? Um, if somebody said I'm a 10, awesome. How do we now? So if you're a 10, that's a gold standard [00:18:00] is what you're saying.

How do we raise the standard? How do we get you to an 11 and make that our new 10? That's our new baseline. If somebody said no to a question, do you know our business mission? Some people guessed and they were saying our core values, which is fine. Uh, some people just said no. Some people said, yeah, of course.

And then they said something and it was pretty freaking close. Um, which shocked me. We had several people that were like pretty, I would say spot on not word for word, but they were spot on. And so it would just open the conversation to us. Like, again, I don't care if you say no, you don't understand the business or you don't have the business mission memorized.

I don't expect anyone to memorize stuff, but to know where it is and know about what it is, is a must

Jen: And to

Todd: because

Jen: it's important, like how it, how it affects what we're doing in our business so that they understand why it's there.

Todd: exactly. Uh, and we like to just touch base on that stuff because like you said, why, why is that mission [00:19:00] important to us? Why is the vision important to us? And what are our core values do and how do, how do they serve us? And so I think a lot of light bulbs went off for our staff. Especially when we explained our vision where we're like you guys are in a, in a way, our clients like Jen and I want to take care of you guys so that you can see through our business mission, which is to take care of the client.

Basically, we're in the process of rewording this, so I'm not going to say what it is, but basically what it boils down to is taking care of the client. And the vision, our business vision, um, is basically break it down real quick is to prove our business model because we do things way different at our salon than I would say,

Jen: Most

Todd: 90%.

Jen: hmm.

Todd: Yeah, maybe 80, 95%. I don't know.

And it's also to serve our employees. Like, how do we get them as far as they want to go? How, how do we help them [00:20:00] reach their goals and dreams and beyond? How do we challenge them? How do we push them? How do we support them?

Jen: hmm.

Todd: And I think that stuff's really important, especially like, so two things. One, you want your staff to understand your vision and your mission and your core values, no matter what they are.

But two, our vision, which I think I, I said earlier, a lot of light bulbs went off for people is to take care of our, our staff because you see a lot of stuff, especially on social media where it's like, well, my staff just leaves and everyone's going to rant or whatever. And that's fine. You can be salty, but instead what you could do is create something where people don't want to leave.

There's no really reason for people to leave. I've shown people time and time again how much money they can make and it's, it's up to you. It really is. It's not an overnight thing. Don't get me wrong. Um, you, and again, I don't [00:21:00] want to turn this into a renting versus commission because I think they're really ultimately the same exact thing.

Um, but I wanted to show our team too how much support they have because

Jen: Right.

Todd: everyone says they're supportive, but when you go off and you're on your own, at the end of the day, it's really, it's on you. Because that's the choice you made.

Jen: hmm.

Todd: And so what's the point of working in a freaking commission salon if you're not going to have the ultimate support team around you?

Jen: Correct.

Todd: so that was the, that was the big part of what we pushed home in the meetings. Because like Jen said, you're always going to have an issue, like cleaning. Every business I've ever worked in when I worked in restaurants, every business is always like, this person never does their roll ups. This person never does their closing work.

This person never does this. And it's, you're always going to have that. So it's, if, if you're complaining about somebody not cleaning to your standard, and that's the worst that you have, that's the worst complaint you have, then you're doing pretty freaking good. And as a business owner, if people are coming to you and they're complaining about cleanliness, but you look around and you're [00:22:00] like, this place is really clean.

I'm proud of this. If you can honestly say that you're proud of it. Then good on you because again, people are always going to have some sort of issue because you have to, it's human nature where we're, we're set up for, um, flight and fright, right? Or fight and you were always like on edge looking for like, what's bad around us.

Cause it's just, it's a safety mechanism and it's just how our brains are wired. But anyway, amazing set of meetings. And, um, we still have two more to do with our esthetician team. Thank you. And some more work to do and, uh, a lot of great stuff came out of it.

Jen: Yeah, for

Todd: What else do you have to say about those? I feel like I rambled forever.

Jen: Um, I think it's just, if you run meetings with your staff or, or your staff wants to go into a meeting with you, either way, to have some questions and have questions that can get you to the end goal, what are you trying to get out of the meeting? Um, what are [00:23:00] the points you need to make? And you need to make sure that you are moving the discussion in that direction so that.

You know, the, the end result gets there and it's not literally just sitting around and just shooting the shit. Um, you know, that can be for a different time and then it's I, I think

Todd: It's funny because that's what you said in the, in the last podcast.

Jen: Yeah, I

Todd: You were like, it gives us time to shoot the shit and I'm like, that's not gonna go how we think it's gonna go.

Jen: No,

Todd: didn't. Okay.

Jen: meetings to touch base, and those will be quicker ones, make sure that [00:24:00] everything, you know, We took notes on is happening. Are you accomplishing it? Um, if not, how can we help more? Um, if you're blowing it out of the water, okay, now what do we need to do? So it really just set up the rest of the year for each person's plan and they were individually part of that, you know, which is really cool. Some people came to us with questions. I don't know if I'm ready for this or that. Okay, hold on. Let's run some numbers. We'll meet back in a little bit and we'll figure out sort of what does this look like for you this year and how can we get you there? Um,

Todd: Um, You

Jen: just figuring out with those meetings, like, how do you want to [00:25:00] drive that, that conversation and how are you going to get there for us?

It was this time, a list of questions and ratings, and it worked really, really well. And everybody left feeling, um, empowered and excited. And that's what you want out of a team of people.

Todd: Yeah, and some of the questions like I mentioned are yes or no, because we wanted to get some information from our staff quickly and then spark their thought. But what I would suggest that you do is have some open ended questions too, because you really don't want, like you're kind of alluding to, you don't want people to be like, good, hey, how's it going?

How's everything going? How were, how was your holiday season? Good. What are you excited about? Uh, good. What is like something you want to work on this year? Everything, you know what I mean? And you'll get those people to open up a little bit so that you can really then dive in and have some conversations like

Jen: you can't do

Todd: we

Jen: answers

Todd: know if you're telling me everything's good, that's just, you're

Jen: and it's not true.

Todd: pacifying me.

Yeah. It's not, everything's good. So [00:26:00] have some open ended questions too, and then really listen. So when our team was talking, some of them, like some of the stuff you're going to get seems very surface level, but. Still listen. Like, why is this person sharing this with me? That this is obviously a concern to them.

And if it's a concern to them and you're trying to be of service to your team, then it needs to be a concern to you, or you have to figure it out. Because like you said, in a lot of these meetings, it's, it's not that someone didn't take out the trash that causes like the breakup, you know what I mean? At home.

I think you were relating it to like a boyfriend, girlfriend, something.

Jen: not why you broke up. It's all the conversation you didn't have before the trash wasn't taken out on that one day that led to the, like, I'm, I'm done. So, you know, we want to avoid that at the salon. We want to make sure we've had all these hard conversations or we've touched base. And if, if it's a, if, if someone ends up leaving that we are like, we all really tried, this just didn't work out or it never even gets there because we're, we're always just making sure we're in a good place.[00:27:00] 

Todd: Definitely.

Jen: I think too, that we ended. Um, that questionnaire, I think Todd had asked two questions about, you know, how do you feel?

I don't know exactly. And you can actually reply right in front of you. Um, like, how do

Todd: I don't, but I feel like I should. Okay.

Jen: how do you feel Jen and I, you know, you know, did as leaders for you this past year? Um, is there anything we could have done better? And everybody was like, you are great. There's nothing else you could do for me.

You're amazing. You're amazing. And so as a leader, you could sit there and be like, wow, thanks. Like I'm, I'm amazing. Cut myself on the back. Um, but I had, I knew shortcomings that I didn't do for them. So then I shared that it doesn't always feel good to be like, well, here's where I think I failed you this year. Um, I didn't feel I measured up to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. They, they all heard my, what it was for me. Um, and I'm. I needed to share that because I, I love that they all think we're doing amazing things, but you know, my own self reflection, here you are. I didn't do this. This is what I'm going to do this year.

This is how I'm going to do this better. This is how I'm going to achieve these things for you guys that I feel need to be done this year. Um, and so kind of went in with that, expecting that everybody was going to say we did [00:28:00] a great job, but then shining some light on some things that I think we could do better so that, you know, everybody's really just being as real as possible in these conversations.

Todd: So, the question I sort of ended with there was, uh, what, what, if anything we've missed. So that can be in the meeting or throughout the year. And then have we fallen short on any of your expectations? Like, The last thing we want is somebody to have expectations of us that we sort of put out there and, um, not boast in a negative way, but sort of boast like here, here's what we offer, here's what we bring to the table, and the last thing we want to do is fall short on that stuff.

So, uh, they, everybody across the board was like, you guys always handle stuff, you know, as it comes up, blah, blah, blah. So it's, everything is, Is great. And I'm like, okay, well, not everything's great because like you said, we've reflected on how we can be better. And so, you know, I just told them like we're, we're not perfect and we're going to get there in a second, but let's finish this up.

Um, and [00:29:00] then yeah, you dove into the areas sort of that we fall, we fell short on and why and what we're going to do about it. So, and a big part of it too is just having like these conversations so that your team understands what's going on. Like, for example, people would say, how are you going to do this stuff?

You guys are already so busy or Jen, your schedule is already packed. How are you going to do this stuff? Okay, great. We've thought of that too. So here's where we're taking time. Like we're not going to devote time in this one area because it doesn't serve us the way we need to serve this business. And that's where the time is going to come from.

Thank you for being aware that we're busy. You're busy too. Everybody's busy. We did a whole podcast on it.

Jen: Busy being busy. Yeah.

Todd: yeah, busy being busy, but it's true. Like when you own a business, you have three kids in your husband, wife team. Yeah. The days get away from you and it's easy to miss stuff and it's easy to push stuff to back burners and.

This year we challenged ourselves to, um, be more, even more effective in our business [00:30:00] and see how, how can we really push this thing in 2025. And so we're starting with some easy, I would say easy wins that we know are going to work. And then from there, we're going to maybe push some people to do some things and get uncomfortable and really grow.

And again, that's the support you get. So anyways, hope this helped.

Jen: Yeah,

Todd: anything else, Jen? Thanks for listening, everyone. Get in our email list. Three, two, one pro push, which is my new, um, get in there. I share a ton of the business stuff that we are actually doing. None of the stuff in there is theory.

It's all things that we've done, or we've done at past businesses or have worked with through past business mentors or whatever.

Jen: hmm. Mm hmm.

Todd: Um, and it's, it's fun. It's a fun newsletter.

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: and if you want to talk to us, find us, uh, through some of the links in the show notes.

Jen: Yes, we're

Todd: Have a great week and we'll see you next time.

Thanks. Bye.

​[00:31:00]